MUScoop

MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: tower912 on March 02, 2013, 05:53:23 PM

Title: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: tower912 on March 02, 2013, 05:53:23 PM
Has he finally turned the corner for good?    Some thought he lacked the physical tools, some thought he just lacked the warrior mentality.    He has really brought the warrior mentality lately and shown off the elite physical skills that he has.    Well played today, young man. 
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Lennys Tap on March 02, 2013, 05:57:51 PM
Made some really big plays today in the second half when our offense was struggling.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: forgetful on March 02, 2013, 06:02:44 PM
Was aggressive and played well.

I'd like to see us run some isolation plays for him in the wide post, he has a nice turnaround/fade away from the wings.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: CrazyEcho on March 02, 2013, 06:04:29 PM
to be fair, I don't think anyone has said he doens't have the physical tools.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: radome on March 02, 2013, 06:07:01 PM
Quote from: tower912 on March 02, 2013, 05:53:23 PM
Has he finally turned the corner for good?    Some thought he lacked the physical tools, some thought he just lacked the warrior mentality.    He has really brought the warrior mentality lately and shown off the elite physical skills that he has.    Well played today, young man. 
I don't know what it was but he is one of the keys to our success or failure. Glad to have him playing well.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: chapman on March 02, 2013, 06:09:06 PM
Quote from: tower912 on March 02, 2013, 05:53:23 PM
  Some thought he lacked the physical tools

If anyone thought that they're an idiot.  

He can shoot and can create his own shot.  Has a good rhythm going in the offense now.  Not a banger, but doing well with what he's comfortable doing.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: ATL MU Warrior on March 02, 2013, 06:28:08 PM
pretty sure some on here thought he lacked lateral quickness or something like that.  I could be confused with a thread about somebody else though.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: NotAnAlum on March 02, 2013, 08:36:49 PM
Someone said that he played well last year because he had to play the 5 and he could "keep up" with 5s because they are slow.  I think that idea is nonsense.  Jamil has the tools and the body to be a great college player and an NBA prospect.  It just seemed he wasn't 100% into the game.  The last few games he has been 100% in and he is showing the kind of player he can be.  Of course he elevated his game at this time last year only to regress early this season.  But I'm not worried about next year right now I'm thinking this year and hope the switch has been turned on.
I thought today we almost went to Jamil a little too much in the 2nd half.  It became give the ball to Jamil and everybody else stand back and watch what he can do.  Can't have that either.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Stretchdeltsig on March 03, 2013, 07:12:34 AM
It was great to see that Jamil wanted the ball and when he caught it, would create his shot and scored repeatedly.  He had the "go to player" mentality today.  Love it!
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: GGGG on March 03, 2013, 07:21:17 AM
Quote from: ATL MU Warrior on March 02, 2013, 06:28:08 PM
pretty sure some on here thought he lacked lateral quickness or something like that.  I could be confused with a thread about somebody else though.


No that was about Jamil.  And he does lack lateral quickness - he's an explosive leaper, but not particularly fast. 

And he isn't scoring by "creating his own shot."  He is scoring by hitting mid-range jumpers, curling off picks and spot shooting.  When is the last time you have seen him put the ball on the floor and take it to the basket?  When is the last time you have even seen him take two dribbles before shooting?
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Goose on March 03, 2013, 07:32:58 AM
He has NBA physical tools. It probably comes down to just much Jamil wants it. Watching him on the court yesterday he looked like a man against boys. He is long, quick, great leaping ability and skilled. He was a joy to watch yesterday.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: GGGG on March 03, 2013, 08:11:07 AM
Goose, sorry, but Jamil isn't quick.  When is the last time you saw him take his guy off the dribble?  He has an NBA body, and great leaping ability, but think about what JFB did and how he played versus how Jamil plays.  They are pretty much the same exact size, but Butler was much better at staying in front of his guy on defense and taking his guy off the dribble.  This is exactly why I don't think Jamil has an NBA game, unless he keeps improving on his outside shot - and can serve a spot shooter type role. 

