I really don't get it, especially after a game like today.
Is it a case of when you land a top recruit, you promise him minutes from the outset no matter what?
It was painfully obvious the kid didn't have it today. Maybe go with someone else when that happens.
Oh well. Hopefully lessons are learned from this one.
The nba prospect chatter has certainly gone down. Hes got a decent college career ahead of him but he is so slow with the ball and on D. He has not chance of an association career without major improvement.
Tarnished the family name forever!
I gather that Wojo has been trying to keep his confidence by letting him play through it. It looked like it worked for a game, but it's probably time to treat him like the other players. It may actually be hurting his confidence to keep him out there. His turnovers were pretty ugly, spurring the run by Creighton. Other guys should get a chance to see if they can contribute, and hopefully Joey gets it back.
Lol no understanding
Mentioned it in a different thread. What Joey needs is a good off season strength and conditioning program in my opinion. Footwork, upper body, base. Often times the biggest jump in play level occurs from first year to second year. I expect Joey to be in that category as well as Bailey. The potential is there and at times the results. The leash has been longer for him than some others at times. Sometimes he has played through it and other times no. Today was a no. What I would like to see even more is getting Sam going much earlier in the game. Too slow on d today, too much dribble to nowhere hoping for bail out. credit to Creighton at both ends.
I thought his ankle affected him.
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on March 03, 2019, 04:50:11 PM
I thought his ankle affected him.
If that's the case, take him out of the game. Maybe one of the nine coaches would notice that.
Cain should be eating into a lot of his minutes but his leash is extremely short.
His contact with the freshman wall has been spectacular. Other teams are developing plans for him and he is no longer the most talented player on the floor. His confidence has been shaken. Bailey and Cain are not seizing the opportunity, though.
Quote from: tower912 on March 03, 2019, 05:02:58 PM
His contact with the freshman wall has been spectacular. Other teams are developing plans for him and he is no longer the most talented player on the floor. His confidence has been shaken. Bailey and Cain are not seizing the opportunity, though.
How does one seize an opportunity in one minute?
Don't immediately get beat defensively.
Quote from: tower912 on March 03, 2019, 05:06:29 PM
Don't immediately get beat defensively.
Sounds like a double standard. One player is allowed countless mistakes and is kept on the floor. Another player makes one and is glued to the bench.
Quote from: Afroman on March 03, 2019, 05:09:41 PM
Sounds like a double standard. One player is allowed countless mistakes and is kept on the floor. Another player makes one and is glued to the bench.
Well, yeah. When one player has shown that he's better than the other, they are allowed to play through more mistakes.
That being said, I said this pregame:
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 03, 2019, 12:07:51 PM
Think we see less Joey and more Joe/Cain/Bailey this game. 7 of their top 8 players are 6'5 or shorter and can shoot the three. Not sure who Joey can defend out there if Theo is in the game. Gotta make em pay on defense by getting the Hausers going in the post if Joey is going to play big minutes
I think this is a matchup were Joey was bound to struggle defensively. Throw in the turnovers and low confidence offense and I think this is a game where Joey could have used more time on the bench.
Good news for Joey, our last two opponents have much more traditional lineups with non-shooting PFs as starters. Hopefully these are two games where he can get his mojo back.
Quote from: Afroman on March 03, 2019, 05:09:41 PM
Sounds like a double standard. One player is allowed countless mistakes and is kept on the floor. Another player makes one and is glued to the bench.
Absolutely. Meanwhile Cain did seize the opportunity when he got extended minutes and then poof his minutes disappeared. Meanwhile Joey continuously is getting beat off the dribble and is a turnover machine. This double standard is a little ridiculous.
Quote from: mufanatic on March 03, 2019, 05:14:19 PM
Absolutely. Meanwhile Cain did seize the opportunity when he got extended minutes and then poof his minutes disappeared. Meanwhile Joey continuously is getting beat off the dribble and is a turnover machine. This double standard is a little ridiculous.
I just hope Cain isn't sitting there thinking if I can't get minutes playing today (one minute), maybe the University of Detroit might be a better fit.
Maybe. But there was a stretch when Cain could do little right on the floor while Joey was playing well. We'll call that 'December and January'. Joey earned Wojo's trust while Cain was losing it. When you are a substitute, your leash is usually shorter.
Honestly, I have thought for weeks that Joey's minutes should be shortened while Cain and Bailey get more. To rest him and build them up. But, the subs have to step up.
Quote from: tower912 on March 03, 2019, 05:06:29 PM
Don't immediately get beat defensively.
That's fine but Joey gets beat on almost every possession. Bailey is a much better defensive player than Joey, it's not close.
Quote from: tower912 on March 03, 2019, 05:19:15 PM
Maybe. But there was a stretch when Cain could do little right on the floor while Joey was playing well. We'll call that 'December and January'. Joey earned Wojo's trust while Cain was losing it. When you are a substitute, your leash is usually shorter.
