MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: PuertoRicanNightmare on April 15, 2019, 04:12:14 PM
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I see a lot of speculation about how, if the Hausers were unhappy with Markus’ ball hogging and inefficiency than why didn’t Wojo do something about it?
I’m wondering if anybody would care to speculate why he did not. Why would a coach known for his defensive intensity, a pass first PG who played at Duke let this go on?
Is it possible Markus is being coddled because he’s fragile? Is it possible there are issues there that put Wojo in a no win situation? Damned if he does, damned if he doesn’t? Maybe he was so certain the Hausers were good that he forgot they needed a little attention themselves?
I’m sorry, I know Wojo is not Buzz. He’s not KO. But I don’t think he’s the problem.
I think the problem is Howard. We can all see it and have seen it for a while. You really think Wojo hasn’t talked to him ad nauseam? Howard continues to pay lip service to his teammates in interviews but it’s blatantly artificial and now we’ve lost two starters as a result.
Personally, I was hoping he’d leave after this year. I am a fan of Marquette basketball. As such, I don’t tune in to watch Markus Howard take 25 shots a game. I just don’t. I don’t care if he scores 25 or 35 or 50. I think Markus does care about that. I watch because I hope we win.
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Rican, who drives da bus? Therein lies yo answer, hey?
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Wojo is to blame. If Wojo talked to Howard, and Howard doesn't listen, theres always suspensions and the pine.
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That read like a very damning opinion of Wojo as a head coach. If what you say is true, Wojo should be gone soon.
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The speculation is interesting. The problem is regardless of whoever is creating the issue, it is the responsibility of the head coach to make sure it never gets to this point.
Wojo brought all the guys here and assembled the team. It is on him to make it work.
If this was an either/or calculus and he feels that he can win more next season with Howard than the Hausers, this is the type of decision he is paid to make.
The problem is letting it get to the point where it becomes an either/or decision between his 3 best players. That is a catastrophic failure of leadership.
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The problem is letting it get to the point where it becomes an either/or decision between his 3 best players. That is a catastrophic failure of leadership.
This is really the crux for me. How in the holy hell did we get to this point? And why was nothing done to stop it?
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This is really the crux for me. How in the holy hell did we get to this point? And why was nothing done to stop it?
Because Buzz left the cupboard bare. ;)
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Don't particularly care who's fault it is. just know its time for a change.
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Howard is a classic coach killer. I’d be much more interested in watching this team next year without Howard than I will be with Howard and no Hausers.
I’m not even looking forward to the season. I can’t say I’ve ever felt that way. I can’t watch this kid dominate the ball, hoist up shot after shot and then talk up his teammates. It’s terrible basketball.
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I also wonder if they both saw a lot of their ppg going to Koby this year. Between he and Markus, that’s a lot of potential points. One or both of Sam and Joey take a hit, and while it may be good for the team, probably not good for draft stock.
Not to mention the fact that Sacar can be looked to to score, too.
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Howard is a classic coach killer. I’d be much more interested in watching this team next year without Howard than I will be with Howard and no Hausers.
I’m not even looking forward to the season. I can’t say I’ve ever felt that way. I can’t watch this kid dominate the ball, hoist up shot after shot and then talk up his teammates. It’s terrible basketball.
This isn't Markus' fault. Don't make this about him. He was allowed to do what he's done. That's on the coaching.
I do agree that this was a major kick to the nuts though. I think I've only not watched 1 Marquette game since like 2009. One game is like 8 or 9 seasons. And I am seriously at a point to where I am debating if its worth it right now. Time heals all and I will be fine come September, but holy fu*k this crap sucks.
Sam is the epitome of what it takes to be a great college basketball player, and I loved 99.9% of his game.
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The problem is that the Hauser brothers are a lot more selfish than we ever realized. Markus is the Big East player of the year – we should be giving him the ball in crunch time.
If we have to pick one of the two to blame, I guess that’s on Wojo...but I find it hard to blame him for not sensing the selfishness of these guys when he was recruiting them..
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They are all a bit to blame. Just depends on what you think is "wrong."
Markus shoots too much.
Wojo didn't manage his players and their expectations.
Hausers quit on their commitment to the team and Marquette.
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I see a lot of speculation about how, if the Hausers were unhappy with Markus’ ball hogging and inefficiency than why didn’t Wojo do something about it?
I’m wondering if anybody would care to speculate why he did not. Why would a coach known for his defensive intensity, a pass first PG who played at Duke let this go on?
Is it possible Markus is being coddled because he’s fragile? Is it possible there are issues there that put Wojo in a no win situation? Damned if he does, damned if he doesn’t? Maybe he was so certain the Hausers were good that he forgot they needed a little attention themselves?
I’m sorry, I know Wojo is not Buzz. He’s not KO. But I don’t think he’s the problem.
I think the problem is Howard. We can all see it and have seen it for a while. You really think Wojo hasn’t talked to him ad nauseam? Howard continues to pay lip service to his teammates in interviews but it’s blatantly artificial and now we’ve lost two starters as a result.
Personally, I was hoping he’d leave after this year. I am a fan of Marquette basketball. As such, I don’t tune in to watch Markus Howard take 25 shots a game. I just don’t. I don’t care if he scores 25 or 35 or 50. I think Markus does care about that. I watch because I hope we win.
markus took 17 shots a game, sam took 11. Sam and Joe couldn't tKe their man off the dribble. It falls on the coach, not Markus.
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Holy hell people...how dare you blame Markus for this, or even the Hausers. I'll tell you what...you know who else jacked up shots like they were a one man team?? Carsen Edwards from Purdue. He had a HIGHER shot rate then Markus did. What did Purdue do?? Only go to the Elite 8. They made it work..Matt Painter made it work...who didn't make it work?? WOJO.
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I also wonder if they both saw a lot of their ppg going to Koby this year. Between he and Markus, that’s a lot of potential points. One or both of Sam and Joey take a hit, and while it may be good for the team, probably not good for draft stock.