And I love the guy.  I love how he plays now and how smart he is.  I just don't think he has some of the tools that people think he does.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: hairy worthen on March 03, 2013, 08:19:47 AM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 03, 2013, 08:11:07 AM
Goose, sorry, but Jamil isn't quick.  When is the last time you saw him take his guy off the dribble?  He has an NBA body, and great leaping ability, but think about what JFB did and how he played versus how Jamil plays.  They are pretty much the same exact size, but Butler was much better at staying in front of his guy on defense and taking his guy off the dribble.  This is exactly why I don't think Jamil has an NBA game, unless he keeps improving on his outside shot - and can serve a spot shooter type role. 

And I love the guy.  I love how he plays now and how smart he is.  I just don't think he has some of the tools that people think he does.
I am not sure. I think he does have quickness. Just because he doesn't take his guy off the dribble doesn't mean he can't. I not sure he has tried that much. To me it is a matter of desire and aggressiveness not lack of ability
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: MarquetteDano on March 03, 2013, 08:59:08 AM
Jamil is really our only true zone buster.  He shined in the second half when ND went zone.  He did a great job yesterday finding the seams in the zone and taking mid-range shots.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Lennys Tap on March 03, 2013, 09:08:49 AM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 03, 2013, 08:11:07 AM
Goose, sorry, but Jamil isn't quick.  When is the last time you saw him take his guy off the dribble?  He has an NBA body, and great leaping ability, but think about what JFB did and how he played versus how Jamil plays.  They are pretty much the same exact size, but Butler was much better at staying in front of his guy on defense and taking his guy off the dribble.  This is exactly why I don't think Jamil has an NBA game, unless he keeps improving on his outside shot - and can serve a spot shooter type role. 

And I love the guy.  I love how he plays now and how smart he is.  I just don't think he has some of the tools that people think he does.

Agree 100%.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: brandx on March 03, 2013, 10:11:46 AM
Quote from: hairyworthen on March 03, 2013, 08:19:47 AM
I am not sure. I think he does have quickness. Just because he doesn't take his guy off the dribble doesn't mean he can't. I not sure he has tried that much. To me it is a matter of desire and aggressiveness not lack of ability

I agree, Hairy. I think he lacks the agressiveness to go one-on-one. But, it's coming. Watching him on defense, he shows great quickness. He's also started to take a leadership role on defense that I think will translate to both ends of the floor next year.

Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: MU82 on March 03, 2013, 10:37:18 AM
Jamil has been more willing to take advantage of opportunities to score. He hasn't been hesitant. He is scoring more and playing more, which makes him more confident, which lets him score and play more, which makes him more confident, lather, rinse, repeat.

He is at his best as a catch-and-shoot guy when open and as an alley-oop dunker.  The few times he has tried to go one-on-one and take fadeaway jumpers from the baseline or key have been unsuccessful and result in misses that lead to opportunities for the opponent -- almost the same as turnovers.

I love him catching when he is open and firing the 3, and I really like his open 15-footer from either baseline. He obviously likes those shots, too!

I agree with Sultan that, to date, he hasn't shown the ability to stay in front of his man and take over stretches of games with his defense (as Butler used to). Given his physical tools, it's a little disappointing that he is at best a mediocre defender.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: 77ncaachamps on March 03, 2013, 10:55:51 AM
Jamil is probably the only guy who plays end-to-end, sideline-to-sideline with speed and tenacity.
His ability to get from the FT line to the hoop defensively is uncanny.

He needs to be confident and have more of a takeover attitude.

But it is mind-boggling when a player of his caliber and ability disappears in games.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Canned Goods n Ammo on March 03, 2013, 01:16:41 PM
Jamil is a freaky athlete, but he does not have elite quickness.

BUT...

A good jumper can make you "quicker" because players have to guard you tight.

On defense, a good scouting report and anticipation can make you "quicker".

