Looking good.
Now up 7 with 2 minutes left. Go hopeful future conference member!
Quote from: chapman on December 15, 2012, 03:06:27 PM
Now up 7 with 2 minutes left. Go hopeful future conference member!
Yup. And it can't hurt our RPI :)
Down to 2 at 1:14...choke job is on.
Quote from: chapman on December 15, 2012, 03:11:01 PM
Down to 2 at 1:14...choke job is on.
Losing two starters to fouls against the number 1 in the country and taking a lead into the last minute....even if they lose there is no way this is a choke job
Why in the world would they have this game in Indianapolis? There's no atmosphere. No cachet. They should be playing this game in Philly or DC.
Quote from: Benny B on December 15, 2012, 03:16:08 PM
Why in the world would they have this game in Indianapolis? There's no atmosphere. No cachet. They should be playing this game in Philly or DC.
2/10
Butler blew that...
Butler missed a 3-pointer in last seconds and game is going to OT.
Why the heck didn't #4 switch? Let them have an easy two if need be.... GUARD THE PERIMETER.
love the new thread
Quote from: Benny B on December 15, 2012, 03:16:08 PM
Why in the world would they have this game in Indianapolis? There's no atmosphere. No cachet. They should be playing this game in Philly or DC.
Dumb comment
Because a C7 conference tourney game between Providence and Villanova is going to generate what in Indy? Answer, less interest than a local High School Basketball game.
Just admit the Indy idea was stupid and move on.
36-16 FT advantage for Indiana, don't see that very often. Definitely don't see the team with 16 even in the game.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on December 15, 2012, 03:21:06 PM
Dumb comment
Because a C7 conference tourney game between Providence and Villanova is going to generate what in Indy? Answer, less interest than a local High School Basketball game.
Just admit the Indy idea was stupid and move on.
Awfully pessimistic of you to think that Providence vs. Villanova is going to be as good as it comes in the C7.
Clarke is just sick.
Score?
They've burnt three timeouts behind the baseline... is IU's press really that good?
86-86 19.3 left Butler ball.
tied butler ball 19.3 secs left in ot.
its on cbs if you are near any tv.
rim, bounce, bounce, rim..... Butler by 2, 2.3 left
butler up 88-86 IND ball with 2.3 left just used last timeout. looking good for butler.
Quote from: Benny B on December 15, 2012, 03:36:25 PM
rim, bounce, bounce, rim..... Butler by 2, 2.3 left
And from a walk on.
AWESOME PLAY. Great win for our conference.... haha...
Tom Crean loses on National TV ... AGAIN!
IU Avenue is despondent.
from the master after losing to Butler.
Satisfaction for the haters, but more importantly good for the RPI.
Welcome to the C7, Dawgs.
We beat UW, Butler beats Indiana. A good year.
So B1G gets interesting now that Indianapolis is exposed. Butrler & Illionois better than expected?
Quote from: Benny B on December 15, 2012, 03:39:24 PM
Welcome to the C7, Dawgs.
Gonna be great to watch Stevens steal Crean's lunch money every year for our conference! This is the last time Indiana sniffs #1 this year. Duke & Florida are clearly better.
Did we really need 6 threads? Merged.
And just fun to watch the end of that game.
Paradoxically, that loss looks WAY less bad now, but I'm much more frustrated about it now. Damn, we should have won that game in Maui.
With 3 starters on the bench (fouled out) Stevens has a walk on take Hulls to the basket for the game winner. Unreal.
That was a great college basketball game...and atmosphere. What a game. Good for MU's RPI..
Quote from: Ners on December 15, 2012, 03:53:11 PM
That was a great college basketball game...and atmosphere. What a game. Good for MU's RPI..
+1 Great college basketball game.
What channel was it on? Unless your all watching it on ESPN3 which I cannot get. Was not shown here in Jersey.
Quote from: muwarrior69 on December 15, 2012, 04:27:40 PM
What channel was it on? Unless your all watching it on ESPN3 which I cannot get. Was not shown here in Jersey.
CBS
Quote from: Jajuannaman on December 15, 2012, 03:41:38 PM
Gonna be great to watch Stevens steal Crean's lunch money every year for our conference! This is the last time Indiana sniffs #1 this year. Duke & Florida are clearly better.
