Depaul is the standard for bad basketball in the Big East. But this year's team might be one of the worst Depaul teams ever
Consider:
Kenpom has Depaul at 192 on Dec 14.
The BE and Power 5 conferences (B1G, ACC, SEC, B12, P12) have a combined total of 75 teams. Only 2 are worse than Depaul (and not by much)
Oregon State (P12) = 200
Boston College (ACC) = 212
Their record to date ...
So far in non-conference play they are 5-4
Wins
Robert Morris (KenPom 282) = I did not know they had a team and they only beat them by 6
UWM (KenPom 241) = They are terrible at 4 - 7 in non-conference play
Missouri State (KenPom 132) = They needed a Billy Garrett buzzer beater to beat this Missouri Valley team that was 13-19 last year
Drake (KenPom 269)= the worst team in the Valley at 1 -9 and Depaul won by 2, coming from behind in the final two minutes
Lamar (KenPom 306) = won by 19, but no team not in the top 300 should count as a win. Division 2 teams (which do not count!) are harder
Losses
Rutgers (KenPom 131)= they were last year's B1G last place team (7-25) with a new coach Arguably the easiest team to beat in the B1G and they could not.
Northwestern (KenPom 47) = Lost by 16, was down by 25 with 4 left before NU emptied their bench.
Temple (KenPom 86) = lost by 11 by was down by 23 with 8 minutes to go before Temple emptied their bench
UIC (KenPom 236) = As bad as Depual is they lost to a team that was worse!
And ... UIC sophomore star Dikembe Dixson went down with a knee injury early in the UIC game yesterday and then still beat Depaul. He is being evaluated today.
Sum It Up
Depaul is the worst team in the BE = no surprise
They are one of the three worst Power 5/Big East teams in the country
They would probably be a bottom half Horizon league team
This is not just another bad Depaul team. They are all-time bad.
I don't wish DePaul bad. That said, there is part of me that chuckles seeing them struggle only because I find Leitao to be such a dislikable person.
Starts at the top. Maybe Leitao thought JLP had some magic up her sleeve this time around. I couldn't imagine why he would have come back (other than for a paycheck).
all this being said we probably loose a game to them this year for their only conference win, because that's how we roll
Leito inherited a burning toxic waste dump with exploding radioactive debris.
If we think the pace of Wojo's rebuilding is slow, imagine being a DePaul fan. In the pre-Jordan era, DePaul was Chicago basketball. You had a Final Four team with the capability to recruit nationally. If they wanted a Chicago player in the post-Al era, they got him.
I have no clue what is really going on at DePaul. It makes no sense that a team with this much potential and their storied history could be this bad. Not even during the Dukiet era were we this bad. I candidly can't imagine what it is about JLP that keeps her employed at DePaul but given the financial potential of a dynamic DePaul basketball program, she needs to be scrapped, sent away on a mission trip to Outer Slobobia or otherwise put out of DePaul's misery.
Imagine the rivalry if DePaul and Marquette were someday again Top 20 programs. The Big East rivalry for the Tollway Cup would be the best in the conference.
Dikembe Dixson plays for UIC.
DePaul is terrible, hardly unprecedented.
Quote from: dgies9156 on December 15, 2016, 12:52:10 PM
Leito inherited a burning toxic waste dump with exploding radioactive debris.
Absolutely nothing compared to what KO inherited.....or Wojo for that matter
I just could not resist this.
But they are going to play 12 games against top 50 (including Providence at 51) in the Big East.
Honestly, they have NO business being in the Big East. They played last night at their on campus arena(where their women play) and couldn't even fill that halfway. They are god awful and really should move down in conference, or fold their program(which some of their fans are in favor of).
I think Depaul outperforms St. Johns this year.
I know I have said this before but anytime I get despondent about MU I go to the DU message board and realize hell is long ways away. They have resident idiot Bubba and about 2 other posters and event those guys are starting to give up.
Quote from: sailwi on December 15, 2016, 09:01:22 PM
I know I have said this before but anytime I get despondent about MU I go to the DU message board and realize hell is long ways away. They have resident idiot Bubba and about 2 other posters and event those guys are starting to give up.
There's a Depaul board?
Quote from: muguru on December 15, 2016, 06:41:43 PM
Honestly, they have NO business being in the Big East. They played last night at their on campus arena(where their women play) and couldn't even fill that halfway. They are god awful and really should move down in conference, or fold their program(which some of their fans are in favor of).
