Looks like the Portuguese translation of Fab Melo is Trevor Mbakwe
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http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6616793
Syracuse center Fab Melo has been arraigned in City Court on a misdemeanor charge after a fight with his girlfriend.
Police say the 20-year-old Brazilian allegedly got into a fight with his girlfriend and damaged her car on Monday. Melo, who was accompanied to court by assistant coach Bernie Fine, pleaded not guilty to criminal mischief and released without bail.
City Judge James Cecile issued an order of protection for the woman, who was in the car at the time of the incident.
Coach Jim Boeheim referred all questions to the university's public affairs office, which declined comment.
The 7-foot Melo, the preseason Big East rookie of the year, never lived up to the hype, averaging just over 2 points and just under 2 rebounds in 24 starts.
What's that thing they say about throwing stones in glass houses??
Quote from: mosarsour on June 07, 2011, 10:55:14 AM
What's that thing they say about throwing stones in glass houses??
Maybe I'm a d-bag, but I don't mind taking a bit of enjoyment from your opponents' mishaps. As a Bears fan in the 1990s, there was very little joy, so when the Packers lost to a miserable Colts team in Indy (a game I won lots of money on), or when they lost to the Broncos in the Super Bowl, or any other time things went against them, I enjoyed it despite them clearly having a better team than the woeful Wannstedt Bears.
Yes, we have our struggles and players that don't work out here, but pointing out the inability of Bob Thuggins to recruit quality character guys, or chuckling at Pitino getting Porcini'd, or being glad that someone else has the crazy problematic big man this time, or laughing at what a...well...laughingstock DePaul has become doesn't really bother me. That's just part of the nature of fandom, to enjoy your success as well as your enemies foibles and downfalls.
Jesus, we spend enough time on this site tearing our own program, players, and coach new ones. I think it's refreshing that we're turning our attention outward for once.
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 07, 2011, 11:11:02 AM
Maybe I'm a d-bag, but I don't mind taking a bit of enjoyment from your opponents' mishaps. As a Bears fan in the 1990s, there was very little joy, so when the Packers lost to a miserable Colts team in Indy (a game I won lots of money on), or when they lost to the Broncos in the Super Bowl, or any other time things went against them, I enjoyed it despite them clearly having a better team than the woeful Wannstedt Bears.
Yes, we have our struggles and players that don't work out here, but pointing out the inability of Bob Thuggins to recruit quality character guys, or chuckling at Pitino getting Porcini'd, or being glad that someone else has the crazy problematic big man this time, or laughing at what a...well...laughingstock DePaul has become doesn't really bother me. That's just part of the nature of fandom, to enjoy your success as well as your enemies foibles and downfalls.
Jesus, we spend enough time on this site tearing our own program, players, and coach new ones. I think it's refreshing that we're turning our attention outward for once.
I see your side. You make a very valid point...especially re: how we as fans are quick to tear down our own program at times.
Quote from: mosarsour on June 07, 2011, 10:55:14 AM
What's that thing they say about throwing stones in glass houses??
Considering MU84 was comparing Fab Melo to a Marquette player, I don't think he's putting us above other teams.
Quote from: AnotherMU84 on June 07, 2011, 10:34:46 AM
-------------------
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6616793
The 7-foot Melo, the preseason Big East rookie of the year, never lived up to the hype, averaging just over 2 points and just under 2 rebounds in 24 starts.
I'm sure the other Marquette84 is at his keyboard berating ESPN and asserting that 2ppg and 2rpg in in line with reasonable expectations for Melo last year. LOL
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 07, 2011, 11:11:02 AM
Maybe I'm a d-bag, but I don't mind taking a bit of enjoyment from your opponents' mishaps. As a Bears fan in the 1990s, there was very little joy, so when the Packers lost to a miserable Colts team in Indy (a game I won lots of money on), or when they lost to the Broncos in the Super Bowl, or any other time things went against them, I enjoyed it despite them clearly having a better team than the woeful Wannstedt Bears.
Yes, we have our struggles and players that don't work out here, but pointing out the inability of Bob Thuggins to recruit quality character guys, or chuckling at Pitino getting Porcini'd, or being glad that someone else has the crazy problematic big man this time, or laughing at what a...well...laughingstock DePaul has become doesn't really bother me. That's just part of the nature of fandom, to enjoy your success as well as your enemies foibles and downfalls.
Jesus, we spend enough time on this site tearing our own program, players, and coach new ones. I think it's refreshing that we're turning our attention outward for once.
Brew, I get the enjoyment but then you have to be ready for the blowback.
We shouldn't be surprised when others take down our program publicly. Just as Lenny's ridiculous claims yesterday about following me for 12 years (holy crap is he full of BS) and saying I was defending Crean's program of all this terrible stuff (oh hark the Angel, Matthews got in a fight in practice and was
dismissed from the team...another kid used steroids and bet and was
dismissed from the team) and somehow comparing those minor actions to what the university and basketball program just went through that put our program on the front pages and top story in the evening news multiple days running. How the two are comparable is beyond me. I dare ask Lenny, Ringout, Tower, etc....name me one other time in the last 15 years where MU athletics has been the TOP story in the evening news for three straight days running and again the top story one day a week later based on scandal with the athletic department. I'd love to know a comparable incident in the 2000's since supposedly there was "equally" bad stuff going on. I guess I must have missed it as did all of the news outlets in town.
We have had plenty of our own issues over the years, regardless of who the coach has been. What happened in the last 2 months was the most this program has been under the microscope probably since the Amal situation in the 1990's....or prior to that with the Copa stuff. Like it or not, we looked pretty bad with how we ran to the athletic department and basketball program WEEKS if not MONTHS before we ran to Milwaukee Police Department. It's INDEFENSIBLE what we did and for that, I and others are said to have hit ROCK BOTTOM. WOW. Seriously...WOW! The fact of the matter is that it was indefensible and it's why the university has issued multiple public apologies, the athletic department has had to issue their own, policies have to be changed and we all know damn well that every other school that plays us we would rip them to shreds if their athletic department was given the heads up weeks \ months ahead of the local authorities.
The worst thing about it is that these 4 guys may have absolutely done nothing wrong at all, but by being stupid and going down the path we did, it looks like a coverup, the DA all but says the actions we took could be perceived as if stories are collaborated, etc.... not MU's finest moments and the players get painted as partially guilty by our rivals and people that already have a beef against MU.
For someone to say I and others have hit ROCK BOTTOM for stating basically what the MPD and DA said is ridiculous....I'm happy to call it what it is, just as they did. A foolishly implemented action that made the university and athletic program we all love look bad. If that's rock bottom, wanting to see us not act in this fashion, then rock bottom it is!
