MUScoop

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/preps/117323978.html (http://www.jsonline.com/sports/preps/117323978.html)

Journal Sentinel is reporting.

Quote from: TallTitan34 on March 03, 2011, 09:13:29 PM
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/preps/117323978.html (http://www.jsonline.com/sports/preps/117323978.html)

Journal Sentinel is reporting.

Maybe THEBADGE can come over here and tell us how wrong he was.


(http://www.jumphigherin4weeks.com/shocked.jpg)

(http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Qii0RxMolYE/SaibCLNVahI/AAAAAAAAA4Q/FMR3SdeCofk/s400/shock.jpg)

(http://files.xboxic.com/xbox-360-hardware/kinect/shocked20old20lady20edited.png)

Just posted that in the other Tokoto thread but you beat me by about a minute.

Interesting that The headline says that UNC beat out the Badgers for Tokoto, not UW and MU.

So much for the suspense...unless the JS is wrong.  Which wouldn't be surprising either.

Glad this is over.  Wish the kid the best. 

Quote from: Skitch on March 03, 2011, 09:17:53 PM
Just posted that in the other Tokoto thread but you beat me by about a minute.

Interesting that The headline says that UNC beat out the Badgers for Tokoto, not UW and MU.

Because MU hasn't been a finalist for awhile.

I doubt we will ever know who the leader was between MU and UW.

Should be fun to watch the Badger meltdown haha.  Bo must have cooled on him.

Kind of a dick move by the Journal Sentinel to report it before his press conference.

Quote from: Skitch on March 03, 2011, 09:17:53 PMJust posted that in the other Tokoto thread but you beat me by about a minute.

Interesting that The headline says that UNC beat out the Badgers for Tokoto, not UW and MU.

Of course it does, the Badgers are the "heavy-hitter" and the only school that believed they were in the running. But let's be honest, any kid who says he wants to play at an up-tempo school was never going to go to Wisconsin. They were always going to be second, but if it wasn't UNC, they would have been second to Marquette, or Maryland, or UCLA.

Allow me to be the first to say "Bo cooled on him"

Any chance North Carolina would schedule MU to give JP a chance to play in front of his hometown?

On the scene at the D&B's festivities

(http://collegelifestyles.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Dave-Busters-just-got-more-interesting___2801200827181.jpg)

Quote from: brewcity77 on March 03, 2011, 09:20:43 PM
Of course it does, the Badgers are the "heavy-hitter" and the only school that believed they were in the running. But let's be honest, any kid who says he wants to play at an up-tempo school was never going to go to Wisconsin. They were always going to be second, but if it wasn't UNC, they would have been second to Marquette, or Maryland, or UCLA.

I'd bet that a few weeks ago when we weren't in his final list and then suddenly we were, that said a lot more about the reality of the situation than anything.  Gibbons and some other recruiting gurus, for whatever they are worth, said the last two days it came to UW and UNC....which means it's been UNC for a long time.

UW must have decided JP's grades were not good enough to get into UW.

Rocky, is scoop ready to handle the masses about to come online?

These things never get to the actual press conference anymore.  What ever happen to suspense!

I know.  Dick move by the JS not giving him his moment.

Dude made a great choice.

Congrats JP!

Quote from: TallTitan34 on March 03, 2011, 09:20:39 PMI doubt we will ever know who the leader was between MU and UW.

Should be fun to watch the Badger meltdown haha.  Bo must have cooled on him.

Kind of a dick move by the Journal Sentinel to report it before his press conference.

Not really, it's business. If he didn't want his decision to get out, he shouldn't have told anyone. The JS' business is to get the scoop and report it first. If they beat Fox-6 to the punch, they're just doing their job.

Quote from: Muhoops85 on March 03, 2011, 09:21:36 PMAllow me to be the first to say "Bo cooled on him"

TT beat you to it ;)

And Chicos, I'd agree that it was only UNC for a long, long time. Pretty much as long as Roy was willing to offer the scholarship, he was going to go there. But I would maintain that if Roy had rescinded his offer for whatever reason, JP would have come to Marquette long before he came to Wisconsin. Again, UW was always going to be second because they're the state school, but they were never, ever, ever going to be first.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2011, 09:20:11 PM
Because MU hasn't been a finalist for awhile.

You know this how? I don't have any "inside sources" but I knew UW wasn't even in the running as JP had made it clear to all (and been quoted in the media) that he had zero interest going to a school that played "slow".

Hahahahaha check out the Badger boards.  I just jumped into the middle of a thread...

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=193&f=2565&t=7222380&p=41 (http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=193&f=2565&t=7222380&p=41)

Not a dick move by the JS. Its their job. The UW boards also felt UNC was the leader when I read them yesterday. I think people are right that MU dropped by the wayside awhile ago and buzz likely knew that.

I suppose so.  I just feel like they could have saved it an extra 30 minutes so he could get the spotlight.  I guess it is there job though.

TT, you're dead on about that Badger board. Hilarious. Just saw that Indiana is within 5 of Wisconsin with about 10 to play. How funny would it be if UW lost to Crean and then "lost" out on Tokoto as well? Be a great double kick in the pants for Bucky ;D

Quote from: Lennys Tap on March 03, 2011, 09:31:30 PM
You know this how? I don't have any "inside sources" but I knew UW wasn't even in the running as JP had made it clear to all (and been quoted in the media) that he had zero interest going to a school that played "slow".

My opinion.  And in my opinion, it's been UNC for about....his whole life.  I don't think MU was EVER in it other than a courtesy hometown tip of the hat.

Since people here love picking out random posts of mine from years past, often not including additional clarifying posts.  I'll submit my own evidence from almost 14 months ago.

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=17568.msg174279#msg174279

"Selby is not going to IU.  Purdue isn't going to get him either.  Just as no one in state is going to get JP Tokoto in the state of Wisconsin."

Or this one, from back in 2009

http://www.muscoop.com/index.php?topic=15255.msg146490#msg146490

"And likely will not come to MU or UW-Madison."

I can officially say I've never been more thrilled to see a recruit go to UNC than I am right now.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2011, 09:40:24 PM
My opinion.  And in my opinion, it's been UNC for about....his whole life.  I don't think MU was EVER in it other than a courtesy hometown tip of the hat.

