MUScoop

You're sitting at your local watering hole. Marquette just lost its last game of the season and the long offseason is about to begin. You find yourself wishing that you could see just one more Marquette national championship before you die. That's all you want. Suddenly, the devil appears next to you, orders a Bud Light, and makes you an offer. He will guarantee that Marquette will win the National Championship next season. However, as long you are alive, they will never make another postseason. They will become the new Depaul, the sleeping giant in the Big East that won't wake up until you die.

You're not sure and pause. He then offers a second deal. He can guarantee that Marquette makes the postseason every season for as long as you are alive. They'll have occasional appearances in the second weekend and even a final four appearance here and there. But they will NEVER win a national championship so long as you are alive. Marquette would essentially become Gonzaga (or Wisconsin), always playing in March, sometimes getting close to a championship but never bringing it home.

Which do you choose? If you don't pick the national championship, how many years of irrelevancy would you be willing to take in order to win it all? If you don't make a choice, the devil says he will turn Marquette into Depaul just for the hell of it.

This question got posed to me the other day, thought I'd share it on here. This is purely a philosophical question on how much a national championship is worth to you as a fan. Deal with the devil is not symbolism for something else. The literal devil is literally offering to make you a deal.

Easy answer for me.

I'll take a lot of Sweet 16s, Elite 8s and Final 4s even without another NC.   

Quote from: jsglow on April 13, 2017, 10:00:08 AM
Easy answer for me.

Me Too, No Brainer!

Take the title and run!

Here's the problem with this hypothetical...

If you pick the title, there's no point in paying attention to MU basketball after that because you know they'll always be bad. Why waste the time when you know the team will literally never turn it around?

If you pick the consistent contender, you know that, no matter how talented the team, they have zero chance to win the whole thing. Why waste the time? Isn't the whole point of cheering for a team the hope and dream that someday they'll win a title? Even if the team gets to the national title game, you would know they're going to lose. Perhaps you'd make big money betting against MU in Vegas, but other than that, why bother?

Didn't we already make a deal with the (Blue) Devil a few off seasons ago?

Consistent success all the way.  Playing the second weekend every year is far better than one magical run.

Plus, the devil will lose track of this deal eventually and we'd sneak a title in. 

Quote from: jsglow on April 13, 2017, 10:00:08 AM
Easy answer for me.

Quote from: Loose Cannon on April 13, 2017, 10:06:24 AM
Me Too, No Brainer!

But as of this writing, the voting is tied.....so which option is the no brainer?

Quote from: TAMU Eagle on April 13, 2017, 10:19:18 AM
But as of this writing, the voting is tied.....so which option is the no brainer?

The right answer is the no brainer, obviously.

I chose consistent success.  Of course I enjoyed 1977.  But I've enjoyed plenty of Marquette basketball since then.

Good thing we'll never have to make this decision.

It's more fun when they are consistently good, as we learned during our recent NCAA tourney dry spell. 

I reckon it depends on how OLD I am when this proposition is made..for me...let's cut down those nets next year !!!   :D

We have a national title already and so that puts us in a nice category. We can find a million other ways to claim fame by being that team thats always in the FF or what not. Yes I'd love the national championship but at least without the national championship you can still cheer for us to make the second or third weekend

I am shocked at the number of people who voted for the National Championship.

To me that is the same as giving a young single guy the choice of :  A) Having an active dating life with many attractive women or B) having a glorious one-night stand with the most beautiful woman in the world, but never getting laid again, and choosing B.

Finish my Bud Light and say no thanks.  The whole point of watching sports is that we don't know the outcome so I'd rather leave it to chance and have a clear conscience, even though the devil's version of consistent success is probably better than the reality.  In any case I've never negotiated with the devil but I'm guessing he usually expects more in return (e.g., your soul, your first born, etc.).

Gimme a 'notha 'natty for 5-7 years of Wojo's 1st year type results. Fair trade.

Quote from: warriorchick on April 13, 2017, 11:40:42 AM
I am shocked at the number of people who voted for the National Championship.

