MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: ChicosBailBonds on October 04, 2009, 10:49:57 PM
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Jordair Jett
http://community.foxsports.com/goodmanonfox/blog/
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What is our luck with talent from Minn?
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Jordair Jett
http://community.foxsports.com/goodmanonfox/blog/
"Marquette head coach Buzz Williams was down to see the 6-foot-2, 200-pound Jett last week, and Wisconsin-Milwaukee was in attendance and able to evaluate his chair-sitting skills on Thursday."
:)
Jett was out due to bronchitis.
Also, saw this:
"Memphis picked up a commitment from wing Chris Crawford, a shooter from the city."
Last time we had a Chris Crawford, we won the conference and he became a pro! :)
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Plan C....?
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That name sounds familiar... was he one of Mbakwe's teammates in HS?
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http://scouthoops.scout.com/a.z?s=75&p=8&c=1&nid=4339028
A one star rated point guard.
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That name sounds familiar... was he one of Mbakwe's teammates in HS?
They both graduated from St. Bernard's but they weren't there at the same time. Mbakwe transferred in and played his senior year there in 2006-07. Jett transferred to St. Bernard's the following year, so by the time he got there, Mbakwe was already done.
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be careful how much stock you put into star ratings espcially of the kids that are not seen alot. I have always felt that lloking at the schools recruitng a kid is a much better indicator.
Neverthelsee, even if he was a consensus 5 star kid that would only mena we would not be getting him...unless it was an indication that Junior was on his way out. Buzz is looking for a back up plan to junior ala Acker for Dominic. Pretty hard to find a 5 star kid that is interested in being a 4 year back up. Look for Buzz to sign a PG but i would be careful how you let it affect your thoughts on his recruitng ability without considering what job that kid will fill.
Now if we can get in a big time combo guard that can play the 1 and the 2 from a little west of here we can kill two birds with one stone and be set up to contend for championships over the next 4 years.
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They both graduated from St. Bernard's but they weren't there at the same time. Mbakwe transferred in and played his senior year there in 2006-07. Jett transferred to St. Bernard's the following year, so by the time he got there, Mbakwe was already done.
Ah, that's it. I knew it sounded familiar. Thanks for clearing that up!
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What is our luck with talent from Minn?
Hockey = Good.
Hoops: Tom Copa, Rod Gross, Ryan Amaroso, Trevor Mbakwe
The only team worth recruiting for hoops in MN is Hopkins. 4 of their starting 5 last year went D1 for hoops. Their point guard went to play football somewhere.
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Hockey = Good.
Hoops: Tom Copa, Rod Gross, Ryan Amaroso, Trevor Mbakwe
The only team worth recruiting for hoops in MN is Hopkins. 4 of their starting 5 last year went D1 for hoops. Their point guard went to play football somewhere.
Dan Fitzgerald.
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Hoops: Tom Copa-decent player. Could have used him the last 4 years
Rod Grosse-rated high coming out, Dukiet failed to develop him
Ryan Amoroso- had the potential, maybe under Buzz he would have stuck around
Trevor Mbakwe-see above
that being said, I know nothing about this kid. I would rather play Monday morning quarterback after the fact ;D
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Battling UWM for him? Now that's a place we haven't been before.
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Hockey = Good.
Hoops: Tom Copa, Rod Gross, Ryan Amaroso, Trevor Mbakwe
The only team worth recruiting for hoops in MN is Hopkins. 4 of their starting 5 last year went D1 for hoops. Their point guard went to play football somewhere.
Don't forget the 7-foot threat from downtown, Mike Kinsella.
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Don't forget the 7-foot threat from downtown, Mike Kinsella.
Let's not forget Jamil Lott as well.
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Hardly a murderer's row of hoops talent. Just a bunch of journeymen, stiffs and underachievers. Would much rather see us dip back into Chicago for players. It's been far too long since we mined that area.
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I am remiss that I failed to recall Kinsella and Fitz. I still have the Pitt game on TiVo when Kinsella went off from behind the arc. That being said it isn't a very impressive list of players.
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Yes, lets see if Buzz can open up the Chicago, Detroit, NYC and the East Coast pipelines. While Crean was able to get a few role players from Michigan, it always surprised me that he didn't have more success in Michigan.
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James Matthews, Brandon Bell and Grimm, right? Michigan could have kept them.
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James Matthews, Brandon Bell and Grimm, right? Michigan could have kept them.