If Jamil can continue to shoot a good percentage and increase his usage, the sky is the limit. He has some physical traits that make him a very good player.

Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: MUSF on March 03, 2013, 01:20:52 PM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 03, 2013, 08:11:07 AM
Goose, sorry, but Jamil isn't quick.  When is the last time you saw him take his guy off the dribble? 

Yesterday against Notre Dame. He got fouled but still had a nice drive.

I remember this, because it was the first time that I saw a glimpse of that NBA quickness to go with his NBA body and hops. I think I still agree with your assessment of Jamil, but I started doubting that assessment a little bit yesterday.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Goose on March 03, 2013, 03:38:04 PM
Guns

I agree. In addition, him being so long helps in quickness. I think he has the tools in the world. The way he is playing now is hopefully great sign for next season from him.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: forgetful on March 03, 2013, 03:51:32 PM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 03, 2013, 08:11:07 AM
Goose, sorry, but Jamil isn't quick.  When is the last time you saw him take his guy off the dribble?  He has an NBA body, and great leaping ability, but think about what JFB did and how he played versus how Jamil plays.  They are pretty much the same exact size, but Butler was much better at staying in front of his guy on defense and taking his guy off the dribble.  This is exactly why I don't think Jamil has an NBA game, unless he keeps improving on his outside shot - and can serve a spot shooter type role. 

And I love the guy.  I love how he plays now and how smart he is.  I just don't think he has some of the tools that people think he does.

You may be right about his quickness, but I disagree.  I think he is very quick, but lacks good footwork (hence him almost traveling every time he catches the ball.  The lack of good footwork manifests as not being quick.  I think if they work on his footwork over the summer, he could be elite.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: GGGG on March 03, 2013, 03:54:12 PM
Quote from: forgetful on March 03, 2013, 03:51:32 PM
You may be right about his quickness, but I disagree.  I think he is very quick, but lacks good footwork (hence him almost traveling every time he catches the ball.  The lack of good footwork manifests as not being quick.  I think if they work on his footwork over the summer, he could be elite.


Well, he might not be quick because of bad footwork...but in the end it means he's not quick.  I hope it is something he can work on. 
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: forgetful on March 03, 2013, 03:58:44 PM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 03, 2013, 03:54:12 PM

Well, he might not be quick because of bad footwork...but in the end it means he's not quick.  I hope it is something he can work on. 

When I wrote that I though we might really be agreeing with each other.  My big point is that quickness can't be taught really, but if it is a footwork issue that is something he can work on.  I agree, though, lets hope it is something he gets together by next year.  If so, I really like this team.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: GGGG on March 03, 2013, 04:01:40 PM
Quote from: forgetful on March 03, 2013, 03:58:44 PM
When I wrote that I though we might really be agreeing with each other.  My big point is that quickness can't be taught really, but if it is a footwork issue that is something he can work on.  I agree, though, lets hope it is something he gets together by next year.  If so, I really like this team.


Yeah we agree.

Maybe it's a "stride" issue too.  He can be "fast," in that he can cover a lot of space.  But perhaps he can trouble with acceleration because of the length of his stride and his footwork.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: tower912 on March 03, 2013, 04:05:10 PM
His 'stride' is long.   Perhaps that is why it looks like he doesn't slide or change direction well to you.   When he plays smart and plays aggressive, he is quick enough.    When he plays passive, he looks slow.   To my eyes, he has all of the physical tools he needs.   It all comes down to how smart and how aggressive he is playing.     The last couple of games, he has been smart and aggressive.   If he continues to play smart and aggressive, there will be no more questions about his athleticism. 
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Goose on March 03, 2013, 04:08:07 PM
I cannot believe that anyone could question the kind of athlete he is. Last year Buzz said he had the tools to be an all time great and Buzz does not throw out positives often. IMO the kid is highly athletic.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: GGGG on March 03, 2013, 04:23:36 PM
Goose, Jamil is very athletic.  He can leap, he has good hands, he has good straight line speed.  He is also very intelligent.  He just isn't exceptionally quick.  Which is why he picks up cheap fouls away from the basket, and his offense is limited to cleaning up on the boards and taking set shots.  Again, he doesn't take people off the dribble, and I don't think its simply because he isn't aggressive, but because he doesn't have that burst of acceleration.  And that may simply be poor footwork...I don't know...but I think it is fairly obvious that he lacks something.