To me that is the same as giving a young single guy the choice of :  A) Having an active dating life with many attractive woman or B) having a glorious one-night stand with the most beautiful woman in the world, but never getting laid again, and choosing B.

Agreed.  Beauty is less important in the dark.

Easily the title for me.  Imagine being a Packer fan the last 25 years if there were zero Super Bowl wins between Favre and Rodgers. Not many are satisfied with just two. Imagine the frustration level of always being right there but coming up short.

One title in my lifetime and the rest is gravy. I was born in 1980, so I respect the old timers that were around for 1977.  I can understand them opting for sustained success. But a Marquette NC is on my sports bucket list.

For me this also depends on how the national championship would come. Is it a dominant year where we win the Big East, lose 6 or less games, earn a 1 or 2 seed? Or do we get hot and win the tournament as an 8 seed?

I'd lean towards taking the national championship but only if it came in the first scenario. A frustrating season that ended with a 6 game hot streak would be less satisfying than a season where we were one of the best teams in the country all year.

If only I had been a fan of a sports team for 41 of my 46 years on earth without a hint of a championship and than said team actually won a championship so I would know if that was enough to satisfy me...  Wait a minute...

At this point, one is enough.  No one can take it away from me and I fully enjoyed the run.  Of course, provided I live another 41 years, if you ask me in 2057 I might have a different answer.

Quote from: warriorchick on April 13, 2017, 11:40:42 AM
I am shocked at the number of people who voted for the National Championship.

To me that is the same as giving a young single guy the choice of :  A) Having an active dating life with many attractive women or B) having a glorious one-night stand with the most beautiful woman in the world, but never getting laid again, and choosing B.

Totally different scenario. I can always rewatch a copy of the title game to relive the experience.

I think a better analogy is a) lots of dating= sustained success, b) marriage = one national championship. I choose b, which also involves never getting laid again

Quote from: warriorchick on April 13, 2017, 11:40:42 AM
I am shocked at the number of people who voted for the National Championship.

To me that is the same as giving a young single guy the choice of :  A) Having an active dating life with many attractive women or B) having a glorious one-night stand with the most beautiful woman in the world, but never getting laid again, and choosing B.

Disagree. It's more like marrying your dream girl as opposed to dating a lot of different women who range from "meh" to "good enough." Quality > Quantity

Put another way: As a Cubs fan, I'd rather have 2016 and nothing else as opposed to a lifetime of 1984s and 2003s. No matter what happens from here on out, the 2016 Cubs season will live forever.

Quote from: MerrittsMustache on April 13, 2017, 12:10:53 PM
Disagree. It's more like marrying your dream girl as opposed to dating a lot of different women who range from "meh" to "good enough." Quality > Quantity

Thats a non-sequitor for the argument presented unless you mean you would just marry the girl and she dies the next day or you get divorced the next day.

Quote from: TAMU Eagle on April 13, 2017, 09:58:10 AM
You're sitting at your local watering hole. Marquette just lost its last game of the season and the long offseason is about to begin. You find yourself wishing that you could see just one more Marquette national championship before you die. That's all you want. Suddenly, the devil appears next to you, orders a Bud Light, and makes you an offer. He will guarantee that Marquette will win the National Championship next season. However, as long you are alive, they will never make another postseason. They will become the new Depaul, the sleeping giant in the Big East that won't wake up until you die.

You're not sure and pause. He then offers a second deal. He can guarantee that Marquette makes the postseason every season for as long as you are alive. They'll have occasional appearances in the second weekend and even a final four appearance here and there. But they will NEVER win a national championship so long as you are alive. Marquette would essentially become Gonzaga (or Wisconsin), always playing in March, sometimes getting close to a championship but never bringing it home.

Taking door # 1  but I'm 90.
Which do you choose? If you don't pick the national championship, how many years of irrelevancy would you be willing to take in order to win it all? If you don't make a choice, the devil says he will turn Marquette into Depaul just for the hell of it.

This question got posed to me the other day, thought I'd share it on here. This is purely a philosophical question on how much a national championship is worth to you as a fan. Deal with the devil is not symbolism for something else. The literal devil is literally offering to make you a deal.