7 hours later, Florida loses.
which was also a good game, that I was amazed florida lost. they seemed to dominate from tip to end except the score says different. Wouldn't be surprised to see UF cutting down nets in april, to be honest. That 3 pt shooting is unreal.
Quote from: boyonthedock on December 16, 2012, 04:05:54 AM
which was also a good game, that I was amazed florida lost. they seemed to dominate from tip to end except the score says different. Wouldn't be surprised to see UF cutting down nets in april, to be honest. That 3 pt shooting is unreal.
The Gators lost because they choked hard in the last minute. One of the best Christmas gifts ever doled out.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on December 16, 2012, 01:19:33 AM
7 hours later, Florida loses.
...to a stacked Arizona team on the road... but why leave that out right?
Quote from: The Golden Avalanche on December 16, 2012, 10:15:15 AM
The Gators lost because they choked hard in the last minute. One of the best Christmas gifts ever doled out.
A little home cooking worked as well. It appears the new rule in basketball is if you are dribbling and the defender makes contact to jar the ball loose it is NOT a foul.
However, if you are shooting and make lighter contact it IS a foul. This was the formula for Zona's success in the last three minutes.
Didn't watch the whole game I presume the refs allowed major fouls on the ball handler all game?
Quote from: Jajuannaman on December 16, 2012, 10:17:22 AM
...to a stacked Arizona team on the road... but why leave that out right?
Every team is going to lose a few games. IU went 10 minutes without scoring a FG yesterday, you're going to lose when that happens. Florida playing like they did down the stretch, they deserved to lose. Duke will lose a game or two as well. This is college basketball.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on December 16, 2012, 10:49:58 AM
Every team is going to lose a few games. IU went 10 minutes without scoring a FG yesterday, you're going to lose when that happens. Florida playing like they did down the stretch, they deserved to lose. Duke will lose a game or two as well. This is college basketball.
Because I said either of those teams would go undefeated? IU is undoubtedly a top 5 team, they just aren't #1.
Quote from: Jajuannaman on December 16, 2012, 10:57:42 AM
Because I said either of those teams would go undefeated? IU is undoubtedly a top 5 team, they just aren't #1.
Actually you said they would never sniff #1 again, which I'm not sure what that means. Is top 5 sniffing #1? Is #2 sniffing #1? More than likely, there will be 4 or 5 teams (sometimes repeat teams) that occupy the number 1 spot this year. I would be surprised if anyone in the Big Ten occupies it for a long because there are 3 teams arguably in the top 5 in the nation from that conference alone. The SEC and ACC aren't very good top to bottom, so less chances to get knocked off. Same goes for Arizona in the Pac 12. Rankings are what they are...fun for the fans and for voters who often don't know what they are doing or don't care.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on December 16, 2012, 11:03:51 AM
Actually you said they would never sniff #1 again, which I'm not sure what that means. Is top 5 sniffing #1? Is #2 sniffing #1? More than likely, there will be 4 or 5 teams (sometimes repeat teams) that occupy the number 1 spot this year. I would be surprised if anyone in the Big Ten occupies it for a long because there are 3 teams arguably in the top 5 in the nation from that conference alone. The SEC and ACC aren't very good top to bottom, so less chances to get knocked off. Same goes for Arizona in the Pac 12. Rankings are what they are...fun for the fans and for voters who often don't know what they are doing or don't care.
Precisely for the reasons you just mentioned, they will not be ranked #1 again. Thanks for making my argument for me? And when did I say rankings actually mean anything?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on December 16, 2012, 10:49:58 AM
Every team is going to lose a few games. IU went 10 minutes without scoring a FG yesterday, you're going to lose when that happens. Florida playing like they did down the stretch, they deserved to lose. Duke will lose a game or two as well. This is college basketball.
You also almost never lose with a FT advantage like they had (IU). IU got the benefit of the doubt on all calls but couldn't pull it out.
They got out coached and out willed.
IU went 10 minutes without scoring a FG yesterday.
Some things never change no matter how much talent one recruits.
I've said that Crean's biggest weakness is in-game adjustments, exacerbated by his inability to recruit bigs. I think I will amend that to his biggest weakness is game coaching through adversity. When things turn against him, he struggles to get his team to right the ship.
Quote from: tower912 on December 16, 2012, 12:32:40 PM
I've said that Crean's biggest weakness is in-game adjustments, exacerbated by his inability to recruit bigs. I think I will amend that to his biggest weakness is game coaching through adversity. When things turn against him, he struggles to get his team to right the ship.
