Anybody who thinks different is oblivious to the facts. I don't want to hear "Oh we'll we lost to only good teams, etc, etc" I'm as big of a fan as they come, but we all need to be realistic.
You clearly do not know what you are talking about.
And obviously you do with your "great" argument!
They need two more wins to feel good on selection Sunday. Win at Seton Hall and win one in the big east tourney.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 02, 2011, 09:02:51 PM
And obviously you do with your "great" argument!
As opposed to yours?
We are in the NCAA tournament.
If you don't think so, put your money where your mouth is.
Get over your ND girlfriend dumping you and grow up!
Quote from: 77fan88warrior on March 02, 2011, 09:04:47 PM
Get over your ND girlfriend dumping you and grow up!
:'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on March 02, 2011, 09:01:08 PM
You clearly do not know what you are talking about.
No, HA is right. I'm trying my hand at my own NCAA bracket. The bubble isn't soft, it's awful. We could lose out and still have a better resume than a good 8-10 teams that will get in. Try making a list of more deserving at-larges. You won't find a way to keep us out. It isn't that we're that good, the rest of the country is simply that bad.
It's simple... MU is a bubble team and every bubble team has reasons to be in the tourney and reasons to be left out. It's a weak field so we have a shot. I have this weird feel that we are going to hear about MU getting jipped and all the analysts saying "If you could have closed that game out against Louisville, you would be in."
How many times have teams come into the tournament (Big East or NCAA) playing poorly and were able to rattle off a few wins in a row? Sometimes being the underdog and not having expectations takes the pressure off. I will remain optimistic at this point but this loss certainly doesn't help our cause. No one expected us to go to the Final Four in 2003. Granted we had one of the greatest, if not THE greatest, basketball players in the country at the time.
Honestly, after tonight, I have a horrible feeling about the NCAAs. 9-9 is a pathetic record, it's very easy for the committee to turn that down. And if we play like we did tonight, we won't win--against anyone.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 02, 2011, 09:07:09 PM
It's simple... MU is a bubble team and every bubble team has reasons to be in the tourney and reasons to be left out. It's a weak field so we have a shot. I have this weird feel that we are going to hear about MU getting jipped and all the analysts saying "If you could have closed that game out against Louisville, you would be in."
Yes the Louisville game was just terrible, but losing to St. Johns and Cincy at home could be the losses haunting MU. Must protect your house. Will be a mute point though if they don't clobber Seton Hall.
We need to win at Seton Hall and at least 1 in the BEAST Tourney. Two wins in the BEAST and we are in. No margin for error till the end of the season though.
If the commitee was looking for a reason not to put 11 BE team in the tourney, and I believe they are, they were just obliged by Marquette.
Quote from: nyg on March 02, 2011, 09:10:28 PM
Yes the Louisville game was just terrible, but losing to St. Johns and Cincy at home could be the losses haunting MU. Must protect your house. Will be a mute point though if they don't clobber Seton Hall.
Sure... the cardinal rule is win at home... but in retrospect, we had the game in the bag.
Quote from: nyg on March 02, 2011, 09:10:28 PM
Yes the Louisville game was just terrible, but losing to St. Johns and Cincy at home could be the losses haunting MU. Must protect your house. Will be a mute point though if they don't clobber Seton Hall.
First off. Check that box to the left. St. John's is 4th in the BEAST. Additionally, they are the #15 team in the country.
Secondly. Its 'moot' point.
First off, consider me one of the oblivious.
Second, please tell me how a team "deserves" to be in the NCAA tourney. What is your criteria?
We could easily end up 8th in the conference yet,but they are going to take two teams lower then us?I really don't think so.
As opposed to yours?
We are in the NCAA tournament.
If you don't think so, put your money where your mouth is.
We are in the NCAA Tournament huh? That's news to me! Congrats Marquette!!! The committee doesn't want to put 11 big east teams in. I feel like this was a must win, and now I think we need 2 Big East tourney wins to make it. Even if we do make the tournament it's only going to take game one before we are bounced out!!
That my friend I would gladly put money on!
Go MU!
Didn't realize you already talked to the committe,and they told you they don't want 11 teams.Sorry!
Get back at me on Selection Sunday Sir.
Barring MU winning the Big East Tournament, if the Warriors don't win Saturday, they'll get to the committee with 14 losses.
Saturday is a must-win. End of story.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 02, 2011, 09:16:26 PM
We are in the NCAA Tournament huh? That's news to me! Congrats Marquette!!! The committee doesn't want to put 11 big east teams in. I feel like this was a must win, and now I think we need 2 Big East tourney wins to make it. Even if we do make the tournament it's only going to take game one before we are bounced out!!
That my friend I would gladly put money on!
Go MU!
Why doesn't want the committee want to put 11 BEAST teams in? Did you ask them? Do you know what they are thinking? The committee will put the best teams in, regardless of which conference they come from.
This game was not a must win. Not even close.
As I said, if you want to put something on it, I'd be glad to take your money.
Email me sir, I'd be happy to meet up with you! ;D
Lunardi might not be a genius,but Marquette isn't close to his last 4 in.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 02, 2011, 09:16:26 PM
As opposed to yours?
