MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: TheREALwrk on March 22, 2019, 06:23:49 PM
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As you all remember, I broke the Vander news in 2013, much to Scoop's raucous calls of Bullsnit.
Well, I'm back again and i have news. Bad news for us scoopers:
Markus is gone to the draft.
Whether it's a good idea or bad idea, we've seen the last of Markus in Blue and Gold.
Do with this what you will. M2N
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As you all remember, I broke the Vander news in 2013, much to Scoop's raucous calls of Bullsnit.
Well, I'm back again and i have news. Bad news for us scoopers:
Markus is gone to the draft.
Whether it's a good idea or bad idea, we've seen the last of Markus in Blue and Gold.
Do with this what you will. M2N
No we haven't. Like I and others have mentioned, Markus will declare, go to the camps. He will be told "ha, no chance" and he will come right back.
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No we haven't. Like I and others have mentioned, Markus will declare, go to the camps. He will be told "ha, no chance" and he will come right back.
Agree. Just think of Russell Westbrook and Terrence Ferguson guarding Markus coming up the floor. Double team and he couldn’t see past their chests. That’s just OKC Thunder of top of my head.
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Markus declaring will be very beneficial for both parties . If he gets good feedback after the combine then he is off to a potential lucrative pro career. That is a good thing for MU and Wojo can sell that to future recruits.
If it doesn’t work out in the combine ,Markus comes back with a list of areas to improve.
Win win proposition for everyone.
Go for it Markus . You have zero down side declaring .
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He can hear directly from the NBA scouts what they think. The right thing to do.
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Wouldn't be surprised if Sam declares as well
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Good for Markus. Hope he makes it big. Lots working against him but he’s not changing what he is by spending another year in school
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Wouldn't be surprised if Sam declares as well
I would. Don’t see him leaving his bro
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I'd expect Markus and Sam to declare. Hell, Joey should too. Get that feedback. Use it to improve your game.
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Wouldn't be surprised if Sam declares as well
He should to get the feedback, though we all know what it would be.
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Declaring for draft? Well, duh.
Actually leaving? Doubt it.
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I'm talking Agent.
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I’ve been hearing the same thing tonight as well.
“Like a steam locomotive rolling down the tracks...he’s gone, he’s gone...and he ain’t coming back”- Hunter/Garcia
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Hopefully not Vander’s agent.
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Markus declaring will be very beneficial for both parties . If he gets good feedback after the combine then he is off to a potential lucrative pro career. That is a good thing for MU and Wojo can sell that to future recruits.
If it doesn’t work out in the combine ,Markus comes back with a list of areas to improve.
Win win proposition for everyone.
Go for it Markus . You have zero down side declaring .
Hermie, by lucrative career, do you mean NBA? The guarantee money is for first round. Do you believe Markus can make the roster of an NBA team or are you referring to an overseas contract.
I hope, along with you and others, that he goes to camp and gets advice.
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In no way am I saying I want him to leave but I would be intrigued to see how this team would perform without him.
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Hermie, by lucrative career, do you mean NBA? The guarantee money is for first round. Do you believe Markus can make the roster of an NBA team or are you referring to an overseas contract.
I hope, along with you and others, that he goes to camp and gets advice.
Lucrative career in the Pull-oons business
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Probably not the worst decision for him. He was really exposed at the end of the year so best to just leave and prevent further questions about his PG ability.
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He should to get the feedback, though we all know what it would be.
Exactly.......I wonder what in the world the scouts could possibly criticize about his game.
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Hermie, by lucrative career, do you mean NBA? The guarantee money is for first round. Do you believe Markus can make the roster of an NBA team or are you referring to an overseas contract.
I hope, along with you and others, that he goes to camp and gets advice.
I think the first round probability is low, all the mocks show him second. If he doesn’t actually get drafted I think he will get signed to a two way contract the way Angel Del Gado did.
The summer league will get him in front of a lot of foreign scouts and if he can’t find his way into the league he will eventually end up in a top tier foreign league.
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Markus declaring and hiring an agent would not surprise me at all.
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I think the first round probability is low, all the mocks show him second. If he doesn’t actually get drafted I think he will get signed to a two way contract the way Angel Del Gado did.
The summer league will get him in front of a lot of foreign scouts and if he can’t find his way into the league he will eventually end up in a top tier foreign league.
Herman, there are mocks show him not even drafted.
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Is he able to graduate this spring? If so, he may decide to get his degree and play pro ball regardless of if it’s in the NBA.
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Eye kan give Markus, Sam, and Joey advise on der games and eye don't work four no NBA, hey?
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I think the first round probability is low, all the mocks show him second. If he doesn’t actually get drafted I think he will get signed to a two way contract the way Angel Del Gado did.
The summer league will get him in front of a lot of foreign scouts and if he can’t find his way into the league he will eventually end up in a top tier foreign league.
Can’t use Delgado as a example. He is a quality big who can help a team and has played this year, not a 5 11 point guard. There are no examples of anyone of Markus size and non shooting weakness on a two way. Wish him well and hope he ends up in that top tier league. I guess they pay pretty good in that league, right?
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I would say Quinn Cook with Golden State Warriors and Tyus Jones with Timberwolves are less than their listed 6-1 height. I have stood next to Quinn he more 5-11ish than 6-1ish.
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As you all remember, I broke the Vander news in 2013, much to Scoop's raucous calls of Bullsnit.
Well, I'm back again and i have news. Bad news for us scoopers:
Markus is gone to the draft.
Whether it's a good idea or bad idea, we've seen the last of Markus in Blue and Gold.
Do with this what you will. M2N
Why is this bad? I believe this may keep Sam and Joey at MU
I do wish Markus the best if true. He was a great representative of MU
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Why is this bad? I believe this may keep Sam and Joey at MU
I do wish Markus the best if true. He was a great representative of MU
You’re speculating they’d leave if he stayed?
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These replies are amazing.... normally this kind of news would elicit chicken-little hot takes across the board, but now the consensus seems to be addition by subtraction similar to graduating Rowsey last year.
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Why is this bad? I believe this may keep Sam and Joey at MU
I do wish Markus the best if true. He was a great representative of MU
Lol.
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You’re speculating they’d leave if he stayed?
I would say anything you hear would be speculation because nobody here is sam, or Joey.
just forwarding what I’ve heard from a brothers, uncles, sisters cousins, parents, who knows more than I
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God speed Vander 2.0!
History repeats?
Better to get paid to ball somewhere I guess.
At least we don't get those damned 1 and done's!
What are the rules now anyway? Declare, go to camps, get feedback and can come back?
Hire an agent and you can't come back?
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I would say anything you hear would be speculation because nobody here is sam, or Joey.
just forwarding what I’ve heard from a brothers, uncles, sisters cousins, parents, who knows more than I
That’s quite interesting
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That’s quite interesting
If by “interesting” you mean “total BS” you are onto something.
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That’s quite interesting
Teenagers who are emotional after a long season of hard work, and dedication. I mean look at the fans on here who are also very upset. (Myself included) I wouldn’t bet on them leaving, that’s all I will say.
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If by “interesting” you mean “total BS” you are onto something.
I know what I know, and I know what I don’t know. That leaves a lot of things as possibilities whether believable or not.
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Teenagers who are emotional after a long season of hard work, and dedication. I mean look at the fans on here who are also very upset. (Myself included) I wouldn’t bet on them leaving, that’s all I will say.
I can imagine there was a lot of frustration and it would be natural for some fingers to be pointed. Never want to see that but they’re human and young.
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If he goes to the camps, we'll find out his real height lol
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Howard leaves. Marquette makes NIT in year 6. Wojo terminated. It all starts over...it’s all so clear now.
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Howard leaves. Marquette makes NIT in year 6. Wojo terminated. It all starts over...it’s all so clear now.
As much as I bitch about this kid, this is a net negative. 25 puts off the board is a tough loss. Not sure the Hausers can fill the void. Markus needed to play within a system. Wojo never gave him a system. The future is uncertain if this is true.
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If by “interesting” you mean “total BS” you are onto something.
Not total BS. Not entirely true, either.
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If Markus leaves you have to read that as he’s done all he thinks he can do at Marquette. If he thinks his stock is higher now than it would be after another ranked season and a deep NCAA run next I’d say that a pretty big indictment that he doesn’t think Wojo can make that happen.
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At this point he also may have enough credits to graduate, and—while he may return to college—it may be at a bigger school.
I’m among those that think that—much like Fletch—his 5’11” is inflated by his hair. As a ball handler and defender, he could definitely use the Euro leagues
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Yeah....the Hausers aren't going anywhere. Nice try though.
As to Markus, of course he is going to declare. I would assume Sam does as well. Players get a free year to declare and return so as juniors they are in use it or lose it territory. I believe both will come back for their senior seasons. Sam I don't think is close to be drafting and Markus is probably a mid 2nd rounder at best. I think they will both get valuable feedback and hopefully they use that to push their games to new levels.
I could see a scenario where Markus decides that he's never going to be a first rounder so might as well get started making money now. If he does, best of luck to him.
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As I said with Vander (because he couldn't shoot) I say with Markus (because he cannot pass or play defense) - he has no NBA shot AT ALL.
Definitely Markus could make $500k+ next year playing pro ball in Europe or China as an elite scorer, but as for NBA:
- Vander was taller, better defender, better PG skills (albeit limited in that area as well) and had a cup of tea
- Jerel was taller, MUCH better defender, better PG skills, and got 36 minutes in the NBA
- Rowsey is a good comp, but better PG skills - and headed off to the same type of Pro career Markus can have. 11ppg for a 2nd level Euro club.
I wish him luck if he goes. If he stays, he needs to learn how to pass. We might never find out how good the Hausers and others are as long as Markus is around... because they'll never get the ball enough to show us.
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I don't know...maybe he goes, maybe he doesn't...but I guess it would seem weird to me that he goes, for many reasons, but he didn't even submit his name last year
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We'll see what happens. I think he and Sam both should've declared last year for the feedback. While losing Rowsey ended up a net positive because of the defensive improvement, losing Howard would be terrible for this team. He's a good enough defender in the system & irreplaceable offensive piece.
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God speed Vander 2.0!
History repeats?
My thought exactly Brother Fanatic (and others).
I'm sure there was a lot of emotion, frustration and anger in our locker room following the Murray State debacle. I still believe we were the better team but candidly, the better team did not show up Thursday.
But there's a big difference between private talk of, "I'm going to the NBA/pro Europe" and actually doing it. For all of you who worry about this, how many times have you become angry and said things you don't really end up executing on?
A lot?
I actually hope Markus and Sam do declare for the draft, get an NBA scout evaluation, realize what they have to work on and come back. I suspect Coach Wojo feels the same way and probably will encourage them to do so.
In the unlikely event they do leave, I'm grateful for what they both have given us and I hope they light up the NBA or Pro Europe.
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If Markus leaves you have to read that as he’s done all he thinks he can do at Marquette. If he thinks his stock is higher now than it would be after another ranked season and a deep NCAA run next I’d say that a pretty big indictment that he doesn’t think Wojo can make that happen.
Nobody has touched this but that uninspired second half vs Murray St was awfully indicative of a group of kids who lacked belief in the plan they were being asked to execute. I watched so many teams battle back from big deficits the past couple of days. MU just surrendered. Huge indictment of Wojo.
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I am absolutely fine if Markus leaves.
ADD McEwen, Torrence, Akonno and Elliot.
Plus add a grad transfer, transfer ?
Of course the hausers, Anim, Morrow, Bailey get more shots and score a bit more.
Cannot stand the 28 shots a game type games from Howard! Great scorer, maybe the best ever at MU but is not good at anything else. Yes he won some games, but he also lost us some games.
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At this point he also may have enough credits to graduate, and—while he may return to college—it may be at a bigger school.
I’m among those that think that—much like Fletch—his 5’11” is inflated by his hair. As a ball handler and defender, he could definitely use the Euro leagues
There is no way Markus has enough credits to graduate.
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Why would you want Bailey to get more shots? He has troubles shooting now.
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Nobody has touched this but that uninspired second half vs Murray St was awfully indicative of a group of kids who lacked belief in the plan they were being asked to execute. I watched so many teams battle back from big deficits the past couple of days. MU just surrendered. Huge indictment of Wojo.
There was little to no fight in that second half. A huge red flag.
Look at how it opened.... MU gives up three straight offensive rebounds, Murray St. dunk. Sam misses a shot, Murray St. comes right down, gets an easy lay-up. A clearly pissed Wojo calls a timeout 90 seconds out of halftime. It was game over right there.
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There was little to no fight in that second half. A huge red flag.
Look at how it opened.... MU gives up three straight offensive rebounds, Murray St. dunk. Sam misses a shot, Murray St. comes right down, gets an easy lay-up. A clearly pissed Wojo calls a timeout 90 seconds out of halftime. It was game over right there.
Yep sadly he’d lost the attention of his team
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At this point he also may have enough credits to graduate, and—while he may return to college—it may be at a bigger school.
I’m among those that think that—much like Fletch—his 5’11” is inflated by his hair. As a ball handler and defender, he could definitely use the Euro leagues
Markus May be able to graduate. I have no idea. But there is no chance he is going to grad transfer into a foreign situation. Markus has it great at MU - very unlikely that he’d have free reign at another school as a grad transfer. This talk is nonsense. It’s go pro or come back.
