MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: mu03eng on February 08, 2017, 12:16:42 PM
-
This topic was prompted by some twitter debate that the #mubb twitteratti got into.
The defensive deficiencies of this team are clearly the root cause of MU's bubble status this year. Some of the issue could be ascribed to roster make-up but certainly not all of it. There are definitely issues in coaching and player development at work, at least in my mind.
So, if coaching is an issue, what changes do you make in the off season? Do you replace someone on the staff? If so who? What do you do in replacement? Or do you stand pat and believe the staff gets better with another year of experience, etc?
-
Who is in charge of the defense? And, who is landing the best recruits? Or, more to the point, whose recruits is MU NOT landing? If the answers to 'defense' and 'not landing recruits' is the same, the answer is easy.
-
Who is in charge of the defense? And, who is landing the best recruits? Or, more to the point, whose recruits is MU NOT landing? If the answers to 'defense' and 'not landing recruits' is the same, the answer is easy.
Really? You think our recruiting sucks?
-
It's still too early to say what's the best course.
We have 6 games left in the regular season — including 3 more against opponents currently ranked in the Top 25. Plus the Big East tournament, likely facing at least one more Top 25 team. And, unless the wheels completely fall off, at least one postseason tournament game (hopefully in the Field of 64) beyond that.
That's a lot of basketball yet to be played against the highest level of competition. We may well need changes after this season — but not until fully evaluating the strengths and weaknesses of this team and the coaching staff.
-
Really? You think our recruiting sucks?
I think it's more of "which coach would we lose that doesn't affect our recruiting."
It also seems like we are using the Director of Basketball Operations as more of a development role rather than the way Buzz did. I fet Buzz used that role for former head coaches that didn't want to recruit anymore (Wainwright I think started as DBO) or just were let go and need to bounce back (Coach from Air Force). I think that helped him with the Xs and Os.
-
I would fire Doug Collins and replace him with Phil Jackson.
It worked for the Bulls!
-
Getting John and Eke will help a lot.
-
It's still too early to say what's the best course.
We have 6 games left in the regular season — including 3 more against opponents currently ranked in the Top 25. Plus the Big East tournament, likely facing at least one more Top 25 team. And, unless the wheels completely fall off, at least one postseason tournament game (hopefully in the Field of 64) beyond that.
That's a lot of basketball yet to be played against the highest level of competition. We may well need changes after this season — but not until fully evaluating the strengths and weaknesses of this team and the coaching staff.
Regardless of how the rest of the season plays out, I think it's pretty clear the defense needs to get better.
-
Getting John and Eke will help a lot.
How are John and Eke on the defensive end?
-
It's still too early to say what's the best course.
We have 6 games left in the regular season — including 3 more against opponents currently ranked in the Top 25. Plus the Big East tournament, likely facing at least one more Top 25 team. And, unless the wheels completely fall off, at least one postseason tournament game (hopefully in the Field of 64) beyond that.
That's a lot of basketball yet to be played against the highest level of competition. We may well need changes after this season — but not until fully evaluating the strengths and weaknesses of this team and the coaching staff.
Not to go all Denny Green(RIP) on you, but the team is who we thought they were. I don't see any possibility that the team will change. That doesn't mean that some alignment of the stars can't happen and we win a bunch of games and get to the FF. This team is great to historic on offense and terrible to below average on defense. If the historic and below average line-up at the same time in some combination we can win, if not we don't
The defense is more than player driven, hence why I think we need to make a change to the staff.
-
How are John and Eke on the defensive end?
(Much) Better than they are on the offensive end.
-
Kevin O'Neill is only 60 yo, and I am confident he can have his own parking spot now.
-
I'm not confident that bringing in a defensive specialist will have all that much of an impact in terms of defensive philosophy. This is not football, where you can make philosophical changes that have a limited impact on a team's other units. How Wojo wants to play on both ends are tied together. Both in style and the players he recruits.
Where a veteran coach could help Wojo is in teaching his ideas.
-
I'm not confident that bringing in a defensive specialist will have all that much of an impact in terms of defensive philosophy. This is not football, where you can make philosophical changes that have a limited impact on a team's other units. How Wojo wants to play on both ends are tied together. Both in style and the players he recruits.