Quote from: Nukem2 on April 13, 2017, 12:15:34 PM
Thats a non-sequitor for the argument presented unless you mean you would just marry the girl and she dies the next day or you get divorced the next day.

So once a championship is won, it's gone forever?

Quote from: TAMU Eagle on April 13, 2017, 10:19:18 AM
But as of this writing, the voting is tied.....so which option is the no brainer?

I am a Majority of One. In my opinion it's a No Brainer.    Living in the past verses Now and the Future.  I'm not comfortable being a Historian, and the story never changes.  Boring!

Quote from: MerrittsMustache on April 13, 2017, 12:21:20 PM
So once a championship is won, it's gone forever?

No, you still have the memory and satisfaction which is forever.  If you marry that dream girl and get divorced the next day, that's just a one night stand.  That's just a bad memory with no future chances.

Devil orders a Bud Light?  I think he'd go with something stronger...

Quote from: MerrittsMustache on April 13, 2017, 12:21:20 PM
So once a championship is won, it's gone forever?

Only if you are North Carolina.

Quote from: frozena pizza on April 13, 2017, 11:43:34 AM
Finish my Bud Light and say no thanks.  The while point of watching sports is that we don't know the outcome so I'd rather leave it to chance and have a clear conscience, even though the devil's version of consistent success is probably better than the reality.  In any case I've never negotiated with the devil but I'm guessing he usually expects more in return (e.g., your soul, your first born, etc.).

Agreed, which is why the provision about picking neither leads to Marquette becoming Depaul with no championship was added. He's a wily SOB that devil

Quote from: AverageJoe on April 13, 2017, 12:31:00 PM
Devil orders a Bud Light?  I think he'd go with something stronger...

I just assumed that is the swill they serve at bars in hell

If the choices are winning a championship next year, and then DePaul from then on..

OR

Never winning a championship but being a consistent NCAA team.  (For example, like Wisconsin's past decade.)

I take the latter every single time.  I don't want to be a miserable fan always looking at the past. 

Are we sure we can count on the devil?

Quote from: Lazar's Headband on April 13, 2017, 11:52:26 AM
Easily the title for me.  Imagine being a Packer fan the last 25 years if there were zero Super Bowl wins between Favre and Rodgers. Not many are satisfied with just two. Imagine the frustration level of always being right there but coming up short.

One title in my lifetime and the rest is gravy. I was born in 1980, so I respect the old timers that were around for 1977.  I can understand them opting for sustained success. But a Marquette NC is on my sports bucket list.

Zar, you're simply too young to remember Packer futility for almost 30 years.  I remember the 1989 season like it was yesterday.  The Pack was right on the brink of the playoffs for the first time in memory (except for the strike year).  Christmas night all we needed was for the Viqueens to lose on a nationally televised game.  They didn't.  And I was almost overcome thinking that it would never happen for my team again.  And just a few years later, Favre hits Sterling in the endzone on a last second hail Mary. THAT felt like the Superbowl, but was only a stupid Wild card game.  No matta.

I tell my kids all the time that they are so spoiled because the Packers have been one of the best teams during their entire freakin' lifetime.

Quote from: warriorchick on April 13, 2017, 11:40:42 AM
I am shocked at the number of people who voted for the National Championship.

To me that is the same as giving a young single guy the choice of :  A) Having an active dating life with many attractive women or B) having a glorious one-night stand with the most beautiful woman in the world, but never getting laid again, and choosing B.

It don't matta 'cuz Kate's gonna kill most dudes durin' dat 10 second stand, hey?

National title then nothing. I was too young to remember 1977 (one month old) and want that one title before I die. I'd take the title, and that way it would be easier to eventually move out of Wisconsin.

Quote from: jsglow on April 13, 2017, 02:11:19 PM
Zar, you're simply too young to remember Packer futility for almost 30 years.  I remember the 1989 season like it was yesterday.  The Pack was right on the brink of the playoffs for the first time in memory (except for the strike year).  Christmas night all we needed was for the Viqueens to lose on a nationally televised game.  They didn't.  And I was almost overcome thinking that it would never happen for my team again.  And just a few years later, Favre hits Sterling in the endzone on a last second hail Mary. THAT felt like the Superbowl, but was only a stupid Wild card game.  No matta.