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Markus declaring will be very beneficial for both parties . If he gets good feedback after the combine then he is off to a potential lucrative pro career. That is a good thing for MU and Wojo can sell that to future recruits.
If it doesn’t work out in the combine ,Markus comes back with a list of areas to improve.
Win win proposition for everyone.
Go for it Markus . You have zero down side declaring .
How dare you have a well stated, rational thought on scoop!
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Markus May be able to graduate. I have no idea. But there is no chance he is going to grad transfer into a foreign situation. Markus has it great at MU - very unlikely that he’d have free reign at another school as a grad transfer. This talk is nonsense. It’s go pro or come back.
The guy that might be closer to grad transferring is Sacar, he redshirted and this is his fourth academic year.
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The guy that might be closer to grad transferring is Sacar, he redshirted and this is his fourth academic year.
Yah, that’s been established long ago.
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The guy that might be closer to grad transferring is Sacar, he redshirted and this is his fourth academic year.
I could see it, but would be disappointed. I think Sacar’s development has been one of the highlights of Wojo’s coaching. His ability to drive and hit a midrange jumper gives our offense a lot when Markus and Sam aren’t getting good looks.
He would be a big loss.
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Can’t use Delgado as a example. He is a quality big who can help a team and has played this year, not a 5 11 point guard. There are no examples of anyone of Markus size and non shooting weakness on a two way. Wish him well and hope he ends up in that top tier league. I guess they pay pretty good in that league, right?
Not comparing Markus to Delgado. Just using his circumstance as an undrafted free agent that received a two way contract as a theoretical possibility.
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Don't F with Rick. He was the absolute, absolute best. No one looked out for other like Rick. No one.
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The Lens
As always, spot on.
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FWIW, Heisy is taking a couple day Scoopcation, so don't expect a response.
He's clearly not himself and needs to take some time off for Arby's.
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FWIW, Heisy is taking a couple day Scoopcation, so don't expect a response.
He's clearly not himself and needs to take some time off for Arby's.
Beat me to it. Damn.
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Howard is a great MU player but won’t be a legendary MU player without some team accomplishments.
Howard can absolutely dominate a game through his ability to score, but only when scoring efficiently. He cannot dominate when he turns into a medium-percentage volume shooter because other aspects of his game are ordinary.
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FWIW, Heisy is taking a couple day Scoopcation, so don't expect a response.
He's clearly not himself and needs to take some time off for Arby's.
Beat me to it. Damn.
WE GOT MULTIPLE BANHAMMERS FLYING!
(http://media.tenor.com/images/77b9779b71fc35f439a027aa203c9ea2/tenor.gif)
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WE GOT MULTIPLE BANHAMMERS FLYING!
Our bonuses are based on Ban statistics.
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Why would you want Bailey to get more shots? He has troubles shooting now.
You are going to see light years improvement in his shot next season. The kid has one year under his belt after 2 solid years away from the game. I expect a huge improvement in that part of his game and think he will go down as a very good MU player when all is said and done.
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You are going to see light years improvement in his shot next season. The kid has one year under his belt after 2 solid years away from the game. I expect a huge improvement in that part of his game and think he will go down as a very good MU player when all is said and done.
I also agree with this. I think he could be one of those players who come back much better after an offseason and the rest of the league is asking "where the hell did that come from?"
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Nobody has touched this but that uninspired second half vs Murray St was awfully indicative of a group of kids who lacked belief in the plan they were being asked to execute. I watched so many teams battle back from big deficits the past couple of days. MU just surrendered. Huge indictment of Wojo.
Very true.
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Nobody has touched this but that uninspired second half vs Murray St was awfully indicative of a group of kids who lacked belief in the plan they were being asked to execute. I watched so many teams battle back from big deficits the past couple of days. MU just surrendered. Huge indictment of Wojo.
Kind of reminds me how UVA gave up on Tony Bennett in the second half against UMBC last year hey? Looking back it’s now obvious why this season turned out to be such a disaster for them.
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Nobody has touched this but that uninspired second half vs Murray St was awfully indicative of a group of kids who lacked belief in the plan they were being asked to execute. I watched so many teams battle back from big deficits the past couple of days. MU just surrendered. Huge indictment of Wojo.
So thats a huge indictment of Wojo....does that mean all the times they did battle back from big deficits its a huge endorsement of Wojo?
Teams get blown out. It happens. I would advise against putting too much weight, positive or negative, on a single game outcome. We battled back from deficits more often than we collapsed.
I do think Wojo tried to get too cute with the defensive game plan. We haven't been a trapping team all season and trying to break it out in the postseason I don't think was the right move. Speaks to the dangers of trying something just to throw out a look that hasn't been scouted.
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So thats a huge indictment of Wojo....does that mean all the times they did battle back from big deficits its a huge endorsement of Wojo?
Teams get blown out. It happens. I would advise against putting too much weight, positive or negative, on a single game outcome. We battled back from deficits more often than we collapsed.
I do think Wojo tried to get too cute with the defensive game plan. We haven't been a trapping team all season and trying to break it out in the postseason I don't think was the right move. Speaks to the dangers of trying something just to throw out a look that hasn't been scouted.
Wojo had this team competing really hard multiple times this year and deserves credit for that (which I freely gave him). That tourney loss, particularly in the second half was as much about a lack of effort as anything. That’s different than say getting shot out of the gym. They just gave up with their season on the line. He wasn’t getting through to them and they weren’t playing like they believed. That’s on him. It’s not necessarily symptomatic of a massive underlying issues but it’s not something I will ignore either.
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Nickel
I agree completely. Multiple times this season I stated the boys showed toughness and applauded that. Biggest game of the year, not sure if I can say that, and it looked like they quit. Your point is not nitpicking or being negative, simply a fact. Coaches are paid to win in March and our team failed miserably.
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It's pretty clear the team quit on The Woj.
The first half didn't end well but we were still in the fight. Marquette was dispirited and it showed.
When a leader stands in front of his crew he needs to know them, read them, then inspire them to greatness. I have no idea what The Woj said at halftime but Marquette came out flat.
That might happen in December but ought not to ever be a part of March. The team had everything to play for but came out with heads hanging.
We got our asses kicked by a mid major of slender accomplishment. And on the National Stage. Humiliation.
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We'll see what happens. I think he and Sam both should've declared last year for the feedback. While losing Rowsey ended up a net positive because of the defensive improvement, losing Howard would be terrible for this team. He's a good enough defender in the system & irreplaceable offensive piece.
Irreplaceable? That's bold. Let's dig in a bit. Would you rather have Howard or Morant running point? What if Torrence is the next Morant? Unlikely, but can you definitively say Howard is irreplaceable?
Was he the primary reason we won certain games this year? Absolutely. Was he the primary reason we lost certain games this year? Absolutely. I personally don't like when so much of a team's success rides on one player. Would rather have more balance so if the star is off we can still win.
Let's also look at a few examples. Two years ago, we knocked off #1 Villanova at home, in a game where Howard didn't score and was limited to about 10 minutes if I remember correctly due to foul trouble. Yet we still won. Fast forward two years and we have a better team, Nova has a worse team, Howard is 2 years older and BE POY, and we still barely beat them at home.
What about at Creighton when Howard went out injured midway through the game when we were down about 15 one or two years ago when they had a better team than this year and we had a worse team? What happens? We storm back and win without him. Fast forward to this year. At Creighton 99.99999% of the time we lose that game, yet Howard had like 40 before OT. I would rather not have a guy with 40 in regulation and get a W.
Or how about at Georgetown this year? Howard plays 3 non-factor minutes and we win. Home against Georgetown with the title on the line and Howard playing, we lose.
Now, let me be very clear on my overall stance on this. I want Howard on the team and I do think he's a tremendous asset. However, I do not think he's irreplaceable. We can and have won without him. I think Wojo gives him way too long of a leash and I don't think Wojo uses him correctly at all. On days when Howard doesn't have it, he doesn't stop shooting and it kills us. It's also no fun to watch, let alone play with, a volume shooter who isn't making shots. Give me a PG who gets everyone involved and who averages 12 PPG all day over a guy who can hit 50 but also usually shoots 20+ shots and turns it over as much as he assists others.
I would rather see more balance. Unfortunately we didn't have another good PG option this year, so options were limited. Just look...Howard had more turnovers this year than assists. That's not good for a point guard. He's not a point guard. I believe we played this entire season without a BE caliber PG. Hard to make noise in March that way. Our crash & burn is Exhibit A.
My preference for next year is that everyone comes back, Elliott & Eke are healthy, Akanno and Torrence are here, and McKewen & Torrence run point (with spot minutes for Akanno) while Howard plays off the ball and gets 25 to 35 MPG depending how he's playing (like everyone else). Now that's a team to get excited about.
Howard running PG, playing 35+ minutes, launching 20+ shots every game no matter the result again next year and getting constant unlimited star treatment and unending praise from Wojo? My opinion, but then expect a repeat of this year. Also, poor Sam must be so tired of having to constantly answer questions about Howard during the postgame pressers. We need more balance. Enough of the star parade. I don't like where it gets us. I don't like the feeling all us fans have right now about how this season ended. There's a lot of anger and a lot of justified reasons for it.
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Irreplaceable? That's bold. Let's dig in a bit. Would you rather have Howard or Morant running point? What if Torrence is the next Morant? Unlikely, but can you definitively say Howard is irreplaceable?
Was he the primary reason we won certain games this year? Absolutely. Was he the primary reason we lost certain games this year? Absolutely. I personally don't like when so much of a team's success rides on one player. Would rather have more balance so if the star is off we can still win.
Let's also look at a few examples. Two years ago, we knocked off #1 Villanova at home, in a game where Howard didn't score and was limited to about 10 minutes if I remember correctly due to foul trouble. Yet we still won. Fast forward two years and we have a better team, Nova has a worse team, Howard is 2 years older and BE POY, and we still barely beat them at home.
What about at Creighton when Howard went out injured midway through the game when we were down about 15 one or two years ago when they had a better team than this year and we had a worse team? What happens? We storm back and win without him. Fast forward to this year. At Creighton 99.99999% of the time we lose that game, yet Howard had like 40 before OT. I would rather not have a guy with 40 in regulation and get a W.
Or how about at Georgetown this year? Howard plays 3 non-factor minutes and we win. Home against Georgetown with the title on the line and Howard playing, we lose.
Now, let me be very clear on my overall stance on this. I want Howard on the team and I do think he's a tremendous asset. However, I do not think he's irreplaceable. We can and have won without him. I think Wojo gives him way too long of a leash and I don't think Wojo uses him correctly at all. On days when Howard doesn't have it, he doesn't stop shooting and it kills us. It's also no fun to watch, let alone play with, a volume shooter who isn't making shots. Give me a PG who gets everyone involved and who averages 12 PPG all day over a guy who can hit 50 but also usually shoots 20+ shots and turns it over as much as he assists others.
I would rather see more balance. Unfortunately we didn't have another good PG option this year, so options were limited. Just look...Howard had more turnovers this year than assists. That's not good for a point guard. He's not a point guard. I believe we played this entire season without a BE caliber PG. Hard to make noise in March that way. Our crash & burn is Exhibit A.
My preference for next year is that everyone comes back, Elliott & Eke are healthy, Akanno and Torrence are here, and McKewen & Torrence run point (with spot minutes for Akanno) while Howard plays off the ball and gets 25 to 35 MPG depending how he's playing (like everyone else). Now that's a team to get excited about.
Howard running PG, playing 35+ minutes, launching 20+ shots every game no matter the result again next year and getting constant unlimited star treatment and unending praise from Wojo? My opinion, but then expect a repeat of this year. Also, poor Sam must be so tired of having to constantly answer questions about Howard during the postgame pressers. We need more balance. Enough of the star parade. I don't like where it gets us. I don't like the feeling all us fans have right now about how this season ended. There's a lot of anger and a lot of justified reasons for it.
Spot on analysis! Great piece
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You guys do realize that mcewen shot 40% from the field and had an assist.to TO ratio of 1.1:1. Not exactly John Stockton like..http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/stats/_/id/4066755/koby-mcewen (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/stats/_/id/4066755/koby-mcewen)
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You guys do realize that mcewen shot 40% from the field and had an assist.to TO ratio of 1.1:1. Not exactly John Stockton like..http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/stats/_/id/4066755/koby-mcewen (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/stats/_/id/4066755/koby-mcewen)
Fair point. Maybe he won't be better then as a PG, which just means we still have a PG problem/hole, unless Akanno comes out of nowhere or Torrence reclassifies and is the real deal. We have had a pair of the most impressive scorers in recent MU history and we have zero anything to show for it.
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Nobody has touched this but that uninspired second half vs Murray St was awfully indicative of a group of kids who lacked belief in the plan they were being asked to execute. I watched so many teams battle back from big deficits the past couple of days. MU just surrendered. Huge indictment of Wojo.
Teem absolutely looked like dey had given up mid wey thru the second half. Just another splinter in Wojo's ass, hey?
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Not sure if it's his catchy name or his fun-to-watch game or the fact he plays for cinderella fave Wofford, but Fletcher McGee was the third-most-talked-about player in first round, right behind Morant and Zion.