We are in the NCAA tournament.
If you don't think so, put your money where your mouth is.
We are in the NCAA Tournament huh? That's news to me! Congrats Marquette!!! The committee doesn't want to put 11 big east teams in. I feel like this was a must win, and now I think we need 2 Big East tourney wins to make it. Even if we do make the tournament it's only going to take game one before we are bounced out!!
That my friend I would gladly put money on!
Go MU!
Come on man. We're all upset we lost but where's the optimism? Believe me, I appreciate you keeping it real, but realistically, we still have a shot.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 02, 2011, 09:20:45 PM
Email me sir, I'd be happy to meet up with you! ;D
I prefer to do it in public so you don't welsh on your bet.
Quote from: NCMUFan on March 02, 2011, 09:11:16 PM
We need to win at Seton Hall and at least 1 in the BEAST Tourney. Two wins in the BEAST and we are in. No margin for error till the end of the season though.
You do know that you're talking about one game, right?
Come on man. We're all upset we lost but where's the optimism? Believe me, I appreciate you keeping it real, but realistically, we still have a shot.
I agree we have a shot, Trust me I want MU to win more than anybody. I just wanted to bring an objective opinion in here for once, Instead of all the biased bull$hit i hear. :)
Quote from: Buzz Williams' Spillproof Chiclets Cup on March 02, 2011, 09:18:59 PM
Barring MU winning the Big East Tournament, if the Warriors don't win Saturday, they'll get to the committee with 14 losses.
Saturday is a must-win. End of story.
This makes more sense than most things I have seen posted on the Scoop over last 2 months.
Quote from: LittleMurs on March 02, 2011, 09:22:41 PM
You do know that you're talking about one game, right?
We know we are playing two more games in the BEAST. One in regular season, one in the BEAST tourney. Sorry for being confusing.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 02, 2011, 09:00:36 PM
Anybody who thinks different is oblivious to the facts. I don't want to hear "Oh we'll we lost to only good teams, etc, etc" I'm as big of a fan as they come, but we all need to be realistic.
Quote from: lab_warrior on March 02, 2011, 09:09:38 PM
Honestly, after tonight, I have a horrible feeling about the NCAAs. 9-9 is a pathetic record, it's very easy for the committee to turn that down. And if we play like we did tonight, we won't win--against anyone.
You guys are aware that Cincinnati is the best defensive team in the Big East by far, right?
Settle down. There is some bad, bad, bad basketball out there and some of it worse than MU.
Don't confuse making the tourney with Great Hoops.
FWIW, in Pitt @ USF game, their saying Marquette has already played their way in with the win @Uconn.
Quote from: 77fan88warrior on March 02, 2011, 09:25:38 PM
This makes more sense than most things I have seen posted on the Scoop over last 2 months.
It is a must win, because 10-8 is a lock right now. I think 10-8 without a BET win still might be good enough. Win on Saturday and they should be pretty safe, way too many bubble teams under .500 right now for 10-8 not to be a real safe record.
Quote from: The Lens on March 02, 2011, 09:28:31 PM
Settle down. There is some bad, bad, bad basketball out there and some of it worse than MU.
Don't confuse making the tourney with Great Hoops.
exactly.
I never said anything besides we would make the tourney.
West Virginia has Louisville,Conn has Notre Dame and Villanova has Pitt.All could eaily lose there games.We win and we have 8th place and a first round bye
Quote from: LAZER on March 02, 2011, 09:35:01 PM
It is a must win, because 10-8 is a lock right now. I think 10-8 without a BET win still might be good enough. Win on Saturday and they should be pretty safe, way too many bubble teams under .500 right now for 10-8 not to be a real safe record.
+1 This year the BE really is the BEast.
Sorry JD, but this is a "panic button" post. If we're not getting in, have you considered the records/profiles of teams that would get in ahead of us? They're not pretty. I think that Seton Hall is very close to must-win, but we're going to be favored in that game. Sucks that we lost tonight though, and didn't look good in the process.
Tough loss, but really no shame in this one since Cincy has beaten Louisville and has road wins at St. John's and Georgetown. As of right now, we are still in. Just look at the competition.