Grimm was a solid contributor if not a big stats guy. His efforts were a big key in those back-to-back wins over G-Town and Pitt in 2006. Now Matthews and Bell were obviously bad recruiting choices.
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Not a Grimm fan. He was an awful rebounder for his size, couldn't score in an empty gym and probably committed more moving pick violations than anyone in MU history.
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Izzo owns Michigan and now Michigan is just starting to get good relations with the PSL again. Beilein just got a commitment from Carlton Brundidge recently (4-star sg)
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Izzo owns Michigan and now Michigan is just starting to get good relations with the PSL again. Beilein just got a commitment from Carlton Brundidge recently (4-star sg)
Izzo does own Michigan, but way back when Crean was hired, Crean was the top recruiter for MSU. You would have thought that he would have enough ties developed to get a few better recruits out of Michigan then Matthews, Bell and Grimm.
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i think you could have said the same thing about Creans entire tenure as MU head coach.
It became painfully clear that Michigan state and probably Izzo is what got the players to MSu and Crean was merely along for the ride. For every good player Crean got at Mu he signed 3-4 absolute trainwrecks, nad i mean trainwrecks very very few middle of the road players during his 9 years a handful of top 100 kids that were good and another 15 or so that were barely D1 or simply not D1 talent.
terrible eye for talent and then a poor recruiter to boot.
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And yet magically won 190 games in 9 years and took us to a final 4. Magic is the only explanation since he couldn't recruit and couldn't coach. ::)
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i think you could have said the same thing about Creans entire tenure as MU head coach.
It became painfully clear that Michigan state and probably Izzo is what got the players to MSu and Crean was merely along for the ride. For every good player Crean got at Mu he signed 3-4 absolute trainwrecks, nad i mean trainwrecks very very few middle of the road players during his 9 years a handful of top 100 kids that were good and another 15 or so that were barely D1 or simply not D1 talent.
terrible eye for talent and then a poor recruiter to boot.
Crean is the Dave Wannstedt of college basketball. "Wannie" rode Jimmy Johnson's coattails to a couple head coaching jobs and was so devoid of charisma that his teams invariably failed. Wannie said all the right things, owners seemed to love him but he could never produce what his mentor did.
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Hold the phone. Maybe, I'll grant you, Crean's recruits were more feast or famine, but to say he did nothing and Izzo did it all is ludicrous.
MSU is what everyone wants MU to be. It's a "program" destination. Izzo is a big part of that, but his assistants play a huge role. And before you reach that status, you have to pay your dues and be consistently good for a long time. Crean, like it or not, played a huge role in MSU today.
I'm still surprised by our lack of success in Michigan recruiting the last 10-15 years, especially with Crean. But I think some of that is from Crean's admitted deep friendship with Izzo. I don't think TC wanted to recruit one-on-one with one of his best friends. And who knows, maybe he didn't cuz he was angling for the MSU job someday.
Either way, it's disappointing for MU, but also a testament to MSU's success that they own Michigan recruiting today.
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I don't think TC wanted to recruit one-on-one with one of his best friends.
He also didn't want to PLAY against his former employer, or against his former assistants, but look where he is now......
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Friendship my ass;
College athletics is big money business on this level. Crean didn't want to be embarassed and have his butt handed to him.
Oh, wait, that's exactly what happened to him. Izzo gave him an ass whoopin' and then called off the dogs.
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Friendship my ass;
College athletics is big money business on this level. Crean didn't want to be embarassed and have his butt handed to him.
Oh, wait, that's exactly what happened to him. Izzo gave him an ass whoopin' and then called off the dogs.
Was that the game Crean coached without his best player?
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Hold the phone. Maybe, I'll grant you, Crean's recruits were more feast or famine, but to say he did nothing and Izzo did it all is ludicrous.
Exactly. When Crean left MSU, why did their little run end? Basically they went to the Final Fours and won the national title while Crean was there or in the first year after he left (with the players Crean had brought in per Izzo). MSU then took a step back in the Big Ten for about 5 years. They were still good, but not at the level they were at.
On 4ever's comments, I'll disagree as well. There's a reason Pittsburgh isn't playing UCLA, even though it would be a marquee matchup. Dixon and Howland would rather not play each other. Some coaches like to do this, others do not.