Today, vs Kentucky: Mr. Magee was more like Mr. Magoo, going 0-12 from 3-point land. Overall 8 points on 4-17 shooting. Didn't get to FT line all game. Kept flinging up no-prayer scuds right to the bitter end, the last coming after he dribbled way too much with his team down by 4. I guess his coach was too stoopid to tell him to stop shooting.
Meanwhile Scoop fave Herro was 2-for-11, including 1-of-6 from 3. In the last 4 minutes of a close game, he hit the side of the backboard with a 3 attempt, threw a wild airball hook shot from the lane and also missed another shot from the lane. But his coach was too stoopid to tell him to stop shooting.
Lots of folks here talked about the Warriors quitting on Wojo. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't. It's obviously just an opinion. It did sure look like they were uninspired, and yes that's on the coach. The Hausers seemed to be sleep-walking pretty much all game (nothing new for Joey the second half of the season), Sacar was MIA, Theo was a non-entity.
But one guy who came out ready to play: Markus.
He scored 16 in the first half and we wilted when he left the game with his second foul. Without Markus, we might have been down by 20 at halftime and lost by 40.
Coaches voted him BE Player of the Year because, I guess, they are stoopid. Don't they know what dozens of Scoopers do: We're better off without him?
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Not sure if it's his catchy name or his fun-to-watch game or the fact he plays for cinderella fave Wofford, but Fletcher McGee was the third-most-talked-about player in first round, right behind Morant and Zion.
Today, vs Kentucky: Mr. Magee was more like Mr. Magoo, going 0-12 from 3-point land. Overall 8 points on 4-17 shooting. Didn't get to FT line all game. Kept flinging up no-prayer scuds right to the bitter end, the last coming after he dribbled way too much with his team down by 4. I guess his coach was too stoopid to tell him to stop shooting.
Meanwhile Scoop fave Herro was 2-for-11, including 1-of-6 from 3. In the last 4 minutes of a close game, he hit the side of the backboard with a 3 attempt, threw a wild airball hook shot from the lane and also missed another shot from the lane. But his coach was too stoopid to tell him to stop shooting.
Lots of folks here talked about the Warriors quitting on Wojo. Maybe they did, maybe they didn't. It's obviously just an opinion. It did sure look like they were uninspired, and yes that's on the coach. The Hausers seemed to be sleep-walking pretty much all game (nothing new for Joey the second half of the season), Sacar was MIA, Theo was a non-entity.
But one guy who came out ready to play: Markus.
He scored 16 in the first half and we wilted when he left the game with his second foul. Without Markus, we might have been down by 20 at halftime and lost by 40.
Coaches voted him BE Player of the Year because, I guess, they are stoopid. Don't they know what dozens of Scoopers do: We're better off without him?
I think that begs the question though. If Markus' teammates know he's going to continue taking the majority of the shots despite being cold in the second half, they have to dig deeper for the motivation. It must suck not getting the chance to contribute offensively because Howard is constantly driving and flinging up a floater, or taking a step back three. And I'm a fan of Markus. To me it seems like the guys tend to defer to Markus to score too much.
TheyWereCones made a very good analysis. MU needs to play more as a team when Markus is in. If Markus returns next year I don't see things changing much. He's Wojo's guy. Howard is still going to get the same number of shots up and have another handful of incredible scoring performances.
Surely one of our incomers or Greg's return will be an improvement over Chartouney. Our big men will improve. But as it stands, the Warrios are entering 2019-2020 without a true point guard and that worries me. With the range of talents on this team, MU desperately needs a true facilitator to get everyone involved. Markus will still get his points, but more will be assisted.
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Meanwhile Scoop fave Herro was 2-for-11, including 1-of-6 from 3. In the last 4 minutes of a close game, he hit the side of the backboard with a 3 attempt, threw a wild airball hook shot from the lane and also missed another shot from the lane. But his coach was too stoopid to tell him to stop shooting. hit the clinching threes to insure Kentucky covered the spread.
FIFY
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FIFY
Clinching free throws you mean?
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I think that begs the question though. If Markus' teammates know he's going to continue taking the majority of the shots despite being cold in the second half, they have to dig deeper for the motivation. It must suck not getting the chance to contribute offensively because Howard is constantly driving and flinging up a floater, or taking a step back three. And I'm a fan of Markus. To me it seems like the guys tend to defer to Markus to score too much.
TheyWereCones made a very good analysis. MU needs to play more as a team when Markus is in. If Markus returns next year I don't see things changing much. He's Wojo's guy. Howard is still going to get the same number of shots up and have another handful of incredible scoring performances.
Surely one of our incomers or Greg's return will be an improvement over Chartouney. Our big men will improve. But as it stands, the Warrios are entering 2019-2020 without a true point guard and that worries me. With the range of talents on this team, MU desperately needs a true facilitator to get everyone involved. Markus will still get his points, but more will be assisted.
That is a very reasonable assessment.
Like you, I am a big Markus fan. I wish he had better court vision, a better handle and more of a knack of finding his teammates, but he doesn't. He yam what he yam. Just like Fletcher Magee is what he is and Tyler Herro is what he is.
It's indisputable that many games, the sheer volume of shots Markus takes means some teammates are not getting as many shots as they "should." Sometimes, that hurts our offense, especially when the shots aren't going in.
Then again, how many times does Sam or Joey get the ball and end up giving it back to Markus with the shot clock running down? How many times does Sam just drift along the perimeter instead of going to the high post or low post and calling for the ball? I love Sam, too, but he missed 6 of his last 7 shots against Seton Hall, he was firing scuds at the end of the Creighton game, etc. Joey? On a milk carton just about the entirety of the second half of the season -- and it's not because Markus didn't get him the ball.
When we beat Nova, the Hausers combined for 4 points but Sacar figured out a way to get the ball enough to score 18. Thank goodness Markus was on that game or we not only would have lost but would have been beaten by 25+.
Markus obviously is an imperfect PG, and assuming he comes back and that's his role again next season, we could face some similar problems. Then again, our "problems" this season included a 23-4 start, second place in the conference and a top-5 NCAA seed even with the imperfect PG.
I'll be thrilled if he comes back, but like you I do hope Wojo continues to grow as a coach and comes up with ways to keep giving Markus looks while also getting others more involved.
I really wouldn't be stunned if Markus leaves to start making $$$, however.
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Clinching free throws you mean?
Doh yup. I was worried when Wofford cut the lead to 2. Travis & Herro came through to cover the -5.5.
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That is a very reasonable assessment.
Like you, I am a big Markus fan. I wish he had better court vision, a better handle and more of a knack of finding his teammates, but he doesn't. He yam what he yam. Just like Fletcher Magee is what he is and Tyler Herro is what he is.
It's indisputable that many games, the sheer volume of shots Markus takes means some teammates are not getting as many shots as they "should." Sometimes, that hurts our offense, especially when the shots aren't going in.
Then again, how many times does Sam or Joey get the ball and end up giving it back to Markus with the shot clock running down? How many times does Sam just drift along the perimeter instead of going to the high post or low post and calling for the ball? I love Sam, too, but he missed 6 of his last 7 shots against Seton Hall, he was firing scuds at the end of the Creighton game, etc. Joey? On a milk carton just about the entirety of the second half of the season -- and it's not because Markus didn't get him the ball.
When we beat Nova, the Hausers combined for 4 points but Sacar figured out a way to get the ball enough to score 18. Thank goodness Markus was on that game or we not only would have lost but would have been beaten by 25+.
Markus obviously is an imperfect PG, and assuming he comes back and that's his role again next season, we could face some similar problems. Then again, our "problems" this season included a 23-4 start, second place in the conference and a top-5 NCAA seed even with the imperfect PG.
I'll be thrilled if he comes back, but like you I do hope Wojo continues to grow as a coach and comes up with ways to keep giving Markus looks while also getting others more involved.
I really wouldn't be stunned if Markus leaves to start making $$$, however.
Fully agree. Watching Markus has been a special treat. I don't want it to end. But I must admit it's a bit unnerving having another season of live or die by Markus. And I don't want to spin it the wrong way. It's a very good problem to have. Like you said, MU went 23-4 before crumbling.
I'm intrigued to see what Greg can do playing some time at point next year. With a fully recovered thumb, I expect his handle to be much better. It feels like it's been ages, but I recall GE having pretty nice court vision around the hoop. Theo and Ed are perfect guys to feed under the hoop after driving. Feel like Greg could set Markus, Sam, Joey and Sacar up pretty well with drive and kick.
Markus doesn't have trouble getting to the hoop. I hope he spends a lot of the summer at some point guard camps. Improving his handle and decision-making could make him that guy instead. Unfortunately it seems hard to convert a shoot-first minded player into a facilitator. Trying to think of some players that successfully transformed from a pure scorer to distributor/scorer within one season.
Wojo's the guy that ultimately brought in the backup PG. Things don't always work out. JC was really outmatched and in over his head at this level. If both Greg and Koby are even slightly ahead of Markus with PG skills, I like MU's chances a lot more. If Torrence reclassifies, is Akanno a good redshirt option? Otherwise it's too clogged in the backcourt.
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It's pretty clear the team quit on The Woj.
The first half didn't end well but we were still in the fight. Marquette was dispirited and it showed.
When a leader stands in front of his crew he needs to know them, read them, then inspire them to greatness. I have no idea what The Woj said at halftime but Marquette came out flat.
That might happen in December but ought not to ever be a part of March. The team had everything to play for but came out with heads hanging.
We got our asses kicked by a mid major of slender accomplishment. And on the National Stage. Humiliation.
A buddy of mine in the AD told me that Wojo feels the same way. Says Woj is PISSED. Apparently, Wojo told the team that they have to wear white tees all summer.
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One more point about Markus... Probably 75% of his points would be replaced automatically by others had he passed and run the offense. Only 25% of his scoring was "special". That differential was apparent late in the season. So, if he goes, only 25% of his scoring needs to be replaced because the system will replace the remainder. As such, I don't see his departure as an unrecoverable situation.
Nevertheless, he needs to learn how to pass.
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You are going to see light years improvement in his shot next season. The kid has one year under his belt after 2 solid years away from the game. I expect a huge improvement in that part of his game and think he will go down as a very good MU player when all is said and done.
He is our only legit NBA prospect on the team.
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I'm hoping he saw the light playing against Morant as to what he needs to become if he wants M2N. Work on ballhandling and passing all offseason. Become a complete PG, not a shooter, and he will have a shot at the NBA. Right now, the NBA is a pipe dream.
(https://media1.tenor.com/images/c92391130998610478055df1c60f3ef3/tenor.gif?itemid=9798604)
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I will be happy to have Markus back, but I will not be sad to see him go.
I would love to see how many points he would score next year , if he stays.
I think we will be very good with him next year. However, I also think we will be even better without him.
I am fine with him staying and with him going. I just hope he makes the best decision for him.
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I will be happy to have Markus back, but I will not be sad to see him go.
I would love to see how many points he would score next year , if he stays.
I think we will be very good with him next year. However, I also think we will be even better without him.
I am fine with him staying and with him going. I just hope he makes the best decision for him.
Are you saying that even without Howard next year's team will be better than this year's team? I'm not sure but a reasonable prediction.
If you are saying that next year's team would be better without than with Markus? Less reasonable.
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Y'all nuts. Markus is a special talent and a joy to watch. He'll be even better next year, just like he's improved the last 2.
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Y'all nuts. Markus is a special talent and a joy to watch. He'll be even better next year, just like he's improved the last 2.
Totally agree with this. Having said that...
What this team sorely lacks is a guy that can manipulate the defense and control the pace of a game. Markus gets manipulated by defenses. Defenses force him into the shots they want him taking, not the other way around. Markus is a much better defender than Rowsey was if for no other reason than simple effort. But Rowsey was infinitely better in terms of getting defenses to react to him. He had the ball on a string, was constantly reading the defense and seeing the court, and was a much better passer. He was also much better at avoiding picking up the ball in troubling spots on the floor or getting stuck in double teams (though he did those things more often than I would've liked). He was also obviously a great shooter. Markus is better at finishing in the paint.
What this team needs is a guy like Storm Murphy from Wofford, who was a Wisconsin kid (and right down the road from UW). The kid is constantly pushing the ball up the court with his head up. If a lane to the bucket is open he keeps pushing, if a teammate is open he finds them, and if not he slows it down and gets the offense going. Constantly probing, getting a step on his defender but keeping him on his hip instead of in front while reading what the defense is doing, and making the smart play. He reminds me of the guards from Loyola last season. Marquette does not have that and desperately needs it. Markus's difficult down the stretch of the season was that defenses forced him into spots on the court where it was hard for him to do anything other than put up contested shots, and that's exactly what he did.
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Are you saying that even without Howard next year's team will be better than this year's team? I'm not sure but a reasonable prediction.
If you are saying that next year's team would be better without than with Markus? Less reasonable.
I’ll go in record and place a wager on that scenario
If MH leaves and we keep everyone we are projected to keep, I’m willing to bet MU will have more post season and regular season success then this year in a projected harder big east
I’m not sure Mh is leaving, but if he does, care to wager? Donation to Chico’s daughters charity perhaps?
