MUScoop

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/att-acquires-directv-49b-deal

so dumb. when does this crap finally stop?

I'm sorry...what crap needs to stop?

Allowing large companies to merge and create dominant corporations.

Comcast/Time Warner. ATT/DirecTV. NBC/Universal. etc. etc

Quote from: jesmu84 on May 18, 2014, 04:41:52 PM
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/att-acquires-directv-49b-deal

so dumb. when does this crap finally stop?

(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-aIdeADyrR-M/TZaNArdDMXI/AAAAAAAAA58/RQa1ueU_7_w/s1600/Robber-Barons-Revisited.gif)


(http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQX3e5KXW3J9IEhcGlUyLFEQ-XzGiTYtip8CG2nfNik6-gy5kafog)

That's Chico beneath the anchor chain

Quote from: jesmu84 on May 18, 2014, 05:10:09 PM
Allowing large companies to merge and create dominant corporations.

Comcast/Time Warner. ATT/DirecTV. NBC/Universal. etc. etc

There is nothing wrong with big corporations...a long as they create a non-competitive environment. 

Yay for less choices, worse customer service and higher prices for everyone!

Honestly, if it wasn't for sports there would be no need for me to have a television provider

Quote from: MUsoxfan on May 18, 2014, 07:45:05 PM
Yay for less choices, worse customer service and higher prices for everyone!

Honestly, if it wasn't for sports there would be no need for me to have a television provider

Lots of people, even on Scoop, like these weird little shows like breaking bread and the throne game. Eventually perhaps some web-delivered shows take off and people get away from cable... but, it's up to the masses and they feed on whatever's put in front of them.. so, may take awhile.

Was chicos talk about moving away from California based in part on this transaction?

All the shows you speak of are streamed on services like Netflix and Amazon Prime

I know the networks rely on ad revenue to produce these shows, but it's getting to be prohibitively expensive to have a television provider. Too many people can't afford to pay $200+ per month to watch TV and surf the internet

Quote from: Jay Bee on May 18, 2014, 07:52:34 PM
Lots of people, even on Scoop, like these weird little shows like breaking bread and the throne game. Eventually perhaps some web-delivered shows take off and people get away from cable... but, it's up to the masses and they feed on whatever's put in front of them.. so, may take awhile.

Was chicos talk about moving away from California based in part on this transaction?

I don't think Chico's is going anywhere.  He has said he is moving for the better part of a decade now.  I think deep down he really likes all that CA has to offer. 

Quote from: MUsoxfan on May 18, 2014, 08:48:54 PM
All the shows you speak of are streamed on services like Netflix and Amazon Prime

HBO shows will, currently and in the foreseeable future, never be available on any steaming service other than the HBO Go app. They are however available for free on other websites.

Quote from: jesmu84 on May 18, 2014, 04:41:52 PM
http://bigstory.ap.org/article/att-acquires-directv-49b-deal

so dumb. when does this crap finally stop?

Only when total control of the Internet is complete. It's all about control of the pipes. As long as there is YouTube, Netflix Google, etc., the Comcasts and ATTs of the world will continue to create a monopoly to control them.

Quote from: brandx on May 18, 2014, 11:23:17 PM
Only when total control of the Internet is complete. It's all about control of the pipes. As long as there is YouTube, Netflix Google, etc., the Comcasts and ATTs of the world will continue to create a monopoly to control them.

COMPLETE SHOCK that the head of the FCC (and former Comcast lobbyist) voted against giving ISPs Common Carrier status.

Chicos can you lower my cell phone bill now bro?

Interesting that Chicos spent all last week telling us about he enjoyed driving a pick-up truck.  Then DTV gets bought by a Texas based company.  What did Chicos know?  And when did he know it?

Maybe BJ can chime in when buy these stocks, aina?

Quote from: MUsoxfan on May 18, 2014, 08:48:54 PM
All the shows you speak of are streamed on services like Netflix and Amazon Prime

I know the networks rely on ad revenue to produce these shows, but it's getting to be prohibitively expensive to have a television provider. Too many people can't afford to pay $200+ per month to watch TV and surf the internet

Every time I check out movie reviews on Amazon, I am amazed at how behind the game I am, and I'm in my 20's. It seems like every post is talking about how they downloaded the movie on Amazon Prime or watched it on Netflix. Everyone in America is moving to these devices.

I haven't had cable since I lived with my parents. The baby boomers are the only people keeping the cable companies in business. Massive changes coming in 20 years as they begin to die out.

Quote from: Jay Bee on May 18, 2014, 07:52:34 PM
Lots of people, even on Scoop, like these weird little shows like breaking bread and the throne game. Eventually perhaps some web-delivered shows take off and people get away from cable... but, it's up to the masses and they feed on whatever's put in front of them.. so, may take awhile.

Was chicos talk about moving away from California based in part on this transaction?

Uhhh Netflix? My problem with moving away from cable stems 100% entirely from keeping the 24-hour cable news and and sports channels.

Quote from: SoCalEagle on May 18, 2014, 10:22:58 PM
I don't think Chico's is going anywhere.  He has said he is moving for the better part of a decade now.  I think deep down he really likes all that CA has to offer. 

A moving van won't make Chico happy. He needs a time machine.

Quote from: Aughnanure on May 19, 2014, 10:36:32 AM
Uhhh Netflix? My problem with moving away from cable stems 100% entirely from keeping the 24-hour cable news and and sports channels.

Trust me, after a month you won't miss either one.

Quote from: Jajuannaman on May 19, 2014, 11:20:01 AM
Trust me, after a month you won't miss either one.

