So on both sides of the court, the refs seemed a bit inexplicable last night. They really wanted to be in control of that game. The technicals (especially on DG when it looked like he got kicked in the chest) and a lot of the ticky-tack fouls seemed baffling. But as I thought about it this morning, I began to wonder...did they think this had the makings of another Cincy/Xavier? I mean, the refs seemed really intent on controlling the pace for much of the game and some of the fouls both ways were really harsh.
Also, the BC has been really good this year about showing replay, especially on questionable calls. Last night I don't remember them replaying a single foul. It makes me wonder if they were maybe trying to keep the crowd from getting too riled up. I honestly don't remember a cascade of boos for a ref like that in a long time at the BC.
It all makes me wonder if reffing is going to be more strict in cross-city games because of that UC/XU game. I hope not...last night was darn near unwatchable at times with all the enforced breaks in play.
There is a fundamental difference between UC/XU and Marquette vs. UWM. For one thing, the coaches at Marquette and Milwaukee seem to respect each other more. For another, it seems that Marquette and Milwaukee are competing for recruits in two different worlds. When was the last time a Marquette recruit came from Randolph?
The reality is that Cincinnati and Xavier are in each other's diapers. Both are potential Final Four teams in many, if not most, years. They recruit similar athletes and are parallel programs. UWM may want to think they are on par with Marquette -- and they have had a few good years -- but the fact that we're 39-0 against them speaks volumes.
Rob Jeter has a nice program on the East Side. They win and if last night was any indication, they're scrappy. They are well coached and play hard. They may make the NCAAs, but they've got about 15 to 20 years of excellence to come before they reach our level.
I do believe that both techinals called on MU were because of the Cincy effect. I have no problem with that. I want the refs to take charge now, so players learn before NCAA tournament not to complain. The refs missed last night Gardner inbounding the ball with his foot over the line. I wish they would of caught that. We need to eliminate the dumb things before it actaully gets called in an important game.
My wife likes to play on her iPhone during the game, looking up only when it gets loud. Because of that, I'm often telling her "Watch this replay!"
That said, and this is just a gut feeling, but I think the BC has been showing fewer and fewer "questionable" replays in general. Because this game was called so close it's a little more evident, but in my opinion, it's part of a larger trend.
As for the calls by the refs, I think you're exactly right. The intentional on DG was inexcusable (although I do think they had to call the foul there) and they T'd him up almost immediately when he started talking. They were shutting things down quick. For two teams without a history of fisticuffs, that was a little odd (and frustrating to watch).
It was a horribly officiated game. Maybe the worst I've seen. The funny thing was that it could have been a real nice basketball game between two rival schools (and their fans) who would have simply enjoyed it and said 'nice game' afterward. No bad blood between the teams or the fans, just legitimate frustration with the refs.
My favorite part was the MU student section inviting a big group of UWM kids down into the preferred lower bleacher behind the baseline. Of course this was done to give energy to the late second half "You Suck!" cheer directed away from the MKE bench and straight at their 'guests'. It was all good as the kids from both sides enjoyed the banter. Too bad the entire night couldn't be like that.
Baldy McCrackin was horrible both ways. Every thing you don't want in an official: delayed calls, hypersensitive, had an agenda to control the game, fell for the flops on both ends, got defensive and was eager to show his power, was only looking at the feet in the horseshoe and not the body movement, Bigs camped in the lane for 8 seconds. I think DJO had two legit fouls.
And Baldy was in position for all of this it seemed. I was pining for Eddie.
Quote from: brewcity77 on December 23, 2011, 05:41:09 AM
So on both sides of the court, the refs seemed a bit inexplicable last night. They really wanted to be in control of that game. The technicals (especially on DG when it looked like he got kicked in the chest) and a lot of the ticky-tack fouls seemed baffling. But as I thought about it this morning, I began to wonder...did they think this had the makings of another Cincy/Xavier? I mean, the refs seemed really intent on controlling the pace for much of the game and some of the fouls both ways were really harsh.
Also, the BC has been really good this year about showing replay, especially on questionable calls. Last night I don't remember them replaying a single foul. It makes me wonder if they were maybe trying to keep the crowd from getting too riled up. I honestly don't remember a cascade of boos for a ref like that in a long time at the BC.
It all makes me wonder if reffing is going to be more strict in cross-city games because of that UC/XU game. I hope not...last night was darn near unwatchable at times with all the enforced breaks in play.
I just think they were in over their head. They ruined the flow of the game. Created more problems than they solved. Players were getting frustrated with the officials and then taking it out on the other team is not good either. I do think they created some of the chippiness.
Buzz spent an awful lot of time chewing on them. Two in particular. He, and the bench, seemed awfully frustrated with those idiots.
Going into the half and right before the 2nd half, he was really getting into it with the one official who had a semblance of hair on his head. That guy gave a look like he was constipated. Maybe he was and that was why he was the worst of the 3 - which is a really bad distinction to hold.
The last minute or so, he was standing right behind the official complaining about something.
I don't recall seeing these guys before. I hate to say it, but it made me wish for the trio of Burr, Higgins and Driscol instead.