Frankly, he turns cheerleader and tries to get the crowd involved.
Quote from: tower912 on December 16, 2012, 12:32:40 PM
I've said that Crean's biggest weakness is in-game adjustments, exacerbated by his inability to recruit bigs. I think I will amend that to his biggest weakness is game coaching through adversity. When things turn against him, he struggles to get his team to right the ship.
I find those comments odd...they come out when they lose a game but when the scramble back and win games through adversity, like Kentucky last year, like the NCAA tournament last year against VCU, etc, there seems to be no such comments. For some reason people lock in on one and not the other. When they do win, making adjustments...nothing. When they do lose (and yes, they make adjustments like everyone else), it comes down to the fact they can't make adjustments. It's like Lebron James syndrome where people would come out of the woodwork when they lost a NBA playoff game but when he won them they were never to be found.
http://seattle.sbnation.com/2012/3/17/2881185/indiana-vs-vcu-2012-ncaa-tournament-score
I don't think TC is a very good defensive coach, that's his biggest weakness. Here are his Pomeroy Defensive Efficiency Ranks since '03: 101 (FF year, yikes), 159, 129, 54, 31, 10 ('08 team that got screwed by the committee), 178, 167, 109, 64, 12 (this year).
They are letting up more than a point per possession on a neutral court or on the road this year (just barely). Pomeory tweeted during the game yesterday: "Finally seeing the Hoosiers look defensively-suspect."
This may not seem like a big deal. However, I don't think anybody has every won an NCAA championship with a defensive ranking outside of the top 25. Pomeroy also mentioned that '05 Washington is the only Number One seed in the NCAA tournament to have a defensive rank outside of the top 25 the year before. For Indiana's sake, they have to get better defensively to contend for a national championship.
Cheese and rice, he looses his first game of the season and he is lowsy coach. Go figure.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on December 16, 2012, 11:03:51 AM
Actually you said they would never sniff #1 again, which I'm not sure what that means. Is top 5 sniffing #1? Is #2 sniffing #1? More than likely, there will be 4 or 5 teams (sometimes repeat teams) that occupy the number 1 spot this year. I would be surprised if anyone in the Big Ten occupies it for a long because there are 3 teams arguably in the top 5 in the nation from that conference alone. The SEC and ACC aren't very good top to bottom, so less chances to get knocked off. Same goes for Arizona in the Pac 12. Rankings are what they are...fun for the fans and for voters who often don't know what they are doing or don't care.
Well, technically, #2 is the only dog that can sniff #1, only #3 can sniff #2, and so on. Just like the old saying, "If you aren't the lead dog, you're just sniffing ass."
IMO, perfect summation of IU/Butler/the game:
http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/8762604/indiana-falls-duke-claims-no-1-grantland-ncaa-basketball-power-rankings
"10. Indiana
Well, I think we can put that debate to rest now. The Duke vs. Indiana debate, sure, but we can also retire the debate over which team has the best home-court advantage in college basketball. That's because, judging from last season and the first couple months of this season, Indiana is twice as good at home as on the road. Hoosiers fans get defensive when I bring this up, but at this point the trend is impossible to ignore. How else can you explain beating three top-five teams at home last year while losing at Nebraska and Iowa?4 How else can you explain the game in Bloomington in which the Hoosiers made North Carolina's roster full of McDonald's All-Americans look like they've never played basketball before, only to play poorly against Georgia, squeak past Georgetown, and look terrible against Butler on neutral courts? The only logical explanation is that playing in Assembly Hall brings out the best in these Hoosiers, and without 17,000 maniacal fans hovering over their opponents, this team is just average.
The most alarming aspect of Indiana's loss to Butler is just how average the Hoosiers looked. The formula for a huge upset is usually for the underdog to keep the game close and then steal a desperate win at the end (somewhat like the way Arizona beat Florida). But against Indiana, Butler was in control for most of the game. This is mostly because Indiana refused to make adjustments. Butler used the same game plan they've used for years. They were precise and fundamentally sound on offense and they packed it in and played physical defense inspired by the axiom that the refs can't call a foul on every possession. That's not a complaint about the officiating. It's just a fact. Butler has played this way for well over a decade, so Indiana shouldn't have been caught off guard. Yet instead of adjusting their style of play and countering Butler's roughhouse style with their own physical play, the Hoosiers just kept expecting the refs to bail them out.5 Indiana's approach on offense seemed to be to just go one-on-one, take a difficult shot, and then hope for an offensive rebound or a foul call. The whole game, it looked like they were thinking: "We shouldn't have to adjust to them. We're the better team — they should adjust to us. At some point, our shots will start falling, their shots will stop falling, and we'll run away with this thing. We got this." Butler coach Brad Stevens's teams have won countless games preying on this attitude. It's why he went to back-to-back Final Fours, it's why Butler broke the bank to keep him in Indianapolis, and it's why UCLA should be on their hands and knees begging him to replace Ben Howland.
