MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: GGGG on December 01, 2013, 10:55:55 PM
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Too many turnovers. Too many empty offensive possessions. Need a guy to step up and hit shots. Too many mental errors like missing box outs.
Still fighting through things.
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When will Buzz install an offense?
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Unfortunately we will be forced to watch a team struggle with a PG who cannot create his own shot or make a contested layup. .500 conference team.
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Simply put, there's no alpha dog. MU may have a good season, make the tourney even.
I'll be shocked if this team is playing the second weekend come late March.
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If there's one stat that stands out .. it's the 315th ranking we have on 3-point%, 28% and dropping .. had 9% tonight.
If we can't keep anyone honest outside the arc, it makes it ever tougher to score inside.
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Maybe Buzz has just installed a bad offense
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The issue isn't just the PG. Wilson isn't an all American by any means but it goes deeper than that.
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I hate saying this because it's pointless, but tonight's game made Vander Blue's decision suck even more. This team is dying for someone like him.
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The issue isn't just the PG. Wilson isn't an all American by any means but it goes deeper than that.
As stated earlier, Wilson is the least of our problems. We need consistent three-point shooters and we need guys that have been here for more than a year (*cough* Taylor *cough*) to understand where they need to be on both ends of the court. We need our scorers to consistently look for their shots. We don't need to rely on a freshman having a coming out party to stay in the game with a team that we are clearly better than. And of course, we don't need refs to hand the opponents 4 points in a tie game. But it shouldn't have come to that, because we are better than SDSU. We know it, and I'm pretty sure they know it too. Lots of time in the season. People were further down after the Green Bay game last year. We'll come back from this. Hardly a season-ender.
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The issue isn't just the PG. Wilson isn't an all American by any means but it goes deeper than that.
I agree. Guy is a decent PG, better than I anticipated. It's that NO ONE can hit a shot. No driving lanes. Juan needs to hit open 3s or MU is starting 3 guys that cannot score the basketball. That doesn't work.
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The bottom line right now is the team is not really that good yet. The point guard doesn't have an outside shot (wow was SDSU sagging off on him or what), the shooting guard is a walk-on, the center team consists of a clumsy, good defensive player and at times a DG stud, the SF is a senior picked to be a BE second team and has had only one really good game, and the other forward is a role player. Steve Taylor appears to have regressed, Mayo doesn't play enough and the rest are young.
Sometimes teams are just not as good as previous years and maybe this will be one of them, maybe not. Still have to root like heck for them, even if a bad year is due. The staff should get the rotations down, but the outside shooting is just killing them now.
Tonight it was free throws, offensive boards putbacks and Thames draining those threes.
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I hate saying this because it's pointless, but tonight's game made Vander Blue's decision suck even more. This team is dying for someone like him.
twisting the knife.
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As stated earlier, Wilson is the least of our problems. We need consistent three-point shooters and we need guys that have been here for more than a year (*cough* Taylor *cough*) to understand where they need to be on both ends of the court. We need our scorers to consistently look for their shots. We don't need to rely on a freshman having a coming out party to stay in the game with a team that we are clearly better than. And of course, we don't need refs to hand the opponents 4 points in a tie game. But it shouldn't have come to that, because we are better than SDSU. We know it, and I'm pretty sure they know it too. Lots of time in the season. People were further down after the Green Bay game last year. We'll come back from this. Hardly a season-ender.
What is happening is that Derrick is not being guarded so that makes MU play 4 on 5 most of the time, add O'Tule or Juan and you have only 2 kids who can make shots. It is to bad that Jamil Wilson doe not have the shooting confidence that Deonte has. He showed he is a potential big time player. Loved seeing him hit a jump shot. A good quick team takes Jake out of the game. It
is obvious that JJJ needs more seasoning. So saying all this Duane would have a great opportunity to change the O. Thames and Carson both took it to MU, point guards that can score. That is
all MU needs, to bad Devante had the flu. These are all good games for MU to play early. Get used to it, until Duane comes back they all will be tight, and I am not sure how Duane will fit in with
all this time off, much like Aaron Rodgers.
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twisting the knife.
Completely sucks, if Marquette could make a "trade", it would be for a guy just like Blue. 100% sucks.
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Typically, MU is better than the sum of its parts. This year hasn't necessarily proved that to be true yet. Still need time to find the right formula and the straw that stirs the drink. It's still early. Haven't even started conference play yet.
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As stated earlier, Wilson is the least of our problems. We need consistent three-point shooters and we need guys that have been here for more than a year (*cough* Taylor *cough*) to understand where they need to be on both ends of the court. We need our scorers to consistently look for their shots. We don't need to rely on a freshman having a coming out party to stay in the game with a team that we are clearly better than. And of course, we don't need refs to hand the opponents 4 points in a tie game. But it shouldn't have come to that, because we are better than SDSU. We know it, and I'm pretty sure they know it too. Lots of time in the season. People were further down after the Green Bay game last year. We'll come back from this. Hardly a season-ender.
Sorry, but a team officially loses the right to complain about the refs when it has a decisive FT advantage but just can't hit the foul shots. (And it was decisive even though we only had 3 more FTs because a huge number of SDSU's came late in the game. And we'd have had plenty more but missed the front ends of 1-and-1s.)
Plus, there was Jake calling timeout because he couldn't inbound the ball and then promptly throwing the ball away for 2 points ... followed shortly afterward by Jamil calling timeout because he got trapped in the corner and then traveling while catching the inbounds pass.
You say we "clearly" were better than SDSU, but a better team doesn't simply give away at least a dozen points on free throws and awful turnovers. A better team also has a PG who doesn't completely disappear in the second half and has to be taken out of the game late (again) because he can't shoot while the opposing PG lights us up all night long. Derrick wasn't our main problem tonight, but he wasn't the "least of our problems" in the second half.
Oh, and nice game by Jamil. I think folks can stop being upset that he wasn't chosen one of the nation's top 100 players.
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Don't care that Blue's gone. Not worried about the 3-pt % to measure success. They have to be able to overcome adversity and finish. ASU and SDSU were 2 good road tests to help the team grow. Think it only helps that Davante was sick. I like watching this team and believe they have a lot of potential. I agree that they have a lot to figure out. Good thing its only December 1.
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I agree. Guy is a decent PG, better than I anticipated. It's that NO ONE can hit a shot. No driving lanes. Juan needs to hit open 3s or MU is starting 3 guys that cannot score the basketball. That doesn't work.
You do realize that the reason there are no driving lanes is because we are playing a PG that no one respects and sags 6 feet off of to pack the lane and block driving lanes right?
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Sorry, but a team officially loses the right to complain about the refs when it has a decisive FT advantage but just can't hit the foul shots. (And it was decisive even though we only had 3 more FTs because a huge number of SDSU's came late in the game. And we'd have had plenty more but missed the front ends of 1-and-1s.)
Plus, there was Jake calling timeout because he couldn't inbound the ball and then promptly throwing the ball away for 2 points ... followed shortly afterward by Jamil calling timeout because he got trapped in the corner and then traveling while catching the inbounds pass.
You say we "clearly" were better than SDSU, but a better team doesn't simply give away at least a dozen points on free throws and awful turnovers. A better team also has a PG who doesn't completely disappear in the second half and has to be taken out of the game late (again) because he can't shoot while the opposing PG lights us up all night long. Derrick wasn't our main problem tonight, but he wasn't the "least of our problems" in the second half.
Oh, and nice game by Jamil. I think folks can stop being upset that he wasn't chosen one of the nation's top 100 players.
As mentioned in the other thread, Derrick lost efficiency when he got injured. A bit harsh to blame a kid for an injury. If anything, it shows how clearly not ready Dawson is since he couldn't get time even when Derrick was playing at half-strength.
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As stated earlier, Wilson is the least of our problems. We need consistent three-point shooters and we need guys that have been here for more than a year (*cough* Taylor *cough*) to understand where they need to be on both ends of the court. We need our scorers to consistently look for their shots. We don't need to rely on a freshman having a coming out party to stay in the game with a team that we are clearly better than. And of course, we don't need refs to hand the opponents 4 points in a tie game. But it shouldn't have come to that, because we are better than SDSU. We know it, and I'm pretty sure they know it too. Lots of time in the season. People were further down after the Green Bay game last year. We'll come back from this. Hardly a season-ender.
Give me a break. We are better than the team that just beat us. That is garbage . So far we have yet to beat a team in the top 50. Not sure what you are watching.
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SDSU was a far more athletic team that played at a higher intensity which we didn't match. Thomas was covered pretty well and couldn't get a shot off in the second half. Can't miss as many layups and free throws as we did and win games.
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I don't disagree with the subject or most of the posts in this thread. That stated, I think all of our issues are fixable. At least we aren't looking at a roster with a lack of talent or ability. If they don't get their act together this will certainly be a frustrating season, but the future (near and long term) still looks fairly bright.
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Buzz needs to figure a lot out still too. Was surprised he took Deonte out for a bit after he was the only one doing anything on offense. After that performance and stretch alone he deserves a lot more time at the 2/3. He can abuse other guards and even some bigs inside with his size and strength.
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Buzz needs to figure a lot out still too. Was surprised he took Deonte out for a bit after he was the only one doing anything on offense. After that performance and stretch alone he deserves a lot more time at the 2/3. He can abuse other guards and even some bigs inside with his size and strength.
No, I just finished watching that game and he had
Derrick Wilson in the game too long at the end when they need scoring. He did not play the defense vs offense switch with him with Mayo or him and Jake.
You need shooters on the floor in the close game that it was. With Wilson's too passive on offense you should have gone with the freshmen. Whatever it takes.
Jamil was invisible. What is his problem. Where the hell was he? No presence at all in crunch time. Command the ball and attack the rim! That was a title game. You are a senior!
You coach when you are in the lead and you coach or learn how to chase, and to close, and finish. They chased pretty good, but did not have the closers and finishers on the floor.
He had managers...we did not need managers down by 5 under 2:00 minutes.
Too much safe passing the ball around the perimeter and everyone is scared to shoot from 3pt range to open it up down low.
The one guy who wasn't was the Freshman Deonte Burton.
You needed to have Jajuan Johnson or Juan Anderson or someone else in there with some size out there who can at least be a threat to open it up down low for Burton, Otule and Gardner.
Bad lineup on the floor the last 5 minutes down by 2 and eventually down by 5. To me Duane Wilson cannot get healthy fast enough.
There were a few bad calls that really hurt, but if Jamil is going to play scared then get someone in there who can be willing to step up and finish off the game. Did he shoot one time in the second half????
Wake up Jamil!
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No, I just finished watching that game and they had PG
Derrick Wilson in the game too long at the end when they need scoring. He did not play the defense vs offense switch with him with Mayo or him and Jake.
You need shooters on the floor in the close game that it was. With Wilson's too passive on offense you should have gone with the freshmen. Whatever it takes.
Jamil was invisible. What is his problem. Where the hell was he? No presence at all in crunch time. Command the ball and attack the rim! That was a title game. You are a senior!
You coach when you are in the lead and you coach or learn how to chase, and to close, and finish. They chased pretty good, but did not have the closers and finishers on the floor.
He had managers...we did not need managers down by 5 under 2:00 minutes.
Too much safe passing the ball around the perimeter and everyone is scared to shoot from 3pt range to open it up down low.
Defense will keep them in games this year but they are going to win or go as far as their shooting and offensive execution will take them and how well they improve and who is the hot hand they should ride that game.
The one guy who wasn't was the Freshman Deonte Burton.
You needed to have Jajuan Johnson or Juan Anderson or someone else in there with some size out there who can at least be a threat to open it up down low for Burton, Otule and Gardner.
Bad lineup on the floor the last 5 minutes down by 2 and eventually down by 5. To me Duane Wilson cannot get healthy fast enough.
There were a few bad calls that really hurt, but if Jamil is going to play scared then get someone in there who can be willing to step up and finish off the game. Did he shoot one time in the second half????
Wake up Jamil!
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I know it's not all Wilson's fault, and I'm sure he's a great kid, but I think he IS, by far, the biggest issue. When your point guard can stand at the three point line with the closest defender three steps off of him and not even look like he is going to attack, it changes the entire potential of an offense. Especially on a team where your bigs are your best players and you need guys drawn to the perimeter.
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Derrick was the best player MU had on the floor in the first half. Deonte was the best in the second half. Not our seniors. And therein lies the problem. Otule was passive, Davante was ill, and Jamil was a space case. There is no alpha dog. Jamil tried a little in the first half but you can't be the alpha dog when you are still, as a 5th year senior, committing stupid fouls that require you go sit on the bench for the last 6 minutes of the first half. We should start calling him Nuke Laloosh.
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Completely sucks, if Marquette could make a "trade", it would be for a guy just like Blue. 100% sucks.
SDSU was a far more athletic team that played at a higher intensity which we didn't match. Thomas was covered pretty well and couldn't get a shot off in the second half. Can't miss as many layups and free throws as we did and win games.
No no no no no. MU played with intensity. What in the world are you watching! Intensity was not the problem. Nor where they more athletic. They just were more hungry, fearless, and less scared.
And they managed to keep that length out of foul trouble. The call on Jake on the 3, the guy with 5 fouls screened Jake into the shooter. That was not a foul on Jake.
Then there was another missed called on the sideline. Both of those were 4-8 pts swings. But the wrong people were on the court the last 5 minutes of the game and he tighten his rotation and stopped giving them different looks.
And we got nothing from Jamil at all. Juan and JuJuan could have played when D. Burton got hot to stretch the floor and they could have done the offense vs defense switch better.
This had nothing do with lack of intensity, athleticism or a lack of talent.
I want more from Jamil, Todd, and Juan on offense when it counts in a hostile environment moving to the rim. The other team is not scared to shoot or to miss...you can shoot and miss with a purpose to set up makes down low on future possessions. We did not see the "gotta have it" in the last 5 minutes. We saw the I don't want to screw this up.
When you get to the title game, leave it all on the floor out there. Let it fly! Don't come back with rounds left in the chamber.
And have the right people on the floor. Not managers but finishers. Closers. If you know who those are or if they know who they are.
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As mentioned in the other thread, Derrick lost efficiency when he got injured. A bit harsh to blame a kid for an injury. If anything, it shows how clearly not ready Dawson is since he couldn't get time even when Derrick was playing at half-strength.
He does not have any efficiency in close games when the other team used 5 players to guard our 4.
He is a liability on offense if he cannot hit some shots. That is where you need a Playmaker. He is a game manager PG. You need someone who is not afraid to make a play.
A broken play. a set play, a hustle play, or a big play threat. Those guys are rare. Burton maybe one of them...so might JuJuan.
Someone mentioned and. Vander Blue is gone, but he is EXACTLY the kind of fearless player that MU needed tonight.
Neither Derrick or Jake should have been in the game...at that point. And Jamil needs to be more aggressive.
I would have had Juan in. Juan can defend and Juan can get the inbounds pass in. And I would have had Mayo in as well.
I did not like the lineup out there. Some guys can get you close but not over the top.
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When will Buzz install an offense?
He has an offense they just pass up open shots all game long and are afraid to shoot a jumper!
They swing the ball well and then there is an open shot in the corner and they swing the ball back around.
I can see if they are dumping it down, but to dump it down you have to at least hit some shots from 3 or dribble and do a pull up in the lane mid-range.
That is what you need. That would open everything up. The Paint touches too would help but no one wants to shoot.
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Unfortunately we will be forced to watch a team struggle with a PG who cannot create his own shot or make a contested layup. .500 conference team.
Charitable with a .500 conference record, the way they are playing now. Pretty disastrous with a 6 year senior, two 5th year seniors, and two Jrs. in the starting line up. This is by far Buzz's most overrated and underperforming team. And please all, spare the comments, "They need to learn how to play", "It's early in the season", "In Buzz we trust", etc.
As said previously, they should be playing the frosh. Jake Thomas, Juan Anderson are role players. Derek Wilson has heart, but cannot shoot, and is not-repeat-- is not a lock down defender. Mayo is 1. Shoot first, and 1A. Play out of control. Jamil Wilson is very inconsistent.
With the talent on this team, the play has been average at best. This will be a long season when the team plays on the road.
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What is happening is that Derrick is not being guarded so that makes MU play 4 on 5 most of the time, add O'Tule or Juan and you have only 2 kids who can make shots. It is to bad that Jamil Wilson doe not have the shooting confidence that Deonte has. He showed he is a potential big time player. Loved seeing him hit a jump shot. A good quick team takes Jake out of the game. It
is obvious that JJJ needs more seasoning. So saying all this Duane would have a great opportunity to change the O. Thames and Carson both took it to MU, point guards that can score. That is
all MU needs, to bad Devante had the flu. These are all good games for MU to play early. Get used to it, until Duane comes back they all will be tight, and I am not sure how Duane will fit in with
all this time off, much like Aaron Rodgers.
Hmmm...comparing Duane to Aaron Rodgers? I like it, but what pressure.
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Give me a break. We are better than the team that just beat us. That is garbage . So far we have yet to beat a team in the top 50. Not sure what you are watching.
We have not beat a team in the top 50, mainly because we are not a top 50 team. Maybe top 100 on a good day.
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Buzz needs to figure a lot out still too. Was surprised he took Deonte out for a bit after he was the only one doing anything on offense. After that performance and stretch alone he deserves a lot more time at the 2/3. He can abuse other guards and even some bigs inside with his size and strength.
Amen. That was a huge bone headed move by Buzz. Burton was the hottest guy on the floor. He probably walked back to the bench muttering "WTF", followed by "In Buzz we trust"
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No no no no no. MU played with intensity. What in the world are you watching! Intensity was not the problem. Nor where they more athletic. They just were more hungry, fearless, and less scared.
And they managed to keep that length out of foul trouble. The call on Jake on the 3, the guy with 5 fouls screened Jake into the shooter. That was not a foul on Jake.
Then there was another missed called on the sideline. Both of those were 4-8 pts swings. But the wrong people were on the court the last 5 minutes of the game and he tighten his rotation and stopped giving them different looks.
And we got nothing from Jamil at all. Juan and JuJuan could have played when D. Burton got hot to stretch the floor and they could have done the offense vs defense switch better.
This had nothing do with lack of intensity, athleticism or a lack of talent.
I want more from Jamil, Todd, and Juan on offense when it counts in a hostile environment moving to the rim. The other team is not scared to shoot or to miss...you can shoot and miss with a purpose to set up makes down low on future possessions. We did not see the "gotta have it" in the last 5 minutes. We saw the I don't want to screw this up.
When you get to the title game, leave it all on the floor out there. Let it fly! Don't come back with rounds left in the chamber.
And have the right people on the floor. Not managers but finishers. Closers. If you know who those are or if they know who they are.
All of the above and Buzz was out coached.
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Our offensive woes are simple. It is not about leadership, it is not about fortitude. It is about being able to make a jump shot to spread the defense. At this point the double down and sometimes triple down on Gardner happens quickly and aggressively because other than Thomas, the defense doesn't worry about him kicking the ball out to a jump shooter. There are actually more driving lanes when Gardner is on the bench because teams are less concerned about the drive and dish with Otule because he can't catch the pass from odd angles from a penetrator. So once SDSU backed off of DeWilson we had all kinds of trouble because no driving lanes, no jump shooters and the double-down on Gardner was very quick.
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Derrick was the best player MU had on the floor in the first half. Deonte was the best in the second half. Not our seniors. And therein lies the problem. Otule was passive, Davante was ill, and Jamil was a space case. There is no alpha dog. Jamil tried a little in the first half but you can't be the alpha dog when you are still, as a 5th year senior, committing stupid fouls that require you go sit on the bench for the last 6 minutes of the first half. We should start calling him Nuke Laloosh.
Agree with all of this. Jamil's play has been very frustrating, and the foul trouble every game has to be fixed. Otule also needs to not be afraid to hit someone with a 260 lb freight train even if he gets called for it sometimes - a 6'10" center shouldn't be getting half his shots blocked.
Derrick had a terrific first half. I can live with some of the turnovers as the price for him being more assertive and trying to make plays. The second half was pretty bad...really need him taking a few hundred shots a day so he can at least keep them honest with a 15 footer if he can't hit from long range. His shot is by no means ugly.
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Charitable with a .500 conference record, the way they are playing now. Pretty disastrous with a 6 year senior, two 5th year seniors, and two Jrs. in the starting line up. This is by far Buzz's most overrated and underperforming team. And please all, spare the comments, "They need to learn how to play", "It's early in the season", "In Buzz we trust", etc.
I'll spare you all the "In Buzz we trust" crap even though IMO his 5 years of success has earned it if you put your money where your incredibly big and obnoxious mouth is. I say over .500 in the conference for any number you can handle. I'll even give you 7-5 odds if you make it worth my while. Time to put up or shut up.
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Derrick Wilson didn't have a good second half, but he was the best player on the floor in the first half. There simply is NOT a better point guard on the roster right now. I have no idea what else he can do. And really, how are we playing "four on five" when HE WAS THE SECOND LEADING SCORER!!!???!! He tried to do too much out there at times, and that's what got him in trouble, but how many times have I read on this board that he is too passive...a game manager, blah, blah, blah.
Again...he's not great...he's not Junior Cadougan...but right now he is the best option.
And as for people taking shots, when JJJ comes in and takes an NBA range 3 pt shot early in the shot clock, Buzz is going to sit him for awhile. That was a ridiculous shot. That's why freshmen are freshmen.
Deonte was great, but I will tell you this, it's not going to take good teams very long to see that the guy only uses his left hand. We are going to see a lot of ups and downs from him this year.
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I'll repeat myself again...this team remains a work in progress. Anyone expecting anything near a finished product after 3 weeks is delusional. With another 3 weeks or so until the BE season starts, I remain optimistic. Those with the last name Wilson will be the keys to this season though.
Derrik Wilson, everyones favorite whipping boy, has been a bit up and down, but is showing he can play. Anyone reading this would have gladly signed up for 5.5 pts, 4+ Rebs, and 4+ assists per game from Derrick before the season started. He can guard guys and he doesn't really turn it over. Outside shooting is an issue, but the kid can play PG.
Jamil Wilson appears to be the other favorite target. He too has been very up and down, but it appears to me he is struggling playing a little different role this year. Sure looks to me like he is being asked to be much more of a Vander Blue/DJO type than Jimmy Butler/Jae Crowder as maybe he has in the past, and most would have expected. He doesn't spend nearly as much time with his back to the basket, and has become much more of a perimeter player on both ends. The transition will take time, but in the end, I expect the results will be very positive.
Duane Wilson, if he can come back, and contribute off the bench could be a huge factor the second half of the year. Hopefully he can add some much needed depth and perimeter shooting. If he does, it could make a huge difference for this team.
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Check this out:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/marquette/23-wesley-matthews/game_stats?season=2008-2009&stat_type=1&game_type=1&chart1=minutes&chart2=points&chart3=effective_fg_pct&chart4=&chart5=
And then:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/marquette/jamil-wilson/game_stats?season=2013-2014&stat_type=1&game_type=1&chart1=minutes&chart2=points&chart3=effective_fg_pct&chart4=&chart5=
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Same thread, different season.
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Check this out:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/marquette/23-wesley-matthews/game_stats?season=2008-2009&stat_type=1&game_type=1&chart1=minutes&chart2=points&chart3=effective_fg_pct&chart4=&chart5=
And then:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/marquette/jamil-wilson/game_stats?season=2013-2014&stat_type=1&game_type=1&chart1=minutes&chart2=points&chart3=effective_fg_pct&chart4=&chart5=
What about it?
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I'll spare you all the "In Buzz we trust" crap even though IMO his 5 years of success has earned it if you put your money where your incredibly big and obnoxious mouth is. I say over .500 in the conference for any number you can handle. I'll even give you 7-5 odds if you make it worth my while. Time to put up or shut up.
yeah sure Lenny, keep slurping the Kool Aid. And speaking of loud and obnoxious, you own it. If I were a betting man, I would bet that you cannot handle facts, which is why you jump to name calling. Please for Lenny's sake, drink Kool Aid with him, but whatever you do, do not comment on our below average performance. As I said ,this is Buzz's most overrated and underperforming team, but you are right--give him a pass because of past performance.
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yeah sure Lenny, keep slurping the Kool Aid. And speaking of loud and obnoxious, you own it. If I were a betting man, I would bet that you cannot handle facts, which is why you jump to name calling. Please for Lenny's sake, drink Kool Aid with him, but whatever you do, do not comment on our below average performance. As I said ,this is Buzz's most overrated and underperforming team, but you are right--give him a pass because of past performance.
So, sounds like you aren't taking him up on his offer then, huh?
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It has definitely been a disappointing start....would be quite surprised if we are not 5-4 after going to Madison. Picked to win the Big East, preseason ranked (this is why I hate preseason rankings), Final Four team by some.
Fortunately, its only December 2nd, but it would be nice to get a scalp or two outside of conference that means something. Only 1 or 2 opportunities left.
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yeah sure Lenny, keep slurping the Kool Aid. And speaking of loud and obnoxious, you own it. If I were a betting man, I would bet that you cannot handle facts, which is why you jump to name calling. Please for Lenny's sake, drink Kool Aid with him, but whatever you do, do not comment on our below average performance. As I said ,this is Buzz's most overrated and underperforming team, but you are right--give him a pass because of past performance.
If you think predicting a sub .500 conference record is "handling facts" and disagreeing with that assessment is "slurping kool aid", I'm offering you some easy money. Not surprised, though, that you would decline. Guys who scream the loudest invariably are afraid to back up their rhetoric.
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If you think predicting a sub .500 conference record is "handling facts" and disagreeing with that assessment is "slurping kool aid", I'm offering you some easy money. Not surprised, though, that you would decline. Guys who scream the loudest invariably are afraid to back up their rhetoric.
+1
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Check this out:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/marquette/23-wesley-matthews/game_stats?season=2008-2009&stat_type=1&game_type=1&chart1=minutes&chart2=points&chart3=effective_fg_pct&chart4=&chart5=
And then:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/marquette/jamil-wilson/game_stats?season=2013-2014&stat_type=1&game_type=1&chart1=minutes&chart2=points&chart3=effective_fg_pct&chart4=&chart5=
Biggest takeaway for me was Wes shooting 257 free throws his senior year. Jamil is on pace for about 90, or the same as his 86 last year. Still plays super soft.
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If we beat Bucky I will be completely over the rest of our losses.
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Check this out:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/marquette/23-wesley-matthews/game_stats?season=2008-2009&stat_type=1&game_type=1&chart1=minutes&chart2=points&chart3=effective_fg_pct&chart4=&chart5=
And then:
http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/player/marquette/jamil-wilson/game_stats?season=2013-2014&stat_type=1&game_type=1&chart1=minutes&chart2=points&chart3=effective_fg_pct&chart4=&chart5=
Gross.
Jamil's numbers as a 5th year senior look like Wes' as a Frosh.
Granted, they aren't an apples to apples comparison (schedule, position, role in the offense, etc.)... but it's still not good for a guy (Jamil) that I love, and had high expectations for.
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So, sounds like you aren't taking him up on his offer then, huh?
Read-I said if I were a betting man. Besides, I still have hope we will improve, so why would I bet against my team? I did not start the .500 comment. I quoted the other poster. You are welcome to take his bet up, if you like. Since Lenny said Buzz's past performance is deserving, judge by the past 8 games.
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Read-I said if I were a betting man. Besides, I still have hope we will improve, so why would I bet against my team? I did not start the .500 comment. I quoted the other poster. You are welcome to take his bet up, if you like. Since Lenny said Buzz's past performance is deserving, judge by the past 8 games.
Dude. relax. It is basketball. On tv, played by 19 year olds. Seriously. Like for real. No joke. Breathe. Bring the blood pressure down.
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If there's one stat that stands out .. it's the 315th ranking we have on 3-point%, 28% and dropping .. had 9% tonight.
If we can't keep anyone honest outside the arc, it makes it ever tougher to score inside.
Is this a surprise? The freshman don't play and aside from Jamil Wilson no one was able to shoot threes any better last year either:
Jamil Wilson 36% 36/100
Trent Lockett 33% 13/39 - GONE
Vander Blue 30% 40/132 - GONE
Juan Anderson 29% 12/42
Todd Mayo 28% 17/61
Jake Thomas 27% 10/36
Steve Taylor 25% 3/12
Junior Cadougan 23% 14/62 - GONE
Davante Gardner 20% 1/5
Derrick Wilson 13% 1/8
Chris Otule 0% 0/0
28% seems to be about the right average.
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Dude. relax. It is basketball. On tv, played by 19 year olds. Seriously. Like for real. No joke. Breathe. Bring the blood pressure down.
This.
It's supposed to be a diversion from real life. It's supposed to be fun. Doesn't mean we can't have intelligent debate, but it's just basketball.
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Dude. relax. It is basketball. On tv, played by 19 year olds. Seriously. Like for real. No joke. Breathe. Bring the blood pressure down.
Dude--you relax. Breathe. I am very mellow. By the way, they are not all 19 year olds. Otule, Gardner, Thomas, The Wilsons, Anderson, etc. have been around a while. Otule will qualify for Social Security in a couple years. Raise the expectation level above mediocrity--no joke.
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Dude--you relax. Breathe. I am very mellow. By the way, they are not all 19 year olds. Otule, Gardner, Thomas, The Wilsons, Anderson, etc. have been around a while. Otule will qualify for Social Security in a couple years. Raise the expectation level above mediocrity--no joke.
I said you RELAX!
yeah sure Lenny, keep slurping the Kool Aid. And speaking of loud and obnoxious, you own it. If I were a betting man, I would bet that you cannot handle facts, which is why you jump to name calling. Please for Lenny's sake, drink Kool Aid with him, but whatever you do, do not comment on our below average performance. As I said ,this is Buzz's most overrated and underperforming team, but you are right--give him a pass because of past performance.
Buzz the Mastermind, draws up a play for Ja. Wilson to walk, and while doing that he takes Burton, the hottest guy on the floor out. In Buzz we trust.
thames is kicking our ass while the lock down defender Derrick is guarding him.
Yep, we need more bigs like Otule, who has worked hard and in his 6th year is averaging about 7 and 3. He has overcome a lot and hopefully he will be able to transition to the pros in Bulgaria.
We could do worse. We could recruit more Mbaos.
All said with all due respect for all concerned.
1. Start Derrick every game giving him 30+ mpg
2. Gush over Derrick whenever he scores 4 or more points in a game
3. Continue to ride JT for 20 minutes a game.
4. Likely relegate Du. Wilson to 3 minutes per game/or redshirt him
5. Continue to develop Otule and hope he can get a 7th year out of him
6. Continue with his Texas homilies about life philosophy
7. Stay with MU "as long as they will want him"
8. Allow Mayo to shine one game and go off the ledge the next
9. Immediately pull Ox from each game whenever he takes a shot beyond 12+feet, at the same time encouraging Jamil and Mayo to chuck up 3 point attempts
10. Explain how tough the NBEast is in order to justify our 5th place standing
11. Start Steve Taylor at the 5 next year and sign 3 more switchables between 6'4" and 6'6" next year, all in the top 100.
12. Redshirt Satchel next year so he can get him on the Otule path
13. Go back to scheduling cupcakes early in the year, "fixing what is broken" from this year.
14. Dance on the Bradley floor after blowing out New Hamp. by 9 points.
How dare you criticize Buzz. Beware you will face the wrath of the Sultan.
By the way, the freshman will not develop only playing against Grambling. They should play-especially in the backcourt.
Here we go again with the great Sultan expounding? Bowing down and slurping at the altar of Buzz. I show up plenty Sultan. You continue to give all the passes you want, and when I see flaws I will call them out. Somebody should. And I submit to you that Buzz needs to shake up the starting lineup again, or there will be no Conference Title, and judging by yesterday, no NCAA tourney. And no, I do not mean starting Anderson for 3 minutes each half. Significant changes are in order.
Prediction: Buzz does not have the gonads to shake up the starting line-up
The only thing sharp about him is his pointy head. Why the hell is he in there? Get him out and on the pines.
Jim Burr is a huge douche. He hates MU, and is the lousiest ref in the country. How does he get our games?
A terrible first half by both teams--ugly, ugly.
Our guard play is killing us.
It only looks like Ox and Taylor came to play.
When is J. Wilson going to step up like a 5th year senior should?
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I said you RELAX!
I am very relaxed knowing that you pulled up a few of my recent posts. It must make your day to read them--DUDE! That is always relaxing to have one quoted. And you can say all that you want Reindeer, but I don't work for you.
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Does everyone here realize that our best offensive player was far from 100% last night? I'm not going to sit here and say that everything is going great with this team, but I don't think our performance thus far indicates a sub .500 conference record.
Based on the analysis of some of the posters here, Creighton must be a horrible team. At least we know they will finish below us.
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If you think predicting a sub .500 conference record is "handling facts" and disagreeing with that assessment is "slurping kool aid", I'm offering you some easy money. Not surprised, though, that you would decline. Guys who scream the loudest invariably are afraid to back up their rhetoric.
A lot of that around here.
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It has definitely been a disappointing start....would be quite surprised if we are not 5-4 after going to Madison. Picked to win the Big East, preseason ranked (this is why I hate preseason rankings), Final Four team by some.
Fortunately, its only December 2nd, but it would be nice to get a scalp or two outside of conference that means something. Only 1 or 2 opportunities left.
I don't think we will end up with any quality non-conference wins, unless you count GW. This is shaping up to be a dicey season.
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I am very relaxed knowing that you pulled up a few of my recent posts. It must make your day to read them--DUDE! That is always relaxing to have one quoted. And you can say all that you want Reindeer, but I don't work for you.
Ok, I believe you.
Curious how you respond to real life hardships and tough times if you take something like college basketball so seriously.
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I don't think we will end up with any quality non-conference wins, unless you count GW. This is shaping up to be a dicey season.
That's not as terrible as it could be since only one of the five opportunities to pick up a strong non-conference win came at home. However, it does mean Marquette will likely need a 15-3 record in 2014 to avoid those questions on their resume when selections commence. Given the conference we're in, I think that record is doable.
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That's not as terrible as it could be since only one of the five opportunities to pick up a strong non-conference win came at home. However, it does mean Marquette will likely need a 15-3 record in 2014 to avoid those questions on their resume when selections commence. Given the conference we're in, I think that record is doable.
I think it's doable, too ... but we didn't exactly manhandle New Hampshire and Southern, two teams that wouldn't be picked to finish in our league's top 10!
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That's not as terrible as it could be since only one of the five opportunities to pick up a strong non-conference win came at home. However, it does mean Marquette will likely need a 15-3 record in 2014 to avoid those questions on their resume when selections commence. Given the conference we're in, I think that record is doable.
I don't know, 15-3 seems awfully optimistic right now. @ Villanova, @ Creighton, @ Butler, @ Providence, @ Xavier, @ Georgetown....a lot of losses seem very plausible right there assuming we hold serve at home, which there will be some very difficult return games at the BC.
I'm thinking 10 or 11 wins right now might be pretty stellar unless we find another gear.
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I don't know, 15-3 seems awfully optimistic right now. @ Villanova, @ Creighton, @ Butler, @ Providence, @ Xavier, @ Georgetown....a lot of losses seem very plausible right there assuming we hold serve at home, which there will be some very difficult return games at the BC.
I'm thinking 10 or 11 wins right now might be pretty stellar unless we find another gear.
Yeah, it has less to do with optimism for Marquette and more to do with what I see as a conference of average and below average teams.
Hall, DePaul, Xavier are not good. St. John's still has Lavin coaching so they'll underperform. GTown has same issues as ever. Which will be similar for Butler whose defense is good but offense too reliant on individual scoring plays. Creighton can't guard. Nova isn't scary regardless of the overhyped reaction to beating an ill and very young Kansas squad. PC is dangerous but Dunn's injury is key and could derail their promise.
Four or five of these teams are capable of looking good for a two week stretch but I've never seen a conference where each team has such debilitating weaknesses.
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I don't think we will end up with any quality non-conference wins, unless you count GW. This is shaping up to be a dicey season.
Marquette Will go 5 games over .500 in conference. Qualify for Tourney as a 6 seed!!
Write it down
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Ok, I believe you.
Curious how you respond to real life hardships and tough times if you take something like college basketball so seriously.
And you don't? Pulling up several past posts off a board sounds like you must take it pretty seriously.
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Marquette Will go 5 games over .500 in conference. Qualify for Tourney as a 6 seed!!
Write it down
MU plays 18 BE games. Unless they tie or have a game rained out, they can't finish 5 games over .500.
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MU plays 18 BE games. Unless they tie or have a game rained out, they can't finish 5 games over .500.
F*cking math...
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Yeah, it has less to do with optimism for Marquette and more to do with what I see as a conference of average and below average teams.
Hall, DePaul, Xavier are not good. St. John's still has Lavin coaching so they'll underperform. GTown has same issues as ever. Which will be similar for Butler whose defense is good but offense too reliant on individual scoring plays. Creighton can't guard. Nova isn't scary regardless of the overhyped reaction to beating an ill and very young Kansas squad. PC is dangerous but Dunn's injury is key and could derail their promise.
Four or five of these teams are capable of looking good for a two week stretch but I've never seen a conference where each team has such debilitating weaknesses.
Taken one by one, your analysis of each team could end up being correct. But collectively, to expect all of them to underperform while Marquette excels, well, it seems unrealistic.
Any fan of any other Big East school could do a similar team-by-team review and say, "Marquette has not looked good. Marquette still has problems at PG so they'll underperform. Marquette has issues. Marquette's defense is good but offense too reliant on a few undependable players. Marquette isn't scary regardless of the overhyped preseason ratings. Marquette is dangerous but Duane Wilson's injury already has hurt their situation."
In other words, we see what we want to see.
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I don't know, 15-3 seems awfully optimistic right now. @ Villanova, @ Creighton, @ Butler, @ Providence, @ Xavier, @ Georgetown....a lot of losses seem very plausible right there assuming we hold serve at home, which there will be some very difficult return games at the BC.
I'm thinking 10 or 11 wins right now might be pretty stellar unless we find another gear.
Buzz is fond of the "build a house" analogy - every April you tear down the old one and pour the foundation for a new one. Some of the "materials" he thought he would have at his disposal (Blue, McKay, Duane Wilson) aren't available, so it's fair to say construction is behind schedule. You're right to say that as of today 10 or 11 Big East wins would be stellar, but I'm hoping (based on past performance) that Buzz will solve some of December's doubts/problems.
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And you don't? Pulling up several past posts off a board sounds like you must take it pretty seriously.
You are right, and I am wrong. Continue to have a fulfilling and meaningful life blowing up on message boards about kids that shoot an orange ball into a hoop, while you watch on tv.
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Any fan of any other Big East school could do a similar team-by-team review and say, "Marquette has not looked good. Marquette still has problems at PG so they'll underperform. Marquette has issues. Marquette's defense is good but offense too reliant on a few undependable players. Marquette isn't scary regardless of the overhyped preseason ratings. Marquette is dangerous but Duane Wilson's injury already has hurt their situation."
In other words, we see what we want to see.
Well said. Question will be whether we can kick it up a notch as thus far it's been pretty pedestrian.
Yeah, it has less to do with optimism for Marquette and more to do with what I see as a conference of average and below average teams.
Hall, DePaul, Xavier are not good. St. John's still has Lavin coaching so they'll underperform. GTown has same issues as ever. Which will be similar for Butler whose defense is good but offense too reliant on individual scoring plays. Creighton can't guard. Nova isn't scary regardless of the overhyped reaction to beating an ill and very young Kansas squad. PC is dangerous but Dunn's injury is key and could derail their promise.
Four or five of these teams are capable of looking good for a two week stretch but I've never seen a conference where each team has such debilitating weaknesses.
I think Xavier (much like MU) is better than we are giving them credit for, especially at Xavier. XU should have beaten a good Iowa team. Seems like that loss stung them for the rest of their tournament. Seton Hall, I expected more quite frankly. DePaul, they've bitten us before with far lesser talent. Butler has exceeded my expectations thus far, perhaps they come back to the pack. Nova looks good. Creighton can't guard but we can't shoot. :D G'Town will be tough at their place. I just don't see us getting out of this conference with 3 losses, not the way we are playing and shooting right now. Lenny's points are well taken and certainly hope for that improvement, but as the title of this thread indicates, we have to figure out a bunch of stuff soon. This weekend doesn't get any easier.
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You are right, and I am wrong. Continue to have a fulfilling and meaningful life blowing up on message boards about kids that shoot an orange ball into a hoop, while you watch on tv.
Just like you. By the way--what is your definition of blowing up?
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Taken one by one, your analysis of each team could end up being correct. But collectively, to expect all of them to underperform while Marquette excels, well, it seems unrealistic.
Any fan of any other Big East school could do a similar team-by-team review and say, "Marquette has not looked good. Marquette still has problems at PG so they'll underperform. Marquette has issues. Marquette's defense is good but offense too reliant on a few undependable players. Marquette isn't scary regardless of the overhyped preseason ratings. Marquette is dangerous but Duane Wilson's injury already has hurt their situation."
In other words, we see what we want to see.
I'd agree with that which is why I never wrote, anywhere, that I expected all nine teams to underperform whilst at the same time expected Marquette to excel. Again, never wrote that. Never.
What I did write is that I feel a record like 15-3 is doable. Not probable. Not likely. Not absurd. But doable. And doable because every other team has some serious weaknesses. Cream will rise like Georgetown did last year after dropping their first two and it's a doable possibility that cream will be Marquette. In fact, based upon the recent successes of all the teams, Marquette is one team where it seems most doable they could rise to the top. Doable.
As to your last line, it's funny to be painted as a blind optimist when so many here have repeatedly painted me as a Buzz hater who's happy as a pig in the mud when Marquette loses.
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Taken one by one, your analysis of each team could end up being correct. But collectively, to expect all of them to underperform while Marquette excels, well, it seems unrealistic.
Any fan of any other Big East school could do a similar team-by-team review and say, "Marquette has not looked good. Marquette still has problems at PG so they'll underperform. Marquette has issues. Marquette's defense is good but offense too reliant on a few undependable players. Marquette isn't scary regardless of the overhyped preseason ratings. Marquette is dangerous but Duane Wilson's injury already has hurt their situation."
In other words, we see what we want to see.
"We see what we want to see" could also be applied to the sky is falling crowd. They want to extrapolate our conference record based solely on our performance without considering the performance of the other BEast teams. Most of the other teams in conference have significant short comings as well. Some, like Creighton, have probably under-performed more than MU.
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Let's not forget that SDSU is ranked top of the nation in opponent's per game, opp. FG% and opp. 3P%. It is possible that we have a good team who just struggled to score against an elite defense. Not all is lost!
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I'd agree with that which is why I never wrote, anywhere, that I expected all nine teams to underperform whilst at the same time expected Marquette to excel. Again, never wrote that. Never.
What I did write is that I feel a record like 15-3 is doable. Not probable. Not likely. Not absurd. But doable. And doable because every other team has some serious weaknesses. Cream will rise like Georgetown did last year after dropping their first two and it's a doable possibility that cream will be Marquette. In fact, based upon the recent successes of all the teams, Marquette is one team where it seems most doable they could rise to the top. Doable.
As to your last line, it's funny to be painted as a blind optimist when so many here have repeatedly painted me as a Buzz hater who's happy as a pig in the mud when Marquette loses.
OK, no insult intended.
And certainly no insult intended by my last line. Because we really do see what we want to see. All of us. Including me.
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A couple things I find funny, though entirely predictable, from this thread and others as I take a closer look...last year at about this same time, MU was 5-3 coming off a loss to UWGB for Heaven's sake. A home win against UW-Madison was their crowning achievement. They had lost to a decent Butler team, and were obliterated by Florida. Anyone see any similarities?
Of course given those monumental and completely unprecedented struggles, I can only assume that the same people currently lamenting his departure, were ripping Vander Blue up and down for his inconsistency early in the year. Sounds familiar.
I won't go back and look, but safe to say that team suffered from the same apathy, lack of toughness, leadership, couldn't shoot, etc. that we are hearing about this year.
This team may not pull it together the way last year's did, but there is every reason to believe that they will. As I've said before, new guys, and old guys doing new things. It takes some time.
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A couple things I find funny, though entirely predictable, from this thread and others as I take a closer look...last year at about this same time, MU was 5-3 coming off a loss to UWGB for Heaven's sake. A home win against UW-Madison was their crowning achievement. They had lost to a decent Butler team, and were obliterated by Florida. Anyone see any similarities?
Of course given those monumental and completely unprecedented struggles, I can only assume that the same people currently lamenting his departure, were ripping Vander Blue up and down for his inconsistency early in the year. Sounds familiar.
I won't go back and look, but safe to say that team suffered from the same apathy, lack of toughness, leadership, couldn't shoot, etc. that we are hearing about this year.
This team may not pull it together the way last year's did, but there is every reason to believe that they will. As I've said before, new guys, and old guys doing new things. It takes some time.
Well, when you put it like that I feel pretty good about this year so far, although I have never been overly worried.
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A couple things I find funny, though entirely predictable, from this thread and others as I take a closer look...last year at about this same time, MU was 5-3 coming off a loss to UWGB for Heaven's sake. A home win against UW-Madison was their crowning achievement. They had lost to a decent Butler team, and were obliterated by Florida. Anyone see any similarities?
Of course given those monumental and completely unprecedented struggles, I can only assume that the same people currently lamenting his departure, were ripping Vander Blue up and down for his inconsistency early in the year. Sounds familiar.
I won't go back and look, but safe to say that team suffered from the same apathy, lack of toughness, leadership, couldn't shoot, etc. that we are hearing about this year.
This team may not pull it together the way last year's did, but there is every reason to believe that they will. As I've said before, new guys, and old guys doing new things. It takes some time.
Well said.
This ain't new, guys.
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A couple things I find funny, though entirely predictable, from this thread and others as I take a closer look...last year at about this same time, MU was 5-3 coming off a loss to UWGB for Heaven's sake. A home win against UW-Madison was their crowning achievement. They had lost to a decent Butler team, and were obliterated by Florida. Anyone see any similarities?
Of course given those monumental and completely unprecedented struggles, I can only assume that the same people currently lamenting his departure, were ripping Vander Blue up and down for his inconsistency early in the year. Sounds familiar.
I won't go back and look, but safe to say that team suffered from the same apathy, lack of toughness, leadership, couldn't shoot, etc. that we are hearing about this year.
This team may not pull it together the way last year's did, but there is every reason to believe that they will. As I've said before, new guys, and old guys doing new things. It takes some time.
By this time last year, Marquette actually was 5-2 and was getting ready to play (and impressively defeat) Wisconsin. The UWGB loss happened later and dropped our record to 7-3.
So while I agree that it is too early to judge this team, it isn't out of line to have healthy concerns about legitimate issues. Of course, one person's healthy concern might be another's "We're Doomed!"
Those who are sure we're doomed seem irrational. But it also isn't completely rational to simply assume that just because something happened last year -- bad or good (or both) -- the pattern automatically will repeat.