This right here. No need to over complicate this. Sam is trying to get to the NBA. His minutes, usage and role were likely to be reduced next year, and potentially significantly reduced when you factor in not only McEwen, but Elliott, Bailey, etc. He was looking at his senior season as a 3-pt specialist who was an average defender and rebounder. They consistently lacked athleticism as a team this year. Next year they will have more options, further eroding his PT. There was undoubtedly frustration on the Hausers' part (I assume that includes the parents), but this was a business decision, and if the rumors of McEwen whipping everyone's asses in practice are to be believed, it was likely a pretty easy one. Really no need to look for anything more complicated or sinister than that.
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This right here. No need to over complicate this. Sam is trying to get to the NBA. His minutes, usage and role were likely to be reduced next year, and potentially significantly reduced when you factor in not only McEwen, but Elliott, Bailey, etc. He was looking at his senior season as a 3-pt specialist who was an average defender and rebounder. They consistently lacked athleticism as a team this year. Next year they will have more options, further eroding his PT. There was undoubtedly frustration on the Hausers' part (I assume that includes the parents), but this was a business decision, and if the rumors of McEwen whipping everyone's asses in practice are to be believed, it was likely a pretty easy one. Really no need to look for anything more complicated or sinister than that.
Weird way to go about it. He'll be closing fast on 24 years old by the time the 2021 NBA draft rolls around. At that age, he might as well be 40 as far as NBA personnel are concerned.
Also, keep that in mind when he plays in 2020-21. He'll be a 23-year-old man playing against a lot of teenagers.
Just a weird decision all around by him.
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Weird way to go about it. He'll be closing fast on 24 years old by the time the 2021 NBA draft rolls around. At that age, he might as well be 40 as far as NBA personnel are concerned.
Also, keep that in mind when he plays in 2020-21. He'll be a 23-year-old man playing against a lot of teenagers.
Just a weird decision all around by him.
Good point. To be drafted as a fifth-year senior, you pretty much need to make first or second team All-American. Sam is a solid player, but I kind of doubt he’s going to do that.
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...if the rumors of McEwen whipping everyone's asses in practice are to be believed...
Your post reminds me of another time when we heard rumors of a player who wasn't eligible to compete "whipping everyone's asses in practice." A guy can dream, right?
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Holy hell people...how dare you blame Markus for this, or even the Hausers. I'll tell you what...you know who else jacked up shots like they were a one man team?? Carsen Edwards from Purdue. He had a HIGHER shot rate then Markus did. What did Purdue do?? Only go to the Elite 8. They made it work..Matt Painter made it work...who didn't make it work?? WOJO.
Ummmm...if we are assuming there is “blame,” it’s easy (and fair) to blame the Hausers, since they are the ones who made the decision.
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My guess is both
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Or neither. The coach is doing what he believes will get wins. Maybe it was the Hausers that were unrealistic. Let's see what happens when they are eligible in two years. Will they be the brilliant stars they are expecting to be? Or will reality meet up with them again?
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Weird way to go about it. He'll be closing fast on 24 years old by the time the 2021 NBA draft rolls around. At that age, he might as well be 40 as far as NBA personnel are concerned.
Also, keep that in mind when he plays in 2020-21. He'll be a 23-year-old man playing against a lot of teenagers.
Just a weird decision all around by him.
Maybe, but would he be better off staying at MU and playing 3rd or 4th fiddle (Howard, McEwen, Joey)?
It worked out pretty well for another 5th year UVA graduate a couple years back. An extra year to work on specific aspects of his game? Is that the worst thing?
If I had to guess, and I am certainly guessing, Wojo and the Hauser family had a very frank discussion about expectations for next year, and the Hausers made the (business) decision they made. Good on everyone involved if that's the case.
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Feel really bad for Howard. He has given a lot to this program and I’m sure the news of this has really hurt his feelings and put a downer on the offseason. I’m not sure how he can move on from this and feel positive going into next year.
On the other hand, this is a complete embarrassment and failure for Wojo to let this happen. This moment will haunt the program for the next 12+ months and it will be impossible to look past what a failure this day has been. How he was not able to manage this situation is incomprehensible. The hausers and Howard were close friends (and still most likely are) but Wojo designed a system that caused them to hate playing with each other so much which led to this event occurring.
As others have mentioned, the hausers are making a huge sacrifice (especially Sam) to get out of this dumpster fire of a program and they would rather wait an entire year than be a part of this team where they were earning max minutes and having the free reign to do as they pleased.
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Weird way to go about it. He'll be closing fast on 24 years old by the time the 2021 NBA draft rolls around. At that age, he might as well be 40 as far as NBA personnel are concerned.
Also, keep that in mind when he plays in 2020-21. He'll be a 23-year-old man playing against a lot of teenagers.
Just a weird decision all around by him.
I think Joey’s stock was the deciding factor. Instead of potentially being the 4th option next year, he can sit out and let the hype machine do its magic. He comes back in 2020 and as long as his numbers improve in the slightest, he’s in a better position for the draft somewhere down the line.
Right or wrong, these kids (and their parents) see the NBA in their future first.
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I think Joey’s stock was the deciding factor. Instead of potentially being the 4th option next year, he can sit out and let the hype machine do its magic. He comes back in 2020 and as long as his numbers improve in the slightest, he’s in a better position for the draft somewhere down the line.
Right or wrong, these kids (and their parents) see the NBA in their future first.
Oh, I think it's fine of they and their parents are looking out for hopes of an NBA future. They ought to be.
I just don't see this helping Sam's NBA future in the least.
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oh come on this is ridiculous.. How full of yourself can you be? they and the parents are looking to get to the nba and they cant be the stars at MU cuz markus? what does sam think hes gonna be a superstar at UVA or MSU? please...… They are both incredibly unathletic for NBA standards. Sam is pretty one-dimensional in my opinion. Great college player. Shot in the dark to have an NBA career.
