The FBS Sun Belt announced that Idaho and New Mexico State will not longer be "football only" members after 2017. They were members of Sun Belt (FCS) and WAC (no football) respectively for the rest of their sports.
So with these moves, and with UMass's ejection from the MAC as a football only member, that means that there is only one remaining "football only" arrangement in FBS. Hawaii is a member of the Mountain West for football, but the Big West for the rest of its sports programs.
Relevant.
I should have put it in the Superbar, but it is relevant as long as people think UConn and their ilk can join the BE and play football elsewhere.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on March 01, 2016, 02:37:48 PM
I should have put it in the Superbar, but it is relevant as long as people think UConn and their ilk can join the BE and play football elsewhere.
UConn, Hawaii, BYU, Memphis...Looks like a good start for a new football-only conference. Who am I missing?
I've reading some rumors about UConn & Cincinnati to the Big 12 when Texas's Longhorn Network is rebranded as the Big XII Network.
I think it's relevant because it starts to bring conference realignment to a close which is important to the Big East and cements the conference format as "survivable".
I'm not sure the Big 12 expands though....they got their championship game without having to dilute their revenue amongst an additional two teams.
Side note: I think it's hilarious how hard and far Texas has fallen as a valued brand since the Longhorn Network launched in both football and basketball.
Quote from: MerrittsMustache on March 01, 2016, 02:40:09 PMUConn, Hawaii, BYU, Memphis...Looks like a good start for a new football-only conference. Who am I missing?
That's hilarious. Imagine a 14-hour connecting flight (one way) for every Huskies-Warriors matchup. I believe Army is a football independent, as well.
Quote from: mu03eng on March 01, 2016, 03:12:28 PM
I think it's relevant because it starts to bring conference realignment to a close which is important to the Big East and cements the conference format as "survivable".
I'm not sure the Big 12 expands though....they got their championship game without having to dilute their revenue amongst an additional two teams.
Side note: I think it's hilarious how hard and far Texas has fallen as a valued brand since the Longhorn Network launched in both football and basketball.
From what else I read is if they don't start a conference network then Oklahoma is gone. The TV partners want "national" which the Big XII is not now and UConn is an easy get into the NYC market.
Also, reading rumors Big10 will make another push for ACC teams because there is speculation over a GORs out clause with the ACC Network being dead over the Commish ceding rights to Raycom Sports (which is run by his son?).
Chad Forde: College basketball is headed for a disaster of Biblical proportions.
Mark Emmert: What do you mean, "Biblical?"
Jay Bilas: What he means is Old Testament, Mr. President, real wrath of God type stuff.
Chad Forde: Exactly.
Jim Nantz: Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling!
Bill Raftery: Forty years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes...
Verne Lundquist: The dead rising from the grave!
Chad Forde: Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together...mass hysteria!
Mark Emmert: All right, all right! I get the point!
Conference realignment is never over. Fortunately, were pretty well insulated at the moment. Unless the acc decides to add basketball only members. Don't think they will but we can kiss Georgetown goodbye if they do.
I still think there will be another major conference shift in the next 15 years. On par with the shifts we saw a few years ago. Gotta be ready to be a taker and not a giver if that comes to pass.
Alot will happen if the Big 12 expansion happens.
this may sound kinda "grassy knoll", but does anyone see football at the high school and college level being
"concusioned" out of existence over say, the next 10-15 years? no? ok, just thought i'd throw that out there.
don't get me wrong, i love football, but will high school be able to afford it in the near future if/when the lawsuits
start flying and mommy and daddy are blaming juniors blabbering on getting hit in the melon one too many
times. ya never know as they all seem to be trying to grab that cash with both hands right now and quickly
how 'bout dem packas-ayn'a
Quote from: rocket surgeon on March 01, 2016, 07:28:27 PM
this may sound kinda "grassy knoll", but does anyone see football at the high school and college level being
"concusioned" out of existence over say, the next 10-15 years? no? ok, just thought i'd throw that out there.
don't get me wrong, i love football, but will high school be able to afford it in the near future if/when the lawsuits
start flying and mommy and daddy are blaming juniors blabbering on getting hit in the melon one too many
times. ya never know as they all seem to be trying to grab that cash with both hands right now and quickly
how 'bout dem packas-ayn'a
I don't know how much football will change but the concussion epidemic will definitely change it somehow
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on March 01, 2016, 02:05:10 PM
So with these moves, and with UMass's ejection from the MAC as a football only member, that means that there is only one remaining "football only" arrangement in FBS. Hawaii is a member of the Mountain West for football, but the Big West for the rest of its sports programs.
Huh, when did Navy leave the AAC?
Quote from: rocket surgeon on March 01, 2016, 07:28:27 PM
this may sound kinda "grassy knoll", but does anyone see football at the high school and college level being
"concusioned" out of existence over say, the next 10-15 years? no? ok, just thought i'd throw that out there.
don't get me wrong, i love football, but will high school be able to afford it in the near future if/when the lawsuits
start flying and mommy and daddy are blaming juniors blabbering on getting hit in the melon one too many
times. ya never know as they all seem to be trying to grab that cash with both hands right now and quickly
how 'bout dem packas-ayn'a
Too many people love football in the lower demographics and are willing to have their kids take the risks.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 01, 2016, 05:34:15 PM
Conference realignment is never over. Fortunately, were pretty well insulated at the moment. Unless the acc decides to add basketball only members. Don't think they will but we can kiss Georgetown goodbye if they do.
I still think there will be another major conference shift in the next 15 years. On par with the shifts we saw a few years ago. Gotta be ready to be a taker and not a giver if that comes to pass.
I agree we are pretty well insulated. In addition the Presidents of the Big East schools are keen on making the conference a defined academic brand so they can keep justifying their ridiculously high tutions.So I see the Big East as the most stable conference.
I would love to see the freak out at UConn if they get left behind in realignment for a third time (2003-2004 and 2012-2013). Being in a conference with Tulane, East Carolina, UCF, SMU, Houston and Tulsa is a huge disadvantage for them in football and basketball, not to mention their student-athletes and fans. Their membership in that league is just not sustainable.
