Don't even know what to think. He has every opportunity, Just not a contributor. With the ball down low, it's almost like he has the yips.
Yep always has to dribble or keep the ball low. Can't jump....
I really like Steve and I think he's a good player. With that said, I wonder if he is as hungry to be great as a guy like Duane. Duane can have a slump, but he's going to be very good because he wants it. Not a criticism, just an observation about temperament. In many ways, I think desire is as big a gift as size.
Knees. They are wrecked.
That attempted under the basket layup in the 1st half he had looked like something straight out of the circus.
I really want Steve to get some consistent games going cuz it would be huge...but he just doesn't really have it.
Late in the second half I noticed he appeared to have an ice wrap on his right knee. Wasn't close enough to tell for sure.
I feel for Steve he's a good kid. Seems like a derailed train right now, just can't do ANYTHING atm.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on January 14, 2015, 10:25:49 PM
Knees. They are wrecked.
This, the heart is there, the effort is there, but the body isn't.
The good news: he has improved defensively over last year
The bad news: he has less offensive confidence than last year. I am NOT sure his offense has regressed but there is definitely a confidence issue this year.
Sad to watch. Seems like a great kid. But he has no lift. Offers nothing. Can't finish strong. Just taking up space at this point.
Quote from: MarquetteDano on January 14, 2015, 11:09:46 PM
The bad news: he has less offensive confidence than last year. I am NOT sure his offense has regressed but there is definitely a confidence issue this year.
You have got to be kidding. Love Steve, but he was awful last year on offense. Missed about two thirds of his lay ups. Maybe it's injuries, maybe his freshman year was a mirage.
Hope he's takin' advantage of his free education. That will serve him well, hey?
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on January 14, 2015, 10:25:49 PM
Knees. They are wrecked.
Exactly. His explosiveness just isn't there. Around the basket, he needs to get set, gather himself and then go up. That just takes too much time. He might be best served taking 1000 threes a day this offseason with hopes of contributing as a role-playing spot-up shooter next season.
Looks like Steve is seeing ghosts.
Agree with most of the comments here. I watched Steve before the game. He looked good. He didn't make all his shots and didn't dunk as much as other players. He just does't stand out or try to stand out. During the game, you get the feeling watching him, that he doesn't play hard or just isn't a proactive player. For whatever reason, he seems satisfied to let other players win the game.
He did not look good during the game though. He looked like a non-entity. I just don't think he can play consistently at this level.
I write that he looked "good" before the game.
Quote from: Stretchdeltsig on January 15, 2015, 09:36:41 AM
I write that he looked "good" before the game.
Got it. Edited.
Remember how tall those guys near him were. Luke also had major problems with their big men. Steve has always had his offensive limitations. Ohio State was an exception with all those dunks but he does not have a good touch up close and cannot jump.
Quote from: teamdee on January 15, 2015, 08:29:06 AM
Looks like Steve is seeing ghosts.
But that was supposed to help Lazar
Clearly has medical issues with his knees. He can no longer elevate.
Lets give Steve some space, if its is his Knees and they do get better, maybe he will too. Look at the improvement in Derricks offense game. (25,000 Shots)
To posters that think Steve has no fire, didn't you see that Time out Positive Fury toward his teammates he had in one of the Orlando games.
Its really not necessary to have quick write offs (Respect the process). Sometimes I have to Bite my Keyboard
Right after Matty hit the three FTW, Steve hobbled to his feet. Pretty clear he's "playing" hurt.
(http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee245/joewiesner1/steve_zps55e16df6.png)
He looked better at Simeon in high school, he could rebound and finish,somethings wrong.
Quote from: LittleWade on January 14, 2015, 10:58:09 PM
When did that happen?
Most of his career he has had knee issues. It's chronic and probably won't ever get better.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 15, 2015, 12:31:45 AM
You have got to be kidding. Love Steve, but he was awful last year on offense. Missed about two thirds of his lay ups. Maybe it's injuries, maybe his freshman year was a mirage.
Not sure what I stated is diametrically opposed to what you just stated above. I am just saying he has lost a lot of confidence in his shot.
Quote from: Oldgym on January 15, 2015, 11:14:09 AM
Right after Matty hit the three FTW, Steve hobbled to his feet. Pretty clear he's "playing" hurt.
