So I am sitting in a Bellevue Starbucks reading Scoop when I sense the elderly gent waiting for his drink is reading over my shoulder. As I am turning he asks if I am a Marquette fan. After relating my connection he asks if I know Glenn Rivers, saying Rivers now has his old job. It was then I realize it is Bill Russell. I had no idea but he lives about a mile from this Starbucks. We visited for 20 minutes and I discovered he is extremely knowledgeable about contemporary college hoops. His thoughts from our conversation:
Marquette:
- He is a huge fan of Buzz Williams. Said he's genuine. Believes Buzz wins over parents with his sincerity and commitment to developing the total man.
- Thinks Buzz will stay at Marquette. Buzz is well paid and is top dog in athletics.
- Thinks Buzz is a National Championship caliber coach.
- I didn't ask about Crean, forgetting Tanned Tommy brought Russell in to speak with Marquette's players. Curious though that Russell didn't mention Crean.
Big East:
- Sad to see the greatest basketball conference fall apart.
- Basketball schools need to get away from football schools.
- Wants to see a Jumbo basketball conference with a Big West division of Zags, Seattle, St Mary's, Loyola Marymount, and his alma mater among others that would join the Big East 10 at MSG every year.
- Really likes Brad Stevens, Mark Few, and Shaka Smart too. Likes their coaching philosophies, stewardship, and loyalty.
Doc Rivers:
- Likes the job Doc is doing but thinks he moves into front office.
- Doesn't like Ainge as a person but respects him as a basketball person.
- Still hates Boston. Said he has kept a home in the NW because it was inclusive. Boston is still too racially divided.
NBA:
- Glad to see Stern retiring. (I got the sense he dislikes the Commish)
- Doesn't like the lack of competitive balance. Stern's world is 5 teams then everybody else.
- Thinks Milwaukee loses its franchise soon.
- Best player he played with was Bob Cousy.
- Best player is Magic Johnson.
The rest of our conversation was local restaurants and Air Force experiences. Interesting man. He looks great and looks like he could still lace 'em up.
"Still hates Boston. Said he has kept a home in the NW because it was inclusive. Boston is still too racially divided."
Boston is absurdly racially divided. It has to be the whitest big city east of the Mississippi. At least it seemed that way to me. It's totally white, then all of a sudden Mattapan is all African American. Strange to say the least. Somewhat disturbing.
Great post keefe. Interesting stuff to say the least.
He could be right about the Bucks, except that Herb Kohl has no intention of selling—and if he does, it will be to a buyer who will keep the team in Milwaukee. Kohl has recently stated this in no uncertain terms.
Quote from: Groin_pull on June 05, 2013, 07:04:58 PM
He could be right about the Bucks, except that Herb Kohl has no intention of selling—and if he does, it will be to a buyer who will keep the team in Milwaukee. Kohl has recently stated this in no uncertain terms.
With regard to the Bucks I think he doesn't feel it is a viable NBA market. I forgot to mention his belief that the NBA becomes truly global with Europe and Asia being prime markets for expansion.
Congrats on posting one of the 2-3 truly interesting off-season posts. Great to hear this!
Super interesting read. Thanks, keefe!
Quote from: Groin_pull on June 05, 2013, 07:04:58 PM
He could be right about the Bucks, except that Herb Kohl has no intention of selling—and if he does, it will be to a buyer who will keep the team in Milwaukee. Kohl has recently stated this in no uncertain terms.
...And he would never lie to us!
Bill Russell is perhaps the most overrated player in basketball history. To begin to even compare him with Chamberlain is absolutely ridiculous.
Quote from: jmayer1 on June 06, 2013, 12:49:07 AM
Bill Russell is perhaps the most overrated player in basketball history. To begin to even compare him with Chamberlain is absolutely ridiculous.
I agree. His resume is clearly a bit thin...
Won two NCAA Championships at U of San Francisco
Won 11 NBA Titles with Celtics
Won Gold Medal as Captain of the US Men's 1956 Olympic Basketball Team
(Called the Original Dream Team, Russell's Olympic champs won by an average margin of +54 points)
Most Championships won by a Professional American Athlete (any sport)
Named NBA MVP five times
Named NBA All Star 12 times (in 13 seasons)
Member Naismith Basketball Hall of Fame
Member National Collegiate Basketball Hall of Fame
Named to NBA 25th Anniversary Team
Named to NBA 35th Anniversary Team
Named to NBA's 50 All Time Greats
NBA Finals MVP Trophy named for him
2nd All Time NBA Total Rebounds
2nd All Time NBA Avg RPG
One of two players to grab 50 Rebounds in One Game
He is erudite, insightful, and witty. He mentioned his daughter is a Harvard Law grad and that he wished he had worked towards a PhD after his playing days. He was also one helluva ball player. He and Wilt are apples and oranges. Players with completely different skills, strengths, and roles. I would be hard pressed to say either was the better. Some guys like scotch while others like bourbon. Neither is wrong.