Where a veteran coach could help Wojo is in teaching his ideas.
Not a defensive specialist, but someone who can teach fundamentals and translate what Wojo wants into action on the court.
-
I have no idea what Chris Carrawell does. Stan Johnson is clearly a recruiter, and is very active on the bench as play is going on. Brett Nelson has been recruiting as well. But Carrawell? I don't think I have seen him linked to anyone recruiting wise. I also don't see him very active in coaching situations during games.
He may play a valuable role that I am just not seeing or understanding.
-
Not a defensive specialist, but someone who can teach fundamentals and translate what Wojo wants into action on the court.
My top comment was in response to the idea of bringing in a guy like a KO or a coach known for a defensive system. That's not going to make much of an impact.
I agree with you. A veteran who can help teach. Someone that would assist in communicating Wojo's ideas could make a difference. I believe it was Freeport that stated here a few months ago about Wojo right now being more of a motivator than a teacher. That certainly seems to be the case. And, I look over to his bench and I do wonder who the teacher is.
-
Not a defensive specialist, but someone who can teach fundamentals and translate what Wojo wants into action on the court.
Did you see how much Jerry was doing this during the fresno game?
I have no idea what Chris Carrawell does. Stan Johnson is clearly a recruiter, and is very active on the bench as play is going on. Brett Nelson has been recruiting as well. But Carrawell? I don't think I have seen him linked to anyone recruiting wise. I also don't see him very active in coaching situations during games.
He may play a valuable role that I am just not seeing or understanding.
This is who I would vote off the island as well.
-
Enough. It's coaching basketball, for pity's sake, not rocket surgery.
-
Not to go all Denny Green(RIP) on you, but the team is who we thought they were. I don't see any possibility that the team will change. That doesn't mean that some alignment of the stars can't happen and we win a bunch of games and get to the FF. This team is great to historic on offense and terrible to below average on defense. If the historic and below average line-up at the same time in some combination we can win, if not we don't
The defense is more than player driven, hence why I think we need to make a change to the staff.
This I agree with. There has to be a usable scheme we can come up with that doesn't have Fischer chasing people on the perimeter, at least. Hedge and recover, maybe, but not more than that.
-
I have no idea what Chris Carrawell does. Stan Johnson is clearly a recruiter, and is very active on the bench as play is going on. Brett Nelson has been recruiting as well. But Carrawell? I don't think I have seen him linked to anyone recruiting wise. I also don't see him very active in coaching situations during games.
He may play a valuable role that I am just not seeing or understanding.
I don't know what he does either. According to his profile on gomarquette.com, he played with Wojo at Duke. He aint goin' nowhere.
-
This is who I would vote off the island as well.
This is the conclusion I reached on twitter as well.
I'll start it #fiurCarrawell
-
(Much) Better than they are on the offensive end.
Im pretty sure theo is good on both sides, but Eke i think is just defense
-
I think Carrawell was brought in as a "player development" kind of coach. Obviously had no college coaching experience before this, but I think was well known for getting guys to improve. Clearly, we don't watch practice and have no clue what kind of impact he has with these guys. Certainly, if I had to pick a coach to cut, it would be him. Though I think we've got bigger problems in player personnel than we do on the coaching staff.
-
From my few games sitting near the bench, during games it seems like Wojo and Carrawell are the ra ra pump guys up coaches. Nelson and Johnson are the talk with individual players about what they need to do coaches.
I wouldn't mind a veteran on the bench with some defensive chops. But I don't think it would help as much as we want it to.
-
This is the conclusion I reached on twitter as well.
I'll start it #fiurCarrawell
I came to that conclusion during a discussion about this earlier in the year. However, he and Wojo are besties, I don't think that's happening. Stan is too good at recruiting. That probably means Nelson would be the one to go if anyone did.
-
There are only three reasons why the defense is bad:
1) the staff has recruited kids who cannot play or learn defense; or
2) the staff cannot teach defense; or
3) the staff teaches defense and the players don't listen and don't execute.
The common thread in all three is: the staff. So something needs to change. Not Wojo - I like Wojo. But something has to change.
-
There are only three reasons why the defense is bad:
1) the staff has recruited kids who cannot play or learn defense; or
2) the staff cannot teach defense; or
3) the staff teaches defense and the players don't listen and don't execute.
The common thread in all three is: the staff. So something needs to change. Not Wojo - I like Wojo. But something has to change.
How would #3 be the staff's fault?
-
How would #3 be the staff's fault?
If you lose your people you are not a leader.
-
I came to that conclusion during a discussion about this earlier in the year. However, he and Wojo are besties, I don't think that's happening. Stan is too good at recruiting. That probably means Nelson would be the one to go if anyone did.
This was my thought too. Nelson has been recruiting well but not like Stan. Though that would likely put a dent in the noon ball rosters.
-
Nelson is very close to the Hausers...
-
Nelson is very close to the Hausers...
Isn't he also a major reason Stan signed on?
-
I know only one --- but Nelson and Carrawell go. Get a veteran name for
recruiting. Johnson is an A-1 start. We need another good salesman.
Can't think of any top names.
-
Well let's not fire Wojo, but get rid of one the assistants as if that will magically turn things around. You really think the staff likes loosing? Let's see if they can find the pieces to make a winning team. I think we're on our way with Hauser, Howard and Rowsey. Let's see if Frohling (box out), Cain, Theojohn and Eke can play the boards and we still have 2 schollies to fill.
-
Fire the moderation staff on scoop. No defense, just constantly ban hammering. One trick pony.
-
bring back Jerry W! :)
-
I have no idea what Chris Carrawell does. Stan Johnson is clearly a recruiter, and is very active on the bench as play is going on. Brett Nelson has been recruiting as well. But Carrawell? I don't think I have seen him linked to anyone recruiting wise. I also don't see him very active in coaching situations during games.
He may play a valuable role that I am just not seeing or understanding.
https://youtu.be/3NYqpH0XzzQ
-
I'd fire Crean.
Ha, beat never to it. 8-)
-
Isn't he also a major reason Stan signed on?
Yes, they were at Drake together, I believe. That's why I don't think anyone will be going. If they're going to figure it out, it will be together. Which probably means more bumps and bruises, and the Marquette faithful needing to accept that this is a work in progress.
-
Crean sucks
-
We need some Western Recruiting Exposure and someone who would distract the opponents which would help our defense. Hire Stacy Johnson.
-
Diener's killing us.
-
We need some Western Recruiting Exposure and someone who would distract the opponents which would help our defense. Hire Stacy Johnson.
ZFB approves.
-
Yes, they were at Drake together, I believe. That's why I don't think anyone will be going. If they're going to figure it out, it will be together. Which probably means more bumps and bruises, and the Marquette faithful needing to accept that this is a work in progress.
I have a feeling this is accurate. Wojo wants people he is comfortable with .
-
I have a feeling this is accurate. Wojo wants people he is comfortable with .
#safespaces
-
Bring in Dom Capers to fix the D.
-
OK, I'll let Wojo make that decision.
I've said it elsewhere and I''ll say it again here:
1) He inherited a mess with only 7 scholarship players in Year 1. No one wins that way.
2) He recruited the fifth to 10th best class in the country his second year. He won 20 games.
3) Under Wojo, We are a bubble team for the 2017 NCAA in his third year. We'll win 18 to 20 games again.
4) He has an excellent recruiting class coming next year that will address many of the problems this year's class has -- and one of his better recruits still has a year to go on his Mormon mission!
If any of you have raised children, you know what's happening with our basketball team and its coaching staff. We grow and develop, and make mistakes. They're called growing pains. Unless you want John Calipari and the crap that comes with him, we're going to have growing pains. The defense will come and two to three years from now, when we are an elite program again, most of you will be singing Wojo's praises and be wondering whether he's going to _______ (fill in the blank).
Be patient. It isn't easy but be patient.
-
Right there with you, dgies.
-
Bring in Dom Capers to fix the D.
+1000! (LOL)
-
We need some Western Recruiting Exposure and someone who would distract the opponents which would help our defense. Hire Stacy Johnson.
+2000!! (LOLouder)
-
The main reason we are bad at defense is roster construction. The teams we play against are taller, quicker, more athletic and MUCH stronger physically than we are. Hard to defend under those circumstances. We are great shooters, though.
-
The main reason we are bad at defense is roster construction. The teams we play against are taller, quicker, more athletic and MUCH stronger physically than we are. Hard to defend under those circumstances. We are great shooters, though.
I disagree with some of this. Roster construction is part of it, but there are inherent fundamental issues with technique and strategy that are a large part of the problem. Take a look at this list:
UNC Asheville
UC Riverside
Oklahoma St.
Stephen F. Austin
Colorado
Towson
Cleveland St.
Indiana
Nevada
Mount St. Mary's
UTEP
Michigan
Navy
North Dakota St.
Fordham
Rider
Boston University
Sam Houston St.
Penn
Iowa
Lehigh
UC Davis
South Alabama
Santa Clara
Wake Forest
New Orleans
Bradley
Green Bay
Grand Canyon
New Hampshire
Arkansas
Liberty
Georgia St.
James Madison
Boston College
Loyola Chicago
Kent St.
Temple
Indiana St.
UAB
Holy Cross
Fairfield
Texas St.
St. Bonaventure
These are the teams that are ranked ahead of us on KenPom from a defensive efficiency standpoint (164 to 120) so even UNC Ashville isn't good. But more importantly, which teams on that list have a better roster combination than us? Or have better players? I'd argue not that many so it has to be a problem of more than just the personnel at this point, we are that bad at defense.
-
The main reason we are bad at defense is roster construction. The teams we play against are taller, quicker, more athletic and MUCH stronger physically than we are. Hard to defend under those circumstances. We are great shooters, though.
That is exactly what I have been saying. Watch Minny last night, not great players, but physically gifted at most positions. Much like Wisconsin. Next coach
will be Steve Novak, he can not play D either.
-
I disagree with some of this. Roster construction is part of it, but there are inherent fundamental issues with technique and strategy that are a large part of the problem. Take a look at this list:
UNC Asheville
UC Riverside
Oklahoma St.
Stephen F. Austin
Colorado
Towson
Cleveland St.
Indiana
Nevada
Mount St. Mary's
UTEP
Michigan
Navy
North Dakota St.
Fordham
Rider
Boston University
Sam Houston St.
Penn
Iowa
Lehigh
UC Davis
South Alabama
Santa Clara
Wake Forest
New Orleans
Bradley
Green Bay
Grand Canyon
New Hampshire
Arkansas
Liberty
Georgia St.
James Madison
Boston College
Loyola Chicago
Kent St.
Temple
Indiana St.
UAB
Holy Cross
Fairfield
Texas St.
St. Bonaventure
These are the teams that are ranked ahead of us on KenPom from a defensive efficiency standpoint (164 to 120) so even UNC Ashville isn't good. But more importantly, which teams on that list have a better roster combination than us? Or have better players? I'd argue not that many so it has to be a problem of more than just the personnel at this point, we are that bad at defense.
Just scrolling quickly through there are about 4 high majors that I saw. If we played the schedule of Fairfield we'd have a better defensive rating than they do.
-
I thought MU D was much better against Butler then I have seen in most games. JJJ took Kamar out of the game in the second half. I think JJJ is much better on the
outside defending then playing that zone which he never blocks anybody out. I am sure he will guard Pryor or Peak against Gtown. Butler hit 5 straght threes in the
first half all in the corners, if you are going to lose, I would rather see that then Chabraz going in for a lay-ups which he did in the second half to win the game.
-
The difference in perception of Wojo from Scoop to the world of New Jersey high school hoops that I travel in could not be more diametrically opposed.
-
Wojo wants people he is comfortable with .
Umm, have any of you ever worked in a corporation?
Of course he wants people he is comfortable with. It's why when a CEO of a company or even the President of the USA brings her's or his own people with her or him. Period. It means some leadership, if not all, from the previous regime are collecting severance, writing resumes and shaking their connection trees!
When you buy Wojo, you buy the package. You count on him to hire the people who he thinks will make a difference in executing your mission, which, in our case, is to again become an elite program in college basketball.
-
If you lose your people you are not a leader.
This. You need your players listening to you and doing or attempting to do what you tell them