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Drew
There are plenty of special talents over time that never won anything. Truly special talents usually succeed at the highest level. I have learned that special talents vary in degree. Example, Aaron Rodgers is a special talent with limited postseason success. Tom Brady is special talent in different way with a great deal of success.
I hope Howard is back, but would not bet his talent taking us to promise land next March.
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I’ll go in record and place a wager on that scenario
If MH leaves and we keep everyone we are projected to keep, I’m willing to bet MU will have more post season and regular season success then this year in a projected harder big east
I’m not sure Mh is leaving, but if he does, care to wager? Donation to Chico’s daughters charity perhaps?
I think you are misunderstanding my post. I said I wasn't sure if I think next year's team without Howard would be better than this year's team. I could see it but I think it would take a few surprises.
But there is no situation where next year's team without Markus is better than next year's team with Markus unless you get a better player to replace him.
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That is a very reasonable assessment.
Like you, I am a big Markus fan. I wish he had better court vision, a better handle and more of a knack of finding his teammates, but he doesn't. He yam what he yam. Just like Fletcher Magee is what he is and Tyler Herro is what he is.
It's indisputable that many games, the sheer volume of shots Markus takes means some teammates are not getting as many shots as they "should." Sometimes, that hurts our offense, especially when the shots aren't going in.
Then again, how many times does Sam or Joey get the ball and end up giving it back to Markus with the shot clock running down? How many times does Sam just drift along the perimeter instead of going to the high post or low post and calling for the ball? I love Sam, too, but he missed 6 of his last 7 shots against Seton Hall, he was firing scuds at the end of the Creighton game, etc. Joey? On a milk carton just about the entirety of the second half of the season -- and it's not because Markus didn't get him the ball.
When we beat Nova, the Hausers combined for 4 points but Sacar figured out a way to get the ball enough to score 18. Thank goodness Markus was on that game or we not only would have lost but would have been beaten by 25+.
Markus obviously is an imperfect PG, and assuming he comes back and that's his role again next season, we could face some similar problems. Then again, our "problems" this season included a 23-4 start, second place in the conference and a top-5 NCAA seed even with the imperfect PG.
I'll be thrilled if he comes back, but like you I do hope Wojo continues to grow as a coach and comes up with ways to keep giving Markus looks while also getting others more involved.
I really wouldn't be stunned if Markus leaves to start making $$$, however.
MU82. I usually think you are nothing but a massive douche bag but given the nature of this board over the last three weeks this is a very good post that i maotly agree with. I will further add that for all the people hating on Markus, i will add that it is not Markuss fault that he is a 2g being asked to play the point. That is on Wojo, maybe people would feel better if Sam struggled at the point while Markus was allowed to play the 2?
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I’m guessing Markus wants to play PG because it’s his only shot at making it in the NBA. If he decides to come back and commits to improving his passing, handle and decision making which is what he needs to do in order to have a chance, hopefully everyone benefits.
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Drew
There are plenty of special talents over time that never won anything. Truly special talents usually succeed at the highest level. I have learned that special talents vary in degree. Example, Aaron Rodgers is a special talent with limited postseason success. Tom Brady is special talent in different way with a great deal of success.
I hope Howard is back, but would not bet his talent taking us to promise land next March.
Goose, I think I know what you're getting at, but the example confuses me. In my mind, the difference in results between Brady and Rodgers generally comes down to coaching and the players around them. So to carry it over, it wouldn't be Markus's fault if we're not succeeding.
Markus has limitations, namely his size. Because of it, he'll never be an overwhelming physical presence who can take over both ends of the floor. However, we've seen plenty of times he's done it on one end with his incredible shooting and quickness. I don't think he is enough to win 4-6 straight on his own against the cream of the crop next March, but I think he can be the centerpiece of a team that does. (Not saying he will, but he could.)
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Totally agree with this. Having said that...
What this team sorely lacks is a guy that can manipulate the defense and control the pace of a game. Markus gets manipulated by defenses. Defenses force him into the shots they want him taking, not the other way around. Markus is a much better defender than Rowsey was if for no other reason than simple effort. But Rowsey was infinitely better in terms of getting defenses to react to him. He had the ball on a string, was constantly reading the defense and seeing the court, and was a much better passer. He was also much better at avoiding picking up the ball in troubling spots on the floor or getting stuck in double teams (though he did those things more often than I would've liked). He was also obviously a great shooter. Markus is better at finishing in the paint.
What this team needs is a guy like Storm Murphy from Wofford, who was a Wisconsin kid (and right down the road from UW). The kid is constantly pushing the ball up the court with his head up. If a lane to the bucket is open he keeps pushing, if a teammate is open he finds them, and if not he slows it down and gets the offense going. Constantly probing, getting a step on his defender but keeping him on his hip instead of in front while reading what the defense is doing, and making the smart play. He reminds me of the guards from Loyola last season. Marquette does not have that and desperately needs it. Markus's difficult down the stretch of the season was that defenses forced him into spots on the court where it was hard for him to do anything other than put up contested shots, and that's exactly what he did.
Interesting, thought-provoking analysis.
Thanks for posting it, wades.
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MU82. I usually think you are nothing but a massive douche bag but given the nature of this board over the last three weeks this is a very good post
Um ... thanks?
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I think Markus' left wrist has been bothering him more than he has let on over the last 7 games. He first injured it during the loss at Nova, and we've only won one game since the injury. The team's struggles coincidentally line up with the time he hurt the wrist. His shooting percentages from 3, 2 and the line have all been worse since the injury. He has had trouble handling the ball, turning it over (even more than before), and even getting himself in position to get good shots off since the injury.
Although I agree with a lot of the analysis here, and a true distribution-oriented point guard would really make the offense dynamic, it makes me think that there may not be as much adjusting needed as we're all talking about if such a point guard is not available for next year.
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Brew
Not disputing your post on Howard's wrist to be potentially the case, but...if it was his wrist, why did the HC not adjust to similar game plan that won a big game at Georgetown? I actually do think the wrist affected him and I actually think the HC did nothing in regards to putting in a new plan. As I have noted throughout the season, hoping your PG scores 40+ points for the win is not a coaching plan many would follow.
IMO, the Georgetown was our best 40 minutes of team basketball. Whatever was adjusted to for that 40 minutes possibly might have been a good plan with an ailing chucker on the team. If you believe Howard was hurt, why do you believe Wojo made ZERO adjustments?
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Goose, I have no answers for Wojo's plan, or lack thereof. Perhaps Markus lied to Wojo and the staff about his wrist so he could stay on the floor more? Again, I don't know....
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Brew
Not disputing your post on Howard's wrist to be potentially the case, but...if it was his wrist, why did the HC not adjust to similar game plan that won a big game at Georgetown? I actually do think the wrist affected him and I actually think the HC did nothing in regards to putting in a new plan. As I have noted throughout the season, hoping your PG scores 40+ points for the win is not a coaching plan many would follow.
IMO, the Georgetown was our best 40 minutes of team basketball. Whatever was adjusted to for that 40 minutes possibly might have been a good plan with an ailing chucker on the team. If you believe Howard was hurt, why do you believe Wojo made ZERO adjustments?
adjusting to the situation is one thing, but having such a one dimensional game plan was the problem to begin with. Maybe the injury or injuries were significant or maybe more significant was that other coaches adjusted to stop MH and the blueprint was out.
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hairy
Agreed on original problem.
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I just want to make this comparison for discussion purposes..Without looking it up can someone tell me who these players are??
Player A
Ortg-110.7
%poss- 36.1
% shots- 36.7
Efg%- 52.0
TS%- 59.0
OR%- 1.5
DR%- 11.2
Arate- 27.2
TO rate- 18.4
FD/40- 7.2
Player B
Ortg-107.0
%poss- 34.6
% shots- 37.4
Efg%- 48.0
TS%- 53.4
OR%- 1.4
DR%- 11.0
Arate- 19.1
TO rate- 15.9
FD/40- 5.9
Very similar players based on these metrics, aren't they??
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TheREALwrk
Any update on Markus departure? Has he hired an agent yet?
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
Anything is possible but I'll just say that doesn't sound like Stan at all
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Anything is possible but I'll just say that doesn't sound like Stan at all
Or Markus
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
Seems like a conversation Stan and Markus would definitely have out in the open at the Al. I'm guessing Markus told Stan he's just mad that he'll be making more money than Stan in about 5 months?
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Seems like a conversation Stan and Markus would definitely have out in the open at the Al. I'm guessing Markus told Stan he's just mad that he'll be making more money than Stan in about 5 months?
I think it's more likely they would wait until someone at MUTV could catch them on camera. Really dramatize it with some music from The Bachelor.
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Brew
Not disputing your post on Howard's wrist to be potentially the case, but...if it was his wrist, why did the HC not adjust to similar game plan that won a big game at Georgetown? I actually do think the wrist affected him and I actually think the HC did nothing in regards to putting in a new plan. As I have noted throughout the season, hoping your PG scores 40+ points for the win is not a coaching plan many would follow.
IMO, the Georgetown was our best 40 minutes of team basketball. Whatever was adjusted to for that 40 minutes possibly might have been a good plan with an ailing chucker on the team. If you believe Howard was hurt, why do you believe Wojo made ZERO adjustments?
this was my first thought as well...but we won that game by 3 points. when markus was on his game and everyone was positively feeding off of him...mu was controlling games. i don't put 100 hour weeks in on MU bball, but my thought was wojo and staff felt their best chance at reaching the ceiling for this team was for markus to go kemba walker. unfortunately (depending on how you want to look at the decline) markus wasn't able to adjust, wasn't able to be consistent, and/or was playing hurt.
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
Was anyone wearing a boot?
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TheREALwrk
Any update on Markus departure? Has he hired an agent yet?
No update. Mum is the word.
Lmao at the "Stan/Markus" conversation. Stan is a consummate professional and wants what's best for Markus, whether that be staying or leaving. The two respect eachother too much to argue in public.
Sam and Markus were chillin in Cartoonys Instagram story the other day, so looks like any bad blood between them (ya, right) is squashed.
For the record, I'd do anything for one more year with Markus. Kid is a second team all-American, can fill it up, and lead us to a 5seed. All the negativity around him is silly. I hope he starts developing an "unfinished business" mindset with Sam.
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I just want to make this comparison for discussion purposes..Without looking it up can someone tell me who these players are??
Player A
Ortg-110.7
%poss- 36.1
% shots- 36.7
Efg%- 52.0
TS%- 59.0
OR%- 1.5
DR%- 11.2
Arate- 27.2
TO rate- 18.4
FD/40- 7.2
Player B
Ortg-107.0
%poss- 34.6
% shots- 37.4
Efg%- 48.0
TS%- 53.4
OR%- 1.4
DR%- 11.0
Arate- 19.1
TO rate- 15.9
FD/40- 5.9
Very similar players based on these metrics, aren't they??
Rowsey & Howard
Edit: Its not Wowsey. Assist, turnover, efg are all better then either of these guys.
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I think it's more likely they would wait until someone at MUTV could catch them on camera. Really dramatize it with some music from The Bachelor.
Will Markus H and Stan J iron out their differences? Find out next week.
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Was anyone wearing a boot?
Stan was wearing one on each foot, and Markus had one on his wrist.
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Anything is possible but I'll just say that doesn't sound like Stan at all
i guess we will have to wait and see
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Stan was wearing one on each foot, and Markus had one on his wrist.
'Tis a sign that we will have three transfers out this offseason.
If Stan or Markus had their arm in a cast up in the air Henry Rowengartner style, it would have meant an surprise commitment.
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
Was this before or after Ferris passed out at 31 Flavors?
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Stan was wearing one on each foot, and Markus had one on his wrist.
This made me laugh.
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
lol
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
My best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who's going with the girl who saw Markus and Stan shouting at each other at 31 Flavors last night. I guess it's pretty serious.
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lol
laugh now wait till hes gone..
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laugh now wait till hes gone..
I am not discounting the chance that he leaves. I'd say 70% he's back, 30% chance he's playing in the G League next season.
But your story is complete and utter BS. Those guys would never have that discussion out in the open.
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I am not discounting the chance that he leaves. I'd say 70% he's back, 30% chance he's playing in the G League next season.
But your story is complete and utter BS. Those guys would never have that discussion out in the open.
I'd say other way around 70% he leaves 30% hes back
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I am not discounting the chance that he leaves. I'd say 70% he's back, 30% chance he's playing in the G League next season.
But your story is complete and utter BS. Those guys would never have that discussion out in the open.
Yeah, unless he was Harry Caul from The Conversation, there’s no way he’d have been able to hear those intimate details.
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I'd say other way around 70% he leaves 30% hes back
There could be a 100% chance Markus leaves. That doesn't change the fact that there's a 100% chance your friend didn't see what he told you he saw.
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I’m hearing that Markus is here for the wrong reasons and won’t go to the fantasy suite with Stan.
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There could be a 100% chance Markus leaves. That doesn't change the fact that there's a 100% chance your friend didn't see what he told you he saw.
we will have to see
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we will have to see
No we won't. Unless you have video of the alleged conversation.