Look, this was only one game and it certainly meant lots more to Butler than it did to Indiana, so I don't want to overreact. But the Indiana fan in me is legitimately concerned. Tom Crean deserves a pat on the back for rebuilding the program from a 6-25 season to the preseason no. 1 in half the time it took Tim "The Tool Man" Taylor to build that hot rod in his garage, but getting outcoached that badly by Brad Stevens is troubling. Meanwhile, the Hoosiers have Cody Zeller, supposedly the best big man in college basketball, yet they gave up 17 offensive rebounds to a much smaller team. And Jordan Hulls, Indiana's senior captain and the team's heart and soul, allowed a walk-on who averages two points per game to beat him one-on-one for the game-winner. Again, one game is not the end of the world. But it's clear that the Hoosiers have a long road ahead of them in re-establishing themselves as favorites to win the national title. Step one: They must play convincingly well outside of Assembly Hall.
4. Many Indiana fans will say, "Yeah, but that was last year. This is a different team." Well, no. Not really. IU essentially just swapped Verdell Jones III for Yogi Ferrell.
5. This is the part of the column where I point out that Andrew Smith outplayed Cody Zeller. To give you an idea of how embarrassing this should be for Zeller, Smith is so bad that even Butler fans don't like him. To give you an idea of how embarrassing that should be for Smith, Butler fans loved Matt Howard."
Quote from: jesmu84 on December 21, 2012, 01:51:43 PM
5. This is the part of the column where I point out that Andrew Smith outplayed Cody Zeller. To give you an idea of how embarrassing this should be for Zeller, Smith is so bad that even Butler fans don't like him. To give you an idea of how embarrassing that should be for Smith, Butler fans loved Matt Howard."
Tom Crean with a big man is like a mule with a spinning wheel. Who knows how he got it and damn if he knows how to use it.
CZeller is wasting time at IU and has the potential to go into the draft as the rare big-time underrated center.
Quote from: Jajuannaman on December 15, 2012, 03:41:38 PM
Gonna be great to watch Stevens steal Crean's lunch money every year for our conference! This is the last time Indiana sniffs #1 this year. Duke & Florida are clearly better.
After this weekend.....there may be sniffing going on. Louisville the new #1 and IU #2 likely.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 13, 2013, 08:00:27 PM
After this weekend.....there may be sniffing going on. Louisville the new #1 and IU #2 likely.
Why you hoopin?
Because three top four teams lost in the last 4 days...lots of sniffing going on.
Chance to vote here.
http://espn.go.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/id/72638/making-the-case-for-who-should-be-no-1
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 13, 2013, 09:22:17 PM
Why you hoopin?
Love seeing that ;D though to CBB's credit this is relevant.
On a slightly related topic, if I'm the winner of an 8/9 or 7/10 game this year, there's no team I'd rather see in the second round than IU. Their home/road disparity is continuing. They barely squeak by Iowa, who isn't nearly as good as their non-con record, and then handle a good Minnesota team at home. Play them anywhere other than Assembly Hall and I think any average to above average team could beat them. I would be shocked to see them reach the Final Four this year.
Quote from: brewcity77 on January 14, 2013, 07:22:23 AM
Love seeing that ;D though to CBB's credit this is relevant.
On a slightly related topic, if I'm the winner of an 8/9 or 7/10 game this year, there's no team I'd rather see in the second round than IU. Their home/road disparity is continuing. They barely squeak by Iowa, who isn't nearly as good as their non-con record, and then handle a good Minnesota team at home. Play them anywhere other than Assembly Hall and I think any average to above average team could beat them. I would be shocked to see them reach the Final Four this year.
Relevant? Sure, I guess. But really, is there a need to dig up a month old thread just to say "I told you so"?
There is for chico if it means he can (a) blow his own horn or (b) blow Crean's.
This is why we can't have nice things.
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 14, 2013, 07:39:49 AM
Relevant? Sure, I guess. But really, is there a need to dig up a month old thread just to say "I told you so"?
Is it your first time visiting ye olde Scoop?
Rubbing someone's face in it when you are right is what we do.
Quote from: MU B2002 on January 14, 2013, 07:56:06 AM
Is it your first time visiting ye olde Scoop?
Rubbing someone's face in it when you are right is what we do.
+9 million.
This place is more insufferable with $hit don't stink 'tude than the foursome of recently graduated sorority girls I was with last night.
Foursome=solid
Quote from: jesmu84 on January 14, 2013, 07:39:49 AM
Relevant? Sure, I guess. But really, is there a need to dig up a month old thread just to say "I told you so"?
Pfft...I'm looking forward to digging up 4-month old threads on March 17 just to say "I told you so" 8-)
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on January 13, 2013, 08:00:27 PM
After this weekend.....there may be sniffing going on. Louisville the new #1 and IU #2 likely.
Smells like turds, aina?
Cut IU some slack, Cody Zeller had to leave the game in the 2nd half...I think he had a night glass or something. I know TC & Indiana would have liked to have him then.
Quote from: The Lens on January 15, 2013, 10:16:22 PM
Cut IU some slack, Cody Zeller had to leave the game in the 2nd half...I think he had a night glass or something. I know TC & Indiana would have liked to have him then.
Coulda gotten "the flu."
Quote from: tower912 on December 16, 2012, 12:32:40 PM
I've said that Crean's biggest weakness is in-game adjustments, exacerbated by his inability to recruit bigs. I think I will amend that to his biggest weakness is game coaching through adversity. When things turn against him, he struggles to get his team to right the ship.
Bump again.
Quote from: tower912 on January 16, 2013, 06:11:24 AM
Bump again.
Bump again.
Interesting when they lose, 3 page threads or longer. When they win...
Fandom is funny like that. I have no doubt when they lose in the NCAAs (every team does but one), the pontifications will be amazing here. :)
You don't want to do this Chicos, they won at home. Their schedule turns brutal soon. This IU team on the road plus TC at the wheel does not forecast to end well.
Quote from: The Lens on February 03, 2013, 09:00:30 AM
You don't want to do this Chicos, they won at home. Their schedule turns brutal soon. This IU team on the road plus TC at the wheel does not forecast to end well.
Why not? People said they wouldn't sniff #1 again all year. Well, they'll be more than sniffing #1, they will BE #1 tomorrow. People also said they'd drop out of the polls in a week. Something tells me unless the Indiana team plane crashes, killing the entire team, there's no way they will go from #1 to unranked in a week.
Yes, there's a good chance they lose at tOSU next week and drop from #1. They probably have another 2-3 losses in the schedule after that. I think they'll go into the Big Teen Tournament 26-5 (14-4) and that will end up good enough for at worst a 3-seed. No reason whatsoever CBB shouldn't be rubbing people's noses in it, especially when you consider just how spectacularly IU has outdone their critics on this board.
IU has enough talent to win it all - 3 high first rounders this year and possibly another in Yogi down the road. Plus, Crean has the guy he needs in Oladipo. I have no idea why Dickie V kept comparing Oladipo to Jordan last night - the guy is straight Wade. I thought the most impressive play last night was his missed alley oop, where the ball was about three feet behind him.
Anyway, Crean's best offense is just to iso Oladipo at the top and let him work. As long as they can do that, IU is fine just because of the talent of Oladipo, especially. I would say Yogi can do a similar thing. My beef is that he doesn't involve Watford or Zeller enough. Zeller's 2nd half points were all orebs off Oladipo penetration. Their P&R with Zeller and Oladipo is as bad as can be. It's frustrating to watch a team with that much talent, use so little of it. That's my only problem with Crean. If you watch a Billy Donovan offense vs a Tom Crean offense it's night and day.
Superior talent and high energy can win a lot of games, but I don't see them achieving to their talent level in March.
I'm not saying at all that this will fall from the rankings etc...more so, I think they will stay in the Top 10 and get a 2 seed but I just don't see him winning 4 games in March, and that is where this team will be measured.
And where a team with 4 NBA'ers rightfully should be measured.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 03, 2013, 08:56:04 AM
Bump again.
Interesting when they lose, 3 page threads or longer. When they win...
Fandom is funny like that. I have no doubt when they lose in the NCAAs (every team does but one), the pontifications will be amazing here. :)
I was wrong and I can admit that. I still don't think they're #1, that's Florida IMO. But they've won the games necessary to move back up in the rankings, so congrats.
What I find MORE interesting, however, is that your posting spikes after an IU win or an MU loss. Very interesting indeed.
Quote from: karavotsos on February 03, 2013, 10:33:33 AM
And where a team with 4 NBA'ers rightfully should be measured.
Be careful with such sweeping generalizations.
Good chance that MU's 2011 team will have 4 NBA'ers. 2 wins in March is well behind your "rightful" measurment.
Fine - a team with 3 firsts, including at least one lotto, and a 2d. I would say the level of talent is closer to UNC last year than our 2011 team.
Quote from: tower912 on January 14, 2013, 07:48:41 AM
There is for chico if it means he can (a) blow his own horn or (b) blow Crean's.
There. Fixed. On your knees, Bondsman
Quote from: The Equalizer on February 03, 2013, 11:58:42 AM
Be careful with such sweeping generalizations.
Good chance that MU's 2011 team will have 4 NBA'ers. 2 wins in March is well behind your "rightful" measurment.
Could be worse. Could take a team with two future NBA'ers to back to back NIT's.
Quote from: tower912 on February 04, 2013, 08:09:05 AM
Could be worse. Could take a team with two future NBA'ers to back to back NIT's.
Could be worse. Could take a team with two future NBA'ers to back to back NIT's. And
lose to get humiliated by a MAC team in the FIRST ROUND of the NIT
Quote from: tower912 on February 04, 2013, 08:09:05 AM
Could be worse. Could take a team with two future NBA'ers to back to back NIT's.
Strange that the Equalizer didn't use that comparison. Could it be the supposedly neutral posts actually have an agenda? Naaah.
Quote from: MarquetteDano on February 05, 2013, 11:33:53 AM
Strange that the Equalizer didn't use that comparison. Could it be the supposedly neutral posts actually have an agenda? Naaah.
Not strange at all:
In 2011 we had 4 NBA players, therefore comparable. In 2004-5 we only had 2, therefore not comparible.
Quote from: The Equalizer on February 05, 2013, 01:08:19 PM
Not strange at all:
In 2011 we had 4 NBA players, therefore comparable. In 2004-5 we only had 2, therefore not comparible.
Perhaps that is why the 2011 and 2012 teams went to the Sweet Sixteen to much acclaim while the 2004 & 2005 squads went to the NIT, including the horrifying loss to Western Michigan.
Quote from: The Equalizer on February 05, 2013, 01:08:19 PM
Not strange at all:
In 2011 we had 4 NBA players, therefore comparable. In 2004-5 we only had 2, therefore not comparible.
Who are the 4 NBA players that we had? I count 3, same as our 2005-6 team that lost in the first round.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 05, 2013, 02:49:21 PM
Who are the 4 NBA players that we had? I count 3, same as our 2005-6 team that lost in the first round.
Maybe he is saying Jimmy, Jae, DJO, and Blue?
Quote from: MU B2002 on February 05, 2013, 02:52:16 PM
Maybe he is saying Jimmy, Jae, DJO, and Blue?
I'm sure the Equalizer would never count a guy who's not on anyone's draft board and whom Chicos considers a longshot.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on February 05, 2013, 03:15:34 PM
I'm sure the Equalizer would never count a guy who's not on anyone's draft board and whom Chicos considers a longshot.
Sure I would. Why wouldn't I expect Blue to make the League? He's got the talent, he's scoring well, he's probably the best overall talent on our team.
He was ranked in the top 35 out of high school by no fewer than four different services (as high as 24th by Rivals). I'd be surprised if he didn't make the league--especially with four years under Buzz's development.
But let me put you on the spot--do you expect Blue to make it or not?
Quote from: The Equalizer on February 05, 2013, 03:46:28 PM
Sure I would. Why wouldn't I expect Blue to make the League? He's got the talent, he's scoring well, he's probably the best overall talent on our team.
He was ranked in the top 35 out of high school by no fewer than four different services (as high as 24th by Rivals). I'd be surprised if he didn't make the league--especially with four years under Buzz's development.