If you're saying that MU, UW, and all the rest of his "finalists" were never in it because UNC was his first, second and third choice I'll agree. My point was that if UNC cooled on him there was NO WAY he was going to UW given their style of play. He HATED it in high school and wanted no part of it in college.

Quote from: brewcity77 on March 03, 2011, 09:38:24 PM
TT, you're dead on about that Badger board. Hilarious. Just saw that Indiana is within 5 of Wisconsin with about 10 to play. How funny would it be if UW lost to Crean and then "lost" out on Tokoto as well? Be a great double kick in the pants for Bucky ;D

Well, Jordan Taylor isn't going to let that happen..... :o

Can't really blame him. I honestly say I hope he does well. Seems like a real good kid.

Badger Board Comments:

1) He will have missed out on the opportunity to play for one of the best coaches in all of college basketball today

2) Our program will come back stronger than ever(that, that doesn't kill you...makes you stronger)

3) i hope he sucks for them. I've always disliked NC, ever since i was a kid. I hope all their players suck. then again, this could be the multiple beers I've had talking.....but I hope he sucks....

4) I hope he tears his acl next week

5) I'm willing to bet that the next man in under Bo will have a better college career than JPT under Roy.  Have fun being a role player JPT.

Here's to hoping we get Jarnell Stokes...

Quote from: Lennys Tap on March 03, 2011, 09:47:58 PM
If you're saying that MU, UW, and all the rest of his "finalists" were never in it because UNC was his first, second and third choice I'll agree. My point was that if UNC cooled on him there was NO WAY he was going to UW given their style of play. He HATED it in high school and wanted no part of it in college.

Perhaps...but let's just say I don't think MU was 2nd.  He may not have liked the style of UW, but I suspect he likes winning and they do that better than we do right now.  I do agree with you that UNC was 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc, etc.  A no brainer.  Why wouldn't he go there...I love Another84's passion, but it sometimes blinds him from the reality of the college basketball world.  There are blueblood programs, about 5 to 10 that are hard to turn down when offered.

Quote from: TallTitan34 on March 03, 2011, 09:51:10 PM
Badger Board Comments:

1) He will have missed out on the opportunity to play for one of the best coaches in all of college basketball today

2) Our program will come back stronger than ever(that, that doesn't kill you...makes you stronger)

3) i hope he sucks for them. I've always disliked NC, ever since i was a kid. I hope all their players suck. then again, this could be the multiple beers I've had talking.....but I hope he sucks....

4) I hope he tears his acl next week

5) I'm willing to bet that the next man in under Bo will have a better college career than JPT under Roy.  Have fun being a role player JPT.

And these same wankers believe that none of their comments drove Vander or Wesley away from UW-madison.  They are a classic bunch, that's for sure.

Have they attacked JP's mother yet like they did with Wesley?

Anyone who wants a kid to fail because he didn't choose your school is a flat-out loser.

6- what does he have against fat chicks and leftist girls with arm pit hair

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2011, 09:54:38 PMPerhaps...but let's just say I don't think MU was 2nd.  He may not have liked the style of UW, but I suspect he likes winning and they do that better than we do right now.  I do agree with you that UNC was 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc, etc.  A no brainer.  Why wouldn't he go there...I love Another84's passion, but it sometimes blinds him from the reality of the college basketball world.  There are blueblood programs, about 5 to 10 that are hard to turn down when offered.

No, UW was always going to be second. But if it wasn't UNC, it would have been Maryland, or Kansas, or Connecticut, or Marquette. It definitely would have been us before Wisconsin. When a guy is asked what are the factors in picking a school and the first thing out of his mouth is the pace at which they play, you don't go to play for the slowest school in the nation.

Quote from: TrueBlueAndGold on March 03, 2011, 09:53:24 PM
Here's to hoping we get Jarnell Stokes...

Are we being mentioned with this kid?

Are we really debating whether or not he would have picked UW or MU if those were his only options?  Who cares?  He picked neither.

Quote from: brewcity77 on March 03, 2011, 09:57:58 PM
No, UW was always going to be second. But if it wasn't UNC, it would have been Maryland, or Kansas, or Connecticut, or Marquette. It definitely would have been us before Wisconsin. When a guy is asked what are the factors in picking a school and the first thing out of his mouth is the pace at which they play, you don't go to play for the slowest school in the nation.

I'd agree with all those but Marquette.  I agree UW was second to all those schools, but I just don't see MU ahead of them for this particular recruit.  For other state of Wisconsin recruits...yes, but never felt the vibe from this kid.  Same with Koenig.

Quote from: TallTitan34 on March 03, 2011, 09:25:27 PM
Rocky, is scoop ready to handle the masses about to come online?

Bah.  A max of 260.  The sever laughs with load averages of 0.35, 0.38, 0.37

For those that understand load averages :)

Quote from: brewcity77 on March 03, 2011, 09:57:58 PM
No, UW was always going to be second. But if it wasn't UNC, it would have been Maryland, or Kansas, or Connecticut, or Marquette. It definitely would have been us before Wisconsin. When a guy is asked what are the factors in picking a school and the first thing out of his mouth is the pace at which they play, you don't go to play for the slowest school in the nation.

Thank you for making my point better than I did, but before the UW folks come after you let's stipulate that they're only the 2nd slowest of 345 D1 teams.

I wish DJO could do what Jordan Tayor is doing tonight. MU would have a couple more W's right now and wouldn't be sweating it out. He has the ability...lacks the confidence or something else at the moment. Frustrating.

ESPN's recruiting page has it up now as well, Tokoto to UNC. Though it will probably become official in about 2-3 minutes.

Quote from: Skitch on March 03, 2011, 09:17:53 PM
Just posted that in the other Tokoto thread but you beat me by about a minute.

Interesting that The headline says that UNC beat out the Badgers for Tokoto, not UW and MU.

The story was written by Rob Reischel, who is the Badger beat writer for the JS, I believe.

so he attends multiple free games and then he doesnt play here.....trash

Quote from: Doris Burkes Thong on March 03, 2011, 10:12:09 PM
I wish DJO could do what Jordan Tayor is doing tonight. MU would have a couple more W's right now and wouldn't be sweating it out. He has the ability...lacks the confidence or something else at the moment. Frustrating.

