If Buzz fails to sign one of the hot 100's he is currently in on, and we sign Trey MacDonald, is that enough? Give Singleton the last schollie, and with Wilson being eligible, 5 guards, 3 bigs, 5 wings. Assuming no transfers and normal progressions, DJO, Blue, Junior, Reggie, Singleton, Wilson, Anderson, Crowder, Jones, EWill, COT, Gardner and MacDonald as the big man project looks very deep and very balanced. The big downside I see is having only a 2 man freshman class, but Buzz has shown he can balance classes when he needs to.
Hopefully we get Shaw, no inside info just wishful thinking and I would not be surprised if the other schollie goes to a JC or prep we haven't heard much about. I was so optimistic back in May with Dawson and some of the others but the luxury we have this year is we don't have to have a top 25 class based on this year's class.
Quote from: tower912 on October 13, 2010, 06:38:18 PM
If Buzz fails to sign one of the hot 100's he is currently in on, and we sign Trey MacDonald, is that enough? Give Singleton the last schollie, and with Wilson being eligible, 5 guards, 3 bigs, 5 wings. Assuming no transfers and normal progressions, DJO, Blue, Junior, Reggie, Singleton, Wilson, Anderson, Crowder, Jones, EWill, COT, Gardner and MacDonald as the big man project looks very deep and very balanced. The big downside I see is having only a 2 man freshman class, but Buzz has shown he can balance classes when he needs to.
Who do you include in that group?
Harrison and Faust are out. Hood is likely out. Does that only leave Shaw or are there others?
We're still in on Rivals #84 Jarion Henry, a 6'8" small forward from Texas that is expected to attend our Madness. That would leave us with three guys that all project at forward if we can land either Shaw or McDonald, but in the long run would give us some nice length.
If it's just McDonald and Singleton, I'll admit I'd be a bit disappointed. Honestly, if it ends up as just one more guy and we still have an open schollie, my guess is we'll end up adding a Juco player in the Spring period, someone nobody has heard of yet. It's possible that Singleton gets it, but I'd say right now unlikely at best.
Considering we used to be pretty happy at Marquette getting just 1 Top 100 kid in a class, and then a couple of 3-stars...yes, I'd say I'd be satisfied. Particularily when measured against what the last 2 recruiting classes have brought and the complexion of the roster being very talented, deep, and young.
Buzz will most likely know the reason(s) why he lost out on some of these kids - and I'm sure the biggest (not saying only) but a huge reason was the existing talent on the roster. We are NOT a Duke, North Carolina, Kentucky or Kansas - where just by our name alone, Top 100 kids want to come...regardless of how much depth is at their position.
That said, I see Buzz taking us on a Sweet 16 run this year, possibly a Final Four run in 2011-2012..and he'll have sent Jimmy Butler and DJO to the NBA at by that time. Vander, Jamail Jones, Jamil Wilson, Reggie Smith, Davante Gardner will be juniors..Erik Williams a senior...and Juan Anderson as sophomore...perhaps that team can make another deep run..possible Final Four.
From there..assuming Buzz is true to his word and will stay as long as "they'll have me," Top 100 kids will soon want to flock to MU..and we will be looked at as an ELITE type of program..like some of the above.
Said it before, I sincerely hope Singleton remains a walk-on.
Quote from: The Golden Avalanche on October 13, 2010, 07:06:48 PM
Who do you include in that group?
Harrison and Faust are out. Hood is likely out. Does that only leave Shaw or are there others?
No reason for the negativity regarding Hood. We just survived a cutdown earlier this week, and are one of three he is still considering. No leader at this point among us, Louisville, and FSU. We'll see.
If anyone was at the pro-am it was clear that Singleton can ball. I understand defense was not a priority at this event; however I liked what I saw.
Trey McDonald would be a big pick up for Buzz. I would be very happy to get him.
Why in would Buzz give a scolie to Singleton? The kid is in the bag...use the scholie he aint goin anywhere.
