MUScoop

MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 09:58:10 PM

Title: Ben McCollum
Post by: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 09:58:10 PM
This guy is impressive.  Coach at D II Northwest Missouri State.  2 national championships in the last three years including undefeated last year.  One loss this year....looking like three championships in four years. 
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:00:41 PM
38 yrs old...young guy with who has been a head coach for a decade. A lot of experience.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: LAZER on March 07, 2020, 10:00:44 PM
Nope
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Windyplayer on March 07, 2020, 10:01:39 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 09:58:10 PM
This guy is impressive.  Coach at D II Northwest Missouri State.  2 national championships in the last three years including undefeated last year.  One loss this year....looking like three championships in four years.
Lol
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: 🏀 on March 07, 2020, 10:01:46 PM
These are hilarious.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:02:41 PM
Any constructive reasons beside nope and lol?
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Windyplayer on March 07, 2020, 10:06:44 PM
Yes, you're venting and subconsciously trolling.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: 🏀 on March 07, 2020, 10:06:56 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:02:41 PM
Any constructive reasons beside nope and lol?

Suggest this when Wojo is actually gone and get back to it.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:09:37 PM
Some weird cats out tonight including some amateur psychologists...must have stayed at a holiday inn last night. 

Let me know when you have a good reason why this guy killing it nationally in d II is a bad choice.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: We R Final Four on March 07, 2020, 10:10:27 PM
Sultan must have seen his team's play.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: 🏀 on March 07, 2020, 10:12:11 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:09:37 PM
Some weird cats out tonight including some amateur psychologists...must have stayed at a holiday inn last night. 

Let me know when you have a good reason why this guy killing it nationally in d II is a bad choice.

My old high school coach hasn't lost a game for three years, has only lost 13 games in ten seasons.

Killing it.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Billy Hoyle on March 07, 2020, 10:14:49 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:09:37 PM
Some weird cats out tonight including some amateur psychologists...must have stayed at a holiday inn last night. 

Let me know when you have a good reason why this guy killing it nationally in d II is a bad choice.

Kim Anderson. You're welcome.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:15:01 PM
Quote from: Retire0 on March 07, 2020, 10:12:11 PM
My old high school coach hasn't lost a game for three years, has only lost 13 games in ten seasons.

Killing it.

Lol.  I'm sure we can find pee wee coaches too.  Not really a comparison  with national competitive college d II ball.  Lots of good college coaches have come up from d II.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 10:16:39 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:15:01 PM
Lol.  I'm sure we can find pee wee coaches too.  Not really a comparison  with national competitive college d II ball.  Lots of good college coaches have come up from d II.

Name one who went right to the high major level and had success
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: 🏀 on March 07, 2020, 10:17:43 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:15:01 PM
Lol.  I'm sure we can find pee wee coaches too.  Not really a comparison  with national competitive college d II ball.  Lots of good college coaches have come up from d II.

Lol. McCullom has coached for/against a dozen+ of the players from that high school.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: 🏀 on March 07, 2020, 10:18:41 PM
Lol. There's more talent on AAU teams then DII, should Scholl look there?
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:18:50 PM
Bo Ryan, Bruce Pearl, Dick Bennett...can't just dismiss it entirely. 

I'd cast a wide net if I were MU and let chips fall where they may to find the right guy.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: wadesworld on March 07, 2020, 10:19:29 PM
We needed a new thread for this?
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: 🏀 on March 07, 2020, 10:20:19 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:18:50 PM
Bo Ryan, Bruce Pearl, Dick Bennett...can't just dismiss it entirely. 

I'd cast a wide net if I were MU and let chips fall where they may to find the right guy.

How many years did it take those guys for high level success? Lol.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:21:40 PM
Quote from: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 10:16:39 PM
Name one who went right to the high major level and had success

If a guy can coach and recruit, he'll succeed. Ryan had a cup of coffee at UWM and started winning in Madison from day 1
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:23:15 PM
Quote from: Retire0 on March 07, 2020, 10:20:19 PM
How many years did it take those guys for high level success? Lol.

Not long.  LOL.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: The Sultan on March 07, 2020, 10:23:15 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:18:50 PM
Bo Ryan, Bruce Pearl, Dick Bennett...can't just dismiss it entirely. 

I'd cast a wide net if I were MU and let chips fall where they may to find the right guy.

None of those guys went right to a high major.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: 🏀 on March 07, 2020, 10:24:49 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:23:15 PM
Not long.  LOL.