Quote from: GoldenWarrior11 on March 01, 2016, 08:58:34 PM
I would love to see the freak out at UConn if they get left behind in realignment for a third time (2003-2004 and 2012-2013). Being in a conference with Tulane, East Carolina, UCF, SMU, Houston and Tulsa is a huge disadvantage for them in football and basketball, not to mention their student-athletes and fans. Their membership in that league is just not sustrightble.
We complain about how our conference schedule has lost a lot of marquis games. I can't imagine what UConn fans say about theirs.
UConn has absolutely nothing in common with any of the other AAC schools. Nothing athletically, academically, geographically or institutionally. It'd be hilarious if it wasn't so sad that UConn literally sold its soul in hopes of advancing football.
Oh well. I'm more than happy with our current collection of Big East schools.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 01, 2016, 07:42:46 PM
I don't know how much football will change but the concussion epidemic will definitely change it somehow
I was talking with the Chair of the UW Mechanical Engineering Department last week and he mentioned the work his side company has done on a new football helmet. According to Dr. Per Reinhall his company is bringing radical new engineered solutions to fight sports-related TBI.
Per took last semester off after his company won an award from GE and Under Armour for their shock absorption technology.
Never underestimate the ingenuity of engineers!
http://depts.washington.edu/uwc4c/news-events/combatting-concussion-new-football-helmet-innovation-from-university-of-washington-startup-wins-head-health-challenge-ii/
UConn's Future Conference Membership A Key Topic During Intro For New AD David Benedict
Published March 2, 2016 Font Size Resize Small Resize Normal Resize Large | Print | Share |
Benedict said he believes the American has put together a strong conference
Many questions asked of new UConn AD David Benedict yesterday at his introductory press conference "focused on the task of getting" the school into a Power Five conference, but Benedict "walked the line between putting UConn in position to be a part of the next stage of conference realignment and not disrespecting the American Athletic Conference," according to Jim Fuller of the NEW HAVEN REGISTER. Benedict said, "I think it is important for us to be good partners with our current conference. I think the American has done a great job putting together a very strong conference in a very short period of time and we are going to be great members to that conference. At the same time, we are going to make sure we position ourselves so we can remain competitive nationally in all of our sports." He added, "This is a Power 5 or if you want to refer to it as an Autonomy 5 program all day every day." UConn President Susan Herbst said of Benedict, "He knows amazing people. He knows people at that level, and it is very important to us" (NEW HAVEN REGISTER, 3/2).
EAGLE EYE: In Hartford, Paul Doyle notes Herbst when introducing Benedict "talked about his commanding presence and diverse background." Benedict is the 12th AD in UConn history and "is very much an outsider after spending his career everywhere but the Northeast." Herbst said, "I find that people who have been around the nation like that -- myself included -- you pick up best practices and you pick up different ideas." Doyle reports Benedict "agreed to a contract that runs through June 30, 2021," and he will "be paid a base salary of $450,000 with the ability to earn $100,000 in bonuses." There is a retention bonus of $50,000 per year if he "stays for five years." UConn "interviewed nine candidates, all within the past week." Benedict said, "Fundraising will be critical to us. That is the only revenue opportunity for us that is totally uncapped" (HARTFORD COURANT, 3/2).
TO-DO LIST: In Hartford, Jeff Jacobs writes his first impression of Benedict is that he "is bright." Jacobs: "He is disciplined. He is concise. And he is careful, really careful." Benedict has "seen all sides of the crazy collegiate landscape at a handful of different schools." He has "touched little money" and he has "touched big money, overseeing the daily operation" of a $120M-a-year program at Auburn and negotiating a nine-year, $81M deal with Under Armour (the biggest such deal in the SEC). Jacobs: "What Benedict must do is best position the athletic department financially. What Benedict must do is keep the athletic department on the solid course it is on academically. What Benedict must do is best position the school for new or restructured venues. What Benedict must do is help make football into FOOTBALL." That "means more fans at games," as well as "assuring a continued rise in fortunes that started last season." What Benedict must do is "continue the school's current campaign of selling its presence in the New York area in case the Big 12 decides that the biggest market is a determining factor in its expansion" (HARTFORD COURANT, 3/2).
STAYING A WHILE? In Connecticut, John Nash noted a promise Benedict made to his 13-year-old sons "was one of the moments that really jumped out from his introductory press conference." Benedict said, "I promised them we're not going anywhere for a really long time." Benedict's history at several different schools "could spell out some sort of trouble, but it could also spell out a top-notch, highly valued up-and-comer, climbing the career ladder because of his talents and success" (THEHOUR.com, 3/1). Also in Connecticut, Gavin Keefe writes under the header, "Benedict Brings Passion, Experience To UConn Job."
I also heard in announcing the new AD, UConn took out an advertisement in the Dallas Morning News as well as 9 billboards in Texas (maybe the Dallas area).
Quote from: Marquette Fan In NY on March 01, 2016, 08:38:14 PM
Too many people love football in the lower demographics and are willing to have their kids take the risks.
Well, someone just got an invitation to the next Beer Summit at Chico's White Lives Matter Ranch in Idaho.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 01, 2016, 05:34:15 PM
Conference realignment is never over.
This is truth.
Apologies for the long post, but when conference realignment is read comprehensively, narratives begin to emerge. Arguably, the roots of the reformed Big East can be traced all the way back to the formation of the Big East Conference in 1979.
1979: Big East forms with BC, UConn, GTown, PC, St. John's, Seton Hall, and Cuse. Villanova joins the following year, and Pitt joins in 1982.
1982: There were seven power conferences. The Big Ten had 10 members; so did the SEC, and what is now the Pac-12. The ACC only had 8. The Big Eight had 8 members, and the Southwest Conference had 9. That year, Penn State applied for Big East membership. However, their membership was rejected due to fear of watering down the basketball brand.
1989: Seven years Later, the Big East changed position, and sought to become a major football conference, but only 3 schools played Division I football. Temple, Rutgers, West Virginia and Virginia Tech were added as football-only members, and Miami joined in all sports. The 4 football-only members parked their other sports in the Atlantic 10 Conference. The Big East had its first major demarcation between football schools and basketball schools. The league had 8 members for football, and 10 for basketball.