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
Markus text to Stan: Need to talk about going pro
Stan reply: Cool, let's meet in front of the Al statue
Markus: Perf, but let's wait til 3pm, at the end of study hall of Volleyball, Soccer and Track
Stan: I like it, also, I'm going to talk very loud
Markus: K, and I'm going to keep the conversation going long enough for the entire ticket staff to come out and see what's up
Stan: Deal. Or shall I say...#DoneDeal
Markus: Sweet use of an ellipsis and a top 5 #mubb meme
Stan: I'm not just a well dressed recruiter, I'm also a big connoisseur of DoddsOnSports, it's where I get all my juicy #mubb news
Markus: I'm ride or die Scoop so meeting or not, I'm going pro
Stan opens Uber App: [orders Uber Select to Arby's]
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Rowsey & Howard
Edit: Its not Wowsey. Assist, turnover, efg are all better then either of these guys.
That's Markus and...Carson Edwards. I posted this to show that being a ball dominant PG that turns it over, doesn't necessarily mean it's bad for your team. Carson also doesn't shoot it as well as Markus. Purdue is in the Sweet 16...with almost the exact type of PG as MU has..and honestly not as much talent as Markus has around him. Better bigs, yes, better shooters/wings etc..no.
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There's no hurry for Markus. He has at least until April 20th (60 days before the draft) to declare.
I don't see any reason why he wouldn't declare as an early entrant, so he can attend pre-draft camps and team workouts. (Last year there were 236 early entry candidates.) Markus would then have until the final declaration date -- June 10th, or 10 days before the draft -- to withdraw his name from consideration.
Why rush such an important decision? Why not get all the information and feedback you can about your draft position first? I'd be surprised if Markus immediately announces he's leaving.
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we will have to see
No we won't. There's a 0% chance this ever happened and him leaving or not leaving doesn't change that.
I'm probably giving this board too much credit, but it's insulting you think anyone here would actually believe that "fight" occurred.
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Markus text to Stan: Need to talk about going pro
Stan reply: Cool, let's meet in front of the Al statue
Markus: Perf, but let's wait til 3pm, at the end of study hall of Volleyball, Soccer and Track
Stan: I like it, also, I'm going to talk very loud
Markus: K, and I'm going to keep the conversation going long enough for the entire ticket staff to come out and see what's up
Stan: Deal. Or shall I say...#DoneDeal
Markus: Sweet use of an ellipsis and a top 5 #mubb meme
Stan: I'm not just a well dressed recruiter, I'm also a big connoisseur of DoddsOnSports, it's where I get all my juicy #mubb news
Markus: I'm ride or die Scoop so meeting or not, I'm going pro
Stan opens Uber App: [orders Uber Select to Arby's]
(https://media3.giphy.com/media/26gsdJuCKyXixRbVu/giphy.gif)
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
(https://img1.etsystatic.com/023/0/5421426/il_fullxfull.478065245_20yl.jpg)
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
From a person high up in the athletic department, I heard that Markus was kidnapped by space aliens, who plan on using him to lead their team in Space Jam 2. They replaced him with Marcus Howard, who just isn't quite the same.
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From a person high up in the athletic department, I heard that Markus was kidnapped by space aliens, who plan on using him to lead their team in Space Jam 2. They replaced him with Marcus Howard, who just isn't quite the same.
Will Markus be taking on the Muggsy Bogues character?
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Markus text to Stan: Need to talk about going pro
Stan reply: Cool, let's meet in front of the Al statue
Markus: Perf, but let's wait til 3pm, at the end of study hall of Volleyball, Soccer and Track
Stan: I like it, also, I'm going to talk very loud
Markus: K, and I'm going to keep the conversation going long enough for the entire ticket staff to come out and see what's up
Stan: Deal. Or shall I say...#DoneDeal
Markus: Sweet use of an ellipsis and a top 5 #mubb meme
Stan: I'm not just a well dressed recruiter, I'm also a big connoisseur of DoddsOnSports, it's where I get all my juicy #mubb news
Markus: I'm ride or die Scoop so meeting or not, I'm going pro
Stan opens Uber App: [orders Uber Select to Arby's]
Now this is a good Scoop.
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
Now that is 100% fake news.
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Markus text to Stan: Need to talk about going pro
Stan reply: Cool, let's meet in front of the Al statue
Markus: Perf, but let's wait til 3pm, at the end of study hall of Volleyball, Soccer and Track
Stan: I like it, also, I'm going to talk very loud
Markus: K, and I'm going to keep the conversation going long enough for the entire ticket staff to come out and see what's up
Stan: Deal. Or shall I say...#DoneDeal
Markus: Sweet use of an ellipsis and a top 5 #mubb meme
Stan: I'm not just a well dressed recruiter, I'm also a big connoisseur of DoddsOnSports, it's where I get all my juicy #mubb news
Markus: I'm ride or die Scoop so meeting or not, I'm going pro
Stan opens Uber App: [orders Uber Select to Arby's]
Bravo!
Best post I've read on Scoop since chicos' 884th reference to the tourney being a crapshoot.
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Stan was wearing one on each foot, and Markus had one on his wrist.
Stan's Bootery.
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He gowne
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For those who always believe the sky is falling, have fun reading between the lines of Stan's latest tweet. What does it mean?!? Who's he talking about?!? OMG!!! OMG!!!
Stan Johnson @MUCoachJohnson • 7h
An honest enemy is always better than a friend who lies. Pay less attention to what people say, and more attention to what they do. Their actions will show you the truth.
https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd (https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd)
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For those who always believe the sky is falling, have fun reading between the lines of Stan's latest tweet. What does it mean?!? Who's he talking about?!? OMG!!! OMG!!!
Stan Johnson @MUCoachJohnson • 7h
An honest enemy is always better than a friend who lies. Pay less attention to what people say, and more attention to what they do. Their actions will show you the truth.
https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd (https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd)
Clearly Wojo is going to UNLV because that rumor made the mosssst sense.
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For those who always believe the sky is falling, have fun reading between the lines of Stan's latest tweet. What does it mean?!? Who's he talking about?!? OMG!!! OMG!!!
Stan Johnson @MUCoachJohnson • 7h
An honest enemy is always better than a friend who lies. Pay less attention to what people say, and more attention to what they do. Their actions will show you the truth.
https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd (https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd)
Bo Ryan > Greg Gard -- Stan's wading into the coaching debates
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For those who always believe the sky is falling, have fun reading between the lines of Stan's latest tweet. What does it mean?!? Who's he talking about?!? OMG!!! OMG!!!
Stan Johnson @MUCoachJohnson • 7h
An honest enemy is always better than a friend who lies. Pay less attention to what people say, and more attention to what they do. Their actions will show you the truth.
https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd (https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd)
OMG, Stan is talking about us!
Stan is talking about us!
Stan is talking about SCOOP!
Soylent Green is people!
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For those who always believe the sky is falling, have fun reading between the lines of Stan's latest tweet. What does it mean?!? Who's he talking about?!? OMG!!! OMG!!!
Stan Johnson @MUCoachJohnson • 7h
An honest enemy is always better than a friend who lies. Pay less attention to what people say, and more attention to what they do. Their actions will show you the truth.
https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd (https://twitter.com/search?q=%40MUCoachJohnson&src=typd)
Right now, here on Scoop...even the Wojo “apologists” have been grumpy and grumbling about our March collapse.
It is easy to see how a young mind would think We Scoopers are all acting like enemies of these fine young men who represent our beloved school. But in the end, all of us are just being honest with how we feel. Don’t pay attention to what we say. Pay attention to what we do...
Sell out FiservForum.
Show up for games in the worst winter weather.
Donate a couple bucks for scholarships to our student athletes.
In a word, care.
Get off our butts and get loud.
Truly support this program.
Surely we all spoke the truth. The team crapped their pants....multiple times with a lot on the line. Markus maybe got a bit selfish....Sam and Joey maybe got frustrated. Whatever...@&#$ happens.
We at Scoop have vented...we’re not your friends.....we’re hear to provide the noise.....you didn’t ignore it and play %@&! out like the coaches thought you would. Guess what, as a famous man once said...we’re the critic....it is not the critic who counts.....we know not what it means to be in the arena....well, ok, we can get inside FF...
But that is the point....pay no attention to what we say, but watch what we do.....we will be inside Fiserv Forum next year....offering not our critique but our unwavering support....our actions will show these young men the truth....
WE ARE MARQUETTE!
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Markus text to Stan: Need to talk about going pro
Stan reply: Cool, let's meet in front of the Al statue
Markus: Perf, but let's wait til 3pm, at the end of study hall of Volleyball, Soccer and Track
Stan: I like it, also, I'm going to talk very loud
Markus: K, and I'm going to keep the conversation going long enough for the entire ticket staff to come out and see what's up
Stan: Deal. Or shall I say...#DoneDeal
Markus: Sweet use of an ellipsis and a top 5 #mubb meme
Stan: I'm not just a well dressed recruiter, I'm also a big connoisseur of DoddsOnSports, it's where I get all my juicy #mubb news
Markus: I'm ride or die Scoop so meeting or not, I'm going pro
Stan opens Uber App: [orders Uber Select to Arby's]
Bueno. Very good
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Markus fell from 40th to off the board on the latest 2019 mock draft update.
https://www.nbadraft.net/2019mock_draft
Ponds also fell to out of board.
2020 mock has not been updated.
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As you all remember, I broke the Vander news in 2013, much to Scoop's raucous calls of Bullsnit.
Well, I'm back again and i have news. Bad news for us scoopers:
Markus is gone to the draft.
Whether it's a good idea or bad idea, we've seen the last of Markus in Blue and Gold.
Do with this what you will. M2N
I'd been told he was looking at the draft from a good NBA-related source too, but as others have said, that does not matter at all any more unless someone signs an agent or scouts tell him he will make it. Hey, if he goes out and has some days where he looks like a poor mans Seth Curry, yeah, there is a risk However, I do believe it's more likely he gets great guidance and I do believe he is a solid nba player after one more year to take what he learns in camp. Remember, Vander really begged scouts to tell him he was a first rounder, and later just said he really just wanted to move on. I don't think that's likely, and I believe he will come back an even better player for MU next year with specific improvements that will also make him a legit NBA player with another year under his belt.
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Markus ran out of gas. Not sure if he was worn out or banged up. He just didn't have "it" the last 8 games or so. He wasn't the only one. Makes you wonder if our conditioning program is not as good as we were led to believe.
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My friend who goes to marquette was at the Al and saw stan and markus arguing about him staying. Stan was telling him that if he stays we would be a top team with Greg and Koby being able to play next season but markus looked very frustrated and said he talked about it with his family after the murray state game. Sounds like he's gone
Pretty sure this is how someone broke the Vander news. This is well done.
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I'd been told he was looking at the draft from a good NBA-related source too, but as others have said, that does not matter at all any more unless someone signs an agent or scouts tell him he will make it. Hey, if he goes out and has some days where he looks like a poor mans Seth Curry, yeah, there is a risk However, I do believe it's more likely he gets great guidance and I do believe he is a solid nba player after one more year to take what he learns in camp. Remember, Vander really begged scouts to tell him he was a first rounder, and later just said he really just wanted to move on. I don't think that's likely, and I believe he will come back an even better player for MU next year with specific improvements that will also make him a legit NBA player with another year under his belt.
So if he declares for the draft and goes undrafted, he will not return?
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Markus ran out of gas. Not sure if he was worn out or banged up. He just didn't have "it" the last 8 games or so. He wasn't the only one. Makes you wonder if our conditioning program is not as good as we were led to believe.
I think the analogy is it was like a pitcher who pitched too many innings. They ran Certain kids too hard too long.
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Pretty sure this is how someone broke the Vander news. This is well done.
Yep
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I think the analogy is it was like a pitcher who pitched too many innings. They ran Certain kids too hard too long.
+1 Wojo will have guards next year, lets one of them can run the point.
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I think the analogy is it was like a pitcher who pitched too many innings. They ran Certain kids too hard too long.
Other teams do it. Why did our kids burn out?
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My best friend's sister's boyfriend's brother's girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who's going with the girl who saw Markus pass out at 31 Flavors last night while talking to a pro scout. I guess it's pretty serious.
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Other teams do it. Why did our kids burn out?
I can't speak for our other players, but Markus plays PG and is therefore facing constant pressure and is also regularly sprinting through multiple screens when he doesn't have the ball and is chasing opponents guards on D. I may be wrong, but it feels like he puts more miles on the odometer per minute than do our other players (and I imagine most players on other teams) when he is playing. Watching live, I thought he looked banged up and was not fluid in his running/movements in the Big East Tournament. Whether that is conditioning or a nagging injury, I don't know.
Not making excuses, but cutting down his minutes so he's only playing 32 min in the major conference games because we have a bench that can play for him has to be a good thing.
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I for one, would like to see Markus back next year. I'd like to see him both on and off the ball but with fewer minutes as some have said. It will keep him fresh, help in avoiding fouls, anf above all reduce the hits. And he will have a more experienced team around him.
Yesterday's classic battle between MSU and Duke was a superb chess match between Coach Wojo's mentor and the crafty Tom Izzo who always reminded me a little of Coach Al's approach. In the end, you must count on your floor general to prevail. Al did this with Butch Lee who was a junior when we won the NCAA championship. Coach Izzo did this with the experienced junior Cassius Winston yesterday.
Markus is better all around player than either Butch or Cassius but not a better leader as junior.
One more year Markus.
