What's the story on him? He was at Madness and he would obviously be a nice signing. I think I saw an interview with him saying he wasn't committing until spring...can anyone confirm this or give a lil more insight?
Thanks
I'd be genuinely surprised if he didn't go to tenneesee or memphis.
Saw this on a Memphis site. Its dated prior to his MM visit. Dan Wolken is some kind of memphis recruiting Guru
per Dan Wolken of the Commercial Appeal
11:04 Dan Wolken: Well, the word among people I talk to in the local basketball community is that his high school coach, Wes Henning, has a lot of influence over Black right now and that Henning is taking him up to Marquette this weekend (for the second time; he also took him up for their elite camp). There are a lot of factors going against Memphis right now with Black, and the reality is, he's not good enough to wait on or play games with in my opinion. He has a lot of holes in his game, and Memphis is going to have to sign multiple bigs anyway, including a Juco most likely. That may be the direction this is heading.[/color]
Also for what its worth the UT boards don't think he is going there.
Quote from: MUONTOP on October 23, 2009, 11:31:59 AM
What's the story on him? He was at Madness and he would obviously be a nice signing. I think I saw an interview with him saying he wasn't committing until spring...can anyone confirm this or give a lil more insight?
That's what his family is saying,... that "he may wait to spring". As you noted, he was at Madness and he has also visited Alabama. He also wants to check out Memphis, Tenn. and Florida. All five schools have offered him and he doesn't appear to be in a rush to make a decision.
QuoteSaw this on a Memphis site. Its dated prior to his MM visit. Dan Wolken is some kind of memphis recruiting Guru
per Dan Wolken of the Commercial Appeal
11:04 Dan Wolken: Well, the word among people I talk to in the local basketball community is that his high school coach, Wes Henning, has a lot of influence over Black right now and that Henning is taking him up to Marquette this weekend (for the second time; he also took him up for their elite camp). There are a lot of factors going against Memphis right now with Black, and the reality is, he's not good enough to wait on or play games with in my opinion. He has a lot of holes in his game, and Memphis is going to have to sign multiple bigs anyway, including a Juco most likely. That may be the direction this is heading.[/color]
Also for what its worth the UT boards don't think he is going there.
That was mostly spin by a Memphis writer trying to explain why he cancelled his visit to their Madness and decided to come to Marquette Madness. If Black didn't want to visit MU, no coach in the world would be able to make him.
I think its good for MU which would otherwise seem to be at a big disadvantage relative to Memphis. This could be very much like Wilson's recruiting was last year only this time to MU's benefit. He waits till spring (not sure why), the local schools fill their scholarships,(Wolken's comment about not wanting to wait), in the spring with the local guys out of the running an out of state school has as good a chance as any. And if his coach likes Buzz that certainly doesn't hurt.
http://scouthoops.scout.com/a.z?s=75&p=2&c=912988&ssf=1&RequestedURL=http%3a%2f%2fscouthoops.scout.com%2f2%2f912988.html
I would assume that we are in his final 5 because we got an official visit from him, and a player is only allowed 5 official visits, but can anybody who has access to this confirm that we are in his final 5? And tell us any other interesting information from the article and what other 4 teams are there? Thanks.
Quote from: wadesworld on October 27, 2009, 06:11:24 PM
http://scouthoops.scout.com/a.z?s=75&p=2&c=912988&ssf=1&RequestedURL=http%3a%2f%2fscouthoops.scout.com%2f2%2f912988.html
I would assume that we are in his final 5 because we got an official visit from him, and a player is only allowed 5 official visits, but can anybody who has access to this confirm that we are in his final 5? And tell us any other interesting information from the article and what other 4 teams are there? Thanks.
wad's - see my post above. It has the information you're requesting.
Quote from: Jay Bee on October 27, 2009, 06:13:48 PM
wad's - see my post above. It has the information you're requesting.
Thanks. I was just wondering if there was any updated information. When my friends and I talked to him after MM I thought I remember him mentioning Cincinnati being involved so I thought maybe they were in the picture. Just looking for clarification.
Any truth to the rumor Black was back on campus the last day or two?
I heard he forgot his lucky toothbrush and came back to get it.
Quote from: NavinRJohnson on October 31, 2009, 09:37:10 AM
Any truth to the rumor Black was back on campus the last day or two?
I heard Vander Blue was in the library on Wednesday. That'd be a good sign if Black was also on campus.
are you guys serious? was t-black really here again? and v-blue was on campus?
I really hope he comes here. Getting Blue has really fired me up and now i am greedy and really want to seal the deal and pull in Mr. Black.
We would be so good.
so seriously, were they here?
Quote from: thanooj on November 01, 2009, 12:38:59 AM
so seriously, were they here?
The grapevine said that he was...I have no idea if its true, and I have my doubts, but that is what I was hoping to find out.
Looks like a false rumor, he was visiting Tenn. according to this guy. Not sure of his credibility but he also states the Black is "leaning" towards Marquette. link:
http://blogs.commercialappeal.com/the_memphis_edge/2009/11/short-weekend-update.html
Quote from: esotericmindguy on November 02, 2009, 12:21:15 PM
Looks like a false rumor, he was visiting Tenn. according to this guy. Not sure of his credibility but he also states the Black is "leaning" towards Marquette. link:
http://blogs.commercialappeal.com/the_memphis_edge/2009/11/short-weekend-update.html
Did anyone else read the comments underneath his blog posting:
By MartyMar on November 2, 2009 11:10 AM
Something shady going on with the Tarik Black and Marquette recruitment.