Here, here. I've been TV free since 1 March and haven't thought twice about it. I was going to wait for the NCAA Tournament but Bert's Tank Job accelerated my cutting the cord.

Quote from: Jajuannaman on May 19, 2014, 11:20:01 AM
Trust me, after a month you won't miss either one.

+1

I am the definition of a news junkie, and I haven't seen a 30 minute cable news program in 10+ years. The demographics for all those channels (including Fox) is terrible. 60+ year old geezers. No thanks.

And sports alone isn't enough for me to justify the costs.

But the real kicker is that so much of today's programming is just pure garbage. 1/3-1/2 of a show is commercials. Awful sitcoms/dramas about the same damn topics (cops/doctors). Entire networks that are 100% product placement (HGTV).

I'll happily watch Breaking Bad on DVD or Netflix, etc.

So no one cares about watching the NBA or NHL playoffs?  Or your local baseball team?

I pay $185 / month for my bundle.  What do you cord cutters play for your stand along internet?

Quote from: The Lens on May 19, 2014, 11:44:36 AM
So no one cares about watching the NBA or NHL playoffs?  Or your local baseball team?

I pay $185 / month for my bundle.  What do you cord cutters play for your stand along internet?

$30/mo. For about 3 years I was paying $25. I pay separately about $75/mo. for my cell phone bill. That's outrageous enough.

I wonder if there has been some trade off between cell phone and internet for cord cutters. If I had to pay more than probably $40/mo. I would very tempted just to use my cell phone at home. Only draw back is when I need to do major work-work at home.

Quote from: warrior07 on May 19, 2014, 11:49:31 AM
$30/mo. For about 3 years I was paying $25. I pay separately about $75/mo. for my cell phone bill. That's outrageous enough.

I wonder if there has been some trade off between cell phone and internet for cord cutters. If I had to pay more than probably $40/mo. I would very tempted just to use my cell phone at home. Only draw back is when I need to do major work-work at home.

Have you considered using your cell phone as a wifi hotspot?

I assume you have unlimited data on your cellular plan.

Quote from: Hards_Alumni on May 19, 2014, 12:08:11 PM
Have you considered using your cell phone as a wifi hotspot?

I assume you have unlimited data on your cellular plan.

Yes. That's kind of my thinking if I ever had to pay for more. Maybe I should do it anyway. It seems like it might be a hassle to set up and I'm not sure I want to rely on it if I'm calling in to a meeting from home.

I recently switched my cellphone package on AT&T to one based on a dataplan rather than minutes and they reduced my bill even further when I got this gizmo from them.  It's like an "extra mobile phone" except you can't make or receive calls with it, but you can connect anything via Wifi to it.  It even has a meter on it so you can see how much data used during the billing month so you avoid going over plan.  My kids are happy because they can connect their iPods in the car now and I've connected my laptop to it.

Quote from: warrior07 on May 19, 2014, 12:17:43 PM
Yes. That's kind of my thinking if I ever had to pay for more. Maybe I should do it anyway. It seems like it might be a hassle to set up and I'm not sure I want to rely on it if I'm calling in to a meeting from home.

My FIL uses his cell phone hotspot as his way of using the internet.  I guess a lot of it depends on your connectivity.  4G?  Reliable connection... that sort of thing.

Quote from: The Lens on May 19, 2014, 11:44:36 AM
So no one cares about watching the NBA or NHL playoffs?  Or your local baseball team?

I pay $185 / month for my bundle.  What do you cord cutters play for your stand along internet?

My CPA pays the routine household bills but I think it's around $30 a month. Cutting the cord was not an economic decision though I was becoming concerned about the political and social ramifications of sky rocketing costs. A lot of sports programming, for instance, is now found on pay tv and is therefore inaccessible for many in this once great Republic.

I cut the cord because I would rather read than watch tv. The vast majority of programming, including the news channels, is crap. All anyone needs to keep fully informed is right here:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world/

Well clearly Chicos approved it, you will recall he owns directv

Quote from: SoCalEagle on May 18, 2014, 10:22:58 PM
I don't think Chico's is going anywhere.  He has said he is moving for the better part of a decade now.  I think deep down he really likes all that CA has to offer. 

Wow... you know it's a dark day at DTV HQ when Chicos isn't even bothering to be creative with his shadow avatar names anymore.

Quote from: The Lens on May 19, 2014, 11:44:36 AM
So no one cares about watching the NBA or NHL playoffs?  Or your local baseball team?

I pay $185 / month for my bundle.  What do you cord cutters play for your stand along internet?

$45/mo. + $8/mo Netflix + $8 Hulu + $99/yr (at renewal) Amazon Prime + $125/yr MLB.tv + $100/mo iPhone talk/data.

Works out to the same ~ $180/mo.; however, my "cable package" includes a cell phone and 2-day shipping.

Quote from: Benny B on May 19, 2014, 02:06:29 PM
$45/mo. + $8/mo Netflix + $8 Hulu + $99/yr (at renewal) Amazon Prime + $125/yr MLB.tv + $100/mo iPhone talk/data.

Works out to the same ~ $180/mo.; however, my "cable package" includes a cell phone and 2-day shipping.

My problem is I live in market.  I'm a MLB.tv sub too but I can't watch any Brewers games when I'm in MKE (where I live).  If I lived in Chicago, I would be much more apt to try that. 

College football, NBA playoffs, MU hoops and Brewer baseball makes it really tough for me to cord cut.

http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Cable-Prices-Have-Risen-Four-Times-the-Price-of-Inflation-129012

Another shock. I'm guessing this is Comcast's business model: "Quick! Siphon as much $ as possible out of boomer generation before they're gone. Next, spend that money on lobbyists to ensure continued control over internet service because that's where TV is headed. Finally, use the absence of net neutrality to gouge TV content providers. Yay!"