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In the end, you must count on your floor general to prevail. Coach Izzo did this with the experienced junior Cassius Winston yesterday.
Tre Jones had a tremendous game in the previous round and was one reason, maybe even the main reason, that Duke advanced.
He had 4 points yesterday and was obviously outclassed by Winston, supporting your point, Doggy.
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Howard is a better overall player than Butch Lee was? I think I read your post correctly, but possibly not. Did you mean Brian Butch that played for UW? Butch Lee, floor general?
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Markus is better all around player than either Butch or Cassius but not a better leader as junior.
Markus is a better scorer than those guys, but not sure where you are getting that he is a better all around player than either of them.
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Markus lands at #86 in the Top 100 Prospects list on ESPN. Just ahead of Cassius Winston and Ethan Happ.
Jonathan Givony and Mike Schmitz wrote an 'NBA Draft Stock Watch: Intel on Top 100 Prospects' article, but it's an ESPN+ article that I won't pay for.
So if anyone on here has ESPN+ and wants to share with us what it says related to Markus, that'd be great.
Unless the guy truly hates school (he doesn't) and the college experience (he doesn't) ala Vander, it seems obvious what his choice should be.
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Markus lands at #86 in the Top 100 Prospects list on ESPN. Just ahead of Cassius Winston and Ethan Happ.
Jonathan Givony and Mike Schmitz wrote an 'NBA Draft Stock Watch: Intel on Top 100 Prospects' article, but it's an ESPN+ article that I won't pay for.
So if anyone on here has ESPN+ and wants to share with us what it says related to Markus, that'd be great.
Unless the guy truly hates school (he doesn't) and the college experience (he doesn't) ala Vander, it seems obvious what his choice should be.
Agree with ONEPOST. We need ESPN+ Article.
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Markus lands at #86 in the Top 100 Prospects list on ESPN. Just ahead of Cassius Winston and Ethan Happ.
Jonathan Givony and Mike Schmitz wrote an 'NBA Draft Stock Watch: Intel on Top 100 Prospects' article, but it's an ESPN+ article that I won't pay for.
So if anyone on here has ESPN+ and wants to share with us what it says related to Markus, that'd be great.
Unless the guy truly hates school (he doesn't) and the college experience (he doesn't) ala Vander, it seems obvious what his choice should be.
Nothing written on Markus. The ESPN+ article stops its writeups at #32 (which would be the end of the 1st round).
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Other teams do it. Why did our kids burn out?
As others have pointed out One kid is beaten up pretty hard every time he goes into the paint ;and two other kids started off the season coming off of major hip and foot injuries. Pretty straightforward analysis.
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Markus lands at #86 in the Top 100 Prospects list on ESPN. Just ahead of Cassius Winston and Ethan Happ.
Jonathan Givony and Mike Schmitz wrote an 'NBA Draft Stock Watch: Intel on Top 100 Prospects' article, but it's an ESPN+ article that I won't pay for.
So if anyone on here has ESPN+ and wants to share with us what it says related to Markus, that'd be great.
Unless the guy truly hates school (he doesn't) and the college experience (he doesn't) ala Vander, it seems obvious what his choice should be.
Can't a third reason to leave would be to make money professionally? The guy was BEast Player of the Year. I doubt his NBA stock gets any higher next year as he will be the same height but a year older. If you could get a job in your chosen field a year earlier, would you have stayed at Marquette? Sure I liked my time at MU, but if I could've gotten out a year early with a job lined up I would've been done in 3.
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Can't a third reason to leave would be to make money professionally? The guy was BEast Player of the Year. I doubt his NBA stock gets any higher next year as he will be the same height but a year older. If you could get a job in your chosen field a year earlier, would you have stayed at Marquette? Sure I liked my time at MU, but if I could've gotten out a year early with a job lined up I would've been done in 3.
Oh sure, but you most likely needed a degree that you would not have had to get that job. Apples and oranges.
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I can't speak for our other players, but Markus plays PG and is therefore facing constant pressure and is also regularly sprinting through multiple screens when he doesn't have the ball and is chasing opponents guards on D. I may be wrong, but it feels like he puts more miles on the odometer per minute than do our other players (and I imagine most players on other teams) when he is playing. Watching live, I thought he looked banged up and was not fluid in his running/movements in the Big East Tournament. Whether that is conditioning or a nagging injury, I don't know.
Not making excuses, but cutting down his minutes so he's only playing 32 min in the major conference games because we have a bench that can play for him has to be a good thing.
One word.
KembaWalker
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I heard at the 31 flavors that Markus has told teammates he is moving on. But again, treat this like the rumors that we hear in coaching. People may just be making rumors so they can hear those rumors back.
If it is true, I wish him the best. It has been a lot of fun to watch him play. He has been a wonderful representative of Marquette on and off the court.
Moreover, if true, I am really excited to see the Koby/Greg/Symir era begin.
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Markus lands at #86 in the Top 100 Prospects list on ESPN. Just ahead of Cassius Winston and Ethan Happ.
Jonathan Givony and Mike Schmitz wrote an 'NBA Draft Stock Watch: Intel on Top 100 Prospects' article, but it's an ESPN+ article that I won't pay for.
So if anyone on here has ESPN+ and wants to share with us what it says related to Markus, that'd be great.
Unless the guy truly hates school (he doesn't) and the college experience (he doesn't) ala Vander, it seems obvious what his choice should be.
Markus was not mentioned in the article.
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Markus ran out of gas. Not sure if he was worn out or banged up. He just didn't have "it" the last 8 games or so. He wasn't the only one. Makes you wonder if our conditioning program is not as good as we were led to believe.
I thought this was a possibility, too, but I'm not sure it's provable unless the team comes out and admits they were all gassed by the end of the year.
From what I've seen/heard, Wojo doesn't appear to push his teams to "Buzz's boot camp" levels. Makes you wonder if Buzz's teams are just more physically equipped for the long season, even if the pre-season boot camps make them more tired early on and susceptible to non-conference bed-craps (e.g., Penn State this year).
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More speculation by all of us ... cuz that's what we do. But anyhoo ...
I felt that Markus wasn't so much tired as he was playing hurt for quite awhile. Just my opinion watching our last month of games.
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More speculation by all of us ... cuz that's what we do. But anyhoo ...
I felt that Markus wasn't so much tired as he was playing hurt for quite awhile. Just my opinion watching our last month of games.
Agreed. I think the groin was more of a factor than we ever knew.
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One word.
KembaWalker
Kemba Walker was bigger and stronger than Markus, and Kemba Walker's don't grow on trees. They are hard to find. Kemba also had freshmen Shabazz Napier to handle the ball for stretches so Walker could play off the ball. Shabazz himself is another good comp. He averaged 35 mpg as a PG over the whole season in 2014 when UConn won the NC again, and had Ryan Boatwright to take some of the ball handling duties. Markus didn't have one of those guys.
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Kemba Walker is 6ft 1 and 190 lbs. and has fantastic ball handling skills. Built like a rock.
Markus will probably be 5ft 10 and 175 and cannot dribble out of a double team.
Kemba had an outstanding BE and NCAA tournament runs.
Markus basically did nothing, if not hamper his outlook in both tournaments.
Kemba is a free agent, currently making 12M a year, coming off a four year contract. Will probably get about 100M contract in few months. The comparison has been brought up on numerous occasions, but just don't see it. Maybe its just a close to the height thing.
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Sorry, Markus is no Kemba Walker. Not a rip on Howard, Kemba is the real deal in the NBA.
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Markus is a great player but he is no kemba walker, maybe eventually but not now
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markus played plenty of games at the beginning of the year that looked more like the way he played at the end of the year...i'm not interested in excuses for his play given that he still couldn't manage to pass to a wide-open sam while jacking from nba range. if he was hurt, tired, not feeling it, etc... he should have stopped jacking shots and found an open teammate. i get that he isn't a point guard, and i get that his size effects his ability to pass out of a double team, but there were plenty of plays where guys were wide-open and getting them the ball required no more talent than any high school point guard possesses. markus chose not to pass the ball...if he was hurt and still pulling that sh1t it makes it even worse.
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I heard at the 31 flavors that Markus has told teammates he is moving on. But again, treat this like the rumors that we hear in coaching. People may just be making rumors so they can hear those rumors back.
If it is true, I wish him the best. It has been a lot of fun to watch him play. He has been a wonderful representative of Marquette on and off the court.
Moreover, if true, I am really excited to see the Koby/Greg/Symir era begin.
31 flavors line gave me the Ferris sarcastic vibe but the rest of your post seemed genuine?
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Can't a third reason to leave would be to make money professionally? The guy was BEast Player of the Year. I doubt his NBA stock gets any higher next year as he will be the same height but a year older. If you could get a job in your chosen field a year earlier, would you have stayed at Marquette? Sure I liked my time at MU, but if I could've gotten out a year early with a job lined up I would've been done in 3.
Absolutely it can be a reason. Could be foolish of me, but I guess I peg Markus as a guy who doesn't want to just settle for getting paid to play basketball like Vander did. With that, and knowing how vital draft spot equalling guaranteed money is, I do think he sees himself as a guy who can play his way into guaranteed money (like Carsen Edwards in this tourney, he's at #25 on that list) and not just 'maybe I'll get drafted'. So while some see it as "he's reached his highest value: might as well leave now" I strongly disagree in that he could prove he's a legit PG prospect (improved assist rate, A/TO ratio, handle, decision-making) and another year could improve his stock to the point he gets guaranteed money and contract security.
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Kemba Walker is 6ft 1 and 190 lbs.
5-11 1/2”
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Absolutely it can be a reason. Could be foolish of me, but I guess I peg Markus as a guy who doesn't want to just settle for getting paid to play basketball like Vander did. With that, and knowing how vital draft spot equalling guaranteed money is, I do think he sees himself as a guy who can play his way into guaranteed money (like Carsen Edwards in this tourney, he's at #25 on that list) and not just 'maybe I'll get drafted'. So while some see it as "he's reached his highest value: might as well leave now" I strongly disagree in that he could prove he's a legit PG prospect (improved assist rate, A/TO ratio, handle, decision-making) and another year could improve his stock to the point he gets guaranteed money and contract security.
To me, I always think if you are not going to get drafted get your degree. A guy like Markus would have a great chance at coaching and there are going to be positions that require the college degree. Maximize your options. Going back to school and paying for it later is a pain in the neck. He'll only be 21 if he stays another year anyway. If you think you are going to get drafted in the second round it is a tougher choice and either option would be reasonable. If you are going to be a first round choice, unless you REALLY love college, go. If you are a lottery pick, if you REALLY love college, go anyway.
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5-11 1/2”
Whatever, nick pit all you want. I'll go with this.
http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/6479/kemba-walker
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Whatever, nick pit all you want. I'll go with this.
http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/6479/kemba-walker
5'11 184 lbs at the combine. But I still don't see the Kemba/Markus comparison.
https://www.si.com/nba/2013/12/13/draft-measurements
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Whatever, nick pit all you want. I'll go with this.
http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/6479/kemba-walker
I was simply stating his actual height. Players and teams exaggerate all of the time. Draymond Green is listed at 6'7" even though he is 6'-5.75". Jae Crowder is 6'-4.75"despite being listed at 6'6". It is what teams do.
If you want real heights, look at measurements from the Draft Combine.
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5'11 184 lbs at the combine. But I still don't see the Kemba/Markus comparison.
https://www.si.com/nba/2013/12/13/draft-measurements
Agreed. I made no comparison between the two players other than saying that playing a lot of minutes doesn't mean they get worn out by season's end.
I firmly believe Markus was still feeling the effects of his injury the last few weeks of the year.
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31 flavors line gave me the Ferris sarcastic vibe but the rest of your post seemed genuine?
I wanted to keep my "source" (a friend [person 1], who knows a guy [person 2] who talked to a "player on the team") within perspective. I can't speak to the veracity of person 2, nor if a conversation happened at all. Again, all we know is that we don't know, but it isn't shocking if it is true and MH is gone.
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I wanted to keep my "source" (a friend [person 1], who knows a guy [person 2] who talked to a "player on the team") within perspective. I can't speak to the veracity of person 2, nor if a conversation happened at all. Again, all we know is that we don't know, but it isn't shocking if it is true and MH is gone.
Well I for one welcome all rumors. They keep things interesting and give us something to talk about other than Wojo sucking or walking on water. Thanks for the info
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5'11 184 lbs at the combine. But I still don't see the Kemba/Markus comparison.
https://www.si.com/nba/2013/12/13/draft-measurements
Since he plays in shoes (barring the occasional wardrobe malfunction), the 6'1" seems more relevant....
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Since he plays in shoes (barring the occasional wardrobe malfunction), the 6'1" seems more relevant....
Sure...but everybody plays in shoes. So it's not any more accurate.
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Sure...but everybody plays in shoes. So it's not any more accurate.
I didn't say more accurate, I said more relevant.
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Since he plays in shoes (barring the occasional wardrobe malfunction), the 6'1" seems more relevant....
So Kemba could be a 6'11" center if he wore a stovepipe hat.
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ESPN lists Markus at 6'0"... maybe its shoes plus hair?
I'd like to see him standing next to Mo Acker... pretty sure there wouldn't be much difference.