You have to wonder what's going on when a top Memphis talent is considering a cold weather school without a marquee head coach.
He could like Florida a lot after that visit too.
Home is where the heart is, Tarik. Where is your heart?Comical...Seriously though, I really hope this bloggers sources are right...a roster of Black, Blue, Jones, J-May, Cadougan, Butler, Buycks, DJO, E-Will, Fulce, O'Tule, Mbao, and a player to be named later would be pretty sick!!!
Quote from: MU_Iceman on November 02, 2009, 12:45:04 PM
Did anyone else read the comments underneath his blog posting:
By MartyMar on November 2, 2009 11:10 AM
Something shady going on with the Tarik Black and Marquette recruitment.
You have to wonder what's going on when a top Memphis talent is considering a cold weather school without a marquee head coach.
He could like Florida a lot after that visit too.
Home is where the heart is, Tarik. Where is your heart?
Comical...Seriously though, I really hope this bloggers sources are right...a roster of Black, Blue, Jones, J-May, Cadougan, Butler, Buycks, DJO, E-Will, Fulce, O'Tule, Mbao, and a player to be named later would be pretty sick!!!
Yea I found that comment pretty funny. This would be a huge get, but there is still a lot of time. From everything I've heard he would be a spring signee, so that tempers the excitement a bit. However, he would be a huge get. He sounds a little like Jeff Adrien from UCONN, a big physical athletic presence that causes a lot of problems around the basket. I've only seen a video of him which was mostly dunks, but he sounds like a great guy to play in the Big East and a type of player we haven't had in awhile (unless you count the type of player Mbakwe was supposed to be).
Quote from: MU_Iceman on November 02, 2009, 12:45:04 PM
Did anyone else read the comments underneath his blog posting:
By MartyMar on November 2, 2009 11:10 AM
Something shady going on with the Tarik Black and Marquette recruitment.
You have to wonder what's going on when a top Memphis talent is considering a cold weather school without a marquee head coach.
He could like Florida a lot after that visit too.
Home is where the heart is, Tarik. Where is your heart?
Comical...Seriously though, I really hope this bloggers sources are right...a roster of Black, Blue, Jones, J-May, Cadougan, Butler, Buycks, DJO, E-Will, Fulce, O'Tule, Mbao, and a player to be named later would be pretty sick!!!
Just remember, Memphis fans probably have the lowest IQ of all college basketball fans. Plus they're barely a mid-major based on that conference.
Memphis will fall off the map.
Quote from: TallTitan34 on November 02, 2009, 03:16:21 PM
Memphis will fall off the map.
Not likely. Pastner is still recruiting at a very high level.
Quote from: MU_Iceman on November 02, 2009, 12:45:04 PM
Did anyone else read the comments underneath his blog posting:
By MartyMar on November 2, 2009 11:10 AM
Something shady going on with the Tarik Black and Marquette recruitment.
You have to wonder what's going on when a top Memphis talent is considering a cold weather school without a marquee head coach.
He could like Florida a lot after that visit too.
Home is where the heart is, Tarik. Where is your heart?
Comical...Seriously though, I really hope this bloggers sources are right...a roster of Black, Blue, Jones, J-May, Cadougan, Butler, Buycks, DJO, E-Will, Fulce, O'Tule, Mbao, and a player to be named later would be pretty sick!!!
Guys c'mon...if anyone knows what shady recruitment looks like, it's Memphis.
Quote from: The Sultan of South Wayne on November 02, 2009, 04:01:43 PM
Guys c'mon...if anyone knows what shady recruitment looks like, it's Memphis.
;D
Would Black likely see more pt with MU than the other suitors?
Quote from: ATWizJr on November 02, 2009, 04:31:39 PM
Would Black likely see more pt with MU than the other suitors?
If your 6'8 and can rebound and play down low like he can in college, you don't need to worry about playing time no matter where you go
Referencing the Memphis article...
we should be recruiting Hippolyte Tsafack, just for his name.
Quote from: KipsBayEagle on November 02, 2009, 04:56:30 PM
If your 6'8 and can rebound and play down low like he can in college, you don't need to worry about playing time no matter where you go
Really? I thought that some on this board felt that his stock had dropped a bit. Maybe I got the wrong impression.
I'm not sure if his rep has taken a hit or not but I remember Rosiak reporting multiple sources telling him Black was pretty dominant during his scrimmage session with the team.
Quote from: ATWizJr on November 02, 2009, 07:48:12 PM
Really? I thought that some on this board felt that his stock had dropped a bit. Maybe I got the wrong impression.
When it was announced that Black would be coming to MU for Madness, (instead of Memphis,) Dan Wolken said some things about Black.
These things suggested that the recruitment was dirty, and that Memphis was moving on from him, he wasnt that good, blah blah blah. "He doesnt want to come here, we didnt want him anyways..." That kind of stuff...
Quote from: GOMU1104 on November 02, 2009, 09:42:27 PM
When it was announced that Black would be coming to MU for Madness, (instead of Memphis,) Dan Wolken said some things about Black.
These things suggested that the recruitment was dirty, and that Memphis was moving on from him, he wasnt that good, blah blah blah. "He doesnt want to come here, we didnt want him anyways..." That kind of stuff...