(http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee245/joewiesner1/steve_zps55e16df6.png)
I noticed that too when watching the replay.
He's hurt. Don't you think he wants to please all us Scoopers if he could?
I felt Steve came back too soon last year from his surgery. Would have preferred to see him redshirt, and take the year to get physically strong. It appears to me that he is damaged goods physically. I like him a lot and think he still has something to offer as a mid range jump shooter.
But....it was Buzz that suggested the redshirt. And everyone knows if Buzz suggested it last year, it was, by definition, wrong. ::) Seeing how he played last year and how this year is going, IMO a strong case can be made that he should have taken the redshirt.
Quote from: tower912 on January 15, 2015, 11:57:33 PM
But....it was Buzz that suggested the redshirt. And everyone knows if Buzz suggested it last year, it was, by definition, wrong. ::) Seeing how he played last year and how this year is going, IMO a strong case can be made that he should have taken the redshirt.
I heard he forced Duane into it as well.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 16, 2015, 12:19:17 AM
I heard he forced Duane into it as well.
This is true. My sources tell me Buzz told Duane that if Duane didn't redshirt, Buzz would go to Duane's family's house every night and dance in their living room.
Quote from: MU82 on January 16, 2015, 08:06:29 AM
This is true. My sources tell me Buzz told Duane that if Duane didn't redshirt, Buzz would go to Duane's family's house every night and dance in their living room.
Source?
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 16, 2015, 12:19:17 AM
I heard he forced Duane into it as well.
"Forced" is a bit of a strong word. Duane didn't want to, but I think the people around him knew it was best. Thank goodness.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on January 16, 2015, 08:23:54 AM
"Forced" is a bit of a strong word. Duane didn't want to, but I think the people around him knew it was best. Thank goodness.
Opinion, Sultan. If you believe that, that is your business. But Buzz did not do it with Duane's best interest in mind. Buzz already was in exit mode early in the year. But you keep fooling yourself about the integrity of the phony cowboy. After all, his integrity has shown itself really well: "I'll be at MU as long as they want me", and bad mouthing the BEast as he is headed out the door, are just a couple of examples of his downhome integrity.
Quote from: willie warrior on January 16, 2015, 09:54:45 AM
Opinion, Sultan. If you believe that, that is your business. But Buzz did not do it with Duane's best interest in mind.
What's your theory as to why Buzz was motivated to have Duane redshirt?
Quote from: mujivitz06 on January 15, 2015, 07:22:13 PM
Post of the year
while good not even close to the bar set by Benny's troll
Quote from: Michael Kenyon on January 16, 2015, 01:11:12 PM
while good not even close to the bar set by Benny's troll
I'll bet Lazar knew you were going to say that.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on January 16, 2015, 09:59:22 AM
What's your theory as to why Buzz was motivated to have Duane redshirt?
How soon you forget Sultan. Posted last year a couple times to which you responded. No sense to hash that over. Since the phony one has moved on, I have also. BTW, how is the Buzzster doing these days?
Quote from: g0lden3agle on January 16, 2015, 08:23:06 AM
Source?
If I revealed my source, I'd have to kill all Scoopers.
Quote from: willie warrior on January 16, 2015, 01:21:22 PM
How soon you forget Sultan. Posted last year a couple times to which you responded. No sense to hash that over. Since the phony one has moved on, I have also. BTW, how is the Buzzster doing these days?
That isn't true. Last year you never provided an explanation for why it benefited Buzz to supposedly "force" Duane to redshirt. You went on a rant that he owed the MU fanbase an explanation - even though everyone knew why. He was coming off an injury.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on January 16, 2015, 01:34:02 PM
That isn't true. Last year you never provided an explanation for why it benefited Buzz to supposedly "force" Duane to redshirt. You went on a rant that he owed the MU fanbase an explanation - even though everyone knew why. He was coming off an injury.
Typical slurper response.
I criticized Buzz for a lot of things last year but the Duane redshirt was not one of them.
Quote from: willie warrior on January 16, 2015, 01:21:22 PM
How soon you forget Sultan. Posted last year a couple times to which you responded. No sense to hash that over. Since the phony one has moved on, I have also. BTW, how is the Buzzster doing these days?