Quote from: River rat on May 19, 2014, 01:35:21 PM
Well clearly Chicos approved it, you will recall he owns directv

You were called out by just about everyone here the last time you went down this path. 

Refresher

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=42055.25

Quote from: jesmu84 on May 19, 2014, 08:33:17 PM
http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Cable-Prices-Have-Risen-Four-Times-the-Price-of-Inflation-129012

Another shock. I'm guessing this is Comcast's business model: "Quick! Siphon as much $ as possible out of boomer generation before they're gone. Next, spend that money on lobbyists to ensure continued control over internet service because that's where TV is headed. Finally, use the absence of net neutrality to gouge TV content providers. Yay!"

That first part is every companies' business model right now.

Quote from: SoCalEagle on May 18, 2014, 10:22:58 PM
I don't think Chico's is going anywhere.  He has said he is moving for the better part of a decade now.  I think deep down he really likes all that CA has to offer.  

LOL.  As explained earlier, certain familial things have made that difficult...death of wife's mother, death of wife's brother, kids schooling, etc. 

Quote from: Benny B on May 19, 2014, 02:01:28 PM
Wow... you know it's a dark day at DTV HQ when Chicos isn't even bothering to be creative with his shadow avatar names anymore.

????  SoCalEagle is a moderator here.

Quote from: jesmu84 on May 19, 2014, 08:33:17 PM
http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Cable-Prices-Have-Risen-Four-Times-the-Price-of-Inflation-129012

Programming costs have risen close to 7 times the price of inflation.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 19, 2014, 09:28:22 PM
????  SoCalEagle is a moderator here.

socalwarrior is the moderator.

SoCalEagle is hoopaloop's mailman.

Quote from: ZiggysFryBoy on May 19, 2014, 09:39:56 PM
socalwarrior is the moderator.

SoCalEagle is hoopaloop's mailman.

And he always rings twice...


(http://images.moviepostershop.com/the-postman-always-rings-twice-movie-poster-1981-1010206855.jpg)

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 19, 2014, 09:29:24 PM
Programming costs have risen close to 7 times the price of inflation.

And.... the whole Dodger/Time Warner deal may end up being the straw that broke the camel's back. It may very well be the 1st huge blow for the a la carte model.

Quote from: brandx on May 20, 2014, 12:44:50 AM
And.... the whole Dodger/Time Warner deal may end up being the straw that broke the camel's back. It may very well be the 1st huge blow for the a la carte model.

That's awful large for a "straw," even a proverbial one.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 19, 2014, 09:27:50 PM
LOL.  As explained earlier, certain familial things have made that difficult...death of wife's mother, death of wife's brother, kids schooling, etc. 

Who knows, maybe if you stay around long enough things will change for the better. You'll probably end up staying in CA after all. Could happen ...

My problem is that I actually like to watch good stuff on TV.

I have never seen one second of one reality TV show and I haven't watched any college football bowl game for nearly a decade.

But I love playoff basketball and hockey, enjoy watching the NFL and college hoops, like being able to watch baseball, and thoroughly enjoy the best shows on HBO, SHO, AMC and FX. And I don't want to watch Breaking Bad 2 years after it's over; I want to watch each new episode that night (or at least that week)!

So to me, it's about entertainment choices, like going to the movies or a sporting event or reading or just taking long walks with my wife and dog (which have the best price - $0).

I will say that I would rather drop $85 for a month of TV than go to one big-arena concert or NFL game.

I admire those who can cut the cord. I have tried but I have missed it too much. Maybe in the not-too-distant future I'll figure out a way to cut the cord and still be able to watch stuff I enjoy when I want to watch it.

Quote from: MU82 on May 20, 2014, 10:38:50 AM
My problem is that I actually like to watch good stuff on TV.

I have never seen one second of one reality TV show and I haven't watched any college football bowl game for nearly a decade.

But I love playoff basketball and hockey, enjoy watching the NFL and college hoops, like being able to watch baseball, and thoroughly enjoy the best shows on HBO, SHO, AMC and FX. And I don't want to watch Breaking Bad 2 years after it's over; I want to watch each new episode that night (or at least that week)!

So to me, it's about entertainment choices, like going to the movies or a sporting event or reading or just taking long walks with my wife and dog (which have the best price - $0).

I will say that I would rather drop $85 for a month of TV than go to one big-arena concert or NFL game.

I admire those who can cut the cord. I have tried but I have missed it too much. Maybe in the not-too-distant future I'll figure out a way to cut the cord and still be able to watch stuff I enjoy when I want to watch it.

Same here. If it wasn't for the Sports channels, tho', I would cut cable. No interest in "News" shows or anything on network TV. Enjoy watching the sports I played my whole life - baseball, basketball, football, golf. Don't watch a minute of the NHL during the regular season, but make up for it during the playoffs.

I wouldn't mind waiting 8 months and watching the HBO, Showtime, AMC, FX, etc. shows over the course of a few days. Kinda like reading a book when you can watch 10 - 12 hours of a show in a few sittings.

If and when Sports go a la carte, cable is gone. But I'm sure there are millions that feel the same way, so until the contract holders can recoup their money without all-or-nothing cable deals with customers, we are stuck.

Quote from: brandx on May 20, 2014, 12:44:50 AM
And.... the whole Dodger/Time Warner deal may end up being the straw that broke the camel's back. It may very well be the 1st huge blow for the a la carte model.