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If Sam Hauser is looking to play in the NBA (and I certainly understand and wouldn’t dissuade him), his best path was to play next year at Marquette. Either that, or he should just outright declare right now.
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I will say again those that assume this was all about putting themselves in the best position to play at the next level are really underselling the issues that caused them to leave. It seems clear to me this goes way beyond wanting to go somewhere they’re featured players.
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I will say again those that assume this was all about putting themselves in the best position to play at the next level are really underselling the issues that caused them to leave. It seems clear to me this goes way beyond wanting to go somewhere they’re featured players.
This +1000...people want to believe that's the case because it's the thing they think makes the most sense, thus then they can blame the Hauser's for making a bad decision. If Sam is leaving with one year left, things must be REALLY bad internally, to think otherwise is closing your eyes to reality. This has less to do about their "basketball futures" then it does other problems that they didn't see getting corrected under Wojo. That's just the facts.
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This +1000...people want to believe that's the case because it's the thing they think makes the most sense, thus then they can blame the Hauser's for making a bad decision. If Sam is leaving with one year left, things must be REALLY bad internally, to think otherwise is closing your eyes to reality. This has less to do about their "basketball futures" then it does other problems that they didn't see getting corrected under Wojo. That's just the facts.
If more don't transfer, does that mitigate the catastrophic program issue and poiint more toward a Hauser issue?
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If more don't transfer, does that mitigate the catastrophic program issue and poiint more toward a Hauser issue?
That’s what I’m thinking. I have no clue if there’s any merit to it or not, but maybe it was a relief to some players that they’re gone.
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This +1000...people want to believe that's the case because it's the thing they think makes the most sense, thus then they can blame the Hauser's for making a bad decision. If Sam is leaving with one year left, things must be REALLY bad internally, to think otherwise is closing your eyes to reality. This has less to do about their "basketball futures" then it does other problems that they didn't see getting corrected under Wojo. That's just the facts.
No, its actually your opinion and perception of the situation.
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If more don't transfer, does that mitigate the catastrophic program issue and poiint more toward a Hauser issue?
Maybe, maybe not. There’s been plenty of speculation today that others are also unhappy and considering transferring. Just because they may choose not to doesn’t necessarily pardon Wojo.
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If more don't transfer, does that mitigate the catastrophic program issue and poiint more toward a Hauser issue?
No. A ton of minutes just opened up, so other guys who might’ve transferred could stay now because of that.
This is 100% a program issue. Wojo had to keep the Hausers. It’s an absolute embarrassment that he couldn’t manage to do it. My god, how could anyone believe otherwise?
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No. A ton of minutes just opened up, so other guys who might’ve transferred could stay now because of that.
This is 100% a program issue. Wojo had to keep the Hausers. It’s an absolute embarrassment that he couldn’t manage to do it. My god, how could anyone believe otherwise?
How can you be so sure?
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Howard is a classic coach killer. I’d be much more interested in watching this team next year without Howard than I will be with Howard and no Hausers.
I’m not even looking forward to the season. I can’t say I’ve ever felt that way. I can’t watch this kid dominate the ball, hoist up shot after shot and then talk up his teammates. It’s terrible basketball.
I don't disagree, Rican, but so, for example, was Henry Ellenson. But because they're his "stars" Wojo protects them at all costs. They can take bad shot after bad shot and the coach doesn't say boo - on the contrary, he says "More!" somebody in another thread said that Markus's usage in our 7 game skid was an unreal 41%. Any coach who allows that from a guy who's gone ice cold is stupid or has lost control. Either way it's bad news for Wojo.
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Howard is a classic coach killer. I’d be much more interested in watching this team next year without Howard than I will be with Howard and no Hausers.
I’m not even looking forward to the season. I can’t say I’ve ever felt that way. I can’t watch this kid dominate the ball, hoist up shot after shot and then talk up his teammates. It’s terrible basketball.
I have to agree. While I was really happy Markus decided to come back a part of me was curious to watch next year’s team without him. We just don’t consistently run offense with his usage rate.
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No, its actually your opinion and perception of the situation.
Actually it's not..I will leave it at that.
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I thought the problem was solved with someone other than Markus running the point, like Kobe. His job would be to get the ball to the open guy.
Much harder to be a ball hog if you are not running the point.
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I can't remember which game it was, but it was fairly late in the season, maybe one of those quickie halftime interviews.
I'm paraphrasing here ... Wojo was asked about Markus having a great first half but would it help the team if he distributed the ball a little more. Wojo smiled and said sure but quickly added that Markus is a special talent and you don't want to tell a player like that to stop shooting.
Take from that what you will. I take it as a coach who understood what Markus was as a player but who also ceded control of the team to that player, and now the chickens have come home to roost. Or actually, the chickens are leaving home for another roost.
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I can't remember which game it was, but it was fairly late in the season, maybe one of those quickie halftime interviews.
I'm paraphrasing here ... Wojo was asked about Markus having a great first half but would it help the team if he distributed the ball a little more. Wojo smiled and said sure but quickly added that Markus is a special talent and you don't want to tell a player like that to stop shooting.
Take from that what you will. I take it as a coach who understood what Markus was as a player but who also ceded control of the team to that player, and now the chickens have come home to roost. Or actually, the chickens are leaving home for another roost.
The problem with this is that Howard doesn’t have the athleticism to do this game after game. He’s a terrible finisher at the rim, mostly I suspect because defenders are certain he will never attempt to find an open teammate.
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Actually it's not..I will leave it at that.
Oh, so you know a guy who knows a guy. Why didn’t you say so in the first place?
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I’m sorry, I know Wojo is not Buzz. He’s not KO. But I don’t think he’s the problem.
(https://onmilwaukee.com/images/articles/ma/marquettehiresstevewojciechowski/marquettehiresstevewojciechowski_fullsize_story1.jpg?20140402113651)
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Maybe Mr & Mrs Hauser ??? 😏😎
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I thought the problem was solved with someone other than Markus running the point, like Kobe. His job would be to get the ball to the open guy.
