Must have been nice knowing what plays were being called.
Decent synopsis on the ESPN report:
http://www.businessinsider.com/espn-report-patriots-spygate-scandal-2015-9
..Advanced scouts would be sent to the games of upcoming Patriots' opponents to film the play signals. The scouts would go undercover as media members, with media credentials listed under "Patriots TV" or "Kraft Productions" and were prepared with excuses of what to say they were filming if security asked them. According to Van Natta Jr. and Wickersham,
"Each video sequence would usually include three shots: the down and distance, the signal, and, as an in-house joke, a tight shot of a cheerleader's top or skirt."Other methods of cheating reportedly include:
- Sending low-level Patriots employees to sneak into the visiting locker room during pre-game warm-ups and steal the play sheet. Van Natta Jr. and Wickersham note, "The practice became so notorious that some coaches put out fake play sheets for the Patriots to swipe."
Sending employees through the visiting team's hotel to try to swipe playbooks and scouting reports.
"Scrambling and jamming" opponent radio headsets to interfere with opponent communication.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on September 08, 2015, 11:24:25 AM
"Scrambling and jamming" opponent radio headsets to interfere with opponent communication.[/li][/list]
"Roger, Iron Claw 602 rolling in hot on Gillette..."
(http://www.airforce-technology.com/projects/prowler/images/prowler1.jpg)
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on September 08, 2015, 11:24:25 AM
Must have been nice knowing what plays were being called.
Decent synopsis on the ESPN report:
http://www.businessinsider.com/espn-report-patriots-spygate-scandal-2015-9
..Advanced scouts would be sent to the games of upcoming Patriots' opponents to film the play signals. The scouts would go undercover as media members, with media credentials listed under "Patriots TV" or "Kraft Productions" and were prepared with excuses of what to say they were filming if security asked them. According to Van Natta Jr. and Wickersham, "Each video sequence would usually include three shots: the down and distance, the signal, and, as an in-house joke, a tight shot of a cheerleader's top or skirt."
Other methods of cheating reportedly include:
- Sending low-level Patriots employees to sneak into the visiting locker room during pre-game warm-ups and steal the play sheet. Van Natta Jr. and Wickersham note, "The practice became so notorious that some coaches put out fake play sheets for the Patriots to swipe."
Sending employees through the visiting team's hotel to try to swipe playbooks and scouting reports.
"Scrambling and jamming" opponent radio headsets to interfere with opponent communication.
Wow. All of this sounds pretty damning.
Though I wonder how prevalent this was (is?) in the NFL. I remember when SpyGate first broke Jimmy Johnson was saying not to jump on Belicheck too much because 'it's more common than you think' (his exact quote was something along those lines).
http://yourteamcheats.com/
Quote from: MU B2002 on September 08, 2015, 02:45:49 PM
http://yourteamcheats.com/
Dude spends an awful lot of time justifying the Patriots' cheating.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on September 08, 2015, 11:24:25 AM
Must have been nice knowing what plays were being called.
Decent synopsis on the ESPN report:
..Advanced scouts would be sent to the games of upcoming Patriots' opponents to film the play signals. The scouts would go undercover as media members, with media credentials listed under "Patriots TV" or "Kraft Productions" and were prepared with excuses of what to say they were filming if security asked them. According to Van Natta Jr. and Wickersham, "Each video sequence would usually include three shots: the down and distance, the signal, and, as an in-house joke, a tight shot of a cheerleader's top or skirt."
This one has been going on for a long time - back to when a "spy" in the booth would do the same thing with binoculars and a pad & pencil.
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13533995/split-nfl-new-england-patriots-apart
This is a long article, but a must read. I read ALL of this twice through...there are many many details here that you've never heard before...and I am convinced Coach Bill is a cheater and a liar.
Please read all of this, and I would enjoy hearing your thoughts and reactions.
Quote from: houwarrior on September 08, 2015, 05:33:20 PM
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13533995/split-nfl-new-england-patriots-apart
This is a long article, but a must read. I read ALL of this twice through...there are many many details here that you've never heard before...and I am convinced Coach Bill is a cheater and a liar.
Please read all of this, and I would enjoy hearing your thoughts and reactions.
Thanks, Hou. I had scanned the article earlier, but had not read it in its entirety.
I was especially amused by:
Spygate's unanswered questions and destroyed evidence had managed to seize the attention of a hard-charging U.S. senator, Arlen Specter of Pennsylvania, who was threatening a congressional investigation.
This would put everyone -- players, coaches, owners and the commissioner -- under oath, a prospect that some in that room at The Breakers believed could threaten the foundation of the NFL.Worried that speaking truthfully could shake the league to its foundation?
This story is also one of the reasons ESPN will remain on top.
Why does it always have to be xxxxxgate?
Spygate. Deflategate. Monicagate. Nannygate. Bountygate. Tigergate. Clockgate. Nipplegate.