1990: Three huge developments. First, Notre Dame signs its TV contract with NBC. Second, the SEC expands, taking Arkansas from the Southwest Conference, and South Carolina from the Metro Conference. This allows the SEC to take advantage of an NCAA rule allowing conferences with 12 or more members to split into two divisions, and hold a football championship game. Such a game would prove to be extremely lucrative and the model for other conferences. The Southwest Conference was reduced to 8 teams in Texas, limiting the league's exposure. Finally, 8 years after being rejected by the Big East, Penn State agreed to join the Big Ten Conference, becoming that league's first new member since Michigan State was added in 1950. They began competition in 1993.
1991: Florida State follows South Carolina's lead, and leaves the Metro Conference for the ACC.
1994: Texas, Texas Tech, Texas A&M, and Baylor announced they were leaving the Southwest Conference to join eight Big Eight schools to form the new Big 12 Conference. No doubt inspired by the SEC's already-lucrative championship game, the Big 12 could now hold a similar game. Only Houston, SMU, Rice, and TCU remained, and the Southwest Conference would dissolve following the 1995-96 school year.
1995: The remainder of the Metro Conference and Great Midwest Conference merged to form "Conference USA," a league of mid-sized athletic programs. Saint Louis, UAB, Memphis, DePaul, Marquette, and Cincinnati joined from the Great Midwest. Tulane, Southern Miss, South Florida, Louisville, and UNC-Charlotte joined from the Metro Conference. VCU, Dayton, and Virginia Tech were left out of the merger. Houston was invited to join Conference USA, but was committed to playing in the final season of the Southwest Conference in 1995. Conference USA began competing in all sports except football.
In the Big East, Rutgers and West Virginia, previously football-only members, joined for all sports. Notre Dame joined the Big East for all sports but football. The Big East football membership held steady at 8, but basketball was now 13.
With the Big East football-only members upgrading to full membership, the A-10 had to replenish its ranks. The A-10 took in Dayton and Virginia Tech, who failed to make it through the Conference USA merger, as well as Xavier, Fordham, and LaSalle, bringing A-10 membership to 12 until Virginia Tech became a full member of the Big East in 2000. VT were replaced by Richmond in 2001 to keep the A-10 level at 12.
1996: Houston joins Conference USA, bringing that conference's membership to 6 for football, and 12 for all sports. The Big 12 hosts its first football championship game.
1997-98: East Carolina and Army join Conference USA as football-only members, bringing football membership to 8. Basketball membership holds steady at 11.
1999: The WAC, which had grown from a modest-sized conference to a ballooning 16-member league stretching from Louisiana to Hawaii after taken in refugees from the Southwest Conference, became simply too unwieldy. 8 members broke off to form the Mountain West Conference. Following the move, the NCAA Tournament, now faced with an extra automatic bid for a new conference, but wanting to keep the number of at-large bids the same, expanded the NCAA Tournament from 64 to 65 teams, adding a "play-in game."
2001: In an effort to bolster its football ranks, TCU joins Conference USA from the WAC. East Carolina upgrades to full Conference USA membership, bringing football to 9 schools, and a 13-team basketball competition.
2003: South Florida's football program completes its transition to Division I-A. They join Conference USA to bring football membership to 10. However, a critical domino falls. The ACC, seeking to emulate the SEC and Big 12, grabs Boston College, Virginia Tech, and Miami from the Big East.
The Big East compensates by adding Louisville, Cincinnati, South Florida, DePaul, and Marquette from Conference USA. UConn's football team completed its ascension to Division I-A. The Big East now had 8 football teams and 16 basketball teams.
The only two remaining non-football schools in Conference USA (Saint Louis and Charlotte) join the A-10, bringing that conference to 14 teams. Army abandoned Conference USA to become a football independent. TCU completed the C-USA defections by joining the Mountain West, bringing the MWC to 9 teams.
To stay alive, Conference USA raided various smaller conferences, adding Marshall from the Mid-American Conference, Central Florida from the Sun Belt, and Rice, Tulsa, UTEP, and Southern Methodist from the WAC. Conference USA now had 12 teams, and could stage a conference championship game in football.
The chain reaction continued. The WAC, now down to 5 members from 16 only 6 years prior (Hawaii, Nevada, Boise State, Fresno State, and Louisiana Tech), added Utah State and New Mexico State from the Sun Belt Conference. Idaho joined from FCS, bringing WAC membership back to 8.
2010: The Big Ten, seeking to add a lucrative conference championship game and expand its Big Ten Network, adds Nebraska to get to 12 members.
The Pac-10 would be the last major conference to add a championship game, but aimed to be the first 16-team superconference. Rumors swirled that the Pac-10 would try to get Texas, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, and either Texas A&M or Texas Tech. As a bridge to this move, the Pac-10 added Colorado from the Big 12. However, Texas ultimately decided to stay put in the Big 12, on the condition of keeping extra revenue derived from their Longhorn Network television channel. The Pac-12 settled for Utah.
Texas' non-move embittered Texas A&M. Not wanting to play second-fiddle to Texas, A&M opted to join the Southeastern Conference, becoming their 13th team. To balance out the SEC's divisions, Missouri was added from the Big 12, bringing that conference down to 8 teams, while the SEC grew to 14. The Big 12 was down to 8 teams.
The Big East, in a desperate gambit to appease its football membership, added TCU from the Mountain West Conference, bringing its football membership to 9, and all-sports membership to 17. However, West Virginia decided the Big 12 offered greener pastures, and made way for the plains, pulling the bottom jenga piece on the Big East's eventual demise. The Big East was back where it started, with 16 all-sports schools, and 8 football schools. The Mountain West was also back where it started, with 8 schools.
With West Virginia gone, and the football legitimacy of the Big East threatened, Pittsburgh and Syracuse moved to the ACC, bringing the ACC to 14 teams. As a result of this move, TCU no longer felt like the Big East was a stable home for the program, and TCU applied for and was granted admission to the Big 12 Conference. ACC membership stood at 14, The Big 12 was back from the brink with 10, and the Big East's membership stood at 13 for all sports, and 5 for football.