Much harder to be a ball hog if you are not running the point.
See, I think this might be part of the problem. We all just assume Markus wouldn't have been playing as much PG next year, but what if Wojo doesn't feel that way?? I mean he did say at one point a year or so ago, that "he owes it to Markus for his development for the next level" to play him at PG.
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Joey. Wanted to be featured. Wasn't going to happen next year. Sam's loyalty was to his brother over the team. Joey was yelling and getting frustrated in November when he didn't get the ball when he wanted it. Sam would tell him to be quiet. The seeds of this were sown early.
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Next man up, hey?
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Joey. Wanted to be featured. Wasn't going to happen next year. Sam's loyalty was to his brother over the team. Joey was yelling and getting frustrated in November when he didn't get the ball when he wanted it. Sam would tell him to be quiet. The seeds of this were sown early.
EXACTLY.
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Joey. Wanted to be featured. Wasn't going to happen next year. Sam's loyalty was to his brother over the team. Joey was yelling and getting frustrated in November when he didn't get the ball when he wanted it. Sam would tell him to be quiet. The seeds of this were sown early.
Whatever the case, this is about Joey. Sam was not leaving for one year. Siggghh....
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Whatever the case, this is about Joey. Sam was not leaving for one year. Siggghh....
EXACTLY. Sam took one for team Hauser.
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Whatever the case, this is about Joey. Sam was not leaving for one year. Siggghh....
Actually Sam did. We can hypothesize all we want but sam, the guy who outscored many MU greats and was widely beloved by the MU faithful left for one year.
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Whatever the case, this is about Joey. Sam was not leaving for one year. Siggghh....
To quote a famous show, "You know nothing, Nukem2".
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To quote a famous show, "You know nothing, Nukem2".
Nor do you. This is all conjecture.
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EXACTLY. Sam took one for team Hauser.
Does not pass the smell test. Joey was impatient, wanted more in less time. But Sam was the driver here..... no way he makes this move in his senior year in which he had All-Big-East potential just because his younger (less effective) brother was unhappy with his role. Sam couldn't take another year of Markus-ball, and it appears Wojo wasn't able to convince him that he could or wanted to rein Markus in. I love my brothers, but if either one of them asked me to make a move that might railroad my future because they couldn't handle one season of not being "the guy" I would tell them to derelick my balls, it was nice playing with you.
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Last week Dodds posted: "I think an extension for Wojo would be smart"
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No. A ton of minutes just opened up, so other guys who might’ve transferred could stay now because of that.
This is 100% a program issue. Wojo had to keep the Hausers. It’s an absolute embarrassment that he couldn’t manage to do it. My god, how could anyone believe otherwise?
So now the minutes available matter, but to Sam and Joey they didn't? Those guys were going to get a ton next season.
If the program/wojo is so bad right now that the Hausers transfer regardless of minutes, why would others stay regardless of minutes?
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****Remind me 9 months time
Wojo supporters will use this event as an excuse to validate not firing wojo for another 3 years. Cause you know, he has to see a full class go through. Even though he cant seem to keep one.
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Really disappointed by the Hausers quitting the team. It seems like a lousy decision.
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Does not pass the smell test. Joey was impatient, wanted more in less time. But Sam was the driver here..... no way he makes this move in his senior year in which he had All-Big-East potential just because his younger (less effective) brother was unhappy with his role. Sam couldn't take another year of Markus-ball, and it appears Wojo wasn't able to convince him that he could or wanted to rein Markus in. I love my brothers, but if either one of them asked me to make a move that might railroad my future because they couldn't handle one season of not being "the guy" I would tell them to derelick my balls, it was nice playing with you.
(https://media1.giphy.com/media/10GqZIENqWKfeM/giphy.gif?cid=790b76115cb53ac23366486e73b74e14)
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I think Sam ultimately wants to win. He seems to be incredibly competitive on the court, and I don't think he felt staying with Markus and Co. would allow him to get a national championship. Maybe he thought being ranked in the top 10 only to fizzle out early in the NCAA's was was the ceiling.
Getting to play at Virginia or wherever he goes, perhaps he feels will be a better team with a chance to win it all. Pure speculation obviously, but I can't come up with many other reasonable options in this bizarre situation.
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I think Sam ultimately wants to win. He seems to be incredibly competitive on the court, and I don't think he felt staying with Markus and Co. would allow him to get a national championship. Maybe he thought being ranked in the top 10 only to fizzle out early in the NCAA's was was the ceiling.
Getting to play at Virginia or wherever he goes, perhaps he feels will be a better team with a chance to win it all. Pure speculation obviously, but I can't come up with many other reasonable options in this bizarre situation.
Congrats, this is the stupidest post of a stupid day.
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If the program/wojo is so bad right now that the Hausers transfer regardless of minutes, why would others stay regardless of minutes?
That’s a good question. We may not be out of the woods yet.
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That’s a good question. We may not be out of the woods yet.
True. Maybe we aren't.
But that wasn't the stance of the person I was responding to
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Congrats, this is the stupidest post of a stupid day.
Please enlighten us....why exactly did Sam want to leave? It certainly isn't to increase his draft stock by waiting till he is 24. I doubt he is leaving solely for Joey, but I suppose its possible. It's not outrageous to think he grew tired of losing 6 out 7 watching Markus ball. He probably thought it would happen again this year.
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Please enlighten us....why exactly did Sam want to leave? It certainly isn't to increase his draft stock by waiting till he is 24. I doubt he is leaving solely for Joey, but I suppose its possible. It's not outrageous to think he grew tired of losing 6 out 7 watching Markus ball. He probably thought it would happen again this year.
Your argument was that Sam wants to win. Marquette was expected to win a lot next year.
So clearly, its not that.
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Your argument was that Sam wants to win. Marquette was expected to win a lot next year.
So clearly, its not that.
We were also expected to win at some point after February 23 this year. Look at what happened. Expectations don't always mean a whole lot.
