http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2018/03/marquettes-ranking-among-catholic-d1.html
I mean, the Catholic-school advocates won with a 90% Catholic league, but with two Catholic schools in the Final Four here is where all 40 rank.
I think you missed Loyola-Chicago.
Canisius?
Man, when I was there Holy Cross was a Jesuit school.
I think Sacred Heart University is Diocesan.
Redo! ;D
Quote from: auburnmarquette on March 27, 2018, 01:44:09 AM
http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2018/03/marquettes-ranking-among-catholic-d1.html
I mean, the Catholic-school advocates won with a 90% Catholic league, but with two Catholic schools in the Final Four here is where all 40 rank.
Were you using this list from years ago? http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2012/12/top-40-catholic-basketball-teams-and.html
USF at 19?
But they are on the verge of hanging a banner....
Yeshiva?
This is an awkward list.
Also would a Jesuit league be the most top heavy conference in the country?
How did I not know the West Coast Conference is made up of only Private schools? It is really the Big East of the West. Would like to see a Big East/West Coast Conference tourney
Quote from: Knight Commission on March 27, 2018, 10:02:37 AM
How did I not know the West Coast Conference is made up of only Private schools? It is really the Big East of the West. Would like to see a Big East/West Coast Conference tourney
Its the Big East of the west only if you don't take into account the quality of basketball being played.
The WCC would be like a conference of Xavier (Gonzaga) Creighton (St. Mary's) St. John's (BYU), DePaul (USF), and 6 teams worse than DePaul.
Thanks all - so added the two and have 42 of 351 now on the link.
Let's say college athletics changed and somehow this became a separate league. Would you all follow MU as closely? I mean there's still a lot of solid teams on here with classic tradition. Not sure you could still claim national champion though.
Quote from: BagpipingBoxer on March 27, 2018, 12:03:19 PM
Let's say college athletics changed and somehow this became a separate league. Would you all follow MU as closely? I mean there's still a lot of solid teams on here with classic tradition. Not sure you could still claim national champion though.
Follow? Yes. As closely? No.
Without a chance to get to the (real) dance and win it all, it might as well be D-2.
Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 27, 2018, 12:57:20 PM
Follow? Yes. As closely? No.
Without a chance to get to the (real) dance and win it all, it might as well be D-2.
If a change in landscape were to force a change like the one I'm suggesting why would it not be the real dance? Us, ND, Zags, Nova, Georgetown and Creighton have all gotten top 3 seeds in the past few years.
Quote from: BagpipingBoxer on March 27, 2018, 01:30:40 PM
If a change in landscape were to force a change like the one I'm suggesting why would it not be the real dance? Us, ND, Zags, Nova, Georgetown and Creighton have all gotten top 3 seeds in the past few years.
Because this year there were only 7 catholic schools in the top 50 teams per KenPom and only 10 in the top 75.
The average Catholic school might be better than the average non-catholic school, but a majority of the top programs (and fanbases) are at non-catholic schools. If Catholics broke off from non-catholic schools no one would miss them honestly.
John, you got it wrong, some of us want less catholic. Big Al was totally against a catholic league, even a close imitation. Yes, we were independent in those days, but there were many strong independents. Today l think there is only one independent, NJIT of Newark.
ND and BC are the model, go play with the big boys. There was a day for the Bonnies, La Sale, H.C., and St. Joe's, but that day has come and gone.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 27, 2018, 01:37:26 PM
Because this year there were only 7 catholic schools in the top 50 teams per KenPom and only 10 in the top 75.
The average Catholic school might be better than the average non-catholic school, but a majority of the top programs (and fanbases) are at non-catholic schools. If Catholics broke off from non-catholic schools no one would miss them honestly.
Was this an average year for catholic schools? I guess I think of us Georgetown and Dayton being pretty farther down than usual but maybe there were a few more that were up as opposed to how they usually are.
Quote from: vogue65 on March 27, 2018, 01:45:50 PM
John, you got it wrong, some of us want less catholic. Big Al was totally against a catholic league, even a close imitation. Yes, we were independent in those days, but there were many strong independents. Today l think there is only one independent, NJIT of Newark.