Quote from: Canadian Dimes on October 13, 2010, 09:22:42 PM
Why in would Buzz give a scolie to Singleton? The kid is in the bag...use the scholie he aint goin anywhere.
Maybe, because he deserves one. Preseason workouts Singleton was third in the pro agility catagory behind Butler and Smith. His has more agility than Cadougan, DJO, Buyckes and Blue.
Quote from: MarkCharles on October 13, 2010, 08:22:53 PM
No reason for the negativity regarding Hood. We just survived a cutdown earlier this week, and are one of three he is still considering. No leader at this point among us, Louisville, and FSU. We'll see.
There's a 66% chance he doesn't attend MU. It's not being negative to write that Hood's likely out because, hey, when its 66% against you then its likely not going to happen.
Btw, it seems there is a leader at this point and he takes down kooky ladies at the dinner table. But he can be beat with an offer that can't be refused. ;)
Quote from: 4everwarriors on October 13, 2010, 08:05:15 PM
Said it before, I sincerely hope Singleton remains a walk-on.
Based on what? He's better than advertised and better than a lot of scholarship players we've had in the last 5 years.
Quote from: Hamostradamus on October 13, 2010, 09:57:05 PM
Based on what? He's better than advertised and better than a lot of scholarship players we've had in the last 5 years.
Based on the hope Buzz is able to recruit better guards than Singleton. No knock against Singleton, the person. Don't even know him. But, to win in the BE, you need Big East talent.
Of all the walk-ons to wear a Warrior jersey, only Dave Delsman should have legitimately been recruited and awarded a scholarship to Marquette University out of high school.
Quote from: The Golden Avalanche on October 13, 2010, 09:33:24 PM
There's a 66% chance he doesn't attend MU. It's not being negative to write that Hood's likely out because, hey, when its 66% against you then its likely not going to happen.
Btw, it seems there is a leader at this point and he takes down kooky ladies at the dinner table. But he can be beat with an offer that can't be refused. ;)
Ok, if you look at it that way, a recruit will always be 'likely' out. Mike Shaw has 4 finalists, so by your logic he is even more likely out. So there will never be a recruit who isn't 'likely out'. Clearly a pessimist's way of thinking.
I don't know what makes UL the leader other than vague internet rumors. Their board seems sure FSU is the leader and are quite pessimistic about their chances. Half the time, notions of a leader come from people talking on a message board about how well a campus visit went or something. But I don't know what makes someone say there is a leader for this kid-it has been a quiet recruitment for a player of his level, at least from his direction. No twitter, not a ton of articles, etc.
In cases like this, listen to what the player says. He said just days ago that 3 schools had emerged from the rest--MU, UL, FSU--and that there was no leader. No reason we don't have a good shot with him if he kept us on his list so recently.
You don't give a scholarship (when you only have 13) to a walk on who didn't start and averaged 5.2 ppg at High Point. I would also pass on McDonald just like MSU and U of M are. You can say that MSU is full but you can't say that they wouldn't find a spot for him if he was worth it.
Quote from: SD Warrior on October 13, 2010, 10:57:18 PM
You don't give a scholarship (when you only have 13) to a walk on who didn't start and averaged 5.2 ppg at High Point. I would also pass on McDonald just like MSU and U of M are. You can say that MSU is full but you can't say that they wouldn't find a spot for him if he was worth it.
Who exactly should we be passing on McDonald for, unless by some miracle we get both Hood and Shaw?
No one is saying McDonald is good enough for MSU to push one of their players out the door. Few players are. But he is more than good enough to be MU's next big man. Seriously people, just because we have been mentioned by a bunch of star recruits doesn't mean we are above a 3 star big man (who, by the way, is rated #87 by NBE and has an impressive list of suitors). He would be the highest rated high school big we've had in a long time. Way too long. What about him isn't good enough???
I don't care if Singleton is a walk-on...
If he's out performing other schollie players in practice and scrimmages, he deserves a schollie.
I think AL would agree...