I'm not trying to rag on the guy too much, but when people say he has "all the tools to be an NBA player," it isn't entirely accurate.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Goose on March 03, 2013, 06:04:49 PM
Sultan

Have watched ball for over 40 years and feel I understand the game quite well. That coupled with Buzz saying Jamil has a chance to leave MU as an all time great is enough for me to stick with my opinion. I think Jamil has enough tools to play at very high level.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Stretchdeltsig on March 03, 2013, 07:15:04 PM
Love to watch jamil play.  When you watch him, you get the feeling that the sky's the limit for him and that he hasn't played his best game yet.  Thankful that he's a Warrior!
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: tower912 on March 05, 2013, 08:12:36 PM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 03, 2013, 08:11:07 AM
  When is the last time you saw him take his guy off the dribble? 



Tonight, against Rutgers. 
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: martyconlonontherun on March 05, 2013, 08:23:43 PM
Quote from: Stretchdeltsig on March 03, 2013, 07:15:04 PM
Love to watch jamil play.  When you watch him, you get the feeling that the sky's the limit for him and that he hasn't played his best game yet.  Thankful that he's a Warrior!

Which makes me sad because he is running out of time in a MU uniform. Reminds me of Tim Thomas when he was with the Bucks.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: MUSF on March 05, 2013, 08:36:56 PM
Quote from: martyconlonontherun on March 05, 2013, 08:23:43 PM
Which makes me sad because he is running out of time in a MU uniform. Reminds me of Tim Thomas when he was with the Bucks.

Good comparison. I love Jamil's game right now.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: tower912 on March 05, 2013, 08:40:40 PM
Quote from: martyconlonontherun on March 05, 2013, 08:23:43 PM
Which makes me sad because he is running out of time in a MU uniform. Reminds me of Tim Thomas when he was with the Bucks.

He's only a junior.   Are you privy to some information about him leaving?
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: martyconlonontherun on March 05, 2013, 08:53:12 PM
Quote from: tower912 on March 05, 2013, 08:40:40 PM
He's only a junior.   Are you privy to some information about him leaving?
Considering he redshirted a year, he is more than 3/4s of his way through his career. At the time of his transfer I had higher expectations for his career. Still a great asset but not what I would consider an all time great.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Silkk the Shaka on March 05, 2013, 09:00:03 PM
Quote from: martyconlonontherun on March 05, 2013, 08:53:12 PM
Considering he redshirted a year, he is more than 3/4s of his way through his career. At the time of his transfer I had higher expectations for his career. Still a great asset but not what I would consider an all time great.

His tournament story this year and entire senior year have yet to be written.  5th year seniors often outperform due to physical maturity, mental maturity, and experienced savvy.  I agree he has slightly under performed MY expectations thus far.... but it ain't over yet and he's clearly headed in the right direction.  How many would have thought Crowder would have been BEast POY at this point of the season his 1st year with us?  I highly doubt Jamil reaches those heights next year (few in a MU uni ever will), but if I had to bet I'd say he'll be an all-conference caliber player in the New BEast next year.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Stretchdeltsig on March 05, 2013, 09:26:40 PM
I thinks Jamil is an outstanding player and leader.  He is a winner.  Glad we have him for one more year!
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: AZWarrior on March 05, 2013, 09:39:17 PM
He's the one player that's been playing consistently well for us the last several games.  It's really good to see him consistently playing to his ability. 