ND and BC are the model, go play with the big boys. There was a day for the Bonnies, La Sale, H.C., and St. Joe's, but that day has come and gone.
Yes, I agree with you and was arguing less Catholic when all the merger talk was going on. I'd love UConn back in the Big East as an 11th team - though I realize when you build a $90 million football stadium to go up to FBS you are stuck. Heck, if Boston University had a plan to really upgrade, I'd love them just to break back into Boston.
I was just throwing this out for those on the other side of the argument, but I am truly on your side though I'm fine with the way things worked out due to FS1 backing as the best option we had.
Quote from: vogue65 on March 27, 2018, 01:45:50 PM
John, you got it wrong, some of us want less catholic. Big Al was totally against a catholic league, even a close imitation. Yes, we were independent in those days, but there were many strong independents. Today l think there is only one independent, NJIT of Newark.
ND and BC are the model, go play with the big boys. There was a day for the Bonnies, La Sale, H.C., and St. Joe's, but that day has come and gone.
No independents left. NJIT joined the Atlantic Sun a few years back....which I don't know that I would ever describe Newark as a place that fits with Atlantic Sun... Sounds so tropical
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 27, 2018, 01:37:26 PM
Because this year there were only 7 catholic schools in the top 50 teams per KenPom and only 10 in the top 75.
The average Catholic school might be better than the average non-catholic school, but a majority of the top programs (and fanbases) are at non-catholic schools. If Catholics broke off from non-catholic schools no one would miss them honestly.
I agree with your over all point, but I count 8 in KenPom top fifty:
1. Villanova
10. Gonzaga
15. Xavier
25. Seton Hall
30. Loyola/Chicago
31. Creighton
32. St. Mary's
35. Notre Dame
Quote from: BagpipingBoxer on March 27, 2018, 01:30:40 PM
If a change in landscape were to force a change like the one I'm suggesting why would it not be the real dance? Us, ND, Zags, Nova, Georgetown and Creighton have all gotten top 3 seeds in the past few years.
With the exception of Gonzaga, ND and the BE schools have gotten 3 seeds because we have always been able to tell recruits they'd be playing the big boys game in and game out, getting major TV exposure, etc. If we were suddenly a quasi minor league, those things would go away and the talent level would eventually go to a mid-major level.
The top 16-20 on the list would make for a really fun early-season tournament... or maybe the top 2 from each conference. it would have to be set up so no BEAST or WCC teams play their own conference in the first two rounds. Would be much better than playing South Western Kentucky Technical and Agricultural College.
Quote from: Sir Lawrence on March 27, 2018, 04:27:23 PM
I agree with your over all point, but I count 8 in KenPom top fifty:
1. Villanova
10. Gonzaga
15. Xavier
25. Seton Hall
30. Loyola/Chicago
31. Creighton
32. St. Mary's
35. Notre Dame
Haha, the one I missed was Notre Dame
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 27, 2018, 07:20:53 PM
Haha, the one I missed was Notre Dame
My favorite thing to ask Notre Dame grads, "Did you apply to any Catholic Universities?"
Quote from: WarriorFan on March 27, 2018, 06:14:46 PM
The top 16-20 on the list would make for a really fun early-season tournament... or maybe the top 2 from each conference. it would have to be set up so no BEAST or WCC teams play their own conference in the first two rounds. Would be much better than playing South Western Kentucky Technical and Agricultural College.
Aren't they in the same conference as Milwaukee Teachers' College?
Quote from: WarriorFan on March 27, 2018, 06:14:46 PM
The top 16-20 on the list would make for a really fun early-season tournament... or maybe the top 2 from each conference. it would have to be set up so no BEAST or WCC teams play their own conference in the first two rounds. Would be much better than playing South Western Kentucky Technical and Agricultural College.
Too bad that isn't permissible and even possible. Any such "tournament" would have to be set up like PK80 which was two separate brackets that crowned two separate champions since the rule is that an exempt tournament cannot have multiple teams from the same conference.
I know it could never, ever, ever happen, but it would be fun if it became a EPL style relegation league with four 10 team leagues. With the bottom three in each league being relegated and the top 3 moving up the following year. Would never work for a million reasons (Would the Sisters of the Poor League (level 4) get an auto invite to the NCAA tournament? The constant roster turnover would probably result in a bottom feeder being great one year and then moving up when the players that made them great graduated) The top league in most years would be in the top 2 of conferences in the country, I was guess.
