Why is it that the majority of comments over the last 12 hours contain some sort of questionable logic, rationale, back story, speculation or explanation for the J-May situation? Someone out there has the answers... and believe me, the answers will come out eventually. So why do people feel the need to proclaim themselves (or imply they are) "all-knowing" on a fan board in front of other random fans and commenters? Is there some sort of award for guessing correctly why J-May left that I didn't hear about?
I'm all for spirited debate, but when you start speculating about an individual's character, intelligence, or personal issues, that's crossing the line. Remember -- THESE ARE 18-22 YEAR OLD KIDS that a few people insist upon bashing. Contrary to some people's beliefs, these kids are not public figures who should be subject to criticism over every move they make - they are college students working (playing) their way through college. If not for basketball, some of these kids wouldn't have a chance to go to college, and in many families, they're the first to have the opportunity... and when they make a bad decision (or an unpopular decision), some people insist on calling their integrity into question and making it a public spectacle. To those people, I say shame on you and I hope your children are never subjected to the same fate.
Guess what... we all made stupid decisions in college. Some of us made our bad decisions in certain campus bars (and perhaps later in her dorm), some made bad decisions in the classroom, and some make them on the basketball court. Let this play out, withhold any unnecessary speculation, and when the truth comes out and you happened to guess correctly, please refrain from the requisite "I told you so."
+1
What you don't like it when everyone dusts this off....
Quote from: Benny B on December 15, 2009, 09:03:45 AM
Why is it that the majority of comments over the last 12 hours contain some sort of questionable logic, rationale, back story, speculation or explanation for the J-May situation? Someone out there has the answers... and believe me, the answers will come out eventually. So why do people feel the need to proclaim themselves (or imply they are) "all-knowing" on a fan board in front of other random fans and commenters? Is there some sort of award for guessing correctly why J-May left that I didn't hear about?
I'm all for spirited debate, but when you start speculating about an individual's character, intelligence, or personal issues, that's crossing the line. Remember -- THESE ARE 18-22 YEAR OLD KIDS that a few people insist upon bashing. Contrary to some people's beliefs, these kids are not public figures who should be subject to criticism over every move they make - they are college students working (playing) their way through college. If not for basketball, some of these kids wouldn't have a chance to go to college, and in many families, they're the first to have the opportunity... and when they make a bad decision (or an unpopular decision), some people insist on calling their integrity into question and making it a public spectacle. To those people, I say shame on you and I hope your children are never subjected to the same fate.
Guess what... we all made stupid decisions in college. Some of us made our bad decisions in certain campus bars (and perhaps later in her dorm), some made bad decisions in the classroom, and some make them on the basketball court. Let this play out, withhold any unnecessary speculation, and when the truth comes out and you happened to guess correctly, please refrain from the requisite "I told you so."
BEST POST OF YEAR. SPECULATION IS PART OF THIS BOARD BUT SOME OF THE COMMENTS HERE HAVE BEEN EXACTLY WHAT SOME HAD ACCUSED BADGER FANS OF WITH THE VANDER BLUE SITUATION.
Agreed.
Calm down, rubes.
Let the story come out over the course of a few days.
No harm in waiting to pass judgment.
I missed the part where people claimed anyone was all-knowing. I'd say almost every post started with "I think..." "This seems.." "I really hope.." "I wonder.." "Might end up..." "Wouldn't surprise me if.." That was from reading just a couple pages.
This is what happens when an institution releases a bombshell press release without any details. It only helps fan the flame of curiosity and speculation.
The lack of information creates a void. People fill that void in many ways. Some of which, you will not like.
Did you expect something different? That a message board forum would be filled with "Good luck, Maymon!" ?
JM has been harmed by the comments on this board today, how?
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on December 15, 2009, 09:24:11 AM
I missed the part where people claimed anyone was all-knowing. I'd say almost every post started with "I think..." "This seems.." "I really hope.." "I wonder.." "Might end up..." "Wouldn't surprise me if.." That was from reading just a couple pages.
This is what happens when an institution releases a bombshell press release without any details. It only helps fan the flame of curiosity and speculation.
The lack of information creates a void. People fill that void in many ways. Some of which, you will not like.
Did you expect something different? That a message board forum would be filled with "Good luck, Maymon!" ?
+1
Amen.
Let's remember, this board is read by parents, family members, recruits etc. Regardless of whether anyone claimed to know anything or not, the speculative crap is just as bad.
Think about it for a second....
Jeronne is a kid from the most powerful high school basketball program in the state, the only one that turns out high major players every year. You want to alienate that program because you bashed one of their own?