Go JWil!   :)
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: BCHoopster on March 05, 2013, 11:13:48 PM
When Jamil scores MU seems to win, gets lots of open looks as teams sag to the big men all the time.  His confidence is growing,  I would like to see him hit a shot in the first half,
seems to be a second half player.  Rutgers let MU shot the outside shot, when they had to, they made a few.  Can not take any team lightly on there court.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: brewcity77 on March 06, 2013, 06:35:37 AM
He still passes up a few too many open threes. Seems like he always gets one great wide open look and thinks about it then passes the ball on. Want him to be aggressive and get that first shot. Maybe it's like a batter never swinging at the first pitch, but I remember one last night where I thought "you gotta take that shot!" and it seems like most nights he has at least 1-2 of those moments.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Goose on March 06, 2013, 07:05:45 AM
Agreed on when Jamil scors we often win. He is too important to not be top three scorer every night. He looks to me to be recharged and his attitude an body language look much better than a few weeks ago. Hope he keeps it up for 13 more months.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: JD on March 06, 2013, 10:00:45 AM
Not surprised by Jamil's recent play,  he did this last year too.


Kid loves pressure, i expect BIG things from him once the tournament starts.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: MerrittsMustache on March 06, 2013, 10:25:00 AM
I've often thought that this team tends to go as Junior goes, but it may actually be more accurate to say that the team goes as Jamil goes...

Jamil's offensive numbers:
22 wins: 24.6 min, 9.9 points, 49.7% FG%, 33.9% 3P%
7 losses: 23.0 min, 6.3 points, 34.8% FG%, 47.1% 3P%

Junior's offensive numbers:
22 wins: 27.6 min, 9.1 points, 45.3% FG%, 21.6% 3P%, 3.4 assists, 3.6 TOs
7 losses: 28.4 min, 7.0 points, 42.0% FG%, 25.0% 3P%, 4.5 assists, 2.2 TOs

Junior's A/TO in losses really stands out but if you take away Jamil's 16-point performance at GB, he's only averaged 4.7 points in MU's other 6 losses compared to nearly 10/game in wins.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: dwaderoy2004 on March 06, 2013, 10:29:33 AM
When Jamil is actively looking for his shot, our whole offense is better.  He's been aggressive lately...hope he keeps it up.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Henry Sugar on March 06, 2013, 10:36:03 AM
Jamil last year vs this year

(http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee41/roblowe14/Jamilv2.png)
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Silkk the Shaka on March 06, 2013, 12:21:49 PM
Quote from: Warrior's Path on March 06, 2013, 10:36:03 AM
Jamil last year vs this year

(http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee41/roblowe14/Jamilv2.png)

These comparison charts are sweet.  Really illustrate a point well.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Lennys Tap on March 06, 2013, 12:27:57 PM
Quote from: Warrior's Path on March 06, 2013, 10:36:03 AM
Jamil last year vs this year

(http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee41/roblowe14/Jamilv2.png)

I'm not an expert on charts but Jamil's looks like he's broken out.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: NotAnAlum on March 06, 2013, 12:40:44 PM
Quote from: Lennys Tap on March 06, 2013, 12:27:57 PM
I'm not an expert on charts but Jamil's looks like he's broken out.

What is being graphed on the vertical??
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: swoopem on March 06, 2013, 12:50:10 PM
Let's not forget that Jamil was our center last year for the majority of the big east season and was completely out of position. This is really his first year in Buzz's system where he is playing (in games) his natural position and is coming on at exactly the right time. I have a feeling he has turned a corner and will be huge for us the remainder of this year and more importantly during our national championship season next year.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Silkk the Shaka on March 06, 2013, 12:51:13 PM
Quote from: NotAnAlum on March 06, 2013, 12:40:44 PM
What is being graphed on the vertical??

I believe it's net points contribution.  I'll let Warrior's Path explain it...
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Henry Sugar on March 06, 2013, 01:08:56 PM
yeah, it's Net Points contributions on the vertical, and then the cumulative impact of the games on the horizontal. Basically, is that player a net-positive or net-negative contributor for the game?