Taylor is the man....it's a guard's game.  They could go far in the NCAA Tournament if that kid plays well.

Hope Buzz keeps in touch with JP, you never know.

Quote from: Jacks DC on March 03, 2011, 10:21:21 PMHope Buzz keeps in touch with JP, you never know.

Agreed. I wish him the best, but if he ever gets homesick, I'm sure we can find room for him :)

The kid is a freak athlete.  He needs a lot of development.  I think there is a reasonable chance he is recruited over by Ol Roy.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2011, 10:19:34 PM
Taylor is the man....it's a guard's game.  They could go far in the NCAA Tournament if that kid plays well.

He needs a pump fake.

Best of luck, JP. Beat Duke!

Quote from: Masterr73 on March 03, 2011, 10:18:39 PM
so he attends multiple free games and then he doesnt play here.....trash

Unless he's on an official visit I believe he pays his own way for those games.

If that was meant to be sarcasm or a teal font, good one.

JP I hope you stick it to these badger fans if you ever play them!  Good luck at UNC!

http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=193&f=2565&t=7264501 (http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=193&f=2565&t=7264501)

Quote from: Masterr73 on March 03, 2011, 10:18:39 PM
so he attends multiple free games and then he doesnt play here.....trash

If this is a serious comment, you are a jackass.

Mods, apologies for name-calling.

Badger fans are calling JP and his family classless for calling Bo during the game to tell him his decision. 

Here's a clue. We ain't gettin' Koenig either.

Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 03, 2011, 10:40:30 PM
Here's a clue. We ain't gettin' Koenig either.

Correct.  The pushing of SC out did not help in that regard either.  That is not opinion, that is straight from several coaches mouths in the LaCrosse area. 

Quote from: TallTitan34 on March 03, 2011, 10:33:31 PM
Badger fans are calling JP and his family classless for calling Bo during the game to tell him his decision. 

On the JSOnline site?  I wouldn't trust that site...I see again tonight there is someone posing as me with about 15 posts.  A lot of impersonators over there. 

Or is this on the Scout site...in which case I'm not surprised at all.   ;D

The Scout site is great humor. Badger fans saying that JPT was never the focus, that Sam Dekker was always their top target for 2012, calling him and his family classless, accusing UNC of offering a job to Trimble, and basically just whining.

I'm glad it's over. As much as I wanted Tokoto, and as much as his talent would help, he plays our lowest need position. In terms of athletic wing players, we have Wilson ready to start next year with Jamail Jones, Juan Anderson, and Jamal Ferguson lined up for the next few years. Now we need to focus on our other needs. Get us a scoring guard and point for 2011 and a big man for 2012. Go to it, Buzz!

The only coach Tokoto bothered to call was Bo Ryan, so UW was definitely his second choice.

Quote from: willie wampum on March 03, 2011, 11:27:19 PMThe only coach Tokoto bothered to call was Bo Ryan, so UW was definitely his second choice.

That's all PR spin. The kid's first priority in his own words when picking a school was the pace they played at. He said UW was second to appease the mass of Wisconsin fans in the state, but he never would have played there. If Roy had decided to look elsewhere with the scholarship, JP would have chosen UConn or Kentucky or Kansas, and UW would have been his second choice. If the entire country outside of Wisconsin had blown up, he would have chosen Marquette or Milwaukee and UW would have been his second choice. UW being the second choice was always how it was going to be, but only for PR reasons.

Big Deal! I hope he does well but he could end up being just another guy...We
got JA.

I'll be curious to see if this also leads Koenig to UNC. I figured that was sewn up when Williams broke his rule about not offering until after a player's sophomore year. Would be absolutely floored if Koenig went anywhere other than UNC now, especially with JPT already in the fold.

Quote from: brewcity77 on March 03, 2011, 11:30:16 PM
That's all PR spin. The kid's first priority in his own words when picking a school was the pace they played at. He said UW was second to appease the mass of Wisconsin fans in the state, but he never would have played there. If Roy had decided to look elsewhere with the scholarship, JP would have chosen UConn or Kentucky or Kansas, and UW would have been his second choice. If the entire country outside of Wisconsin had blown up, he would have chosen Marquette or Milwaukee and UW would have been his second choice. UW being the second choice was always how it was going to be, but only for PR reasons.

If this was all just PR, he would have done the classy thing and called all the coaches on his "list."  He just called Bo.  That tells you something.

BTW, if it came down to having to choose between UW and MU, there was a 95% chance he picks the Badgers.  For whatever reason, things didn't click with Buzz. 

JP is not the issue at MU right now, a Jordan Taylor type scoring point is.  Watching Junior pass up shot
after shot against Cinci is puzzling.  Not sure how good D. Wilson is?  Has anybody seen him play?  I am
not sure MU can ride Junior the next two years.  Hope I am wrong.  Secondly, Buzz needs a 6'8'' player
or better who can attack the glass.  It looks like Jamil is tall but plays soft.  Jae really is a small forward and
Erik looks like a small forward as well.  Need a 2 with sometype of talent, anybody left?  Also, I think the kid
that just left OU looks the real deal, JT Taylor?  If Mayo is looking at UCF, is he serious about playing in the
Big East or just wants to be the big fish there, UCF, how serious is he about hoops?

Quote from: willie wampum on March 03, 2011, 11:37:04 PMIf this was all just PR, he would have done the classy thing and called all the coaches on his "list."  He just called Bo.  That tells you something.

BTW, if it came down to having to choose between UW and MU, there was a 95% chance he picks the Badgers.  For whatever reason, things didn't click with Buzz.

Yup, tells me that his family is smart enough to know how to appease most of the fans in the state. I'm sorry, but leaving a voicemail during the UW game doesn't tell me that he was really honestly considering UW. If UNC hadn't worked out, he would have put off the decision for a few months, picked another out-of-state powerhouse that played up-tempo ball, and UW would have been second. Just look at what JP himself said about the type of game he wanted to play. His top priority was pace. Sorry, but there's no way anyone prioritizes on pace and picks UW. Never would have happened. One phone call doesn't change that.

Quote from: willie wampum on March 03, 2011, 11:37:04 PM
If this was all just PR, he would have done the classy thing and called all the coaches on his "list."  He just called Bo.  That tells you something.

BTW, if it came down to having to choose between UW and MU, there was a 95% chance he picks the Badgers.  For whatever reason, things didn't click with Buzz. 

Tobacco spitting, not cool

Warriors and Badgers were never in the mix. He was just making nice. Its a shame the "marquee" schools get what they want and we always have to scatch and claw He's no harrison barnes, gonna have to work hard after playing in the mighty metro conference..

He will have a hard time like any freshman but at NC for
sure, talent is over abundant there.  Hope he likes practice.

When it's all said and done, Vander Blue will have a better college career than JPT!

Quote from: mu77vegas on March 04, 2011, 12:06:02 AM
When it's all said and done, Vander Blue will have a better college career than JPT!

I totally question that point.  Did you see Vanders shot from the corner, looks like he has
a hitch in his shot right now, it was horrible.  And that lay-up he got pinned to the glass,
it was put up like an 8th grader.  Long way to go.  Tokoto problems might stem from his
size, not sure where he plays, awful skinny.  Both are tremendous athletics, hope they
both turn out for the best.

BCHoopster, are you speaking
In poetry?
Let's be honest
Here
Nobody knows where JP
Tokoto would have gone
Had he not gone to UNC
because it was always going to be UNC
There was no second option
It was UNC and then
UNC and then
UNC

Tokoto said he called each of
the coaches that had made his final 8
He said it was a very difficult
decision
So I don't know where this idea that
"He only called Bo and Roy"
He called 8 coaches, and said he spoke
To each in person
But Bo was coaching his game.

Quote from: wadesworld on March 04, 2011, 12:56:08 AM
BCHoopster, are you speaking
In poetry?Let's be honest
Here
Nobody knows where JP
Tokoto would have gone
Had he not gone to UNC
because it was always going to be UNC
There was no second option
It was UNC and then
UNC and then
UNC

Tokoto said he called each of
the coaches that had made his final 8
He said it was a very difficult
decision
So I don't know where this idea that
"He only called Bo and Roy"
He called 8 coaches, and said he spoke
To each in person
But Bo was coaching his game.

Funny as hell man. Thanks for the good humor.

I think Jamil Wilson is basically the same kind of player as JP with the same level of athleticism. I think Jamil has the chance to be really good at MU. I'll be interesting to see who has the better career.

After Tokoto's public announcement, I talked with him one-on-one about his decision to choose North Carolina. He said it was a 'no-brainer.'

You can read my full story here: http://bit.ly/TokotoUNC (http://bit.ly/TokotoUNC)

Quote from: Doris Burkes Thong on March 04, 2011, 01:13:01 AM
Funny as hell man. Thanks for the good humor.

Haha no problem. In all seriousness I honestly think we had as much of a chance to land him as the 7 other "finalists"...0%. Which is why I don't think we'll ever know who was "#2" on his list...because there was no #2. We never had a chance with hi, but neither did UCONN, Kentucky, Kansas, or UW. It was UNC all along. And I can't blame him. If I was a 17 year old basketball player in Wisconsin with my choice of literally anywhere to go it'd be UNC in a heartbeat. And the kid will be a stud for them. The 1 thing that will keep him from starting there from day 1 is his lack of an outside shot, which he'll improve a great deal on over the next year and a half He'll still see significant time his freshman year and start his sophomore year. His athleticism is off the charts.

Best of luck JP.

And I agree that Jamil will be a stud for us as well. Can't wait to watch him develop here.

Quote from: wadesworld on March 04, 2011, 12:56:08 AM

Tokoto said he called each of the coaches that had made his final 8
So I don't know where this idea that "He only called Bo and Roy"
He called 8 coaches, and said he spoke To each in person
But Bo was coaching his game.

This is incorrect. And you can read my story that talks about that for FOX Sports WI here: http://bit.ly/TokotoUNC (http://bit.ly/TokotoUNC)  -- JP told me that the only two coaches he called were Bo Ryan (during Wisconsin's game) and Roy Williams (during his press conference). That's it.

Oh well--there is always next year--and the next switchable we can go after that is 3 stars.

Good luck young man.  I hope it works out for you.  If it doesn't and you want to play close to home, remember MU.

Just another example of a state kid dissing Mu and UW for the bright lights of tobacco road.

not dissing, just facing facts. Better weather, better looking women, better chance at making final four, better looking campus, better way of life, hard to believe people still live in the upper midwest.

I'm always amazed that Marquette does as well as it does recruiting wise and academic wise considering it's located in a city with a third world quality public school system. We're lucky we are not in the Dying American City League a.k.a. Horizon League.

Quote from: groove on March 04, 2011, 07:32:44 AM
not dissing, just facing facts. Better weather, better looking women, better chance at making final four, better looking campus, better way of life, hard to believe people still live in the upper midwest.

I'm always amazed that Marquette does as well as it does recruiting wise and academic wise considering it's located in a city with a third world quality public school system. We're lucky we are not in the Dying American City League a.k.a. Horizon League.

Three thoughts ....

When I use the same facts to argue the B10 is becoming a mid-major football conference, everyone jumps on me that I'm completely wrong.

Why stop with MU?  Why does Pitt, Syracuse, UConn, Nova, GU, SJU, DePaul, SH, Louisville, Cincy, Xavier, Dayton, MSU, SLU, etc. get any recruits at all.  They are in also in dying cities with third world education systems.  In fact many of them are much worse than Milwaukee.

Why does the Ivy league continue to attract the best?  Ever been to New Haven?  Why would any smart person consider spending more than one second in that armpit?

here we go again, making excuses why we cannot compete against UNC or Duke, etc. Better women, give me a break! If that is a reason, then the recruit is really superficial at best.

And why was Wisky his second choice? We really fumbled this one--and it was a dis.

Quote from: AnotherMU84 on March 04, 2011, 07:42:05 AM
When I use the same facts to argue the B10 is becoming a mid-major football conference, everyone jumps on me that I'm completely wrong.

Because you are.  How on earth could you call the conference located in one of the largest population bases in the country, and is the second weathiest in terms of revenue generation per school, a mid-major???

Quote from: mu77vegas on March 04, 2011, 12:06:02 AM
When it's all said and done, Vander Blue will have a better college career than JPT!

What do you base this on?  Hope and a prayer???

By the way, just because he didn't call Buzz last night, doesn't mean that Buzz didn't know earlier that they were out of the picture.  My guess is that he wasn't caught blind-sided by this and thought we may have still had a chance.  Let's not jump down JPT's throught over a statement like that.

Quote from: AnotherMU84 on March 04, 2011, 07:42:05 AM
Why does the Ivy league continue to attract the best?  Ever been to New Haven?  Why would any smart person consider spending more than one second in that armpit?

self-flagellation?

Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 04, 2011, 07:56:18 AM

Because you are.  How on earth could you call the conference located in one of the largest population bases in the country, and is the second weathiest in terms of revenue generation per school, a mid-major???

Ahh, spoken like a true B10 kool-aid drinking defender.  I said the B10 cannot longer get the recruits to compete and you respond with a lot of irrelevant non-football facts.

I guess you agree as you're trying to change the subject.

They can no longer get the recruits to compete?  Michigan State just came off of two straight years in the Final Four and Ohio State is the #1 team in the country.  Purdue and Wisconsin are also in the top ten.

Are those facts enough for you?

But keep spouting your mid-major meme...it is humorous...

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2011, 10:19:34 PM
Taylor is the man....it's a guard's game.  They could go far in the NCAA Tournament if that kid plays well.

I came away thinking just the opposite. I think they're pretty good, but I just don't see them going far. The good news is he scored 17 consecutive points.  The bad news is he scored 17 consecutive points. As always it will come down to the match up. As much as people like to complain about MU's performance on the road, UW's is equally suspect, if not worse. This may sound stupid given that comment, but their best road win is against us.

Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 04, 2011, 08:22:48 AM
They can no longer get the recruits to compete?  Michigan State just came off of two straight years in the Final Four and Ohio State is the #1 team in the country.  Purdue and Wisconsin are also in the top ten.

Are those facts enough for you?

But keep spouting your mid-major meme...it is humorous...

Umm, the original statement was "B10 is becoming a mid-major football conference"

First you respond with irrelevant non-football statistics.

Now you respond with basketball statistics.

Again, you're agreeing with me that the B10 is a second rate football conference as your best argument is to change the subject.

Scores don't lie ... see how the B10 did this past January 1 (0-5 with three blow outs).  This is why happens when a mid-major football conference goes up against D1 schools in bowl games.

I was at the presser last night and came away with following observations:

1. Great kid and a lot of poise. Was very impressed with the whole package.
2. Decision obviously was easy one for the kid/family. However, I did not like when Dad said it was a "business decision". Basically if he did not take scholly soon it could be gone. I realize that happens but a place where to timeline put on him might be better choice.
3. His body language regarding Prep School indicated he wants nothing to do with that. Appears he really likes where he is at and his teammates.
4. He is SKINNY!!!
5. Beautiful Mom!!!
6. Beautiful Mom!!

I wish we would have landed him big time. That said, I believe Jamil Wilson is the real deal with a better frame. I strongly recommend all posters speak well of the kid. You never know what happens in a year or two. I do think VB, JW and J.P. would have been unreal to watch.

Quote from: Goose on March 04, 2011, 09:00:43 AM
I wish we would have landed him big time. That said, I believe Jamil Wilson is the real deal with a better frame. I strongly recommend all posters speak well of the kid. You never know what happens in a year or two. I do think VB, JW and J.P. would have been unreal to watch.

JP and Jamil is a tough comparison, just because Jamil is so much farther along in his physical development. But I agree, he will be the real deal. He can guard 1-4 and is smooth with the ball. He seriously just glides around the court, making it look easy.

This year off might be the best thing to happen to him as well. He can get stronger, get used to the system, and build that hunger up for next season.

Quote from: AnotherMU84 on March 04, 2011, 08:27:40 AM
Scores don't lie ... see how the B10 did this past January 1 (0-5 with three blow outs).  This is why happens when a mid-major football conference goes up against D1 schools in bowl games.

And the year before they had a winning record on New Year's Day.  Definately below the SEC, and the powers of the B12, but better than the rest.

Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 04, 2011, 09:12:31 AM

And the year before they had a winning record on New Year's Day.  Definately below the SEC, and the powers of the B12, but better than the rest.

Not sure how he's defining mid-major, but here's the final top 25 by conference:

SEC - 6
Big 12 - 5
ACC - 4
Big 10 - 3
Pac 10 - 2
MWC - 2
WAC - 2
CUSA - 1

I can't honestly say that I've ever heard anyone refer to Big 10 football as "mid major."  I hate Big 10 football, and I was as happy to see them crap the bed this year as anyone, but they're certainly not a mid major conference.  And if you factor in Nebraska, that would put them in a tie for second with Big 12 and ACC.

And just for fun:

2009
SEC - 4
Big 10 - 4
ACC - 4
Big 12 - 3
Big East - 3
MWC - 3
Pac 10 - 2
WAC - 1
MAC - 1

2008
Big 12 - 5
SEC - 4
Big 10 - 4
MWC - 3
Pac 10 - 3
ACC - 3
BEast - 2
WAC - 1

2007
SEC - 5
Big 12 - 5
Big 10 - 4
Pac 10 - 4
ACC - 3
BEast - 2
MWC - 1
WAC - 1

2006
SEC - 6
Big 10 - 4
Pac 10 - 3
Big East - 3
ACC - 3
Big 12 - 2
MWC - 2
WAC - 1
Ind - 1

5 year total (2006-2010)
SEC - 25
Big 12 - 20
Big 10 - 19
ACC - 17
Pac 10 - 14
MWC - 11
Big East - 10
WAC - 6
CUSA - 1
MAC - 1
Ind - 1

The 2010 bowl games notwithstanding, this doesn't look to me like the Big 10 is becoming a mid major football conference.

Quote2. Decision obviously was easy one for the kid/family. However, I did not like when Dad said it was a "business decision". Basically if he did not take scholly soon it could be gone. I realize that happens but a place where to timeline put on him might be better choice.

Recruiting at the truly elite level is a completely different ball game. Roy has five spots total for class of 2012 (barring any early departures) and already has filled two and insider rumors are that the dominoes are about to start falling with the others. He had offers to two point guards, LJ Rose and Marcus Paige and Paige committed a few weeks back. After the Paige commitment, Rose went public with the fact that UNC had been his leader and was somewhat disappointed that he had not acted sooner.....it's really a game of high stakes poker.  When only two offers are made they are told it's first come, first served....

At this level most kids have a pretty good idea of where they want to go after one visit....some want to take advantage of the whole process and visit a lot of schools just for the fun in doing so but they also run the risk of having the schollie disappear if they drag things out too long.

JP was the first person Roy called and also first to get an offer in the class of 2012....he has also offered Shabazz Mohammed and has told several others that their offers are dependent on what happens with the first two. UNC insiders believe that Roy is now about to focus on bigs for the class and will also continue to recruit the back ups for the SF position that Mohammed plays.

You can't blame the coaches especially those like K and Roy who really don't cast a wide net because they have a need that has to be filled and they can't take the chance of waiting out someone and ending up empty handed. Roy has 18 players for the classs of 2012 on the radar but has only made 4 offers to date and two have already accepted.....like I said....it's a very different ball game.

By comparison, look at all the offers Buzz has out there...he has to throw far more against the wall because as much as we hate to admit it, MU (and even UW) doesn't have the cachet of a UNC or Duke and the closing percentage is much lower as a result.

Texas Warrior-- I agree with your post 100%.  I realize he loves the school and tradition and most likely will have an awesome career there. However, I believe he is taking a gamble and possibly going one level down would be a better fit. My gut feeling is he is a great kid with a big heart and sometimes guys like that get lost in the shuffle.

He did not appear to me to a "making a business decision" type of kid. He came across as a kid who loves his family, teammates and friends. Normally I am not impressed with 17y kids, including my own, but he was impressive. Question is does he have a killer instinct? If not, UNC could be long four years.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2011, 10:45:00 PM
Correct.  The pushing of SC out did not help in that regard either.  That is not opinion, that is straight from several coaches mouths in the LaCrosse area. 

Could not be further from the truth. he was not pushed out.

Quote from: IWB on March 04, 2011, 03:36:30 PMCould not be further from the truth. he was not pushed out.

IWB, you seem like the kind of guy who might know. Was MU in the running at all for Tokoto, and has Buzz been putting any effort over the past 4-5 months in recruiting him as it became more and more likely that UNC was the only horse in the race? Or was the addition of Jamal Ferguson for 2012 somewhat a sign that we weren't really holding out hope for JP?

MU had a legit shot as JP's mom absolutely loves Buzz, and she wanted him to stay close to home, but let him be the one to make the decision. Yes, Buzz was recruiting him and the kid was at MU weekly over the summer playing with the guys. Seemed to fit in well. The commit from Ferguson had no bearing on the recruitment of JP, but I also believe that Buzz knew a while ago that MU was not going to be the school of choice.

Quote from: IWB on March 04, 2011, 03:51:12 PMMU had a legit shot as JP's mom absolutely loves Buzz, and she wanted him to stay close to home, but let him be the one to make the decision. Yes, Buzz was recruiting him and the kid was at MU weekly over the summer playing with the guys. Seemed to fit in well. The commit from Ferguson had no bearing on the recruitment of JP, but I also believe that Buzz knew a while ago that MU was not going to be the school of choice.

Cheers for that. And it seems to poke a bit of a hole in the "tobacco spit" theory that so many have been postulating regarding JP's mom not wanting him to have anything to do with Buzz. Thanks.

Ha!! Hardly, she loves Buzz. I was at the infamous open gym when Roy, Izzo, Calipari, Weber, Dawkins etc were there. She walked in and had baked some cookies for the guests. She said hello and shook hands with each one of them. When she got to Buzz, he held out his hand and said, "Coach Buzz, I won't shake your hand, I got to hug you Coach Buzz!" and she gave him a big old bear hug. She also called MU often over the summer to see what the schedule was so she could bring her son down.

His mom didn't like Buzz' chewing tobacco? His mom's love of Buzz is what kept MU alive in the recruitment.

Quote from: IWB on March 04, 2011, 03:36:30 PM
Could not be further from the truth. he was not pushed out.

That is the perception (whether it's reality or not) of several coaches in that area.  All comes down to how you define "pushed out". 

Example A

Son, you better look to transfer because I don't want you on my team any longer.

Example B

Son, you're welcome to stay on this team but my philosophy is to get athletic players that can run like gazelles and jump like spiderman.  We're going to run an offense built around those athletic traits.  I hope you stay, but I want to be honest with you that this is the direction I'm going if you wish to stay.


It's all how you define "pushed out"....i.e. what opportunity that kid has if he stays.

Quote from: IWB on March 04, 2011, 03:36:30 PM
Could not be further from the truth. he was not pushed out.

You obviously lack the insider connections with the LaCrosse high school athletics community possessed by some of our West Coast members.

I got "pushed out" once in my basketball career.  I was a sophomore in high school, and I dribbled the ball off my foot.

"Sorry, but we can't use you."

"Sniff."  (I got over it, though.  Thanks for asking.)

Hey, LaCrosse is the west coast of Wisconsin.  ;D IWB, the ultimate MU insider, says the idea that SC was pushed out couldn't be farther from the truth.   The facts say that the coach that recruited him left for another gig.   CBB says that SC was pushed out.   Hmmmm, whom to believe.    Ummmmmmmm.    IWB it is.  

Quote from: IWB on March 04, 2011, 03:36:30 PM
Could not be further from the truth. he was not pushed out.

Thanks for the information - much preferred to specuation posing as information.

Quote from: IWB on March 04, 2011, 04:02:50 PM
Ha!! Hardly, she loves Buzz. I was at the infamous open gym when Roy, Izzo, Calipari, Weber, Dawkins etc were there. She walked in and had baked some cookies for the guests. She said hello and shook hands with each one of them. When she got to Buzz, he held out his hand and said, "Coach Buzz, I won't shake your hand, I got to hug you Coach Buzz!" and she gave him a big old bear hug. She also called MU often over the summer to see what the schedule was so she could bring her son down.

His mom didn't like Buzz' chewing tobacco? His mom's love of Buzz is what kept MU alive in the recruitment.

Nice to learn the truth from a real insider. The haters and the gullible will be disappointed.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 04, 2011, 04:10:24 PM
That is the perception (whether it's reality or not) of several coaches in that area.  All comes down to how you define "pushed out". 

Example A

Son, you better look to transfer because I don't want you on my team any longer.