People do know that Watergate was the name of an actual hotel and not some scandal involving water, right?
I have refused to call any of these things "gate."
Yes, a bold stand, I know.
Quote from: MU82 on September 08, 2015, 10:48:36 PM
Why does it always have to be xxxxxgate?
Spygate. Deflategate. Monicagate. Nannygate. Bountygate. Tigergate. Clockgate. Nipplegate.
People do know that Watergate was the name of an actual hotel and not some scandal involving water, right?
I have refused to call any of these things "gate."
Yes, a bold stand, I know.
Would be better if it was originally at the Doubletree
Quote from: MU82 on September 08, 2015, 10:48:36 PM
Why does it always have to be xxxxxgate?
Spygate. Deflategate. Monicagate. Nannygate. Bountygate. Tigergate. Clockgate. Nipplegate.
People do know that Watergate was the name of an actual hotel and not some scandal involving water, right?
I have refused to call any of these things "gate."
Yes, a bold stand, I know.
We are in so much agreement here!!
Quote from: houwarrior on September 08, 2015, 05:33:20 PM
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13533995/split-nfl-new-england-patriots-apart
This is a long article, but a must read. I read ALL of this twice through...there are many many details here that you've never heard before...and I am convinced Coach Bill is a cheater and a liar.
Please read all of this, and I would enjoy hearing your thoughts and reactions.
Yes, exactly. I always assumed there was more to the tapes than Goodell led on, and it covered a lot more than the small sample that he tried to lead the media to believing. But the one part of it to me that screams how much Belichick is a cheater, is the lengths they went to cover this up and hide it. Taping over Patriots logos in order to sneak cameramen onto the field as an example.
If he was just "misinterpreting a rule", then there would be no need to take these additional steps. Which then in turn also makes him a huge liar.
Quote from: WarriorInNYC on September 09, 2015, 08:49:18 AM
Yes, exactly. I always assumed there was more to the tapes than Goodell led on, and it covered a lot more than the small sample that he tried to lead the media to believing. But the one part of it to me that screams how much Belichick is a cheater, is the lengths they went to cover this up and hide it. Taping over Patriots logos in order to sneak cameramen onto the field as an example.
If he was just "misinterpreting a rule", then there would be no need to take these additional steps. Which then in turn also makes him a huge liar.
Well yeah. But what does all this mean? Another wrist slap?
Quote from: MU82 on September 09, 2015, 09:20:18 AM
Well yeah. But what does all this mean? Another wrist slap?
Nothing will happen that hasn't happened already. The league isn't going to retroactively punish them more simply because the previous allegations have been brought to light.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on September 09, 2015, 09:22:57 AM
Nothing will happen that hasn't happened already. The league isn't going to retroactively punish them more simply because the previous allegations have been brought to light.
Their is a theory that suggests the opposite.
NFL owners are a bunch of hyper-competitive billionaires. They just don't want to win, they want to crush everyone that stands in their way.
This theory says their are a segment of billionaires owners that were apologetic about spy-gate and how easy the Patriots got off (in their view). They want the Patriots crushed. Than cannot stand Bob Kraft (the other billionaire owners).
These owners are headed by Woody Johnson (Jets), Steve Ross (Dolphins) and Jerry Jones (Cowboys). Others are with them, probably because they are jealous of the Pats success.
These owners don't give a crap about deflated footballs. This was a device to hammer the Patriots again, to what they think is the proper vengeance for spy-gate.
They had it then the judge took it away last week.
So now the gloves are off and they are leaking all the "bad things" the Patriots do as they will not stop until they are a pathetic 5 - 11 team (or, they want the Patriots to become the Bears).
PS Yes - All teams probably cheat as bad the Patriots. But the other 31 teams don't have 4 rings in the last 11 years. They hate them for that want to knock the cheating big dog off the porch.
Quote from: Heisenberg on September 09, 2015, 10:03:24 AM
Their is a theory that suggests the opposite.
NFL owners are a bunch of hyper-competitive billionaires. They just don't want to win, they want to crush everyone that stands in their way.
This theory says their are a segment of billionaires owners that were apologetic about spy-gate and how easy the Patriots got off (in their view). They want the Patriots crushed. Than cannot stand Bob Kraft (the other billionaire owners).
These owners are headed by Woody Johnson (Jets), Steve Ross (Dolphins) and Jerry Jones (Cowboys). Others are with them, probably because they are jealous of the Pats success.
These owners don't give a crap about deflated footballs. This was a device to hammer the Patriots again, to what they think is the proper vengeance for spy-gate.
They had it then the judge took it away last week.
So now the gloves are off and they are leaking all the "bad things" the Patriots do as they will not stop until they are a pathetic 5 - 11 team (or, they want the Patriots to become the Bears).
PS Yes - All teams probably cheat as bad the Patriots. But the other 31 teams don't have 4 rings in the last 11 years. They hate them for that want to knock the cheating big dog off the porch.
actually just 2 rings in the last 11 but yeah, 4 in the last 14 Super Bowls
Quote from: Heisenberg on September 09, 2015, 10:03:24 AM
NFL owners are a bunch of hyper-competitive billionaires. They just don't want to win, they want to crush everyone that stands in their way.
Plenty of evidence to suggest this isn't true. They just want the money to keep rolling in.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on September 09, 2015, 09:22:57 AM
Nothing will happen that hasn't happened already. The league isn't going to retroactively punish them more simply because the previous allegations have been brought to light.
Didn't they do that exact thing with Ray Rice?
Quote from: jesmu84 on September 09, 2015, 01:09:17 PM
Didn't they do that exact thing with Ray Rice?
They tried but it was overturned by an arbitrator. And I didn't say they *couldn't.* They just aren't.
Quote from: brandx on September 09, 2015, 11:23:34 AM
Plenty of evidence to suggest this isn't true. They just want the money to keep rolling in.
What evidence?
Quote from: Heisenberg on September 09, 2015, 03:46:18 PM
What evidence?
It seems like the NFL since the 1960s isn't composed of owners who want to crush other owners who stand in their way, but is instead composed of owners who are united to maximize revenue and minimize expenses. Owners, such as Al Davis, who stand on their own against the group are usually ostracized and labelled as outsiders.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on September 09, 2015, 03:51:49 PM
It seems like the NFL since the 1960s isn't composed of owners who want to crush other owners who stand in their way, but is instead composed of owners who are united to maximize revenue and minimize expenses. Owners, such as Al Davis, who stand on their own against the group are usually ostracized and labelled as outsiders.
See Woody Johnson, Stephen Ross, Jerry Jones, Bill Bidwell, Arthur Blank, Steve Bisciotti, Jimmy Haslam, Robert C. McNair, Jeffrey Lurie and Dan Synder
They think the NFL is bullet proof (like Chicos) and nothing they do can hurt the revenues. They have massive egos and they think they are competing with each other and their priority is win AND to crush the competition.
They have the same mindset and killer instinct as the players on the field. To think otherwise is folly.
And they are jealous of the Patriots and want them crushed and Woody Johnson (Jets) wants Kraft out of the league for Spygate (that is what he wants, not going to get it).
Why else would the league want to crush their most popular player (Brady) and arguably their most popular team? This Brady thing is suicide for a bunch of owners that you think conspire to maximize revenues,. Gooddell knows it but he is required to do the bidding of a number of owners that want the Patriots crushed. Kraft does not have enough support to stop Gooddell, too many want him crushed or are too jealous to support Kraft.
Kraft is not liked among the other owners
I think you are way overstating this. In the end, even if Brady would have been suspended, it was largely a slap on the wrist. If Goodell and the league were truly interested in "crushing" the Patriots, he could have used deflategate as a reason to release all of the previous evidence and suspend Belicheck indefinitely if not ban him for life. Because if true, his actions were way worse for the integrity of the game than Sean Payton's or Gregg Williams'.
The Patriots are the Clintons of the NFL, everyone is gunning for them in order to take them down a notch even if they have to make mountains out of molehills.
Quote from: Fluffy Blue Monster on September 10, 2015, 07:35:23 AM
I think you are way overstating this. In the end, even if Brady would have been suspended, it was largely a slap on the wrist. If Goodell and the league were truly interested in "crushing" the Patriots, he could have used deflategate as a reason to release all of the previous evidence and suspend Belicheck indefinitely if not ban him for life. Because if true, his actions were way worse for the integrity of the game than Sean Payton's or Gregg Williams'.
So the $1 million dollar fine, and the loss of draft picks and suspending Brady for 4 games is a "slap on the wrist?"
And no they do not want Belicheck indefinitely banned, they want him driven out of New England and then try and higher him.
Two days ago this ESPN story laid it all out, it'sl about getting even for Spygate.
http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/13533995/split-nfl-new-england-patriots-apart
Condensed version
ESPN just nuked the Patriots and NFL for SpygateThe latest bombshell from Bristol links the NFL's tough stance on DeflateGate to its fumbling of the Spygate investigation.
http://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/9/8/9275433/espn-patriots-spygate-deflategate-roger-goodell-bill-belichick
Owners and others were disappointed that the NFL did not issue stronger discipline to the Patriots in the wake of the investigation over video taping opposing teams' hand signals. The ESPN report, in talking with owners, executives and others around the league, found that many inside the NFL view Goodell's tough stance on DeflateGate as a "makeup call" for how the league handled the Spygate.-----------------
Here is what you need to understand ...
their is not such thing as "the shield." It's 32 hyper-competitive killer sharks willing to do anything to win and kill their competition. It's every man (owner) for itself. That is what we like about football, it's war, next man up, do what it takes and all the rest.
The owners are exactly like the players on the field. So while league defenses are doing whatever it takes to stop Brady, the other owners will do whatever it takes to stop Bob Kraft.