MUScoop

This week's AP Top 25 and how I voted: Dec. 28


Source: This week's AP Top 25 and how I voted: Dec. 28 (http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/363676081.html)

       what has always befuddled me is when a decently ranked team loses, especially a close game to a higher ranked opponent, they drop off some.  most recent example, louisville-kentucky.  not that i have any pitino love here, but i have noticed this over the years.  i understand it's a loss, but when the loss could have very easily been a win...
     blow-outs are a different story for obvious reasons

Quote from: rocket surgeon on December 28, 2015, 06:28:29 PM
       what has always befuddled me is when a decently ranked team loses, especially a close game to a higher ranked opponent, they drop off some.  most recent example, louisville-kentucky.  not that i have any pitino love here, but i have noticed this over the years.  i understand it's a loss, but when the loss could have very easily been a win...
     blow-outs are a different story for obvious reasons

Agree that Louisville should not be punished (5 years ago i would've punched myself in the ear for even thinking those words) for their loss to uk.

i do trust Matt's POV that UL was "looking for their first good win of the year" and the teams around them had "quality" wins to advance.  if uk had moved more than 2 spots up i'd be jumping on the Conspiracy Theory Train.  During conference play #13 playing at #11 should not be dinged for a 2 pt loss.

All that being said......Matt does a fabulous job of explaining his thinking on each poll

Pittino let the UK fans know what number he thought his team was after a road loss at UK, ai'na?

Quote from: naginiF on December 28, 2015, 07:39:14 PM
Agree that Louisville should not be punished (5 years ago i would've punched myself in the ear for even thinking those words) for their loss to uk.

i do trust Matt's POV that UL was "looking for their first good win of the year" and the teams around them had "quality" wins to advance.  if uk had moved more than 2 spots up i'd be jumping on the Conspiracy Theory Train.  During conference play #13 playing at #11 should not be dinged for a 2 pt loss.

All that being said......Matt does a fabulous job of explaining his thinking on each poll

good thoughts!  as i'm not pulling up any other specifics, but i remember seeing this scenario a number of times.  losing to a top 5 or so team in a good game and losing ground.  in the end, it's the big show that matters.  except if it hinders a seeding however, that's where rpi needs to come in.

yes i saw pitino's salute-musta had a little riding on the game?  who gets the top?  much easier to see sports center from there-heyna?

Quote from: rocket surgeon on December 28, 2015, 06:28:29 PM
       what has always befuddled me is when a decently ranked team loses, especially a close game to a higher ranked opponent, they drop off some.  most recent example, louisville-kentucky.  not that i have any pitino love here, but i have noticed this over the years.  i understand it's a loss, but when the loss could have very easily been a win...
     blow-outs are a different story for obvious reasons

It's why human rankings are so stupid.  A computer ranking looks at a good team, losing to a really really good team, and if it is a competitive, close game, doesn't just drop them for the sake of losing.  Especially by rewarding a so-so team simply because they didn't lose as they played two total scrubs.

The human ratings are a joke.  I used to watch Mike Deane and staff vote and it was comical.  Rick Majerus was famous for it.  Absolutely comical.  Not an ounce of thought put into it. 

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on December 28, 2015, 09:23:36 PM
It's why human rankings are so stupid.  A computer ranking looks at a good team, losing to a really really good team, and if it is a competitive, close game, doesn't just drop them for the sake of losing.  Especially by rewarding a so-so team simply because they didn't lose as they played two total scrubs.

The human ratings are a joke.  I used to watch Mike Deane and staff vote and it was comical.  Rick Majerus was famous for it.  Absolutely comical.  Not an ounce of thought put into it.

Many coaches don't even vote, they let an assistant or the SID do it for them. I don't think it's totally fair to take the media polls and coach polls and lump them together as "human polls" that are a "joke."

All you have to do is read the article in the link Matt provided. You can see the amount of thought Matt put into his AP poll.