2011: Fearing a Big East power grab, the A-10 added Butler from the Horizon League, and VCU from the Colonial, temporarily bringing its membership to 15. BYU left the Mountain West, seeking to become a "Western Notre Dame" football independent. The MWC was down to 7 teams.
2012: In a desperate attempt to stabilize the football conference, the Big East expanded nationwide, promising to become a football conference capable of hosting a championship game by 2015. The league added SMU, Houston, and UCF as members in all sports, and Boise State and San Diego State in football only. The moves brought Big East football membership to 10, and all-sports membership to 16. Conference USA's membership was reduced to 9. The Mountain West dropped to 5, as Boise State and San Diego State moved to place their other sports in smaller conferences.
In response, the Mountain West raided the WAC for new members. Fresno State, San Jose State, Nevada, and Utah State were added as all-sports members, and Hawaii joined in football only. WAC membership was decimated, and the Mountain West grew to 10 teams, almost reaching the size of the old unwieldy WAC. The current iteration of the WAC was on life support, with only UTSA, Texas State, Idaho, and New Mexico State remaining.
The Big East offered full membership to Memphis and Temple, and to Navy for football only. With the loss of Temple, the Atlantic 10 would be back to 14. Conference USA was down to 8. The Big East football membership grew to 13, with an all-sports membership of 18. Among all-sports members, the basketball schools were outnumbered for the first time at 10-8.
Conference USA followed the Big East raid by raiding smaller conferences for 8 schools, doubling their membership to 16 as Charlotte and Old Dominion kickstarted FBS football programs, joining C-USA from the Atlantic 10 and Colonial Athletic Association respectively. The A-10 membership was reduced to 13. Conference USA also raided the WAC for UTSA and Louisiana Tech, reducing that league's membership to 2, leading to an announcement that the WAC would no longer sponsor college football. Conference USA also added Middle Tennessee State, Florida International, Florida Atlantic and North Texas from the Sun Belt Conference.
Notre Dame had enough of the Big East's new inferior membership, and moved to the ACC, gaining access to the ACC's bowl-tie-ins, and promising to play 5 games against ACC opposition a year. Notably, regular ND opponents BC, Pitt, Miami, Florida State, Georgia Tech, and Wake Forest were already in the ACC. The Big East's all-sports membership dropped to 17. The football membership remained unchanged at 13.
Concerned about Penn State's newfound isolation in ACC country, the Big Ten moved to add Maryland and the next day, added Rutgers. Big Ten membership stood at 14, The ACC dropped to 13, and Big East football membership dropped to 12, with the all-sports membership at 16.
The ACC adds Louisville to replace Maryland, spurning overtures from Connecticut and Cincinnati. The ACC was back to 14, and the Big East was down to 11 football schools, and 15 all-sports schools.
The Big East meekly responded; adding Tulane for all sports and East Carolina for football only. The football membership was up to 13, and the all-sports membership was up to 16.
Of the 16 all-sports Big East schools, 7 were basketball-first members who did not sponsor FBS football, and had been on the sidelines during this entire process. The football product was increasingly unstable, and the new additions were diluting the basketball product. Of the 9 remaining all-sports schools, 6 had not yet joined the conference and achieved full voting rights. Outgoing members Syracuse, Pittsburgh, Louisville, Rutgers, and Notre Dame no longer had voting rights, and new members Temple, Memphis, SMU, Houston, UCF, and Tulane did not have voting rights either. The basketball schools, for the first time in realignment, had a voting super-majority of 7-3, and could vote to dissolve the league. This window would close in July 2013 as Temple achieved full voting rights, and Memphis, UCF, Houston, and SMU joined the Big East. The basketball schools knew the time was now or never, and planned to leave the Big East. Xavier, Butler, and Creighton join the "Catholic 7" and the reformed Big East begins play in 2013-14.
+1
Good summary, but ND did not join the ACC until the Catholic 7 left the Big East. Xavier and Butler were on the fringes waiting to join, but there was no formal announcement of membership beyond the C-7. ND wanted to keep its football independence, and according to Mike Brey, seriously considered joining with the C-7. I believe that is why the conference was originally the C-7 with Butler and Xavier presumably ready to join, and no decision on who might be added or how big the conference would be. Certainly there was going to be a need to add one team, and that of course turned out to be Creighton.
Quote from: Goatherder on March 03, 2016, 01:51:55 PM
Good summary, but ND did not join the ACC until the Catholic 7 left the Big East. Xavier and Butler were on the fringes waiting to join, but there was no formal announcement of membership beyond the C-7. ND wanted to keep its football independence, and according to Mike Brey, seriously considered joining with the C-7. I believe that is why the conference was originally the C-7 with Butler and Xavier presumably ready to join, and no decision on who might be added or how big the conference would be. Certainly there was going to be a need to add one team, and that of course turned out to be Creighton.
Notre Dame announced they were joining the ACC in September 2012
http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/8369070/notre-dame-sports-football-hockey-acc
The Catholic 7 announced they were leaving in December 2012.
http://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2012-12-15/seven-basketball-only-schools-leaving-big-east-start-new-conf
Now since these conversations were happening long before December, I am positive that ND knew what was going on and looked at the C7 as a potential option. It probably caused them to look around to see what the best landing space might be.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on March 03, 2016, 01:55:56 PM
Notre Dame announced they were joining the ACC in September 2012
http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/8369070/notre-dame-sports-football-hockey-acc
The Catholic 7 announced they were leaving in December 2012.
http://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball-men/article/2012-12-15/seven-basketball-only-schools-leaving-big-east-start-new-conf
Now since these conversations were happening long before December, I am positive that ND knew what was going on and looked at the C7 as a potential option. It probably caused them to look around to see what the best landing space might be.
Ding, ding. Winner, winner chicken dinner.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on March 03, 2016, 01:55:56 PM
Now since these conversations were happening long before December, I am positive that ND knew what was going on and looked at the C7 as a potential option. It probably caused them to look around to see what the best landing space might be.
Wasn't there also some talk after the fact about ND actually considering backing out of the ACC deal to join us?
Quote from: MUMountin on March 03, 2016, 03:10:17 PM
Wasn't there also some talk after the fact about ND actually considering backing out of the ACC deal to join us?