Jeronne is a kid who's best friend is the crown jewel of next year's class, and despite what his mom has said, nothing is ever final until the recruit shows up on campus. Do you want to take the chance of angering VB and company to the point where they feel like they did during the UW fiasco and decide MU isn't the place for them?
Jeronne's aunt just happens to be the legal guardian of Junior Lomomba, another Memorial product that MU has been recruiting very hard. Do you really want to alienate that family and virtually guarantee no shot at continuing the Memorial pipeline with another Top 100 kid in 2012?
I'm all for freedom of speech, but at some point on a fan forum people have to realize that the needs of the program should outweigh their right to say whatever the heck they feel like saying.
No good comes from posts like we've seen over the last 12+ hours.
Quote from: Benny B on December 15, 2009, 09:03:45 AM
Why is it that the majority of comments over the last 12 hours contain some sort of questionable logic, rationale, back story, speculation or explanation for the J-May situation? Someone out there has the answers... and believe me, the answers will come out eventually. So why do people feel the need to proclaim themselves (or imply they are) "all-knowing" on a fan board in front of other random fans and commenters? Is there some sort of award for guessing correctly why J-May left that I didn't hear about?
I'm all for spirited debate, but when you start speculating about an individual's character, intelligence, or personal issues, that's crossing the line. Remember -- THESE ARE 18-22 YEAR OLD KIDS that a few people insist upon bashing. Contrary to some people's beliefs, these kids are not public figures who should be subject to criticism over every move they make - they are college students working (playing) their way through college. If not for basketball, some of these kids wouldn't have a chance to go to college, and in many families, they're the first to have the opportunity... and when they make a bad decision (or an unpopular decision), some people insist on calling their integrity into question and making it a public spectacle. To those people, I say shame on you and I hope your children are never subjected to the same fate.
Guess what... we all made stupid decisions in college. Some of us made our bad decisions in certain campus bars (and perhaps later in her dorm), some made bad decisions in the classroom, and some make them on the basketball court. Let this play out, withhold any unnecessary speculation, and when the truth comes out and you happened to guess correctly, please refrain from the requisite "I told you so."
I am in general agreement with the post and would like to say welcome to the internet age where everyone has a voice whether it is truthful or not. Some posters (not me) here and on the other board have genuine knowledge of the situation and are posting some facts. Here is an example (by a Badger fan >:( ) http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=415&f=2850&t=5301070
He posted that about 2 hours before the media got the story and put it on JS Online. That is one of the main purposes of these message boards, to publish facts that are not out there or for whaterver reason, the usual sources don't want the fans to know.
Now there are a lot of posters here that are basketball fans and analyze everything about the team and recruiting. Usually posters on this board take the facts as we know them and try to reach logical conclusions from that. Yeah, it is called speculation. However the discussion and speculation on this board sometimes leads to conclusions that impune the character of an 18 year old kid who may or may not have done something wrong. I agree with you that we should refrain making those judgements until we have all the facts. However, simply listing the most likely possibilities doesn't hurt anyone. I would disagree with you and say that most posters on the board have not attacked Jeronne but have questioned whether he is happy with his role on the team (see original rumor) or whether he crossed some line vis-a-vis his coach. Neither of which, in my opinion reflects horribly on his character, it just means he should move on. However, I still think that both theories don't make complete sense so I think there is something else going on so we should wait and see what that is.
I am just saying that you've got to take the good with the bad nowadays because a lot of info is on these boards. I also agree that everyone should practice self restraint before posting something that appears as fact that genuinely hurts someone when all the facts are not in.
Quote from: bma725 on December 15, 2009, 09:41:16 AM
I'm all for freedom of speech, but at some point on a fan forum people have to realize that the needs of the program should outweigh their right to say whatever the heck they feel like saying.
Also, those reading a fan (short for fanatic) forum need to realize that they'll read all sorts of things, from wild and wacky to well thought out and reasonable, which may or may not be true. It's part of a fan forum. it requires a little discretion by both contributors, and readers.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on December 15, 2009, 09:24:11 AM
I missed the part where people claimed anyone was all-knowing. I'd say almost every post started with "I think..." "This seems.." "I really hope.." "I wonder.." "Might end up..." "Wouldn't surprise me if.." That was from reading just a couple pages.
This is what happens when an institution releases a bombshell press release without any details. It only helps fan the flame of curiosity and speculation.
The lack of information creates a void. People fill that void in many ways. Some of which, you will not like.
Did you expect something different? That a message board forum would be filled with "Good luck, Maymon!" ?
These were the exact types of phrases that we all roasted the UW boards for with regards to Vander Blue.
If you guys really want to get into heavy speculation, may I suggest private email or PM.
Nothing wrong with speculating, but this is a pretty public place to be talking about a kid's private affairs.