Bo Pastner cooled on him. Probably didn't think he could handle the rigor of playing teams like Rice and Southern Methodist night in and night out.
From another Dan Wolken article earlier this year:
"Tarik Black (6-7 center, Ridgeway/Memphis): For Pastner, getting two high-level local prospects in his first full recruiting class would send a powerful message about the direction of the program under the new regime. In fact, if Calipari was still coaching at Memphis, Black would have practically been a lock to go elsewhere. Academics are a priority for Black and his family, so Duke and UCLA could end up being seriously involved. Having Elliot Williams on campus will be helpful for Pastner, who can make the case that an academically oriented player fits well with his program. Black, ranked No. 43 by Rivals, is a powerful athlete but will need to do a lot of skill development to be an elite college player."
Doesn't sound like it would be an academic issue...
Does anyone have rivals insider access for the Whispers: Leader emerging for Black? article? I know that the Memphis blog had us as the leader, just wondering if this had some more info about that. Also I see Tony Mitchell is down to 3 on rivals, Georgtown, Mizzou and Marquette. He has Marq listed has medium interest but he had many more schools listed just a couple days ago. Does anyone know if he has unofficially visited or plans on visiting here?
The Rivals article does nothing but restate the speculation that was in the Memphis blog without actually citing them as a source.
Quote from: jono21 on November 03, 2009, 02:54:25 PM
Does anyone have rivals insider access for the Whispers: Leader emerging for Black? article? I know that the Memphis blog had us as the leader, just wondering if this had some more info about that. Also I see Tony Mitchell is down to 3 on rivals, Georgtown, Mizzou and Marquette. He has Marq listed has medium interest but he had many more schools listed just a couple days ago. Does anyone know if he has unofficially visited or plans on visiting here?
Not sure if Mitchell has been on campus, but the coaching staff has had an in-home visit with him.
Quote from: Pakuni on November 03, 2009, 04:03:48 PMNot sure if Mitchell has been on campus, but the coaching staff has had an in-home visit with him.
I would love to have him on the team. Rivals/Yahoo has him rated as a 5 star and the number 15 player overall for 2010. http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/recruiting/player-Tony-Mitchell-84314
ESPN has him rated at 94 and has some pretty high remarks for himhttp://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/player?recruitId=73058&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fncb%2frecruiting%2ftracker%2fplayer%3frecruitId%3d73058
He's a Dallas kid. Use your Texas connection, Buzz!
Also interesting, rival's front page for basketball recruiting is an article on Tarik Black.
http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/
Mitchell fits the mold of what Buzz is looking for. 6'6" small forward from Texas.
I have insider on rivals
TARIK BLACK
During the travel team circuit, conventional wisdom had Memphis Magic teammates Joe Jackson and Tarik Black pegged as a package deal - most likely to Memphis. Jackson did commit to Memphis almost two months ago. Black, however, has yet to follow.
In fact, it now appears as if Marquette might be the front-runner out of a group of five schools for Black, a 6-foot-7, 230-pound post player from Memphis Ridgeway High School.
Now that the travel circuit is over and the high school season is gearing up, Ridgeway coach Wes Henning has taken a much more prominent role in guiding Black through the recruiting process.
Henning has strong ties to the current Marquette coaching staff, and Black took his first visit of the fall to Marquette for its midnight madness festivities.
Alabama, Tennessee, Florida and Memphis are the other schools in the hunt for Black, the No. 47-ranked prospect in the Rivals150. Black is coming off a weekend visit to Tennessee and has also visited Alabama. Florida and Memphis might also receive visits from Black.
TONY MITCHELL
Speaking of bursting onto the national scene, no prospect's stock increased more over the summer than Dallas Pinkston forward Tony Mitchell. A freak athlete but also a skilled wing player, Mitchell unofficially visited Georgetown this past weekend.
Those close to the situation say that ultimately it will be a battle between Missouri and Georgetown for Mitchell's signature. Marquette is also in the mix.
thanks todd.
I like the word "frontrunner". Looking good with Black, close the deal Buzz...
This is a big if, but IF we get TB, who do we want next? A JC big still, back PG, a project big, or someone else? I think that Buzz will go after best player regardless of position, which is a pretty solid strategy, IMO.
This would be huge.
Quote from: Todd Warner on November 03, 2009, 11:29:03 PM
Henning has strong ties to the current Marquette coaching staff, and Black took his first visit of the fall to Marquette for its midnight madness festivities.
Can anyone elaborate?
Quote from: radome on November 04, 2009, 07:28:39 AM
This is a big if, but IF we get TB, who do we want next?
IDK. That Tony Mitchell kid sounds pretty good to me. Freak athlete...Skilled wing...sign me up.
Seriously, man would it be sweet if Black were to commit just before the season started. Snatching Blue out of Madison, and then a player like that out of Memphis? Come on.
Quote from: Henry Sugar on November 04, 2009, 07:36:17 AM
Can anyone elaborate?
I don't know about the strong connection, but it's possible Buzz and Henning stayed at the same Holiday Inn Express back in May...
http://www.camppros.com/register/detail.aspx?ListingId=724&OrgId=84
Quote from: radome on November 04, 2009, 07:28:39 AM
This is a big if, but IF we get TB, who do we want next? A JC big still, back PG, a project big, or someone else? I think that Buzz will go after best player regardless of position, which is a pretty solid strategy, IMO.
A lights out shooter...