No, you never posted a reason - just stated it as a fact.
Quote from: willie warrior on January 16, 2015, 09:54:45 AM
Opinion, Sultan. If you believe that, that is your business. But Buzz did not do it with Duane's best interest in mind. Buzz already was in exit mode early in the year. But you keep fooling yourself about the integrity of the phony cowboy. After all, his integrity has shown itself really well: "I'll be at MU as long as they want me", and bad mouthing the BEast as he is headed out the door, are just a couple of examples of his downhome integrity.
You crack me up, Willie. Out of one side of you mouth comes the "fact" that the administration showed Buzz the door. Out of the other side comes the "fact" that Buzz deserted MU. That's a contradiction, Willie. Both "facts" can't be true. Even to the most irrational hater.
Quote from: Texas Western on January 15, 2015, 09:51:02 PM
I felt Steve came back too soon last year from his surgery. Would have preferred to see him redshirt, and take the year to get physically strong. It appears to me that he is damaged goods physically. I like him a lot and think he still has something to offer as a mid range jump shooter.
God, if only Steve had redshirted. McKay (a much, much better player) stays, we win a bunch more games last year (this year, too). Remember, Buzz was the one insisting Taylor was hurt. Steve said no, but he sure played like it. Still is.
In hindsight, Steve probably would have benefited from a redshirt. But that's the benefit of hindsight. Thank god we got Duane redshirtted instead of wasting a year of eligibility on a season that was going nowhere.
Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on January 16, 2015, 01:34:02 PM
That isn't true. Last year you never provided an explanation for why it benefited Buzz to supposedly "force" Duane to redshirt. You went on a rant that he owed the MU fanbase an explanation - even though everyone knew why. He was coming off an injury.
I've got the guy ignored, and even I know he never posted an explanation. just throwing sh it at the wall and hoping it sticks
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 16, 2015, 01:53:17 PM
God, if only Steve had redshirted. McKay (a much, much better player) stays, we win a bunch more games last year (this year, too). Remember, Buzz was the one insisting Taylor was hurt. Steve said no, but he sure played like it. Still is.
Over the years I have learned from experience that surgeries require not only the healing and basic rehab, but also another 3-4 more months of intense workouts to get back to the level of a high D-1 athlete. Coming back hurt is fools gold. Similarly,This is why I also think Luke needs to bite the bullet and get the surgery for his shoulder as soon as the season is over. If he does that he could be ready by the beginning of the season.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 16, 2015, 01:53:17 PM
God, if only Steve had redshirted. McKay (a much, much better player) stays, we win a bunch more games last year (this year, too). Remember, Buzz was the one insisting Taylor was hurt. Steve said no, but he sure played like it. Still is.
The irony is the staff wanted McKay to redshirt to bulk up, but he transferred so he could avoid that. The result is instead of sitting out one year here he sat out a year and a half in Ames. He leaves to avoid the redshirt and ends up sitting out longer than he would have if he stayed.
Definitely an "Oh what might have been" situation. Love a frontline of Luke, Juan, and McKay.
I don't get why more players don't redshirt. It's better for the team since you have more experienced players and a player is less likely to transfer, the player is better on the court and can get a masters off it, and it solves the freshman playing time issue while providing bodies in practice.
Quote from: martyconlonontherun on January 16, 2015, 10:12:48 PM
I don't get why more players don't redshirt. It's better for the team since you have more experienced players and a player is less likely to transfer, the player is better on the court and can get a masters off it, and it solves the freshman playing time issue while providing bodies in practice.
You are asking 18-year-olds to be rational and pragmatic.
They all think they will be stars, if not instantly, then maybe by midway through their freshman years. Many of them think they will go pro by the time they are through with their junior seasons, if not earlier. Many of them don't think for themselves, as they have many "advisers" in their ears.
Quote from: MU82 on January 16, 2015, 10:17:38 PM
You are asking 18-year-olds to be rational and pragmatic.
They all think they will be stars, if not instantly, then maybe by midway through their freshman years. Many of them think they will go pro by the time they are through with their junior seasons, if not earlier. Many of them don't think for themselves, as they have many "advisers" in their ears.