Quote from: MarkCharles on October 13, 2010, 11:24:22 PM
Who exactly should we be passing on McDonald for, unless by some miracle we get both Hood and Shaw?
No one is saying McDonald is good enough for MSU to push one of their players out the door. Few players are. But he is more than good enough to be MU's next big man. Seriously people, just because we have been mentioned by a bunch of star recruits doesn't mean we are above a 3 star big man (who, by the way, is rated #87 by NBE and has an impressive list of suitors). He would be the highest rated high school we've had in a long time. Way too long. What about him isn't good enough???
I completely agree. We need big guys and Dwight Howard and Shaq clones are not going to fall out of the sky and come to MU. We need to develop a big man every year so that we always have four on the roster. That way, we can possibly redshirt one or absorb an injury.
4 bigs who can play the center, 3 PGs, 6 "switchables" on the wings and we are set. We are close. Buzz might have that by his 5th season when we can truely judge him as a coach and recruiter. McDonald would help get us there.
I hope to one day watch a Marquette game and not have to think "I wish we still had Barro" like I have had to do the last two years.
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on October 13, 2010, 11:58:51 PM
I don't care if Singleton is a walk-on...
If he's out performing other schollie players in practice and scrimmages, he deserves a schollie.
I think AL would agree...
I don't care if AL would agree. And I hate throwing around words like "deserve." Based on what? The Pro-Am? Agility drills? C'mon...the only thing that counts is on-court performance during the regular season. If he shows that he can truly play, then give him one. But that shouldn't be a decision that is made based upon a weak summer league and practice.
Quote from: Hamostradamus on October 13, 2010, 09:57:05 PM
Based on what? He's better than advertised and better than a lot of scholarship players we've had in the last 5 years.
He's better than advertised...because of the Pro-Am??? You do realize that the Pro-Am had a pretty weak field of players right? That hardly means he has the ability to actually play actual ball...or have the potential to improve.
Singleton is easly better than Dave Delsman.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on October 14, 2010, 08:07:05 AM
He's better than advertised...because of the Pro-Am??? You do realize that the Pro-Am had a pretty weak field of players right? That hardly means he has the ability to actually play actual ball...or have the potential to improve.
Right, because watching someone play basketball can tell you absolutely nothing about how good they are at basketball. Got it.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on October 14, 2010, 08:52:30 AM
Right, because watching someone play basketball can tell you absolutely nothing about how good they are at basketball. Got it.
Really? I'd call it "basketball".
You cats are twisted. This is the Big East. Reserve guards from High Point are going to compete with the talent UL, Syr., St. Johns, GU, et al are reloading with? Guaranteed to be a bitchfest here when we get are asses handed to us with non-BE guard play.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on October 14, 2010, 08:52:30 AM
Right, because watching someone play basketball can tell you absolutely nothing about how good they are at basketball. Got it.
Not if the competition is substandard compared to what they will face during BE play. I can ball like a beast against slow, unathletic old dudes, but that doesn't mean I can play college basketball.
Quote from: Hamostradamus on October 13, 2010, 09:57:05 PM
Based on what? He's better than advertised and better than a lot of scholarship players we've had in the last 5 years.
I'd agree that Singleton is better than a good number of players we've had on scholarship the last 5 years. If he EARNS a scholarship, by earning playing time in "the guts of a game," not just mop up duty - Buzz will give him one - I think it as simple as that. Singleton by NO means is your average walk on - he has some serious skills, and to judge him on his scoring average as a freshman at High Point, really isn't the barometer of how good he can be. There are many Top 100 kids who come out and don't average 5.2ppg..and Singleton played well against the Big East teams he faced.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on October 14, 2010, 08:59:34 AM
You cats are twisted. This is the Big East. Reserve guards from High Point are going to compete with the talent UL, Syr., St. Johns, GU, et al are reloading with? Guaranteed to be a bitchfest here when we get are asses handed to us with non-BE guard play.