I never voted in AP football/basketball polls but I did vote for many major sports awards in my time -- Cy Young, Rookie of the Year, Hall of Fame, NFL All-Pro, etc -- and I took pride in doing so. I never just blew them off. Matt's work gives me faith that most of today's sportswriters still take this kind of stuff seriously.

Quote from: MU82 on December 28, 2015, 09:35:20 PM
Many coaches don't even vote, they let an assistant or the SID do it for them. I don't think it's totally fair to take the media polls and coach polls and lump them together as "human polls" that are a "joke."

All you have to do is read the article in the link Matt provided. You can see the amount of thought Matt put into his AP poll.

I never voted in AP football/basketball polls but I did vote for many major sports awards in my time -- Cy Young, Rookie of the Year, Hall of Fame, NFL All-Pro, etc -- and I took pride in doing so. I never just blew them off. Matt's work gives me faith that most of today's sportswriters still take this kind of stuff seriously.

Here's the problem I have with even the media doing the polls.  It is incredibly time consuming to go through the top 50 teams, who they played, who those teams played, what happened not only this week, but two weeks ago, four weeks ago, who was injured, etc.  People don't have the time, or the ability to do so.  Thus, they tend to look at the most recent happenings, check out the scores and vote. If you lose, you drop.  It's just silly and asinine.  Matt seems to do better than some, but I'll bet dollars to donuts if he were to answer the question honestly he would say it is difficult to take all that data and truly understand what is going on.  I'd also bet that he would say if a team loses, 99% of the time that team is going to drop because they lost, regardless of anything else.  That's just a poor way to go about it.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on December 28, 2015, 10:35:47 PM
Here's the problem I have with even the media doing the polls.  It is incredibly time consuming to go through the top 50 teams, who they played, who those teams played, what happened not only this week, but two weeks ago, four weeks ago, who was injured, etc.  People don't have the time, or the ability to do so.  Thus, they tend to look at the most recent happenings, check out the scores and vote. If you lose, you drop.  It's just silly and asinine.  Matt seems to do better than some, but I'll bet dollars to donuts if he were to answer the question honestly he would say it is difficult to take all that data and truly understand what is going on.  I'd also bet that he would say if a team loses, 99% of the time that team is going to drop because they lost, regardless of anything else.  That's just a poor way to go about it.

Without going back to look, one thing I really liked was Matt's defense of having Arizona ahead of Providence after the Friars beat the Wildcats on a neutral court. He pointed out that he didn't think single-game results should be the be-all and that on the whole, he still felt Arizona at that point was a better team despite having lost that one game.

Not really a defense of the polls on the whole, but if everyone in the AP poll put as much care and thought in as he seems to (they don't) and publicly addressed criticisms of their ballot, I think it would actually be a useful tool with a lot of use.

As far as the coaches, that's just a joke. They don't have the time to really watch the games or put out a ballot, and if they aren't even voting, what's the point?

Quote from: brewcity77 on December 29, 2015, 12:04:17 PM
Without going back to look, one thing I really liked was Matt's defense of having Arizona ahead of Providence after the Friars beat the Wildcats on a neutral court. He pointed out that he didn't think single-game results should be the be-all and that on the whole, he still felt Arizona at that point was a better team despite having lost that one game.

Not really a defense of the polls on the whole, but if everyone in the AP poll put as much care and thought in as he seems to (they don't) and publicly addressed criticisms of their ballot, I think it would actually be a useful tool with a lot of use.

As far as the coaches, that's just a joke. They don't have the time to really watch the games or put out a ballot, and if they aren't even voting, what's the point?

As opposed to a social tool without a use?

/Green Day'd
//nothing going on at work this week

Quote from: Ellenson Family Reunion on December 29, 2015, 01:01:13 PM
As opposed to a social tool without a use?

/Green Day'd
//nothing going on at work this week

LOL Think I edited that mid-post, then didn't re-read before hitting the button.  ;D

Marquette getting 2 votes in the ESPN Power Rankings....

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/powerrankings