The idea that the Hausers were frustrated with Wojo's coaching and gameplanning makes sense. And for that to escalate as we collapsed game after game to close out the season also makes sense. I'm guessing this built up over the season, and they decided they would be better off playing for someone other than Wojo even if it means they have to sit for a year.
And remember, they're not the only starters to leave the program under Wojo. I think this has a whole lot more to do with Wojo's management choices than Sam or Joey's NBA potential.
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We were also expected to win at some point after February 23 this year. Look at what happened. Expectations don't always mean a whole lot.
The idea that the Hausers were frustrated with Wojo's coaching and gameplanning makes sense. And for that to escalate as we collapsed game after game to close out the season also makes sense. I'm guessing this built up over the season, and they decided they would be better off playing for someone other than Wojo even if it means they have to sit for a year.
And remember, they're not the only starters to leave the program under Wojo. I think this has a whole lot more to do with Wojo's management choices than Sam or Joey's NBA potential.
I'm not refuting that. He said verbatim, "I think Sam ultimately wants to win".
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Congrats, this is the stupidest post of a stupid day.
I don't know--- pretty high bar.
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We were also expected to win at some point after February 23 this year. Look at what happened.
The idea that the Hausers were frustrated with Wojo's coaching and gameplanning makes sense. And for that to escalate as we collapsed game after game to close out the season also makes sense.
Maybe if Sam had made a few of the wide open 3s he had in the closing minutes of games or if Joey hadn't treated the ball as if it were covered in Crisco, we would have won a couple of those games down the stretch.
There's plenty of blame to go around.
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I see a lot of speculation about how, if the Hausers were unhappy with Markus’ ball hogging and inefficiency than why didn’t Wojo do something about it?
I’m wondering if anybody would care to speculate why he did not. Why would a coach known for his defensive intensity, a pass first PG who played at Duke let this go on?
Is it possible Markus is being coddled because he’s fragile? Is it possible there are issues there that put Wojo in a no win situation? Damned if he does, damned if he doesn’t? Maybe he was so certain the Hausers were good that he forgot they needed a little attention themselves?
I’m sorry, I know Wojo is not Buzz. He’s not KO. But I don’t think he’s the problem.
I think the problem is Howard. We can all see it and have seen it for a while. You really think Wojo hasn’t talked to him ad nauseam? Howard continues to pay lip service to his teammates in interviews but it’s blatantly artificial and now we’ve lost two starters as a result.
Personally, I was hoping he’d leave after this year. I am a fan of Marquette basketball. As such, I don’t tune in to watch Markus Howard take 25 shots a game. I just don’t. I don’t care if he scores 25 or 35 or 50. I think Markus does care about that. I watch because I hope we win.
Answer - Joey
If you didn't need to watch Markus you would have tuned into a 14-17 season give a game or 2 either way.
If that's what you wanted then just go back and watch a rerun of all the games Buzz final season.
That was exactly what you claim to wish you'd seen..
Vander Blue left and a very unselfish point guard in Derrick Wilson took over, which would have been like watching Joseph Chartouney run the offense if Markus had left.
Markus assist rate was over 27% - in the top 3% of all players and almost twice that of Joey and Sam. He created the shots for himself because we didn't have a healthy PG with Elliott injured and McEwen sitting out, but he also created good shots for others by drawing defenders.
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Markus: The worst best player a team could have.
I only imagine this scenario:
Wojo: Markus is coming back
Hausers: you gonna make him pass to us?
Wojo: You know, Markus is an exceptional talent. You kind of have to let him do his thing
Hausers: Let us know how that works out for ya. Later dude.
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Sam And joey better work on their foreign language skills for their over seas careers as that is their absolute ceiling.
Its all on wojo for the mess but at least these two losers wont do anything meaningful at the pro level. I cant believe how many on here actuAlly thing either one has a shot at the NBA. They would get eaten alive.
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Joey. Wanted to be featured. Wasn't going to happen next year. Sam's loyalty was to his brother over the team. Joey was yelling and getting frustrated in November when he didn't get the ball when he wanted it. Sam would tell him to be quiet. The seeds of this were sown early.
Maybe Joey would get the ball if he actually held onto the damn ball. I was yelling and frustrated when the turned it over on 5 possessions to end the Creighton game.
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It would be great if BD or someone with a real story posts some plausible details but to join the speculation train...
I think it's incredibly telling that Sam didn't specifically thank Wojo in his "I'm out" twitter, instead just going with the overly generic "everyone involved with the Marquette basketball program". Basically Wojo got the same thanks as the ticket sellers. It seems if it wasn't Wojo there would be been a "Thanks to Coach Wojo and all the coaching staff..." or something along those lines. It's a conspicuous and I'm sure deliberate omission.
That said, a number of us here have been harping about Markus' hero ball all season (even when it was working well). Certainly plausible to think it bothered those guys as well.
And here's the thing, Wojo's "give the keys to my guy and hope for the best" strategy isn't new this year. It was the same with Rowsey to a large extent last year. And with Hank.
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It would be great if BD or someone with a real story posts some plausible details but to join the speculation train...
I think it's incredibly telling that Sam didn't specifically thank Wojo in his "I'm out" twitter, instead just going with the overly generic "everyone involved with the Marquette basketball program". Basically Wojo got the same thanks as the ticket sellers. It seems if it wasn't Wojo there would be been a "Thanks to Coach Wojo and all the coaching staff..." or something along those lines. It's a conspicuous and I'm sure deliberate omission.
That said, a number of us here have been harping about Markus' hero ball all season (even when it was working well). Certainly plausible to think it bothered those guys as well.
And here's the thing, Wojo's "give the keys to my guy and hope for the best" strategy isn't new this year. It was the same with Rowsey to a large extent last year. And with Hank.
Like I’ve been saying this move is personal. This goes beyond touches, shots, etc.
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Your argument was that Sam wants to win. Marquette was expected to win a lot next year.
So clearly, its not that.
You can't call someone else's post stupid...and then post this. Extremely plausible that Sam and Joey don't feel Wojo can win.