More in today's NBE basketball report, similar to the Rivals note above:
In a small, but significant recruiting update, Dan Wolken writes in his Short Weekend Update for the Memphis Edge that reliable people in recent days have told him that Tarik Black is leaning to Marquette. The 6-foot-7, 230-lb Memphis (TN) native visited the Golden Eagles for Marquette Madness recently. He is also considering Tennessee, Florida, Alabama and the local Memphis program, which many thought he would ultimately end up with. Ridgeway High School coach Wes Henning has close ties to the MU coaching staff and those ties have put Buzz Williams' program in good position in this race.
link: http://w3.nbebasketball.com/2009/11/04/big-east-news-notes-1142009-2/
Quote from: muarmy81 on November 04, 2009, 09:10:42 AM
A lights out shooter...
IF a Novak-type shooter is available then yes, I agree that that would be a good snag.
But I think that the other real need is a JUCO PG to come in an provide some minutes at the 1. Jeff Goodman from Fox Sports said it himself, DJO is NOT a true PG and looks a little uncomfortable there and the same goes for Buycks. We don't know what kind of player Cadougan is going to be yet and we have several versatile 2's and 3's on next year's roster (Blue projects as more of a 2)...I think we need to bring in a TRUE PG to provide some reliability and depth at a position that will really be an unknown for us next season.
But again, if a LIGHTS OUT shooter is available (who isn't 6'0" tall)...it's hard to pass on him...either of those scenarios would be fine with me...
Someone to Keep an eye on this year who looks to be a good shooter would be Kahlil McDonald. He is back at Blinn JC in TEXAS and they list him at 6-4, and he shoot 53% from the 3 point line last year. He was also a 1st Team Pre-season Juco which just means people expect him to have another good year.
If we take a JUCO I want him to be one of the TOP 3-4 player's in the JUCO ranks. Which I would say Dwight and DJO would fall in that category.
Trend, Lott, would not.
A PG is definately needed. Particularly, we need someone who can step up and play defense on a quick point guard. Ideally, it would be nice if Jamail Jones can really guard PGs. Then it would be like having Scottie Pippen as a big player putting pressure on point guards. Maybe we can even teach him to play a point forward if he is an athletic, good shooter like some of his reviews say.
Black would be such a good get for Buzz though. He can come in and be that missing piece.
Does Coleman have to go to JUCO, does anyone have new info about him because just today ESPNs recruiting page main story has Coleman on the front. The article http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/mens/news/story?id=4619108 and it seems as though he has always had Marquette has his first choice.
Quote from: kmwtrucks on November 04, 2009, 11:04:10 AM
Someone to Keep an eye on this year who looks to be a good shooter would be Kahlil McDonald. He is back at Blinn JC in TEXAS and they list him at 6-4, and he shoot 53% from the 3 point line last year. He was also a 1st Team Pre-season Juco which just means people expect him to have another good year.
If we take a JUCO I want him to be one of the TOP 3-4 player's in the JUCO ranks. Which I would say Dwight and DJO would fall in that category.
Trend, Lott, would not.
I was wondering if he was still in the picture. The thing about him was he was something like one credit short to be able to play this year. As I remember the story you need two full-time years at a junior college and his first semester he took one less credit than fulltime and therefore did not qualify under the two year fulltime rule. The question this raises in my mind is if he would be eligible after the first semester of this year? I believe MU has an open scholarship?
My only thought on the Mid Year eligibility would be is this. I thought that if he was not on a basketball roster this year and not playing that would have been a possiblity, but I would be shocked if the NCAA would let him play 8 games at a JC, and then 18 games for MU. That would just seem against what the NCAA would like.
In all honesty I really do not know.
Quote from: jono21 on November 04, 2009, 11:27:33 AM
Does Coleman have to go to JUCO, does anyone have new info about him because just today ESPNs recruiting page main story has Coleman on the front. The article http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/mens/news/story?id=4619108 and it seems as though he has always had Marquette has his first choice.
No one will know for sure whether he's going the JUCO route until his school year is over. But given what's been said by those in the know, his grades are not something he'll be able to make up by doing well this year so we shouldn't even be thinking about him as a possibility.
ESPN and the other services don't like to talk about academics, so the fact that the kid may not play college b-ball until 2012 is not important to them.
Quote from: MU_Iceman on November 04, 2009, 10:54:37 AM
IF a Novak-type shooter is available then yes, I agree that that would be a good snag.
But I think that the other real need is a JUCO PG to come in an provide some minutes at the 1. Jeff Goodman from Fox Sports said it himself, DJO is NOT a true PG and looks a little uncomfortable there and the same goes for Buycks. We don't know what kind of player Cadougan is going to be yet and we have several versatile 2's and 3's on next year's roster (Blue projects as more of a 2)...I think we need to bring in a TRUE PG to provide some reliability and depth at a position that will really be an unknown for us next season.
But again, if a LIGHTS OUT shooter is available (who isn't 6'0" tall)...it's hard to pass on him...either of those scenarios would be fine with me...