This
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 16, 2015, 08:06:28 PM
I've got the guy ignored, and even I know he never posted an explanation. just throwing sh it at the wall and hoping it sticks
Your definition of truth doesn't mean it is so. Sultan's either. Gas is gas, and plenty is thrown by the Buzz lovers to defend him. And if I am on ignore then you cannot know, if you have never read the posts. Some of the statements you people make are hilarious.
I did post a number of posts about Buzz's idiotic statements on Derrick, on the redshirt of Duane, and Buzz's other BS antics. Because they did not fit with Sultan and others love woody for Buzzster (who has thoroughly proven his phoniness to all who have an open mind), and it doesn't fit with their opinion of Buzz, they of course ignore it. Now some of you want to play that whole mess again.
Reading is fundamental. My opinions/explanations were posted, and I need not re-post so guys like Sultan can profess their smug imaginary Buzz propaganda in response. Go back and read the explanations if you are so interested. My guess is you won't. You would rather just spout.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 16, 2015, 01:53:17 PM
God, if only Steve had redshirted. McKay (a much, much better player) stays, we win a bunch more games last year (this year, too). Remember, Buzz was the one insisting Taylor was hurt. Steve said no, but he sure played like it. Still is.
Great point.
I found willie's reasoning why Buzz forced duane to redshirt. Yes, this is an actual quote from a different thread.
Quote from: willie warrior on September 23, 2014, 05:51:14 PM
Still like the Ostrich with the head in the sand. We could have Duane for the second half but he was forced to redshirt, so Buzz could play his butt boy, the elite one.
Steve is not a back to the basket power forward. Wojo needs to play him with Luke and Juan so he can be a face up shooter, either at the free throw line or the wide post with an occasional slip out to the perimeter for a three.
Even in high school he could defend the post but he was never a banger on offense. I know why Wojo starts the three point guards (best shooters, limit the fouls on MU's bigs) but in BE play, opponents are collapsing on Luke. MU really needs to improve its spacing on offense and open up the paint.
That said, his knee is near shot still. Joe Fulce-like career?
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on January 17, 2015, 09:34:14 AM
Steve is not a back to the basket power forward. Wojo needs to play him with Luke and Juan so he can be a face up shooter, either at the free throw line or the wide post with an occasional slip out to the perimeter for a three.
Even in high school he could defend the post but he was never a banger on offense. I know why Wojo starts the three point guards (best shooters, limit the fouls on MU's bigs) but in BE play, opponents are collapsing on Luke. MU really needs to improve its spacing on offense and open up the paint.
That said, his knee is near shot still. Joe Fulce-like career?
The problem is that Steve has shown no ability to being an effective face up shooter from anywhere (3 point line, free throw line, wing, baseline). His form looks good but he just doesn't make enough shots. Joe Fulce, OTOH, was a very good shooter - nearly automatic from the baseline.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on January 17, 2015, 10:02:12 AM
The problem is that Steve has shown no ability to being an effective face up shooter from anywhere (3 point line, free throw line, wing, baseline). His form looks good but he just doesn't make enough shots. Joe Fulce, OTOH, was a very good shooter - nearly automatic from the baseline.
Freshmen year where he was used more a flasher to the free throw line, he shot 53%. Last season he shot 32% and this he is shooting 43.7%. Except for Gtown last year, he was not being used like he was freshmen year...Burton was.
Granted, he is gimp, has a limited range of about 10-15 feet, but he is better facing the basket. More so, MU has major spacing issues in its offense. I contend a bigger line up helps open creases and shooter space for the guards or Juan/Sandy/JJJ at the 3. As it is, MU has three PG's in the game dribbling without a purpose up top waiting for a high pick by Luke late in the shot clock which also takes him out of his space of effectiveness.
If the ball is dumped to Luke, Steve can either flash the free throw line or circle around on the ball side for a face up look from Luke. Steve can also flair on the wide post off a guard's dribble drive for a spot up. Or you can swing him up top for the pick instead of Luke, even for a pick and pop. Instead, he is Luke's undersized back up with his back to the basket which he is neither healthy enough nor tall enough to be successful at (or talented enough for that role).
It was a stop gap move to start the season, I understand. Time for adjustments now to make him more effective in a very stuck in concrete offense.