My buddy is a Clemson fan and they are considered one of the first, if not the first team out of the tournament. We still have a much better resume than they do (assuming they lose this game to Duke). Before tonight, they had played only one team currently in the RPI top 25, UNC, and lost to them twice. They also have losses to Virginia, NC State and South Carolina while we have no bad losses.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 02, 2011, 09:25:08 PMI agree we have a shot, Trust me I want MU to win more than anybody. I just wanted to bring an objective opinion in here for once, Instead of all the biased bull$hit i hear. :)
And I want people to post educated opinions rather than just panicking every time we lose a game, instead of all the ignorant bull$hit I hear :)
But I don't get that, do I? Seriously, go look at some resumes of teams projected around the end of the bracket. Here's an idea of just how soft the bubble is. These are Lunardi's last 4 in, then I'll include our resume:
RichmondRecord: 22-7 (11-3)
RPI: 66
SOS: 139
kenpom: 59
Top 50 wins: 6 Purdue
Bad Losses: 179 Georgia Tech (also lost to 83 Bucknell at home that we beat)
MichiganRecord: 18-12 (8-9)
RPI: 60
SOS: 24
kenpom: 45
Top 50 wins: 42 Harvard, 49 Michigan State
Bad Losses: 100 Northwestern, 171 Indiana
AlabamaRecord: 19-10 (11-4)
RPI: 87
SOS: 129
kenpom: 51
Top 50 wins: 12 Kentucky, 35 Tennessee
Bad Losses: 101 Seton Hall, 102 Arkansas, 124 St. Peter's, 149 Providence, 179 Iowa
BaylorRecord: 18-11 (7-8)
RPI: 78
SOS: 48
kenpom: 65
Top 50 wins: 29 Texas A&M (twice)
Bad Losses: 134 Iowa State, 137 Oklahoma, 162 Texas Tech
MarquetteRecord: 18-12 (9-8)
RPI: 53
SOS: 30
kenpom: 26
Top 50 wins: 9 Notre Dame, 18 Connecticut, 19 West Virginia, 20 Syracuse
Bad Losses: None
So I asked you to look it up. Apparently you couldn't be bothered to do that. Well, I made it easy for you. These teams above are the
last four projected to make the tournament. That means as of right now,
they are in. Compare their resumes to ours. We have a better RPI than all of them. We have a better SOS than all but one of them. We have a better kenpom rating than all of them. We have more top 50 wins than any of them. We are clearly better in terms of bad losses. Even if we lose to Seton Hall we will still have better credentials than any of them. If we lose to Seton Hall and go on to lose to South Florida in the first round of the Big East tournament, that will still probably only give us one bad loss as Seton Hall would likely rise into the top 100 RPI by beating us, thus nullifying a bad loss.
And right now, there's probably another 8 teams that are considered to be "in the field" that still have a worse resume than we do. Compare us to teams like Washington, Illinois, Michigan State, Georgia, Butler, Gonzaga, and Tennessee and tell me that we're on the verge of dropping out. Do so with a straight face. If you have any remote sense of how logic works, you can't do it. If we don't make the tournament, even if we drop our next two games, it won't be because of merit, it will be because the Selection Committee really doesn't want 11 Big East teams in the Big Dance. Because even if we lose two games, there is no possible way in hell that there will be even 8 teams that make the tournament with better resumes than we have.
Do the research. Look into it. Don't just go pissing and whining because we lost one damn game. The bubble is soft. We are going to the NCAAs. Deal with it.
I feel bad even responding to this nonsense thread but after we play Seton Hall could you please name me 68 teams who deserve to play in the NCAA Tourney ahead of us? Maybe you haven't been paying attention to any college basketball this year. If MU wins Saturday, we are a LOCK and fully deserve to be included in the top 68 teams in the country. What a bogus thread.
Quote from: MU PoopScoop on March 02, 2011, 10:52:32 PM
I feel bad even responding to this nonsense thread but after we play Seton Hall could you please name me 68 teams who deserve to play in the NCAA Tourney ahead of us? Maybe you haven't been paying attention to any college basketball this year. If MU wins Saturday, we are a LOCK and fully deserve to be included in the top 68 teams in the country. What a bogus thread.
Agree.
If we lose Saturday....then lose the first game in the BET....let's just say 9-9 I don't think "easily" gets us in if we also lose the first BET game. We need to win Saturday and put any doubt out of reach.
So bottom line is if we win Sat. we're basically in no matter what goes on at BET?
Quote from: Doris Burkes Thong on March 02, 2011, 11:02:31 PM
So bottom line is if we win Sat. we're basically in no matter what goes on at BET?
Yes.
Quote from: Doris Burkes Thong on March 02, 2011, 11:02:31 PMSo bottom line is if we win Sat. we're basically in no matter what goes on at BET?
Win Saturday or win the first game of the BET, we're a lock. Lose both and we'll be sweating bullets on Selection Sunday, but should still be in as an 11 seed, though possibly in a play-in game.
Quote from: Doris Burkes Thong on March 02, 2011, 11:02:31 PM
So bottom line is if we win Sat. we're basically in no matter what goes on at BET?
Bottom line, nobody knows. Probably, but anyone that says we are a lock doesn't know for sure until Selection Sunday.
Quote from: MU PoopScoop on March 02, 2011, 10:52:32 PM
I feel bad even responding to this nonsense thread but after we play Seton Hall could you please name me 68 teams who deserve to play in the NCAA Tourney ahead of us? Maybe you haven't been paying attention to any college basketball this year. If MU wins Saturday, we are a LOCK and fully deserve to be included in the top 68 teams in the country. What a bogus thread.
Remember there's something like 12 teams who will definitely not deserve to make the tourney ahead of us who will because they will have won the post season tournament for their crappy conference.
Threads like this just piss me off. Maybe if you said "deserves to be on the bubble" I would be ok with that. But how can you say a team that has played our schedule and is still 9-9 in conference with 4 guys that played D1 minutes last year does not belong in the tournament.