I'm still sticking with not wanting another point guard. Unless we're concerned about injuries, this player won't belong on the court. I said the following in another thread and I think it rings even more true if we have Black taking up healthy minutes at the 4-5:
QuoteI'd rather play someone who isn't a "100% true point guard" but has talent. With Butler, Jones, Maymon, Fulce, Williams, and anyone who fills the two open slots, and maybe some minutes in a small lineup for Blue/DJO/Buycks, the 3-4 are covered. You have 80 minutes per game to give at the point and 2. If Cadougan's healthy he would be good for 25+, Blue could be good enough to get 30+, Buycks as a senior and a healthy DJO with this year to get experience could get 20+ each. If it boils down to a Juco junior or 2-star freshman to have a "true" point guard, give me Blue or Buycks at the point instead rather than limiting their time on the floor for lesser talent. If there aren't any injuries, any new 2010 guard would have to get redshirted. A pure shooter might be the exception, but they would still be getting maybe 5 minutes per game.
If we want a Juco/2-star freshman point guard for depth, they should be prepared to be redshirted if no injuries occur. There's no way to justify putting them on the floor because they won't have the value of playing Buycks as a senior or a top player like Blue slightly out of position.
I'll say go with the best player available. If it's a four star point guard that is good enough to compete with Cadougan for time instead of a "fill-in", then sure. If it's a 6'11" tree, go ahead. The other option that hasn't been really discussed is taking a transfer. We haven't had one since Acker, but we seem to have the luxury of taking someong with a year or two of D1 experience to sit for a year and play in 2011-2012.
making the giant assumption that we bring in Black along with Blue and Jones, and the rest of our roster stays the same. IE we only have 1 more SHIP open. It has to be a someone that can handle the ball. It may not have to be a pure point, But 4 gaurds on a roster is not enough, you have to have 5. Think about when Travis went down, and we were short ballhandler's. We were terrible.
Yeah, but that was when we had an idiot for a coach.
I am not worried about the JUCO route and evening scholarships. If you keep bringing in better talent some of it will depart for the NBA early and all the worry was for naught
Assuming that Black comes to MU and no roster changes (because that is guaranteed ::)), now is the time to take a Christopherson/Chapman type. A 6'4 shooter who may need to develop in other areas. Gives you a 5th guard, opens up some three guard sets, etc.
I'd rather take a defensive specialist than a low ceiling Christopherson, Chapman type who will probably transfer eventually anyway.
Another banger, or Carson DesRosier skill set in a perfect world.
Otherwise the best all around guard you can find.
Quote from: chapman on November 04, 2009, 12:43:35 PMIf we want a Juco/2-star freshman point guard for depth, they should be prepared to be redshirted if no injuries occur. There's no way to justify putting them on the floor because they won't have the value of playing Buycks as a senior or a top player like Blue slightly out of position.
I'll say go with the best player available. If it's a four star point guard that is good enough to compete with Cadougan for time instead of a "fill-in", then sure. If it's a 6'11" tree, go ahead. The other option that hasn't been really discussed is taking a transfer. We haven't had one since Acker, but we seem to have the luxury of taking someong with a year or two of D1 experience to sit for a year and play in 2011-2012.
There are a number of reasons why a JUCO PG is the right move:
1) It helps balance out the classes (which is a goal of Buzz's)
- You aren't going to get a Freshman PG to come to MU next year because, technically, Cadougan is going to be a frosh. HS kids commit because they see a role for themselves. If a highly regarded PG is already there AND would be in the same graduating class, you have no shot at landing the HS kid
2) A JUCO PG is more likely to commit to a back up role than a HS kid
- In many cases, these JUCO kids are simply looking for an opportunity to contribute on a bigger stage. He would come in knowing his role and, unlike the 2-star HS PG you reference, he would have some experience playing against better competition
3) Strong PG play is what wins in March
- Now let me clarify this, obviously it is important to have an inside presence, but in our situation - if Black were to commit - MU's roster would have three guards who are heralded as scorers (Buycks, DJO, Blue), we have a great deal of depth when it comes to versatile forwards who are 6'6" to 6'8" (Butler, Fulce, Maymon, E-Will, Jamail Jones, Black) and two guys over 6'10" (O'Tule, Mbao)...what good are any of them if you don't have players who can beat pressure and distribute the ball...because while adding a shooter or big man is always great, you only have JR to run the point...and let us not forget that he has never played a college game AND he's coming off of a VERY serious injury
We all preach the importance of a balanced roster...but it's more important for a team to have a roster that is well balanced BY POSITION than it is a roster that is well balanced by graduation class...we NEED another PG on this roster come next year...
[/list][/list]
Quote from: MU_Iceman on November 05, 2009, 10:39:38 AM
There are a number of reasons why a JUCO PG is the right move:
1) It helps balance out the classes (which is a goal of Buzz's)
- You aren't going to get a Freshman PG to come to MU next year because, technically, Cadougan is going to be a frosh. HS kids commit because they see a role for themselves. If a highly regarded PG is already there AND would be in the same graduating class, you have no shot at landing the HS kid
2) A JUCO PG is more likely to commit to a back up role than a HS kid
- In many cases, these JUCO kids are simply looking for an opportunity to contribute on a bigger stage. He would come in knowing his role and, unlike the 2-star HS PG you reference, he would have some experience playing against better competition
3) Strong PG play is what wins in March
- Now let me clarify this, obviously it is important to have an inside presence, but in our situation - if Black were to commit - MU's roster would have three guards who are heralded as scorers (Buycks, DJO, Blue), we have a great deal of depth when it comes to versatile forwards who are 6'6" to 6'8" (Butler, Fulce, Maymon, E-Will, Jamail Jones, Black) and two guys over 6'10" (O'Tule, Mbao)...what good are any of them if you don't have players who can beat pressure and distribute the ball...because while adding a shooter or big man is always great, you only have JR to run the point...and let us not forget that he has never played a college game AND he's coming off of a VERY serious injury
We all preach the importance of a balanced roster...but it's more important for a team to have a roster that is well balanced BY POSITION than it is a roster that is well balanced by graduation class...we NEED another PG on this roster come next year...
