Wow. Is Michigan a team full of mid major talent without any heart ;)
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 12, 2013, 09:56:04 PM
Wow. Is Michigan a team full of mid major talent without any heart ;)
I believe it's "no balls", technically.
Whoa. What the hell happened in this game ? Damn you state of the union.
Wait, Michigan State has emerged as the best team in the Big Ten and could very likely play its way to a one seed? There's a shocker. Anyone seriously want to dispute Izzo as the best coach in the game?
Quote from: chapman on February 12, 2013, 10:30:54 PM
Wait, Michigan State has emerged as the best team in the Big Ten and could very likely play its way to a one seed? There's a shocker. Anyone seriously want to dispute Izzo as the best coach in the game?
Brad Stevens.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2013, 10:42:43 PM
Brad Stevens.
Shouldn't the best coach in America at least be in first place by themselves in the Atlantic 10? Shouldn't they have been better last year after back to back Final game apperances.....remember the mental gymnastics here when our Final Four team didn't make the NCAAs....Stevens went back to back championship game and followed that up with the CBI, not even the NIT.
OH THE HUMANITY.
Yes, I think he's a wonderful coach. When they underperform, nothing sticks to him. They were awfully mediocre last year. This year one would think they would be alone in first in the A10, but they haven't gotten there...yet. Maybe they will.
Quote from: chapman on February 12, 2013, 10:30:54 PM
Wait, Michigan State has emerged as the best team in the Big Ten and could very likely play its way to a one seed? There's a shocker. Anyone seriously want to dispute Izzo as the best coach in the game?
They were co-champions of the B10 last year and a 1 seed in the tourney. Dramond Green was their only loss and he was a senior anyways. Are you actually surprised they are competing for the B10 title this year? Weird. They (along with Indiana) were expected to be at the top this year.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 12, 2013, 11:03:07 PM
Shouldn't the best coach in America at least be in first place by themselves in the Atlantic 10? Shouldn't they have been better last year after back to back Final game apperances.....remember the mental gymnastics here when our Final Four team didn't make the NCAAs....Stevens went back to back championship game and followed that up with the CBI, not even the NIT.
OH THE HUMANITY.
Yes, I think he's a wonderful coach. When they underperform, nothing sticks to him. They were awfully mediocre last year. This year one would think they would be alone in first in the A10, but they haven't gotten there...yet. Maybe they will.
I was half joking. Only half though. In reality, the dude went to 2 straight National Championships. I know you're trying to back Tom Crean up, but Stevens made the National Championship with a good, but not incredible, college player in Gordon Hayward and was an inch away from winning it all. He then returned to the National Championship with MATT HOWARD as his best player. That team should've been more of an NIT team but they made it to a National Championship. He's doing it at Butler, and I would not be surprised to see them back in a Final Four this year, despite not being nearly a top 4 team in terms of talent. And I don't think Stevens cares much about a conference title if he gets to a Final Four. Might be wrong on this but I believe they didn't win the Horizon League (consider that...a Horizon League team in 2 straight National Championships) the 2nd year they went to the National Championship, yet there they were on the last day of the year.
In comparison, since for some reason you decided to do that (?), Crean took a team with 3 NBA players on it, including a top 2 player in the country that year and top 5 player of this generation, and promptly lost in the semifinals by 33. Then he went to the NIT the next year. Not back to back Final Fours (or Championship games), just 1 and then NIT. The Final Four was an incredible run. Minneapolis was 1 of, if not the, most memorable weeks of my life. Loved it. Thankful Wade, Crean, Novak, and company gave it to us. But to compare MU's performance to Butler's is comical.
Stevens is just always cool, calm, and collected. He has everything under control and the most random crap seems to fall for him/Butler all the time. I remember I believe it was their 2nd Final Four run against Florida they were down 10 in the 2nd half and we were watching the game and my buddy and I turned to each other and said, "Stevens has them exactly where he wants them." Sure enough all of a sudden balls are bouncing off the back rim, 10 feet up and dropping in for Butler. It's insane. Same with the MU shot this year and the Gonzaga game this year. They need an absolute miracle to pull it out and sure enough, there it is.
Just watch Stevens throughout the entire video here. Cool, calm, collected. As if the last shor meant nothing and they had won by 30 against a cupcake. Absolutely love it...