Every conference needs bottom dwellers, everyone can't be above average.
Quote from: forgetful on December 15, 2016, 09:13:12 PM
There's a Depaul board?
I visited their Scout board. More chatter there than I thought.
http://www.scout.com/college/depaul/forums/2585-discussion
Quote from: forgetful on December 15, 2016, 09:13:12 PM
There's a Depaul board?
I think it's spelled "bored."
I just hope MU doesn't give them reason to wake up for a night.
Someone in the BE will always be last. Glad it is not us.
I am more concerned about our program development. Hiring inexperienced coaches at high salaries is a strange management approach and if they work out they move on. This does not happen to top programs. Top programs also can consistently find a power forward or two and learn D. We are progressing and we might eventually get there but it has not been a direct path. This concerns me much more than a team in Chicago and it's impact on the league.
Quote from: Class71 on December 16, 2016, 02:31:23 AM
Someone in the BE will always be last. Glad it is not us.
I am more concerned about our program development. Hiring inexperienced coaches at high salaries is a strange management approach and if they work out they move on. This does not happen to top programs. Top programs also can consistently find a power forward or two and learn D. We are progressing and we might eventually get there but it has not been a direct path. This concerns me much more than a team in Chicago and it's impact on the league.
I agree with this. I would like to remind everyone that in two years under Wojo MU finished last once and has lost twice to DePaul. DePaul does not spend the money that MU does, so which program is the bigger failure based on return on dollars spent?
Quote from: bilsu on December 16, 2016, 09:28:45 AM
I agree with this. I would like to remind everyone that in two years under Wojo MU finished last once and has lost twice to DePaul. DePaul does not spend the money that MU does, so which program is the bigger failure based on return on dollars spent?
Still Depaul. They haven't been relevant in a generation.
Quote from: bilsu on December 16, 2016, 09:28:45 AM
I agree with this. I would like to remind everyone that in two years under Wojo MU finished last once and has lost twice to DePaul. DePaul does not spend the money that MU does, so which program is the bigger failure based on return on dollars spent?
Wow.
Give their athletic department a $1M gift and the AD will gladly earmark it for a top notch women's croquet team. And they'll give her a plaque to honor the accomplishment.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on December 16, 2016, 09:30:55 AM
Still Depaul. They haven't been relevant in a generation.
Finished first in our conference in 03-04, made the Second Round of the NCAA.
Quote from: WI inferiority Complexes on December 16, 2016, 09:47:57 AM
Finished first in our conference in 03-04, made the Second Round of the NCAA.
Including this season, here's DePaul for the past 25 years:
- 2 NCAA Appearances 2000, 2004
- 1 NCAA Victory 2004, over Dayton in overtime
- 5 Coaches Of those, only Dave Leitao has a winning record in this span. He is 72-60, so at their current pace it will be back under .500 soon enough.
- 4 20-win seasons No real sugar coating that
- 6 years of futility From 2009-2014 DePaul finished every season dead last in the Big East
I'd say that counts as not relevant in a generation. I'd similarly say Washington State (bids in 2007, 2008), South Carolina (1997, 1998, 2004), and Penn State (1996, 2001, 2011) haven't been relevant in a generation.
Crowd shot at tipoff. Just pathetic.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzrfQssVQAAyVy8.jpg)
Quote from: Class71 on December 16, 2016, 02:31:23 AM
Someone in the BE will always be last. Glad it is not us.
You don't have to outrun the bear... you just have to outrun the slowest kid in the group.
Quote from: MU82 on December 16, 2016, 09:35:13 AM
Wow.
Insane comment, but I'm not surprised by who it is coming from.
It was reported that Oliver Purnell made 2.2 million a season at DePaul. In his tenure, he had
15 total conference wins. In five seasons! That's $733,333 dollars per conference win!
And, let's add to the fact that DePaul's last
winning season was 06-07. That's 10 years ago.
So, what program is the bigger failure based on return???
No doubt that DePaul's program is far below MU's. Also no doubt that we need to get up on a significantly higher ledge relative to where we currently sit.
Did you notice that the thread title reads "Depaul" instead of "DePaul?" Just another sign of the university's decreased significance. It doesn't even warrant proper capitalization. Before long it'll be merely "depaul."
depawl's problem is that it needs fresh blood, a fresh face at the helm. I think they should fire Leitao and hire Oliver Purnell, a respectable, available coach who could jumpstart the program.