But let me put you on the spot--do you expect Blue to make it or not?
Blue has a legitimate shot but who knows at this point? Answer: Nobody. Not even one GM knows.
It's just as disingenuous to say that Crean took us to the NIT with 2 NBA players as it is to say Buzz "only" got us to the S16 with four NBA players. If Diner, Novak, Crowder, or DJO were NBA players those years, they would have been drafted after that season. They weren't ready for that level yet, hence they remained in college. When MU has had NBA-ready talent, we make the tournament and generally do fairly well.
Quote from: Jajuannaman on February 05, 2013, 04:10:12 PM
It's just as disingenuous to say that Crean took us to the NIT with 2 NBA players as it is to say Buzz "only" got us to the S16 with four NBA players. If Diner, Novak, Crowder, or DJO were NBA players those years, they would have been drafted after that season. They weren't ready for that level yet, hence they remained in college. When MU has had NBA-ready talent, we make the tournament and generally do fairly well.
Slow. Clap.
Thread. Over.
Quote from: Guns n Ammo on February 05, 2013, 05:01:27 PM
Slow. Clap.
Thread. Over.
'cept I spelled "Diener" wrong. Commence self-flagellation.
Quote from: Jajuannaman on February 05, 2013, 05:24:45 PM
'cept I spelled "Diener" wrong. Commence self-flagellation.
...modify button.
Crean is a recycler...
http://offthebench.nbcsports.com/2012/11/17/ewwww-indiana-mens-basketball-coach-tom-crean-eats-gum-off-the-court-video/
Quote from: The Lens on February 03, 2013, 09:00:30 AM
You don't want to do this Chicos, they won at home. Their schedule turns brutal soon. This IU team on the road plus TC at the wheel does not forecast to end well.
Well, they only have one loss away from home so far this year. I expect them to lose a few coming up, but the way some people are talking they can't win anything on the road. Their record says something else.
Quote from: keefe on February 03, 2013, 08:39:42 PM
There. Fixed. On your knees, Bondsman
I liked it so much better when you were writing Haiku's or playing pretend pilot.
Quote from: The Lens on February 03, 2013, 10:31:50 AM
I'm not saying at all that this will fall from the rankings etc...more so, I think they will stay in the Top 10 and get a 2 seed but I just don't see him winning 4 games in March, and that is where this team will be measured.
Depends on the draw, but I don't disagree with you. Though I do think there is a lot of hating in some of the picks here, too. Some of the predictions have been so wildly poor it's the only thing I can attribute it to...certainly not what people are watching with their eyes.
It's a crapshoot. One bad shooting night, and you're toast. One hot shooting night from the opponent, and you're toast. Only one team wins it all. Though he's been to a Final Four and not many coaches have...he has a lot of nice pieces...it will be a fun tournament to watch.
Quote from: The Equalizer on February 05, 2013, 03:46:28 PM
Sure I would. Why wouldn't I expect Blue to make the League? He's got the talent, he's scoring well, he's probably the best overall talent on our team.
He was ranked in the top 35 out of high school by no fewer than four different services (as high as 24th by Rivals). I'd be surprised if he didn't make the league--especially with four years under Buzz's development.
But let me put you on the spot--do you expect Blue to make it or not?
As is typically your wont, you give a false (to your side of the argument) impression by stating only Van's highest rankings. In the end, the TRUTH is his RSCI was 53 and falling.
I think he's got a real shot, but I wouldn't put him in the league now to further a bogus argument. Which is, of course, what you did.
BUMP
Not too proud to say...Nice win for TC & Co. I have maintained their road feb schedule would be their undoing, so today is a nice and unexpected win in my eyes.
Just like with Deane at Lamar, it's nice to see a forced-out coach find success elsewhere. A win-win.
Quote from: The Lens on February 10, 2013, 01:57:31 PM
BUMP
Not to proud to say...Nice win for TC & Co. I have maintained their road feb schedule would be their undoing, so today is a nice and unexpected win in my eyes.
Just like with Deane at Lamar, it's nice to see a forced-out coach find success elsewhere. A win-win.
Forced out coach?
Crean making MU look bad. Odds on favorite to win title. Hell of a game versus ohio state.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 10, 2013, 02:08:47 PM
Forced out coach?
Pete Carroll?
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/sports_blog/2009/12/usc-football-pete-carroll-charlie-weis-notre-dame.html
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 10, 2013, 02:08:47 PM
Forced out coach?