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sCIeYy9AhXk
I wont dispute that Stevens is a good coach. However, it definitely takes some luck to get through the ncaa tournament. In their first run to the championship game, they beat a Syracuse team that lost their starting center before the tournament. Then they played KState who was coming off of a triple overtime win over Xavier. And I could be wrong about this, but I seem to remember a KState player missing a portion of the Butler game due to injury. Their second run, however, didnt involve as much luck.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 12, 2013, 11:19:14 PM
I was half joking. Only half though. In reality, the dude went to 2 straight National Championships. I know you're trying to back Tom Crean up, but Stevens made the National Championship with a good, but not incredible, college player in Gordon Hayward and was an inch away from winning it all. He then returned to the National Championship with MATT HOWARD as his best player. That team should've been more of an NIT team but they made it to a National Championship. He's doing it at Butler, and I would not be surprised to see them back in a Final Four this year, despite not being nearly a top 4 team in terms of talent. And I don't think Stevens cares much about a conference title if he gets to a Final Four. Might be wrong on this but I believe they didn't win the Horizon League (consider that...a Horizon League team in 2 straight National Championships) the 2nd year they went to the National Championship, yet there they were on the last day of the year.
In comparison, since for some reason you decided to do that (?), Crean took a team with 3 NBA players on it, including a top 2 player in the country that year and top 5 player of this generation, and promptly lost in the semifinals by 33. Then he went to the NIT the next year. Not back to back Final Fours (or Championship games), just 1 and then NIT. The Final Four was an incredible run. Minneapolis was 1 of, if not the, most memorable weeks of my life. Loved it. Thankful Wade, Crean, Novak, and company gave it to us. But to compare MU's performance to Butler's is comical.
Stevens is just always cool, calm, and collected. He has everything under control and the most random crap seems to fall for him/Butler all the time. I remember I believe it was their 2nd Final Four run against Florida they were down 10 in the 2nd half and we were watching the game and my buddy and I turned to each other and said, "Stevens has them exactly where he wants them." Sure enough all of a sudden balls are bouncing off the back rim, 10 feet up and dropping in for Butler. It's insane. Same with the MU shot this year and the Gonzaga game this year. They need an absolute miracle to pull it out and sure enough, there it is.
Just watch Stevens throughout the entire video here. Cool, calm, collected. As if the last shor meant nothing and they had won by 30 against a cupcake. Absolutely love it...
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sCIeYy9AhXk
+10000
Quote from: chapman on February 12, 2013, 10:30:54 PM
Wait, Michigan State has emerged as the best team in the Big Ten and could very likely play its way to a one seed? There's a shocker. Anyone seriously want to dispute Izzo as the best coach in the game?
Mark Few
Quote from: keefe on February 13, 2013, 12:47:09 AM
Mark Few
I'll finish that for ya...has yet to make a Final Four.
Bielein made a mistake last night. Down 25 with 10 minutes to go, he put on his 1-3-1 for about 5 possessions and it actually gave MSU some pause. Dumb. Take your beating and save the 1-3-1 for the rematch. All he did in a game that he couldn't win was let Sparty practice against it with nothing on the line. Should have kept that arrow in the quiver and sprung it in Ann Arbor. BTW, way to go, Sparty. That Izzo guy can coach a little.
Has Stevens lost an entire recruiting class yet?
Quote from: honkytonk on February 12, 2013, 11:06:03 PM
They were co-champions of the B10 last year and a 1 seed in the tourney. Dramond Green was their only loss and he was a senior anyways. Are you actually surprised they are competing for the B10 title this year? Weird. They (along with Indiana) were expected to be at the top this year.
I assume he was referring to everyone (ESPN) talking incessantly about Indiana, Michigan, Ohio State, Minnesota (early) and even Wisconsin and Illinois...while taking Michigan State for granted.
Quote from: Guns n Ammo on February 12, 2013, 09:58:28 PM
I believe it's "no balls", technically.
I'd say, they haven't beat a B1G team on the road that has a winning conference record!
Apparently this is the first ever Mich/Mich St game when both were ranked in the top 10.
I find this very surprising.
Has MU/DePaul ever played each other when both were in the top 10? It would have been in the late 70s or possibly 2002/2003 when we were in the top 10 and DePaul was coming off top 10 teams with Quentin Richardson ... did DePaul hold top 10 status until 2002/2003?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 12, 2013, 11:03:07 PM
Shouldn't the best coach in America at least be in first place by themselves in the Atlantic 10? Shouldn't they have been better last year after back to back Final game apperances.....remember the mental gymnastics here when our Final Four team didn't make the NCAAs....Stevens went back to back championship game and followed that up with the CBI, not even the NIT.
OH THE HUMANITY.
Yes, I think he's a wonderful coach. When they underperform, nothing sticks to him. They were awfully mediocre last year. This year one would think they would be alone in first in the A10, but they haven't gotten there...yet. Maybe they will.
This is exhibit A for all those who contend that you no longer start "I love TC" threads. What, pray tell, is the difference between starting one and using an innocuous, unrelated statement (Mark Stevens is a good coach) to go off on yet another Tom Crean is great, why are people here unfair to him rant.
Oh the humanity, indeed.
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on February 13, 2013, 08:00:59 AM
Has Stevens lost an entire recruiting class yet?
