We got a lot of replays on the video board tonight! Did the Big East change their rule on showing replays? Was that rule only for charging calls? I don't remember.
Whatever the case, it was nice seeing the replays in the arena.
I wanted to keep seeing JJJ's dunks on a repeat. Getting to see the one down the lane again was nice.
That dunk was a warcrime against the rim and Georgetown's defense.
https://twitter.com/MarquetteMBB/status/814298575978934272 (https://twitter.com/MarquetteMBB/status/814298575978934272)
It would be smart to do more replays. One of the most common reasons people cite for staying home is because they get replays on TV.
The replays were nice, but a bit frustrating too, especially seeing Sam get called for out-of-bounds when the replay showed otherwise and a number of obvious fouls on Georgetown that somehow didn't get called.
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 29, 2016, 01:04:56 PM
The replays were nice, but a bit frustrating too, especially seeing Sam get called for out-of-bounds when the replay showed otherwise and a number of obvious fouls on Georgetown that somehow didn't get called.
That's the concern with in-arena replays, right? Getting the crowd going against the refs?
Quote from: jesmu84 on December 29, 2016, 01:47:35 PM
That's the concern with in-arena replays, right? Getting the crowd going against the refs?
I think so, though last night, I don't think the replays got the crowd against the refs, it was that stretch of repeated terrible calls favoring Georgetown that got the crowd against the refs.
I don't remember the exact sequence, but it felt like in the span of 2-3 minutes, we had the Hauser OOB play, a terrible uncalled foul by Hayes that would've been his fourth, and the Rowsey three that went uncalled. Maybe the over-the-back by Pryor on JJ was in there? Though that might have ended up in our favor, but at the time everyone around me thought it was on JJ despite Pryor pretty much climbing his back (both #23s).
I really didn't have many issues with the refs last night outside of that little stretch, but when it was bad, it was awful and the entire stadium was letting them have it before and after the replays.
If I was Marquette, and I was losing season ticket holders and my attendance was trending down .. I'd start playing all replays and wait for a reprimand.
And then I'd keep doing it, until the 5th or 6th reprimand when the NCAA really really super duper wants it to stop.
The referees were by and large just fine last night. A couple missed calls that benefited both teams. But nothing terrible.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on December 29, 2016, 03:44:53 PM
If I was Marquette, and I was losing season ticket holders and my attendance was trending down .. I'd start playing all replays and wait for a reprimand.
And then I'd keep doing it, until the 5th or 6th reprimand when the NCAA really really super duper wants it to stop.
+1. The arena shouldn't be some BS safe-space for the refs. They should hear it when they mess up.
Quote from: Dr. Vinnie Boombatz on December 29, 2016, 03:47:54 PM
The referees were by and large just fine last night. A couple missed calls that benefited both teams. But nothing terrible.
The delayed call on the Rowsey three and the no call on JJ getting trucked were pretty egregious. Even the Hoya board thought those were obvious calls.
It seemed like one of the refs doesn't believe the pump fake into a foul should count as a foul.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on December 29, 2016, 05:47:06 PM
The delayed call on the Rowsey three and the no call on JJ getting trucked were pretty egregious. Even the Hoya board thought those were obvious calls.
It seemed like one of the refs doesn't believe the pump fake into a foul should count as a foul.
I'm not one of those folks who always thinks the refs favor the other team, but he reffing was particularly bad last night, with about 75% of the bad calls going against Marquette.
At least 3 of those bad calls led directly to GTown buckets. If we had lost a close one, I would have been pissed.
1.5 really bad calls went against MU. JJ's non call where he then stood and watched while Georgetown scored, and the near non-call on Rowsey. If that one hadn't gotten fixed, the whole game could have turned.
Quote from: tower912 on December 29, 2016, 06:09:50 PM
1.5 really bad calls went against MU. JJ's non call where he then stood and watched while Georgetown scored, and the near non-call on Rowsey. If that one hadn't gotten fixed, the whole game could have turned.
The JJJ non call yeah. The Rowsey call was good. Just delayed.
Quote from: Dr. Vinnie Boombatz on December 29, 2016, 06:24:49 PM
The JJJ non call yeah. The Rowsey call was good. Just delayed.
That almost non-call got me thinking during the game last night about the review process for referee performance.
The ref two feet behind Rowsey, in no way screened, deemed it no foul.
The baseline official from the other side of the floor had to come running over to make the call that was obvious to everyone else on the floor.
So does the nearer ref face any review after the game? the week? the season?
Does it go by coach complaints? Is the NCAA actually a vetting body when it comes to officials? I know the NCAA determines who gets tourney assignments, but in-conference scheduling is up to the individual leagues. Is discipline (or reduced scheduling) at their discretion as well?
