As several of you know, the AD there is one of my best friends and a former Marquette employee. Tom Penders resigned today from Houston. An interesting job. They have a ton of history but are mired in CUSA. This is one school that if the conference merry go round goes right, could end up considerably better then where they are.
We're talking about a school that went to 3 straight Final Fours, has been number one in football, etc.
I mention all this because of Buzz's pull down in Texas, and especially in the Houston area. It will be very interesting to see who Mack Rhoades goes after. Mack hired Billy Gillespie at UTEP when he was there. He then hired Doc Sadler who took this year's UTEP team to the NCAAs.
For those of you who think I'm a Buzz hater...I sent a note to Mack this morning telling him not even to think about Buzz and bringing him back to Texas. ;)
Why wouldn't they just hire Gillespie?
A. If Buzz Williams were to leave Marquette to go to Houston, this would be the biblical equivalent of Soddom and Gamora
B. Why did Penders resign?
The notion that Buzz would be interested in this - or any job - for the simple fact it's in Texas is silly.
I understand it's the guy's home state, but he's not going to take over a lesser program for less money for that reason alone.
Also, the fact of the matter is Buzz has only lived in Texas two years in the last decade. Might suggest he's adjusted to life outside his home state.
I doubt Buzz moves to C-USA and Houston unless he hates our weather and The Quon. Yes, Houston has a rich basketball tradition as does Loyola of Chicago, but that was eons ago.
Chicos....there's absolutely nothing "interesting" about the Houston job openning. Nothing.
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 22, 2010, 11:32:28 AM
I doubt Buzz moves to C-USA and Houston unless he hates our weather and The Quon. Yes, Houston has a rich basketball tradition as does Loyola of Chicago, but that was eons ago.
Buzz was an assistant at Colorado state. I know he likes to say that Milwaukee gets more snow than he thought god could create, but he must have seen way more snow in Fort Collins.
Chicos ...
At the end of the day, coaches move for one reason ... money. Tradition and facilities mean they can win and therefore get more money. It's all about money.
If it was only about tradition and facilities than Calipari would not need $32 million/8 years. He would accept less, not more to take the Kentucky job.
MU was paying Crean north of $2 million/year. So MU has the capacity to pay big bucks, because it has before. If Buzz keeps doing what he doing, he can get to the big payday without leaving.
If Houston is ready to open its bank account for a guy like Buzz, then we might have a worry. Do you think they can offer the next head coach "Crean Money?" If so, how will this sit with the football coach?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 22, 2010, 11:24:25 AM
I mention all this because of Buzz's pull down in Texas, and especially in the Houston area. It will be very interesting to see who Mack Rhoades goes after. Mack hired Billy Gillespie at UTEP when he was there. He then hired Doc Sadler who took this year's UTEP team to the NCAAs.
Actually Doc is at Nebraska now, where he's struggling mightily there in year 3. Tony Barbee took UTEP to the tourney this year.
Quote from: KipsBayEagle on March 22, 2010, 11:28:23 AM
A. If Buzz Williams were to leave Marquette to go to Houston, this would be the biblical equivalent of Soddom and Gamora
B. Why did Penders resign?
Yes, why did Penders resign? He just got Houston in the tournament, makes no sense.
Quote from: Wade for President on March 22, 2010, 11:37:09 AM
Chicos....there's absolutely nothing "interesting" about the Houston job openning. Nothing.
The interseting part for Chicos is that he can name drop that he knows the Houston AD. There is no other reason this thread exists aside from that fact. It's pretty sad, really.
Quote from: nyg on March 22, 2010, 11:51:59 AM
Yes, why did Penders resign? He just got Houston in the tournament, makes no sense.
He has a history of health issues. He also left his last two positions amid scandal. Texas with an student's grades being released (really not that big a deal, but still an NCAA violation). And George Washington there was Atilia Cosby.
Why exactly in this case? Who knows. Let it play out.
Gillispie is rumored to be a candidate.
Quote from: Ready2Fly on March 22, 2010, 11:52:12 AM
The interseting part for Chicos is that he can name drop that he knows the Houston AD. There is no other reason this thread exists aside from that fact. It's pretty sad, really.
I found it interesting.