None went straight to high major with immediate success. Do the math LOOOOOOL.

unnatural carnal knowledgeing idiots around here.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Billy Hoyle on March 07, 2020, 10:25:25 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:21:40 PM
If a guy can coach and recruit, he'll succeed. Ryan had a cup of coffee at UWM and started winning in Madison from day 1

Yep. Just ask Missouri:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Anderson_(basketball)
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:26:28 PM
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on March 07, 2020, 10:23:15 PM
None of those guys went right to a high major.

Whatever!! So you think they would have bombed and been losers had they done so? Asinine
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 10:27:15 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:21:40 PM
If a guy can coach and recruit, he'll succeed. Ryan had a cup of coffee at UWM and started winning in Madison from day 1

So cause he coached well at D2 he can recruit? Again, McCollum hasn't experienced a single minute of D-1 basketball as a player, assistant, or HC.

Bo Ryan was a D1 assistant before Platteville, and still spent 2 full seasons at UWM. False equivalency
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: 🏀 on March 07, 2020, 10:27:38 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:26:28 PM
Whatever!! So you think they would have bombed and been losers had they done so? Asinine

Thanks for playing Cher, you've made you're point.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:29:04 PM
Quote from: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 10:27:15 PM
So cause he coached well at D2 he can recruit? Again, McCollum hasn't experienced a single minute of D-1 basketball as a player, assistant, or HC.

Bo Ryan was a D1 assistant before Platteville, and still spent 2 full seasons at UWM. False equivalency

Go back and read my first reply. I'm not advocating for the guy. Just saying it shouldn't be completely discounted.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: The Sultan on March 07, 2020, 10:30:06 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:26:28 PM
Whatever!! So you think they would have bombed and been losers had they done so? Asinine

I didn't say that. I think their experience at lower levels helped them to succeed though.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 10:36:53 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 10:29:04 PM
Go back and read my first reply. I'm not advocating for the guy. Just saying it shouldn't be completely discounted.

That's fine. Find an example of it working and report back.

Otherwise it's like looking for gold in a coal mine cause it's still a mine and it might work, shouldn't totally discount it!
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:39:02 PM
Chris Beard, Bo Ryan, John Beilein, etc.  starting and succeeding in d II shouldn't just be discounted as no way the coach will prosper in d I.  He would be a gamble but a winner with a high ceiling potentially imo.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 10:51:04 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:39:02 PM
Chris Beard, Bo Ryan, John Beilein, etc.  starting and succeeding in d II shouldn't just be discounted as no way the coach will prosper in d I.  He would be a gamble but a winner with a high ceiling potentially imo.

Are you purposefully ignoring everything here in which McCollum or guys at the UW schools mentioned have nothing in common with Beard or Ryan, background wise, and Beilein made the jump 30 years ago at a school that is a buy game for us.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: The Sultan on March 07, 2020, 10:52:10 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:39:02 PM
Chris Beard, Bo Ryan, John Beilein, etc.  starting and succeeding in d II shouldn't just be discounted as no way the coach will prosper in d I.  He would be a gamble but a winner with a high ceiling potentially imo.

UWGB hired the head coach of the D2 champions a couple years ago. Guy with Midwest roots and everything. And he's been...OK.

The outliers are usually just outliers.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 11:00:11 PM
Quote from: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 10:51:04 PM
Are you purposefully ignoring everything here in which McCollum or guys at the UW schools mentioned have nothing in common with Beard or Ryan, background wise, and Beilein made the jump 30 years ago at a school that is a buy game for us.

So coaches that took teams to the Final Four would have otherwise all been failures had they made immediate jump from sub D-1 directly to a P6 program? They would have all been irrelevant were it not for stops at low or mid majors?
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 11:14:13 PM
Quote from: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 11:00:11 PM
So coaches that took teams to the Final Four would have otherwise all been failures had they made immediate jump from sub D-1 directly to a P6 program? They would have all been irrelevant were it not for stops at low or mid majors?

Those coaches you mention.

1) spent time at high major programs as an assistant for nearly a decade each.

2) these coaches cut their teeth at a non-P6 school

McCollum has neither. He was a D2 assistant. We gave the most recent example of someone who has number 1 and not number 2, and how it failed. Having neither is a recipe for disaster
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: HutchwasClutch on March 07, 2020, 11:27:30 PM
Quote from: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 11:14:13 PM
Those coaches you mention.