That's a great story! I think our own Murffius actually played against him.
Quote from: jmayer1 on June 06, 2013, 12:49:07 AM
Bill Russell is perhaps the most overrated player in basketball history. To begin to even compare him with Chamberlain is absolutely ridiculous.
Hmmmm...But to compare Russell=Otule would be a better one!
Great post!
Quote from: jmayer1 on June 06, 2013, 12:49:07 AM
Bill Russell is perhaps the most overrated player in basketball history. To begin to even compare him with Chamberlain is absolutely ridiculous.
Why did you stop watching sports in 1960. Since then a whole list of "most over rated" have played
Gretzky, Jordon, Montana, Barry Sanders, LeBron, Pele....
Quote from: jmayer1 on June 06, 2013, 12:49:07 AM
Bill Russell is perhaps the most overrated player in basketball history. To begin to even compare him with Chamberlain is absolutely ridiculous.
I highly doubt anyone on this board has ever actually seen enough games of Chamberlain or Russell to have a real educated opinion on the matter. Any comparison would just be made off looking at career highlight reels, and all time stat sheets. Having said that, I still fail to see why the comparison is ridiculous.
I saw a lot of the Russell vs Wilt games. It was a great debate at the time: who was better? I always liked Russell because he won--though whether Wilt with the 76'ers or Lakers, Russell always had better supporting cast. Wilt had far better individual stats but Russell had great stats too and a better team. He was a lot shorter than Wilt but always gave him all he could handle. Officials always protected Wilt which is why he never fouled out. This was, and still is, a great sports debate.
Quote from: Gato78 on June 06, 2013, 09:21:37 AM
I saw a lot of the Russell vs Wilt games. It was a great debate at the time: who was better? I always liked Russell because he won--though whether Wilt with the 76'ers or Lakers, Russell always had better supporting cast. Wilt had far better individual stats but Russell had great stats too and a better team. He was a lot shorter than Wilt but always gave him all he could handle. Officials always protected Wilt which is why he never fouled out. This was, and still is, a great sports debate.
What makes it a great debate is that they were so very different, as both players and persons. Russell was the consummate team player and he made the Celtics Dynasty. A terrific defender and rebounder he was the heart of a team that dominated in a way no other in any sport has done. Wilt compiled phenomenal offensive statistics. The irony is that towards the end of his career, Chamberlain filled a role similar to Russell's. The Lakers had more than enough offensive firepower so Chamberlain focused on anchoring the defense and rebounding.
This is one of those questions for which there will never be a definitive answer. Some guys like blondes while others prefer brunettes. Ginger or Mary Ann.
Ginger is perhaps the most overrated character in sitcom history. To begin to even compare her with Mary Ann is absolutely ridiculous.
Quote from: Terror Skink on June 06, 2013, 12:20:10 PM
Ginger is perhaps the most overrated character in sitcom history. To begin to even compare her with Mary Ann is absolutely ridiculous.
I forget, which one had the bigger knockers?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on June 06, 2013, 12:23:40 PM
I forget, which one had the bigger knockers?
I believe they were both extremely talented actresses, 4ever.
(http://i.ytimg.com/vi/XTw1lzxTAis/0.jpg)
Quote from: 4everwarriors on June 06, 2013, 12:23:40 PM
I forget, which one had the bigger knockers?
Quote from: 4everwarriors on June 06, 2013, 12:23:40 PM
I forget, which one had the bigger knockers?
The Skipper
Quote from: keefe on June 06, 2013, 01:16:20 AM
I agree. His resume is clearly a bit thin...