There are a number of flaws with it, but I do think that it's a helpful view of how a player has been playing through the season. If you look at the charts, they generally pass the common sense test.

And yes, Jamil has been playing very strong pretty much since the start of conference play.

Finally, since I haven't said it in a few days, Free Steve Taylor!
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Silkk the Shaka on March 06, 2013, 01:28:26 PM
Quote from: Warrior's Path on March 06, 2013, 01:08:56 PM
yeah, it's Net Points contributions on the vertical, and then the cumulative impact of the games on the horizontal. Basically, is that player a net-positive or net-negative contributor for the game?

There are a number of flaws with it, but I do think that it's a helpful view of how a player has been playing through the season. If you look at the charts, they generally pass the common sense test.

And yes, Jamil has been playing very strong pretty much since the start of conference play.

Finally, since I haven't said it in a few days, Free Steve Taylor!


Would be interested to see THAT chart....
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Henry Sugar on March 06, 2013, 02:06:44 PM
Quote from: Jajuannaman on March 06, 2013, 01:28:26 PM
Would be interested to see THAT chart....

(http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee41/roblowe14/SteveTaylor.png)

Steve Taylor (9.3 mpg) comparison to Juan Anderson (13.5 mpg) and Jamil Wilson (24.2 mpg)

Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: GGGG on March 06, 2013, 02:08:20 PM
Quote from: Warrior's Path on March 06, 2013, 02:06:44 PM
(http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee41/roblowe14/SteveTaylor.png)

Steve Taylor (9.3 mpg) comparison to Juan Anderson (13.5 mpg) and Jamil Wilson (24.2 mpg)


When both Taylor and Wilson went out yesterday, Juan had to come in and was really, really struggling defensively. 
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: dwaderoy2004 on March 06, 2013, 02:10:35 PM
Juan is borderline useless right now.  That chart just confirms what me eyes were telling me.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Canned Goods n Ammo on March 06, 2013, 02:15:32 PM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 06, 2013, 02:08:20 PM

When both Taylor and Wilson went out yesterday, Juan had to come in and was really, really struggling defensively. 

I can't really figure Juan out.

Usually by this point, I can identify that a player is good at ABC, and can work on XYZ.

He's made a few shots, and his form looks good. He rebounds ok. He appears to be capable on defense (he's long, fast, tries hard). His ball handling doesn't stand out as particularly good or bad. But, I can't really tell what he is good at and what he is bad at. Kind of average or a little below average at everything.

I guess the stats will tell the story, but from the eye test, I can't really see where he's good or where he's bad. He's kind of just there.

Still has good potential, and would be a great 4 year player-development story for Buzz.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Canned Goods n Ammo on March 06, 2013, 02:17:47 PM
Quote from: dwaderoy2004 on March 06, 2013, 02:10:35 PM
Juan is borderline useless right now.  That chart just confirms what me eyes were telling me.

I guess I agree, but I don't really see him being deficient in any specific area. He's also not really good at anything either.

Some more strength and patience will certainly help next year (like Vander this year).

Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: dwaderoy2004 on March 06, 2013, 02:22:05 PM
Quote from: Guns n Ammo on March 06, 2013, 02:17:47 PM
I guess I agree, but I don't really see him being deficient in any specific area. He's also not really good at anything either.

Some more strength and patience will certainly help next year (like Vander this year).



For sure.  Useless relative to what Wilson and Taylor bring to the table.  There's not one thing he does better than either of those guys right now.  Didn't mean to be overly harsh...but if he's net negative, he shouldn't be seeing the court, especially when better options are there.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: MU82 on March 06, 2013, 02:25:12 PM
Jamil and Vander have made nice strides this season -- Vander the whole year, Jamil the last month or so.

Assuming they aren't victims of horrible advice and both come back for their senior seasons, they should be a very strong 1-2 punch. Maybe not Jae-DJO strong, but strong nonetheless.