Example B

Son, you're welcome to stay on this team but my philosophy is to get athletic players that can run like gazelles and jump like spiderman.  We're going to run an offense built around those athletic traits.  I hope you stay, but I want to be honest with you that this is the direction I'm going if you wish to stay.


It's all how you define "pushed out"....i.e. what opportunity that kid has if he stays.

Why not just admit you were busted and let it go?

Good luck to JP. Heckuva talent but if he thinks Roy is suddenly going to stop recruiting 4 and 5 stars because he signed him, he's wrong.

Is he the most touted WI talent to leave the state since Joe Wolf?

Quote from: NavinRJohnson on March 04, 2011, 08:25:09 AM
I came away thinking just the opposite. I think they're pretty good, but I just don't see them going far. The good news is he scored 17 consecutive points.  The bad news is he scored 17 consecutive points. As always it will come down to the match up. As much as people like to complain about MU's performance on the road, UW's is equally suspect, if not worse. This may sound stupid given that comment, but their best road win is against us.

Here's what ESPN said today about the Big Ten and Wisconsin...

"If the tournament were seeded today, the Big Ten would probably land six bids. That's a perfectly respectable number. But it's also a bit deceptive in its imbalance. Three of those bids would go to legitimate national title contenders: Ohio State, Purdue and Wisconsin.

77ncaachamps
I think that he is biggest WI recruit since Wolf. The schools on his list would be very difficult to top. I hope he made the right choice.

Quote from: 77ncaachamps on March 04, 2011, 06:05:17 PM
Good luck to JP. Heckuva talent but if he thinks Roy is suddenly going to stop recruiting 4 and 5 stars because he signed him, he's wrong.

Is he the most touted WI talent to leave the state since Joe Wolf?

Too much UNC love .... players to consider since Wolf ...

Latrell Sprewell
Terry Porter
Nick Van Exel
Caron Butler

Some that did not leave the state
Jim Mac (passed on UCLA)
Sam Okey (based on HS rankings)
Brian Butch (based on HS rankings)
Tony Smith
Travis Diener
Brian Butch (McDonald AA)


Tony Bennett
Tony Pieper
Deven Harris

All depends on how you define "pushed"? Well, here's my definition, let's see if you can top it.

Scott was unhappy and considered transferring while Crean was still at MU. He saw James, McNeal, Matthews, Cubillan and Acker in front of him, and Taylor and Williams coming in behind him, and did not believe he had a role.

With every team, different coaches assume different roles. Buzz assumed the role of the guy that rode them hard, Buckley the father figure etc etc. Well, Buzz rode them hard, and some guys don't take that kind of coaching well, and Scott was one of those guys, Cooby was another. Scott was 50-50 on leaving BEFORE Crean left.

When Crean left he waited to see who the new coach was. When Buzz was hired, they immediately call a team meeting, and Buzz went in and told the team himself that he was their new coach. He explained how he would run things, how the team would play etc etc. Scott knew the up and down style Buzz wanted did not favor him. When the meeting ended, Scott stayed behind and asked Buzz if they could talk. He told Buzz he wanted a release. Buzz asked him to think about it for a couple of days but Scott had made his mind up, so that was it, but they wanted to keep it quiet until after the banquet.

Scott already knew what schools he was going to consider, even before Buzz was hired. You see, his longtime high school girlfriend was a student at Iowa. She was considering a transfer to Iowa State due to her major. And you know what? Scott's final two schools were....drumroll.....Iowa and Iowa State. he selected Iowa State and she transferred to ISU where they both still are today.

Yep, that is my definition of "pushed".

Can you say PWND???

Truth v agenda. 

Terry Porter - UWSP?

Thanks for setting the record straight, IWB. Don't be a stranger - this board can use a real insider.

Quote from: AnotherMU84 on March 04, 2011, 06:52:03 PM
Too much UNC love .... players to consider since Wolf ...

Latrell Sprewell
Terry Porter
Nick Van Exel
Caron Butler

Terry Porter went to UWSP.  The other three were not recruited by in-state schools to my knowledge.

Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on March 04, 2011, 10:11:00 PM

Terry Porter went to UWSP.  The other three were not recruited by in-state schools to my knowledge.

Correct ...

The larger point is are we ready to proclaim Tokoto better than all these guys after leading the Falls to a .500 record and a UNC offer?  Does that mean Koenig is better than all these guys too for the same reason?

Latrell Sprewell
Terry Porter
Nick Van Exel
Caron Butler
Jim Mac (passed on UCLA)
Sam Okey (based on HS rankings)
Tony Smith
Travis Diener
Brian Butch (McDonald AA)
Tony Bennett
Tony Pieper
Deven Harris

Joe Wolf deciding NC had a bigger impact on the program.  MU was in decline.  Joe Wolf was not nearly the athlete JP is, but he had skills....could bring the ball up the court, had an outside shot.  He would have made a huge difference, and may have brought Majerus the success he had later, at MU.

JP would nave been great get, but we don't NEED him.  We have other good players at his position.

What about UW?  If UW was indeed his second choice (like Wolf's second choice was MU) could UW not landing JPT lead to a decline in Madison ... especially once Taylor leaves.

UW needed JPT

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 04, 2011, 04:10:24 PM
That is the perception (whether it's reality or not) of several coaches in that area.  All comes down to how you define "pushed out". 

Example A

Son, you better look to transfer because I don't want you on my team any longer.

Example B

Son, you're welcome to stay on this team but my philosophy is to get athletic players that can run like gazelles and jump like spiderman.  We're going to run an offense built around those athletic traits.  I hope you stay, but I want to be honest with you that this is the direction I'm going if you wish to stay.

It's all how you define "pushed out"....i.e. what opportunity that kid has if he stays.

Run like gazelles and jump like spiderman??  Hilarious.  The degree of sensationalism in this post is reason enough for one to have doubts.  But thanks to IWB for effectively ending the nonsense.

Quote from: IWB on March 04, 2011, 06:53:39 PM
All depends on how you define "pushed"? Well, here's my definition, let's see if you can top it.


Yep, that is my definition of "pushed".

Wonderful...explain to me why some of the coaches up in that area don't feel that way.  

Maybe they just have an "agenda" against MU.

Thanks...I'll hang up and listen.  