At least wait until after the rest of the story comes out. Then make your comments.
Quote from: mu_hilltopper on December 15, 2009, 09:24:11 AM
I missed the part where people claimed anyone was all-knowing. I'd say almost every post started with "I think..." "This seems.." "I really hope.." "I wonder.." "Might end up..." "Wouldn't surprise me if.." That was from reading just a couple pages.
This is what happens when an institution releases a bombshell press release without any details. It only helps fan the flame of curiosity and speculation.
The lack of information creates a void. People fill that void in many ways. Some of which, you will not like.
Did you expect something different? That a message board forum would be filled with "Good luck, Maymon!" ?
Disagree. There is a difference between what constitutes "filling the void" and what constitutes unnecessary, perhaps malicious, attacks on an 18 year old for what, at this point, is nothing more that an unpopular decision in the MU community.
Further, there is a difference between speculation (using one of the disclaimer phrases you mentioned above) and claiming/implying to have the answers. Not all, but several posts are definitely the latter. And you cannot simply put a disclaimer on a false statement (or something you do not know to be true) to make it any more appropriate.
Edited - Last statement was not necessary.
Benny, I'm with you. I'm dismayed at the news. I like Jeronne (from what I know of him) and am disappointed at the ramifications for the program, but wish him the best. I am VERY surprised to see the EXACT same statements on this board that we HAMMERED the Badger fans for only a few months ago.
I am especially upset to see people turn on Jeronne's father. From all we know, Tim has been an ardent supporter of his son, this program, and of Vander throughout the last months. I don't understand or agree with the majority of posts that have speculated about his role in this occurrance and or knocked his character. I especially abhor the several 10 second clips posted to try to make him look stupid.
I guess I was actually naive enough to believe that the community of Marquette fans was above this sort of drivel. I guess not. I sincerely hope that this emotional outpouring does not hinder our program moving forward.
You can say all you want about how this is a message board and emotions run high. You can claim that people are more heated and reactionary in online forums, and that this is the norm. In the end, it's about having SELF CONTROL, and it seems to me that this is a basic life skill that most here do not have. I hope that there is a significant amount of crow eating from these dudes in the next several days as this unfolds.
Best wishes to Jeronne and his family. I hope Jmay has a great career in D1 athletics, and that there can be an attitude of mutual respect and understanding between himself and the Marquette program.
Quote from: BirkieWarrior on December 15, 2009, 10:39:20 AM
I am especially upset to see people turn on Jeronne's father. From all we know, Tim has been an ardent supporter of his son, this program, and of Vander throughout the last months. I don't understand or agree with the majority of posts that have speculated about his role in this occurrance and or knocked his character.
Generally, where there is smoke, there's fire. He has a meddlesome history/reputation strong enough that certain schools didn't even attempt to recruit Jeronne, and he felt the need to lie and say he said he had no knowledge of this.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on December 15, 2009, 11:03:38 AM
Generally, where there is smoke, there's fire. He has a meddlesome history/reputation strong enough that certain schools didn't even attempt to recruit Jeronne, and he felt the need to lie and say he said he had no knowledge of this.
All potentially true statements, but what harm comes from waiting for the facts to come out before issuing judgment. As far as I have seen, there has not been evidence to prove that he knew this was going to happen or that he was its cause. Not saying it's impossible, just that it hasn't been substantiated. What has been substantiated is that from what we've seen in public (the WI game on Saturday, for example), he's been repping MU proudly. Nothing/no one is hurt by waiting for the facts.
There is a lot more wrong with society than this.
lets be clear, 20+ individuals are NOT kids and are held responsible for their actions, or at least should be. College, among other things, is about life lessons and thats why some fail. They simple cant handle it while the vast majority can.
Quote from: bilsu on December 15, 2009, 11:12:05 AM
There is a lot more wrong with society than this.
+1,000,000
Cable news and reality television immediately come to mind.
Quote from: bma725 on December 15, 2009, 09:41:16 AM
Amen.
Let's remember, this board is read by parents, family members, recruits etc. Regardless of whether anyone claimed to know anything or not, the speculative crap is just as bad.
Think about it for a second....
Jeronne is a kid from the most powerful high school basketball program in the state, the only one that turns out high major players every year. You want to alienate that program because you bashed one of their own?
Jeronne is a kid who's best friend is the crown jewel of next year's class, and despite what his mom has said, nothing is ever final until the recruit shows up on campus. Do you want to take the chance of angering VB and company to the point where they feel like they did during the UW fiasco and decide MU isn't the place for them?
