Whatever. I am going out with friends shortly, so I will do this at halftime.
1. Luke.
2. JjJ, run the offense, play defense every time. Bad habits are creeping back and there are equally talented guys willing to come and do what wojo wants.
3. MH looks better every game. Obviously, there will be off nights.
4. Sam tearing it up on the defensive boards.
5. The day will come when Rowsey and KR start hitting 3s.
6. Great ball movement.
7. A year ago, Duane lays that in instead of dunking.
8. Good to see William Gates.
9. Man, I hope we don't screw it up or have somebody injured in the second half.
#JINX
Is MH for Matt Heldt or Markus Howard?
@MarquetteMBB
#mubb hits the century mark for the 2nd-straight game for the first time since the 2008-09 season with a 101-79 win over HBU at the @BMOHBC.
- Cheatham is playing really good, quicker than last year and very underrated.
- Reinhardt is playing really bad, 4 fouls, 3 turnovers and 0 for 6 on threes, all wide open. Probably shooting under 25% on year. Hope he comes around eventually.
- Wojo cutting his rotation down to nine now, with Cohen gone and Rowsey at end of bench. Still does some hockey line subbing, but worked tonight.
-One more game until Georgia and Wisconsin to work on things.
These games VS. +300 teams do nothing to get ready for Wisconsin or Georgia.
Wojo needs to shorten the bench further and let Katin watch a little more. He's 328th in the country in percentage of shots and has a eFG percentage of 33. Last year at USC he was 54%. Not sure what the deal is but he's been awful.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on November 26, 2016, 09:12:32 PM
Last year at USC he was 54%. Not sure what the deal is but he's been awful.
No he wasn't.
Think we should give Katin more time to shake off the rust before writing him off.
Quote from: Jay Bee on November 26, 2016, 09:37:26 PM
No he wasn't.
eFG% was 53.4% last year. 2pFG% 50.9%, 3pFG% 37.3%.
Quote from: Ruby on November 26, 2016, 10:03:50 PM
Think we should give Katin more time to shake off the rust before writing him off.
This. Apparently, many Scoopers learned nothing from the Lockett experience.
What rust? He played last year just like everyone else.
Quote from: Ruby on November 26, 2016, 10:03:50 PM
Think we should give Katin more time to shake off the rust before writing him off.
What Rust? He played last year.
Quote from: Actually No on November 26, 2016, 10:05:41 PM
eFG% was 53.4% last year. 2pFG% 50.9%, 3pFG% 37.3%.
So you're agreeing with me. Thanks.
Quote from: Lazar's Headband on November 26, 2016, 08:32:05 PM
Is MH for Matt Heldt or Markus Howard?
Hope he means Howard, 'cause Heldt doesn't look much like a BE caliber player at all right now.
Sure some glimmers of hope, but overall ick.
Shifting gears a bit, but Luke's shoulder is a big concern after he apparently aggravated it again tonight. With surgery behind him, the fact it still seems to be quite fragile is scary, particularly given our lack of depth inside. With time Heldt may very well be serviceable, but he does not appear ready to provide anything close to Luke's level of production in the event Luke goes down for a while.
Anyone have any information or insight on the extent of the shoulder problem? I had thought that was largely behind him at this point. It has to be very painful and frustrating for him to keep hurting it, especially since he is playing at a pretty high level right now.
Heldt: Nothing wrong with having 5 more fouls, good defense, an occasional bucket and good box-outs even if he doesn't get the board. IMHO right now he's a better defender than Fish
Howard: Still the "most lost" on the team, but better this time
Katin: not a bust yet, but has 1 more game to prove he's not
Du: Must be healthy now. Wow.
JJJ/Haney: The thing I want to see more of is these guys working together. They both seem to "get their own" (not selfishly, but because they can) but when they start creating for each other the magic really begins.
TC: The best PG on the team by far
Rowsey: Needs to be the super scoring super sub. Better when paired with Heldt.
