From a blog piece on the marketing of Kentucky basketball, again noting (as did a recent article posted here more directed at Coach K's phoniness in comparison to Calipari) that there at least is honesty in how Calipari promotes Kentucky's program:
"What Calipari has done is turn his basketball program into a place that, like a law, business, dental, or other professional school, is focused on insuring that each of its students moves on to successful, satisfying careers. In this regard, Calipari is the most honest man in the sport."
As has been noted here many times, there is Kentucky, and then Kansas, UNC, Duke and maybe a couple of others, and then the rest....
Kentucky is simply a different model. And while Calipari is clearly an egomaniac, he uses his ego and the culture of celebrity to serve his ultimate purposes in recruiting.
Read more: http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/sportingscene/2012/11/john-calipari-and-the-marketing-of-kentucky-basketball.html#ixzz2CJsTzPdM (http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/sportingscene/2012/11/john-calipari-and-the-marketing-of-kentucky-basketball.html#ixzz2CJsTzPdM)
Love Calipari. He is always 5 steps ahead of everyone else
The guy's a winner. In may ways he is a latter day Al McGuire.
That place is ridiculous. If you haven't seen it, here's the video:
http://www.coachcal.com/16170/2012/09/no-place-like-home-uks-new-gold-standard-in-housing/
Time for someone to pony up $7,000,000 to build a facility across from the Al. Though something tells me Marquette wouldn't accept the donation...
Quote from: unforgiven on November 15, 2012, 04:49:25 PM
The guy's a winner. In may ways he is a latter day Al McGuire.
Really. I didn't know McGuire put 2 schools on probation.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on November 15, 2012, 05:36:59 PM
Really. I didn't know McGuire put 2 schools on probation.
Dagger!!!
Man, the college sports arms race is really out of control.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on November 15, 2012, 05:36:59 PM
Really. I didn't know McGuire put 2 schools on probation.
First, there is no greater, better, funnier coach than Al McGuire. But to think Al didn't cut corners is naïve. He had a tremendous relationship with a number of JCs, the best with Saddleback College
Some love him. Some hate him. Not unlike Vander Blue.
Thread success.
So, just to get this straight, Calipari does right by his players?
So if I did research on the players he has recruited to the various institutions I will find that either 1) they are set for life playing basketball or 2) they have a degree from his institution at a higher rate than Duke, Kansas, North Carolina, etc.?
I call b.s.
Quote from: MarquetteDano on November 15, 2012, 09:44:51 PM
So, just to get this straight, Calipari does right by his players?
So if I did research on the players he has recruited to the various institutions I will find that either 1) they are set for life playing basketball or 2) they have a degree from his institution at a higher rate than Duke, Kansas, North Carolina, etc.?
I call b.s.
Don't call bs on the author. As he says:
"These are clear violations of N.C.A.A. regulations intended to maintain the sanctity of amateur athletics, an industry with revenues in the billions, and, as such, Calipari is certainly bad for the institution of college basketball as practiced over many decades.
But he does not do badly by his top players, and the violations above are not breaches of Calipari's own stated goal: getting young men paid to play the game of basketball.
Quote from: MarquetteDano on November 15, 2012, 09:44:51 PM
So, just to get this straight, Calipari does right by his players?
So if I did research on the players he has recruited to the various institutions I will find that either 1) they are set for life playing basketball or 2) they have a degree from his institution at a higher rate than Duke, Kansas, North Carolina, etc.?
I call b.s.
You can call b.s. but I wont. The NBA seems to put a premium on Cal's players. The hype machine cannot be stopped. So many thought Pitino's 96 UK team could not be topped; they were considered the greatest team in the history of ncaa basketball. I think Cal topped it...twice. And there is more to come. Wiggins is considered the next Carmelo Anthony. He will end up at UK....along with the Harrison twins.
Quote from: unforgiven on November 15, 2012, 08:33:58 PM
First, there is no greater, better, funnier coach than Al McGuire. But to think Al didn't cut corners is naïve. He had a tremendous relationship with a number of JCs, the best with Saddleback College
I'm sorry, Calipari is scum and Al is a legend. The only thing they have in common is an uncanny ability of self promotion.
I cannot stand Calipari. Slimey as they come.
Quote from: JoBo2756 on November 15, 2012, 11:41:12 PM
I cannot stand Calipari. Slimey Squirmy as they come.
Fixed
I think the opinions of Calipari are determined by your opinion of the state of college basketball. People who believe in the "student" part of student-athlete and how the NCAA puts on the charade of saying academics matter or are necessary to college athletics believe Calipari is "slimey". People who think that the NCAA is a joke, and that the only thing that matters is the sport and the athletes and succeeding in that regard believe Calipari is honest and successful.
Personally, I think as long as the "student-athlete" image is attempted to be upheld by the NCAA/institutions then Calipari will be slimey and undermining the philosophy of college athletics. But you can't deny his success at spitting in the face of that philosophy and building his own minor league NBA team.
Same old story about the forced amateurism world the NCAA lives in and the real world as it actually exists.