Buzz's traditional recruiting area is Houston. He has a lot of relationships there and there is a bunch of talent.
The AD at Houston obviously pays a little bit more attention to Marquette than the standard AD might, based on his previous employment at Marquette and his relationships.
Houston is a school that has a lot of history and might be willing to make a strategic bet on returning to glory. Especially given conference shuffling.
Having said that, no way. It's a crap job.
Gillispie's the cat that makes sense.
By the way, I'm starting to really like Buzz, but if he went to the administration holding up another job offer I'd have no problem with them telling him to take a freaking hike.
They went so far out on a limb when they hired this guy it's not even funny. Talking about other jobs seems like nonsense to me.
One more thing...if he decided to leave...I'd still like him more than our previous coach. By a lot.
There's no way in hell Buzz is going there (and Chicos didn't imply that he would), but it is an interesting job -- if they'll commit resources to the program. It's a program with some history and is in a great location for recruiting. Just because Chicos wondered whether the AD would "go after" Buzz doesn't mean that Chicos thinks Buzz would take -- or even consider -- the job. Some people need to quit reflexively attacking every Chicos post.
Quote from: Ready2Fly on March 22, 2010, 11:52:12 AM
The interseting part for Chicos is that he can name drop that he knows the Houston AD. There is no other reason this thread exists aside from that fact. It's pretty sad, really.
+1
Quote from: PuertoRicanNightmare on March 22, 2010, 11:25:29 AM
Why wouldn't they just hire Gillespie?
I was kidding him this morning on that very idea, but obviously Billy has some baggage now so who knows. Mack has been very good at hiring coaches at UTEP and when he was AD at Akron....I'm sure he'll go for a Texas guy, but who knows. That's his call...he does seem to go after coaches that have strong local or regional ties.
And yes, Stillawarrior.....you are correct, I'm not implying Buzz will go to Houston. Sorry if some of you took it that way. I brought up the Houston job because of the Marquette connection and because that is one school that if they can get their act together, could make some noise down the road.
There are a lot of schools in that description right now. St. John's, DePaul, Houston....major cities....major talent for high school hoops...strong strong tradition in hoops.
Quote from: Ready2Fly on March 22, 2010, 11:52:12 AM
The interseting part for Chicos is that he can name drop that he knows the Houston AD. There is no other reason this thread exists aside from that fact. It's pretty sad, really.
No, actually your interpretation is sad. A lot of people here remember Mack quite well from their interactions with him at the Blue and Gold fund....perhaps you never met him (have you ever donated to MU athletics?)
Sorry you're so jaded in life and every post I make throws you over the edge. How's Dodds board? I heard he's a name dropper and that probably just makes your skin crawl.....
Quote from: 4everwarriors on March 22, 2010, 12:03:31 PM
Gillispie's the cat that makes sense.
Agreed. He needs someone to accept him the way Eustachy was at Southern Miss. He'll be able to recover and has a great base there to lead off on. Especially if Penders is leaving a mess behind.
Regardless, it sounds like it would be the right opportunity for him.
Only a Texan would prefer Houston to Milwaukee. No snow but Houston weather is the pits in the summer.
Quote from: elephantraker on March 22, 2010, 12:20:31 PM
Only a Texan would prefer Houston to Milwaukee. No snow but Houston weather is the pits in the summer.
Agreed. But Milwaukee weather is the pits during the Winter.
As a former resident of Houston, you couldn't pay me enough to move back there. Terrible, but different strokes for different folks.
QuoteBy the way, I'm starting to really like Buzz, but if he went to the administration holding up another job offer I'd have no problem with them telling him to take a freaking hike.
They went so far out on a limb when they hired this guy it's not even funny. Talking about other jobs seems like nonsense to me.
Couldn't disagree more. I actually care about program success, not just some prideful oath of loyalty. This is a business. If MU for some reason refuses to show Buzz the money I wouldn't hold it against Buzz to look elsewhere. He doesn't owe MU anything just because "they went out on a limb to hire this guy." MU hired who they thought would be best for MU. Once that became Buzz, the relationship started anew. He doesn't have a debt because of MU's risk promoting him instead of bringing someone else in. That risk is the administration's cross to bear.
