It's an insider article, but here's the blurb:
If Buzz Williams is no longer welcome in West Virginia, he's got plenty of friends in his adopted home state of Wisconsin. The native Texan crushed recruiting in the Badger State this year by adding two high schoolers and a junior college product. The biggest names are ESPN 100 prospects small forward Deonte Burton (Milwaukee, Wis./Vincent) and point guard Duane Wilson (Milwaukee, Wis./Domincan). Burton is one of the most powerful and explosive players in the 2013 class, while Wilson is a solid combo guard with range to 20 feet and a solid basketball IQ.
They are behind UNC, Michigan and Kansas and just ahead of Indiana.
http://insider.espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/classrankings
ESPN is a little slow on the uptake, but I think it's a matter of time before McKay gets the national recognition that DJO and Crowder got. He may not win JUCO POY, but I think he'll finish near the top and make this class look that much better.
Quote from: dwaderoy2004 on June 13, 2012, 02:19:59 PM
and just ahead of Indiana.
http://insider.espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/classrankings
THIS!
Quote from: Gardner's Postgame Snack on June 13, 2012, 04:01:59 PM
ESPN is a little slow on the uptake, but I think it's a matter of time before McKay gets the national recognition that DJO and Crowder got. He may not win JUCO POY, but I think he'll finish near the top and make this class look that much better.
Maybe in retrospect, but neither, bit even NJCPOY Crowder really helped our recruiting rankings. I think McKay could be an immense player for us, and will almost certainly have the biggest impact of any of the Milwaukee's Best in 2013-14, but don't expect ESPN to really acknowledge his existence until he steps on the court.
Did ESPN change the way they do their player rankings? I could have sworn that in the past, all top 100 players were at least an 89 or higher and most were well into the 90s. It appears that only 20 or so players are even in the 90s for the 2013 class.
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on June 15, 2012, 05:33:46 PM
Did ESPN change the way they do their player rankings? I could have sworn that in the past, all top 100 players were at least an 89 or higher and most were well into the 90s. It appears that only 20 or so players are even in the 90s for the 2013 class.
Yes, they have adjusted how they rate players, so they have a wider range of scores to give out.
Quote from: LittleMurs on June 15, 2012, 08:19:34 PM
Yes, they have adjusted how they rate players, so they have a wider range of scores to give out.
Will all JUCOs still get the "40-We haven't even pretended to look at this guy" treatment?
Quote from: Bocephys on June 15, 2012, 10:42:40 PM
Will all JUCOs still get the "40-We haven't even pretended to look at this guy" treatment?
The 40 rating will be replaced with a stick figure shrugging its shoulders.
Quote from: Bocephys on June 15, 2012, 10:42:40 PM
Will all JUCOs still get the "40-We haven't even pretended to look at this guy" treatment?
It's amazing. These guys could have 80+ rankings on ESPN out of high school, but their skills dramatically deteriorate in the JUCO ranks ::)
Quote from: Gardner's Postgame Snack on June 16, 2012, 01:15:03 PM
It's amazing. These guys could have 80+ rankings on ESPN out of high school, but their skills dramatically deteriorate in the JUCO ranks ::)
No, they don't. They just don't rank JUCOs. They are literally saying nothing about them as players when they grade them as a 40. They are not saying they suck.
Matt Thomas committed to Iowa State I didn't even hear that.
Quote from: wadesworld on June 16, 2012, 01:16:49 PM
No, they don't. They just don't rank JUCOs. They are literally saying nothing about them as players when they grade them as a 40. They are not saying they suck.
I just believe that you could carry over the information that accumulated when they were in high school (for those that were sought after non-qualifiers). Will it be entirely accurate? No, but 8 times out of 10, it'd give you a pretty decent ballpark.
Quote from: Gardner's Postgame Snack on June 18, 2012, 10:05:31 AM
I just believe that you could carry over the information that accumulated when they were in high school (for those that were sought after non-qualifiers). Will it be entirely accurate? No, but 8 times out of 10, it'd give you a pretty decent ballpark.
But do you really want a polished juco
measured the same as a high schooler?
Agree with Gardner.
Quote from: martyconlonontherun on June 18, 2012, 02:41:07 PM
But do you really want a polished juco
measured the same as a high schooler?
That's the thing. These recruit rankings aren't just based on the upcoming year, or if you put X's recruits against Y's in a pick-up game. 4 years of a top recruit is better than 2 years of a JUCO. Yes, most top recruits won't stay four years but you can't assume that.
Quote from: strotty on June 18, 2012, 03:03:17 PM
That's the thing. These recruit rankings aren't just based on the upcoming year, or if you put X's recruits against Y's in a pick-up game. 4 years of a top recruit is better than 2 years of a JUCO. Yes, most top recruits won't stay four years but you can't assume that.
Not so sure about that... I'd rather have 2 years of Crowder & 3 years of DJO than 4 years of Jamail Jones or Erik Williams. And I thought those guys were gonna be good (obviously, given my screen name). Plus a lot of top 100 guys ride the pine the first year or two anyway.
You look at the lists of the Top 10, maybe the top 15 are potential pros and at least solid college players. After that, it is a crap shoot, you are recruiting on potential. Some live
up to there rankings but majority do not come close. Buzz is a good at valuating talent, having an eye for a good player. More importantly, he has coaches that he has befriended
that have helped him get players in JC. Now kids know about Buzz getting a few of them in the league. I am sure McKay wanted to come to MU but having all those JC kids make the
pros made a difference in his recruitment.
Quote from: Jamailman on June 18, 2012, 03:31:04 PM
Not so sure about that... I'd rather have 2 years of Crowder & 3 years of DJO than 4 years of Jamail Jones or Erik Williams. And I thought those guys were gonna be good (obviously, given my screen name). Plus a lot of top 100 guys ride the pine the first year or two anyway.
That's all hindsight, though.
Quote from: strotty on June 18, 2012, 04:10:00 PM
That's all hindsight, though.
Yes, our 20/20 hindsight is telling us that buzz's jucos have outplayed his four-year players.
Quote from: Jamailman on June 18, 2012, 03:31:04 PM
Not so sure about that... I'd rather have 2 years of Crowder & 3 years of DJO than 4 years of Jamail Jones or Erik Williams. And I thought those guys were gonna be good (obviously, given my screen name). Plus a lot of top 100 guys ride the pine the first year or two anyway.
And that's why I think ESPN doesn't try to even compare the two. The recruit number is more of a projection, whereas a JUCO has less potential but a lot to offer right away.
It would be nice if ESPN would give a separate grade (Maybe an A-F grading scale) but it doesn't make sense to put Burton and McKay on the same 1-100 chart as if they were comparable.
Quote from: RawdogDX on June 18, 2012, 06:40:11 PM
Yes, our 20/20 hindsight is telling us that buzz's jucos have outplayed his four-year players.
Right, and recruiting rankings are done before any kids step on the court. So...?
I find it hilarious that we're still arguing about the ESPN rating methodology. ESPN is the DePaul of the recruiting services... sure they have the name, history, and every once in a while they knock down a half-court shot, but at the end of the day, they're still a last-place team.
I've seen better arguments from trekkies arguing Kirk vs. Picard.
Buzz is going to add another player to the 2013 class. Coach Chew is in charge of the recruitment for the last player. Will be interesting to see what happens with the holy scholarship thing.