Hauser: I like him better at this point this year than I liked Ellenson at this point last year. I don't think he's a one and done, but he has better defensive fundamentals and a better outside shot. Doesn't get to the hoop like Ellenson but doesn't need to.
Fisher: Stay healthy... and please learn how to play defense before mid-January!
Quote from: Ruby on November 26, 2016, 10:03:50 PM
Think we should give Katin more time to shake off the rust before writing him off.
If by rust you mean a shoot first mentality, then I agree. Wojo claims he is a very good passer; I'd like to see some examples.
Quote from: WarriorFan on November 27, 2016, 12:28:53 AM
...
JJJ/Haney: The thing I want to see more of is these guys working together. They both seem to "get their own" (not selfishly, but because they can) but when they start creating for each other the magic really begins.
...
Completely agree with this. Too often, it's clear as soon as one gets the ball, he's going it alone. I wish they would look for each other more.
It's a W. I like W's but hopefully the D can step it up before the next few games.
Quote from: WarriorFan on November 27, 2016, 12:28:53 AM
Katin: not a bust yet, but has 1 more game to prove he's not
Does this statement remind anyone of similar statements made about Trent Lockett about 6 games into his season With MU?
Quote from: Jesse Livermore on November 27, 2016, 08:31:02 AM
Does this statement remind anyone of similar statements made about Trent Lockett about 6 games into his season With MU?
Lockett performed within his role all year. We just had expectations that he was going to be something different and once we adjusted our expectations, you could see what value he brought.
Unless Katin's role was to come to Marquette and shoot poorly, he isn't doing what Trent did.
Quote from: Jesse Livermore on November 27, 2016, 08:31:02 AM
Does this statement remind anyone of similar statements made about Trent Lockett about 6 games into his season With MU?
Lockett played D. Lockett passed well. Lockett "fit". Lockett was not a gunner. This, I'm afraid, is not a Lockett situation.
I really didn't think Reinhardt took a bad shot all night. At least 5 of his 6 threes were wide open, in rhythm shots within the offense. He just couldn't get one to fall. He's got the yips or something. Hope he breaks out of it soon. He is playing defense well and goes hard after boards though he's not getting many of them.
Luke was pretty dominant tonight against a very big boy. I was at the game and I don't think the injury was actually anything. I think he tweaked it and panicked a bit. He was telling Wojo that he was fine and could shoot the free throws. But I think Wojo wanted to be careful with him given that we were up big on a cupcake. I have dislocated one of my shoulders a few times and get those stingers every once in a while. Its scary but they are usually nothing.
Not sure why Rowsey didn't play until way late in the first half. But he immediately threw up a bad three and then turned it over and was sat. I agree with others that he may need to settle into the role of super scorer off the bench.
Duane only made one bukcet but it was a doozy. His passing has gotten so much better. He makes the extra pass and is so unselfish. Thought the threes he took were good looks that just didn't go. His on ball defense is still suspect. Saw his man blow by him more than once.
Hauser's rebounding is an unexpected pleasant surprise. He's got Henry's ability to always be in the right place so he gets the "easy" rebounds.
Johnson/Cheatham munched some cupcakes. That's about all that can be said.
Heldt is okay an defense. He might even be better than Luke. If he can learn how to set a pick and seal a lane without fouling, then we have ourselves another Otule. That worked for us for a few years.
I still think Carter is the best PG on the roster. 9 points, 6 assists, and 0 turnovers is a line I would take from a starting PG every day of the week and five times on Sunday. Howard WILL be the best PG on the roster sometime before Carter graduates. His scoring ability from the PG position is something we haven't had in a long time. He needs to let the game slow down. Led the the team with 3 turnovers and all of them were easily avoidable.
Only 11 team turnovers. Not the goal of 10 or less but last year we were giving up like 15 a game to cupcakes it seemed.
Our 2P defense was smothering last night. Probably more an indicator of the opponent than our defense. They hit a lot of threes but my recollection was that most of them were well defended, they just hit tough shots.
It always comes down to defense. We need to rotate better on ball screens and deny the passing lanes without being susceptible to back door passes. You really have to want to play D.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on November 26, 2016, 09:12:32 PM
These games VS. +300 teams do nothing to get ready for Wisconsin or Georgia.
I wouldn't say they do nothing. You can tell that Wojo is having the players work on things. The pick and roll defense was better last night except when Luke bumped the ball handler way beyond the three point line for his first foul. A Big East team will have him fouled out in 5 minutes if he keeps pulling that crap.
I will also say that it feels nice to dominate cupcakes again. Maybe I'm misremebering but I feel like it took as longer last year get in control of these games and we looked more sloppy doing it.
Quote from: WarriorFan on November 27, 2016, 08:41:32 AM
Lockett played D. Lockett passed well. Lockett "fit". Lockett was not a gunner. This, I'm afraid, is not a Lockett situation.
six games into Lockett season everyone thought he sucked (because he did not do any of the things noted above in the first six games). He turned out to be pretty good (above is an accurate impression of him after 30 games)
six games into Carlino's season most thought he was a bust. He might have been our best player that season
six games into Katin's season many are getting antsy that he is not any good. Give it to the end of January, Transfers need 10 to 15 games to figure it it.
Quote from: Jay Bee on November 26, 2016, 10:22:45 PM
So you're agreeing with me. Thanks.
A tenth of a percentage point was worth a "no he didn't"? Pedantry at its worst.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on November 27, 2016, 09:18:57 AM
I wouldn't say they do nothing. You can tell that Wojo is having the players work on things. The pick and roll defense was better last night except when Luke bumped the ball handler way beyond the three point line for his first foul. A Big East team will have him fouled out in 5 minutes if he keeps pulling that crap.
I will also say that it feels nice to dominate cupcakes again. Maybe I'm misremebering but I feel like it took as longer last year get in control of these games and we looked more sloppy doing it.
As far as cupcakes go HBU was not bad , they had a few decent players. They exposed things we need to work on such as defense. Also it is good for guys to have some positive offensive moments to build off of. For example Duane built on his prior good performance and he has that spark and lift again.
Quote from: Jesse Livermore on November 27, 2016, 09:50:24 AM
six games into Lockett season everyone thought he sucked (because he did not do any of the things noted above in the first six games). He turned out to be pretty good (above is an accurate impression of him after 30 games)
That is simply not true. After six games he was shooting over 40% with 41 total attempts in about the same number of minutes that Katin has now. Katin OTOH has taken 58 shots and only making 25% of them.
Quote from: Jesse Livermore on November 27, 2016, 09:50:24 AM
six games into Carlino's season most thought he was a bust. He might have been our best player that season
He scored 38 points v. Georgia Tech in his fifth game so this is inaccurate as well.
Quote from: Jesse Livermore on November 27, 2016, 09:50:24 AM
six games into Katin's season many are getting antsy that he is not any good. Give it to the end of January, Transfers need 10 to 15 games to figure it it.
I would guess this is pretty much an unsubstantiated argument.
Now I am not calling him a bust because he may indeed turn it around. But he is nowhere near like either Lockett or Carlino were. Not even close. This is just a bad theory.
All true Sultan but the only thing that I noted last night was that Katin's shot didn't fall. I didn't think he took bad ones and I didn't think he tried to play hero ball. So I was okay with it.
Quote from: jsglow on November 27, 2016, 11:10:19 AM
All true Sultan but the only thing that I noted last night was that Katin's shot didn't fall. I didn't think he took bad ones and I didn't think he tried to play hero ball. So I was okay with it.
Yeah I agree with this. He didn't take a shot outside the flow of the offense. I think he is going to be fine. Or at least I hope he will.
Quote from: Dr. Vinnie Boombatz on November 27, 2016, 11:11:56 AM
Yeah I agree with this. He didn't take a shot outside the flow of the offense. I think he is going to be fine. Or at least I hope he will.