Now, if MU did pay Buzz as well as it reasonably could and he still went into the office with other offers, thats another story. The school can only do so much, and to try to push them over that ledge is unreasonable. I'm not sure what Buzz's salary is this year, but my guess is that he should be given a token raise as a show of MU's commitment and willingness, and a tan tommy sized raise if all goes well for another 2-3 years.
Not sure what is sadder, Chicos's continual name dropping or the fact that he thinks Doc Sadler coaches UTEP
Quote from: Canadian Dimes on March 22, 2010, 12:33:31 PM
Not sure what is sadder, Chicos's continual name dropping or the fact that he thinks Doc Sadler coaches UTEP
Does Doc Sadler own a Ford DeLorean?
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/18/sports/ncaabasketball/18houston.html
Last week the NY Times did a piece on Houston and Penders.
His son, who is a high school coach, has better facilities and equipment than Penders had at Houston.
Their home floor was unable to be used at times because of leaks.
Penders spent his own money on TVs and equipment so he could break down film.
Sounds like a nightmare. Of course they could rise again, but they have a long, long way to go.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 22, 2010, 12:17:44 PM
No, actually your interpretation is sad. A lot of people here remember Mack quite well from their interactions with him at the Blue and Gold fund....perhaps you never met him (have you ever donated to MU athletics?)
Sorry you're so jaded in life and every post I make throws you over the edge. How's Dodds board? I heard he's a name dropper and that probably just makes your skin crawl.....
Aside from season tickets every year since my freshman year '02-'03, no. Although, I'm not sure how many 26 year olds are heavy donors to the hoops program. What's the relevance anyway?
Interesting that you bring up the board you've been banned from under several different screen names for being an extreme annoyance.
Quote from: Ready2Fly on March 22, 2010, 12:59:11 PM
Aside from season tickets every year since my freshman year '02-'03, no. Although, I'm not sure how many 26 year olds are heavy donors to the hoops program. What's the relevance anyway?
Interesting that you bring up the board you've been banned from under several different screen names for being an extreme annoyance.
If you don't like what Chicos is saying then attack his points. Attacking the person is boring/irritating for everyone else. If you're so personally hurt by what Chicos did or said then take it to PMs because I'm here to read about MU bball, not some high-school drama crap.
Quote from: Skatastrophy on March 22, 2010, 01:03:53 PM
If you don't like what Chicos is saying then attack his points. Attacking the person is boring/irritating for everyone else. If you're so personally hurt by what Chicos did or said then take it to PMs because I'm here to read about MU bball, not some high-school drama crap.
+1
Quote from: bartmiller#1 on March 22, 2010, 12:41:18 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/18/sports/ncaabasketball/18houston.html
Last week the NY Times did a piece on Houston and Penders.
His son, who is a high school coach, has better facilities and equipment than Penders had at Houston.
Their home floor was unable to be used at times because of leaks.
Penders spent his own money on TVs and equipment so he could break down film.
Sounds like a nightmare. Of course they could rise again, but they have a long, long way to go.
Geez, sounds similar to the New Orleans job...how'd that work out for Buzz? Will chicos mention Buzz for every job opening like Katz did for Crean?
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5018573
I have a feeling we're going to be seeing Buzz go head to head with Penders at least once next year.
DePaul?
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 22, 2010, 03:53:34 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=5018573
I have heard Billy G. is right up there on the short list. He would be a good hire for the program and a good place for Billy to get back in the game.
Quote from: YoungMUFan4 on March 22, 2010, 04:25:39 PM
DePaul?
No it would more likely be St. Johns. He's from Connecticut and worked at Columbia, Fordham and Rhode Island.
But that was years ago...and he's 65 now. I'd stay away from Penders if I were an AD.
Quote from: StillAWarrior on March 22, 2010, 12:07:34 PM
There's no way in hell Buzz is going there (and Chicos didn't imply that he would), but it is an interesting job -- if they'll commit resources to the program. It's a program with some history and is in a great location for recruiting. Just because Chicos wondered whether the AD would "go after" Buzz doesn't mean that Chicos thinks Buzz would take -- or even consider -- the job. Some people need to quit reflexively attacking every Chicos post.
Agreed.