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 07, 2011, 12:40:36 PMBrew, I get the enjoyment but then you have to be ready for the blowback.
Everything after this really didn't seem to fit with where I was going with this, so I'll address the only sentence that I really needed to read out of that post.
I'm fine with that. That's what sports is about. You talk smack to your opponents, they talk smack back to you. You enjoy their shortcomings while they enjoy yours. If anyone can't take it, maybe they should find some more suitable interests. Otherwise, if you really want to be a sports fan, sack up and bring some smack to the party. If you're so thin-skinned that you can't handle it, restrict your entertainment time to reading books, going to the theater, or playing video games...just not online video games, because if you can't handle smack from sports fans, you'll never make it in the online world.
And before this goes off-topic, let's not turn this into another Crean/Buzz or Vander's indiscretions thread. Every time we try to have a little good-natured fun at our rivals' expense, some jackass site yokel (not naming ANY names, because there are too many to name, and I'm probably one of them sometimes) has to ruin it by trying to turn us all against ourselves. This should be about one thing and one thing only:
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff102/brewcity77/Nelson.jpg)
We followed protocols that have likely been in place for a loooooong time, informing the alleged victim that it was her decision on whether to take her accusations to the police. She declined and opted instead to have it handled by the university. She "had her day in court" at that level and the evidence necessary for a sexual assault charge wasn't there. She then went to the MPD who took her case to the DA. He used it to get himself some publicity but decided to not even bring ANY charges.
But we did get some negative publicity and for some that's the ultimate and unforgiveable sin. After all, deriving your self worth from managing perceptions better than the other guy (and getting your joy from ripping him for it) is all that's available to the small, shallow and phony. What a sad, pathetic way to look at life.
Apologies to Brew for responding to Chicos - nothing wrong with good natured back and forth between fans.
Once again one here seems to go by the premise: Guilty even if not charged with a crime, simply due to accusation.
On another note, at least Vander punched a DUDE and not a girl or her car. Seems to be common at Syracuse for basketball players to punch girlfriends, see Devendorf, Eric. But hey, lets not throw stones since we live in glass houses.
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 07, 2011, 01:31:14 PM
That's what sports is about. You talk smack to your opponents, they talk smack back to you. You enjoy their shortcomings while they enjoy yours. If anyone can't take it, maybe they should find some more suitable interests. Otherwise, if you really want to be a sports fan, sack up and bring some smack to the party.
Schadenfreude is a requirement to enjoy sports. If you don't agree with that, then I'll enjoy watching you suffer.
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 07, 2011, 01:31:14 PM
Everything after this really didn't seem to fit with where I was going with this, so I'll address the only sentence that I really needed to read out of that post.
I'm fine with that. That's what sports is about. You talk smack to your opponents, they talk smack back to you. You enjoy their shortcomings while they enjoy yours. If anyone can't take it, maybe they should find some more suitable interests. Otherwise, if you really want to be a sports fan, sack up and bring some smack to the party. If you're so thin-skinned that you can't handle it, restrict your entertainment time to reading books, going to the theater, or playing video games...just not online video games, because if you can't handle smack from sports fans, you'll never make it in the online world.
And before this goes off-topic, let's not turn this into another Crean/Buzz or Vander's indiscretions thread. Every time we try to have a little good-natured fun at our rivals' expense, some jackass site yokel (not naming ANY names, because there are too many to name, and I'm probably one of them sometimes) has to ruin it by trying to turn us all against ourselves. This should be about one thing and one thing only:
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff102/brewcity77/Nelson.jpg)
Easy for you to say now. Just wait until you hear opponents' fans chanting "Vander Orange."
Oh dear, I'm not sure I'll be able to withstand how they hurt us with their words.
Quote from: 2002MUalum on June 07, 2011, 02:52:00 PM
Schadenfreude is a requirement to enjoy sports. If you don't agree with that, then I'll enjoy watching you suffer.
When I sit down to watch a game, all I really care about is that both teams have fun, show good sportsmanship and try their darndest. Keeping score just leads to hurt feelings.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 07, 2011, 03:07:02 PM
When I sit down to watch a game, all I really care about is that both teams have fun, show good sportsmanship and try their darndest. Keeping score just leads to hurt feelings.
You may end up living in a trailer down by the river.
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 07, 2011, 01:31:14 PM
And before this goes off-topic, let's not turn this into another Crean/Buzz or Vander's indiscretions thread. Every time we try to have a little good-natured fun at our rivals' expense, some jackass site yokel (not naming ANY names, because there are too many to name, and I'm probably one of them sometimes) has to ruin it by trying to turn us all against ourselves. This should be about one thing and one thing only:
(http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff102/brewcity77/Nelson.jpg)
THIS........A select few have made this board almost unreadable...again.
Quote from: TallTitan34 on June 07, 2011, 12:01:53 PM
Considering MU84 was comparing Fab Melo to a Marquette player, I don't think he's putting us above other teams.
Correct ... I was trying to both enjoy some Schadenfreude and remind ourselves that we are not above what happened here.
And if this incident marks the end of Fab Melo at 'cuse, remember that it ended with a loss to MU!
I was thinking about this the other day when reading the other thread that was closed down (why was it closed down)? Some of the Chico post I do not agree with but two things are spot on.
1) Marquette really did mess up the investigation and it made not only the school, the athletic department look bad, but it casts a cloud over these four players. With the Duke Lacrosse case there was complete closure. In the end, everyone knew they were screwed over by a rogue DA and batcrap crazy woman at a school where a number of people couldn't wait to assume they were guilty because of who Duke is. That included a large number of liberal professors there that took out an advertisement lynching that team before the facts came out. In the end, closure. There will be no closure here, and that is a shame because it puts that cloud over these young men. The lack of closure is 100% on Marquette for the way they handled it. When I re-read those quotes Chico's posted from the police department and the district attorney, they essentially say there remains a cloud. They say they don't have enough evidence to prove guilt or exonerate these guys because of how Marquette handled. Very poor performance by MU and criticizing them for it does not mean one hates MU, Buzz Williams or anyone else. If someone criticizes the gov't, does it mean he hates the USA? If one criticizes the Bears or Packers or whomever your favorite team is, does that mean he hates them? MU blew this one and it's a shame for the players and has certainly loaded the gun for those in the Milwaukee community that already don't care for the school. Our rival basketball schools are having a field day with this. as they should.
2) I cannot remember a more troubling story about MU basketball in the last decade. He's right on that.