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I'm still not convinced that it's at all a need. I just don't see where you justify cutting minutes for Cadougan, Blue, or Buycks to fit a much less talented Juco point guard in the mix next year. Put Blue at the point when Cadougan is on the bench. Especially with Black there would be so much depth at the 3-5 that Blue will not be sliding over to the 3 and have to get minutes at the 1-2. Unless you want to cut Buycks and DJO down to 10 combined minutes then you put Blue at the point. Blue would be a better point guard option than any Juco junior who would come for two years to sit on our bench. He's not billed at just a scorer, but a very good passer who sees the court well. You're not going to find a Juco point guard that you would want on the floor over Blue. The following year you can afford to do it; with Buycks, Butler, and Fulce gone there will be more time for Blue at the 2-3, which is why you're better off taking a transfer or waiting a year on a point guard.
We will know by the spring signing period if we need another point guard. DJO and/or Buyckes will show whether they can or cannot play point guard. Buzz will know alot more on how Cadougan is healing.
Quote from: tower912 on November 04, 2009, 01:49:50 PM
Assuming that Black comes to MU and no roster changes (because that is guaranteed ::)), now is the time to take a Christopherson/Chapman type. A 6'4 shooter who may need to develop in other areas. Gives you a 5th guard, opens up some three guard sets, etc.
If you do this, I would imagine that this player would be redshirted his freshman year. It could work, but I would hate for the kid to think the sky is his limit (a la Rosebrough) only to find out he's a bad player in the NCAA's best conference.
Buzz has said he wants 5 guards on his roster.
For 2010, we currently have 4 guards on the roster (DB, DJO, JC, VB). Therefore...I believe there will be another guard added to this 2010 class.
This doesnt mean it will be a guard that will demand/expect/deserve much PT...but rather one that understands what is role will be.
Could be a JUCO or a HS player.
who necessarily says he takes minutes from anyone? i agree bring in a juco Pg and he get acker minutes like acker got when DJ was healthy.. a minute or two ahalf but not all the time and then a few mop up mintues in blow outs. a pure backup.
now are you going to get a 3 star player to sign up for that no. or a juco AA...no. but maybe a kid who was a 1 or 2 star player in hs who has gotten better and matured skill wise and physically and would be acceptable with being brought in as a back up. that would be happy with that role given the opportunity to play in the BE and be a part of a really good team for two yerars and get a great degree.
Quote from: chapman on November 05, 2009, 12:31:44 PM
I'm still not convinced that it's at all a need. I just don't see where you justify cutting minutes for Cadougan, Blue, or Buycks to fit a much less talented Juco point guard in the mix next year. Put Blue at the point when Cadougan is on the bench. Especially with Black there would be so much depth at the 3-5 that Blue will not be sliding over to the 3 and have to get minutes at the 1-2. Unless you want to cut Buycks and DJO down to 10 combined minutes then you put Blue at the point. Blue would be a better point guard option than any Juco junior who would come for two years to sit on our bench. He's not billed at just a scorer, but a very good passer who sees the court well. You're not going to find a Juco point guard that you would want on the floor over Blue. The following year you can afford to do it; with Buycks, Butler, and Fulce gone there will be more time for Blue at the 2-3, which is why you're better off taking a transfer or waiting a year on a point guard.
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Quote from: MR.HAYWARD on November 05, 2009, 05:12:09 PM
who necessarily says he takes minutes from anyone? i agree bring in a juco Pg and he get acker minutes like acker got when DJ was healthy.. a minute or two ahalf but not all the time and then a few mop up mintues in blow outs. a pure backup.
now are you going to get a 3 star player to sign up for that no. or a juco AA...no. but maybe a kid who was a 1 or 2 star player in hs who has gotten better and matured skill wise and physically and would be acceptable with being brought in as a back up. that would be happy with that role given the opportunity to play in the BE and be a part of a really good team for two yerars and get a great degree.
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You just proved my point. You described a player that can't get minutes on any other team and will only play if someone gets hurt. The Blackledge of point guards. And as I said, we don't need that player like has been suggested. It's just extra, hardly necessary depth. In that case bringing in a player to play walk-on minutes in case someone gets hurt would be no more valuable than bringing in another wing who is halfway decent in case someone transfers.
well chapman you need to be realistic here...there are 13 available scholarships but show me a team that hey all get minutes. the point simply is next year you have blue, buycks djo and junior. 4 is fine unless one gets hurt...sort of like this year a guy like acker is not reaally needed unless. ....doh! i will be impossible to get a good one but a capable player ala a trend type pg just might come in handy if for no other reason than to save a guy in mop up time. nice thing with a juco to is you can refill his scolie in 2 years when guard playing time will be reopening
Quote from: MR.HAYWARD on November 05, 2009, 08:14:30 PM
well chapman you need to be realistic here...there are 13 available scholarships but show me a team that hey all get minutes. the point simply is next year you have blue, buycks djo and junior. 4 is fine unless one gets hurt...sort of like this year a guy like acker is not reaally needed unless. ....doh! i will be impossible to get a good one but a capable player ala a trend type pg just might come in handy if for no other reason than to save a guy in mop up time. nice thing with a juco to is you can refill his scolie in 2 years when guard playing time will be reopening
+100000000000000
Chapman, there isn't a team in the NCAA that plays all 13 players even minutes...every team is going to have a "scrub"...in fact, they'll probably have a "scrub" at every position.