Quote from: Canadian Dimes on March 22, 2010, 02:04:38 PM
Geez, sounds similar to the New Orleans job...how'd that work out for Buzz? Will chicos mention Buzz for every job opening like Katz did for Crean?
Looks like Tony Benford has contacted Katz to have him float his name for the Houston job. ;)
"Texas assistant Rodney Terry would certainly make a lot of sense at Houston. He has support. Let's see if he can get the gig. Keep hearing conflicting reports on whether Billy Gillispie of Kentucky, UTEP and Texas A&M fame can get the job.
Marquette assistant Tony Benford, a native of Hobbs, N.M., and former Texas Tech player, has always recruited Texas well and deserves a look."
http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/blog/_/name/katz_andy/id/5022568/oregon-consider-rose-bennett (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/blog/_/name/katz_andy/id/5022568/oregon-consider-rose-bennett)
I would be shocked if Billy G doesn't end up there.
Didn't Clyde Drexler want this position some time ago? Kind of like Mark Aguirre & DePaul?
Quote from: Canadian Dimes on March 22, 2010, 02:04:38 PM
Geez, sounds similar to the New Orleans job...how'd that work out for Buzz? Will chicos mention Buzz for every job opening like Katz did for Crean?
...hey, where did my pal Mr. Hayward go? Hmm, I wonder
Quote from: KC2016 on March 24, 2010, 10:40:21 PM
Didn't Clyde Drexler want this position some time ago? Kind of like Mark Aguirre & DePaul?
Clyde was Houston's head coach for '98-99 and '99-00.
He was pretty horrible. 19-37 record.
Very good player, bad coach.
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 24, 2010, 10:46:27 PM
...hey, where did my pal Mr. Hayward go? Hmm, I wonder
Yes, where did he go. Hasn't posted in weeks?
On vacation?
Quote from: Canadian Dimes on March 22, 2010, 02:04:38 PM
Geez, sounds similar to the New Orleans job...how'd that work out for Buzz? Will chicos mention Buzz for every job opening like Katz did for Crean?
if he doesn't some one else will an hour later. That stuff belongs on the board, why complain?
Quote from: elephantraker on March 22, 2010, 12:20:31 PM
Only a Texan would prefer Houston to Milwaukee. No snow but Houston weather is the pits in the summer.
You don't have to shovel humidity. And the women are among the most attractive in the country. No state income tax. Housing prices very very low. Houston is not typical redneck country.
Chico's, do you think if this job opened up in 3 or 4 years when Crean's A$$ gets kicked out of Indiana and he needs to go to CUSA like his predecessor, does he take this job?
Quote from: nyg on March 25, 2010, 07:53:42 AM
Yes, where did he go. Hasn't posted in weeks?
Here's a hint
(http://www.freakingnews.com/pictures/21000/Canadian-toilet-paper--21026.jpg)
(http://www.willferguson.ca/images/biggerbooks_howtobe.jpg)
Quote from: ChicosBailBonds on March 26, 2010, 04:36:23 PM
Here's a hint
(http://www.freakingnews.com/pictures/21000/Canadian-toilet-paper--21026.jpg)
(http://www.willferguson.ca/images/biggerbooks_howtobe.jpg)
And the "dimes"????
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/college/houston/6932163.html
It looks like UH job will go to Gillespie or Floyd. NCAA hasn't yet ruled on sanctions for Floyd paying cash to O J Mayo friend and he could be in trouble still. Best Guess is Rhoades will go with UTEP Billy. An Aggie friend told me today Billy not only never signed his contract with UK (only an MOU), he never signed the A&M contract either! One hopes he's sober/advised to ensure he gets and signs a UH contract. With the horrible condition of UH Hofheinz pavillion and a pretty bare cupboard of recruits (graduating the 3 key seniors), the UH job is not a plum job. K bradley and E williams are Cy Springs grads and Houston is still a big BB hotbed (41 div 1 players last year) so it can be rebuilt.
I was at MU undergrad during 70's, I am a grad of UH law in the PHi Slamma Jamma years, so I'd like to see both programs succeed . Guy Lewis is a client, and should be in BB hall of fame--instead of Valvano (stiil hurts)!