1) spent time at high major programs as an assistant for nearly a decade each.

2) these coaches cut their teeth at a non-P6 school

McCollum has neither. He was a D2 assistant. We gave the most recent example of someone who has number 1 and not number 2, and how it failed. Having neither is a recipe for disaster

Yes, point taken that zero high D-1 experience of any type is not going to be a recipe for success at a program like ours.

Ryan had been away from major D-1 a long time though before making his way back though, pretty sure all the way back to failed Coefield regime!  Otherwise  Platteville and UWM for only two years.  So it wasn't way off from being a straight jump.  And that's why I go back if a guy can coach and run a program, he'll have success no matter the path. 
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: willie warrior on March 08, 2020, 11:40:06 AM
Quote from: Retire0 on March 07, 2020, 10:18:41 PM
Lol. There's more talent on AAU teams then DII, should Scholl look there?
Scholl better be looking before a freight train hits him blindside.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Dr. Blackheart on March 08, 2020, 11:45:19 AM
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on March 07, 2020, 10:52:10 PM
UWGB hired the head coach of the D2 champions a couple years ago. Guy with Midwest roots and everything. And he's been...OK.

The outliers are usually just outliers.

Al McGuire
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: mu_hilltopper on March 08, 2020, 11:49:04 AM
However you slice it .. Marquette needs a coach who can make something with nothing .. increase the value beyond the sum of their parts.   

MU needs a coach who knows his way around a junkyard.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: oldwarrior81 on March 08, 2020, 11:53:20 AM
I suggest one look at Linc Darner's resume prior to taking the job in Green Bay.
After five years he's 91-79 in the Horizon League.

Usually the D2 guys are best served by proving it at a lower D1 level.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Dish on March 08, 2020, 12:00:37 PM
Hologram Al benefits...

-No threat to get Coronavirus
-Reasonably inexpensive
-Stan can do Stan things still
-Can literally recruit at infinity places at once
-Appeals to sweater vest crowd
-No other program has a hologram coach


Just sayin...
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Silent Verbal on March 08, 2020, 12:01:16 PM
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on March 08, 2020, 11:49:04 AM
However you slice it .. Marquette needs a coach who can make something with nothing .. increase the value beyond the sum of their parts.   

MU needs a coach who knows his way around a junkyard.

I agree with this analysis.  All the successful coaches at MU, minus Crean, have been brash renegades.  Maybe Wojo would be better somewhere else, but he's been a poor fit for MU.  Unfortunately, he was exactly the type of guy MU was looking to hire when he got the job, and the kind they still seem to want in place.  I'm not sure we'll see another "stick it to the man" type of coach at Marquette anytime soon.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: keefe on March 08, 2020, 12:10:52 PM
Quote from: JWags85 on March 07, 2020, 10:16:39 PM
Name one who went right to the high major level and had success

Wags

Beilein went from D II to DI and quickly turned around a theretofore uncompetitive Canisius.

But Beilein is likely the exception.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Dawson Rental on March 08, 2020, 12:21:40 PM
Quote from: Blackhat on March 07, 2020, 10:09:37 PM
Some weird cats out tonight including some amateur psychologists...must have stayed at a holiday inn last night. 

Let me know when you have a good reason why this guy killing it nationally in d II is a bad choice.

A good reason?  How about three?

   1. Dawson Garcia  (6'11")
   2. Justin Lewis      (6'7.5" with a 7'2" wingspan)
   3. Osasere Ighodaro   (6'9")

     With Markus and Sacar having to score from the wing, Marquette could be neutralized by players with great length.   Wojo noticed and that's why we have the above three coming in and why MU will be awfully hard to score on starting next year.  Unless, of course,  we fire Wojo and they're most likely all gone, and we will have something very close to DePaul while the new guy figures out what's needed and how to recruit it, if he ever can recruit it.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: JWags85 on March 08, 2020, 01:09:17 PM
Quote from: keefe on March 08, 2020, 12:10:52 PM
Wags

Beilein went from D II to DI and quickly turned around a theretofore uncompetitive Canisius.
2
But Beilein is likely the exception.

Agreed he's likely an exception, but even with Beilein, he went 10 years and 6 postseason (2 NCAA, 4 NIT) berths before he got to a level that coaching at Marquette would be at.  And again, I think high level D-1 and D2 are different by even greater scales than they were in the early 90s.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Silent Verbal on March 08, 2020, 01:15:13 PM
Quote from: 4everDawson on March 08, 2020, 12:21:40 PM
A good reason?  How about three?