Brew, taking shots at teams is part of being a fan. Needling them when they are down, kicking them, making fun of them. We all love to do it and should continue. I disagree with Chico's on that one unless he is saying poke away and make fun, but don't get into the realm of arrests and misdeeds because our house is not clean. He may have a point there. I'd prefer to make fun of teams for not playing well, or watching IU lose to some directional school, or UW flameouts early in the tournament. Making fun of the other stuff seems to be ripe for bad karma.
Quote from: Hoopaloop on June 08, 2011, 09:42:23 AM
2) I cannot remember a more troubling story about MU basketball in the last decade. He's right on that.
It should have been a non-story. I guess what actually happened will never come out to the public.
I agree with others these types of trangressions are bound to happen, but that does not make them OK. 18-22 year olds make dumb decisions and they should have to deal with consequences realtive to their transgressions. MU and every other institution has had them.
Thankfully MU seems to run a pretty tight ship and does a pretty good job over the decades of bringing in high character kids, but even they make mistakes.
But to say what Blue did versus say what Dom James did is somehow different, is pathetic. To say what Mortensen did is OK in sports is truly truly pathetic...betting and cheating are the lowest forms of trangressions for any athlete. The theme never changes with chicos Buzz=bad, Crean = good. Blue gets in a fight...bad. James...gets in a fight= good. ignore works good until some one quotes the guy.
Seems chicos thinks a punk getting layed out for running his mouth is the worst thing in the world. Probably because he as a punk himself has been on the receiving end of more than a few knuckle sandwiches.
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand it's all about Blue and incidents at Marquette, yet again :-[
My lord do we ever take ourselves too seriously sometimes. Every win puts us in the Final Four and every loss means we're worse than Centenary, and that's off the court as well as on it.
Listen, Fab Melo had an awful season. Finally, another Big East school seems to have gotten the short end of the stick when recruiting a promising big. Not only on the court, but off it. Haha, your player sucks and he's a d-bag.
Yet again, here comes the "Marquette faithful", clamoring over what we are doing wrong and lamenting our own woes. The same people who have been hand-wringing for the past 3 months about these issues can't look at this situation and say "you know what, stuff happens to other people too, let's get some schadenfreude in and move on", instead we have to bring it all up again, lament lament lament, cry and diminish our own program.
I'm sorry, but this attitude and mindset has just become a bit grating after hearing the same thing drone on all off-season. As I said before, maybe I'm a d-bag for being glad that someone other than us is going through this right now, and maybe I'm a d-bag for thinking that we should stop surmising about situations we don't know anything about because we weren't there, and maybe I'm a d-bag for thinking that Marquette did the right thing by handling this situation by protocols they've had in place for years and not reporting a crime they don't believe occurred.
My god, the season can't start soon enough. Thank jeebus the Gold Cup is on to distract me from all this, at least periodically.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 07, 2011, 03:07:02 PM
When I sit down to watch a game, all I really care about is that both teams have fun, show good sportsmanship and try their darndest. Keeping score just leads to hurt feelings.
Don't forget you care more about them being good student athletes than winning on the floor.
Schadenfreude is wonderful!
One of my favorite sports moments as a Packer fan over the past couple of years was watching this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoJ_K4Mlt4w
The fact that the Packers won the Super Bowl the very next year just makes it even more sweet!
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 07, 2011, 12:40:36 PM
Like it or not, we looked pretty bad with how we ran to the athletic department and basketball program WEEKS if not MONTHS before we ran to Milwaukee Police Department. It's INDEFENSIBLE what we did and for that, I and others are said to have hit ROCK BOTTOM. WOW. Seriously...WOW!
Calm down dude. The
OUTRAGE!!! at your self-victimization is entertaining, but I don't want your health to suffer.
Quote from: Hoopaloop on June 08, 2011, 09:42:23 AM
I was thinking about this the other day when reading the other thread that was closed down (why was it closed down)? Some of the Chico post I do not agree with but two things are spot on.
1) Marquette really did mess up the investigation and it made not only the school, the athletic department look bad, but it casts a cloud over these four players. With the Duke Lacrosse case there was complete closure. In the end, everyone knew they were screwed over by a rogue DA and batcrap crazy woman at a school where a number of people couldn't wait to assume they were guilty because of who Duke is. That included a large number of liberal professors there that took out an advertisement lynching that team before the facts came out. In the end, closure. There will be no closure here, and that is a shame because it puts that cloud over these young men. The lack of closure is 100% on Marquette for the way they handled it. When I re-read those quotes Chico's posted from the police department and the district attorney, they essentially say there remains a cloud. They say they don't have enough evidence to prove guilt or exonerate these guys because of how Marquette handled. Very poor performance by MU and criticizing them for it does not mean one hates MU, Buzz Williams or anyone else. If someone criticizes the gov't, does it mean he hates the USA? If one criticizes the Bears or Packers or whomever your favorite team is, does that mean he hates them? MU blew this one and it's a shame for the players and has certainly loaded the gun for those in the Milwaukee community that already don't care for the school. Our rival basketball schools are having a field day with this. as they should.
I have to laugh when you talk about "closure". For whom? You and your "right to know"? The Duke lacrosse players had their world's turned upside down by false accusations. If you honestly believe they wouldn't trade their "closure", which included expulsion, indictment, NY Times vicious editorials, trial and a lost year of their lives (among other things) for the closure the MU players received (a finding by both school and local government officals that no charges were warrented) I think you're crazy.
Quote from: Hoopaloop on June 08, 2011, 09:42:23 AM
They say they don't have enough evidence to prove guilt or exonerate these guys because of how Marquette handled.
Not true. What they said was there was not enough evidence to bring charges. Guilt or innocence would be determined AFTER charges were brought. There's nothing to be exonerated from since no charges were brought.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on June 08, 2011, 10:50:35 AM
Schadenfreude is wonderful!
One of my favorite sports moments as a Packer fan over the past couple of years was watching this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoJ_K4Mlt4w
The fact that the Packers won the Super Bowl the very next year just makes it even more sweet!
I have never seen that video before. It just made my Favorites. ;D Nice find!
Yes, there is closure. Not enough evidence to bring charges = closure. I'm not saying, and I never have, that I think this has been handled well at any point on the continuum. But some people are treating this approximately like that cult was handling 5/21/11.
Quote from: brewcity77 on June 08, 2011, 10:43:40 AM
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand it's all about Blue and incidents at Marquette, yet again :-[
My lord do we ever take ourselves too seriously sometimes. Every win puts us in the Final Four and every loss means we're worse than Centenary, and that's off the court as well as on it.