Quote from: Eldon on December 16, 2016, 11:30:17 AM
depawl's problem is that it needs fresh blood, a fresh face at the helm. I think they should fire Leitao and hire Oliver Purnell, a respectable, available coach who could jumpstart the program.
That would be the most duhpaul thing ever.
Quote from: RJax55 on December 16, 2016, 10:31:31 AM
Insane comment, but I'm not surprised by who it is coming from.
It was reported that Oliver Purnell made 2.2 million a season at DePaul. In his tenure, he had 15 total conference wins. In five seasons! That's $733,333 dollars per conference win!
And, let's add to the fact that DePaul's last winning season was 06-07. That's 10 years ago.
So, what program is the bigger failure based on return???
How is bilsu's question insane? Frankly, I think it's quite valid question even though I disagree with the implication.
Quote from: GoldenWarrior11 on December 16, 2016, 10:20:18 AM
Crowd shot at tipoff. Just pathetic.
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzrfQssVQAAyVy8.jpg)
There's more people at the games I do PA for at a D3 school. And the gym is about the same size.
Quote from: Benny B on December 16, 2016, 12:27:12 PM
How is bilsu's question insane? Frankly, I think it's quite valid question even though I disagree with the implication.
Return on investment between programs is a valid question, but using DePaul as a comp vs MU (or any of the other Big East programs) is the insane part.
Even if DePaul's return on investment is better in terms dollars on hand (highly unlikely), there's other factors to consider. Over the last 10 years, they are the worst power conference team. The level of futility is staggering, especially with their history. Which has led to no student involvement, little alumni support and almost zero local media coverage. They are an afterthought in the Chicago sports market. This all hurts the DePaul brand.
You have been to the AllState for the MU game. How many DePaul fans are there? Maybe 1,500. What's the season ticket base at? Maybe 1,000? There's no way that is not having a significant impact on the athletic department.
While they are not spending MU money on the program, they are spending some cash. Purnell's contract is one example. And, their new stadium is another.
If DePaul is lucky JLP just wants the stadium to be her saving grace before stepping down
Quote from: BagpipingBoxer on December 16, 2016, 01:12:04 PM
If DePaul is lucky JLP just wants the stadium to be her saving grace before stepping down
The arena deal is classic DePaul. The school was offered a rent-free lease at the United Center and turned it down so it could pay the city of Chicago $70 million to build a arena that isn't even near an El station. The cost has zoomed to $173 million and the idea that DePaul's suburban audience are going to drive downtown for a Wednesday evening game is is fallacy. If you're drawing 2,400 a game in Rosemont, what will they draw on South Lake Shore Drive?
And the kicker? They signed a 50 year lease.
Quote from: DFW HOYA on December 16, 2016, 05:18:15 PM
The arena deal is classic DePaul. The school was offered a rent-free lease at the United Center and turned it down so it could pay the city of Chicago $70 million to build a arena that isn't even near an El station. The cost has zoomed to $173 million and the idea that DePaul's suburban audience are going to drive downtown for a Wednesday evening game is is fallacy. If you're drawing 2,400 a game in Rosemont, what will they draw on South Lake Shore Drive?
And the kicker? They signed a 50 year lease.
If they built it at the Finkl site or nearby, I would become a season ticket holder. See one good team in non-con and Big East teams play a 10 minute cab ride from home? Sure. Make it inconvenient? No way.
As it is, I drive up for most MU games.
Quote from: RJax55 on December 16, 2016, 01:09:15 PM
You have been to the AllState for the MU game. How many DePaul fans are there? Maybe 1,500. What's the season ticket base at? Maybe 1,000? There's no way that is not having a significant impact on the athletic department.
They actually draw quite well for MU games, especially students. It's "get in free with your rejection letter from Marquette" night.
Tonight Depaul played at home against Southeast Missouri State, RPI 272 and last in the Ohio Valley (now 4 - 8)
Depaul won by 3, but was trailing in the final minute.