I think the talk was to have them park in the Big East in the 1 year or so gap before joining the ACC. So leaving the AAC earlier than original contracts may have stipulated.
No disrespect to Creighton at all, but I sure would have liked ND to be in this conference!
Quote from: MUMountin on March 03, 2016, 03:10:17 PM
Wasn't there also some talk after the fact about ND actually considering backing out of the ACC deal to join us?
I don't think that was ever serious.
Quote from: TSmith34 on March 02, 2016, 12:27:42 PM
Well, someone just got an invitation to the next Beer Summit at Chico's White Lives Matter Ranch in Idaho.
All lives matter
Like that of the Combres, good friends
https://www.youtube.com/v/KsRUj6o5A84
Quote from: Marquette Fan In NY on March 01, 2016, 08:38:14 PM
Too many people love football in the lower demographics and are willing to have their kids take the risks.
Stop with the risks over inflated nonsense. Mayo Clinic did a study on this last year.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3538465/
http://portlandtribune.com/lor/49-opinion/242681-109622-high-school-footballs-benefits-outweigh-the-risks
They examined kids that played high school football in the 40's, 50's and found no differences to those that didn't play. If you were in the glee club, you had just as much chance as brain issues down the road. Those that are effected are those that take a pounding constantly, but having kids play ball through high school....not an issue. If you want to play in college and pros, sure there is a risk but there is a risk for many things in life. We wouldn't have a military if every cowered. We wouldn't have people operating heavy machinery, climbing utility poles, etc, etc.
Quote from: jsglow on March 03, 2016, 03:19:30 PM
I don't think that was ever serious.
There was an article about this on ESPN at the time. ND threw out the idea that they would be willing to consider (prefer?) playing the "new" Big East during their gap year. Apparently it was the Big East that turned them down.
Quote from: Eldon on March 03, 2016, 04:17:35 PM
There was an article about this on ESPN at the time. ND threw out the idea that they would be willing to consider (prefer?) playing the "new" Big East during their gap year. Apparently it was the Big East that turned them down.
I remember the gap years stuff but that's as far as that went IIRC.
Quote from: jsglow on March 03, 2016, 04:22:13 PM
I remember the gap years stuff but that's as far as that went IIRC.
So magnanimous of ND to offer, though. I am glad they told them to go pound sand.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2016, 04:00:16 PMThey examined kids that played high school football in the 40's, 50's
...and the 40s did
just happen, so that's relevant.
It doesn't really matter what is or isn't happening with regards to concussions and football. Only the
perception matters. I think you are going to see football slowly fade out (just like every other "most popular sport in America"). It'll take a long time—it's very popular—but it'll be interesting to see what happens to conference alignment as a consequence.
"Never stop recruiting" realignment style?
Quote from: warriorchick on March 03, 2016, 04:27:36 PM
So magnanimous of ND to offer, though. I am glad they told them to go pound sand.
Yep. It was the C7 who rejected that notion, so ND went back to the ACC for an earlier start date.
BTW, interesting stuff on twitter today about the Big Ten still looking at the ACC for expansion and that ESPN is trying to head that off at the pass.
Miami and Atlanta are the #8 and #9 metro markets in the country.
I doubt Miami (a private university) fits what the Big Ten is looking for. But Florida State might. It's a public school ranked in the top 50 by U.S. News & World Report, one that apparently aspires to become a top 25 public research university. Also ranked by Forbes as the #17 most valuable program in college football (tops in the ACC). The fact that it's located in Tallahassee almost 500 miles from Miami may not matter if the FSU alumni base is big enough.
Georgia Tech is also ranked in the top 50 public universities, with an engineering program some say is one of the 10 best in the world. Located right in downtown Atlanta.
I hope the realignment carousel keeps on spinning. Happy we got off the ride and can safely watch the spectacle from a distance.
I think what matters most for MU is we are part of a conference of like minded institutions that has a primary focus on basketball, has stability and also is an attractive platform for the rest of our athletic offerings.
Over time the NCAA units will pile up for everyone in the league which should allow all the teams in the league to continue to improve their programs.
When the TV contract comes up for renewal there will be multiple bidders and I am confident the Big East will do fine.
Marquette is in the best position it could possibly be by being in the Big East. We do not have a football program so we are not going to be in the Power 5 conferences. Our Big East conference is much stronger and has more upside than the A-10 or the American. One notable development is all of the Big East schools are doing very well in recruiting. The kids are excited about playing in our league and like the campus environment that our schools offer.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on March 03, 2016, 04:33:15 PM
Yep. It was the C7 who rejected that notion, so ND went back to the ACC for an earlier start date.
BTW, interesting stuff on twitter today about the Big Ten still looking at the ACC for expansion and that ESPN is trying to head that off at the pass.
I saw this Twitter exchange posted on another board.
MH ver3@MH ver3
Ok so now I can share my ACC info
MH ver3@MH ver3
ESPN not launching ACCN. Going to offer ACC an extra $30m per year on contract to give each school a $2m bump.
MH ver3@MH ver3
ESPN also going to make members of ACC sign a new GOR in order to get the $
MH ver3@MH ver3
Several ACC schools expected to not agree with this. ESPN trying to avert B10 gutting ACC.
MH ver3@MH ver3
This will be ESPNs last ditch effort to keep ACC intact.
MH ver3@MH ver3
FSU,UVA,UNC, Duke, Clemson, and GT are all going to be opposed of GOR
MH ver3@MH ver3
ACC will not get their extra $$ if GOR not signed by all.
MH3 @MH3 · 48m48 minutes ago
Just to clarify: ACC GOR would not be an extension of the current GOR but a new GOR entirely with no backdoor clause hinging on ACCN launch
MH3 @MH3 · 48m48 minutes ago
The current ESPN contract always stated that of no network was launched then the deal and GOR would be reworked within a certain time period
MH3 @MH3 · 49m49 minutes ago
And the time is up
MH3 @MH3 · 48m48 minutes ago
ESPN is already losing $$ on current ACC deal and would be losing more by giving more $$
MH3 @MH3 · 48m48 minutes ago
Back when ACC was making $14m per school and it looked like FSU and Clemson were leaving ESPN threw more $& at ACC
MH3 @MH3 · 47m47 minutes ago
Then the cord cutting started in earnest and profits began to plummet and cuts were made
MH3 @MH3 · 47m47 minutes ago
Now ESPN has backed itself in a corner and it is cheaper to thrown$30m per year at ACC than to lose way more trying to launch a network
MH3 @MH3 · 46m46 minutes ago
B12N is only feasible to ESPN because it would use the existing LHN infrastructure and LHN already has carriage in heart of B12
Brad Weiss @UConnPittDad · 48m48 minutes ago
@MH3 is UCONN is squarly in the mix?