Finally, on the Wannstadt analogy, I guess I don't see it. Crean had 9 winning records at MU as head coach and post season apperaances most of those years (all but 1). He took MU to the Final Four.
Wannstedt made the postseason ONCE in 6 years with the Bears and had 4 of his six seasons with a losing record.. I don't see how that resembles anything Crean did.
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Exactly. When Crean left MSU, why did their little run end? Basically they went to the Final Fours and won the national title while Crean was there or in the first year after he left (with the players Crean had brought in per Izzo). MSU then took a step back in the Big Ten for about 5 years. They were still good, but not at the level they were at.
On 4ever's comments, I'll disagree as well. There's a reason Pittsburgh isn't playing UCLA, even though it would be a marquette matchup. Dixon and Howland would rather not play each other. Some coaches like to do this, others do not.
Finally, on the Wannstadt analogy, I guess I don't see it. Crean had 9 winning records at MU as head coach and post season apperaances most of those years (all but 1). He took MU to the Final Four.
Wannstedt made the postseason ONCE in 6 years with the Bears and had 4 of his six seasons with a losing record.. I don't see how that resembles anything Crean did.
+1
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+1
Agreed on all accounts.
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And yet magically won 190 games in 9 years and took us to a final 4. Magic is the only explanation since he couldn't recruit and couldn't coach. ::)
+1 Terrible coach, terrible recruiter but all he did was win at the highest level and take us to the Final Four for the first time in 3 decades. I'm going to say it was not only magic, but fairy dust as well. On top of that, every other team in America was just worse which is why we did so well. On top of that, D. Wade didn't get once iota better since coming to MU, he was the #5 pick even when he sat out his first year.
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first of all the board idiot (chicos for anyone wondering) only started this entire thread to call out Buzz. Chicos has time and again called ND prep a shady diploma mill and stated Buzz should not get players from there, despite his gay lover recruiting from there.
Secondly, chicos absolutely ignorant statement that MSU went down after Crean left is simply that...entirely ignorant. yes MSU did not fair as well as far post season success but that was imply becuase they suffered from early defections to the NBA, Guys like Charlie Bell and Peterson and their PG were all great college players ala ajerel McNeal but were not exactly good enough to go pro early...them staying around allowed them to have tremendous post season success.
in the few years following that post season success MSU had mcdonald all-american recruits leave for the NBA after a single year or two...jason richardson, the point guard cant remenber his name, zach randolph , etc. those teams and players were even more talented then the title teams.
only an ignorant fool would say the program slipped after Crean left.
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first of all the board idiot (chicos for anyone wondering) only started this entire thread to call out Buzz. Chicos has time and again called ND prep a shady diploma mill and stated Buzz should not get players from there, despite his gay lover recruiting from there.
Secondly, chicos absolutely ignorant statement that MSU went down after Crean left is simply that...entirely ignorant. yes MSU did not fair as well as far post season success but that was imply becuase they suffered from early defections to the NBA, Guys like Charlie Bell and Peterson and their PG were all great college players ala ajerel McNeal but were not exactly good enough to go pro early...them staying around allowed them to have tremendous post season success.
in the few years following that post season success MSU had mcdonald all-american recruits leave for the NBA after a single year or two...jason richardson, the point guard cant remenber his name, zach randolph , etc. those teams and players were even more talented then the title teams.
only an ignorant fool would say the program slipped after Crean left.
I took you off ignore to do a little cleaning up.
1) Not gay, married happily with two kids (note, I don't send my kids to basketball or other sporting camps of coaches I disrespect or feel they are terrible coaches as this would be a disservice to my children)
2) I have NEVER called ND Prep a diploma mill. I have called other schools a diploma mill, but not ND prep. In fact, here's what I actually said...August 22, 2007
"The question for me is pretty simple. Are kids from Notre Dame Prep making the grade in college? Are they staying eligible? Are they graduating? The NCAA has already cleared this school, but unfortunately some other "prep" schools became diploma mills and as thus has tainted many of the other Prep schools.
If ND Prep kids were failing out left and right or not graduating, I think that raises a distinct red flag. If that is not happening, where is the problem?"
I have most certainly called some other prep schools diploma mills, but never ND Prep, let alone "time and again". Don't believe me, why don't you go to the search function and check yourself. The last 9999 days it says I haven't....that amounts to 27 years. Other prep schools, yes I have, but not ND Prep.