Quote from: g0lden3agle on January 17, 2015, 09:21:01 AM
I found willie's reasoning why Buzz forced duane to redshirt. Yes, this is an actual quote from a different thread.
Only willie would use a phrase like "butt boy" and expect to be taken seriously.
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on January 17, 2015, 10:29:14 AM
Freshmen year where he was used more a flasher to the free throw line, he shot 53%. Last season he shot 32% and this he is shooting 43.7%. Except for Gtown last year, he was not being used like he was freshmen year...Burton was.
Granted, he is gimp, has a limited range of about 10-15 feet, but he is better facing the basket. More so, MU has major spacing issues in its offense. I contend a bigger line up helps open creases and shooter space for the guards or Juan/Sandy/JJJ at the 3. As it is, MU has three PG's in the game dribbling without a purpose up top waiting for a high pick by Luke late in the shot clock which also takes him out of his space of effectiveness.
If the ball is dumped to Luke, Steve can either flash the free throw line or circle around on the ball side for a face up look from Luke. Steve can also flair on the wide post off a guard's dribble drive for a spot up. Or you can swing him up top for the pick instead of Luke, even for a pick and pop. Instead, he is Luke's undersized back up with his back to the basket which he is neither healthy enough nor tall enough to be successful at (or talented enough for that role).
It was a stop gap move to start the season, I understand. Time for adjustments now to make him more effective in a very stuck in concrete offense.
+1. I think a lot of work has been done to make Steve a viable backup center out of necessity. Wojo needs to rebuild the rest of his game.
Quote from: jsglow on January 17, 2015, 12:02:10 PM
+1. I think a lot of work has been done to make Steve a viable backup center out of necessity. Wojo needs to rebuild the rest of his game.
Hate to say it, but my expectations for Steve have pretty much hit bottom. Really like the kid, think he's one of the more interesting characters on the team, but it's starting to seem like he can't bang, he can't jump, he can't hit layups, he can't hit the midrange, and he can't hit threes. He can still rebound a bit, and he is at least a body, but he's a long way from where he was as a freshman.
I would absolutely love to be wrong, but I think it's more likely that he just plays a lesser role as a senior than that the staff is able to rebuild his game and make him a solid contributor. Next year he'll be competing for minutes with Luke, Henry, Wally, Heldt, and anyone else we might bring in to play in the front court. He plays now because of necessity, but I can't see the need being nearly as big next year.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 19, 2015, 09:18:51 PM
Hate to say it, but my expectations for Steve have pretty much hit bottom. Really like the kid, think he's one of the more interesting characters on the team, but it's starting to seem like he can't bang, he can't jump, he can't hit layups, he can't hit the midrange, and he can't hit threes. He can still rebound a bit, and he is at least a body, but he's a long way from where he was as a freshman.
I would absolutely love to be wrong, but I think it's more likely that he just plays a lesser role as a senior than that the staff is able to rebuild his game and make him a solid contributor. Next year he'll be competing for minutes with Luke, Henry, Wally, Heldt, and anyone else we might bring in to play in the front court. He plays now because of necessity, but I can't see the need being nearly as big next year.
Agreed.
Unless Taylor experiences Juan-like improvement between his junior and senior seasons, he is destined for spot duty and garbage-time play.
Butt boy here
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 19, 2015, 09:18:51 PM
Hate to say it, but my expectations for Steve have pretty much hit bottom. Really like the kid, think he's one of the more interesting characters on the team, but it's starting to seem like he can't bang, he can't jump, he can't hit layups, he can't hit the midrange, and he can't hit threes. He can still rebound a bit, and he is at least a body, but he's a long way from where he was as a freshman.
I share your concerns, and feel bad for many of those limitations that are probably related to his knee.
But the thing about Steve's game that has frustrated me the most is a mental lapse that he has made repeatedly the past few games. One of our guards have been driving to the hoop, and when Steve's man steps up to double the driver, the guard will dump it down to Steve for what should be a wide-open layup. Unfortunately, Steve looks up to the hoop for the rebound as soon as the guard leaves the floor, instead of remaining ready for a possible pass. Turns an easy hoop (even for a guy with knee issues) into a TO. It's happened with Derrick, Matt and Duane as the driver.