MH3@MH3
@UConnPittDad yes. Very much so. Vital market for a conference network to obtain.
MH3 @MH3 · 45m45 minutes ago
ESPN was in a position where it was going to have to pay the old BigEast a big payday to keep the rights because the ratings were there
MH3 @MH3 · 44m44 minutes ago
Instead they used ACC to destroy BE and now it is looking like it is the ACC's time to take the fall
@ · 44m44 minutes ago
ESPN gets most of what they want with B12 and SEC
MH3 @MH3 · 46m46 minutes ago
And buys some of what they want from B10.
MH3 @MH3 · 46m46 minutes ago
And then they have some of the PAC for the games no one outside of California gives a damn about.
Quote from: Marcus92 on March 03, 2016, 05:20:12 PM
Miami and Atlanta are the #8 and #9 metro markets in the country.
I doubt Miami (a private university) fits what the Big Ten is looking for. But Florida State might. It's a public school ranked in the top 50 by U.S. News & World Report, one that apparently aspires to become a top 25 public research university. Also ranked by Forbes as the #17 most valuable program in college football (tops in the ACC). The fact that it's located in Tallahassee almost 500 miles from Miami may not matter if the FSU alumni base is big enough.
Georgia Tech is also ranked in the top 50 public universities, with an engineering program some say is one of the 10 best in the world. Located right in downtown Atlanta.
I hope the realignment carousel keeps on spinning. Happy we got off the ride and can safely watch the spectacle from a distance.
There are only going to be four schools that the Big 10 would likely accept from the ACC: Virginia, Duke, UNC, and Georgia Tech. Those are the only schools in the ACC that are AAU as well which is a big deal. Nebraska is the only school that isn't AAU in the Big 10 and when they lost that rating just after joining the Big 10 they were almost kicked out.
There is no way a Florida State or Miami is going to fit into the Big 10. The Big 10 just wants to access the south, they don't have to go all the way into Florida for that.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on March 03, 2016, 04:33:15 PM
Yep. It was the C7 who rejected that notion, so ND went back to the ACC for an earlier start date.
BTW, interesting stuff on twitter today about the Big Ten still looking at the ACC for expansion and that ESPN is trying to head that off at the pass.
Yep, ESPN created this monster and now is having trouble controlling it because of so many network options now. Contract is coming due for Big Ten soon, ESPN has to keep that in the fold but at as low a cost as possible
Any one know how factual that Twitter exchange is? Pretty fascinating to peek behind the curtain.
Quote from: mu03eng on March 04, 2016, 07:28:25 AM
There are only going to be four schools that the Big 10 would likely accept from the ACC: Virginia, Duke, UNC, and Georgia Tech. Those are the only schools in the ACC that are AAU as well which is a big deal. Nebraska is the only school that isn't AAU in the Big 10 and when they lost that rating just after joining the Big 10 they were almost kicked out.
There is no way a Florida State or Miami is going to fit into the Big 10. The Big 10 just wants to access the south, they don't have to go all the way into Florida for that.
Agree with your point generally, but Pitt is also AAU.
MH3 is not reputable at all. He is as reliable at Yoda or TheDudeWV with regards to realignment. Look them up if you want a laugh.
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on March 01, 2016, 02:35:52 PM
Relevant.
Every day I get up and thank God that you are there, ever vigilant to protect me and others from irrelevant threads!
Quote from: GoldenWarrior11 on March 04, 2016, 08:21:59 AM
MH3 is not reputable at all. He is as reliable at Yoda or TheDudeWV with regards to realignment. Look them up if you want a laugh.
I agree with this. He tends to be a little out there. However the Big Ten is trying to make moves. Their next deal is coming due after the next academic year.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 01, 2016, 09:30:57 PM
We complain about how our conference schedule has lost a lot of marquis games. I can't imagine what UConn fans say about theirs.
In women's basketball, UConn is typically beating other conference members by forty points. Can't sustain a top program with that big of a lack of quality competition.
Quote from: MU Fan in Connecticut on March 04, 2016, 07:20:31 AM
I saw this Twitter exchange posted on another board.
MH ver3@MH ver3
Ok so now I can share my ACC info
MH ver3@MH ver3
ESPN not launching ACCN. Going to offer ACC an extra $30m per year on contract to give each school a $2m bump.
MH ver3@MH ver3
ESPN also going to make members of ACC sign a new GOR in order to get the $
MH ver3@MH ver3
Several ACC schools expected to not agree with this. ESPN trying to avert B10 gutting ACC.
MH ver3@MH ver3
This will be ESPNs last ditch effort to keep ACC intact.
MH ver3@MH ver3
FSU,UVA,UNC, Duke, Clemson, and GT are all going to be opposed of GOR
MH ver3@MH ver3
ACC will not get their extra $$ if GOR not signed by all.
MH3 @MH3 · 48m48 minutes ago
Just to clarify: ACC GOR would not be an extension of the current GOR but a new GOR entirely with no backdoor clause hinging on ACCN launch
MH3 @MH3 · 48m48 minutes ago
The current ESPN contract always stated that of no network was launched then the deal and GOR would be reworked within a certain time period
MH3 @MH3 · 49m49 minutes ago
And the time is up
MH3 @MH3 · 48m48 minutes ago
ESPN is already losing $$ on current ACC deal and would be losing more by giving more $$
MH3 @MH3 · 48m48 minutes ago
Back when ACC was making $14m per school and it looked like FSU and Clemson were leaving ESPN threw more $& at ACC
MH3 @MH3 · 47m47 minutes ago
Then the cord cutting started in earnest and profits began to plummet and cuts were made
MH3 @MH3 · 47m47 minutes ago
Now ESPN has backed itself in a corner and it is cheaper to thrown$30m per year at ACC than to lose way more trying to launch a network
MH3 @MH3 · 46m46 minutes ago
B12N is only feasible to ESPN because it would use the existing LHN infrastructure and LHN already has carriage in heart of B12
Brad Weiss @UConnPittDad · 48m48 minutes ago
@MH3 is UCONN is squarly in the mix?