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ESPN lists Markus at 6'0"... maybe its shoes plus hair?
I'd like to see him standing next to Mo Acker... pretty sure there wouldn't be much difference.
Definitely taller than Mo...but no way is he 6 foot.
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To me, I always think if you are not going to get drafted get your degree. A guy like Markus would have a great chance at coaching and there are going to be positions that require the college degree. Maximize your options. Going back to school and paying for it later is a pain in the neck. He'll only be 21 if he stays another year anyway. If you think you are going to get drafted in the second round it is a tougher choice and either option would be reasonable. If you are going to be a first round choice, unless you REALLY love college, go. If you are a lottery pick, if you REALLY love college, go anyway.
I don't know Markus but I've read a lot about him and he sure sounds like an intelligent young man. Assuming that's true, he would have absolutely no problem earning his degree down the line, be it a year from now or 10 years from now. Heck, he could finish his bachelor's and earn his masters online in a couple years.
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I don't know Markus but I've read a lot about him and he sure sounds like an intelligent young man. Assuming that's true, he would have absolutely no problem earning his degree down the line, be it a year from now or 10 years from now. Heck, he could finish his bachelor's and earn his masters online in a couple years.
Further, seeing how open Markus has been about a number of issues this season, I believe that when he makes a decision he will announce it with a great deal of class, and respect for his teammates and the MU fans.
Markus is bound to test the waters this year, we should expect that. Also, remember that this year certain elite players are permitted to hire an agent to help them navigate the draft process and still return to school should they decide to do so. I expect that Markus, who is a finalist for a number of national awards, would be permitted to hire an agent. This path has certain restrictions on what the agent can pay for, but I think it offers those "testing the waters" most of the same advantages as other potential draftees in terms of prepping for interviews, setting up individual team workouts, etc.
All of my observances through the media is that Markus is level-headed and has a strong family support system that will help him make the best decision for him.
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Further, seeing how open Markus has been about a number of issues this season, I believe that when he makes a decision he will announce it with a great deal of class, and respect for his teammates and the MU fans.
Markus is bound to test the waters this year, we should expect that. Also, remember that this year certain elite players are permitted to hire an agent to help them navigate the draft process and still return to school should they decide to do so. I expect that Markus, who is a finalist for a number of national awards, would be permitted to hire an agent. This path has certain restrictions on what the agent can pay for, but I think it offers those "testing the waters" most of the same advantages as other potential draftees in terms of prepping for interviews, setting up individual team workouts, etc.
All of my observances through the media is that Markus is level-headed and has a strong family support system that will help him make the best decision for him.
Outstanding observations.
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If he goes undrafted, it would be dumb not to come back. Realistic chance at a final four next season
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1. NYK Zion Williamson PF Duke Fr. 6-6 18.6
2. CLE RJ Barrett SG/SF Duke Fr. 6-7 18.7
3. PHX Ja Morant PG Murray St So. 6-3 19.6
4. CHI Darius Garland PG Vanderbilt Fr. 6-3 19.1
5. ATL De'Andre Hunter PF Virginia So. 6-8 21.2
6. MEM Cam Reddish SF Duke Fr. 6-9 19.5
7. ATL (via DAL) Jarrett Culver SG Texas Tech So. 6-6 20.0
8. WAS Sekou Doumbouya PF Limoges Intl. 6-9 18.2
9. NOP Jaxson Hayes C Texas Fr. 7-0 18.8
10. LAL Romeo Langford SF Indiana Fr. 6-6 19.3
11. CHA Coby White PG/SG North Carolina Fr. 6-5 19.0
12. MIN Kevin Porter Jr. SG USC Fr. 6-6 18.8
13. MIA PJ Washington PF Kentucky So. 6-8 20.5
14. BOS (via SAC) Bol Bol C Oregon Fr. 7-2 19.3
15. ORL Keldon Johnson SF Kentucky Fr. 6-6 19.4
16. BKN Rui Hachimura PF Gonzaga Jr. 6-9 21.1
17. DET Nassir Little SF/PF North Carolina Fr. 6-6 19.0
18. BOS (via LAC) Talen Horton-Tucker SF Iowa St Fr. 6-4 18.3
19. SAS Cameron Johnson SF/PF North Carolina Sr. 6-9 23.0
20. OKC Tyler Herro SG Kentucky Fr. 6-5 19.1
21. UTA Nickeil Alexander-Walker SG Virginia Tech So. 6-6 20.5
22. POR Brandon Clarke PF Gonzaga Jr. 6-8 22.4
23. IND KZ Okpala SF/PF Stanford So. 6-9 19.8
24. BOS Goga Bitadze C Buducnost Intl. 6-11 19.6
25. CLE (via HOU) Jontay Porter C Missouri So. 6-11 19.3
26. PHI Matisse Thybulle SF Washington Sr. 6-6 22.0
27. BKN (via DEN) Grant Williams PF Tennessee Jr. 6-7 20.2
28. GSW Ty Jerome PG/SG Virginia Jr. 6-5 21.6
29. SAS (via TOR) Luguentz Dort SG Arizona St Fr. 6-5 19.9
30. MIL Bruno Fernando C Maryland So. 6-10 20.5
31. BKN (via NYK) Tre Jones PG Duke Fr. 6-3 19.1
32. PHI (via CLE) Chuma Okeke SF/PF Auburn So. 6-7 20.5
33. PHX Eric Paschall PF Villanova Sr. 6-8 22.3
34. PHI (via CHI) Admiral Schofield SF/PF Tennessee Sr. 6-5 21.9
35. ATL Dylan Windler SF Belmont Sr. 6-7 22.4
36. CHI (via MEM) Jalen McDaniels SF/PF SDSU So. 6-10 21.1
37. DAL Daniel Gafford C Arkansas So. 6-10 20.4
38. CHA (via WAS) Luka Samanic PF O. Ljubljana Intl. 6-11 19.1
39. NOP Isaiah Roby PF Nebraska Jr. 6-8 21.1
40. SAC (via LAL) Ayo Dosunmu PG/SG Illinois Fr. 6-4 19.1
41. ATL (via CHA) Ashton Hagans PG Kentucky Fr. 6-3 19.6
42. ATL( via MIN) Darius Bazley SF/PF N/A Fr. 6-9 18.7
43. MIN (via MIA) Dedric Lawson PF Kansas Jr. 6-8 21.4
44. PHI (via SAC) Joshua Obiesie PG/SG Wuerzburg Intl. 6-6 18.8
45. SAC (via ORL) Deividas Sirvydis SF L. Rytas Intl. 6-9 18.7
46. ORL (via BKN) Shamorie Ponds PG St. John's Jr. 6-1 20.7
47. DET Nazreon Reid PF/C LSU Fr. 6-10 19.5
48. LAC Carsen Edwards PG Purdue Jr. 6-0 21.0
49. SAS Amir Hinton PG/SG Shaw Jr. 6-5 22.0
50. CHA (via OKC) Jaylen Hoard PF Wake Forest Fr. 6-9 19.9
51. UTA Miye Oni SF Yale Jr. 6-6 21.6
52. LAC (via POR) Yovel Zoosman SF Maccabi Intl. 6-8 20.8
53. IND Adam Mokoka SG Mega Bemax Intl. 6-5 20.6
54. BOS Brian Bowen SF Sydney Intl. 6-7 20.4
55. NYK (via HOU) Terence Davis SG Mississippi Sr. 6-4 21.8
56. PHI Charles Bassey C W. Kentucky Fr. 6-11 18.3
57. NOP (via DEN) Louis King SF/PF Oregon Fr. 6-8 19.9
58. GSW John Konchar SG IPFW Sr. 6-6 23.0
59. TOR James Palmer Jr. SF Nebraska Sr. 6-6 22.6
60. SAC (via MIL) Charles Matthews SF Michigan Jr. 6-6 22.3
latest espn mock draft for anyone that cares
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If he goes undrafted, it would be dumb not to come back. Realistic chance at a final four next season
As far as I know, players still need to notify the NCAA of their intent to return about 10 days after the completion of the draft combine. They cannot wait to see if they are drafted.
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As far as I know, players still need to notify the NCAA of their intent to return about 10 days after the completion of the draft combine. They cannot wait to see if they are drafted.
it would be dumb for him to leave is what im saying
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it would be dumb for him to leave is what im saying
Unless he wants to leave for any number of reasons that matter to him.
Then it would be dumb for him to follow the advice of anonymous interwebs posters.
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it would be dumb for him to leave is what im saying
If you say so.
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Can't a third reason to leave would be to make money professionally? The guy was BEast Player of the Year. I doubt his NBA stock gets any higher next year as he will be the same height but a year older. If you could get a job in your chosen field a year earlier, would you have stayed at Marquette? Sure I liked my time at MU, but if I could've gotten out a year early with a job lined up I would've been done in 3.
Completely disagree.
He can get a lot better. Look no further than Markus' good friend and roommate at the Chris Paul basketball camp Ja Morant.
If Markus wants to be a PG, he can work on getting strong, faster, a better distributor of the basketball. In short lots of things he can do to improve.
As much as NBA scouting is portrayed as a highly technical science ... a postseason run matters a lot if you want to get drafted.
Just Ask Donte DiVincenzo, you think he would still have been the 17th pick in the draft if Nova bombed out in the second round last year? Every player has a run of three or four really good games in a year. Instead of having it January, Donte picked the NCAA tourney and shining in the National Championship game. His reward is millions from the Bucks to sit on the bench.
So here's how Markus gets drafted in the first round next year. Average 31 in next year's NCAA and drop 40 to get MU in the FF.
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Can someone add Powell’s name to the mock draft and get him to
Leave seton hall. I can’t handle another year of him.
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So Kemba could be a 6'11" center if he wore a stovepipe hat.
The last I checked, shoes actually make a difference in how high off the ground your hands and arms are; they get you closer to the hoop. Oh, and players actually do wear them on the court.
Stovepipe hats, not so much.
But if you want to argue simply for the sake of arguing, have at it.
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So Kemba could be a 6'11" center if he wore a stovepipe hat.
I don't think that would be very effective, but it would be fun to watch!
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As far as I know, players still need to notify the NCAA of their intent to return about 10 days after the completion of the draft combine. They cannot wait to see if they are drafted.
No longer the case, can hire an agent and return to school if undrafted. Must notify the ad by the Monday after the draft
https://www.google.com/amp/s/ftw.usatoday.com/2018/08/college-basketball-ncaa-rules-agents-explanation-nba-draft-undrafted-players-fbi/amp
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The last I checked, shoes actually make a difference in how high off the ground your hands and arms are; they get you closer to the hoop. Oh, and players actually do wear them on the court.
So why don't players all wear lifts, or go all out for 4" stiletto heels? That gets you further off the ground.
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So why don't players all wear lifts, or go all out for 4" stiletto heels? That gets you further off the ground.
(https://sneakernews.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/kevin-hart-air-jordan-1-bred-platform-shoes-1.jpg)
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So why don't players all wear lifts, or go all out for 4" stiletto heels? That gets you further off the ground.
Maybe because it wouldn’t work in a game? Just a guess....
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Sorry, Markus is no Kemba Walker. Not a rip on Howard, Kemba is the real deal in the NBA.
Da only similarity shared by Kemba and Markus is der first names begin wit "M," aina?
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No longer the case, can hire an agent and return to school if undrafted. Must notify the ad by the Monday after the draft
https://www.google.com/amp/s/ftw.usatoday.com/2018/08/college-basketball-ncaa-rules-agents-explanation-nba-draft-undrafted-players-fbi/amp
The information I read says that this option will only become available if other rule changes take place - but perhaps they already have.
https://www.ncaa.org/about/flexibility-going-pro-and-getting-degree (https://www.ncaa.org/about/flexibility-going-pro-and-getting-degree)
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The last I checked, shoes actually make a difference in how high off the ground your hands and arms are; they get you closer to the hoop. Oh, and players actually do wear them on the court.
Stovepipe hats, not so much.
But if you want to argue simply for the sake of arguing, have at it.
Not much of a sense of humor? I don’t know how to be more obvious when making a joke.
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Not much of a sense of humor? I don’t know how to be more obvious when making a joke.
GoooooMarquette has had a really tough showing in this thread.
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So Markus made AP Second Team All American. Obviously Scoopers weren't doing the voting.
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Interesting to note that the only senior on the first, second or third team is Happ.
https://ktiv.com/2019/04/02/duke-freshmen-williamson-barrett-top-ap-all-america-team/
First Team
Zion Williamson, Duke, 6-7, 285, freshman, Spartanburg, S.C., 22.1 ppg, 8.9 rpg, 2.1 apg, 69.3 fg pct, 1.8 blocks, 2.2 steals (64 of 64 first-place votes, 320 points).
Grant Williams, Tennessee, 6-7, 236, junior, Charlotte, N.C., 19.0 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 3.1 apg, 56.5 fg pct, 82.6 ft pct, 1.4 blocks, 1.1 steals (49, 286).
RJ Barrett, Duke, 6-7, 202, freshman, Mississauga, Ontario, 22.9 ppg, 7.5 rpg, 4.1 apg (44, 275).
Ja Morant, Murray State, 6-3, 175, sophomore, Dalzell, S.C., 24.6 ppg, 5.5 rpg, 10.0 apg, 50.3 fg pct, 81.0 ft pct, 1.8 steals (43, 272).