Yep, it was a gutsy call but validated by back to back Sweet 16s. I just wish they would have been more up front about it but, the curious coaching "search" makes all the sense now.
Quote from: The Lens on February 10, 2013, 02:37:10 PM
Yep, it was a gutsy call but validated by back to back Sweet 16s. I just wish they would have been more up front about it but, the curious coaching "search" makes all the sense now.
For it to be "validated" wouldn't you want the next chapter to achieve just as much as the previous chapter?
Quote from: The Golden Avalanche on February 10, 2013, 02:39:47 PM
For it to be "validated" wouldn't you want the next chapter to achieve just as much as the previous chapter?
The next chapter already has achieved as much as the previous chapter - 5 NCAA tourney wins - albeit in just 4 seasons, as opposed to 9 at the helm. The next chapter has yet led us into 1st round NIT exits coming off Sweet 16 season with 2 future NBA players on the roster. The next chapter appears to have a very talented bench of players top to bottom that should be able to sustain continued NCAA tourney appearances.
I'll never understand why some want to downplay the achievements of our CURRENT coach to try to prop up and inflate those of our previous coach who chose to move on from MU.
Quote from: Ners on February 10, 2013, 03:03:27 PM
I'll never understand why some want to downplay the achievements of our CURRENT coach to try to prop up and inflate those of our previous coach who chose to move on from MU.
Probably for the same reason some want to downplay the achievements of our PREVIOUS coach to try to prop up and inflate those of out current coach.
Tom Cream did a very good job for Marquette.
Buzz Williams is doing a very good job for Marquette.
Why some of thou continue to find it necessary to take sides and debate the same crap making the same arguments FIVE years later is beyond me.
Quote from: The Lens on February 10, 2013, 02:37:10 PM
Yep, it was a gutsy call but validated by back to back Sweet 16s. I just wish they would have been more up front about it but, the curious coaching "search" makes all the sense now.
I assume teal is stuck on your keyboard. ;)
Quote from: Ners on February 10, 2013, 03:03:27 PM
The next chapter already has achieved as much as the previous chapter - 5 NCAA tourney wins - albeit in just 4 seasons, as opposed to 9 at the helm. The next chapter has yet led us into 1st round NIT exits coming off Sweet 16 season with 2 future NBA players on the roster. The next chapter appears to have a very talented bench of players top to bottom that should be able to sustain continued NCAA tourney appearances.
I'll never understand why some want to downplay the achievements of our CURRENT coach to try to prop up and inflate those of our previous coach who chose to move on from MU.
Next chapter looks great....though if you want to play the game you are playing, the next chapter hasn't taken us to a Final Four, won a conference championship, started with a much different situation (real practice facility, Big East, a few years off Final Four, etc. Goes both ways. Glad we've had great coaches, past and present.
Quote from: Pakuni on February 10, 2013, 06:37:48 PM
Probably for the same reason some want to downplay the achievements of our PREVIOUS coach to try to prop up and inflate those of out current coach.
Tom Cream did a very good job for Marquette.
Buzz Williams is doing a very good job for Marquette.
Why some of thou continue to find it necessary to take sides and debate the same crap making the same arguments FIVE years later is beyond me.
This is a very good point. No argument here....I had a great appreciation for what Crean did at MU results-wise, but ultimately got sucked into the ridiculous 5 year debate due to the group who was taking shots at the current coach in an effort to champion the previous. My thought was why take shots at the guy who is the current coach...and why not let go of Crean, everyone recognize what he did/accomplished at MU....and move on?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on February 10, 2013, 07:11:02 PM
Next chapter looks great....though if you want to play the game you are playing, the next chapter hasn't taken us to a Final Four, won a conference championship, started with a much different situation (real practice facility, Big East, a few years off Final Four, etc. Goes both ways. Glad we've had great coaches, past and present.
Agree...though I wouldn't put too* much value on the Conference USA championship..a nice achievement but to win a Big East title obviously is a whole different animal. No doubt the profile of MU hoops was raised big time through Crean's efforts at MU, which certainly made Buzz's job an easier situation to walk into. It's worked out well for TC to go to Indiana, and MU hasn't lost a step with Buzz at the helm, and Buzz probably is a slightly better recruiter than was TC...which is needed at MU...as it certainly is a harder place to recruit to than a blue blood program.