How so, please explain

Quote from: SoCalEagle on May 20, 2014, 01:33:14 AM
Who knows, maybe if you stay around long enough things will change for the better. You'll probably end up staying in CA after all. Could happen ...

Things were better in the 1970's and 1980's here, that's why so many people have moved out and why so many companies have.  Based on the trends, very unlikely to get better.  Smart money left...

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 20, 2014, 11:57:42 AM
Things were better in the 1970's and 1980's here, that's why so many people have moved out and why so many companies have.  Based on the trends, very unlikely to get better.  Smart money left...

Ahem.... California is the 8th largest economy in the WORLD.

Quote from: brandx on May 20, 2014, 12:26:54 PM
Ahem.... California is the 8th largest economy in the WORLD.

Yup, it was as high as #5 in the 1980's and 90's.  It reached it's highest share level of the total US GDP in 1992 at 13.8% and then declined below 12% during the 1990's...it has since been flat for the last 13 years.   Progress.  Forward. 

Then you look at GDP growth since 2008....California...WE'RE #44, WE'RE #44 with a negative GDP growth.  Woohoo.  Texas #2, by the way.  On a per capita level, even worse.


http://www.bloomberg.com/visual-data/best-and-worst/highest-gdp-growth-states

Chicos, do you thinks the Feds will approve this merger/sale?

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 20, 2014, 01:33:46 PM
Yup, it was as high as #5 in the 1980's and 90's.  It reached it's highest share level of the total US GDP in 1992 at 13.8% and then declined below 12% during the 1990's...it has since been flat for the last 13 years.   Progress.  Forward.  

Then you look at GDP growth since 2008....California...WE'RE #44, WE'RE #44 with a negative GDP growth.  Woohoo.  Texas #2, by the way.  On a per capita level, even worse.


http://www.bloomberg.com/visual-data/best-and-worst/highest-gdp-growth-states

All that list tells you is which states are benifiting the most from fossil fuel.
1, 2, 5 & 6 have the benefit of big oil to inflate their statistics while # 4 (despite it's decline due to fracked natural gas) has coal.

Quote from: MU Fan in Connecticut on May 20, 2014, 02:01:18 PM
All that list tells you is which states are benifiting the most from fossil fuel.
1, 2, 5 & 6 have the benefit of big oil to inflate their statistics while # 4 (despite it's decline due to fracked natural gas) has coal.

Texas has had oil for decades. Why wasn't it #2 40 years ago?

I think if you stripped out "big oil" you'd see the same results. But, yes, oil is a large industry.

Quote from: muwarrior69 on May 20, 2014, 02:00:44 PM
Chicos, do you thinks the Feds will approve this merger/sale?

I have no comment, I just read what various experts are saying in the news.

Quote from: keefe on May 19, 2014, 01:07:12 PM
All anyone needs to keep fully informed is right here:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world/

+1. Love the BBC

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 20, 2014, 05:46:35 PM
I have no comment but to day I only read what various experts are saying in the news.

What are they saying? In the ATT-TMO deal I knew from meeting one with the DoJ crew that it was a steep, uphill battle. Yours is a different play than ours was but the same economic and social policy implications are operative. I'm curious how this will play out. Under Bush it's a slam dunk but the guy now sitting in the office without corners has a different view. 

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 20, 2014, 01:33:46 PM
Yup, it was as high as #5 in the 1980's and 90's.  It reached it's highest share level of the total US GDP in 1992 at 13.8% and then declined below 12% during the 1990's...it has since been flat for the last 13 years.   Progress.  Forward. 

Then you look at GDP growth since 2008....California...WE'RE #44, WE'RE #44 with a negative GDP growth.  Woohoo.  Texas #2, by the way.  On a per capita level, even worse.


http://www.bloomberg.com/visual-data/best-and-worst/highest-gdp-growth-states

Oh, so you want to move to a state with high GDP growth? Have fun in North Dakota.

Seriously, chicos, aren't there other things besides GDP and taxes when considering where to live and raise a family. Never mind, I guess you answered that question by choosing to stay in CA all these years.

Quote from: SoCalEagle on May 21, 2014, 05:41:25 PM

Seriously, chicos, aren't there other things besides GDP and taxes when considering where to live and raise a family.

Mountains and water. That's all a man needs other than the love of a good woman.

Quote from: keefe on May 21, 2014, 06:43:52 PM
Mountains and water. That's all a man needs other than the love of a good woman.

I'd say desert, water, and a good women.

Mountains probably sound a lot better to you after time in the Mideast

Quote from: Bleuteaux on May 20, 2014, 05:53:04 PM
+1. Love the BBC

The bar on North Ave? They have a decent atmosphere, but after falling for the "quarter glued to the floor" trick for the third time I'm not sure I can go back.

Quote from: SoCalEagle on May 21, 2014, 05:41:25 PM
Oh, so you want to move to a state with high GDP growth? Have fun in North Dakota.

Seriously, chicos, aren't there other things besides GDP and taxes when considering where to live and raise a family. Never mind, I guess you answered that question by choosing to stay in CA all these years.

::)

Again, I told you why we stayed.  My wife got sick with our second child, later her mom got Alzheimer's and died, her brother got cancer and died, my daughter got sick and for the first few years we wanted her treated at the Children's Hospital that she was diagnosed at. 

Are there reasons other than taxes and GDP?  Of course.  Quality of life?  It's outrageously expensive in California, especially when your wife doesn't work.  Traffic commute.  A gov't that believes in not following the laws of the state to the detriment of the citizens that do.  Companies and people leaving left and right.  A state underwater by trillions due to pension liability, school system that has totally crumbled the last few decades.  Yes, all kinds of reasons.  I could go on and on and on.  That's exactly why so many people have left.  I would have, but other things out of my control kept me here.  That is now finally changing.

Not sure why this is so hard to process, I really don't.  In all the years I have been on this earth, I have spent about half of them in California, but half of those years were not of my choosing as I was a kid.  The future for my wife and I will not be here.  I will follow those of friends and family that left and have never looked back.  Smart people.

I just wish I could be around for the $33 billion  $65 billion $70.7 billion   $90.5 billion  now back to $68.5 billion bullet    train that will make the Los Angeles to San Francisco trip in 2 hours 40 minutes  3 hours 15 minutes  3 hours 35 minutes trip that will cost a consumer less more than a plane trip that is 1/3 the time.  Brilliant.

Quote from: brandx on May 21, 2014, 08:11:31 PM
I'd say desert, water, and a good women.

Mountains probably sound a lot better to you after time in the Mideast

One of my favorite writers is Edward Abbey. Abbey spent all of his adult life in the four corners area and lived in some of my favorite places - Moab and Taos. Abbey's Desert Solitaire is a captivating read. I would compare it to Aldo Leopold's A Sand County Almanac which is about Wisconsin.

My family has had a place in northern NM for several generations and all of us grew up with an appreciation for the high desert chaparral in the shadow of the Sangre de Cristos. After 6 deployments to the sandbox I am really much more interested these days in seeing vast expanses of water. Still, as much as I love the PNW, my favorite spot in North America is northern NM.

Quote from: keefe on May 21, 2014, 08:32:04 PM
One of my favorite writers is Edward Abbey. Abbey spent all of his adult life in the four corners area and lived in some of my favorite places - Moab and Taos. Abbey's Desert Solitaire is a captivating read. I would compare it to Aldo Leopold's A Sand County Almanac which is about Wisconsin.

My family has had a place in northern NM for several generations and all of us grew up with an appreciation for the high desert chaparral in the shadow of the Sangre de Cristos. After 6 deployments to the sandbox I am really much more interested these days in seeing vast expanses of water. Still, as much as I love the PNW, my favorite spot in North America is northern NM.

I own every Abbey book. My wife has read Desert Solitaire several times. And you're right about Moab. That is our 1st stop off whenever we are in Utah. From there we will hit NM, Lake Powell, etc. The southern section of Canyonlands is outstanding, as well. Just an absolutely stunning landscape throughout southern Utah and northern NM.

Quote from: brandx on May 21, 2014, 10:33:47 PM
I own every Abbey book. My wife has read Desert Solitaire several times. And you're right about Moab. That is our 1st stop off whenever we are in Utah. From there we will hit NM, Lake Powell, etc. The southern section of Canyonlands is outstanding, as well. Just an absolutely stunning landscape throughout southern Utah and northern NM.

Moab is a a great playground that is fun year round. And Arches is majestic. My watering hole of choice there is Woody's. Woody's has a famous bar - it's an enormous 100+ year old solid block of wood that runs the length of the room. People, some famous and more infamous, have carved their names in it since it first supported malted beverages. 

But the most transcendent place in North America is Taos at sunrise. Words cannot capture the magnificence. It is awe-inspiring.

Quote from: keefe on May 21, 2014, 08:32:04 PM
One of my favorite writers is Edward Abbey. Abbey spent all of his adult life in the four corners area and lived in some of my favorite places - Moab and Taos. Abbey's Desert Solitaire is a captivating read. I would compare it to Aldo Leopold's A Sand County Almanac which is about Wisconsin.

My family has had a place in northern NM for several generations and all of us grew up with an appreciation for the high desert chaparral in the shadow of the Sangre de Cristos. After 6 deployments to the sandbox I am really much more interested these days in seeing vast expanses of water. Still, as much as I love the PNW, my favorite spot in North America is northern NM.

Yeah, but how's the GDP growth. According to chicos you should spend more time in North Dakota. That's the place to be!!

Quote from: SoCalEagle on May 22, 2014, 12:05:31 AM
Yeah, but how's the GDP growth. According to chicos you should spend more time in North Dakota. That's the place to be!!

Definitely more freedoms there, get to do more with your money, more of an independent lifestyle.  The weather would not be great, though I can say that about a lot of places I've spent winters in.

Seems many folks are thinking it is a decent place to go.  Tops in the nation in population growth the last 2 years and an unemployment rate of 2.6%. 

Now the second largest oil producing state in the USA, behind only Texas.  Median HH incomes increased the highest of anywhere in the country.

Good for North Dakota.  Well done.  A shining star.  Cashing in on those natural resources...fine by me.

Quote from: SoCalEagle on May 22, 2014, 12:05:31 AM
North Dakota. That's the place to be!!

North Dakota is Green Acres!

(http://www.maggiore.net/greenacres/images/Anim_Homepage.gif)

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 22, 2014, 12:29:12 AM
Definitely more freedoms there, get to do more with your money, more of an independent lifestyle.  The weather would not be great, though I can say that about a lot of places I've spent winters in.

Seems many folks are thinking it is a decent place to go.  Tops in the nation in population growth the last 2 years and an unemployment rate of 2.6%. 

Now the second largest oil producing state in the USA, behind only Texas.  Median HH incomes increased the highest of anywhere in the country.

Good for North Dakota.  Well done.  A shining star.  Cashing in on those natural resources...fine by me.

The GDP rise is all because of fracked oil and only oil.  Nothing else is driving the growth.  National Geographic had a great article on this (sometime in the last 12 months).  Apartment rents if you can find one are higher than major cities. 

Quote from: keefe on May 21, 2014, 06:43:52 PM
Mountains and water. That's all a woman needs other than the love of a good woman.

FIFY.

Quote from: MU Fan in Connecticut on May 22, 2014, 07:15:19 AM
The GDP rise is all because of fracked oil and only oil.  Nothing else is driving the growth.  National Geographic had a great article on this (sometime in the last 12 months).  Apartment rents if you can find one are higher than major cities. 

yup, and the oil reserves there should last upwards of 280 years if not longer.  Opportunities for many people.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on May 22, 2014, 09:40:23 AM
yup, and the oil reserves there should last upwards of 280 years if not longer.  Opportunities for many people.

Including the downside, sexual assault and domestic violence is way up,  drunk driving is way up, high school dropout rates are way up...

Not picking on you CBB,  and not saying that they shouldn't drill,  but sad that many communities have not yet invested in services that would deal with the downsides of these types booms.

Nightlife in the Dakota's is great. The Corn Palace absolutely rocks every Saturday til 10 pm.

Quote from: reinko on May 22, 2014, 11:22:07 AM
Including the downside, sexual assault and domestic violence is way up,  drunk driving is way up, high school dropout rates are way up...

Not picking on you CBB,  and not saying that they shouldn't drill,  but sad that many communities have not yet invested in services that would deal with the downsides of these types booms.

No profit to be made there.

Quote from: brandx on May 22, 2014, 11:45:36 AM
Nightlife in the Dakota's is great. The Corn Palace absolutely rocks every Saturday til 10 pm.

We are working with an alternative fuels institute in ND and some of the staff have related that a huge problem from fracking is that droves of men have moved there and thrown the male:female ratio way off balance.

I have read where the practice of killing female babies in China has created significant social problems for the same reason.

Quote from: keefe on May 22, 2014, 11:51:15 AM
I have read where the practice of killing female babies in China has created significant social problems for the same reason.

I wonder if India or China are worse on this. A colleague from India told me that his daughter was the first female in his family in like 3-4 generations. (I assume he means up the paternity side.) He also said that it's illegal for a doctor to tell the parents the sex of their child, so they didn't even know until she was born, because sex-selective abortion is that problematic.

North Dakota is an awful place to live. I had family there for a while.

The oil towns are occupied by trailers full of men, the men to women ratio approaches 4:1, there's nothing to do, the weather is miserable, and its no place to raise a family.

There's one reason to go there, and that's money.

Quote from: Bleuteaux on May 22, 2014, 03:23:05 PM
North Dakota is an awful place to live. I had family there for a while.

The oil towns are occupied by trailers full of men, the men to women ratio approaches 4:1, there's nothing to do, the weather is miserable, and its no place to raise a family.

There's one reason to go there, and that's money.

Idaho has the Aryan Nation and North Dakota is essentially a trailer park for men. I can see why a guy would want to escape California for that!

Quote from: brandx on May 22, 2014, 11:45:36 AM
Nightlife in the Dakota's is great. The Corn Palace absolutely rocks every Saturday til 10 pm.

Corn palace is in mitchell, SD.

ZFB's mineral rights are in ND.

Quote from: Lennys Tap on May 22, 2014, 03:30:57 PM
Idaho has the Aryan Nation and North Dakota is essentially a trailer park for men. I can see why a guy would want to escape California for that!

Lenny

There are parts of Idaho that every Scooper should avoid unless you are a Skinhead or a Mo. However, there are parts of Idaho and Montana that are spectacular.

Quote from: keefe on May 22, 2014, 03:47:13 PM
Lenny

There are parts of Idaho that every Scooper should avoid unless you are a Skinhead or a Mo. However, there are parts of Idaho and Montana that are spectacular.

Northern Idaho is fantastic. I've never left the panhandle but Coeur d'Alene is one of the most beautiful areas in the country. Sandpoint is great too.

Quote from: Bleuteaux on May 22, 2014, 03:50:13 PM
Northern Idaho is fantastic. I've never left the panhandle but Coeur d'Alene is one of the most beautiful areas in the country. Sandpoint is great too.

People are amazed that Few enjoys his life in Spokane but as you correctly point out, the Inland Empire is incredibly beautiful. If you love the outdoors it is tough to find a better place to live than the Coeur d'Alene region.

Quote from: Lennys Tap on May 22, 2014, 03:30:57 PM
Idaho has the Aryan Nation and North Dakota is essentially a trailer park for men. I can see why a guy would want to escape California for that!

Come live here in Calif, they would love to have you and you can help put a dent in the emigration numbers.

Every state has their downside, but I'll bet the world there are more trailer parks in Calif and more racist supremacists than anywhere else in the states, just do to population.

Quote from: keefe on May 22, 2014, 03:47:13 PM
Lenny

There are parts of Idaho that every Scooper should avoid unless you are a Skinhead or a Mo. However, there are parts of Idaho and Montana that are spectacular.

+ 500 for both Montana and Idaho

Quote from: Bleuteaux on May 22, 2014, 03:23:05 PM
North Dakota is an awful place to live. I had family there for a while.

The oil towns are occupied by trailers full of men, the men to women ratio approaches 4:1, there's nothing to do, the weather is miserable, and its no place to raise a family.

There's one reason to go there, and that's money.

But GNP....

Quote from: Bleuteaux on May 22, 2014, 03:23:05 PM
North Dakota is an awful place to live. I had family there for a while.

The oil towns are occupied by trailers full of men, the men to women ratio approaches 4:1, there's nothing to do, the weather is miserable, and its no place to raise a family.

There's one reason to go there, and that's money.

That was what Oklahoma and Iowa were once upon a time as well.

Quote from: keefe on May 22, 2014, 03:56:53 PM
People are amazed that Few enjoys his life in Spokane but as you correctly point out, the Inland Empire is incredibly beautiful. If you love the outdoors it is tough to find a better place to live than the Coeur d'Alene region.

I'm not amazed at all. Few has it made.

He's paid big money to coach at a place that's relatively off the grid. Of course he is expected to win, but that's relative ... nobody expects Gonzaga to contend for the Elite 8 every year.

He basically is the king of his own little country there. Frankly, I'd be amazed if he ever leaves.

Quote from: MU82 on May 22, 2014, 08:08:34 PM
I'm not amazed at all. Few has it made.

He's paid big money to coach at a place that's relatively off the grid. Of course he is expected to win, but that's relative ... nobody expects Gonzaga to contend for the Elite 8 every year.

He basically is the king of his own little country there. Frankly, I'd be amazed if he ever leaves.

From what I'm told he has not intention to ever leave. He and his wife Marcy have it made in Spokane and at GU.

http://seattletimes.com/html/sports/2002859771_few12.html?SPID=12965&DB_OEM_ID=3350

Quote from: warrior07 on May 22, 2014, 12:18:37 PM
I wonder if India or China are worse on this. A colleague from India told me that his daughter was the first female in his family in like 3-4 generations. (I assume he means up the paternity side.) He also said that it's illegal for a doctor to tell the parents the sex of their child, so they didn't even know until she was born, because sex-selective abortion is that problematic.

My babysitter is Indian.  She says it's not just in-utero sex-determination that's illegal, ultrasounds (presumably just for pregnant women) are illegal.  She has mentioned numerous times that she's glad her three granddaughters were born in the US, which I've always interpreted as being more than just for reasons of opportunity and prosperity.

Quote from: warrior07 on May 22, 2014, 12:18:37 PM
I wonder if India or China are worse on this. A colleague from India told me that his daughter was the first female in his family in like 3-4 generations. (I assume he means up the paternity side.) He also said that it's illegal for a doctor to tell the parents the sex of their child, so they didn't even know until she was born, because sex-selective abortion is that problematic.

China is much worse due to the one child policy. Because sons care for the parents in old age having a son is imperative from a social policy standpoint. But beyond the merely mercenary, sons carry on the name and a whole host of other cultural imperatives. Having a daughter effectively ends your line.

Nursing homes are non-existent in Asia. In Japan, women are now avoiding marrying oldest sons because they know that means caring for their in-laws. Since Japanese have one of the longest life-spans this can be a decades long proposition.

Quote from: Benny B on May 23, 2014, 02:13:06 PM
My babysitter is Indian.  She says it's not just in-utero sex-determination that's illegal, ultrasounds (presumably just for pregnant women) are illegal.  She has mentioned numerous times that she's glad her three granddaughters were born in the US, which I've always interpreted as being more than just for reasons of opportunity and prosperity.

Thought you were talking about Redskins 'til I read the 2nd sentence  :-\

Quote from: Benny B on May 23, 2014, 02:13:06 PM
My babysitter is Indian. 

Why do you have a babysitter or is this a Forum Letters segue?

Guys, guys... Mergers always work out for consumers

(http://i.imgur.com/hTnfTkG.jpg)

Of course this chart conveniently ignores all of the bank start-ups, and the other banking options, that are out there.  For instance, there are about 250 banks and 175 credit unions in the state of Wisconsin.  You don't have to use a big bank if you don't want to.

Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on May 30, 2014, 09:06:24 AM
Of course this chart conveniently ignores all of the bank start-ups, and the other banking options, that are out there.  For instance, there are about 250 banks and 175 credit unions in the state of Wisconsin.  You don't have to use a big bank if you don't want to.

True. but how much influence do those start-ups have? And, how much will they ever really have?

Once the big ones are at the top, they can change the rules of the game so they stay there.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/2303080/bill-would-prohibit-fcc-from-reclassifying-broadband-as-utility.html

I hope Mr. Latta enjoys his future job as a Comcast exec.

Quote from: jesmu84 on May 30, 2014, 09:14:47 AM
True. but how much influence do those start-ups have? And, how much will they ever really have?

Once the big ones are at the top, they can change the rules of the game so they stay there.

This is true, and it's why the process of regulation will rarely serve the general consumer. Regulations are designed by monopolists for the little people so that they do not become big people.

Quote from: jesmu84 on May 30, 2014, 09:14:47 AM
True. but how much influence do those start-ups have? And, how much will they ever really have?

Once the big ones are at the top, they can change the rules of the game so they stay there.

What influence are you talking about?  What rules have they changed?  I do all my banking at a bank that exists in about five counties.  They were the cheapest interest-rate wise for my mortgage, zeroed out pretty much all fees since we have a mortgage there, and offer everything I need from an internet banking standpoint.  

The issue with bank consolidation is probably felt much more on the commercial side than on the consumer side.  But most of the time that consumers get screwed by big banks, is because they don't shop around.

Quote from: The Sultan of Sunshine on May 30, 2014, 09:21:17 AM

What influence are you talking about?  What rules have they changed?  I do all my banking at a bank that exists in about five counties.  They were the cheapest interest-rate wise for my mortgage, zeroed out pretty much all fees since we have a mortgage there, and offer everything I need from an internet banking standpoint.  

The issue with bank consolidation is probably felt much more on the commercial side than on the consumer side.  But most of the time that consumers get screwed by big banks, is because they don't shop around.

I'm talking about government/legislation influence.

I actually think big banks are way more convenient from my (consumer) perspective. Their ATMs & branches are all over the city, and can usually be found all over the major cities I enjoy travelling to. How is that a bad thing? I get the perception that there's less selection/competition from a private/small business loan perspective, but there will always be competition in that arena keeping rates where they should be for the current economic environment. Consolidate away!

Quote from: jesmu84 on May 30, 2014, 09:14:47 AM
True. but how much influence do those start-ups have? And, how much will they ever really have?

Once the big ones are at the top, they can change the rules of the game so they stay there.

I would look deeper into your chart and ask why many of those mergers happened?  Including the Savings and Loan collapse, the bankruptcy of some banks, and the home collapse in 2008.  Many of those banks weren't going to survive at all, thus they were bought or merged.

Not all mergers benefit consumers, not all mergers are supposed to.  Some mergers certainly do.  It's also how you look at things.

Let's use Comcast Time Warner.  Sure as the day is long, when that merger goes through and prices rise people will scream and say "SEE, the merger didn't help".  What they will fail to do is ask the question, how much MORE would prices have risen without the scale they are creating to beat back Disney, Viacom, NewsCorp, CBS, HBO, etc, to try and contain rates.  Too many people fail to think it through.  Just the way it is.   Prices are a combination of your costs, what profits you are trying to make and\or put back into the business (R&D, etc).  When costs go up meteorically, your only hedge is to get bigger and use that scale to pound them back. 

Quote from: Bleuteaux on May 22, 2014, 03:50:13 PM
Northern Idaho is fantastic. I've never left the panhandle but Coeur d'Alene is one of the most beautiful areas in the country. Sandpoint is great too.

Have to totally agree. I made 2 trips to our hop farm in Bonners Ferry, ID and stayed in a lake house near Sandpoint, ID and I would go back for a vacation in a heart beat. It's one of the most beautiful places I have ever been.

Quote from: Chili on May 30, 2014, 12:26:13 PM
Have to totally agree. I made 2 trips to our hop farm in Bonners Ferry, ID and stayed in a lake house near Sandpoint, ID and I would go back for a vacation in a heart beat. It's one of the most beautiful places I have ever been.

OK, I'm convinced. It will be put on the docket for next year. Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

The NW corner of the country (Idaho, Oregon, Washington) is probably the only area of the country I haven't visited.

Quote from: brandx on May 30, 2014, 04:30:52 PM
OK, I'm convinced. It will be put on the docket for next year. Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

The NW corner of the country (Idaho, Oregon, Washington) is probably the only area of the country I haven't visited.

You won't be disappointed.  It is likely where my wife and I are going to next.  Beautiful part of the country.

Quote from: brandx on May 30, 2014, 04:30:52 PM
OK, I'm convinced. It will be put on the docket for next year. Any recommendations would be greatly appreciated.

The NW corner of the country (Idaho, Oregon, Washington) is probably the only area of the country I haven't visited.

Wow. An old hippie like you never having been to the last remaining bastion of counter culture observance? A pilgrimage is in order.

Slightly OT?

http://uproxx.com/tv/2014/06/john-oliver-took-on-net-neutrality-last-night-and-were-all-the-better-for-it/

Quote from: jesmu84 on June 02, 2014, 02:25:35 PM
Slightly OT?

http://uproxx.com/tv/2014/06/john-oliver-took-on-net-neutrality-last-night-and-were-all-the-better-for-it/

I wanted to post this too!
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(http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/2014-06/2/13/enhanced/webdr08/enhanced-8875-1401729086-11.png)
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Quote from: Ari Gold on June 02, 2014, 03:21:10 PM
I wanted to post this too!
(http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/2014-06/2/13/enhanced/webdr06/anigif_enhanced-17218-1401728600-1.gif)
(http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/2014-06/2/13/enhanced/webdr08/enhanced-8875-1401729086-11.png)
(http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/2014-06/2/13/enhanced/webdr04/enhanced-22769-1401729085-4.png)

Shocking ;D

And, as you can guess, when the black line starts to go back up, June 2014, is when the negotiations were settled. But like all the execs have said, I'm sure they won't be anything but completely fair and impartial.

http://www.engadget.com/2014/06/06/cable-companies-alleged-to-astroturf-net-neutrality/

Nice.

Quote from: jesmu84 on June 06, 2014, 11:16:47 AM
http://www.engadget.com/2014/06/06/cable-companies-alleged-to-astroturf-net-neutrality/

Nice.

I'll bet the Obama administration and their incredibly cozy relationship with Comcast will be all over this.  

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 06, 2014, 02:56:02 PM
I'll bet the Obama administration and their incredibly cozy relationship with Comcast will be all over this.  

You write it in real, but it's pretty transparent that you don't mean it like that. But, in the end, it doesn't really matter what the political party or affiliation. The private entities are still scumbags and will always do whatever is in their best interest always.

Quote from: jesmu84 on June 06, 2014, 07:27:17 PM
You write it in real, but it's pretty transparent that you don't mean it like that. But, in the end, it doesn't really matter what the political party or affiliation. The private entities are still scumbags and will always do whatever is in their best interest always.

Are governmental entities scumbags, or pillars of kindness and compassion?

Quote from: Jay Bee on June 06, 2014, 08:50:12 PM
Are governmental entities scumbags, or pillars of kindness and compassion?

Both? But mostly scumbags. But, then, you and I aren't th people who always advocate for private entities doing things the right way no matter what.