This is worse than average Depaul this year.
less than a minute to go and they almost gave the game away. player inbounds the ball to a teammate who was going out of bounds to inbound the ball. Two D1 players on that team tonight
I belive there were more people at the depaul game tnite than the mu game
Quote from: Mr. Sand-Knit on December 19, 2016, 11:22:37 PM
I belive there were more people at the depaul game tnite than the mu game
I think the only time in the past 15 years that any Depaul game has matched any MU game in attendance is when MU plays at Depaul
Quote from: Mr. Sand-Knit on December 19, 2016, 11:22:37 PM
I belive there were more people at the depaul game tnite than the mu game
I know you're trying to be funny but if you actually saw the DePaul game their was maybe 500 people at it. And that includes the sidelines the cheerleaders and the band.
Quote from: Jesse Livermore on December 20, 2016, 06:19:18 AM
I know you're trying to be funny but if you actually saw the DePaul game their was maybe 500 people at it. And that includes the sidelines the cheerleaders and the band.
I was there and this is accurate. They actually shut down beer sales at halftime.
Quote from: DFW HOYA on December 16, 2016, 05:18:15 PM
The arena deal is classic DePaul. The school was offered a rent-free lease at the United Center and turned it down so it could pay the city of Chicago $70 million to build a arena that isn't even near an El station. The cost has zoomed to $173 million and the idea that DePaul's suburban audience are going to drive downtown for a Wednesday evening game is is fallacy. If you're drawing 2,400 a game in Rosemont, what will they draw on South Lake Shore Drive?
And the kicker? They signed a 50 year lease.
Not to defend Depaul, but the "not near an EL Station" is a fallacy. Its 4 blocks from a Red Line and 2 from a Green Line. Thats closer than some people's commute off a train to work in the morning.
Finkle sight would have been amazing, but you got the impression that it never had a prayer.
I'm not sure playing rent free at the UC was a great option either. If people aren't going to bother to travel to Rosemont, they aren't going to travel to the UC either. And that arena is cavernous and they will be getting whatever dates are leftover after the Bulls and Hawks play.
I can at least understand why they made the choice they did. Not saying in the end it was the correct one, but it is understandable.
They should have just teamed with Loyola or NW and seen about putting together stadium together.
Quote from: JWags85 on December 20, 2016, 09:59:23 AM
Not to defend Depaul, but the "not near an EL Station" is a fallacy. Its 4 blocks from a Red Line and 2 from a Green Line. Thats closer than some people's commute off a train to work in the morning.
Finkle sight would have been amazing, but you got the impression that it never had a prayer.
The Finkle land was sold for $100 million and the developer promised $1 billion in development ... making it one for the largest projects ($wise) in the history of Chicago.
To put a basketball stadium on that site would have arguably made it the most expensive stadium ever built.
So while I agree with you that it would have been great to have it there, the economics never made it a possibility.
Depaul is a 26 point underdog to Nova and is leading 56 to 55 with 3 1/2 to play!
If it happens, is this the biggest upset in Big East conference play history?
I think this is Virginia/Chaminade level upset.
Quote from: Yukon Cornelius on December 28, 2016, 07:21:13 PM
Depaul is a 26 point underdog to Nova and is leading 56 to 55 with 3 1/2 to play!
If it happens, is this the biggest upset in Big East conference play history?
I think this is Virginia/Chaminade level upset.
Virginia and Chaminade are not in the same conference...
Looky here fellas, hey?
Quote from: naginiF on December 28, 2016, 07:31:32 PM
Virginia and Chaminade are not in the same conference...
who said they were?
(re-read what I wrote carefully)
Quote from: Yukon Cornelius on December 28, 2016, 07:34:10 PM
who said they were?
(re-read what I wrote carefully)
lighten up and be able to recognize a joke
So are we happy because this shows that Nova is beatable by anybody, including us?
Or worried because this shows that we could lose to DePaul again?
Quote from: MU82 on December 28, 2016, 10:38:34 PM
So are we happy because this shows that Nova is beatable by anybody, including us?
Or worried because this shows that we could lose to DePaul again?
Both :P
Quote from: MU82 on December 28, 2016, 10:38:34 PM
So are we happy because this shows that Nova is beatable by anybody, including us?
Or worried because this shows that we could lose to DePaul again?
It really sucks for DePaul, because every Big East coach will point out this game and DePaul will not be able to sneak up on another team that does not respect them.
Quote from: Newsdrms on December 28, 2016, 10:39:27 PM
Both :P
Yep. I'm kinda glad this happened, because it all but eliminated the chance that our boys won't take the DePaul game seriously.