Listen, Fab Melo had an awful season. Finally, another Big East school seems to have gotten the short end of the stick when recruiting a promising big. Not only on the court, but off it. Haha, your player sucks and he's a d-bag.
Yet again, here comes the "Marquette faithful", clamoring over what we are doing wrong and lamenting our own woes. The same people who have been hand-wringing for the past 3 months about these issues can't look at this situation and say "you know what, stuff happens to other people too, let's get some schadenfreude in and move on", instead we have to bring it all up again, lament lament lament, cry and diminish our own program.
I'm sorry, but this attitude and mindset has just become a bit grating after hearing the same thing drone on all off-season. As I said before, maybe I'm a d-bag for being glad that someone other than us is going through this right now, and maybe I'm a d-bag for thinking that we should stop surmising about situations we don't know anything about because we weren't there, and maybe I'm a d-bag for thinking that Marquette did the right thing by handling this situation by protocols they've had in place for years and not reporting a crime they don't believe occurred.
My god, the season can't start soon enough. Thank jeebus the Gold Cup is on to distract me from all this, at least periodically.
I think you are missing people's point. Most people are bringing up our problems to control the arrogance on this board. I get it is a message board but posters act like MU's stuff doesn't stink at times. I'm not one to stone another program when similar stuff happens at our University. I'm sure even shadier stuff happens at MU that I don't know about, but I just care about enjoying college basketball and the positives. I don't think posters should chastise ANY programs (ours or a rival). Let's stick to basketball before we look like hypocrites.
Quote from: tower912 on June 08, 2011, 06:45:17 PM
Yes, there is closure. Not enough evidence to bring charges = closure. I'm not saying, and I never have, that I think this has been handled well at any point on the continuum. But some people are treating this approximately like that cult was handling 5/21/11.
So the "closure" you got Tower was the university getting slammed by anyone that matters in law enforcement (District Attorny, MPD)...that's some closure. Hoo Rah.
You obviously haven't read the musings of fans, non-fans, etc about how MU handled this situation, what the remarks of the Chief of Police were, the remarks of the District Attorney, public apologies by MU, public apologies by the Athletic Department. These four kids could have been totally cleared if we as a university didn't F this up so bad. Instead, there will always be people out there that believe something happened and it can't be proven it didn't. The worst thing about it is the remarks by law enforcement that really put the hammer to MU for that very reason.
Did she get justice? Did the players get justice? Neither did because MU chose not to tell the authorities in a timely fashion. The effect is that you have a cloud hanging over these kids who were "never charged" but certainly the law enforcement folks were damn pissed off at MU how they handled it....they were "never charged" nor were they fully cleared because too much time had been passed....thus the cloud. That's closure?
Let's not forget that law enforcement has to be an advocate of justice for BOTH parties, the players and the young woman. It's amazing to me how much the woman in all this has been crapped on by SOME (not all, not even the majority) of folks here.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 11, 2011, 12:26:54 PM
Did she get justice? Did the players get justice? Neither did because MU chose not to tell the authorities in a timely fashion. The effect is that you have a cloud hanging over these kids who were "never charged" but certainly the law enforcement folks were damn pissed off at MU how they handled it....they were "never charged" nor were they fully cleared because too much time had been passed....thus the cloud. That's closure?
Let's not forget that law enforcement has to be an advocate of justice for BOTH parties, the players and the young woman. It's amazing to me how much the woman in all this has been crapped on by SOME (not all, not even the majority) of folks here.
So you are saying MU should report an alleged sexual assualt to the MPD, that they didn't feel had any merit?? Furthermore, why is it then MU's fault, that the "victim" didn't go to police immediately after the incident? To most, if we don't get the satisfaction we are looking for in a dispute, and truly feel wronged/violated - we usually escalate the situation. Why did this girl choose not to? Furthermore, the "victim" was fairly well acquainted with the alleged perpatrators, as they had each others cell phone numbers, etc..and texted...there was a pre-existing relationship between the parties involved.
The fact MU didn't find any wrongdoing, the MPD didn't indict anyone, etc...yet you continue to harpoon the issue as not being "closed," isn't surprising, as any chance you can take to crap on the basketball program at MU - you pretty much take.
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 01:39:09 PM
So you are saying MU should report an alleged sexual assualt to the MPD, that they didn't feel had any merit??
Well, that's exactly the way MU now feels.
"Marquette University has acknowledged that it failed to comply with its duty to report sexual assault incidents and promised to report all incidents to Milwaukee police."http://bit.ly/jFz9gT (http://bit.ly/jFz9gT)
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 01:39:09 PM
Furthermore, why is it then MU's fault, that the "victim" didn't go to police immediately after the incident? To most, if we don't get the satisfaction we are looking for in a dispute, and truly feel wronged/violated - we usually escalate the situation. Why did this girl choose not to? Furthermore, the "victim" was fairly well acquainted with the alleged perpatrators, as they had each others cell phone numbers, etc..and texted...there was a pre-existing relationship between the parties involved.
First, MU had an obligation (which they now acknowledge) to report the incident.
Second, going to the police was the only way to provide justice to
both parties. If the athletes were truly innocent, a thorough unbiased investigation by the MPD clearing them would be far more credible than MU's internal kangaroo-court hearing.
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 01:39:09 PM
Furthermore, the "victim" was fairly well acquainted with the alleged perpatrators, as they had each others cell phone numbers, etc..and texted...there was a pre-existing relationship between the parties involved.
You sound like Whoopie Goldberg here, arguing that it wasn't
rape rape.
If it was your daughter claiming she was attacked on a date or at a party, would you still argue that that the alleged attacker is exonerated merely by being "fairly well acquainted" with her, having a "pre-existing relationship", having cell phone numbers, exchanging texts, etc?
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 01:39:09 PM
The fact MU didn't find any wrongdoing,
Not true . . .
"The students were found to have violated the university's policy against harassment, but a university disciplinary panel determined they were not guilty of sexual assault."http://bit.ly/kUHco6Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 01:39:09 PM
the MPD didn't indict anyone, etc...yet you continue to harpoon the issue as not being "closed," isn't surprising, as any chance you can take to crap on the basketball program at MU - you pretty much take.
The MPD didn't clear anyone either. Because of the delay in reporting, they were unable to perform an adequate investigation.
"The Sensitive Crimes Unit cites the delay in reporting the crimes as a factor for not gathering enough evidence. They say no law enforcement agency was able to adequately investigate the incidents at the time"http://bit.ly/jFz9gT (http://bit.ly/jFz9gT)
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 01:39:09 PM
you continue to harpoon the issue as not being "closed," isn't surprising, as any chance you can take to crap on the basketball program at MU - you pretty much take.
And the case will never be "closed" because MU screwed up by not reporting it--ensuring that a proper investigation
that would have cleared the athletes!!! can never be completed.
The internal investigation will NEVER be viewed as fair, because MU had a vested interest in the outcome.
Even MU admitted that they screwed up and had a duty to report the incident. Why are you still defending them?
Per usual 84, you attack the Men's Basketball program at every chance, and I defend. Blah, blah. After reading your 15 quote/rebuttal essay: Please provide your feelings on just one question:
If your daughter were raped or attacked as you SPECULATE here as to what happened (which rape and attack are a far cry from Sexual Harassment), would you not instruct her to go directly to the police, even if MU found nothing substantive of rape?
Why did the girl not go immediately to the police if she didn't get satisfaction from MU DPS?
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 04:08:31 PM
Per usual 84, you attack the Men's Basketball program at every chance, and I defend. Blah, blah. After reading your 15 quote/rebuttal essay: Please provide your feelings on just one question:
If your daughter were raped or attacked as you SPECULATE here as to what happened (which rape and attack are a far cry from Sexual Harassment), would you not instruct her to go directly to the police, even if MU found nothing substantive of rape?
Why did the girl not go immediately to the police if she didn't get satisfaction from MU DPS?
Read your signature at the bottom of your posts, remind yourself that it also applies to 84, and walk away (good advice which I all too infrequently follow).
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 04:08:31 PM
Per usual 84, you attack the Men's Basketball program at every chance, and I defend. Blah, blah. After reading your 15 quote/rebuttal essay: Please provide your feelings on just one question:
Nothing in my post attacked the men's basketball program. Nothing.
In fact, I highlighted that the screwup by the MU DPS and administration
prevented a proper MPD investigation that could have
eliminated all potential conflict of interest and provided a
complete exoneration of the athletes involved (assuming they were innocent).
Meanwhile, your post was filled with your typical errors and misrepresentations.
- You were wrong for saying that MU had no obligation to report the incident to the MPD. They do.
- You were wrong for saying that MU found no wrongdoing. They did.
- You were wrong for misrepresenting that because MPD didn't indict (sic) anyone, the alleged assault did not occur. In reality, the MPD couldn't investigate because of the delay.
- You were wrong for trying to blame the victim.
As usual, you fail to own up to your own errors, and instead, accuse me of attacking the Men's Basketball program. And yet, you can't point to one single thing I wrote that was an attack on the Mens Basketball program, can you?
And as is typically the case with you, instead of admitting that you were mistaken--or coming up with some reasonable counter argument--you attack me personally.
Why don't you have the class (or guts) to admit you were wrong on MU having no obligation to report the incident?
Why don't you admit you were wrong to say that MU cleared the athletes of any wrongdoing?
Why don't you admit that the MPD didn't investigate because of the delay--not because they thought there was no crime?
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 04:08:31 PM
If your daughter were raped or attacked as you SPECULATE here as to what happened
(which rape and attack are a far cry from Sexual Harassment), would you not instruct her to go directly to the police, even if MU found nothing substantive of rape?
Yes, I would instruct her to go the police.
Now its your turn: If your daughter FELT she had been assaulted by someone she knew, would you instruct her NOT to go to the police because she had a pre-existing relationship with her attacker, exchanged texts, had his cell phone number etc.?
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 04:08:31 PM
Why did the girl not go immediately to the police if she didn't get satisfaction from MU DPS?
Wrong question.
Given the potentially high-profile nature of the alleged attackers coupled with the seriousness of the charges, why didn't MARQUETTE insist on a full and complete MPD investigation?
If for no other reason, it would have provided defense against the appearance that MU covered-up the incident.
Finally, I'll say this: Those four athletes should NOT have let themselves get into this situation in the first place. I take no solace that MU found that they
only violated MU's Sexual Harassment policy instead of something more serious.
84 - Difficult to debate when you invent scenarios such as: If your daughter were raped, just because she had a pre-existing relationship with the assailant - would you not instruct her to go to the police??
Comical per usual. My whole premise and argument in this whole thing is the girl had free will - if she wasn't satisfied with MU DPS's resolution - go to the police. Why did she not? That's on her. If you can find where I wrote that due to her knowing the assailants that "attacked" her, she should NOT have gone to the police...then I'll give you an inch. But, you took a statement I made (She had a pre-existing relationship with the accused) and added it to it something I've never written (would you not instruct her to go the police), and asked me for a rebuttal. Why would I rebut something I never said/claimed??
All along I've said the girl should have gone to the police if she was in fact raped/assulted. The reality, as MU found, and the MPD found - was that she was not raped nor assulted. If she were, charges would have been filed, and the case would have been turned over to the MPD.
Do you really believe that if MU DPS found a girl who had been raped, with evidence, they would have ignored the girl, not reported, due to the alleged perpatrators being athletes?? Sorry that you have so little confidence in your alma mater - if in fact you went to Marquette in the first place????
Quote from: Ners on June 11, 2011, 06:32:33 PM
My whole premise and argument in this whole thing is the girl had free will - if she wasn't satisfied with MU DPS's resolution - go to the police. Why did she not? That's on her. If you can find where I wrote that due to her knowing the assailants that "attacked" her, she should NOT have gone to the police...then I'll give you an inch. But, you took a statement I made (She had a pre-existing relationship with the accused) and added it to it something I've never written (would you not instruct her to go the police), and asked me for a rebuttal. Why would I rebut something I never said/claimed??
All along I've said the girl should have gone to the police if she was in fact raped/assulted. The reality, as MU found, and the MPD found - was that she was not raped nor assulted. If she were, charges would have been filed, and the case would have been turned over to the MPD.
Do you really believe that if MU DPS found a girl who had been raped, with evidence, they would have ignored the girl, not reported, due to the alleged perpatrators being athletes??
I know exactly what your premise was. Unfortunately, its based on the false conclusion that women in this position act out of free will. According to the US Department of Justice, 60% of sexual assaults aren't reported to the police. The reasons range from shame or embarrassment to intimidation or fear.
I don't think we can conclude anything from here failure to go to police.
That having been said, you're still focused on the wrong question.
We shouldn't care about why the girl didn't call MPD. The thing that bothers me is why MARQUETTE didn't call the MPD.
If the MU DPS truly and honestly felt that no crime had been committed, the ONLY way to completely exonerate those four athletes would have been a full and complete police investigation. The MPD should have been called for the protection of the players.
If MU was convinced that no assault occurred, there could have been no better proof than DNA evidence clearing the athletes. The Duke lacrosse players were cleared in part because there was no physical DNA evidence connecting them to the accuser.
Marquette now understands that they screwed this up, which is why they admitted they were wrong not to refer the matter to the MPD.
Gotta love that 84 really has no idea what went on, yet assumes that a DNA test can clear or convict someone.
Unintentional comedy at its finest.
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on June 12, 2011, 10:16:32 AM
Unintentional comedy at its finest.
The one (unintentionally) redeeming quality in an otherwise vast wasteland.
Quote from: Marquette84 on June 11, 2011, 07:48:47 PM
I know exactly what your premise was. Unfortunately, its based on the false conclusion that women in this position act out of free will. According to the US Department of Justice, 60% of sexual assaults aren't reported to the police. The reasons range from shame or embarrassment to intimidation or fear.
I don't think we can conclude anything from here failure to go to police.
That having been said, you're still focused on the wrong question.
We shouldn't care about why the girl didn't call MPD. The thing that bothers me is why MARQUETTE didn't call the MPD.
Question for you - If the girl wasn't too sshamed or embarrased or intimidated to report the incident to MU's DPS, what makes you think she'd be ashamed, embarassed or intimidated to report the matter to the Milwaukee police??
Really tragic that you want Marquette to call the police on its students/athletes who are wrongfully accused of such a serious crime as sexual assult/rape. Harassment is a LONG way from being attacked/assulted/raped, etc.
The DPS also followed long-standing standard oprating procedures whether or not a student-athlete was involved. 84 is well-intentioned, but the DPS was doing what it had always done for any student, FBOW. Now, its is well that DPS will follow better SOPs, though this will obviously impact all students at MU facing allegations going forward, again FBOW depending upon circumstances.
Quote from: Nukem2 on June 12, 2011, 01:12:33 PM
The DPS also followed long-standing standard oprating procedures whether or not a student-athlete was involved. 84 is well-intentioned, but the DPS was doing what it had always done for any student, FBOW. Now, its is well that DPS will follow better SOPs, though this will obviously impact all students at MU facing allegations going forward, again FBOW depending upon circumstances.
Exactly correct (except for the well-intentioned part).
The policy itself was flawed. MU has recognized this and rightly changed the policy as a result. But everyone involved did exactly as they were instructed to do, and there is absolutely zero evidence (or even implication from the cops and DA) that the student-athletes in question received preferential treatment or that there was some inappropriate attempt to cover up or impede an investigation.
These facts, of course, won't stop those who wish to criticize the program at every turn from doing so, but they are the facts nonetheless.
*Yawn*
Something tells me if the past 2 months of arguing didn't convince anyone of anything other than Marquette was right, Marquette was wrong, or Marquette was in a grey area, another thread won't solve it. Not sure there's a new angle anyone will uncover that hasn't already been touched, and doubt there will be anything new said that hasn't already been posted multiple times already.
Quote from: Ners on June 12, 2011, 11:44:07 AM
Really tragic that you want Marquette to call the police on its students/athletes who are wrongfully accused of such a serious crime as sexual assult/rape. Harassment is a LONG way from being attacked/assulted/raped, etc.
First, perhaps you should take your complaint up with Marquette, because that "tragic" situation you describe is the official school policy:
"
Marquette University has acknowledged that it failed to comply with its duty to report sexual assault incidents and promised to report all incidents to Milwaukee police."
http://bit.ly/kUHco6 (http://bit.ly/kUHco6)
That seems pretty straight forward to me. If you think they are wrong, stop fighting me on it--take it up with the MU administration.
Second, can you please explain why you disagree with my statement that an MPD investigation could have done more to more fully exonerate those athletes? You seem to attack me personally for making this statement, but I don't understand why you disagree that a more complete investigation doesn't help the innocent.
Third, whether you like it or not, a good portion of the general public in Milwaukee and Wisconsin thinks that MU whitewashed this situation and covered it up. That's not my personal view, and obviously not yours. But unlike you, I live and work with people who have this view.
Do yourself a favor before you attack me on this again: Watch the video in the link above.
MU does NOT come off looking good. We've been criticized by the DA, the Chief of Police, even some of our own students. And if you lived in the area you can bet that you'd be hearing about it from neighbors, coworkers and others.
Quote from: Marquette84 on June 12, 2011, 01:38:03 PM
First, perhaps you should take your complaint up with Marquette, because that "tragic" situation you describe is the official school policy:
"Marquette University has acknowledged that it failed to comply with its duty to report sexual assault incidents and promised to report all incidents to Milwaukee police."
http://bit.ly/kUHco6 (http://bit.ly/kUHco6)
That seems pretty straight forward to me. If you think they are wrong, stop fighting me on it--take it up with the MU administration.
Second, can you please explain why you disagree with my statement that an MPD investigation could have done more to more fully exonerate those athletes? You seem to attack me personally for making this statement, but I don't understand why you disagree that a more complete investigation doesn't help the innocent.
Third, whether you like it or not, a good portion of the general public in Milwaukee and Wisconsin thinks that MU whitewashed this situation and covered it up. That's not my personal view, and obviously not yours. But unlike you, I live and work with people who have this view.
Do yourself a favor before you attack me on this again: Watch the video in the link above.
MU does NOT come off looking good. We've been criticized by the DA, the Chief of Police, even some of our own students. And if you lived in the area you can bet that you'd be hearing about it from neighbors, coworkers and others.
Still waiting for you to tell me why the girl reported the incident to MU DPS, but was too intimidated, ashamed, embarrased, scared or whatever else you want to contrive - to not report the incident to MPD?
Lastly,. MPD did its investigation and found nothing to indict the acused on....so, in my view...the athletes in question were exonerated not only by MU's DPS (though guilty of sexual harrasment - god forbid 19 year old boys make unwanted advances/comments toward girls) - but also by the MPD, in that MPD did not bring charges. End of story. And for those neighbors, acquaintences, etc., who want to give MU a black eye for how it handled the situation...those same people likely will always take issue with most things Marquette due to its perception as "elitist."
Quote from: Pakuni on June 12, 2011, 01:20:29 PM
Exactly correct (except for the well-intentioned part).
Fixed.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 12, 2011, 01:20:29 PM
The policy itself was flawed. MU has recognized this and rightly changed the policy as a result.
Yes, it was flawed. Yet some are here defending it as the right thing to do.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 12, 2011, 01:20:29 PM
But everyone involved did exactly as they were instructed to do,
Yes and no. Marquette was instructed (by the law) to report the incident. Their policy said otherwise. So MU employees followed MU policy--yet that policy was contrary to the law.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 12, 2011, 01:20:29 PM
and there is absolutely zero evidence (or even implication from the cops and DA) that the student-athletes in question received preferential treatment or that there was some inappropriate attempt to cover up or impede and investigation.
Without an independent investigation, there is also zero evidence that would have cleared the athletes from the charges, and insulate MU from accusations of a coverup.
In the absence of an MPD investigation, there is a widespread belief among the general public in the Milwaukee area that there WAS some coverup.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 12, 2011, 01:20:29 PM
These facts, of course, won't stop those who wish to criticize the program at every turn from doing so, but they are the facts nonetheless.
But sometimes, we shoot ourselves in the foot (like not informing the MPD about an accusation of a serious crime). What I don't understand is the "circle-the-wagons" attitude that Ners has taken.
We know that a lot of people in Wisconsin already think that MU is arrogant and insular. Not referring this case to the MPD is simply reinforcing that belief.
Don't you agree that an MPD investigation clearing the athletes if conducted back in October would have been FAR less damaging to MU's reputation than the way the matter was actually handled?
Quote from: Pakuni on June 12, 2011, 01:20:29 PM
Exactly correct (except for the well-intentioned part).
The policy itself was flawed. MU has recognized this and rightly changed the policy as a result. But everyone involved did exactly as they were instructed to do, and there is absolutely zero evidence (or even implication from the cops and DA) that the student-athletes in question received preferential treatment or that there was some inappropriate attempt to cover up or impede an investigation.
These facts, of course, won't stop those who wish to criticize the program at every turn from doing so, but they are the facts nonetheless.
+1. In the old days only guys like Badgermaniac and BBFran would go after MU over this. In April 2008 Chicos and 84 joined the club.
Quote from: Ners on June 12, 2011, 01:59:56 PM
Still waiting for you to tell me why the girl reported the incident to MU DPS, but was too intimidated, ashamed, embarrased, scared or whatever else you want to contrive - to not report the incident to MPD?
Do you know whether the girl reported it to MU DPS? Hmm. Maybe one of her friends called. Hmmm. Maybe someone heard noises and called. Hmmm Maybe DPS was on a routine patrol and came across the situation. Hmmm. Maybe the RA called. Hmmm.
Quote from: Ners on June 12, 2011, 01:59:56 PM
Lastly,. MPD did its investigation and found nothing to indict the acused on....so, in my view...the athletes in question were exonerated not only by MU's DPS (though guilty of sexual harrasment - god forbid 19 year old boys make unwanted advances/comments toward girls) - but also by the MPD, in that MPD did not bring charges. End of story.
Somehow, I don't read this as a statement exonerating the athletes:
"No law enforcement agency was able to adequately investigate this matter at the time it occurred, and the subsequent efforts by the Milwaukee Police Department were inhibited by the fact that it did not receive this information until several months after the incident occurred," Chisholm said in a statement.http://trib.in/kVZaIC (http://trib.in/kVZaIC)
BTW, if you think that MU was right to conclude that the accusation itself was false, shouldn't they have turned in the girl for making a false report of a crime?
Quote from: Ners on June 12, 2011, 01:59:56 PM
And for those neighbors, acquaintences, etc., who want to give MU a black eye for how it handled the situation...those same people likely will always take issue with most things Marquette due to its perception as "elitist."
And issues like this are exactly what leads to the perception of being elitist.
Why can't you simply agree that an MPD investigation clearing the athletes if conducted back in October would have been FAR less damaging to MU's reputation than the way the matter was actually handled?
Quote from: Marquette84 on June 12, 2011, 02:26:52 PM
Do you know whether the girl reported it to MU DPS? Hmm. Maybe one of her friends called. Hmmm. Maybe someone heard noises and called. Hmmm Maybe DPS was on a routine patrol and came across the situation. Hmmm. Maybe the RA called. Hmmm.
Hmmm.
Marquette's student newspaper, the Marquette Tribune, quoted Capt. Russell Shaw, associate director of the school's security force, as saying that the department performed several follow-up interviews with the student after her initial report and that she never requested further assistance.http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/118783474.html
Hmmm.
According to the MU Department of Public Safety crime log, a student reported being sexually assaulted by an acquaintance between 10:30 and 11:45 p.m. Oct. 30 at Humphrey Hall, a dorm that houses many student athletes. The log states that Milwaukee police assistance was "declined."http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/118783474.html
Hmmmm.
"At that time a female Marquette student reported to Marquette University Public Safety ..."http://media.jsonline.com/documents/Chisholm_Marquette_letter.pdf
Hmmm.
"The Marquette University Department of Public Safety investigated the woman's claims after she first made them on October 30. "
http://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local/118783409.html
Hmmmm.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 12, 2011, 02:39:38 PM
Hmmm.
Marquette's student newspaper, the Marquette Tribune, quoted Capt. Russell Shaw, associate director of the school's security force, as saying that the department performed several follow-up interviews with the student after her initial report and that she never requested further assistance.
http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/118783474.html
Hmmm.
According to the MU Department of Public Safety crime log, a student reported being sexually assaulted by an acquaintance between 10:30 and 11:45 p.m. Oct. 30 at Humphrey Hall, a dorm that houses many student athletes. The log states that Milwaukee police assistance was "declined."
http://www.jsonline.com/news/milwaukee/118783474.html
Hmmmm.
"At that time a female Marquette student reported to Marquette University Public Safety ..."
http://media.jsonline.com/documents/Chisholm_Marquette_letter.pdf
Hmmm.
"The Marquette University Department of Public Safety investigated the woman's claims after she first made them on October 30. "
http://www.todaystmj4.com/news/local/118783409.html
Hmmmm.
None of these reports are inconsistent with a roommate, friend, RA, or other student making the
initial call to public safety.
Now, is it too much for you to comment on whether you agree that an MPD investigation clearing the athletes if conducted back in October would have been FAR less damaging to MU's reputation than the way the matter was actually handled?
Quote from: Marquette84 on June 12, 2011, 02:54:09 PM
None of these reports are inconsistent with a roommate, friend, RA, or other student making the initial call to public safety.
Huh?
Every single news report says it was the accuser who first reported this. Or do you know something the DPS doesn't? Perhaps you shopuld instruct them on how to process DNA evidence.
Quote
Now, is it too much for you to comment on whether you agree that an MPD investigation clearing the athletes if conducted back in October would have been FAR less damaging to MU's reputation than the way the matter was actually handled?
I have no idea. Neither do you.
And it doesn't really matter. Everybody in this situation did as they were instructed and as policy dictated. There was no indication of any wrongdoing or a cover up. They followed a flawed policy and MU changed it, well before the DA's comments, I might add.
Frankly, outside a few chicken littles around here and those already inclined dislike MU (se: UW fans), I don't see this as being terribly damaging to MU's reputation. Case in point: There's a glowing story about Buzz Williams published today by Yahoo!/Rivals, the most read sports site on the Internet, ahead of even ESPN.com. Hundreds of words long, and not one of those words mentions this incident. Why? Because outside Milwaukee nobody cares much. Within a few weeks this will all but be forgotten except by the few dark clouds that patrol this site.
Am I thrilled about the way this was handled? Of course not. And I'm glad MU has taken steps to ensure it won't happen this way again. But I'm not going to cry about it for weeks on end like some others.
I mean, it's not like ESPN's Outside the Lines did an expose on the situation, right? That, I'm sure, would have you deeply troubled about reputation.
And a few short weeks after taking him off ignore, 84 rejoins chicos.
Quote from: Pakuni on June 12, 2011, 03:24:00 PM
I have no idea. Neither do you.
And it doesn't really matter. Everybody in this situation did as they were instructed and as policy dictated. There was no indication of any wrongdoing or a cover up. They followed a flawed policy and MU changed it, well before the DA's comments, I might add.
Frankly, outside a few chicken littles around here and those already inclined dislike MU (se: UW fans), I don't see this as being terribly damaging to MU's reputation. Case in point: There's a glowing story about Buzz Williams published today by Yahoo!/Rivals, the most read sports site on the Internet, ahead of even ESPN.com. Hundreds of words long, and not one of those words mentions this incident. Why? Because outside Milwaukee nobody cares much. Within a few weeks this will all but be forgotten except by the few dark clouds that patrol this site.
Am I thrilled about the way this was handled? Of course not. And I'm glad MU has taken steps to ensure it won't happen this way again. But I'm not going to cry about it for weeks on end like some others.
I mean, it's not like ESPN's Outside the Lines did an expose on the situation, right? That, I'm sure, would have you deeply troubled about reputation.
Speak for yourself.
I most certainly think that it would have been far less damaging to MU and the athletes had they referred this to the MPD in October rather than trying to handle it internally (assuming that the athletes truly were innocent).
Had MU reported this in October:
1. It doesn't lead to a public dressing down of MU by the District Attorney and Chief of Police.
2. It doesn't lead to an admission that MU's policy was in violation of the requirement to report a crime.
3. It doesn't lead to several days of negative MU storyline dominating the Milwaukee NEWS coverage (not sports coverage, but hard news) in both March and May.
4. It doesn't reinforce MU's reputation among local residents of being arrogant and insular
5. It exonerates the athletes in question, rather than merely getting off due to an inability to conduct an investigation.
6. It eliminates any appearance of impropriety.
Had the police come that night (and nothing truly happened), then they would have left concluding there was no crime, MU could have closed the book themselves, and there would have been no news coverage at all.
The negative news coverage centered around the fact that MU failed in its duty to report a possible crime.
I find the following statement from the DA troubling: "
No law enforcement agency was able to adequately investigate this matter at the time it occurred, and the subsequent efforts by the Milwaukee Police Department were inhibited by the fact that it did not receive this information until several months after the incident occurred"
I don't think its credible that the several days of negative hard news coverage had no impact on the local population. We both know relations between MU and the greater Milwaukee community have often been strained--it has nothing do with sports rivalries, and 100 puff pieces on Buzz Williams won't change that.
Go ahead and have the last word.
DOMINATED Milwaukee news coverage for several days?
Boy, nothing I can say at this point can top that.
Quote from: tower912 on June 12, 2011, 04:26:25 PM
And a few short weeks after taking him off ignore, 84 rejoins chicos.
Unfortunately, people quote his posts, which limits the "ignore" feature.
Quote from: Lennys Tap on June 12, 2011, 02:13:40 PM
+1. In the old days only guys like Badgermaniac and BBFran would go after MU over this. In April 2008 Chicos and 84 joined the club.
That's because in the olden days, 1999-2008 no MU players (let alone 4) were accused of Sexual Assault nor did the University fail in it's policy nor did we have the MPD, District Attorney and others come down on MU.
Always those pesky details.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 16, 2011, 02:21:31 PM
That's because in the olden days, 1999-2008 no MU players (let alone 4) were accused of Sexual Assault nor did the University fail in it's policy nor did we have the MPD, District Attorney and others come down on MU.
Always those pesky details.
Question - Why do you continue to be such a fan of a school and team that so consistently lets you down, embarasses you, causes you to feel squirmy, recruits too many JUCO's, is a bunch of choking dogs who pee themselves, and have alarmingly dropped from being a 5th and 6th place Big East team, to a 9th place team - albeit, one that actually advances to the Sweet 16? Then again, they only did advance to Sweet 16 due to favorable matchups, and college basketball being down this year, right?
Sadly, most all of the above has been your M.O. around here well before the Sexual Assualt allegations came to light. So, this isn't a cause and effect case of where because MU had 4 athletes accused of sexual assult, you then became a hater/skeptic/cynic of the program. That started in April of 2008. Again those pesky little details.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 16, 2011, 02:21:31 PM
That's because in the olden days, 1999-2008 no MU players (let alone 4) were accused of Sexual Assault nor did the University fail in it's policy nor did we have the MPD, District Attorney and others come down on MU.
Always those pesky details.
The University "failed in its policy?". WTF does that mean? The policy in place and the one followed (allowing the alleged victim the option of having his/her grievance addressed by university or municipal authorities) was the same one in place from 1999-2008.
Also glad to see you're still an empty vessel concerned more about accusations and the perception they can afford the haters than the fact that YOUR university found allegation of sexual assault (love how you capitalized those words - did it give you a woody?) groundless. Oh, I forgot. As of April 8. 2008 any representative of that university can't be trusted.
Continue if you must posing as the loyal fan and conscience of Marquette University. So far you've managed to convince yourself and perhaps one or two others. Most see what you've been up to since April 2008 though.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on June 16, 2011, 02:21:31 PM
That's because in the olden days, 1999-2008 no MU players (let alone 4) were accused of Sexual Assault nor did the University fail in it's policy nor did we have the MPD, District Attorney and others come down on MU.
Always those pesky details.
Don't believe in the concept of innocent until proven guilty, huh? Apparently being accused of something is as good as a conviction in your book...even after the young men have been cleared.
Whatever the case, you're going to get this board talking about you so I guess you're getting exactly what you want.