I'm wondering if the teams get any say in who the refs are? Of course you can't have the home team choose the refs out of their own conference for obvious reasons but I think in this case both Buzz and Jeter would agree 'never again' on the yahoos that 'ruined' last night's game. It really was a shame. The boos cascaded down from all fans regardless of team loyalty, although on different plays of course.
It was unfortunate, I was really excited to attend my first game of the year where MU was playing a reasonably competent opponent and had some friends from out of town joining me. However, the officiating made the game damn near unwatchable. I think it totally threw off the flow of the game, really disrupted the rhythm of the offense for both teams, and just got in the players' heads.
Here's hoping that crew doesn't get any more of our games this year, or in the cross town games going forward.
We even heard Bill Cords comment, walking out after the game, that this was the worst job of officiating by a crew in a game that he had ever seen.
Quote from: dgies9156 on December 23, 2011, 09:50:25 AM
The reality is that Cincinnati and Xavier are in each other's diapers. Both are potential Final Four teams in many, if not most, years.
Um, do you mean Duke and North Carolina? Neither Cincy or the X-Men deserve that much credit.
Quote from: Dr. Blackheart on December 23, 2011, 10:23:24 AM
Baldy McCrackin was horrible both ways. Every thing you don't want in an official: delayed calls, hypersensitive, had an agenda to control the game, fell for the flops on both ends, got defensive and was eager to show his power, was only looking at the feet in the horseshoe and not the body movement, Bigs camped in the lane for 8 seconds. I think DJO had two legit fouls.
And Baldy was in position for all of this it seemed. I was pining for Eddie.
Besides his ridiculous agenda towards DJO, my favorite call of his was when Jamil was playing D, his fan fell in front of him, Jamil took a step back as the player got up, Baldy put his whistle in his mouth and crouched, and as soon as Jamil re-established defensive post position on the UWM player after he got up, Baldy blew the whistle. It was horrible and completely representative of the predictive officiating he operated under all evening.
Completely agree, Brew. I had the same exact thoughts last night that they were trying way too hard to make sure X-Cincy didn't occur. The funny part is that game is a rivalry and one with a completely different dynamic.
I also overheard a conversation in the stands... someone said they had reffed with the bald ref (that's a joke) in a girl's high school game. Said he gave two T's to one of the coaches in that game as well.
Quote from: JWags85 on December 23, 2011, 01:12:19 PM
Besides his ridiculous agenda towards DJO, my favorite call of his was when Jamil was playing D, his fan fell in front of him, Jamil took a step back as the player got up, Baldy put his whistle in his mouth and crouched, and as soon as Jamil re-established defensive post position on the UWM player after he got up, Baldy blew the whistle. It was horrible and completely representative of the predictive officiating he operated under all evening.
I don't think they had any sort of "agenda" against DJO. They were just bad...and both sides had reasons to complain.
BE does not want replays of questionable calls played on the jumbo trons. The topic is brought up each year as early on we get all the replays then as conference play approaches the replays start to go away.
As for Baldy I think he also was on the floor for the GB game and he must have really thought it was a Cincy-XU type rivalry last night. Thankfully almost all his work is in the Horizon and MAC
Are these 3 BE refs?
I suspect the NCAA has issued guidelines to refs regarding "rivalry games". It would explain the refs being (IMO) way too over controlling. It made for such a boring game.
Well, on to Vandy.
Quote from: dgies9156 on December 23, 2011, 09:50:25 AM
There is a fundamental difference between UC/XU and Marquette vs. UWM. For one thing, the coaches at Marquette and Milwaukee seem to respect each other more. For another, it seems that Marquette and Milwaukee are competing for recruits in two different worlds. When was the last time a Marquette recruit came from Randolph?
Ahhh Marquette offered that Randolph player you speak of. Kyle Kelm!!
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on December 23, 2011, 02:45:13 PM
I don't think they had any sort of "agenda" against DJO. They were just bad...and both sides had reasons to complain.
I was mostly joking due to the fact that he was on the whistle for both of the bad charging calls against him.
Quote from: schubert33 on December 23, 2011, 05:14:50 PM
Ahhh Marquette offered that Randolph player you speak of. Kyle Kelm!!
Which quietly went away as his HS career progressed...
Quote from: schubert33 on December 23, 2011, 05:14:50 PM
Ahhh Marquette offered that Randolph player you speak of. Kyle Kelm!!
I believe Wisconsin had an interest early in his career, as well. Yet he chose UWM "over" both those programs. I wonder why. ;)
Quote from: radome on December 23, 2011, 03:08:22 PM
Are these 3 BE refs?
I read the article from the JS announcing the 5 year contract as research for the piece I wrote about continuing the series for Anonymous Eagle.
The first four games were Big East refs. This year was Horizon League refs.
it was pretty evident that they were lower-league refs.
I'm sure they are just fine for a Youngstown State game- certainly over their heads when the game and talent picksup.
I watch a lot of Horizon basketball. I don't think the refs were "over their heads" or anything like that. You guys make it sound like the Horizon is like a JV girls high school game. I think they were just bad.