Some fans seem like they think MU is a program with the caliber of Duke or UNC, based on how hard they are on Buzz and this team. With this schedule the season was never going to be pretty, much less a cake walk. Regardless of Gonzaga's ranking, this team does not have a bad loss and has beaten 4 teams that seem to be locks for the tournament and has played over half of the current top 25.
I get it that we don't like to lose, but come on.
Quote from: mikem91288 on March 03, 2011, 12:24:48 AM
Threads like this just piss me off. Maybe if you said "deserves to be on the bubble" I would be ok with that. But how can you say a team that has played our schedule and is still 9-9 in conference with 4 guys that played D1 minutes last year does not belong in the tournament.
Some fans seem like they think MU is a program with the caliber of Duke or UNC, based on how hard they are on Buzz and this team. With this schedule the season was never going to be pretty, much less a cake walk. Regardless of Gonzaga's ranking, this team does not have a bad loss and has beaten 4 teams that seem to be locks for the tournament and has played over half of the current top 25.
I get it that we don't like to lose, but come on.
We still have a chance to go 10-8.
"with 4 guys that played D1 minutes last year"
Our lack of experience won't and shouldn't be a factor in whether we make the tournament.
Quote from: mikem91288 on March 03, 2011, 12:24:48 AM
Threads like this just piss me off. Maybe if you said "deserves to be on the bubble" I would be ok with that. But how can you say a team that has played our schedule and is still 9-9 in conference with 4 guys that played D1 minutes last year does not belong in the tournament.
Some fans seem like they think MU is a program with the caliber of Duke or UNC, based on how hard they are on Buzz and this team. With this schedule the season was never going to be pretty, much less a cake walk. Regardless of Gonzaga's ranking, this team does not have a bad loss and has beaten 4 teams that seem to be locks for the tournament and has played over half of the current top 25.
I get it that we don't like to lose, but come on.
Do you think the committee cares one lick whether 4 guys played D1 minutes last year?
I don't think any fans here believe MU is of the Duke, UNC flavor except for those that honestly think a kid like Tokoto should choose us over one of those schools...they're just delusional fans, but they don't think we're at that level. They argue that kids will get more playing time at MU than sit on the bench at Duke or UNC.
The committee will decide soon enough. MU now needs to beat a Seton Hall team on the road, for their senior day to blunt any doubt. It's a shame that it has to come to this, but if MU loses at the Hall, imagine the pressure in that first round BET game. Better take care of business this Saturday to end any speculation.
We are what we are...the 11th best team in the BE and a bubble teams that is likely in with at least one more win. If we dont get in even with that, it would be hard for me to argue with the NIT.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 02, 2011, 09:07:09 PM
It's simple... MU is a bubble team and every bubble team has reasons to be in the tourney and reasons to be left out. It's a weak field so we have a shot. I have this weird feel that we are going to hear about MU getting jipped and all the analysts saying "If you could have closed that game out against Louisville, you would be in."
So now we must hang on the thought that it is a weak field this year and we have a shot. How about the thought that we are weak this year also, sliding in the wrong direction, and need to upgrade substantially for the future.
Willie, remember that every junior and senior on this year's team is a JUCO transfer, recruited by necessity because Crean's 2007 class was poor and we lost 2008's recruits when Crean left. The relative success of the last couple of years can mask the fact that Buzz has been patching together a roster. With three of Buzz's recruiting classes represented on the roster next year we'll get our first look at whether Buzz is building a Big East caliber program. I think he is.
Quote from: LittleMurs on March 03, 2011, 12:30:13 AM
We still have a chance to go 10-8.
"with 4 guys that played D1 minutes last year"
Our lack of experience won't and shouldn't be a factor in whether we make the tournament.
Yes, I meant to say 10-8. But, I am not saying the selection committee will look at our lack of experience I am saying people need to look at the whole picture when starting threads that say we don't deserve to make the tournament. My point is I do think we deserve to make the tournament, we have had a solid year with lots of new guys that have not been down this road before.
Quote from: mikem91288 on March 03, 2011, 08:57:08 AM
Yes, I meant to say 10-8. But, I am not saying the selection committee will look at our lack of experience I am saying people need to look at the whole picture when starting threads that say we don't deserve to make the tournament. My point is I do think we deserve to make the tournament, we have had a solid year with lots of new guys that have not been down this road before.
do you think 9-9 gets us in?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 03, 2011, 12:33:36 AM
Do you think the committee cares one lick whether 4 guys played D1 minutes last year?
I don't think any fans here believe MU is of the Duke, UNC flavor except for those that honestly think a kid like Tokoto should choose us over one of those schools...they're just delusional fans, but they don't think we're at that level. They argue that kids will get more playing time at MU than sit on the bench at Duke or UNC.
The committee will decide soon enough. MU now needs to beat a Seton Hall team on the road, for their senior day to blunt any doubt. It's a shame that it has to come to this, but if MU loses at the Hall, imagine the pressure in that first round BET game. Better take care of business this Saturday to end any speculation.
Chicos, mostly agree with you. I do not think the selection committee cares one lick about our lack of experience, that was not what I was saying. I am saying that people that start threads saying we are not a tournament team are wrong, because we are! One of the toughest schedules in the nation, with 4 guys that played last year. The FANS need to remember this and realize we have no bad losses.
As for the Duke UNC comment. I am sick of hearing people say we suck. After 3 losses people were calling for Buzz to leave (not necessarily on this board, but I go to school here and hear all the craziness). Now all the talk about how we are a terrible team was back last night. I stand behind my statement that with these guys and this schedule and this conference. I am happy with 10-8 and controlling our own destiny here.
Jduquaine....I feel you should be aware that some as$hole is signing your name to stupid posts.
Quote from: mikem91288 on March 03, 2011, 09:02:53 AM
Chicos, mostly agree with you. I do not think the selection committee cares one lick about our lack of experience, that was not what I was saying. I am saying that people that start threads saying we are not a tournament team are wrong, because we are! One of the toughest schedules in the nation, with 4 guys that played last year. The FANS need to remember this and realize we have no bad losses.
As for the Duke UNC comment. I am sick of hearing people say we suck. After 3 losses people were calling for Buzz to leave (not necessarily on this board, but I go to school here and hear all the craziness). Now all the talk about how we are a terrible team was back last night. I stand behind my statement that with these guys and this schedule and this conference. I am happy with 10-8 and controlling our own destiny here.
You're sounding like a voice of reason in the wilderness to me. People forget that after Crean's poor 2007 class and the school losing the 2008 class when Crean left, Buzz had to patch a team together with JUCOs; ALL the seniors AND juniors on this year's team are JUCOs. Next year, Buzz gets to work with three classes he recruited as freshmen. That should give everyone a better idea of Buzz's value. Although I do understand the concerns of those who think we can do better in a coach. I mean Jerry Wainwright, formerly of DePaul, is available, no?
I have grown weary of watching other teams run plays to free up their hot shooter while we dribble and pass around the perimeter until time gets critical. I don't see any adjustments. We have the talent but teams realise that if they pack in the zone we will frustrate ourselves
Quote from: elephantraker on March 03, 2011, 09:46:05 AM
I have grown weary of watching other teams run plays to free up their hot shooter while we dribble and pass around the perimeter until time gets critical. I don't see any adjustments. We have the talent but teams realise that if they pack in the zone we will frustrate ourselves
All that running around the perimeter must be accomplishing something, Pomeroy has us at third in the BE (and 14th in the country) on offense.
Getting back to the topic...
I kinda felt that MU doesn't deserve to be in after the game. But then I watched College Basketball Final and I saw them talking about tournement hopes for Colorado, Minnesota, Memphis, and Maryland. If those team were ("were is the operative word) still in the discussion for the Big Dance, we are definitely more worthy.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 03, 2011, 12:58:27 PM
Getting back to the topic...
I kinda felt that MU doesn't deserve to be in after the game. But then I watched College Basketball Final and I saw them talking about tournement hopes for Colorado, Minnesota, Memphis, and Maryland. If those team were ("were is the operative word) still in the discussion for the Big Dance, we are definitely more worthy.
If Minnesota gets in at 7-11 in the Big 10 (if they beat PSU) ahead of us then I'll be pissed.
Quote from: ErickJD08 on March 03, 2011, 12:58:27 PMGetting back to the topic...
I kinda felt that MU doesn't deserve to be in after the game. But then I watched College Basketball Final and I saw them talking about tournement hopes for Colorado, Minnesota, Memphis, and Maryland. If those team were ("were is the operative word) still in the discussion for the Big Dance, we are definitely more worthy.
Exactly what I've been trying to say. Even with our high number of total losses, the bubble is ungodly soft. We have 4 top 25 RPI wins. We don't have any losses outside the top 50 RPI. And even with our projected RPI being around 53, that's still much better than teams like Alabama (87), Baylor (78), Richmond (66), Michigan (61), Gonzaga (67), and Colorado (79) that are said to be sitting on the bubble. The reason no one is talking about us being on the bubble is because the teams that are on the bubble are flat-out bad. The teams that are looking like 11 and 12 seeds simply don't have credentials that would make the tournament in years past. But this isn't years past, this is 2011.
Our resume is already good enough, and when teams like Minnesota and Baylor can be in the argument with sub-.500 conference records, and teams like Washington State and Tennessee can be right there with .500 records in those god-awful conferences, than how on God's green earth can so many people think that we are out with a .500 record in the unquestioned best conference in the country?
If we lose to Seton Hall on the road, we're still in. If we lose to USF or even DePaul in the Big East tourney, we're still in. All the doubters should actually
look at the resumes of the teams that aren't just behind us, but so far back that they aren't even choking on our exhaust because it already cleared before they got this far and yet are
still making it in to the tournament. THE BUBBLE IS SOFT! WE ARE GOING TO THE NCAAS! DEAL WITH IT!
Quote from: DiaperDandy on March 02, 2011, 09:03:56 PM
They need two more wins to feel good on selection Sunday. Win at Seton Hall and win one in the big east tourney.
That was my feeling before the Cincy loss. Now I am thinking differently as I do not believe the Big East will get 11 bids. I think they need two wins to remain on the bubble and three wins to get in for sure.
Quote from: bilsu on March 03, 2011, 03:24:41 PMThat was my feeling before the Cincy loss. Now I am thinking differently as I do not believe the Big East will get 11 bids. I think they need two wins to remain on the bubble and three wins to get in for sure.
*Sigh*
I feel like I'm shouting into a vacuum. Can someone who thinks we are on the outside looking in please, please, please give me an explanation as to why they believe that in which they actually explain which teams have resumes that are better than Marquette's? It's so easy to say "it won't happen" just because being a negative nancy is fashionable, but I have yet to see one person back up the argument with "we won't get in because of x, y, and z". The best anyone can come up with is the Selection Committee doesn't want to put 11 Big East teams in.
.500 or worse teams from the Big 12, PAC-10, SEC, and Big Ten are either projected in or on the bubble. All of those teams in question have at least one sub-100 RPI loss, and in most cases 2-4 of them. None of those teams have the number of top-25 RPI wins that we do. Bottom line, they do not have our resume.
Is it really too much to ask that someone give a
REAL explanation instead of just "well, I don't think we'll get in because I'm a mopey moe after the Cincinnati loss"?
As it is every year...if they deserve to get in, they will more than likley get in. If they don't they more than likely will not. You worthiness as always, is 100% relative to the rest of the teams around you, and has little to do with how good any individual thinks they are, or should be. When all is said and done will they be one of the that earns an at-large bid? Yes, i think they probably will.
If you think they are not good enough to get in, you need to list 68 teams that are clearly better than they are (of course, that's impossible since there are still dozens if not hundreds of games to be played before selections are made.).
After the UConn game, it was my belief that MU had to win one of its remaining 3 (or more) remaining games to avoid finishing losing 3 in a row to secure their spot. The fact that they lost last night does not change that. One more win, no matter where it comes, and I believe the only question on selection Sunday will be as to location and the number next to their name.
Quote from: brewcity77 on March 03, 2011, 03:31:12 PM
*Sigh*
I feel like I'm shouting into a vacuum. Can someone who thinks we are on the outside looking in please, please, please give me an explanation as to why they believe that in which they actually explain which teams have resumes that are better than Marquette's? It's so easy to say "it won't happen" just because being a negative nancy is fashionable, but I have yet to see one person back up the argument with "we won't get in because of x, y, and z". The best anyone can come up with is the Selection Committee doesn't want to put 11 Big East teams in.
.500 or worse teams from the Big 12, PAC-10, SEC, and Big Ten are either projected in or on the bubble. All of those teams in question have at least one sub-100 RPI loss, and in most cases 2-4 of them. None of those teams have the number of top-25 RPI wins that we do. Bottom line, they do not have our resume.
Is it really too much to ask that someone give a REAL explanation instead of just "well, I don't think we'll get in because I'm a mopey moe after the Cincinnati loss"?
+1
I'd like to see some reasons as well.
I feel like we need to win @SHU, and at least one in the BET...so that we have some momentum going into the tournament, not to qualify for it.
This is exactly my point, read the Subject line: "Honestly Marq doesn't deserve to be in the NCAA Tourney" I'm not saying they wont, the reason they will be in is because of the soft bubble this year. Hence my subject line "DOESN'T DESERVE" If we need to hang our hat on the fact that other teams are horrible so we will make the tournament well thats a pathetic way to go about it.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 02, 2011, 09:00:36 PM
Anybody who thinks different is oblivious to the facts. I don't want to hear "Oh we'll we lost to only good teams, etc, etc" I'm as big of a fan as they come, but we all need to be realistic.
What other bubble teams are more worthy? Do any have more good wins than MU does?
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 03, 2011, 06:01:35 PMThis is exactly my point, read the Subject line: "Honestly Marq doesn't deserve to be in the NCAA Tourney" I'm not saying they wont, the reason they will be in is because of the soft bubble this year. Hence my subject line "DOESN'T DESERVE" If we need to hang our hat on the fact that other teams are horrible so we will make the tournament well thats a pathetic way to go about it.
It's called reality, bud. Listen, if it was a field of 64, we'd be closer to the bubble, but still on the inside. If it was a field of 48, we'd probably be out, barring getting to the Big East tournament final. If it was a field of 32, we'd be out. But it's not. It's a field of 68. It's a soft bubble. And whether you like it or not, there will be 68 teams that the Selection Committee determines have done enough to DESERVE to make the tournament. 31 will go to conference champions. 37 will go to at-large teams. And right now, we are well within the range of at-large teams to get in.
I repeat, 4 wins over RPI top 25 teams. No losses to sub-50 RPI teams. A projected RPI of 53. A projected SOS of 30. It's good enough to get in most years, and this year will be no exception.
So I repeat. We are going to the NCAAs. Deal with it. I don't see why us going to the tournament is so upsetting to people. Isn't it supposed to be a good thing?
It's called reality, bud. Listen, if it was a field of 64, we'd be closer to the bubble, but still on the inside. If it was a field of 48, we'd probably be out, barring getting to the Big East tournament final. If it was a field of 32, we'd be out. But it's not. It's a field of 68. It's a soft bubble. And whether you like it or not, there will be 68 teams that the Selection Committee determines have done enough to DESERVE to make the tournament. 31 will go to conference champions. 37 will go to at-large teams. And right now, we are well within the range of at-large teams to get in.
I repeat, 4 wins over RPI top 25 teams. No losses to sub-50 RPI teams. A projected RPI of 53. A projected SOS of 30. It's good enough to get in most years, and this year will be no exception.
So I repeat. We are going to the NCAAs. Deal with it. I don't see why us going to the tournament is so upsetting to people. Isn't it supposed to be a good thing?
I guess some people in this world are satisfied with just making the cut, or getting bounced out early in a first round.... Lol, That's something really to be proud of! Whooo Rah!!
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 03, 2011, 06:26:55 PM
I guess some people in this world are satisfied with just making the cut, or getting bounced out early in a first round.... Lol, That's something really to be proud of! Whooo Rah!!
You can't win without a ticket.
Cups half full right?!
Quote from: brewcity77 on March 03, 2011, 06:21:34 PM
So I repeat. We are going to the NCAAs. Deal with it. I don't see why us going to the tournament is so upsetting to people. Isn't it supposed to be a good thing?
It's a great thing....but I'm not as 100% certain as you are that we're lock city, especially if we lose on Saturday. Projected RPI is now 60.1 and that's assuming a win. A loss pushes it to 66...that is UGLY FUGLY territory.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 03, 2011, 06:26:55 PMI guess some people in this world are satisfied with just making the cut, or getting bounced out early in a first round.... Lol, That's something really to be proud of! Whooo Rah!!
First of all, quote button. Not a difficult concept. It's in the top right corner of all the posts. Second, if you follow this team and see who they've lost to and the margins, you know that they can play with anyone on any given night. If we get a 10 or 11 seed, who out there really scares you? Utah State? George Mason? Xavier? Missouri? Texas A&M? I think we would have a chance of beating any of those teams. And if we did win, what about the second round? Would a Duke, BYU, San Diego State, or North Carolina provide an insurmountable challenge? I don't think so, considering we've beaten teams like Notre Dame, Syracuse, and Connecticut that are in line for similar seeds.
Quite simply, you can't do anything in March if you don't get into the tournament. And I, for one, am not willing to puss out as a fan and write off our chances just because we lost one game. Teams in the Big East know us. They know how to play us. That won't be the case with everyone else we see. I've said before, I could just as easily see us going to the Elite 8 as I could see us going out in the first round. But I do know that if we don't make the cut, we don't have the chance to do either. I'd rather get in and have the chance than miss out and write off the season.
If you don't want to cheer for the team because they've let you down, fine. Then just go away. My guess is the players don't want fans like you anyway. But if you want to support them through thick and thin and earn the right to enjoy the highs and lows right along with them, then man up and accept that not everything in life is sunshine and roses.
You truly are dumb! No crap we can beat anyone of those teams, hell any team can win on any given day!! The fact is this, the reason Marquette is going to be in the tourney is because of a weak bubble. And I just stated that I prefer not to get in that way. No big deal guy, don't crap yourself. I'm still a fan always will be, but it's still disappointing to some people!
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 03, 2011, 06:40:09 PMYou truly are dumb! No crap we can beat anyone of those teams, hell any team can win on any given day!! The fact is this, the reason Marquette is going to be in the tourney is because of a weak bubble. And I just stated that I prefer not to get in that way. No big deal guy, don't crap yourself. I'm still a fan always will be, but it's still disappointing to some people!
:D
Spoken like a kid. So if Marquette gets an 11-seed, knocks off Xavier in the first round and BYU in the second, then ends up grinding out a rematch with the 3-seed Syracuse before falling in another tough contested matchup with 1-seed Duke in the Elite 8 you'll be complaining about how we got in? Perspective, son, perspective. Trust me, in life you'll find you're better off playing with and adjusting to the hand you're dealt than crying about the color of the cards in the deck.
Yet again!!.....You let me know when Marquette does that hoss! Is Marquette all of a sudden going to start winning all of these games?! Let me know when they get out of the second round bossman!
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 03, 2011, 06:26:55 PM
I guess some people in this world are satisfied with just making the cut, or getting bounced out early in a first round.... Lol, That's something really to be proud of! Whooo Rah!!
I'm not doing cartwheels, but if we get in with a team that was forced to go totally JUCO in its junior and senior classes because they were empty I think it's a solid accomplishment. They'll be 277 other D1 teams who would trade places.
Quote from: JDuquaine on March 03, 2011, 06:45:17 PMYet again!!.....You let me know when Marquette does that hoss! Is Marquette all of a sudden going to start winning all of these games?! Let me know when they get out of the second round bossman!
LOL
Seriously, you have me rolling. You're better off just quitting while you're not too far behind.
I never said it's guaranteed, I gave a hypothetical. Maybe we do, maybe we don't. I'd rather have the chance to cheer for this team a few more times than bang my head against the wall because I don't like the options the Selection Committee will be presented with. Either way, I'd just let this one go. The more you post, the worse you will look.
We agree to disagree sir... but I do hope your right!
GO MARQUETTE!
Quote from: brewcity77 on March 03, 2011, 03:31:12 PM
*Sigh*
I feel like I'm shouting into a vacuum. Can someone who thinks we are on the outside looking in please, please, please give me an explanation as to why they believe that in which they actually explain which teams have resumes that are better than Marquette's? It's so easy to say "it won't happen" just because being a negative nancy is fashionable, but I have yet to see one person back up the argument with "we won't get in because of x, y, and z". The best anyone can come up with is the Selection Committee doesn't want to put 11 Big East teams in.
.500 or worse teams from the Big 12, PAC-10, SEC, and Big Ten are either projected in or on the bubble. All of those teams in question have at least one sub-100 RPI loss, and in most cases 2-4 of them. None of those teams have the number of top-25 RPI wins that we do. Bottom line, they do not have our resume.
Is it really too much to ask that someone give a REAL explanation instead of just "well, I don't think we'll get in because I'm a mopey moe after the Cincinnati loss"?
I completely understand what you are saying but let me say this. There is no way that the committee wants to put 11 Big East teams in this tournament regardless of the resume of those teams, I think that MU actually bailed them out last night. I am not arguing that they do not deserve to get in over the likes of Minnesota, Michigan, etc.. I just think that they are caught up in a numbers game. I know that the NCAA always says that the they don't pay attention to how many teams from each conference are in the tournament but do you really believe that?
I cannot imagine getting inside the heads of the people who do this however, even though nearly every prognosticator has had 11 BE teams in the tournament, I cannot imagine them actually doing it. I hope they do, but I'm not hopeful.
In past years, I think that may have cost the conference a 9th bid. This year I think is different. The difference between the 9th Big East team in past years has been close to the resumes of teams 64 and 65, meaning it may have been a numbers game or it
may have been a legit bid on merit. This year that doesn't exist. Our resume compares favorably to most projected 8 & 9 seeds. When you consider the drek that may get in from other conferences that are clearly inferior, denying a .500 Big East team would be ludicrous. If we are snubbed, the ONLY possible explanation will be that they didn't want 11 teams in. It's never been this blatant before. And if there's already 10 teams that are in, is the 11th really that big of a jump?
On the "not wanting to put 11 in" idea, this article, while long, really kind of shows that the committee doesn't really have time to evaluate which conference a team is part of (or keep track of how many are in).
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/andy_staples/02/21/mock.tournament.selection/index.html
Quote from: Muhoops85 on March 03, 2011, 06:53:16 PM
I completely understand what you are saying but let me say this. There is no way that the committee wants to put 11 Big East teams in this tournament regardless of the resume of those teams, I think that MU actually bailed them out last night. I am not arguing that they do not deserve to get in over the likes of Minnesota, Michigan, etc.. I just think that they are caught up in a numbers game. I know that the NCAA always says that the they don't pay attention to how many teams from each conference are in the tournament but do you really believe that?
I cannot imagine getting inside the heads of the people who do this however, even though nearly every prognosticator has had 11 BE teams in the tournament, I cannot imagine them actually doing it. I hope they do, but I'm not hopeful.
My response to this is if Marquette were to have won last night, would Cinci have been left out? Under your logic, the answer to that question would be yes. And the obvious answer to someone on the outside looking in is no. We're all disappointed, and rightfully so. But, if we win on Saturday, and win our first BEAST tourney game (assuming 9-11 seed), we'll be just fine.
Quote from: JamilJaeJamailJrJuan on March 03, 2011, 08:28:37 PM
My response to this is if Marquette were to have won last night, would Cinci have been left out? Under your logic, the answer to that question would be yes. And the obvious answer to someone on the outside looking in is no. We're all disappointed, and rightfully so. But, if we win on Saturday, and win our first BEAST tourney game (assuming 9-11 seed), we'll be just fine.
Sure, but if MU loses Saturday, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see MU left out of the tourney.
Too many people are taking a bid for granted.
Quote from: willie wampum on March 03, 2011, 08:56:12 PMSure, but if MU loses Saturday, I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see MU left out of the tourney.
Too many people are taking a bid for granted.
And too many people haven't actually looked at how soft the bubble is, and how good 9-9 in the Big East is compared to some of the conference records of teams projected in from crap conferences. [/shoutingintovacuum]
Quote from: Lennys Tap on March 03, 2011, 06:47:46 PM
I'm not doing cartwheels, but if we get in with a team that was forced to go totally JUCO in its junior and senior classes because they were empty I think it's a solid accomplishment.
I made this same comment at the game the other night. It is a minor miracle that MU is as good as they are right now given the depleted roster Buzz was left with after season 1. In a very short period of time, he was able to cobble together a team that, while nothing special, is competitive with any team in the country.