BTW, altough I am a milw native through college years, I truly love Houston--, my home for 30 years --pls dont hate on me for such. MU alum club has 1000 plus in houston (many NASA engineers, managers, insurance banking, etc) so we all still bleed for MU and miss good brats, beer and cheese--just not the cold---lol.
Quote from: DaCoach on March 26, 2010, 02:01:05 PM
You don't have to shovel humidity. And the women are among the most attractive in the country. No state income tax. Housing prices very very low. Houston is not typical redneck country.
I agree-- also great restaurants, arts and entertainment. Our strong economy is due to no zoning, distaste for over govt regul, and huge influx of well educated youth here for jobs in a very diverse economy. Oil is only 10-15% of business-- we have biggest med center in US, hi-tech, finance, huge volume port (ship channel from the Gulf), NASA, lots of intl businesses, and more. Nobody here makes motorcycles-- but they can ride year round.
Quote from: houwarrior on March 26, 2010, 07:35:55 PM
I agree-- also great restaurants, arts and entertainment. Our strong economy is due to no zoning, distaste for over govt regul, and huge influx of well educated youth here for jobs in a very diverse economy. Oil is only 10-15% of business-- we have biggest med center in US, hi-tech, finance, huge volume port (ship channel from the Gulf), NASA, lots of intl businesses, and more. Nobody here makes motorcycles-- but they can ride year round.
how about the long summers of 90 plus temps with high humidity, traffic from hell almost anytime of day and any area of town, poor air quality, urban sprawl for mile upon mile, strip clubs, heavy industry, bars right next to residential areas and piss poor schools. other than that I agree with you.
Actually you are right houston is a nice place to live, it just takes some getting used to. I think the overall quality of life ius much better in Milwaukee.
Quote from: houwarrior on March 26, 2010, 07:35:55 PM
I agree-- also great restaurants, arts and entertainment. Our strong economy is due to no zoning, distaste for over govt regul, and huge influx of well educated youth here for jobs in a very diverse economy. Oil is only 10-15% of business-- we have biggest med center in US, hi-tech, finance, huge volume port (ship channel from the Gulf), NASA, lots of intl businesses, and more. Nobody here makes motorcycles-- but they can ride year round.
Hey, don't forget the huge assist Houston got from the rest of the country when we relocated George W away from the city for eight years! ::)
Little M--
Not quite right ...George W was born in Conn, moved w/his dad to texas, who started an oil co (zapata) w/partner, Hugh Luedke (founder of pennzoil), and the family lived in Midland. W then went back up to yale, returned to lubbock(failed oil bus and lost in run for congress), then ran tx rangers baseball team in DFW, before governorship in Austin, then prez no 43 in DC...W has now moved back to Dallas--George W has no Houston loyalty, nor lineage. I am not sure he knows where Houston is.
His Dad George HW, "sr" (no 41) and Barbara, however, do live in Houston, 4 blocks from here, ..so we'll give you a half right there- lol.
As an aside ,George W has seen Geoge Sr in maine, but W never has visited his dad here in Htown(see- he cant find it!)
I am more a fan of BB, than of the "BS" of politicos, so here is the list of UH players who went on to the NBA (incl 3 of all time top 50 team):
Anderson, Cadillac 1987-1997
Birdsong, Otis 1977-1988
Chaney, Don 1968-1979
Davis, Dwight 1972-1976
Drexler, Clyde 1983-1997 HOF
Ferreira, Rolando 1988-1988
Ford, Alton 2001-2003
Goldwire, Anthony 1995-2005
Hamood, Joe 1967-1967
Hayes, Elvin 1968-1983 HOF
Herrera, Carl 1991-1998
Jones, Damon 1998-2007
Jones, Dwight 1973-1982
Lentz, Leary 1967-1968
Luckenbill, Ted 1961-1962
Mack, Sam 1992-2001
Micheaux, Larry 1983-1984
Olajuwon, Hakeem 1984-2001 HOF
Outlaw, Bo 1993-2007
Owens, Andre 2005-2007
Phillips, Gary 1961-1965
Reynolds, George 1969-1969
Spain, Ken 1970-1970
Taylor, Ollie 1970-1973
Williams, Rob 1982-1983
Winslow, Rickie 1987-1987
Young, Michael 1984-1989
There are many former houston area high school BB players in Div 1 schools around the country (K Bradley and E Williams , J Butler, C Otule at MU -examples) ...