Won two NCAA Championships at U of San Francisco
Won 11 NBA Titles with Celtics
Won Gold Medal as Captain of the US Men's 1956 Olympic Basketball Team
(Called the Original Dream Team, Russell's Olympic champs won by an average margin of +54 points)
Most Championships won by a Professional American Athlete (any sport)
Named NBA MVP five times
Named NBA All Star 12 times (in 13 seasons)
Member Naismith Basketball Hall of Fame
Member National Collegiate Basketball Hall of Fame
Named to NBA 25th Anniversary Team
Named to NBA 35th Anniversary Team
Named to NBA's 50 All Time Greats
NBA Finals MVP Trophy named for him
2nd All Time NBA Total Rebounds
2nd All Time NBA Avg RPG
One of two players to grab 50 Rebounds in One Game
He is erudite, insightful, and witty. He mentioned his daughter is a Harvard Law grad and that he wished he had worked towards a PhD after his playing days. He was also one helluva ball player. He and Wilt are apples and oranges. Players with completely different skills, strengths, and roles. I would be hard pressed to say either was the better. Some guys like scotch while others like bourbon. Neither is wrong.
Your posts require a dictionary/thesaurus.
Great post, keefe.
The part I just can't get over is that you live in the Seattle area...and still get your coffee at Starbucks.
Quote from: GooooMarquette on June 06, 2013, 01:06:16 PM
Great post, keefe.
The part I just can't get over is that you live in the Seattle area...and still get your coffee at Starbucks.
I used to go to Cowgirls Espresso, Java Juggs, or Hot Chick-a-Latte for my daily fix until my wife shamed me into returning to Starbucks...
Actually, I usually go to Café Ladro or Macrina Bakery for my java. If I'm lazy I'll hit the Starbucks just down the street in Bellevue. The Starbucks around here serve alcohol and stay open past midnight.
Seattle has pioneered the Bikini Barista concept. Here is a directory of the establishments dedicated to a superb multi-sensory customer experience:
http://bikini-baristas.com/
http://www.foxyladycoffee.com/
Quote from: keefe on June 06, 2013, 01:18:26 PM
I used to go to Cowgirls Espresso, Java Juggs, or Hot Chick-a-Latte for my daily fix until my wife shamed me into returning to Starbucks...
Wow - I'd have to pay cash if I ever went to those places, or there'd be hell to pay when the CC bill arrived. :-[
Quote from: keefe on June 06, 2013, 01:18:26 PM
I used to go to Cowgirls Espresso, Java Juggs, or Hot Chick-a-Latte for my daily fix until my wife shamed me into returning to Starbucks...
Actually, I usually go to Café Ladro or Macrina Bakery for my java. If I'm lazy I'll hit the Starbucks just down the street in Bellevue. The Starbucks around here serve alcohol and stay open past midnight.
Seattle has pioneered the Bikini Barista concept. Here is a directory of the establishments dedicated to a superb multi-sensory customer experience:
http://bikini-baristas.com/
http://www.foxyladycoffee.com/
I truly love America. And I have another stop to make when I head to Seattle this fall.
Russell was so much better than Wilt it was funny. Yes, Wilt was bigger, stronger, etc., etc. Russell, however, was smarter and understood the team concept that Wilt would never get.
As an aside, when I left MA to go to Milwaukee, I came across an article that described the most concentrated black ghetto in the country - Milwaukee's.
I remember being told that "we were waiting for Groppi (spelling?) at the end of the 16th street bridge."
Honest to God true story. One of the very first of these was Cowgirls Espresso right outside the Main Gate of McChord AFB. When it opened hundreds of guys who lived ON BASE were driving out the gate to get their coffee (even though there are 4 Starbucks on base!) All of these additional cars at rush hour snarled traffic; it was taking 45 minutes to get on base. The Wing Commander was enraged and wanted to put the stand "off-limits" until a JAG advised him otherwise.
I noticed a lot of our young airmen had distinctive cups from the stand...the girls kiss the cups leaving lipstick prints and sign the guys names...so I asked one young Senior Airman if the coffee was any good. He just smiled and said, "Best damn $10 cuppa in the world, sir!"
As it turns out, the baristas are essentially nekkid and perform a show in the full length drive up window. This is the military so this is happening at 0620! Nothing like mornin' wood
The comments on racial segregation got me to wondering if there are any recent studies. As it turns out, this study (http://www.businessinsider.com/most-segregated-cities-census-maps-2013-4?op=1) using 2010 census data lists Milwaukee as the nation's second most racially devided city, behind only Detroit. Boston is tenth on the list. FWIW....
Quote from: mileskishnish72 on June 06, 2013, 01:58:22 PM
Russell was so much better than Wilt it was funny. Yes, Wilt was bigger, stronger, etc., etc. Russell, however, was smarter and understood the team concept that Wilt would never get.