Honestly, I have thought for weeks that Joey's minutes should be shortened while Cain and Bailey get more. To rest him and build them up. But, the subs have to step up.
When Joey sat after a bad turnover, Bailey came in for him and played for a long time and played very good defense and MU took over the lead at end of first half. Cain came in for someone else and played one minute. Bailey played 14 minutes, Joey played 28.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on March 03, 2019, 05:19:49 PM
That's fine but Joey gets beat on almost every possession. Bailey is a much better defensive player than Joey, it's not close.
Agreed. And it has been so all year. But Joey outplayed him offensively and was holding his own defensively for a couple of months. Bailey is still not playing well offensively. Neither is Joey. So, do you play the guy who hasn't made shots in a months, or the guy who was hot but is now lacking confidence?
Another case where the coach is at the mercy of the players production to make him a genius or an idiot.
The defense wasn't the issue. Not sure where the idea that Joey continually got beat defensively. The only player that played well for Creighton was Kreimplj (however you spell it) and he was almost always guarded by Theo/Ed/Matt.
Joey's turnovers were an issue. So were everyone's who touched the ball today.
I'm sorry but there is zero chance of an MU team ever being built around Jamal Cain. I'd say it's probable that there will be MU teams built around Joey Hauser. He is a better player today and has a much higher potential. Jamal isn't even a 1-1 replacement for Joey... at all.
Let's be real here, Jamal has to beat out Bailey for PT first before surpassing a starter. Bailey brings a lot more in limited minutes, playing solid defense with some great blocks and making few dumb mistakes. Jamal's turnover rate is 26.2%. Brendan's is 3.2%. In several ways Jamal is just a poor fit for the kind of player we need off the bench this year.
Quote from: D'Lo Brown on March 03, 2019, 05:30:38 PM
Jamal's turnover rate is 26.2%. Brendan's is 3.2%. In several ways Jamal is just a poor fit for the kind of player we need off the bench this year.
Sounds like Jamal would have been a perfect fit today
Joey didn't deserve the minutes he got today and that's on Wojo. One of several examples of lineup mismanagement from Wojo today. It happens
Quote from: D'Lo Brown on March 03, 2019, 05:30:38 PM
I'm sorry but there is zero chance of an MU team ever being built around Jamal Cain. I'd say it's probable that there will be MU teams built around Joey Hauser. He is a better player today and has a much higher potential. Jamal isn't even a 1-1 replacement for Joey... at all.
Let's be real here, Jamal has to beat out Bailey for PT first before surpassing a starter. Bailey brings a lot more in limited minutes, playing solid defense with some great blocks and making few dumb mistakes. Jamal's turnover rate is 26.2%. Brendan's is 3.2%. In several ways Jamal is just a poor fit for the kind of player we need off the bench this year.
The initial point here wasn't that Jamal should start or play 30 minutes a game.
However, in a situation such as today when Joey is clearly having an off-day, that might present an opportunity for other options.
Quote from: Afroman on March 03, 2019, 05:36:29 PM
The initial point here wasn't that Jamal should start or play 30 minutes a game.
However, in a situation such as today when Joey is clearly having an off-day, that might present an opportunity for other options.
I was responding to the idea of a double standard cited by you and another, explicitly having to do with Jamal. My point was that Jamal isn't even in the conversation of replacing Joey, as you can see in my post. Bailey is pretty clearly ahead of Jamal in the rotation, and playing better in the role needed. If Joey should have played less (don't disagree) then I can see the next-man-up strategy coming in to play. I'm saying that Cain is not the next man up.
Joey shouldn't have gotten the minutes that he did, but it's tough when literally everyone is turning the ball over. Yea Jamal didn't have a TO in his one minute, but he still not exactly trustworthy yet when it comes to ball control.
https://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=57768.0
We've had this discussion before. I suggested starting Bailey when I saw Joey hitting his freshman wall. Check the dates.
And if you go back far enough, you will see that after the UMBC game, I said that Joey looked slow and Bailey looked better on defense.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on March 03, 2019, 05:18:29 PM
Just stop.
He looked slow, didn't seem to be jumping on rebounds. The guy was down in a heap for a minute and was limping around. I have no clue why Wojo didn't take him out but he didn't play well after that.
Bailey was starting at the beginning of the season. He lost his job to Joey, but I think we should go back to Bailey.
Quote from: Afroman on March 03, 2019, 05:09:41 PM
Sounds like a double standard. One player is allowed countless mistakes and is kept on the floor. Another player makes one and is glued to the bench.
It's not middle school basketball. It's not even Steven. Some players get longer leashes than others. It has always been that way. It's not an equal opportunity for everyone on the bench.
Wojo is sticking with the best players and playing the hell out of them. Cain is not level as Joey, hence him not getting more minutes. Truthfully, the talent level falls off a great deal after Howard and the Hausers. Plenty of needs to be filled on recruiting front.
Joey is a good ballplayer, he will be even better. He's in a slump and would benefit from more pine time, baby. Frosh wall - rest, come back.