Quote from: Sir Lawrence on March 27, 2018, 04:27:23 PM
I agree with your over all point, but I count 8 in KenPom top fifty:
1. Villanova
10. Gonzaga
15. Xavier
25. Seton Hall
30. Loyola/Chicago
31. Creighton
32. St. Mary's
35. Notre Dame
What is really pathetic about this list is that MU is 9th.
Quote from: willie warrior on March 28, 2018, 06:37:24 PM
What is really pathetic about this list is that MU is 9th.
Hate to say Notre Dame would have been much further ahead of us if Bonzie didn't go down - so there is a huge gap between these 8 and us
And MU would have been better wo injuries to Howard and Hauser.
Quote from: Fullodds on March 29, 2018, 07:50:27 AM
And MU would have been better wo injuries to Howard and Hauser.
Yep. People can play "what if" all day when it comes to injuries, but the reality is that every team deals with them eventually. Sam's injury in particular could have swung several games in the other direction.
And our '09 tourney run if Dominic didn't get hurt...and missing out in '05 without Diener....
Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 29, 2018, 08:45:48 AM
Yep. People can play "what if" all day when it comes to injuries, but the reality is that every team deals with them eventually. Sam's injury in particular could have swung several games in the other direction.
And our '09 tourney run if Dominic didn't get hurt...and missing out in '05 without Diener....
09-present if otule wasn't hurt
Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 29, 2018, 08:45:48 AM
Yep. People can play "what if" all day when it comes to injuries, but the reality is that every team deals with them eventually. Sam's injury in particular could have swung several games in the other direction.
And our '09 tourney run if Dominic didn't get hurt...and missing out in '05 without Diener....
Don't forget Jerel's injury in 2007. His being out dropped us to a 9 seed against Michigan State.
Dom's injury sucked but Buzz really mismanaged that Missouri game. There is no way Dom should have played. That lost the game, not Lazar stepping over the line while trying to inbound the ball under our hoop.
You are correct on your first point too. Just look at the conference. Creighton could play the "what if" game this year, as could St. John's. The biggest "what if" in recent history is Cincy and Kenyon Martin. They probably win the 2000 national title if he doesn't break his leg in the CUSA quarters against SLU. I know for some this is stunning, but other teams have injuries that change their seasons too.
USA Today Article on Catholics love of basketball. MU mention
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaab/2018/03/28/villanova-loyola-reaching-final-four-brings-light-catholic-love-basketball/467753002/
Uh oh, rocket, somebody did a story on Catholicism and basketball.
New York Times article today. Why Catholic colleges excel at basketball. Marquette mention.
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/30/sports/catholic-basketball-final-four.html?smid=tw-share
Quote from: Billy Hoyle on March 29, 2018, 11:23:01 AM
Don't forget Jerel's injury in 2007. His being out dropped us to a 9 seed against Michigan State.
Dom's injury sucked but Buzz really mismanaged that Missouri game. There is no way Dom should have played. That lost the game, not Lazar stepping over the line while trying to inbound the ball under our hoop.
You are correct on your first point too. Just look at the conference. Creighton could play the "what if" game this year, as could St. John's. The biggest "what if" in recent history is Cincy and Kenyon Martin. They probably win the 2000 national title if he doesn't break his leg in the CUSA quarters against SLU. I know for some this is stunning, but other teams have injuries that change their seasons too.
Ah yes. That MSU game, we scored 11-13 points in the first half. A real offensive onslaught, that game.
Quote from: willie warrior on March 30, 2018, 07:00:23 PM
Ah yes. That MSU game, we scored 11-13 points in the first half. A real offensive onslaught, that game.
That was one ugly game, though we did score 18 points not 11-13. One of our worst NCAA halves in MU history.
In 2013, we also scored 18 points against Syracuse in the first half and 21 points in the second half of same game (39 total points).
In '94, 23 points against Duke in the second half. Also 23 points in '71 in first half in our win against Miami (OH) and 23 points in '13 first half in our win against Davidson.