and some in NBA, currently (Rashard Lewis, Lamarcus Aldredge, T J Ford, Ameka Okafor, Daniel Gibson, Kurt Thomas-examples)
Football is still king, but credit ex UH coach Guy v Lewis for recruiting and making BB popular w/kids in Houston
The NCAA Final Four is here next year- I cant wait
Penders was toast as soon as he gave the interview to the NYT. Since the new AD was brought in, he has raised $100M for new facilities. Penders went to the NCAA only once in his 6 years and promptly exited. This despite playing in the subpar USA Conference. He hasn't been able to recruit from Houston despite being the only major university in town.
I understand they are willing to bump the ante from $500K for their next coach. Gillespie and Floyd are the leading candidates but there is another unnamed coach being wooed. I can't see the fit for Buzz, especially after his last 2 years at MU. The Houston job is a long term rebuilding position. Other than coming back to Texas, Williams would be taking a big step backwards.
Quote from: DaCoach on March 27, 2010, 09:45:44 PM
Penders was toast as soon as he gave the interview to the NYT. Since the new AD was brought in, he has raised $100M for new facilities. Penders went to the NCAA only once in his 6 years and promptly exited. This despite playing in the subpar USA Conference. He hasn't been able to recruit from Houston despite being the only major university in town.
I understand they are willing to bump the ante from $500K for their next coach. Gillespie and Floyd are the leading candidates but there is another unnamed coach being wooed. I can't see the fit for Buzz, especially after his last 2 years at MU. The Houston job is a long term rebuilding position. Other than coming back to Texas, Williams would be taking a big step backwards.
Mack is doing a great job as AD down there....he'll make the right hire.
Quote from: DaCoach on March 27, 2010, 09:45:44 PM
Penders was toast as soon as he gave the interview to the NYT. Since the new AD was brought in, he has raised $100M for new facilities. Penders went to the NCAA only once in his 6 years and promptly exited. This despite playing in the subpar USA Conference. He hasn't been able to recruit from Houston despite being the only major university in town.
I understand they are willing to bump the ante from $500K for their next coach. Gillespie and Floyd are the leading candidates but there is another unnamed coach being wooed. I can't see the fit for Buzz, especially after his last 2 years at MU. The Houston job is a long term rebuilding position. Other than coming back to Texas, Williams would be taking a big step backwards.
The unamed other coach possibility for UH has generally been reported as an asst coach of Barnes at UT-- I dont have his name handy. Rhoades quote that sometimes you need to make a big splash leads one to think the other two--Floyd and Bill are the 1st choices. But given Rhoades recent , skillfull handling of UH football coach Sumlin extension(who came up in many better job opening rumors) --I agree that he'll do his best on UH BB job fill. The UH womens BB coach Joe Curl, also just quit due to Health, so he is busy.
"but W never has visited his dad here in Htown(see- he cant find it!)"
Count your blessings! I'd take number 41 over 43 any day.
On a different topic, take those three HOF players and you'd have a front line that could match up with anyone.
Surprised how many players I remember, and also surprised that Ricky Winslow only played one year in the NBA. Wasn't he pretty darn good in college?
This thread is like a Tom Izzo team...not a great start but a strong finish...loved all the Houston talk. Like Milwaukee, Houston is an underrated city.
Quote from: LittleMurs on March 29, 2010, 10:19:34 PM
"but W never has visited his dad here in Htown(see- he cant find it!)"
Count your blessings! I'd take number 41 over 43 any day.
On a different topic, take those three HOF players and you'd have a front line that could match up with anyone.
Surprised how many players I remember, and also surprised that Ricky Winslow only played one year in the NBA. Wasn't he pretty darn good in college?
Ricky was all conf 3rd team, but a tweener in NBA size-- played big in college but too small to play same in college w/no perim game to play the 2 or 3
No rush, take your time.....plenty of time to hire a coach
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/solomon/6935785.html
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/college/houston/6932163.html
James Dickey hired for Houston.
http://sports790.com/pages/mattandadam.html
Dickey? Really?
I guess the job was that interesting after all.