As an aside, when I left MA to go to Milwaukee, I came across an article that described the most concentrated black ghetto in the country - Milwaukee's.
I remember being told that "we were waiting for Groppi (spelling?) at the end of the 16th street bridge."
Based on a 20 minute conversation I will say Bill Russell is a very thoughtful, articulate, and gracious man with definite passions, concerns, and convictions. Wilt Chamberlain spoke of bedding 20,000 women; Bill Russell concerns himself with finding beds for thousands of homeless single mothers. Therein lies the difference.
Quote from: Terror Skink on June 06, 2013, 01:50:24 PM
I truly love America. And I have another stop to make when I head to Seattle this fall.
Lizard
Do look me up when you are in this area. I think having a beer with you would be stimulating. I mean that in a positive way.
Crash
Quote from: keefe on June 06, 2013, 02:06:20 PM
Honest to God true story. One of the very first of these was Cowgirls Espresso right outside the Main Gate of McChord AFB. When it opened hundreds of guys who lived ON BASE were driving out the gate to get their coffee (even though there are 4 Starbucks on base!) All of these additional cars at rush hour snarled traffic; it was taking 45 minutes to get on base. The Wing Commander was enraged and wanted to put the stand "off-limits" until a JAG advised him otherwise.
I noticed a lot of our young airmen had distinctive cups from the stand...the girls kiss the cups leaving lipstick prints and sign the guys names...so I asked one young Senior Airman if the coffee was any good. He just smiled and said, "Best damn $10 cuppa in the world, sir!"
As it turns out, the baristas are essentially nekkid and perform a show in the full length drive up window. This is the military so this is happening at 0620! Nothing like mornin' wood
I'll give the military a lot of credit for a lot of things, but morning wood is by no means an exclusive to those in uniform.
So says Rosie Palm and her 5 friends.
I am mostly a lurker / seldom poster, but I must respond to this post by keefe, Outstanding! Thank you.
Tell me though, WTH is Bill Russell doing living in Milwaukee? That really threw me. My last reference to Russell was a Golf Channel story on him living in Seattle. I am trying to figure out why Bill Russell is living in Milwaukee? I may start hanging out in your coffee shop, stalking Bill Russell. It would be great to talk with him, but I have always read that he is an extremely private person.
I am old enough to have watched a lot of Bill Russell on TV only. I was in the Wilt favorers group because Wilt was a unique scoring machine, especially when young. Russell was incredible on defense, and always had a strong supporting cast versus Wilt. Enjoying this thread immensely.
Quote from: CoachRaymondsClass on June 06, 2013, 10:08:47 PM
I am mostly a lurker / seldom poster, but I must respond to this post by keefe, Outstanding! Thank you.
Tell me though, WTH is Bill Russell doing living in Milwaukee? That really threw me. My last reference to Russell was a Golf Channel story on him living in Seattle. I am trying to figure out why Bill Russell is living in Milwaukee? I may start hanging out in your coffee shop, stalking Bill Russell. It would be great to talk with him, but I have always read that he is an extremely private person.
I am old enough to have watched a lot of Bill Russell on TV only. I was in the Wilt favorers group because Wilt was a unique scoring machine, especially when young. Russell was incredible on defense, and always had a strong supporting cast versus Wilt. Enjoying this thread immensely.
Coach, he ran into hin in the Seattle area where keefe lives.
Great matchup....Wilt v Lew Alcindor...... Discuss.
Also had the greatest commercial of all time!
An AT&T commercial where he wings the ball up behind his back and without looking at a goal and somehow hits the shot.
His tag line was supposed to be "I missed, but you can't with AT&T."
As the entire background of the commercial was laughing, he improvised and said, "I can't miss.. and neither can you.., with AT&T."
Best commercial ever!!!!!!!
Quote from: real chili 83 on June 06, 2013, 10:17:02 PM
Coach, he ran into hin in the Seattle area where keefe lives.
Great matchup....Wilt v Lew Alcindor...... Discuss.
TOTALLY misunderstood and misplaced. I am thinking that there was a Starbucks in Milwaukee on Bellevue on the East Side. Laughing at myself. Of course, I should have recognized the suburb of Seattle, because I have spent some time there. I must really be getting old :D
Quote from: MURFC on June 06, 2013, 12:47:46 PM
Your posts require a dictionary/thesaurus.
Not if you are a Marquette grad that actually did all of the required reading.
Quote from: dgies9156 on June 06, 2013, 10:42:22 PM
Also had the greatest commercial of all time!
An AT&T commercial where he wings the ball up behind his back and without looking at a goal and somehow hits the shot.
His tag line was supposed to be "I missed, but you can't with AT&T."
As the entire background of the commercial was laughing, he improvised and said, "I can't miss.. and neither can you.., with AT&T."
Best commercial ever!!!!!!!
I don't know....this more recent one with Bill Russell is pretty darn funny:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaUiLpTL4fY
Quote from: CoachRaymondsClass on June 07, 2013, 10:31:41 AM
TOTALLY misunderstood and misplaced. I am thinking that there was a Starbucks in Milwaukee on Bellevue on the East Side. Laughing at myself. Of course, I should have recognized the suburb of Seattle, because I have spent some time there. I must really be getting old :D
Coach,
We're all getting old!
If Russell is reticent I think it may be with the media. He knew many others at the Starbucks by name. Russell approached me because he noticed I was reading something about Marquette basketball (Scoop, actually.) He commented Seattle basketball fans can only speak on UDub/Pac12, as if there is no college basketball east of the Cascades. He mentioned he frequents that Starbucks at least 4 days a week and said he'll look for me as he wants to hear more Air Force stories.
Quote from: warriorchick on June 07, 2013, 11:54:56 AM
Not if you are a Marquette grad that actually did all of the required reading.
Wait - there was required reading?
Quote from: keefe on June 07, 2013, 12:34:18 PM
Coach,
We're all getting old!
If Russell is reticent I think it may be with the media. He knew many others at the Starbucks by name. Russell approached me because he noticed I was reading something about Marquette basketball (Scoop, actually.) He commented Seattle basketball fans can only speak on UDub/Pac12, as if there is no college basketball east of the Cascades. He mentioned he frequents that Starbucks at least 4 days a week and said he'll look for me as he wants to hear more Air Force stories.
You should ask him about Al owning Cousy, I'd love to hear his opinion on that escapade.
Quote from: cbowe3 on June 07, 2013, 01:05:52 PM
You should ask him about Al owning Cousy, I'd love to hear his opinion on that escapade.
Wasn't that about Al's defense on Cousy consisting of fouling him?
I'm not sure of the exact details because I wasn't around, but I thought the story was that Al gathered the media around to talk sh!t to Cousy before a game and since they grew up on the same parks playing against each other they were buddies. So Al jumped on a table then shouted "I own Cousy" and it was a big deal. This was his way of getting in his head and somewhat making a name for himself through the media.
Quote from: cbowe3 on June 07, 2013, 02:20:11 PM
I'm not sure of the exact details because I wasn't around, but I thought the story was that Al gathered the media around to talk sh!t to Cousy before a game and since they grew up on the same parks playing against each other they were buddies. So Al jumped on a table then shouted "I own Cousy" and it was a big deal. This was his way of getting in his head and somewhat making a name for himself through the media.
I've read that it was while Al was with the Knicks. He always claimed he could stop Cousy, so they played him on Cousy when the Knicks played the Celtics...and Al proceeded to commit foul after foul. Here's what it says on Al's Wiki page:
After college, McGuire played in the NBA, first with the New York Knicks (1951–53) and then with the Baltimore Bullets (1954). While with the Knicks, he once famously pleaded with his coach for playing time, with this guarantee: "I can stop Cousy." Inserted into the lineup, McGuire proceeded to foul him on his next six trips down the court.
Quote from: keefe on June 07, 2013, 01:10:20 PM
Wasn't that about Al's defense on Cousy consisting of fouling him?
Keefe, say hi to THE Goose in AK this week.
Quote from: real chili 83 on June 07, 2013, 03:36:04 PM
Keefe, say hi to THE Goose in AK this week.
Roger, Goose. Whack 'em in Ontario, bro. Good hunting.
Tight lines and safe travels.
Quote from: GooooMarquette on June 07, 2013, 12:43:29 PM
Wait - there was required reading?
(http://imgc.allpostersimages.com/images/P-473-488-90/65/6569/9Q72100Z/posters/danny-shanahan-see-spot-run-see-spot-run-who-wrote-this-crap-new-yorker-cartoon.jpg)
I think this was the coolest thing I've read all offseason. Finally something really worth reading. Thanks for posting.