I tell my kids all the time that they are so spoiled because the Packers have been one of the best teams during their entire freakin' lifetime.

I am just old enough to remember the tail end of the bad Packers, including that Christmas night game between the Vikings and Bengals. I remember ABC cutting back and forth between the Packers and Steelers watching the game on TV. Four teams had their playoff fates on the line.

But point taken. My Packer fandom has largely seen success.

Quote from: Lazar's Headband on April 13, 2017, 02:45:48 PM
I am just old enough to remember the tail end of the bad Packers, including that Christmas night game between the Vikings and Bengals. I remember ABC cutting back and forth between the Packers and Steelers watching the game on TV. Four teams had their playoff fates on the line.

But point taken. My Packer fandom has largely seen success.

I'm just old enough to remember the Ice Bowl and to pretend to be Paul Hornung in the backyard.  All good.

If it's me i go for the consistency.  Being bad for 3 years sucks, going into every season knowing you have no chance (not because of the Devil but because you are Cleveland Brown's like in your management of the team) is too painful.

if it's you I hope you pick the National Title then we can Scoopfund an assassin around Memorial Day.

Quote from: frozena pizza on April 13, 2017, 11:43:34 AM
Finish my Bud Light and say no thanks.  The whole point of watching sports is that we don't know the outcome so I'd rather leave it to chance and have a clear conscience, even though the devil's version of consistent success is probably better than the reality.  In any case I've never negotiated with the devil but I'm guessing he usually expects more in return (e.g., your soul, your first born, etc.).

Say no to the Bud Light Devil, and you might end up dead in an Auto Zone parking lot.

Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on April 13, 2017, 04:31:36 PM
Say no to the Bud Light Devil, and you might end up dead in an Auto Zone parking lot.

Well done.

I think the devil already has an exclusive contract with Duke. In the fine print it allows for UNC to win a NC every now and then. That is why they call him the (baby) blue Devil.

Quote from: jsglow on April 13, 2017, 10:00:08 AM
Easy answer for me.

You offering first born or first love, or both?

And in all honesty, I'd prefer neither of the above. As a fan, it would sap all the meaning knowing you would win the title, and take all the fun out of it. Similarly, it would take the fun out of every season knowing you had no chance to win.

I suppose that's why it's better to not make deals with devils. At the end of the day, they are lose-lose.

I think of the 70s without a title and MU would be remembered as "having a good run" or doing "pretty well" during that decade.

I love seeing Bo put his head through that hoop every time I see it. #1.
National Champs. Forever. No brainer.

Quote from: TAMU Eagle on April 13, 2017, 09:58:10 AM
You're sitting at your local watering hole. Marquette just lost its last game of the season and the long offseason is about to begin. You find yourself wishing that you could see just one more Marquette national championship before you die. That's all you want. Suddenly, the devil appears next to you, orders a Bud Light, and makes you an offer. He will guarantee that Marquette will win the National Championship next season. However, as long you are alive, they will never make another postseason. They will become the new Depaul, the sleeping giant in the Big East that won't wake up until you die.

You're not sure and pause. He then offers a second deal. He can guarantee that Marquette makes the postseason every season for as long as you are alive. They'll have occasional appearances in the second weekend and even a final four appearance here and there. But they will NEVER win a national championship so long as you are alive. Marquette would essentially become Gonzaga (or Wisconsin), always playing in March, sometimes getting close to a championship but never bringing it home.

Which do you choose? If you don't pick the national championship, how many years of irrelevancy would you be willing to take in order to win it all? If you don't make a choice, the devil says he will turn Marquette into Depaul just for the hell of it.

This question got posed to me the other day, thought I'd share it on here. This is purely a philosophical question on how much a national championship is worth to you as a fan. Deal with the devil is not symbolism for something else. The literal devil is literally offering to make you a deal.

I'm 90 so door number 1!

90? For realz? There has got to be a Scoop Award for that.