MH3@MH3
@UConnPittDad yes. Very much so. Vital market for a conference network to obtain.
MH3 @MH3 · 45m45 minutes ago
ESPN was in a position where it was going to have to pay the old BigEast a big payday to keep the rights because the ratings were there
MH3 @MH3 · 44m44 minutes ago
Instead they used ACC to destroy BE and now it is looking like it is the ACC's time to take the fall
@ · 44m44 minutes ago
ESPN gets most of what they want with B12 and SEC
MH3 @MH3 · 46m46 minutes ago
And buys some of what they want from B10.
MH3 @MH3 · 46m46 minutes ago
And then they have some of the PAC for the games no one outside of California gives a damn about.
I haven't heard anything about a back door clause hinging on the ACC Network being launched. If its true, it would be very interesting. He is right about one thing, an ACC network would not do well. I could see ESPN not wanting to spend the money on that.
If the ACC blows up, it will make realignment very interesting. It might open the possibility of Notre Dame coming back to us. But it could also hurt the Big East. If the ACC tries to replace teams with basketball only members, we might see a school or two defect. Georgetown wanted that back when the C7 first broke off. Don't know if things have changed since then.
All that being said, until I see some more reputable sources picking up on this. I'm not expecting anything anytime soon. But the realignment carousel will spin again. Just got to make sure the Big East are takers and not taken when that day comes.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 01, 2016, 09:30:57 PM
We complain about how our conference schedule has lost a lot of marquis games. I can't imagine what UConn fans say about theirs.
I am sure the team itself would prefer that we didn't have
any Marquis games. The uniforms are really uncomfortable.
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3f/Gilbert_du_Motier_Marquis_de_Lafayette.PNG)
(http://uploads7.wikiart.org/images/maurice-quentin-de-la-tour/marc-rene-marquis-de-voyer-d-argenson.jpg)
Quote from: Marquette Fan In NY on March 03, 2016, 08:17:47 PM
I think what matters most for MU is we are part of a conference of like minded institutions that has a primary focus on basketball, has stability and also is an attractive platform for the rest of our athletic offerings.
Over time the NCAA units will pile up for everyone in the league which should allow all the teams in the league to continue have the ability to improve their programs, if they so choose.
When the TV contract comes up for renewal there will be multiple bidders and I am confident the Big East will do fine.
Marquette is in the best position it could possibly be by being in the Big East. We do not have a football program so we are not going to be in the Power 5 conferences. Our Big East conference is much stronger and has more upside than the A-10 or the American. One notable development is all of the Big East schools are doing very well in recruiting. The kids are excited about playing in our league and like the campus environment that our schools offer.
FIFY Some allowance needed to be made for DePaul.
Quote from: Buzz Williams' Spillproof Chiclets Cup on March 04, 2016, 08:02:04 AM
Agree with your point generally, but Pitt is also AAU.
Unfortunately for Pitt, they do nothing for the Big Ten regarding expansion of the base for the Big Ten network.
Quote from: Crean to Ann Arbor on March 04, 2016, 08:39:56 AM
In women's basketball, UConn is typically beating other conference members by forty points. Can't sustain a top program with that big of a lack of quality competition.
UConn's women's basketball team beats everybody by 40 points. Their bench is the number 2 team in the country. Their current 66 game winning streak all have been double digits wins. Their senior class is 142-5, their junior class is 107-1. They are unwatchable as none of their games are competitive.
Quote from: CTWarrior on March 04, 2016, 10:01:10 AM
UConn's women's basketball team beats everybody by 40 points. Their bench is the number 2 team in the country. Their current 66 game winning streak all have been double digits wins. Their senior class is 142-5, their junior class is 107-1. They are unwatchable as none of their games are competitive.
And that is against non-conference foes (top teams in the country). Truly amazing streak and not sure that the conference matters one bit.
Quote from: TAMU Eagle on March 04, 2016, 08:57:06 AM
I haven't heard anything about a back door clause hinging on the ACC Network being launched. If its true, it would be very interesting. He is right about one thing, an ACC network would not do well. I could see ESPN not wanting to spend the money on that.
If the ACC blows up, it will make realignment very interesting. It might open the possibility of Notre Dame coming back to us. But it could also hurt the Big East. If the ACC tries to replace teams with basketball only members, we might see a school or two defect. Georgetown wanted that back when the C7 first broke off. Don't know if things have changed since then.
All that being said, until I see some more reputable sources picking up on this. I'm not expecting anything anytime soon. But the realignment carousel will spin again. Just got to make sure the Big East are takers and not taken when that day comes.
I'm not so sure about this. If Duke and UNC bolt for the B10 (and UVA and GTech, to boot), I think the Big East is probably a better conference than that gutted version of the ACC.
Quote from: warriorchick on March 04, 2016, 08:59:32 AM
I am sure the team itself would prefer that we didn't have any Marquis games. The uniforms are really uncomfortable.
Somebody had to say it. Well done.
Quote from: Oldgym on March 04, 2016, 10:14:09 AM
Somebody had to say it. Well done.
A reflection of my (lack of) erudition I guess, but this is what came to my mind when I read his post
(http://www.tradingcarddb.com/Images/Cards/Baseball/64034/64034-15Fr.jpg)
Quote from: Eldon on March 04, 2016, 10:09:07 AM
I'm not so sure about this. If Duke and UNC bolt for the B10 (and UVA and GTech, to boot), I think the Big East is probably a better conference than that gutted version of the ACC.
Better, or at least a wash.
I could understand why GTown might prefer the current ACC to the current BE. But if the ACC loses some of its best basketball members to the B10, there would be far less reason to go. The basketball teams by conference would be fairly close - UL, Cuse, maybe NC State at the top of the ACC. Nova, X, hopefully MU back at the top of the BE. Maybe this still gives a nod to the ACC...but then you have to add the inherent instability of being a hoops-only school in a conference with mostly football schools.
