Lazar, Jimmy, and DJO all have good NBA odds at some point. That is a lot of talent to have on the floor. The lack of depth is going to affect consistency, but we are dangerous.
Quote from: DomJamesToTheBasket on February 06, 2010, 04:18:33 PM
Lazar, Jimmy, and DJO all have good NBA odds at some point. That is a lot of talent to have on the floor. The lack of depth is going to affect consistency, but we are dangerous.
so did dom james on his way to the basket, but he didnt get there just yet ;)
For some reason, I believe Dom James will be on a pro team roster in the near future.
Good stuff Dimitri. DJ has the talent to be on a roster, though. I think he'll get a good look in camp next summer. His defense is going to endear him to coaches and his athleticism could really be unleashed in a league that doesn't play defense.
I'd say Lazar gets drafted (2nd round).
Butler may sneak in late 2nd.
DJO goes undrafted but signs as a FA.
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on February 06, 2010, 04:55:33 PM
I'd say Lazar gets drafted (2nd round).
Butler may sneak in late 2nd.
DJO goes undrafted but signs as a FA.
I'd say DJO has the best chance of all of them to get drafted. Can Zar defend at the NBA level? Is he quick/explosive enough? I hope so. But DJO is an explosive, explosive athlete. There were times in the game today where his bursts of speed reminded me of D-Wade. We've seen his dunks - some compare DJO to Jerel - Jerel wasn't nearly as explosive (even as a senior) as DJO is as a sophmore.
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on February 06, 2010, 04:55:33 PM
I'd say Lazar gets drafted (2nd round).
Butler may sneak in late 2nd.
DJO goes undrafted but signs as a FA.
As of right now, I don't think Lazar gets drafted. He would have to play SF and he would get torn up trying to defend that position in the NBA. He has the talent to make a team, though.
DJO is too eary to get a good read, but he is not a PG and, therefore, undersized for the NBA. He can negate that by demonstrating the ability to defend the NBA 2. His athleticism is going to get noticed.
Jimmy has the best shot IMO. 6'7.75" G/F. He is the only one that has prototype size. He is playing exceptional basketball.
Quote from: DomJamesToTheBasket on February 06, 2010, 04:52:27 PM
Good stuff Dimitri. DJ has the talent to be on a roster, though. I think he'll get a good look in camp next summer. His defense is going to endear him to coaches and his athleticism could really be unleashed in a league that doesn't play defense.
Agreed, I think DJ is an excellent player. His main hindrance is his size, which he makes up for with his athleticism, and his shooting.
If he can score in other ways he may eventually develop a good enough shot for the association
Quote from: DomJamesToTheBasket on February 06, 2010, 05:09:29 PM
As of right now, I don't think Lazar gets drafted. He would have to play SF and he would get torn up trying to defend that position in the NBA. He has the talent to make a team, though.
DJO is too eary to get a good read, but he is not a PG and, therefore, undersized for the NBA. He can negate that by demonstrating the ability to defend the NBA 2. His athleticism is going to get noticed.
Jimmy has the best shot IMO. 6'7.75" G/F. He is the only one that has prototype size. He is playing exceptional basketball.
Maybe i shoudnt do this because they are very different, but I have a difficult time not comparing Lazar to Wes. I think Lazar may be a better shooter (even though matthews shot well last year) and he is definitely a better rebounder and can defend the post just as well. May not be as athletic or versatile as wes, but if matthews can make it I believe Lazar can make it
Quote from: mudimitri on February 06, 2010, 05:13:15 PM
Agreed, I think DJ is an excellent player. His main hindrance is his size, which he makes up for with his athleticism, and his shooting.
If he can score in other ways he may eventually develop a good enough shot for the association
If it weren't for DJ's horrible luck with injuries at the end of last season and during the summer camps, he would be on an NBA team right now.