Quote from: AnotherMU84 on March 05, 2011, 08:53:35 AM
What about UW?  If UW was indeed his second choice (like Wolf's second choice was MU) could UW not landing JPT lead to a decline in Madison ... especially once Taylor leaves.

UW needed JPT

UW got Dekker...they're going to be just fine.

Quote from: Lennys Tap on March 04, 2011, 05:19:03 PM
Why not just admit you were busted and let it go?

Busted?  LOL.  I'm just passing on what some of the coaches up there feel that has been reported on several sites, including Wis Sports and others.  Nothing more, nothing less.  As I said, perception and reality is all the matters.

I'm curious, in the last 10 years if you were to hear it from some "insiders" MU has NEVER, I repeat, NEVER done anything but act as angelic patron saint of Christ.  I wonder why that is.  Hmmm.   It's amazing how pure as the driven snow we are from some of these insiders....makes you wonder what access will be cut off if truthiness is ever revealed some of this stuff.

At any rate, you should go more to the Scout site Lenny.  I'm sure they would love you there.  You can get all dressed up in your Kumbaya outfit, put your head in the sand, shave your head and pray to Curly.

Maybe they can comment on the Newbill, HBO stuff...you know, since they are ultimate insiders.   ;)

Quote from: AnotherMU84 on March 05, 2011, 08:09:24 AM
Correct ...

The larger point is are we ready to proclaim Tokoto better than all these guys after leading the Falls to a .500 record and a UNC offer?  Does that mean Koenig is better than all these guys too for the same reason?

Latrell Sprewell
Terry Porter
Nick Van Exel
Caron Butler
Jim Mac (passed on UCLA)
Sam Okey (based on HS rankings)
Tony Smith
Travis Diener
Brian Butch (McDonald AA)
Tony Bennett
Tony Pieper
Deven Harris

I don't think anybody is proclaiming Tokoto a better player, but he certainly was recruited by more significant programs than the vast majority of these guys. Only Butch and Okey compare, reallyt. Butler isn't a valid comparison because he'd been out of the state for two years by the time he picked a school.
Keep in mind, the UCLA program that recruited Mac was in the dumps. They'd only made two NCAA appearances in the previous seven seasons under Larry Farmer and Walt Hazard.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 05, 2011, 09:50:55 AM
Wonderful...explain to me why some of the coaches up in that area don't feel that way.  

Maybe they just have an "agenda" against MU.

Thanks...I'll hang up and listen.  

Can you let us know how you manage to be a father, a little league baseball coach, husband, DirecTV big shot, that keeps a busy travel schedule, that has time to talk to not just lots of connected people within college basketball, but now also has "connctions or conversations" with coaches in the La Crosse, WI - all the while well living in Orange County, CA and having over 10,000 posts on this site??

I'm tired from just having wrote that.  It must be exhausting to live that?

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 05, 2011, 09:56:47 AM
Busted?  LOL.  As I said, perception and reality is all the matters.

Perception and reality is all that matters? Nonsensical. I imagine you meant to say "perception OF reality is all that matters". That's dead wrong too,of course. Reality is all that matters. Worrying about people's "perceptions" (misperceptions due to lack of information, preconceptions, bigotry, etc) is a fool's errand.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 05, 2011, 09:53:15 AM
UW got Dekker...they're going to be just fine.

Yeah, Sam Dekker. It's a mystery Bo even bothered to recruit Tokoto when he already had Sam Dekker lined up.

MU got Jamal Ferguson ... we're going to be just fine.

And, seriously, Chico's ... do you think anybody here really believes you have insider sources among the Greater LaCrosse High School sports community?

Quote from: Pakuni on March 05, 2011, 10:31:57 AM
Yeah, Sam Dekker. It's a mystery Bo even bothered to recruit Tokoto when he already had Sam Dekker lined up.

MU got Jamal Ferguson ... we're going to be just fine.

And, seriously, Chico's ... do you think anybody here really believes you have insider sources among the Greater LaCrosse High School sports community?

And seriously, did I ever say I have sources in the greater Lacrosse sports community.  Uhm, no, I didn't.  Guess what, I don't have sources in the White House, either, but that doesn't mean I can't read what they say or hear from pundits what is said...right?

Thanks for playing.

Dekker will be a very good player for them.  He's the same type of guy that you guys always crap on when UW signs these guys and then by their junior and senior year they are beating us (again) with those very players, only to hear Another84 say how White and Slow they are.   ::)

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 05, 2011, 10:36:21 AM
And seriously, did I ever say I have sources in the greater Lacrosse sports community.  Uhm, no, I didn't.  Guess what, I don't have sources in the White House, either, but that doesn't mean I can't read what they say or hear from pundits what is said...right?

Thanks for playing.

Dekker will be a very good player for them.  He's the same type of guy that you guys always crap on when UW signs these guys and then by their junior and senior year they are beating us (again) with those very players, only to hear Another84 say how White and Slow they are.   ::)

And your credibility continues to flush itself down the toilet, Chicos.

Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 05, 2011, 10:36:21 AM
And seriously, did I ever say I have sources in the greater Lacrosse sports community.  Uhm, no, I didn't.  Guess what, I don't have sources in the White House, either, but that doesn't mean I can't read what they say or hear from pundits what is said...right?

Thanks for playing.

Dekker will be a very good player for them.  He's the same type of guy that you guys always crap on when UW signs these guys and then by their junior and senior year they are beating us (again) with those very players, only to hear Another84 say how White and Slow they are.   ::)

OK, fine. If these loud and frequent complaints from the LaCrosse coaching community are so public - say, like something that comes out of the White House - perhaps you could point us in the right direction where we can find them. Message board posts, newspaper articles, youtube videos ... whatever.  It is, after all "straight from several coaches mouths" and must be public for you to have heard them sans insider sources.
Just let us know where we can find it.

And sorry, I don't make it a habit of crapping on UW recruits. I'm pretty sure today is the first time I've ever mentioned the name Sam Dekker.

Chico - You said that your side of the Christopherson story has been "reported" at WisHoops. Please point that out to me as I would love to see it.

Newbill? Yes, as a matter of fact I do know that entire story and no, I will not post it on a message board. I didn't even feel right posting Scott's personal business.

HBO? Sorry, don't know that one.