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I was informed of a few more notes last night away from Scoop and this whole thing sounds more and more like the Maymon family situation.
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I was informed of a few more notes last night away from Scoop and this whole thing sounds more and more like the Maymon family situation.
Go on ...
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More like .....How WOJO "handles" Markus.....
So 1 + 1 does equal 2 in this case......
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I want to say that I generally support players’ right to transfer and control their own destiny.
I’ll let others color between the lines about what happened. And I wasn’t there so I’m a bit reluctant to draw big conclusions. But based on what I know there’s an unfair amount of blame to the coach and teammates among the fan base. The Hausers chose to quit Marquette because their feelings were hurt. Bailing on a top 5-10 team over hurt feelings strikes me as a bit dramatic.
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This is a simple sorry. Quit looking for zebras. Hausers didn't want to play with Markus. Felt Wojo gave him the green light and this ultimately was the reason for the end of season collapse. Sam and Joey know that wasn't going to change next season.
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Wojo needed to make it work between the Hausers and Howard, and he was out of his depth. Losing them is an embarrassment and damaging as hell to recruiting going forward, especially in the state of WI. Wojo is a dead man walking.
This is why you can’t look to the future in college sports, which is what so many posters on here have been trying to do to rationalize Wojo’s failures. You have to win *this* year, every year, because you might not get the same chance again with the same players.
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This is a simple sorry. Quit looking for zebras. Hausers didn't want to play with Markus. Felt Wojo gave him the green light and this ultimately was the reason for the end of season collapse. Sam and Joey know that wasn't going to change next season.
The bolded part is simply not true. There was absolutely nobody else on this team this year that could/would create off of the dribble. Sacar occasionally would, but seemed to settle for the corner three. Next year, Koby can do that. So Sam and Joey didn't believe it would change, possibly. But they have no idea of knowing...My opinion, if they don't want to be here, they are dead to me. Next Warrior up.
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You can't call someone else's post stupid...and then post this. Extremely plausible that Sam and Joey don't feel Wojo can win.
This is kind of the point I was trying to make in another post. Sam and Joey were on a team that was ranked in the Top 10 in the country and saw it completely implode. If they believed that this was Wojo's fault, it's also not unreasonable to think that they don't believe Wojo can live up to those expectations for next year.
I'm not saying that they're right...who the hell knows? But, it's quite possible that they believe that Wojo just can't take a team to that level. Personally, I doubt they'd be walking away if they truly believed it was a legit final four contender. I suspect they fear that the same problems that caused a really good team to turn into a train wreck would still be present and would make next year a huge disappointment too.
At this point, I really hope that they're wrong. I hope that they were the problem, and that the team will outperform everyone's recently lowered expectations. Gotta admit that I have my doubts.
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Next Warrior up.
Hear, hear!
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The bolded part is simply not true. There was absolutely nobody else on this team this year that could/would create off of the dribble. Sacar occasionally would, but seemed to settle for the corner three. Next year, Koby can do that. So Sam and Joey didn't believe it would change, possibly. But they have no idea of knowing...My opinion, if they don't want to be here, they are dead to me. Next Warrior up.
While somewhat true, they've seen Koby and Greg in practice all year, and should have a clear sense of what they will bring. Maybe what was up in the air and somehow scary to them (especially Joey) was that they didn't know for sure how Wojo would allocate playing time. Perhaps Joey implicitly knows that he was under pressure from Bailey at the end of the season, and worries about the impact of 2 more guys worthy of playing time.
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Joey Hauser is not sitting on the bench for anyone on the current MU roster. He is highly skilled player and was going to be a starter every year MU.
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I was informed of a few more notes last night away from Scoop and this whole thing sounds more and more like the Maymon family situation.
Probably not to the same extent (or tone) as Tim Maymon, but I do think this was a family-driven decision. And once one member is unhappy (Joey, IMO, all season), they all have his back. I think they see Joey as an eventual draft pick, and he wasn't being "showcased" as such. We live in a world where Aunt Becky will pay $500k to cheat her daughter's way into college - parents of these "special" athletes want to see their kids' dreams come true.
This is probably the Ellenson family 2.0 - lets all remember that they had unrealistic expectations as to what Wally brought to the table, and Wojo didn't cave to them just to keep them happy. Wojo shouldn't be promising anyone anything in the way of minutes, touches, offensive scheme, etc.
I find it interesting that Harry Froling is one of the people backing up the Hausers via Twitter. His circumstances were similar - he had outsized dreams of an NBA career, and he wanted it now. When things didn't work out as planned, he bolted.
At the end of the day, I don't really blame Wojo for this. You can't coach to personal expectations.
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I'm sorry, but Joey is not going to get more exposure or better opportunities anywhere else. If he goes to a better program, he will always have to prove himself to get minutes. The other option is to go play at UWM knowing they will never land a higher rated recruit than him but nobody on a national level is going to pay any attention. He got the minutes he deserved last year, no more or less.
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Probably not to the same extent (or tone) as Tim Maymon, but I do think this was a family-driven decision. And once one member is unhappy (Joey, IMO, all season), they all have his back. I think they see Joey as an eventual draft pick, and he wasn't being "showcased" as such. We live in a world where Aunt Becky will pay $500k to cheat her daughter's way into college - parents of these "special" athletes want to see their kids' dreams come true.
This is probably the Ellenson family 2.0 - lets all remember that they had unrealistic expectations as to what Wally brought to the table, and Wojo didn't cave to them just to keep them happy. Wojo shouldn't be promising anyone anything in the way of minutes, touches, offensive scheme, etc.
I find it interesting that Harry Froling is one of the people backing up the Hausers via Twitter. His circumstances were similar - he had outsized dreams of an NBA career, and he wanted it now. When things didn't work out as planned, he bolted.
At the end of the day, I don't really blame Wojo for this. You can't coach to personal expectations.