I agree with DJ to the Basket, though. I think The Butler has the best chance of getting drafted with his size. I think Lazar will have a tough time getting drafted because even though he's made leaps and bounds with his athleticism, he is still wayyy behind other 2s and 3s and undersized to be a 4.
Who knows though, maybe he'll go Sir Charles all up on it. Lazar the Czar.
DJO has 2 seasons after this, though, to improve. As a sophomore, he's more athletic than Jerel ever was, he is already an amazing scorer, and he turns it over just like Jerel! His D needs improvement, but again, he has 2 more seasons to step up his D. Guarding Vander Blue in practice next year should help him get to the next level, I'd imagine.
EDIT
and oh yeah...how about DJO's ball deflection against UCONN? His HUGE block today at the end of the game? May not ever be the Big East Defensive Player of the Year, but he's come up HUGE
Quote from: mudimitri on February 06, 2010, 05:16:23 PM
Maybe i shoudnt do this because they are very different, but I have a difficult time not comparing Lazar to Wes. I think Lazar may be a better shooter (even though matthews shot well last year) and he is definitely a better rebounder and can defend the post just as well. May not be as athletic or versatile as wes, but if matthews can make it I believe Lazar can make it
It's funny that the major knock on Wes was whether he could defend in the NBA and he ends up playing a major role BECAUSE of his defense. Nice scouting scouts.
Quote from: DomJamesToTheBasket on February 06, 2010, 05:26:01 PM
It's funny that the major knock on Wes was whether he could defend in the NBA and he ends up playing a major role BECAUSE of his defense. Nice scouting scouts.
Who said he couldnt defend?
Quote from: GOMU1104 on February 06, 2010, 05:27:43 PM
Who said he couldnt defend?
There were questions on his ability to defend in the league. Is he a 2 or a 3? Is he quick enough to defend a 2? Is he big/strong enough to defend the 3? The answer to all 3 questions is sometimes. The only thing that is unquestioned IMO is strength. He OWNS the MU pull-up record.....I can't remember the exact number, but it was over 40!!!
It is too early to speculate on DJO, but he has been spectacular. There are few players that I would describe as "jaw-dropping" and he has that. When opposing teams scout us, they probably see DJO as a nightmare. You have to play up on him because of his 3 prowess, but then he blows by to the hoop. He is a MAJOR threat on the court.
Considering DJO has two more years to improve his skills, I have to go with him above Zar or Jimmy.
Does anyone think Wes's success will help guys like Lazar or Jimmy get drafted? It probably doesn't play much of a role, but people could look at Wes and see how they missed on him and what the type of player he is, and maybe draft a guy like Lazar if they were on the fence about him.
Quote from: cheebs09 on February 06, 2010, 06:35:22 PM
Does anyone think Wes's success will help guys like Lazar or Jimmy get drafted? It probably doesn't play much of a role, but people could look at Wes and see how they missed on him and what the type of player he is, and maybe draft a guy like Lazar if they were on the fence about him.
I honestly don't think it will. It definitely doesn't hurt.
Quote from: cheebs09 on February 06, 2010, 06:35:22 PM
Does anyone think Wes's success will help guys like Lazar or Jimmy get drafted? It probably doesn't play much of a role, but people could look at Wes and see how they missed on him and what the type of player he is, and maybe draft a guy like Lazar if they were on the fence about him.
I would lean towards no but you never know.
Quote from: DomJamesToTheBasket on February 06, 2010, 05:33:35 PM
There were questions on his ability to defend in the league. Is he a 2 or a 3? Is he quick enough to defend a 2? Is he big/strong enough to defend the 3? The answer to all 3 questions is sometimes. The only thing that is unquestioned IMO is strength. He OWNS the MU pull-up record.....I can't remember the exact number, but it was over 40!!!
Actually, Wes' defense was one of his strengths coming out...because of his quickness, size and strength.
Scouts wondered if his offense would translate to the NBA.
If you are going to compare Lazar to anyone, it would be Marcus Landry. Landry looked like the classic 'tweener. Too small to be a 4 in the NBA...too slow to be a 3. Both had a good inside/outside game in college...but how does transfer to the pros?