Didn't any of you see "Constantine?!"  It's a really bad movie, but it demonstrated that the only way to beat the Devil is through sacrifice...

So, the deal was that MU wins a championship and will not win another "as long as you're alive." So, take the championship...look the Devil in the eye, flip him off and step off the curb in front of a bus.

Literally taking one for the team.

Quote from: Lazar's Headband on April 13, 2017, 12:09:37 PM
Totally different scenario. I can always rewatch a copy of the title game to relive the experience.

I think a better analogy is a) lots of dating= sustained success, b) marriage = one national championship. I choose b, which also involves never getting laid again

Poor analogy, Zar. I love my wife and I get to experience that love every moment I'm with her. It's like winning a national championship EVERY year!

Quote from: MU82 on April 14, 2017, 08:56:02 AM
Poor analogy, Zar. I love my wife and I get to experience that love every moment I'm with her. It's like winning a national championship EVERY year!

Da wife is looking over your shoulder as you post, ai-na?

(https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/ff/2d/80/ff2d800c4a5bb689ed59da56a212a5d0.jpg)

Quote from: thekahoona on April 14, 2017, 08:29:39 AM
Didn't any of you see "Constantine?!"  It's a really bad movie, but it demonstrated that the only way to beat the Devil is through sacrifice...

So, the deal was that MU wins a championship and will not win another "as long as you're alive." So, take the championship...look the Devil in the eye, flip him off and step off the curb in front of a bus.

Literally taking one for the team.

Hey, how about a spoiler alert!

No deal.

Quote from: We R Final Four on April 14, 2017, 08:20:43 AM
90? For realz? There has got to be a Scoop Award for that.

I apologize for the hyperbole. My point is that the answer is age dependent. Actually 72 though so keep off my lawn!

As a purely philosophical question, the answer is easy for me.
I would take sustained success with no possibility of a natty. I don't think it would be hard for me to recalibrate personal expectations so that a FF would equal a natty.

As a matter of practicality, the answer is easy for me.
I would take the natty next year. Drop a few hundred G's on Marquette at 100-1 or 80-1 at the start of the season, and you can have one hell of a championship party. You might even have enough left over to buy MU a football team  ;)

There are a couple things I'd want to know before truly answering this...how good is Wisconsin going to be during this stretch after MU won the Natty and never made it back to the tourney again?? Yes, that matters...it matters a lot to me. If they are going to be really good, go to the tourney every year etc...then I might have a hard time saying win the Natty and then nothing. If however, UW will go back to being it's normal irrelevant self(like they were before 2000), then I will take the national champ, say F you to every arrogant badger dbag I encounter(and that's a lot), and bask in the glow until I die.

Truly, this is an age-related problem. It's been 40 years since our last one, and according to the government and their formula for minimum required distributions I don't have that many years left. I'll take a championship any day!

This is one of the most ridiculous questions yet in Scoop. I refuse to vote.

Look, we have only one national championship. I get it.

But the purpose of everything we do is to work for the second, third and fourth one. We may not get there next year, but being a national power with a competitive shot at being number 1 is what we strive to be. At Marquette, winning isn't everything, but wanting to win is -- hence win every day!

Look, even this year I held out hope, albeit small, that we could win and win some more until it was us facing some elite program on Monday night. Didn't happen but I refuse to give up hope. That"s a fan.

So yes, I expect one national championship more beforetheLord comes a calling. Two, three or four would be wonderful.

Quote from: dgies9156 on April 15, 2017, 09:03:22 AM
This is one of the most ridiculous questions yet in Scoop. I refuse to vote.

Devil is a wily SOB. Refuse to choose and he dooms Marquette to Depaul status just for the hell of it.

When I  first saw this, I thought it was a ridiculous choice, but I actually have enjoyed thinking about it some. I posed the question to my MU alum wife and my MU fan son and they struggled with it, too.

I think I've settled on sustained success because striving to be great is what it's all about. Besides, there is always a chance that we'll be especially great one year - we'll tell the devil to go to hell and win the effen title anyway, just as Shoeless Joe from Hannibal, Mo. was able to prevail in Damn Yankees!