   1. Dawson Garcia  (6'11")
   2. Justin Lewis      (6'7.5" with a 7'2" wingspan)
   3. Osasere Ighodaro   (6'9")

     With Markus and Sacar having to score from the wing, Marquette could be neutralized by players with great length.   Wojo noticed and that's why we have the above three coming in and why MU will be awfully hard to score on starting next year.  Unless, of course,  we fire Wojo and they're most likely all gone, and we will have something very close to DePaul while the new guy figures out what's needed and how to recruit it, if he ever can recruit it.

Maybe we'll be hard to score on, but more likely the freshmen will be freshmen and take awhile to adjust to playing defense at the college level.  And the guard situation next year does not look great at the moment.  We plugged one hole and another's opening right up.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: The Sultan on March 08, 2020, 02:03:49 PM
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on March 08, 2020, 11:45:19 AM
Al McGuire

60 years ago
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: NickelDimer on March 08, 2020, 07:04:33 PM
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on March 08, 2020, 11:49:04 AM
However you slice it .. Marquette needs a coach who can make something with nothing .. increase the value beyond the sum of their parts.   

MU needs a coach who knows his way around a junkyard.
Yep. That's our brand. We're so off brand right now it's unrecognizable. Do not like.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: MikeDeanesDarkGlasses on March 08, 2020, 08:20:50 PM
Quote from: NickelDimer on March 08, 2020, 07:04:33 PM
Yep. That's our brand. We're so off brand right now it's unrecognizable. Do not like.

Bo Ryan is for hire....
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: lawdog77 on March 08, 2020, 08:27:16 PM
Quote from: Silent Verbal on March 08, 2020, 01:15:13 PM
Maybe we'll be hard to score on, but more likely the freshmen will be freshmen and take awhile to adjust to playing defense at the college level.  And the guard situation next year does not look great at the moment.  We plugged one hole and another's opening right up.
I have a feeling our starting guards will be Symir and Greg. Not bad, but we need depth. If Mane signs, we will have a decent backcourt. Cain or Bailey have to step up and lead the youth at the 3. Garcia at the 4, and John at the 5. Lewis and Osa to be brought along slowly. That's not a bad team.

Wojo has my vote for another year.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: MikeDeanesDarkGlasses on March 08, 2020, 08:29:41 PM
Quote from: lawdog77 on March 08, 2020, 08:27:16 PM
I have a feeling our starting guards will be Symir and Greg. Not bad, but we need depth. If Mane signs, we will have a decent backcourt. Cain or Bailey have to step up and lead the youth at the 3. Garcia at the 4, and John at the 5. Lewis and Osa to be brought along slowly. That's not a bad team.

Wojo has my vote for another year.

Exactly how good do you think this team would be?
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Silent Verbal on March 08, 2020, 08:47:54 PM
Quote from: MikeDeanesDarkGlasses on March 08, 2020, 08:29:41 PM
Exactly how good do you think this team would be?

Without Mane, it'll probably be similar to the Ellenson year.  And we missed the postseason that year.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: ZiggysFryBoy on March 08, 2020, 08:49:33 PM
Quote from: MikeDeanesDarkGlasses on March 08, 2020, 08:20:50 PM
Bo Ryan is for hire....

^^^ban dis guy.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: lawdog77 on March 08, 2020, 08:50:12 PM
Quote from: MikeDeanesDarkGlasses on March 08, 2020, 08:29:41 PM
Exactly how good do you think this team would be?
Floor-bubble team, ceiling sweet 16. I really think once the keys are given to Sy to run the team the offense will run great. The problem, I believe, will be defense.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: The Sultan on March 09, 2020, 07:25:25 AM
Quote from: lawdog77 on March 08, 2020, 08:50:12 PM
Floor-bubble team, ceiling sweet 16. I really think once the keys are given to Sy to run the team the offense will run great. The problem, I believe, will be defense.


I just can't see how next years team can be a tournament team. I like Symir, but I worry about him as a full time PG in the BE.
Title: Re: Ben McCollum
Post by: Dawson Rental on March 09, 2020, 08:17:48 PM
Quote from: MikeDeanesDarkGlasses on March 08, 2020, 08:20:50 PM
Bo Ryan is for hire....

He only recruits within a car's drive of campus.  It's too hard to explain another plane ticket for his massage therapist.
EhPortal 1.39.9 © 2025, WebDev