What I was told was pretty much this. Someone mentioned here some grad students knew several weeks ago? The Parents told Wojo either Marcus or my kids. The parents thought Marcus was declaring.
Someone can probably confirm that everyone looked close, together and happy at the Awards Banquet as I think the players do really get along?
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If that was the case, the coach cannot fold. It may cost him his job in this case, but the coach cannot give in to extortion.
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I understand the desire to assign blame in a situation like this, but the reality is, that unless you know the entire story and have all the facts, you can't accurately do that. My guess is that no one is completely clean in this situation. Sam, Joey, Markus, Wojo, Hausers parents all likely contributed to this.
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Joey Hauser is not sitting on the bench for anyone on the current MU roster. He is highly skilled player and was going to be a starter every year MU.
I believe this is probably accurate, but in order for it to be true, it would almost necessarily mean that Sam would subsequently end up having to come off the bench. Howard, McEwen (possibly Elliott instead) and John were starting for sure next year. That leaves 2 spots for Joey, Sam, and Sacar. To think that Sacar would automatically go to the bench in favor of the Hausers is far from a safe assumption. He is more athletic and better defender than both. From where I'm sitting, the writing was on the wall...one of teh Hausers was no longer going to be s starter, and both were going to see their roles reduced. Throw in Elliott, Bailey, etc., and Hausers' roles get diminished even more. Wojo was rightly unapologetic about it, and the Hauser family decided it was best to go elsewhere. Still only 200 minutes in a game, and it is difficult to get NBA scouts attention when you are third or fourth fiddle, and spending time on the bench. For those reasons, I have no problem with the decision made by either Wojo or the Hausers.
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I believe this is probably accurate, but in order for it to be true, it would almost necessarily mean that Sam would subsequently end up having to come off the bench. Howard, McEwen (possibly Elliott instead) and John were starting for sure next year. That leaves 2 spots for Joey, Sam, and Sacar. To think that Sacar would automatically go to the bench in favor of the Hausers is far from a safe assumption. He is more athletic and better defender than both. From where I'm sitting, the writing was on the wall...one of teh Hausers was no longer going to be s starter, and both were going to see their roles reduced. Throw in Elliott, Bailey, etc., and Hausers' roles get diminished even more. Wojo was rightly unapologetic about it, and the Hauser family decided it was best to go elsewhere. Still only 200 minutes in a game, and it is difficult to get NBA scouts attention when you are third or fourth fiddle, and spending time on the bench. For those reasons, I have no problem with the decision made by either Wojo or the Hausers.
And this is why it's a lock for them to be Badgers. UVA can get better recruits. MSU as well.
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This is a simple sorry. Quit looking for zebras. Hausers didn't want to play with Markus. Felt Wojo gave him the green light and this ultimately was the reason for the end of season collapse. Sam and Joey know that wasn't going to change next season.
Preach it.
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lawdog
Once again you are off target. The Hauser boys can play anywhere in the country.
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This isn't an Ellenson or Maymon situation. They are far from helicopter parents, Dave was a college player, and a HS coach. He knows the lines. There's no AAU coach being an intermediary. Yes, they believe Joey can be a pro. But nothing about MU, or how he was used would keep him from progressing to that goal.
The decision was not made weeks ago, and may not have been by the banquet. Joey was gonna follow whatever Sam decided, and ultimately Sam thought it was best to move on.
I wish I could get into more detail, but I was told it in confidence and have to respect that. It's just a shame that there wasn't stronger leadership in place, as this outcome could have been avoided.
Also, please don't rip Markus for this. He's a great kid and they're still friends. He plays the way he knows how, and hasn't been coached hard enough to change it.
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I was informed of a few more notes last night away from Scoop and this whole thing sounds more and more like the Maymon family situation.
And I have heard it is the opposite. And it is from the same people that were telling it was true hours before Scoop knew, so I find some reason to believe them.
But either way, it's bad.
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lawdog
Once again you are off target. The Hauser boys can play anywhere in the country.
They most certainly can. But things are a bit different at places like MSU or UVA. Sam will definitely get his wherever he goes as a senior, but teams may be hesitant to make a 1 year player the focal point of their offense. Joey will likely also be a great player wherever they land, but at places like MSU and UVA he is going to re-recruited over every single season and is going to need to earn his minutes. If he was butt hurt about not being the focal point of MU's offense as a freshman due to a 2nd team AA guard being on his team, I can't imagine how he's going to feel when he has multiple top 50 recruits to battle against each season that actually play his position.
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I really believe there are no winners and only losers in this whole situation.
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I understand the desire to assign blame in a situation like this, but the reality is, that unless you know the entire story and have all the facts, you can't accurately do that. My guess is that no one is completely clean in this situation. Sam, Joey, Markus, Wojo, Hausers parents all likely contributed to this.
This.
And on top of that, it's OK for there not to be a "bad guy" in this situation. It seems, rather, we have three parties (Wojo, Markus and the Hausers) each looking out for their best interests.
Markus decided it was in his best interest to remain in school.
Wojo decided it was in his best interest to ride his all-American player and welcome him back with open arms.
The Hausers decided it was in their best interests not to play second fiddle to Markus.
Nobody is necessarily wrong here. It's a shame they couldn't make it work - and Wojo deserves most of the blame for that, because his job is to make it work - but there doesn't have to be a villain here.
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This isn't an Ellenson or Maymon situation. They are far from helicopter parents, Dave was a college player, and a HS coach. He knows the lines. There's no AAU coach being an intermediary. Yes, they believe Joey can be a pro. But nothing about MU, or how he was used would keep him from progressing to that goal.
The decision was not made weeks ago, and may not have been by the banquet. Joey was gonna follow whatever Sam decided, and ultimately Sam thought it was best to move on.
I wish I could get into more detail, but I was told it in confidence and have to respect that. It's just a shame that there wasn't stronger leadership in place, as this outcome could have been avoided.
Also, please don't rip Markus for this. He's a great kid and they're still friends. He plays the way he knows how, and hasn't been coached hard enough to change it.