3) I started this thread because many people are interested in who we are recruiting. The VERY SAME DAY I started this thread someone said there was no recruiting news and how Buzz plays things so close to the vest. Well, I thought I would do the neighborly thing and report a bit of recruiting news that was not on this site. I happen to have high regard for ND Prep and especially for one of the coaches there that happened to be at MU when I was working the department.
4) Now, on your MSU stuff....please tell me you are joking. For one thing, it was you and a few others that kept saying here for years that all that counts is the post-season. Now, all of a sudden you care less about it because MSU took a dump a few years in the post season? How convenient. Any other goal posts you want to move?
When Izzo started as head coach he brought Crean on at the same time. The two had worked together as assistants a few years earlier. So what you're saying is, the genius and the guy that gets all the credit (Izzo) was a complete moron for bringing on Crean...it was a rare moment where his genius wasn't quite there? Afterall, he did hire him, didn't he? It's the same trap you walk into everytime you talk about Buzz. You say what a moron Crean is and you totally forget that Crean hired Buzz as an assistant and later pushed hard on MU to hire Buzz for the head coaching gig. Why, then, would you be happy that a complete moron, asshat is the sole reason why Buzz is here? Contradict yourself much?
MSU with Crean
1995-96 16-16 NIT
1996-97 17-12 NIT
1997-98 22-8 Sweet 16
1998-99 33-5 NCAA Final Four, Big Ten Championship
Crean named head coach at MU in April after Final Four run
The next two years, Crean's recruits still coming in and playing a major role
1999-00 32-7 NCAA Champions, Big Ten Champs
2000-01 28-5 NCAA Final Four, big Ten champs
Funny, now the tide slowly changes....the very last of Crean's recruits are around because so many of the other kids left early or graduated
2001-02 19-12 NCAA first round, Big Ten champs
2002-03 22-13 NCAA Elite 8
2003-04 18-12 NCAA first round
2004-05 26-7 NCAA Final Four
2005-06 22-12 NCAA first round
2006-07 23-12 NCAA 2nd round
2007-08 27-9 NCAA Sweet 16
Let's summarize....the most wins in school history...when Crean was there. Three straight Final Fours...when Crean was there or using his recruits.....national championship ...with Crean's recruits.
After Crean left....Six straight years of no Big Ten championships after winning 4 straight
If you don't think going to three straight Final Fours and winning 4 straight Big Ten titles to then going out in the 1st\2nd round 4 of the next 6 years and winning ZERO Big Ten championships ISN'T a slip, I really don't know what to think of you. It's a slip, not a major slip, but a slip. MSU is obviously back now. Last year they won the Big Ten and went to the championship game....10 years after Crean left. Now, did they accomplish all those things solely because of Crean? Absolutely not. They had other very good assistant coaches, great players (that he and others recruited), etc. But to suggest they didn't slip, please. They definitely slipped....not only because of Crean, but certainly part of it....Izzo said so himself.
There's a reason why Izzo has said time and time again that Crean was the best assistant he ever had. There's a reason why he told IU to hire him. There's a reason why he told MU to hire him. But you, in your absolute hatred of the man are colored in such a delusional fog you fail to see what's there.
Best of luck with your future lying and misstatement of facts.
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Don't you guys ever get tired of this? Every single thread. This site is barely readable in the off-season.
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Don't you guys ever get tired of this? Every single thread. This site is barely readable in the off-season.
Yes, I get tired of it....especially when lies are stated and facts be damned.
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Don't you guys ever get tired of this? Every single thread. This site is barely readable in the off-season.
It's easier to read when you press the IGNORE button. Try it. ;)
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It's easier to read when you press the IGNORE button. Try it. ;)
Exactly....24 others have gone that route and it definitely makes it easier to read.
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Chicos cant keep me on ignore though ::)
the reading comprehension is pretty weak ....i stated IZoo recruited better than ever after Crean left and had significantly better talent yet his post season and record suffered due to multiple early departures of mcdonalds all-americans and lottery choices...yet Chicos then references records and post season numbers wow!!!
Lose taylor, randolph, and richardson over the course of a few years and Chicos says your program is slipping becuase Crean left. Wow sounds like a mother defending her son
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Don't you guys ever get tired of this? Every single thread. This site is barely readable in the off-season.
Not really, it's better than most sitcom's. I thoroughly enjoy the banter.