How 'bout that sequence when he missed a good look, we got the rebound and fed him again for another miss? Just not his night. But do note that Hauser now gets more minutes.
Quote from: Jesse Livermore on November 27, 2016, 09:50:24 AM
six games into Lockett season everyone thought he sucked (because he did not do any of the things noted above in the first six games). He turned out to be pretty good (above is an accurate impression of him after 30 games)
six games into Carlino's season most thought he was a bust. He might have been our best player that season
six games into Katin's season many are getting antsy that he is not any good. Give it to the end of January, Transfers need 10 to 15 games to figure it it.
Six Games InLockett9.0 PPG
4.5 RPG
1.5 APG
43.9 eFG%
41 shot attempts
Carlino14.3 PPG
3.3 RPG
2.8 APG
49.2 eFG%
62 shot attempts
Reinhardt8.8 PPG
3.0 RPG
1.3 APG
33.6 eFG%
58 shot attempts
I don't think you can really compare either of them with Carlino, who had only one real stinker (NJIT) in his first six, which also included his blistering 38 points against Georgia Tech. But the big difference for me is that Reinhardt's terrible eFG% is made worse by his high quantity of shot attempts.
He did miss a number of open looks last night, but at this point he just doesn't seem to have it. Not sure why or what's wrong. Maybe it's his form, maybe his confidence, maybe he's just not acclimated to the system, but thus far, I'd say of our three grad transfers in the past 5 years, he is definitely the most disappointing through 6 games.
Quote from: MU82 on November 26, 2016, 10:06:45 PM
This. Apparently, many Scoopers learned nothing from the Lockett experience.
Lockett's issues were TOs and getting his shot to drop early. But he played solid defense and rebounded and his TO's dropped late December and his shot started to fall. Katin has not shown much in any area other than FT shooting so far. Needs to get going soon for next week's trio of gaames (GA/FSU/WI) and the BE season.
Quote from: Ellenson Family Reunion on November 27, 2016, 10:31:07 AM
A tenth of a percentage point was worth a "no he didn't"? Pedantry at its worst.
Huh. I thought I must be misunderstanding the argument.
Lockett's year certainly wasn't the gold standard. Not good shooting, lots of turnovers.
The turnovers were expected based on past performance... but, the shooting? Yikes. 54.7% and 53.4% eFG% in the two years prior to arrival in Milwaukee.. then he drops to sub-45% with us.
2FG% was 43.6% at MU... 53.2% in his three years at ASU.
Must be MU
Trent Lockett would do wonders for this team.
I've really liked how Duane has been playing the last 2 games
Quote from: Dr. Vinnie Boombatz on November 27, 2016, 11:04:57 AM
That is simply not true. After six games he was shooting over 40% with 41 total attempts in about the same number of minutes that Katin has now. Katin OTOH has taken 58 shots and only making 25% of them.
I try not to get in Smuggles McHeisy's head, because that is a dark and scary place, but I don't think he is comparing Lockett as a player to Katin as a player. Nor do I think he is comparing their statistics.
What he is comparing is ScoopLand's knee-jerk reaction to Lockett to its current reaction to Katin.
Lockett was quite vilified here on Scoop all the way into the start of the Big East season. By extension, Buzz was vilified because folks couldn't understand why he was giving Lockett so darn many minutes. It was only after much of the season that most Scoopers began to appreciate what Lockett brought to that team.
I have no idea if Katin will be accepted similarly here. I have no idea if he'll start to play the kind of game that will get him accepted. But I do agree with Smuggles that 6 games seems awfully quick to declare that Katin is a failure - just as 6 games (and even 2x that many) was too quick to say the same about Lockett.
I agree with glow and TAMU that Katin didn't do anything wrong last night except miss some open shots. He didn't force shots. He didn't take wild shots. He just missed some wide-open 3s. If this persists, he'll have to stop shooting them, but he did make a respectable 36% of them last season. His eFG% last year was .477 (it's .336 this year).