Quote from: jesmu84 on November 16, 2012, 10:45:08 AM
I think the opinions of Calipari are determined by your opinion of the state of college basketball. People who believe in the "student" part of student-athlete and how the NCAA puts on the charade of saying academics matter or are necessary to college athletics believe Calipari is "slimey". People who think that the NCAA is a joke, and that the only thing that matters is the sport and the athletes and succeeding in that regard believe Calipari is honest and successful.
Personally, I think as long as the "student-athlete" image is attempted to be upheld by the NCAA/institutions then Calipari will be slimey and undermining the philosophy of college athletics. But you can't deny his success at spitting in the face of that philosophy and building his own minor league NBA team.
You have a good point here. So if there are two sets of fans that either believe the NCAA is right and college athletes should be "student-athletes" (notice student comes first) vs. those that believe the NCAA is a sham, than there are certainly some athletic departments that fit into those two camps. My issue is the flexibility with which those two camps can operate and the fact that their results are often very different. I want Marquette to win. However, if our athletes are students first, we will never have a chance against a program that views things differently. Based on LW's interview in the Marquette Journal (or whatever it's called) he is very serious about us having "student-athletes" (which is fine and I respect that). However, I HIGHLY doubt that the UK athletic director would give an interview along those same lines because I don't believe they view their program and "student" athletes through the same lense.
That said, I'm thinking that there needs to either be a stricter set of rules against athletic perks to cut the UKs of the world down to size, or we need to go in the other direction, remove the whole idea of "students first, athletes second," start paying our men's basketball and football players and make it clear that we should all compete on the same playing field. Otherwise it won't be fair and never will. (maybe the lynch pin here is revenue because in both of these scenarios, schools lose out on money either way.)
UK is getting so close to skirting the rules it makes me sick. Maybe some of the lawyers on this board can weigh in on the possibility that they have a rules review every year to explore where they can exploit new or different loop holes to gain competitive advantage. I don't believe Marquette would do that (it's against who we are as a culture and university), but I would be willing to bet $50 that UK has done it at least once in the past 3 years.
I'm just bitter that he's getting away with it and taking all the good players (can you tell I'm a bit bitter...)
Thoughts?
Quote from: honkytonk on November 15, 2012, 10:25:44 PM
You can call b.s. but I wont. The NBA seems to put a premium on Cal's players. The hype machine cannot be stopped. So many thought Pitino's 96 UK team could not be topped; they were considered the greatest team in the history of ncaa basketball. I think Cal topped it...twice. And there is more to come. Wiggins is considered the next Carmelo Anthony. He will end up at UK....along with the Harrison twins.
I don't have the same problem that many do with regards to Calipari. But the NBA likes his Kentucky players not because of Coach Cal, but because they are highly talented - probably talented enough to go to the NBA right out of high school.
And I'm not sure what you are saying about Pitino's 1996 team - Kentucky beat UMass in the Final Four that year after losing to them earlier in the year.
Quote from: JoBo2756 on November 16, 2012, 11:09:12 AM
That said, I'm thinking that there needs to either be a stricter set of rules against athletic perks to cut the UKs of the world down to size, or we need to go in the other direction, remove the whole idea of "students first, athletes second," start paying our men's basketball and football players and make it clear that we should all compete on the same playing field. Otherwise it won't be fair and never will. (maybe the lynch pin here is revenue because in both of these scenarios, schools lose out on money either way.)
The problem with the NCAA having a stricter set of rules is that the organization is already filled with arcane rules with no consistency on how they are implemented - not to mention that they don't have the staff to fully carry out what they already have in place.
I mean, they have not declared Shabazz Muhammed eligible even though they can't tell him what exactly he has done wrong. I don't want to give this organization any more rules to enforce.
I love Al and think he was years ahead of his time. When I see Pitino I see Al's style and mannerisms. Cal has some similarity to me as well. Biggest comparison to me is the hate they generate and how that relates to Al. Back in the day outside of MU fans Al was a villian. He loved the role and both Pitino and Cal love that role today.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on November 16, 2012, 11:15:46 AM
I don't have the same problem that many do with regards to Calipari. But the NBA likes his Kentucky players not because of Coach Cal, but because they are highly talented - probably talented enough to go to the NBA right out of high school.
And I'm not sure what you are saying about Pitino's 1996 team - Kentucky beat UMass in the Final Four that year after losing to them earlier in the year.
Im talking in terms of the number of players that made the NBA from the 96 team.
Tony Delk, Ron Mercer, Mark Pope, Antoine Walker, Derek Anderson, Nazr Mohammed, Walter McCarty...and I think another one or two might have had a cup of coffee at some point.
Quote from: unforgiven on November 15, 2012, 08:33:58 PM
First, there is no greater, better, funnier coach than Al McGuire. But to think Al didn't cut corners is naïve. He had a tremendous relationship with a number of JCs, the best with Saddleback College
Al took very few JUCOs. His stars -- Thompson, Dean, Chones, Allie, Bo, Butch, Lucas, Frazier, Jeff Sewell -- came in as freshmen. He filled in with Whitehead, Lackey and a few (not many) others. And he always had four or five local kids fill out the roster, and they all came in as freshmen.