PG is arguably the most important position on your roster. Now you keep talking like JR is going to come in like a 5th year, senior, all-american who has no lingering health issues and can give us 40 minutes a game...even if he was that player, I don't think you'd find a coach in the college basketball ranks who would say that he didn't feel that a back-up pg was necessary...you need to have a security blanket when people get into fould trouble, for mop up time, and when, god forbid, someone get's hurt. If they don't bring in a back up and JR goes down, you honestly would be comfortable with a bunch of off guards trying to run your offense and guard another team's pg?
Quote from: MR.HAYWARD on November 05, 2009, 08:14:30 PM
nice thing with a juco to is you can refill his scolie in 2 years when guard playing time will be reopening
Or you could bank it or get a transfer, because then Buycks, Butler, and Fulce leave there will be minutes to fill in one year with a worthwhile player instead of keeping a waste on your team for two.
The simple fact is Cadougan can give us 20 minutes and we would be fine. Blue won't be playing much, if at all at the 3 when you have Jones, Butler, Williams, Fulce, Maymon, this hypothetical Black, Otule, and Mbao at the 3-5. Blue is probably a better point guard than any Juco player in the country, much less some scrub that realistically would have low-major talent. If Blue would play the point for 20 minutes and the 2 guard for ten, you would still have just 30 minutes for Buycks and DJO to play combined so you miss nothing. If Cadougan would turn out to be a 5 mpg player or (God forbid) Blue would miss any time to injury, then sure give me a backup point guard. But in the same situation, if Black would come in and get hurt, then we'd be right back at square one of wanting a powerful 4/5, so we'd like an extra one of those for depth too. Assuming no one gets hurt, this last player is competing for time where there isn't any regardless of position. If they can distribute the ball, they might get 4 minutes every other game. If they can shoot, same thing. If they're big and can sit in the middle, same thing. It's nice to have X or Y, but we don't have this glaring "need" for anyone if we land Black.
Can we move these side conversations about who we recruit next into the other threads that are about other recruits and where to go next? I keep coming on here hoping to find any updated information on Traik Black's situation and I have to read through a page and a half of other stuff.
Quote from: wadesworld on November 05, 2009, 09:05:30 PM
Can we move these side conversations about who we recruit next into the other threads that are about other recruits and where to go next? I keep coming on here hoping to find any updated information on Traik Black's situation and I have to read through a page and a half of other stuff.
+1,000,000
I'm looking for updates too.
http://northcarolina.scout.com/a.z?s=78&p=2&c=917778&ssf=1&RequestedURL=http%3a%2f%2fnorthcarolina.scout.com%2f2%2f917778.html
I'm just searching Google for Tarik Black and this article came up with the preview saying "With Black, Marquette is beginning to make a strong move. But Memphis, Tennessee , Florida and Alabama are still on his list. Recently Tarik's mother ..."
Can anybody who has a Scout account inform us of any new information or what Tarik's mother said? It would be greatly appreciated.
Quote from: GOMU1104 on November 05, 2009, 01:51:52 PM
Buzz has said he wants 5 guards on his roster.
For 2010, we currently have 4 guards on the roster (DB, DJO, JC, VB). Therefore...I believe there will be another guard added to this 2010 class.
This doesnt mean it will be a guard that will demand/expect/deserve much PT...but rather one that understands what is role will be.
Could be a JUCO or a HS player.
I think you can add Jamail Jones to the guard group. From what I've read on him, he souds pretty much like a Wes Matthews clone.
Quote from: wadesworld on November 09, 2009, 12:24:42 PM
http://northcarolina.scout.com/a.z?s=78&p=2&c=917778&ssf=1&RequestedURL=http%3a%2f%2fnorthcarolina.scout.com%2f2%2f917778.html
I'm just searching Google for Tarik Black and this article came up with the preview saying "With Black, Marquette is beginning to make a strong move. But Memphis, Tennessee , Florida and Alabama are still on his list. Recently Tarik's mother ..."
Can anybody who has a Scout account inform us of any new information or what Tarik's mother said? It would be greatly appreciated.
Old news but here it is...
"With Black, Marquette is beginning to make a strong move. But Memphis, Tennessee, Florida and Alabama are still on his list. Recently Tarik's mother – Judith – told Scout.com the plan was for him to sign late."
Update from http://thememphisedge.com/
[Comment From MikeMike: ]
Tarik Black? Any updates on where he is leaning? Do you think JJ and WB are helping to recruit him?
Tuesday November 10, 2009 11:29 Mike
11:30
Dan Wolken:
I talked to someone last night who is very closely connected to the Tarik Black situation. He told me that he has no idea what Black is going to do. Again, if Memphis has other bigs ready to go, they are going to go ahead and sign them and not wait for Black to make a decision. He's had every opportunity. I know that Jackson, Barton and Crawford are working him hard.
Looks like no one knows anything.
Good for the kid. I wish more recruits kept their decisions to themselves rather than having different things leak to different schools.
leaks tend to do more damage than good. I respect TB for playing it close to his chest.
http://scouthoops.scout.com/a.z?s=75&p=8&c=1&nid=4168651
With Memphis getting this guy at Center today, probably means they are now cooled on Black.