Jeronne's aunt just happens to be the legal guardian of Junior Lomomba, another Memorial product that MU has been recruiting very hard. Do you really want to alienate that family and virtually guarantee no shot at continuing the Memorial pipeline with another Top 100 kid in 2012?
I'm all for freedom of speech, but at some point on a fan forum people have to realize that the needs of the program should outweigh their right to say whatever the heck they feel like saying.
No good comes from posts like we've seen over the last 12+ hours.
Amen, Brother!
Big news like this tends to bring the crazies (and the imposters) out of the wood work to throw their two cents in. I'm not saying their two cents aren't worth a damn, but their two cents usually aren't well thought out and tend to be much more inflammatory.
talking heads ramble
a stream rushes to the sea
too fast for comfort
Quote from: Hards_Alumni on December 15, 2009, 05:56:20 PM
Amen, Brother!
Big news like this tends to bring the crazies (and the imposters) out of the wood work to throw their two cents in. I'm not saying their two cents aren't worth a damn, but their two cents usually aren't well thought out and tend to be much more inflammatory.
Hards, you and I disagree a lot of the time...
This is not one of those times!
I agree with you 100%.
Quote from: 2002mualum on December 15, 2009, 06:42:32 PM
Hards, you and I disagree a lot of the time...
This is not one of those times!
I agree with you 100%.
I agree with your agreement.
First, let me say this. There is no place for personal attacks against a kid or his family because of his interaction with a bball program. That said, I really don't think there have been that many posts bashing Jeronne and his family personally. It certainly is not the majority.
As for some of the other points raised in the initial post and throughout the thread, I have some thoughts.
Yes, we all have made mistakes or demonstrated poor judgement as a college kid but most of us learned the hard way at some point that life isn't just about you, and your decisions carry consequences, intended or otherwise, that impact a lot of people. Handling a player with kid gloves because he is talented or you are afraid to piss off his 5 star friend or high school/AAU coach is sending the wrong message. If JM wants to quit the team mid-season, then he should be ready to deal with the consequences. If he wants to be treated like every other college kid and make his mistakes in relative anonymity, then he should just go be a regular college kid. I am not going to call JM or Tim names but I am also going to voice my opinion that his behavior is selfish and immature and he won't be successful in bball or anything else in life if he walks away when things get tough or the when someone has the balls to tell him no. If anything I have said above would cause a recruit to stay away from MU or alienate a coach or parent, then so be it.
warthog-driver: the poems stopped being fun/funny/clever a long time ago.
I know nothing about Jerrone Maymon. In fact, I just had to question whether I spelled his name right.
Nonetheless, I would bet my car that a large part of why he left is because 1) he thinks he is better than he really is and 2) he wasn't getting as many minutes as he wanted.
Anything else is just side-notes to these reasons.
I thought the MU fans have been pretty good in being respectful. Kind of like a breakup with an old flame. It is easier to find a fault than to find a compliment. This board is unknown to most rodent fans. But the other board has been overrun with them claiming Maymon wasn't good enough for UW but at the same time having to point out the faults of the Maymons to us. It has been absolutely repulsive.
Quote from: bma725 on December 15, 2009, 09:41:16 AM
Amen.
Let's remember, this board is read by parents, family members, recruits etc. Regardless of whether anyone claimed to know anything or not, the speculative crap is just as bad.
Think about it for a second....
Jeronne is a kid from the most powerful high school basketball program in the state, the only one that turns out high major players every year. You want to alienate that program because you bashed one of their own?
Jeronne is a kid who's best friend is the crown jewel of next year's class, and despite what his mom has said, nothing is ever final until the recruit shows up on campus. Do you want to take the chance of angering VB and company to the point where they feel like they did during the UW fiasco and decide MU isn't the place for them?
Jeronne's aunt just happens to be the legal guardian of Junior Lomomba, another Memorial product that MU has been recruiting very hard. Do you really want to alienate that family and virtually guarantee no shot at continuing the Memorial pipeline with another Top 100 kid in 2012?
I'm all for freedom of speech, but at some point on a fan forum people have to realize that the needs of the program should outweigh their right to say whatever the heck they feel like saying.
No good comes from posts like we've seen over the last 12+ hours.
I agree that wild speculation isn't appropriate. But I don't blame anyone for voicing their displeasure with this entire situation. I don't care who reads this...this isn't just some seashells and balloons fan page.
(Like the reference???)
Quote from: MUeng on December 15, 2009, 11:17:14 AM
lets be clear, 20+ 18+ individuals are NOT kids and are held responsible for their actions, or at least should be.
Fixed. I was always told that if I want to be treated as an adult, then I have to act like an adult. I'm fully an adult age-wise - and nearing adulthood emotionally - and I definitely believe this to be true.