Quote from: barfolomew on December 29, 2016, 06:39:58 PM
That almost non-call got me thinking during the game last night about the review process for referee performance.
The ref two feet behind Rowsey, in no way screened, deemed it no foul.
The baseline official from the other side of the floor had to come running over to make the call that was obvious to everyone else on the floor.
So does the nearer ref face any review after the game? the week? the season?
Does it go by coach complaints? Is the NCAA actually a vetting body when it comes to officials? I know the NCAA determines who gets tourney assignments, but in-conference scheduling is up to the individual leagues. Is discipline (or reduced scheduling) at their discretion as well?
I think the baseline ref was sick of that guy effing up the calls. As I recall, that one guy was responsible for most of the bad ones.
Quote from: warriorchick on December 29, 2016, 07:08:38 PM
I think the baseline ref was sick of that guy effing up the calls. As I recall, that one guy was responsible for most of the bad ones.
I don't ref basketball, just baseball, but it's generally an unwritten rule that you don't overrule someone else's call unless they ask for help. To get to the point where you have to run across the court and overrule a call you have to be super pissed at your partner. I've worked with umpires that I've gotten fed up with and had to overrule. It's not fun. Usually, I don't take assignments with those guys again.
Quote from: SaveOD238 on December 29, 2016, 10:03:46 PM
To get to the point where you have to run across the court and overrule a call you have to be super pissed at your partner.
Did you see the game? ::)
Quote from: warriorchick on December 29, 2016, 10:08:52 PM
Did you see the game? ::)
Yep. My favorite moment was how after that play when they went to review the tape, it looked like the other two refs squeezed out the third from being able to look at the screen. The refs last night were not friends.
I think inside and up to the three point line is a dual coverage zone of the lead and the trail. It looked like the lead official under the rim came charging in though. It didn't help that a few plays earlier Rowsey tried the same pump fake 3 move on another big. That one was far less convincing and pretty weak. I wonder if that was fresh in the officials mind that he tried to sell it.
I officiate to and it's called. . . Don't fish in someone else's pond. The lead had to be absolutely convinced he saw it to come in on that call. In the end, it was delayed but they got it right.
From my old colleague and pal who directs pretty much all MU games at the BC:
They follow the Big East rules-
Only one angle to be shown and one look at it.
No blocking or charging calls. Nothing controversial that might insite the crowd, or challenge the integrity of the referees.
On a side note, he said that in fact Georgetown thought we were showing too many replays Monday night....
Doing many games there myself, MU has a coordinator/producer of sorts that more or less nixes stuff or calls for certain things to be cued up and played. It's a pretty tight script all in all and actually, imo, ties the hands of the director to call the game a great deal- ergo goofy promotions when the crowd really wants to see game action or replays.
There you have it.
Quote from: TVDirector on December 30, 2016, 10:41:44 AM
No blocking or charging calls.
That must have been what I was thinking of.
Thanks for that post! Great information!
I thought that they began showing more replays last season.
Quote from: TVDirector on December 30, 2016, 10:41:44 AM
From my old colleague and pal who directs pretty much all MU games at the BC:
They follow the Big East rules-
Only one angle to be shown and one look at it.
No blocking or charging calls. Nothing controversial that might insite the crowd, or challenge the integrity of the referees.
On a side note, he said that in fact Georgetown thought we were showing too many replays Monday night....
Doing many games there myself, MU has a coordinator/producer of sorts that more or less nixes stuff or calls for certain things to be cued up and played. It's a pretty tight script all in all and actually, imo, ties the hands of the director to call the game a great deal- ergo goofy promotions when the crowd really wants to see game action or replays.
There you have it.
excellent post! these are the types of things-from people in the know-who make 'scoop cool-thank you!
Write Stu Jackson if you want more replays (great Val hire btw). I did about three years ago and got a very thoughtful response (he says he gets many on this subject).
His main point is the home fans getting out of hand. I referenced the NFL where scoreboard replays actually help fans move on but that his point was their was an option for a coach video review. That they needed to get the review option ironed out first. Glad they are easing back for the in-house fans' benefit and experience (so I don't need to text friends at home).
Based on digital analysis officials get about 90-95% of the calls right but are 50/50 on close calls. Maybe 2-3 calls per game.
As a homer, all calls against MU are bad. However, watching as a neutral fan at the Thanksgiving or NCAA tournament games, all fans think the refs suck on every call. It is pretty funny actually. Sitting through these games puts things in perspective in regard to how good these officials are overall.
That doesn't mean their aren't bad ones or ones who try to take over games at the end to make the game about them. Uneven and inconsistent game calling is the biggest offense. However, they are professionals and deserve criticism.
Btw, this is the first year of a pooled officiating agreement with the BE and ACC sharing. A physical urban league and a finesse league. Good prep for the postseason but I am guessing there will be a period of adjustment.