Our odds just got extremely improved with this signing.
Come on Buzz.
Good for us. Git 'em Buzz!
I assume Black wants to play power forward, so signing a center does not hurt Memphis's chances with Black.
With a "premier" center, there's less than Black can do down in and around the block.
Plus the C-USA is not the Frontcourt powerhouse conference that the BEast is
Don't fall asleep on Bama. new coach whose team needs a serious talent up grade--decent conference and closer to home. Jones is an exception, but it is very hard to get kids from the South to leave.
Unless the kids are from Texas. Then Buzz can just reel them in.... ;D
Word is that UF has just signed a 5 star big man...
Quote from: LastWarrior on November 11, 2009, 01:40:46 PM
Word is that UF has just signed a 5 star big man...
A 5-star big that has been committed to UF for months and does not effect Black's decision.
If Black is as good as the hype, it doesn't matter which big signs where. What matters is where Mr. Black wants to get his minutes. Hopefully, it is MU.
How many openings does Memphis have? Does this latest commit make 5 recruits for them now?
Quote from: bma725 on November 11, 2009, 01:42:29 PM
A 5-star big that has been committed to UF for months and does not effect Black's decision.
Well... now TB REALLY knows that the 5 star is going to UF... ;D
this is a good sign that he is leaning away fro memphis...
http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school?
http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school?schoolId=235&page=briefingroom&season=2010&action=login&appRedirect=http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school%3fschoolId%3d235%26page%3dbriefingroom%26season%3d2010 (http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school?schoolId=235&page=briefingroom&season=2010&action=login&appRedirect=http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school%3fschoolId%3d235%26page%3dbriefingroom%26season%3d2010)
Quote from: muhannan on November 12, 2009, 10:36:42 AM
this is a good sign that he is leaning away fro memphis...
http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school?
http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school?schoolId=235&page=briefingroom&season=2010&action=login&appRedirect=http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school%3fschoolId%3d235%26page%3dbriefingroom%26season%3d2010 (http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school?schoolId=235&page=briefingroom&season=2010&action=login&appRedirect=http://insider.espn.go.com/ncb/recruiting/tracker/school%3fschoolId%3d235%26page%3dbriefingroom%26season%3d2010)
The first one is a list of all NCAA schools. The other is a blog that does not mention Tarik Black. What is a good sign?
Quote from: wadesworld on November 12, 2009, 01:58:49 PM
The first one is a list of all NCAA schools. The other is a blog that does not mention Tarik Black. What is a good sign?
I'll ask the same question since I can't figure it out either....
I think he put the 2nd link on there because it says that Memphis got a verbal from a PF yesterday. Granted if Tarik wanted to play at Memphis they would still take him, he is much better than the kid in that post.
Wow... I hadn't checked out any of Black's film before today. Dude's a beast, and exactly the kinda of player MU has been lacking. Someone that knows how to finish down low when they get the ball... a-la Pops Mensah-Bonsu from GW of a few years back...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7l0B1PAv_E&feature=player_embedded
Quote from: Tigidal on November 12, 2009, 06:10:14 PM
Wow... I hadn't checked out any of Black's film before today. Dude's a beast, and exactly the kinda of player MU has been lacking. Someone that knows how to finish down low when they get the ball... a-la Pops Mensah-Bonsu from GW of a few years back...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7l0B1PAv_E&feature=player_embedded
holy sht no kidding. wow.
Quote from: mu89 on November 12, 2009, 06:18:18 PM
holy sht no kidding. wow.
Impressive. What intrigues me most about this kid was the comments coming from the way he played at the open gym he participated in while visiting MU. NOT to compare him to Wade in any way, but you rarely hear those comments but we heard something somewhat similar from Wade at MU practices while he was sitting a year, and also from Liam, which we'll never know on. Maybe some in the know, like BMA, are hearing those comments and thinking nothing of them and I just don't follow closely enough to know to ignore it, but those type of comments always seem to stand out to me.
Quote from: bilsu on November 11, 2009, 12:18:35 PM
I assume Black wants to play power forward, so signing a center does not hurt Memphis's chances with Black.
While Hippolyte Hsafack is listed as a center recruit, he is the EXACT same size as Black; 6' 8" and 230, although Tarik told an interviewer on YouTube in July that he was up to 236 pounds. On the plus side, no one would question his first name with a guy named Hippolyte on the team, on the down side, he would have to learn how to pronounce "Hippolyte Hsafack" since thew guy would be a teammate. ;) On the more serious side, Tarik is ranked higher than Hippolyte Hsafack, and I doubt he'd shrink from the competition. More likely, Memphis may still sign another big, but are at least looking at JCs for that spot. (maybe Monterle will have a place to go) I really think that the University of Memphis, the former Memphis State, is a longshot because every lengthly article on Black brings up academics as his first priority when selecting a school. If his heart was with Memphis, he would have announced when his buddy from AAU, Joe Jackson, did. If you're going out of town to school, comfort level is more important. That makes me think that his high school coach's high opinion of the MU coaches, is a big advantage. Memphis' one shot, IMHO, is guys from Memphis he's played with on the AAU circuit for years working on him.
Not comparing Memphis to NC, but NC has 3 PFs in the top 50 coming to them this year. Sometimes a player always thinks he is going to play.
It should be an interesting couple of days.