He has to have 5 years first.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 13, 2013, 09:13:47 AM
This is exhibit A for all those who contend that you no longer start "I love TC" threads. What, pray tell, is the difference between starting one and using an innocuous, unrelated statement (Mark Stevens is a good coach) to go off on yet another Tom Crean is great, why are people here unfair to him rant.
Boy, is this right on the money.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 13, 2013, 09:13:47 AM
This is exhibit A for all those who contend that you no longer start "I love TC" threads. What, pray tell, is the difference between starting one and using an innocuous, unrelated statement (Mark Stevens is a good coach) to go off on yet another Tom Crean is great, why are people here unfair to him rant.
Oh the humanity, indeed.
I could have put anyone in there. I, again, just find the double standards here priceless. Sorry if you don't like it when they are exposed when one application is used for one coach and another for someone else.
I think he's a lot like Few, however, in that he is comfortable at a lower level of spotlight. He wants to be liked (he is likeable) and when you are at a school like Gonzaga, Butler, VCU, you're always going to be viewed as the underdog...you become a teflon coach. If that's his comfort zone, that's fine. But if we're going to say he is the best coach in the country, shouldn't he finish better than a 5th seed in the Horizon League...I repeat..the HORIZON League? Shouldn't he be going to a tournament not called the CBI after back to back NCAA championship appearances? I know we hold other, FAR LESSER coaches, to those standards around here.
I think Stevens is a really good coach. Would love to have him at any of my alma maters if Self, Crean, or Buzz left. In a heartbeat. So far he hasn't been willing to step up to a higher profile job. Perhaps he wants to stay in the comfort zone he is at. No harm in that.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 13, 2013, 10:49:10 AM
I could have put anyone in there. I, again, just find the double standards here priceless. Sorry if you don't like it when they are exposed when one application is used for one coach and another for someone else.
I think he's a lot like Few, however, in that he is comfortable at a lower level of spotlight. He wants to be liked (he is likeable) and when you are at a school like Gonzaga, Butler, VCU, you're always going to be viewed as the underdog...you become a teflon coach. If that's his comfort zone, that's fine. But if we're going to say he is the best coach in the country, shouldn't he finish better than a 5th seed in the Horizon League...I repeat..the HORIZON League? Shouldn't he be going to a tournament not called the CBI after back to back NCAA championship appearances? I know we hold other, FAR LESSER coaches, to those standards around here.
I think Stevens is a really good coach. Would love to have him at any of my alma maters if Self, Crean, or Buzz left. In a heartbeat. So far he hasn't been willing to step up to a higher profile job. Perhaps he wants to stay in the comfort zone he is at. No harm in that.
He's taking a big step up by staying put. Butler's joining the C7+X & TBD, if you don't recall. Don't mess with happy. Stevens is clearly happy.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 13, 2013, 10:49:10 AM
I could have put anyone in there. I, again, just find the double standards here priceless. Sorry if you don't like it when they are exposed when one application is used for one coach and another for someone else.
I think he's a lot like Few, however, in that he is comfortable at a lower level of spotlight. He wants to be liked (he is likeable) and when you are at a school like Gonzaga, Butler, VCU, you're always going to be viewed as the underdog...you become a teflon coach. If that's his comfort zone, that's fine. But if we're going to say he is the best coach in the country, shouldn't he finish better than a 5th seed in the Horizon League...I repeat..the HORIZON League? Shouldn't he be going to a tournament not called the CBI after back to back NCAA championship appearances? I know we hold other, FAR LESSER coaches, to those standards around here.
I think Stevens is a really good coach. Would love to have him at any of my alma maters if Self, Crean, or Buzz left. In a heartbeat. So far he hasn't been willing to step up to a higher profile job. Perhaps he wants to stay in the comfort zone he is at. No harm in that.
I guess your opinion (or anyone's) is based on your definition and application of "good coach." Is a good coach one that succeeds/overachieves with below-average/average players? Or is a good coach one that can recruit top tier players? Is a coach bad if he can recruit top tier players, but underachieves?
It's all in the eye of the beholder.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 13, 2013, 10:49:10 AM
I could have put anyone in there. I, again, just find the double standards here priceless. Sorry if you don't like it when they are exposed when one application is used for one coach and another for someone else.
You are insufferable.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 13, 2013, 10:49:10 AM
I could have put anyone in there. I, again, just find the double standards here priceless. Sorry if you don't like it when they are exposed when one application is used for one coach and another for someone else.
I think he's a lot like Few, however, in that he is comfortable at a lower level of spotlight. He wants to be liked (he is likeable) and when you are at a school like Gonzaga, Butler, VCU, you're always going to be viewed as the underdog...you become a teflon coach. If that's his comfort zone, that's fine. But if we're going to say he is the best coach in the country, shouldn't he finish better than a 5th seed in the Horizon League...I repeat..the HORIZON League? Shouldn't he be going to a tournament not called the CBI after back to back NCAA championship appearances? I know we hold other, FAR LESSER coaches, to those standards around here.