So you got the Hauser perspective. Now go get Wojo's and report back to us. Let's see if they're the same.
The above would very much support what my gut has told me from the very beginning...Sam had one year left to improve his NBA prospects, and was going to have a very difficult time doing that coming off the bench with a reduced role. I would never criticize him for using that as rationale for the decision, anymore than I would criticize Wojo for establishing and being honest about what the expectations should be. Its completely reasonable to assume that Sam may have been the 4th option next year (Howard, Koby, Joey). Not exactly the best scenario for showcasing your abilities for the NBA.
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So you got the Hauser perspective. Now go get Wojo's and report back to us. Let's see if they're the same.
The above would very much support what my gut has told me from the very beginning...Sam had one year left to improve his NBA prospects, and was going to have a very difficult time doing that coming off the bench with a reduced role. I would never criticize him for using that as rationale for the decision, anymore than I would criticize Wojo for establishing and being honest about what the expectations should be. Its completely reasonable to assume that Sam may have been the 4th option next year (Howard, Koby, Joey). Not exactly the best scenario for showcasing your abilities for the NBA.
Sam wasn’t coming off the bench in a reduced role.
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This isn't an Ellenson or Maymon situation. They are far from helicopter parents, Dave was a college player, and a HS coach. He knows the lines. There's no AAU coach being an intermediary. Yes, they believe Joey can be a pro. But nothing about MU, or how he was used would keep him from progressing to that goal.
The decision was not made weeks ago, and may not have been by the banquet. Joey was gonna follow whatever Sam decided, and ultimately Sam thought it was best to move on.
I wish I could get into more detail, but I was told it in confidence and have to respect that. It's just a shame that there wasn't stronger leadership in place, as this outcome could have been avoided.
Also, please don't rip Markus for this. He's a great kid and they're still friends. He plays the way he knows how, and hasn't been coached hard enough to change it.
Sure, mistakes were made. If you like Wojo, it's a learning experience during his first head coaching gig. If you don't like Wojo, it shows he's not cut out for this level.
This situation was fluid up until the high noon ultimatum yesterday. On the ledge, off the ledge; on the ledge, off the ledge.
But at a certain point, perhaps leadership could come from two of the three adults stuck in a bad situation? Then again it's probably an easier out for the two to pin it on the third. And maybe showing leadership was seen in walking away. A riddle something something wrapped something something enigma.
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This is a simple sorry. Quit looking for zebras. Hausers didn't want to play with Markus. Felt Wojo gave him the green light and this ultimately was the reason for the end of season collapse. Sam and Joey know that wasn't going to change next season.
Yes but there was talk of changes, like in any team. And Markus is on the team and an All-AMERICAN. This could’ve/should been worked around by everyone.
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Sam wasn’t coming off the bench in a reduced role.
Ok, then Joey was. Or were they gonna go with 6 starters?
Or were Koby and Elliott not going to play? Bailey not going to see additional minutes? Was Anim not going to play?
Both Housers necessarily were going to see there minutes and roles reduced. Unless you are aware of some new rule changes whereby games are going to be more than 40 minutes, or teams are allowed to play more than 5 at a time.
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This.
And on top of that, it's OK for there not to be a "bad guy" in this situation. It seems, rather, we have three parties (Wojo, Markus and the Hausers) each looking out for their best interests.
Markus decided it was in his best interest to remain in school.
Wojo decided it was in his best interest to ride his all-American player and welcome him back with open arms.
The Hausers decided it was in their best interests not to play second fiddle to Markus.
Nobody is necessarily wrong here. It's a shame they couldn't make it work - and Wojo deserves most of the blame for that, because his job is to make it work - but there doesn't have to be a villain here.
I agree with this wholeheartedly. Each made the decision they feel is best for them, and they should. It’s on Wojo to deal with it and win. This is why he gets paid the big bucks. If he can’t, move on.
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Well then Joey was. Or were they gonna go with 6 starters?
I think at worst Joey wasn’t promised anything but if he made that leap we often see from year one to two he would’ve been our 3rd best player
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They most certainly can. But things are a bit different at places like MSU or UVA. Sam will definitely get his wherever he goes as a senior, but teams may be hesitant to make a 1 year player the focal point of their offense. Joey will likely also be a great player wherever they land, but at places like MSU and UVA he is going to re-recruited over every single season and is going to need to earn his minutes. If he was butt hurt about not being the focal point of MU's offense as a freshman due to a 2nd team AA guard being on his team, I can't imagine how he's going to feel when he has multiple top 50 recruits to battle against each season that actually play his position.
+1000. Never said they couldn't play anywhere, just that at UVA and MSU, they will not be the focal point. Those two schools will be getting MCD AA type recruits. At Wisconsin, they will not be recruited over.
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But at a certain point, perhaps leadership could come from two of the three adults stuck in a bad situation?
Yep.
As I've said multiple times, it's a bad look for the CEO of this organization, makes him look weak and totally not in control. It will be difficult for him to overcome this.
But ...
Daddy and Mommy H aren't angels in this. Rather than encourage their little boys to deal with adversity, they let them officially become the Quitter Brothers. Heck, for all we know, they actually encouraged them to become the Quitter Brothers.
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Yep.
As I've said multiple times, it's a bad look for the CEO of this organization, makes him look weak and totally not in control. It will be difficult for him to overcome this.
But ...
Daddy and Mommy H aren't angels in this. Rather than encourage their little boys to deal with adversity, they let them officially become the Quitter Brothers. Heck, for all we know, they actually encouraged them to become the Quitter Brothers.
Going to the original thread title, this has nothing to do with Markus outside of his role on the team relative to the Hausers. He did nothing wrong.
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If that was the case, the coach cannot fold. It may cost him his job in this case, but the coach cannot give in to extortion.
Yeah. Combine that with the Herro rumblings about not wanting to play with him, and it feels a lot like that is the narrative coming out of the family. Shame too, as I really liked Sam. But can't dwell on those who quit the team. Next man up.