Combine them with Gardner (and Otule?), Mayo (if he comes back), Taylor and the recruits, and it's pretty sweet ... especially if Duane Wilson turns out to be one of those special freshman PGs who can make a difference.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Silkk the Shaka on March 06, 2013, 02:31:01 PM
Quote from: Guns n Ammo on March 06, 2013, 02:15:32 PM
I can't really figure Juan out.

Usually by this point, I can identify that a player is good at ABC, and can work on XYZ.

He's made a few shots, and his form looks good. He rebounds ok. He appears to be capable on defense (he's long, fast, tries hard). His ball handling doesn't stand out as particularly good or bad. But, I can't really tell what he is good at and what he is bad at. Kind of average or a little below average at everything.

I guess the stats will tell the story, but from the eye test, I can't really see where he's good or where he's bad. He's kind of just there.

Still has good potential, and would be a great 4 year player-development story for Buzz.

He's not quick (yet) and is REAAAAALLLY skinny, I think mostly due to the fact that he had those shoulder problems.  While he hasn't stood out since the DePaul game (I believe), he provides some nice energy to start games and then primarily sits for JWilson & Taylor.  If he can pack on some lbs. this summer he could be a nice piece next year.  Clearly loves MU and brings a lot of enthusiasm to the team.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: GGGG on March 06, 2013, 02:33:25 PM
Quote from: Guns n Ammo on March 06, 2013, 02:15:32 PM
I can't really figure Juan out.

Usually by this point, I can identify that a player is good at ABC, and can work on XYZ.

He's made a few shots, and his form looks good. He rebounds ok. He appears to be capable on defense (he's long, fast, tries hard). His ball handling doesn't stand out as particularly good or bad. But, I can't really tell what he is good at and what he is bad at. Kind of average or a little below average at everything.

I guess the stats will tell the story, but from the eye test, I can't really see where he's good or where he's bad. He's kind of just there.

Still has good potential, and would be a great 4 year player-development story for Buzz.


I think he has potential to grow into a decent forward if he could just get a little stronger.  Look at him compared to Ryan Evans as a sophomore.  They are almost identical statistically - if anything Juan is ahead of where Evans was at the time.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?2-ryan-evans=2010-2011&add=2-ryan-evans&p1=juan-anderson

If he can grow into a player like Evans...someone who hustles, plays defense, hits a shot now and then...then I will be pleased.  If you have a front line of Anderson, Taylor and McKay the year after next, that is a lot of speed and length for opposing defenses to deal with.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Henry Sugar on March 06, 2013, 02:34:53 PM
Quote from: dwaderoy2004 on March 06, 2013, 02:10:35 PM
Juan is borderline useless right now.  That chart just confirms what me eyes were telling me.

Quote from: dwaderoy2004 on March 06, 2013, 02:22:05 PM
For sure.  Useless relative to what Wilson and Taylor bring to the table.  There's not one thing he does better than either of those guys right now.  Didn't mean to be overly harsh...but if he's net negative, he shouldn't be seeing the court, especially when better options are there.

I don't think that's entirely fair. He's a sub-par offensive player but the best defensive rebounder on the team. If he cut down on his turnovers and hit a few more open threes he'd be better.

Also, there are two other points. First, not all players are going to be net-positive. Going back a few years, typically only 6-7 of the guys on the team are net positive. Second, remember that the net-points concept does have some flaws, particularly related to defense.

Now, do I think Steve Taylor should get some of Juan's minutes? yeah
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Silkk the Shaka on March 06, 2013, 02:39:10 PM
Quote from: Warrior's Path on March 06, 2013, 02:06:44 PM
(http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee41/roblowe14/SteveTaylor.png)

Steve Taylor (9.3 mpg) comparison to Juan Anderson (13.5 mpg) and Jamil Wilson (24.2 mpg)



Dayum sugar, that was quick.  Gotta play Steve more.  Gotta play Steve more.  Gotta play Steve more.  