Exactly. If he were so good, why didn't he get recruited by schools more high profile than High Point, and didn't get better offers than a walk on at MU when he left HPU? We bitch and moan that three star recruits aren't good enough anymore, but we go all nuts about a former two star walk on.
But I guess since he looked good in the Pro-Am.... ::)
Quote from: Ners on October 14, 2010, 09:09:23 AM
I'd agree that Singleton is better than a good number of players we've had on scholarship the last 5 years. If he EARNS a scholarship, by earning playing time in "the guts of a game," not just mop up duty - Buzz will give him one - I think it as simple as that.
Agreed. That is all I am saying. If he earns it during the season, give him one. Don't just throw him one now because he played well over the summer and performs well in agility drills.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on October 14, 2010, 09:10:08 AM
But I guess since he looked good for a walk-on in the Pro-Am.... ::)
fixed
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on October 14, 2010, 09:10:08 AM
Exactly. If he were so good, why didn't he get recruited by schools more high profile than High Point, and didn't get better offers than a walk on at MU when he left HPU? We bitch and moan that three star recruits aren't good enough anymore, but we go all nuts about a former two star walk on.
But I guess since he looked good in the Pro-Am.... ::)
That's, um, pretty silly.
If Stephen Curry were so good, why wasn't he recruited by better schools than Davidson (and High Point)?
If Rodney Stuckey were so good, how come he wasn't recruited by better schools than Eastern Washington?
If Jason Thompson were so good, how come he wasn't recruited by better schools than Rider?
I am not saying Singleton will become, or even could become, as good as those guys. It's obviously extremely unlikely. But let's not pretend a player's ultimate abilities are determined by who recruits him out of high school. If that were the case, all NBA first-round picks would come out of about 30 programs.
By the way, who's "going nuts" over Singleton? Suggesting that a walk-on (with D-1 experience, no less)
could come in and
eventually earn a scholie is hardly revolutionary thought. It, in fact, happens every year.
Quote from: MarkCharles on October 13, 2010, 10:43:28 PM
Ok, if you look at it that way, a recruit will always be 'likely' out. Mike Shaw has 4 finalists, so by your logic he is even more likely out. So there will never be a recruit who isn't 'likely out'. Clearly a pessimist's way of thinking.
In cases like this, listen to what the player says. He said just days ago that 3 schools had emerged from the rest--MU, UL, FSU--and that there was no leader. No reason we don't have a good shot with him if he kept us on his list so recently.
On the first point, recruiting is in itself the most pessimistic part of any program. You are going to be turned down far more often then getting a 'yes' when you ask the girl to dinner. The second best answer is a 'no' and that's why recruitments like Dawson (when we got a 'no' early) always cause less angst then recruitments like Harrison and Faust (when we got a 'maybe' for months before the 'no').
As for your last point, don't put too much stock in the player. D'Angelo Harrison came out of the weekend by most accounts heading to SJU. He then set up an announcement for Thursday. On Wednesday morning, he said all four teams had a chance. By Wednesday evening, more then one outlet was reporting he has committed to SJU. Moral of the story, there is always misdirection in recruiting and that's why using a Ouija board may be the best chance of knowing what's going on.
Quote from: The Golden Avalanche on October 14, 2010, 10:21:01 AM
On the first point, recruiting is in itself the most pessimistic part of any program. You are going to be turned down far more often then getting a 'yes' when you ask the girl to dinner. The second best answer is a 'no' and that's why recruitments like Dawson (when we got a 'no' early) always cause less angst then recruitments like Harrison and Faust (when we got a 'maybe' for months before the 'no').
As for your last point, don't put too much stock in the player. D'Angelo Harrison came out of the weekend by most accounts heading to SJU. He then set up an announcement for Thursday. On Wednesday morning, he said all four teams had a chance. By Wednesday evening, more then one outlet was reporting he has committed to SJU. Moral of the story, there is always misdirection in recruiting and that's why using a Ouija board may be the best chance of knowing what's going on.
On your first point, thats pretty much my point exactly. You will get turned down a lot more than you'll get a yes. I just don't see the need for the overall pessimism just because we are one of 3 finalists. Being one of the last 3 is about as good a situation as you can be in for a recruit.