If you take the comparison out further, Landry is barely hanging on the NBA. Rarely sees the floor on a bad team. To be honest, that is where I see Lazar...if he doesn't wind up in Europe.
Regardless, he will make plenty of $$$ playing basketball somewhere.
I think DJO has the best prospects because of his size and shooting. Personality wise, he's an aggressive player so that killer instinct going to the rack will come. Then again, as the youngest its easy to say that his prospects are best in that MLB maxim "prospects get GM's fired" kind of way.
As for Zar and Jimmy, I have a really hard time seeing how they would fit in on a team. The Landry comparison to Zar is, I think, an apt one. He just doesn't have that unusual quickness for someone as undersized as he is. His shot is certainly promising, but in the NBA, coaches think they can teach really athletic types to shoot consistently (see Jerel if he were taller) so that goes against him.
Similarly, I don't particularly like Jimmy's prospects either. We can list him as a G/F swingman type all we want, but at MU he has never handled the ball in the open floor or really even on the wing. Its tough to forecast a guy as a swingman when he has a suspect handle and little outside shot to speak of. He would make a very interesting D-leaguer though in the sense that teams might see a lot of untapped potential for a brutal wing player in him and see if the handle and quick first step develops.
I'd like to think Zar is like Jared Dudley: a 6'6ish SF who can play the block and step out and shoot the ball.
Zar's not tall enough to play the PF, but he has enough skills to guard a 2 to a smaller 4.
Dude's heady. Has NBA skills and stealthiness. Clean demeanor, photogenic smile, and is an awesome first name.
He's a second-rounder. Lock it.
i hope so. it would be nice to see a team go for him, but another thing he has working against him is his age. given that its hard to debate that he has a pretty low ceiling and he also went the distance in school, it will take a team that thinks he can contribute right away rather than take a flier on someone thats just an athlete in the second round. in that sense its kind of like a jerel situation from last year... or wes i suppose.
I think that Lazar and Jimmy have all of the intangibles that you want. Both very smart and have an uncanny knack for coming up with the ball. Jimmy's missed free throws are also now forever erased by his shot at UConn and Lazar's body of work trumps his stepping on the line against Mizzou (I still cringe just thinking about that).
I don't see either being drafted necessarily. They do not have a skill set to get excited about necessarily. Novak and Diener are two of the best shooters in the world, so scouts have a good reason to draft them and try to teach them the system. Lazar is not very athletic and Jimmy has not shown the skill level to be drafted. I could see either of them getting picked up one day by an NBA team. Jimmy in particular has the ideal body for a three man.
Jimmy has next year to show what he can do. Needs to show he can shoot. I imagine that coaches are going to have their 4 men back up a few more feet when they get Jimmy on the perimeter so we will see how well he can shoot from the outside.
Lazar needs to market himself as a three point threat to make up for his lack of quickness. He has been doing that lately and needs to keep it up to have a prayer at the draft.
Quote from: mviale on February 06, 2010, 04:42:37 PM
For some reason, I believe Dom James will be on a pro team roster in the near future.
I was thinking about this the other day. He could have the same kind of path as Will Bynum, who is playing very well for the Pistons. Same body type and game.
Wes Matthews' success can only help. If one MU player was underrated prior to the draft, then scouts should realize they were all underrated.
Jimmy Butler? Being objective on the matter there is a 5% chance that guy makes the NBA....he's a nice player but at 6'5 there are so many players available, don't let Wes's success blind you. Zar is borderline, he'll probably be a 2nd round pick. DJO has the best potential IMO.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on February 06, 2010, 11:57:02 PM
Jimmy Butler? Being objective on the matter there is a 5% chance that guy makes the NBA....he's a nice player but at 6'5 there are so many players available, don't let Wes's success blind you. Zar is borderline, he'll probably be a 2nd round pick. DJO has the best potential IMO.