You think Brad Stevens should be held to the same standards that we hold TC? Really? Fine. In 5+ years at Butler Stevens has won 4 conference championships, has a.783 winning %, has been to 4 NCAA tournaments, 2 final 4s, 2 championship games and has an 11-4 record in tourney play. And by all accounts he's not a total douche. If Tom Crean did at MU what Brad Stevens has at Butler (and wasn't a total douche) there would be a statue of him right next to Al's. Rightfully so. The two aren't (and shouldn't be) in the same discussion. Not even remotely close.
Quote from: tower912 on February 13, 2013, 07:31:47 AM
Bielein made a mistake last night. Down 25 with 10 minutes to go, he put on his 1-3-1 for about 5 possessions and it actually gave MSU some pause. Dumb. Take your beating and save the 1-3-1 for the rematch. All he did in a game that he couldn't win was let Sparty practice against it with nothing on the line. Should have kept that arrow in the quiver and sprung it in Ann Arbor.
not even close... the reason for doing what bielein did was plain as day, as was izzo's reaction...good move by both coaches, imho. anything higher than middle school level basketball blows your opinion out of the water.
How do you really feel?
Quote from: avid1010 on February 13, 2013, 01:33:29 PM
not even close... the reason for doing what bielein did was plain as day, as was izzo's reaction...good move by both coaches, imho. anything higher than middle school level basketball blows your opinion out of the water.
I guess I'm slow... what was the reason for going into the 1-3-1, and what was izzo's reaction?
Quote from: g0lden3agle on February 13, 2013, 01:50:14 PM
I guess I'm slow... what was the reason for going into the 1-3-1, and what was izzo's reaction?
Thanks for asking. Thought I was the only clueless one.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 13, 2013, 01:07:38 PM
You think Brad Stevens should be held to the same standards that we hold TC? Really? Fine. In 5+ years at Butler Stevens has won 4 conference championships, has a.783 winning %, has been to 4 NCAA tournaments, 2 final 4s, 2 championship games and has an 11-4 record in tourney play. And by all accounts he's not a total douche. If Tom Crean did at MU what Brad Stevens has at Butler (and wasn't a total douche) there would be a statue of him right next to Al's. Rightfully so. The two aren't (and shouldn't be) in the same discussion. Not even remotely close.
Well put.
Brad Stevens has made Butler the best basketball school in Indiana over the past 5 years. The same time frame that Crean has been at Indiana. We'll see if Crean can get to where Stevens has been twice this year, like has been expected of him all year long.
It's Butler, It's Butler.
Would have responded earlier, but I was too busy watching 9th place Charlotte beat Butler tonight at Butler.
Quote from: wadesworld on February 13, 2013, 06:12:35 AM
I'll finish that for ya...has yet to make a Final Four.
Mighty long list
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 13, 2013, 08:27:32 PM
Would have responded earlier, but I was too busy watching 9th place Charlotte beat Butler tonight at Butler.
Not true. You started another thread around 730pm. But you waited to comment here until you had some more ammo.
Quote from: jesmu84 on February 13, 2013, 08:31:42 PM
Not true. You started another thread around 730pm. But you waited to comment here until you had some more ammo.
Very true...for THIS thread. Starting a thread doesn't require reading any others. This thread, required me to read the responses and respond....that I wasn't going to do until after the ND game, after the Syracuse game and after the Butler game.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 13, 2013, 08:27:32 PM
Would have responded earlier, but I was too busy watching 7th place Charlotte, and 1 game out of 1st place in the conference (18-6 overall, 6-4 in conference) beat Butler tonight at Butler.
Fixed it for you.
Weird, I remember watching 7th place (and 5 games back from 1st in the conference) Illinois beat Indiana this year. So, you mean to tell me that upsets happen in NCAA Men's (have to clarify, because they do not happen in women's basketball...) basketball? Whoda thunk? (Now to use one of your trademarks, and, shockingly enough! Hoopaloops!) ::)
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 13, 2013, 10:49:10 AM
I think he's a lot like Few, however, in that he is comfortable at a lower level of spotlight.
I don't think Mark Few sees it as a spotlight thing. He has an extremely comfortable life in Spokane. The Inland Empire is beautiful and if you love the outdoors there is no finer place. Few is generously compensated, he has lifetime job security, his family is safe, he and his wife are part of the social food chain, and players want to be a part of what he has built. In 13 seasons Few has a career .800 winning percentage and has several Top 10 poll finishes.
Frankly, he coaches one of the nation's very best high major programs at a small Jesuit university. He has not struggled with recruiting and he schedules an aggressive non-conference slate that gives the Zags a healthy RPI. This is a far cry from a lower level spotlight!