There is certainly a lot of misinformation. But there is absolutely nothing of substance to suggest there is a leader for Hood. If there is, show me, because all I have seen is internet speculation. Plus, Hood seems like a great kid who isn't interested in playing a lot of games with his recruitment. Maybe naive to take what he says at face value, but his words are worth a lot more to me than some dude on UL's message board.
Quote from: Pakuni on October 14, 2010, 10:03:59 AM
That's, um, pretty silly.
If Stephen Curry were so good, why wasn't he recruited by better schools than Davidson (and High Point)?
If Rodney Stuckey were so good, how come he wasn't recruited by better schools than Eastern Washington?
If Jason Thompson were so good, how come he wasn't recruited by better schools than Rider?
But if any of them decided to transfer after their freshman year, they certainly wouldn't be walking on somewhere.
The only situation whereby Singleton should get a scholarship is if we decide to bank a scholarship or if a transfer opens one up. And both of those should be one year deals. He should not be given one long term.
He knew what he was getting himself in to, and he obviously has some way of paying for his tuition, so I don't know why he should get a scholarship when this team clearly has other needs.
Quote from: MarkCharles on October 14, 2010, 10:52:44 AM
The only situation whereby Singleton should get a scholarship is if we decide to bank a scholarship or if a transfer opens one up. And both of those should be one year deals. He should not be given one long term.
He knew what he was getting himself in to, and he obviously has some way of paying for his tuition, so I don't know why he should get a scholarship when this team clearly has other needs.
We do not know if Buzz promised him anything. It could very well be that Buzz promised him a scholarship after one year.
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on October 13, 2010, 11:58:51 PM
I don't care if Singleton is a walk-on...
If he's out performing other schollie players in practice and scrimmages, he deserves a schollie.
I think AL would agree...
Then I guess Deane should have given scholies to Shaw n Crawford because they were starters? If someone transfers ala Mbakwe or Maymon last minute he may get a scholie for a year or a semester... But the kid ain't goin anywhere n Buzz ain't givin him a precious scholie
Shaw and Crawford were getting their tuition paid by baseball. Does not compare to Singleton who is paying his own way.
:D ;) ;) :D ;D : I guess it's down to Hood, Henry, McDonald and Shaw. Would like to have 2. Here is an interesting name--Montervale Clark. Buzz let him go, I understand he was never charged with any crime. Don't know about academics though. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Quote from: bilsu on October 14, 2010, 06:03:46 PM
Shaw and Crawford were getting their tuition paid by baseball. Does not compare to Singleton who is paying his own way.
Don't bother him with the pesky details.
Quote from: Earl Tatum on October 14, 2010, 07:43:13 PM
:D ;) ;) :D ;D : I guess it's down to Hood, Henry, McDonald and Shaw. Would like to have 2. Here is an interesting name--Montervale Clark. Buzz let him go, I understand he was never charged with any crime. Don't know about academics though. Correct me if I'm wrong.
He was arrested and charged in September 2009. I have no idea where the case is now, but that ship is long gone.
Knowing Buzz we are in on a lot more....he seems to pull Jucos out of his hat like with DJO and Jae. Plus the spring signing season will undoubtedly bring more prospects forward.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on October 14, 2010, 07:52:15 PM
He was arrested and charged in September 2009. I have no idea where the case is now, but that ship is long gone.
Knowing Buzz we are in on a lot more....he seems to pull Jucos out of his hat like with DJO and Jae. Plus the spring signing season will undoubtedly bring more prospects forward.
You know, I've looked and looked for what's happened with Clark's case, but found nothing.
I will note, however, that he's now at Highland Community College outside in Freeport, Ill., which means either his case was resolved (without prison time) or some judge in Texas thought the merits of the case weren't strong enough and/or he wasn't enough of a danger to keep Clark in state.
All that said, I think we'll all take a pass on Monterale. He blew his chance.