FWIW, I've heard it mentioned numerous times that Butler is much closer to 6'7" than 6'5".
Quote from: Doris Burkes Thong on February 07, 2010, 12:06:20 AM
FWIW, I've heard it mentioned numerous times that Butler is much closer to 6'7" than 6'5".
Why would they list his height lower than what it actually is? Doesnt make sense.
Quote from: Avenue Commons on February 06, 2010, 09:16:24 PM
I was thinking about this the other day. He could have the same kind of path as Will Bynum, who is playing very well for the Pistons. Same body type and game.
But Bynum *can* shoot the ball with more consistency.
If anything, we should be rooting for more misery at Golden State (NBDL Direct) headquarters. They fact Coby Karl was signed proves 1) "it's who you know" and 2) Jerel and/or DJ could be easily playing for that team.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on February 06, 2010, 11:57:02 PM
Jimmy Butler? Being objective on the matter there is a 5% chance that guy makes the NBA....he's a nice player but at 6'5 there are so many players available, don't let Wes's success blind you. Zar is borderline, he'll probably be a 2nd round pick. DJO has the best potential IMO.
this. JB doesnt have NBA weight
DJO actually reminds me a lot of Ben Gordon. Lights out shooter, a little undersized, but can get in the lane and create his own shot. Both need to be hidden a little bit on the defensive end, but DJO has the potential to be a good defender because of his strength and quickness. DJO needs to tighten his handle a little bit, but a great shooter always has a spot in the league.
Quote from: esotericmindguy on February 06, 2010, 11:57:02 PM
Jimmy Butler? Being objective on the matter there is a 5% chance that guy makes the NBA....he's a nice player but at 6'5 there are so many players available, don't let Wes's success blind you. Zar is borderline, he'll probably be a 2nd round pick. DJO has the best potential IMO.
If Butler is only 6'5"", then Hayward is only 6'4".
Butler is listed at 6'6" on the official roster and Fulce is at 6'7". Having stood next to the two of them, I'd say Butler is at least an inch taller than Fulce. Being 6'3" myself, I'd say Butler is every bit of 6'6" and Fulce is more like 6'5".
Quote from: dwaderoy2004 on February 07, 2010, 11:37:25 AM
DJO actually reminds me a lot of Ben Gordon. Lights out shooter, a little undersized, but can get in the lane and create his own shot. Both need to be hidden a little bit on the defensive end, but DJO has the potential to be a good defender because of his strength and quickness. DJO needs to tighten his handle a little bit, but a great shooter always has a spot in the league.
Tightening his handle is important. DJO has the shooting ability, but there's just something weird about how high he dribbles and keeps his shoulders stiff. I'd be interested to hear how long his wingspan is. Most NBA players have lengthy wingspans. DJO looks like he has narrow shoulders.
Quote from: 77ncaachamps on February 07, 2010, 03:04:16 PM
Tightening his handle is important. DJO has the shooting ability, but there's just something weird about how high he dribbles and keeps his shoulders stiff. I'd be interested to hear how long his wingspan is. Most NBA players have lengthy wingspans. DJO looks like he has narrow shoulders.
I'd agree that DJO's shoulders at times can seem stiff as he dribbles (if we are putting him under the finest of microscopes), but I wouldn't say he has narrow shoulders. It had been mentioned in a previous topic that someone thought DJO was "uncoordinated." Definitely not the right choice of words - I would say a good description for DJO would be athletically, unorthodoxed. He can be herky jerky, a la Nick Van Exel, but then there are times his straight-line speed is D-Wade like. I DEFINITELY see DJO making the NBA..better athlete than Ben Gordon and stronger..and he's only a sophmore..so give him a couple of years.
We've seen significant improvement just since the beginning of the season. Being he's a sophomore and has two more years to work on his game, I think he's got a legitimate shot.
Jimmy is 6'7.75" as measured by Homer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZsGGSHcdi8