This team is young. We expected incidents like this last year, and instead ended up getting them this year. Last year we had three senior starters, along with an experienced role-player and a breakout transfer. This year, there's really only one proven senior starter (sorry Dwight), and a lot of guys adjusting to new roles or D1 basketball period. We also have a coach who is young and will learn from this as well.
Here are some positives from our first two weeks:
- We took away 5 wins from a stretch of 7 games in 14 days. Now, the team finally gets to rest a bit.
- DJO finally found his stroke. Despite his poor start, he's averaging 14.4 ppg through 7 games and has hit double-digits in all but one game.
- Our two losses came against the #1 and #18 teams in the country by a combined 8 points. It'd be better to have them, but they aren't the kind of losses that count against you come Selection Sunday.
- Our much-hyped freshman guard is just as good as advertised defensively and shows signs of being a budding star.
- Our completely unhyped freshman center is much better than expected offensively and shows signs of being a budding star.
- Jimmy Butler is still Jimmy F'in Butler, scoring double figures every game and looking ready to be our senior leader.
Okay...hopefully that makes some of us Negative Nancy's feel better.
I agree man, wish everyone could understand. I'm optimistic just cause I love the team so much.
I've tried my best to be optimistic with this team but it has really really hard. They're small and they can't shoot. That's a bad combination. On the other hand, they play their butts off and find a way to be in every game, but when it comes down to it, they still can't shoot, and their lack of size and inability to hit a an open jump shot will kill them. However, these Buzz coached teams have a nack for proving people wrong, so there is always a chance.
Quote from: brewcity77 on November 27, 2010, 11:50:40 PM
This team is young. We expected incidents like this last year, and instead ended up getting them this year. Last year we had three senior starters, along with an experienced role-player and a breakout transfer. This year, there's really only one proven senior starter (sorry Dwight), and a lot of guys adjusting to new roles or D1 basketball period. We also have a coach who is young and will learn from this as well.
Here are some positives from our first two weeks:
- We took away 5 wins from a stretch of 7 games in 14 days. Now, the team finally gets to rest a bit.
- DJO finally found his stroke. Despite his poor start, he's averaging 14.4 ppg through 7 games and has hit double-digits in all but one game.
- Our two losses came against the #1 and #18 teams in the country by a combined 8 points. It'd be better to have them, but they aren't the kind of losses that count against you come Selection Sunday.
- Our much-hyped freshman guard is just as good as advertised defensively and shows signs of being a budding star.
- Our completely unhyped freshman center is much better than expected offensively and shows signs of being a budding star.
- Jimmy Butler is still Jimmy F'in Butler, scoring double figures every game and looking ready to be our senior leader.
Okay...hopefully that makes some of us Negative Nancy's feel better.
What freshman guard shows signs of being a "budding star?" Can't be Blue, since he is far below average offensively.
Gardner is better than expected offensively, but he can't defend, jump or box-out to get a rebound, so he's far from a budding star.
And Jimmy F'in Butler showed no signs of wanting to be a senior leader tonight. He was MIA for most of the game. MU doesn't have many scorers. In fact, they only have two in Butler and DJO, so Butler better bring the effort and leadership every game.
Quote from: flash on November 28, 2010, 12:44:11 AM
I've tried my best to be optimistic with this team but it has really really hard. They're small and they can't shoot. That's a bad combination. On the other hand, they play their butts off and find a way to be in every game, but when it comes down to it, they still can't shoot, and their lack of size and inability to hit a an open jump shot will kill them. However, these Buzz coached teams have a nack for proving people wrong, so there is always a chance.
Hopefully another poster won't threaten to punch you in the face (multiple times) over your comments.
Why do you hate Marquette?
Each of the last five years the boards have freaked out about our preseason play, yet every year the team wins 10+ conference games and makes the tournament.
Calm down guys.
Quote from: nomorebuycks on November 28, 2010, 01:01:07 AMWhat freshman guard shows signs of being a "budding star?" Can't be Blue, since he is far below average offensively.
Yeah, it can be. Slashes to the rack well, defends like a beast, and clearly the sky's the limit from an athletic perspective. If you haven't seen star potential in him over the past two weeks, you must be blind.
Quote from: nomorebuycks on November 28, 2010, 01:01:07 AMGardner is better than expected offensively, but he can't defend, jump or box-out to get a rebound, so he's far from a budding star.
Every time he's played 10+ minutes, he's scored 10+ points. That's not just better than expected, that's way, way, way above expectations. He's also averaging 3.2 boards per game, which isn't great, but not bad considering he's averaging 10 minutes a game. We know he still needs work in the weight room, and his defense definitely needs work, but he's got 6 games under his belt. Again, the scoring alone shows his potential. You act as though a guy not looking like first team All-Big East after two weeks makes them a slouch.
Quote from: nomorebuycks on November 28, 2010, 01:01:07 AMAnd Jimmy F'in Butler showed no signs of wanting to be a senior leader tonight. He was MIA for most of the game. MU doesn't have many scorers. In fact, they only have two in Butler and DJO, so Butler better bring the effort and leadership every game.
Well, sinking 7 of 8 from the line was stepping up. The free throws he hit with 26 seconds to play were stone cold, and desperately needed to keep UW-M from completing the comeback. Despite being MIA, he still finished with 13 points. And saying we only have two scorers is simply ignorant of this team. We have four players (Butler, DJO, Crowder, Buycks) averaging in double figures, and Gardner would be if not for two games where he scarcely played due to injury, and he's still averaging an impressive 8.0 ppg in 10.0 mpg. If we can get that kind of contribution from those five guys, along with the occasional double-figure performance from guys like Blue, Otule, Williams (all of whom have done it once this year already) then we should be okay from a scoring perspective.
i also believe Otule has played extremely well...and one who doesnt dont remeber his the last two years. offensively he has really improved, blocks shots and just needs to improve his rebounding and hands now. i think he will be a beast the next two years!
Quote from: brewcity77 on November 28, 2010, 02:11:12 AM
Yeah, it can be. Slashes to the rack well, defends like a beast, and clearly the sky's the limit from an athletic perspective. If you haven't seen star potential in him over the past two weeks, you must be blind.
Absolutely. If you dont see star potential in Blue at this point I am not sure that you are watching the same player....
Thank you for this post.
This team reminds me a lot of the 2006-2007 team the first year we played without Novak. We barely beat a bad Idaho St. team (in OT at home), needed a DJames miracle at a bad Valpo to win at the buzzer, lost to a bad North Dakota St. team at home right after Thanksgiving, then (GASP!) lost to Wisconsin at home. That team went on to go 10-6 in conference, and had McNeal not gone down late, I think we would have made some noise in the tournament.
Get some perspective people.
Quote from: Ready2Fly on November 28, 2010, 08:55:06 AM
Thank you for this post.
This team reminds me a lot of the 2006-2007 team the first year we played without Novak. We barely beat a bad Idaho St. team (in OT at home), needed a DJames miracle at a bad Valpo to win at the buzzer, lost to a bad North Dakota St. team at home right after Thanksgiving, then (GASP!) lost to Wisconsin at home. That team went on to go 10-6 in conference, and had McNeal not gone down late, I think we would have made some noise in the tournament.
Get some perspective people.
Thanks for the perspective lecture, but you left out a blowout win over Texas Tech, and a 10 point win over Duke.
That's the difference with this season. Had they won the Gonzaga game, I think the tone would be different.
Quote from: MUfan12 on November 28, 2010, 09:03:58 AM
Thanks for the perspective lecture, but you left out a blowout win over Texas Tech, and a 10 point win over Duke.
That's the difference with this season. Had they won the Gonzaga game, I think the tone would be different.
Texas Tech wasn't really very good (70th Kenpom) and that Duke team wasn't nearly as good as this year's version. So I think it's a really good comparison to the early season struggles of a team losing its senior star (Novak and Lazar). We'll be more than fine. We definitely have things to work on, but this is an NCAA tournament team for sure.
Quote from: flash on November 28, 2010, 12:44:11 AM
I've tried my best to be optimistic with this team but it has really really hard. They're small and they can't shoot. That's a bad combination. On the other hand, they play their butts off and find a way to be in every game, but when it comes down to it, they still can't shoot, and their lack of size and inability to hit a an open jump shot will kill them. However, these Buzz coached teams have a nack for proving people wrong, so there is always a chance.
Agreed. The more you watch them play the more you realize expectations among the fans might be a little high.
Match-ups determine outcomes. A team's make-up is a fragile thing. Joe Fulce, a glue guy, goes down at the same time as Mr. Offense (1 point per minute), the Ox. Down goes our backline depth. Why does it impact us:
- Joe led MU in defensive rebounding %--35.5% vs. Crowder's 20.8%
- Ox led us in offensive rebounding %--18.8% vs. Crowder's 9.9%
Neither played big minutes but both are incredibly efficient when they enter. Look how Ox completely changed the Bucknell and Duke games.
Now we have Otule, our defensive stopper with his swats, trying to be our offensive block threat. With Joe out, Buzz decides to go much smaller....even going with four guards to protect our perimeter defense. Result: we get hammered on the offensive boards two straight games, although we were even with Duke, a much taller team, on this stat. Then, on top of it, Buzz is stilll trying to figure out his guard rotations which are unsettled.
Quote from: chren21 on November 28, 2010, 08:41:15 AM
Absolutely. If you dont see star potential in Blue at this point I am not sure that you are watching the same player....
I don't see a guy who has a very good skill set offensively. I hope you're right and he's a superstar in waiting.
Quote from: nomorebuycks on November 28, 2010, 10:50:15 AM
I don't see a guy who has a very good skill set offensively.
So you haven't seen him slash to the basket without anyone touching him? Or how his body control in the air gets him in position while avoiding charges? Or his ability to find an open jumper?
Sure his shot needs some work and he needs to finish with a bit more aggression, but he's already there athletically.
Are you sure you've been watching Marquette games?
Quote from: Ready2Fly on November 28, 2010, 08:55:06 AM
Thank you for this post.
This team reminds me a lot of the 2006-2007 team the first year we played without Novak. We barely beat a bad Idaho St. team (in OT at home), needed a DJames miracle at a bad Valpo to win at the buzzer, lost to a bad North Dakota St. team at home right after Thanksgiving, then (GASP!) lost to Wisconsin at home. That team went on to go 10-6 in conference, and had McNeal not gone down late, I think we would have made some noise in the tournament.
Get some perspective people.
Actually that was a good North Dakota State team that went 20-8, beat Wisconsin at Wisconsin the year prior and lost to Kansas State the same year they beat us by 2 points. They defeated UWGB by double digits, Princeton, among others that year. They were hardly a "bad North Dakota State team".
That team (MU) also had a solid PG at the helm which we don't really have right now. I don't think the comparison is apt.
The way I see it is that this team has won 5 games, lost two to the #1 defending champions by 5, and the #18 team int he country, by 3. We have really not played great basketball in any of these games.
So, I do not think we will get worse. It's possible, but I just don't see that. We will improve. DJO and Butler will contineu to contribute, Vander will get his offensive game in line, JC will become a better point with experience (he practically has none), Crowder will improve on rebounds as he learsn the D1 game, Otule and Gardner have gotton better and should continue, and the rest is up in the air: Buycks? Smith? Jones? Williams? Can any of these guys step up and contribute in a meaningful way? If so, we have more options. Somehow, this team needs to learn how to box out and rebound or it will be even tougher in the BEast.
Som I think we will get better, play better, and win some tough ones. We cannot afford to lose any of the ones we should win, tho.
Go Marquette!!
Quote from: Canadian Dimes on November 28, 2010, 08:30:14 AM
i also believe Otule has played extremely well...and one who doesnt dont remeber his the last two years. offensively he has really improved, blocks shots and just needs to improve his rebounding and hands now. i think he will be a beast the next two years!
I'm with you on this one. He's not perfect but he does provide a decent interior defensive presence for us that we haven't had since Robert Jackson. He's also shown unexpected (by me at least) proficiency on the offensive end IF he has established good position and is calling for the ball. Catching and controlling the ball in traffic is his obvious weakness...if he can just improve that aspect of his game I think he'd make us fans very happy.
It's fun to see two post players with actual post moves as well as otule's blocks. Obviously both guys have limitations, but it's refreshing. Now distributing them the ball efficiently is another thing.
and MU is still 38 - 0 versus UW-M
Coudagon also is showing signs, which is positive. I do think, as the year goes on, Blue and Junior need to contribute more on the offensive end with some consistency in the outside shot. Blue's shot looks different than it did in high school...maybe the transition to D-1, with all the changes in his physical makeup due to strength, conditioning and overall demands of the program have something to do with it. I do like the way he drives to the hoop and once he finds his jumper...look out.
It is what it is....a very young team with liabilities and potential. A lot ot be excited about and things that will drive the faithful to another round. Enjoy watching these kids grow up into whatever the future brings. They are good kids with a lot of talent...think of where they will be a year or two from now.
nomorebuycks is a troll. I'm calling it now. Ignore him.
The thing about this Marquette team, and last year's team to be honest, is that they are a great equalizing force. They play pretty much the exact same against Duke as they do against South Dakota.
This makes for interesting games knowing that we can truly play with the big boys, but we will likely be in a dogfight against lower teams as well. We can play Duke to a three point nailbiter and then turn around and play UWM to the exact same three point margin. I really expect to see this all season long
Quote from: SacWarrior on November 28, 2010, 09:33:34 PM
The thing about this Marquette team, and last year's team to be honest, is that they are a great equalizing force. They play pretty much the exact same against Duke as they do against South Dakota.
This makes for interesting games knowing that we can truly play with the big boys, but we will likely be in a dogfight against lower teams as well. We can play Duke to a three point nailbiter and then turn around and play UWM to the exact same three point margin. I really expect to see this all season long
+1
This is why we never get blown out, but have allowed lesser teams to play close to us as well. I expect a lot of close games once again this year.
Quote from: SacWarrior on November 28, 2010, 09:33:34 PM
The thing about this Marquette team, and last year's team to be honest, is that they are a great equalizing force. They play pretty much the exact same against Duke as they do against South Dakota.
This makes for interesting games knowing that we can truly play with the big boys, but we will likely be in a dogfight against lower teams as well. We can play Duke to a three point nailbiter and then turn around and play UWM to the exact same three point margin. I really expect to see this all season long
I agree with your explanation but don't think that counts as playing "pretty much the exact same" against whatever opponent. The reality seems to be that we play at the level of our opponent. We can step it up and hold our own against Duke, but then we turn around and allow UWM to be in the game when it's on the line.
Makes for an exciting, anxiety-causing rollercoaster ride. Count me in for the fun!
Quote from: 79Warrior on November 28, 2010, 10:07:28 AM
Agreed. The more you watch them play the more you realize expectations among the fans might be a little high.
Perhaps. (IMO you could say that about EVERY team early in the season when they are playing some of these smaller schools)
But there REALLY is a lot to be excited about for MU basketball.