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MSU with Crean
1995-96 16-16 NIT
1996-97 17-12 NIT
1997-98 22-8 Sweet 16
1998-99 33-5 NCAA Final Four, Big Ten Championship
Crean named head coach at MU in April after Final Four run
The next two years, Crean's recruits still coming in and playing a major role
1999-00 32-7 NCAA Champions, Big Ten Champs
2000-01 28-5 NCAA Final Four, big Ten champs
Funny, now the tide slowly changes....the very last of Crean's recruits are around because so many of the other kids left early or graduated
2001-02 19-12 NCAA first round, Big Ten champs
2002-03 22-13 NCAA Elite 8
2003-04 18-12 NCAA first round
2004-05 26-7 NCAA Final Four
2005-06 22-12 NCAA first round
2006-07 23-12 NCAA 2nd round
2007-08 27-9 NCAA Sweet 16
Let's summarize....the most wins in school history...when Crean was there. Three straight Final Fours...when Crean was there or using his recruits.....national championship ...with Crean's recruits.
After Crean left....Six straight years of no Big Ten championships after winning 4 straight
Chiocs words cut and pasted.
you will notice Chicos says MSU had its down turn in years 3-4-5 after the loss of Crean. Looking at it with absolutely zero wisdom or knowledge....par for the course for chicos....you might conclude he was right. However one only needs to recall that Izzo recruited and had yet lost after their frshman or sophomore years zach randolph, marcus taylor and jason richardson. zach randolph and jason richardson both of whom have been nba all- stars would have been juniors and seniors during two of those three years. Marcus taylor also would have greatly helped.
So the true behind the lies is during those 3 or so years Izzo was left with a very very young lineup as his stars left early. All the credit agin to Izzo in year 4 they were back to the final 4 after the youngsters had a chance to mature.
I am sure if Mu lost 3 players after there freshman or sophomore years for three staright years while Crean was head coach at Mu we would get some diatribe from chicos about if you are going to have a great program you are going to lose great players early and that might hurt your post season successes.
sort of ironic that Al McGuires greatest teams did not always have great post season success often times due to guys like maurice lucas, larry mcneil and Jim chones leaving early and only reached the pormised land when it had a junior and senior laden team of all americans.
sorry for the facts i know they only get in chicos way. MSU slipped because crean left wow what a freaking joke.
You will notice that
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Your reading problems persist. I said they slipped, which you denied, now you say they did slip but it's because of youth...which is it, did they slip or not slip? I said they slipped for many reasons, including Crean leaving. Please read....are you capable? And yes, slipping is slipping and using the win loss record is more than acceptable to determine if a team slips. In fact, I would argue that most people would use that as the primary measurement, though to your point (yes, you do make them from time to time) is that other circumstances should be considered. What you are incapable of, however, is giving Crean any credit for recruiting much of the MSU team that went to three Final Fours and became a dominant program when he was there. Even though Tom Izzo extends those words toward him, you do not....whom to trust on this matter?
Oh and I'm sorry, Zach Randolph....you mean the player that Crean recruited to MSU. Charlie Bell....the kid that Tom Crean got to sign for MSU? That Charlie Bell. Jason Richardson...the kid that Tom Crean got to sign with MSU? Why don't you look up what those kids said about Tom Crean and their recruiting process to Michigan State, how much of a key he was to going to MSU. Let's not forget that several of those guys that signed with MSU damn near went to MU instead, despite how far we had fallen at the time, because of the relationship they had with Crean. Was he the only reason they went to MSU, of course not, but Izzo, Crean and a few others resurrected what had become a middle of the road Big Ten program in Jud's final years.
By the way, isn't that the argument you've made about Buzz recruiting Erik Williams and other MU players when he was the assistant at MU and not the head coach. To use your words...."those were Buzz's recruits, not Crean's". But I suppose that doesn't work up at MSU, right? Or are you changing the goal posts again. Too funny.
Sorry, I didn't hear your apology on the ND Prep accusation as a diploma mill. I'm sure that's coming from you any day now.
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ROFLMFAO ;D ::) ::)
i thought you had me on ignore!!
the hypocrisy continues...say on thing do another!! ;D
what a joke you are
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ROFLMFAO ;D ::) ::)
i thought you had me on ignore!!
the hypocrisy continues...say on thing do another!! ;D
what a joke you are
Stop posting.
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Stop posting.
+1
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+1
I would agree, but watching Chicos beat him down is pretty amusing.