These things do tend to even out over time. I mean, I was pretty sure Sam wasn't going to keep hitting 70% of his 3s as he did early on.
I actually have seen a decent amount of hustle from Katin, some nice rebounds, etc. He seems to fit in personality-wise. I'm certainly willing to give him more time - not that it really matters what I think, you think or anybody else here thinks.
Go Marquette!
Quote from: MU82 on November 27, 2016, 02:13:34 PM
I try not to get in Smuggles McHeisy's head, because that is a dark and scary place, but I don't think he is comparing Lockett as a player to Katin as a player. Nor do I think he is comparing their statistics.
What he is comparing is ScoopLand's knee-jerk reaction to Lockett to its current reaction to Katin.
Lockett was quite vilified here on Scoop all the way into the start of the Big East season. By extension, Buzz was vilified because folks couldn't understand why he was giving Lockett so darn many minutes. It was only after much of the season that most Scoopers began to appreciate what Lockett brought to that team.
I have no idea if Katin will be accepted similarly here. I have no idea if he'll start to play the kind of game that will get him accepted. But I do agree with Smuggles that 6 games seems awfully quick to declare that Katin is a failure - just as 6 games (and even 2x that many) was too quick to say the same about Lockett.
I agree with glow and TAMU that Katin didn't do anything wrong last night except miss some open shots. He didn't force shots. He didn't take wild shots. He just missed some wide-open 3s. If this persists, he'll have to stop shooting them, but he did make a respectable 36% of them last season. His eFG% last year was .477 (it's .336 this year).
These things do tend to even out over time. I mean, I was pretty sure Sam wasn't going to keep hitting 70% of his 3s as he did early on.
I actually have seen a decent amount of hustle from Katin, some nice rebounds, etc. He seems to fit in personality-wise. I'm certainly willing to give him more time - not that it really matters what I think, you think or anybody else here thinks.
Go Marquette!
My statements were accurate because of what 82 noted,
this board was all over Lockett and Carlino early on because
this board thought they were both bad. What Brew and Vinny stats argue is how off-based
this reactionary place can be ... and how all the caterwauling about Katin will again look silly in about 2 months.
82 has shown again he really understands me ... I will PM him about my parents affect on me :)
Quote from: Jesse Livermore on November 27, 2016, 02:25:14 PM
My statements were accurate because of what 82 noted, this board was all over Lockett and Carlino early on because this board thought they were both bad. What Brew and Vinny stats argue is how off-based this reactionary place can be ... and how all the caterwauling about Katin will again look silly in about 2 months.
82 has shown again he really understands me ... I will PM him about my parents affect on me :)
Oh my ... maybe we even complete each other, Smuggles!
Quote from: GoldenEagles32 on November 27, 2016, 01:16:14 PM
I've really liked how Duane has been playing the last 2 games
For sure. Most encouraging things were the dunk and the chase-down block on top of the heady, controlled play. That to me says the athleticism we were expecting from him is back, on top of the fact that things have finally clicked after 2 full years of PT (as it does for most players). Really think he will be a crucial player for us this year, and he will likely see his minutes increase as the non-con progresses.
Quote from: StillWarriors on November 27, 2016, 12:11:19 AM
Shifting gears a bit, but Luke's shoulder is a big concern after he apparently aggravated it again tonight. With surgery behind him, the fact it still seems to be quite fragile is scary, particularly given our lack of depth inside. With time Heldt may very well be serviceable, but he does not appear ready to provide anything close to Luke's level of production in the event Luke goes down for a while.
Anyone have any information or insight on the extent of the shoulder problem? I had thought that was largely behind him at this point. It has to be very painful and frustrating for him to keep hurting it, especially since he is playing at a pretty high level right now.
It seems as though his shoulder slips halfway out, and then back in. More of a sublexation. Which is obviously painful. I think its something surgery should have corrected, but must not have. We're in trouble if he actually dislocates it.