I think GTown would appreciate the BE a bit more if the ACC falls apart.
A buddy of mine has confirmed that Georgia Tech has sent Andy Samberg's cousin to meet with B10 reps about coming to Georgia Tech
https://www.youtube.com/v/98nNpzE6gIs
Quote from: mu03eng on March 04, 2016, 07:28:25 AMThere are only going to be four schools that the Big 10 would likely accept from the ACC: Virginia, Duke, UNC, and Georgia Tech. Those are the only schools in the ACC that are AAU as well which is a big deal. Nebraska is the only school that isn't AAU in the Big 10 and when they lost that rating just after joining the Big 10 they were almost kicked out.
There is no way a Florida State or Miami is going to fit into the Big 10. The Big 10 just wants to access the south, they don't have to go all the way into Florida for that.
Good point. I was thinking the Big 10's main reasons for expansion would be 1) to challenge the SEC for football supremacy; and 2) to broaden the conference footprint and audience. But I think you're right about the importance of 3) academic standards.
Maybe I've got the priority all wrong. Nebraska, Rutgers and Maryland didn't exactly add new football powerhouses to the Big Ten.
Quote from: Marcus92 on March 04, 2016, 10:23:04 AM
Maybe I've got the priority all wrong. Nebraska, Rutgers and Maryland didn't exactly add new football powerhouses to the Big Ten.
True. But to be fair, Nebraska seemed to be coming back to prominence just before joining the B10. In its last two seasons before joining, they finished ranked #14 and #20 in the AP. Not anywhere near the peak of their success, but not bad either.
Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 04, 2016, 10:28:44 AM
True. But to be fair, Nebraska seemed to be coming back to prominence just before joining the B10. In its last two seasons before joining, they finished ranked #14 and #20 in the AP. Not anywhere near the peak of their success, but not bad either.
Nebraska is a big college football brand that draws eyeballs to the BTN.
Quote from: Marcus92 on March 04, 2016, 10:23:04 AM
Good point. I was thinking the Big 10's main reasons for expansion would be 1) to challenge the SEC for football supremacy; and 2) to broaden the conference footprint and audience. But I think you're right about the importance of 3) academic standards.
Maybe I've got the priority all wrong. Nebraska, Rutgers and Maryland didn't exactly add new football powerhouses to the Big Ten.
Money is the first, second and third reasons why the Big Ten expanded. They brought in a national football brand in Nebraska, and two public universities in the two largest metropolitan areas on the east coast. Access for the Big Ten network, which is just printing money for the conference right now.
Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 04, 2016, 10:20:40 AM
Better, or at least a wash.
I could understand why GTown might prefer the current ACC to the current BE. But if the ACC loses some of its best basketball members to the B10, there would be far less reason to go. The basketball teams by conference would be fairly close - UL, Cuse, maybe NC State at the top of the ACC. Nova, X, hopefully MU back at the top of the BE. Maybe this still gives a nod to the ACC...but then you have to add the inherent instability of being a hoops-only school in a conference with mostly football schools.
I think GTown would appreciate the BE a bit more if the ACC falls apart.
And if a few leave for the Big10 who's to say others won't follow to leave for the SEC or Big XII (with a new TV Network)?
Do you think Notre Dame sees its affiliation with the ACC as a success?
It's pretty clear they've valued football independence over all else, and wanted no part of the C7 (and/or vice-versa). Perhaps the ACC is the only major conference willing to put up with ND being an "almost but not exactly" full member. Seems kind of like the kind of "arrangement" an unfaithful husband might have with his wife. Neither gets the benefit of a true commitment, but it has the appearance of stability and it's better than the alternative.
Quote from: Marcus92 on March 04, 2016, 10:57:47 AM
Do you think Notre Dame sees its affiliation with the ACC as a success?
It's pretty clear they've valued football independence over all else, and wanted no part of the C7 (and/or vice-versa). Perhaps the ACC is the only major conference willing to put up with ND being an "almost but not exactly" full member. Seems kind of like the kind of "arrangement" an unfaithful husband might have with his wife. Neither gets the benefit of a true commitment, but it has the appearance of stability and it's better than the alternative.
Oh I think Notre Dame is thrilled with their membership. As you mention, they didn't have to give up football independence, yet they reap the benefits of conference bowl tie ins. And they get the benefit of aligning their other sports with a pretty good conference.
The Big Ten or SEC would never allow them to join as a partial member. The Big 12 might but the conference doesn't really fit their profile. The Pac 12 is too geographically distant.
That being said, would ND prefer the BE versus a gutted ACC? Not sure. The football bowl tie ins are important.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on March 04, 2016, 11:05:29 AM
Oh I think Notre Dame is thrilled with their membership. As you mention, they didn't have to give up football independence, yet they reap the benefits of conference bowl tie ins. And they get the benefit of aligning their other sports with a pretty good conference.
That being said, would ND prefer the BE versus a gutted ACC? Not sure. The football bowl tie ins are important.
Hit the nail on the head. The main reason ND is in the ACC is the bowl tie ins. With the current structure of the CFP if ND didn't make that they would be playing in mid December bowl games since almost every other game has conference tie ins. While the average fan may think playing in a December 31st Bowl Game is no difference, it means millions of dollars to a school like ND, who doesn't have to split that money wit conference members.
Quote from: GooooMarquette on March 04, 2016, 10:28:44 AM
True. But to be fair, Nebraska seemed to be coming back to prominence just before joining the B10. In its last two seasons before joining, they finished ranked #14 and #20 in the AP. Not anywhere near the peak of their success, but not bad either.
This is accurate. Under Bo Pelini Nebraska averaged a 9-4 season. Also Nebraska has a very committed fan base, so away games at places like Northwestern etc. are sellouts.
Quote from: warriorchick on March 04, 2016, 08:59:32 AM
I am sure the team itself would prefer that we didn't have any Marquis games. The uniforms are really uncomfortable.
Marquette has a pretty good history with Marquis games, at least Marquis Estill.