Love Steve's trend line.  So hot right now.

It would likely take some time so don't feel compelled by any means, but I'd be intrigued to see Taylor vs. Hayward vs. Butler vs. Crowder in their 1st years in the program.... for entertainment purposes only of course
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Henry Sugar on March 06, 2013, 02:58:18 PM
Quote from: Jajuannaman on March 06, 2013, 02:39:10 PM
It would likely take some time so don't feel compelled by any means, but I'd be intrigued to see Taylor vs. Hayward vs. Butler vs. Crowder in their 1st years in the program.... for entertainment purposes only of course

Problem is that I don't have the information for 2008-2010, and only have a partial view for 2010-2011. Unfortunately, the only way to generate these charts is by manually entering in every single game.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: 🏀 on March 06, 2013, 02:58:38 PM
Quote from: Jajuannaman on March 06, 2013, 02:39:10 PM
Dayum sugar, that was quick.  Gotta play Steve more.  Gotta play Steve more.  Gotta play Steve more.  

Love Steve's trend line.  So hot right now.

It would likely take some time so don't feel compelled by any means, but I'd be intrigued to see Taylor vs. Hayward vs. Butler vs. Crowder in their 1st years in the program.... for entertainment purposes only of course

Venturing out a guess that it will be Crowder, Hayward, Taylor then Butler.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Canned Goods n Ammo on March 06, 2013, 03:43:14 PM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 06, 2013, 02:33:25 PM

I think he has potential to grow into a decent forward if he could just get a little stronger.  Look at him compared to Ryan Evans as a sophomore.  They are almost identical statistically - if anything Juan is ahead of where Evans was at the time.

http://statsheet.com/mcb/players/compare?2-ryan-evans=2010-2011&add=2-ryan-evans&p1=juan-anderson

If he can grow into a player like Evans...someone who hustles, plays defense, hits a shot now and then...then I will be pleased.  If you have a front line of Anderson, Taylor and McKay the year after next, that is a lot of speed and length for opposing defenses to deal with.

I think that is fair. I don't expect Soph. players to be complete by any means.

Juan is just sort of a weird case where I don't know what specific improvement will help him.

Maybe shooting off of the dribble? I don't know if I have ever seen him do that. Get stronger and finish around the rim?
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: GGGG on March 06, 2013, 03:48:10 PM
Simply getting stronger would help his game tremendously.  It would help him defend better and be stronger to the hoop.  He has a nice look to his shot already, but more reps wouldn't hurt.

I think Jajuannaman hit it on the head.  Give him a summer to workout without having to worry about his shoulder, and he really could make strides next year.
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Canned Goods n Ammo on March 06, 2013, 03:53:10 PM
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 06, 2013, 03:48:10 PM
Simply getting stronger would help his game tremendously.  It would help him defend better and be stronger to the hoop.  He has a nice look to his shot already, but more reps wouldn't hurt.

I think Jajuannaman hit it on the head.  Give him a summer to workout without having to worry about his shoulder, and he really could make strides next year.

More strength would conceivably help his entire game, but he still has to have some skill improvement to go along with it.

The top of the key jumper looks good, so more reps there, and I don't think MU has made (or even attempted) many corner 3's. Jae used to find that shot. Maybe Juan could as well.

If he can guard multiple spots, then he becomes a true switchable as well.

Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Tugg Speedman on March 06, 2013, 04:13:33 PM
Quote from: Warrior's Path on March 06, 2013, 10:36:03 AM
Jamil last year vs this year

(http://i228.photobucket.com/albums/ee41/roblowe14/Jamilv2.png)

Bull Market ... buy, buy, buy!!
Title: Re: What's right with Jamil Wilson
Post by: Earl Tatum on March 06, 2013, 04:17:08 PM
Play STEVE More!, Play STEVE More! Play STEVE more! Ellenson from Rice Lake is a "HORSE"! Big Body for 6-8.
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