Cassius Winston, Michigan State, 6-1, 185, junior, Detroit, 18.9 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 7.6 apg, 40.4 3-pt fg pct, 84.0 ft pct (42,268).
Second Team
Rui Hachimura, Gonzaga, 6-8, 230, junior, Toyama, Japan, 20.1 rpg, 6.6 rpg, 60.9 fg pct, 1.0 steals (25, 207).
Jarrett Culver, Texas Tech, 6-6, 195, sophomore, Lubbock, Texas, 18.5 ppg, 6.3 rpg, 3.7 apg, 1.4 steals (15, 188).
Markus Howard, Marquette, 5-11, 175, junior, Chandler, Ariz., 24.8 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 4.0 apg, 40.6 3-pt fg pct, 3.5 3-pt fg/game, 88.7 ft pct, 1.1 steals (11, 186).
Ethan Happ, Wisconsin, 6-10, 237, senior, Milan, Ill., 17.5 ppg, 10.1 rpg, 4.6 apg, 53.1 fg pct, 1.3 blocks, 1.1 steals (6, 139).
Carsen Edwards, Purdue, 6-1, 200, junior, Atascocita, Texas, 23.0 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 3.0 apg, 84.3 ft pct, 3.3 3-pt fg/game, 1.4 steals (6, 133).
Third Team
De’Andre Hunter, Virginia, 6-7, 225, junior, Philadelphia, 15.1 ppg, 5.0 rpg, 2.1 apg, 53.0 fg pct, 45.7 3-pt fg pct (3, 125).
Dedric Lawson, Kansas, 6-9, 235, Memphis, Tenn., 19.1 ppg, 10.3 rpg, 82.4 ft pct, 1.1 blocks, 1.3 steals (3, 110).
Brandon Clarke, Gonzaga, 6-8, 215, junior, Phoenix, 16.5 ppg, 8.4 rpg, 69.3 fg pct, 3.1 blocks, 1.2 steals (4, 92).
PJ Washington, Kentucky, 6-8, 228 sophomore, Dallas, 14.8 ppg, 7.5 rpg, 51.5 fg pct, 41.9 3-pt fg pct, 1.2 blocks (1, 79).
Kyle Guy, Virginia, 6-2, 175, junior, Indianapolis, 15.6 ppg, 4.4 rpg, 2.2 apg, 46.3 3-pt fg pct, 83.6 ft pct (1, 44).
Honorable Mention (alphabetical order)
Keith Braxton, St. Francis (Pa.); Ignas Brazdeikis, Michigan; Tookie Brown, Georgia Southern; Chris Clemons, Campbell; RJ Cole, Howard; Jeremy Combs, Texas Southern; Jarron Cumberland, Cincinnati; Mike Daum, South Dakota State; Jordan Davis, Northern Colorado; Cameron Delaney, Sam Houston State; Lamine Diane, Cal State Northridge; Daniel Gafford, Arkansas; Jon Axel Gudmundsson, Davidson; Rapolas Ivanauskas, Colgate; Ty Jerome, Virginia; Cameron Johnson, North Carolina; Anthony Lamb, Vermont; Fletcher Magee, Wofford; Caleb Martin, Nevada; CJ Massinburg, Buffalo; Garrison Mathews, Lipscomb; Luke Maye, North Carolina; Drew McDonald, Northern Kentucky; Sam Merrill, Utah State; Jaylen Nowell, Washington; Miye Oni, Yale; Shamorie Ponds, St. John’s; Myles Powell, Seton Hall; Admiral Schofield, Tennessee; Marial Shayok, Iowa State; B.J. Stith, Old Dominion; Matisse Thybulle, Washington; Jake Toolson, Utah Valley; Marques Townes, Loyola of Chicago; Tremont Waters, LSU; Coby White, North Carolina; Justin Wright-Foreman, Hofstra; Cameron Young, Quinnipiac.
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Interesting to note that the only senior on the first, second or third team is Happ.
I wonder how many are back. Donation
Winston, Howard, Guy? Anyone else?
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To me, I always think if you are not going to get drafted get your degree. A guy like Markus would have a great chance at coaching and there are going to be positions that require the college degree. Maximize your options. Going back to school and paying for it later is a pain in the neck. He'll only be 21 if he stays another year anyway. If you think you are going to get drafted in the second round it is a tougher choice and either option would be reasonable. If you are going to be a first round choice, unless you REALLY love college, go. If you are a lottery pick, if you REALLY love college, go anyway.
Are you talking about getting a degree for a coaching position or for a real job? If you were talking about a real job, I would agree it is hard to go back and get a degree with a major/school you are proud to show off. But it sounds like you are talking about coaching and I assume Howard is 30 credits or less away from graduating. I'm sure he could transfer credits and take some online classes to finish up the degree. If a big-time school wants him, a degree won't hold him back. He's a smart kid and could get it.
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Completely disagree.
He can get a lot better. Look no further than Markus' good friend and roommate at the Chris Paul basketball camp Ja Morant.
If Markus wants to be a PG, he can work on getting strong, faster, a better distributor of the basketball. In short lots of things he can do to improve.
As much as NBA scouting is portrayed as a highly technical science ... a postseason run matters a lot if you want to get drafted.
Just Ask Donte DiVincenzo, you think he would still have been the 17th pick in the draft if Nova bombed out in the second round last year? Every player has a run of three or four really good games in a year. Instead of having it January, Donte picked the NCAA tourney and shining in the National Championship game. His reward is millions from the Bucks to sit on the bench.
So here's how Markus gets drafted in the first round next year. Average 31 in next year's NCAA and drop 40 to get MU in the FF.
I think you are really underrating DDV. He may not have been the 17th pick, but DDV has NBA size and athleticism (42 inch vertical). He is "sitting" on the bench due to injury. He started the season in the best NBA's team rotation before the injury set in. You don't get that given to you because of a good tourney run.
Ja Morant also doubled his PPG and didn't prove anything last year. MH has proven everything but a few tourney wins. I don't think a few tourney wins will make NBA scouts over look his defense and flaws.
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MH has proven everything but a few tourney wins. I don't think a few tourney wins will make NBA scouts over look his defense and flaws.
NO. HE. HASN'T. How is this so hard for some of you to comprehend?
If Markus has any hope at a long-term career in the NBA, it will be as a PG. On that front, he has a LONG way to go.
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GoooooMarquette has had a really tough showing in this thread.
I didn't mean my post as a criticism. Goo is a good poster here.
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Markus is the 10th player in the 100+ year history of Marquette men's basketball to be named a First, Second or Third Team All-American by the AP. Pretty good company:
Dean Meminger (1st team, 1971)
Jim Chones (1st team, 1972)
Butch Lee (1st team, 1978; 2nd team, 1977)
Dwyane Wade (1st team, 2003)
Earl Tatum (2nd team, 1976; 3rd team, 1975)
Jerel McNeal (2nd team, 2009)
Jae Crowder (2nd team, 2012)
Bo Ellis (3rd team, 1977)
Sam Worthen (3rd team, 1980)
FYI, the AP began naming its team selections in 1948.
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Not much of a sense of humor? I don’t know how to be more obvious when making a joke.
James Breeding was officiating my response....
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Markus is the 10th player in the 100+ year history of Marquette men's basketball to be named a First, Second or Third Team All-American by the AP. Pretty good company:
Dean Meminger (1st team, 1971)
Jim Chones (1st team, 1972)
Butch Lee (1st team, 1978; 2nd team, 1977)
Dwyane Wade (1st team, 2003)
Earl Tatum (2nd team, 1976; 3rd team, 1975)
Jerel McNeal (2nd team, 2009)
Jae Crowder (2nd team, 2012)
Bo Ellis (3rd team, 1977)
Sam Worthen (3rd team, 1980)
FYI, the AP began naming its team selections in 1948.
bUt He'S nOt A pOiNt GuArD!!!!
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Markus is the 10th player in the 100+ year history of Marquette men's basketball to be named a First, Second or Third Team All-American by the AP. Pretty good company:
Dean Meminger (1st team, 1971)
Jim Chones (1st team, 1972)
Butch Lee (1st team, 1978; 2nd team, 1977)
Dwyane Wade (1st team, 2003)
Earl Tatum (2nd team, 1976; 3rd team, 1975)
Jerel McNeal (2nd team, 2009)
Jae Crowder (2nd team, 2012)
Bo Ellis (3rd team, 1977)
Sam Worthen (3rd team, 1980)
FYI, the AP began naming its team selections in 1948.
If he comes back, he likely becomes the third player to do it twice
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I didn't mean my post as a criticism. Goo is a good poster here.
It's all good.
And congrats to Markus!!
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Markus is the 10th player in the 100+ year history of Marquette men's basketball to be named a First, Second or Third Team All-American by the AP. Pretty good company:
Dean Meminger (1st team, 1971)
Jim Chones (1st team, 1972)
Butch Lee (1st team, 1978; 2nd team, 1977)
Dwyane Wade (1st team, 2003)
Earl Tatum (2nd team, 1976; 3rd team, 1975)
Jerel McNeal (2nd team, 2009)
Jae Crowder (2nd team, 2012)
Bo Ellis (3rd team, 1977)
Sam Worthen (3rd team, 1980)
FYI, the AP began naming its team selections in 1948.
One notable player was not on that list. His obituary tells the story.
https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2010-nov-02-la-me-maurice-lucas-20101102-story.html
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NO. HE. HASN'T. How is this so hard for some of you to comprehend?
If Markus has any hope at a long-term career in the NBA, it will be as a PG. On that front, he has a LONG way to go.
I agree and a nice start would be cutting down those 134 TO's from last year.
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Herman
Luke was a very good man. Thanks for sharing.
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Markus is the 10th player in the 100+ year history of Marquette men's basketball to be named a First, Second or Third Team All-American by the AP. Pretty good company:
Dean Meminger (1st team, 1971)
Jim Chones (1st team, 1972)
Butch Lee (1st team, 1978; 2nd team, 1977)
Dwyane Wade (1st team, 2003)
Earl Tatum (2nd team, 1976; 3rd team, 1975)
Jerel McNeal (2nd team, 2009)
Jae Crowder (2nd team, 2012)
Bo Ellis (3rd team, 1977)
Sam Worthen (3rd team, 1980)
FYI, the AP began naming its team selections in 1948.
Man. Reading that list brings back a lot of memories
And Sam Worthen, there was a wizard.
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Man. Reading that list brings back a lot of memories
And Sam Worthen, there was a wizard.
Ball on a string....
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It's also a reminder of just how much talent MU landed in those days: 8 consensus AP All-Americans between 1971 and 1980. Pretty amazing.
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I'm surprised neither Kojis or Rand were All Americans. Did they only do 1 team back then?
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Da only similarity shared by Kemba and Markus is der first names begin wit "M," aina?
No'a. Both All-Americans. Both among nation's leading scorers.
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Who is the only first team AP All American at Marquette whose jersey is not retired?Wake up Marquette.Inexcusable!!!
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Who is the only first team AP All American at Marquette whose jersey is not retired?Wake up Marquette.Inexcusable!!!
Especially they got rid of the “get your degree” requirement with Rivers and Wade.
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Especially they got rid of the “get your degree” requirement with Rivers and Wade.
He has his degree.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1999-05-24-9905240024-story.html (https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1999-05-24-9905240024-story.html)
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I'm surprised neither Kojis or Rand were All Americans. Did they only do 1 team back then?
Kojis was honorable mention. He unfortunately came along at a time as several of the all time greats . Jerry West , Oscar Robertson , Jerry Lucas , Dave Debusschure etc. Rand was also AP honorable mention and made some All America teams
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I am surprised Lloyd Walton is not on that list, and that Bo only made 3rd team. Both may have been slighted by having too many other good players around them.
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I am surprised Lloyd Walton is not on that list, and that Bo only made 3rd team. Both may have been slighted by having too many other good players around them.
One thing to remember is back in the pre internt pre cable era, a lot of the All Americans were a function of the Sports Information Directors and Journalism schools. Same goes true for some of the real turkeys that were named Heisman Trophy winners. Case in point Jim Brown never won Heisman trophy.
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Kojis was honorable mention. He unfortunately came along at a time as several of the all time greats . Jerry West , Oscar Robertson , Jerry Lucas , Dave Debusschure etc. Rand was also AP honorable mention and made some All America teams
All those guys were in the 60s after Kojis, other than West
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All those guys were in the 60s after Kojis, other than West
Robertson was in 59 as well.
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He has his degree.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1999-05-24-9905240024-story.html (https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-xpm-1999-05-24-9905240024-story.html)
Ah. Then let’s get it done!!
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It's also a reminder of just how much talent MU landed in those days: 8 consensus AP All-Americans between 1971 and 1980. Pretty amazing.
Not enough championships for all that talent
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As 4ever has noted many times, 22 belongs in the rafters.
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As 4ever has noted many times, 22 belongs in the rafters.
I love Doc but 22 deserves it way more.
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PTM
You might be right on March success for the boys. I do believe that Al had everything in place for a great five year run post NC. Unfortunately, we never saw it happen. ‘74-‘77 was a very good run and they had pipeline for best of the best recruits when Al stepped down. His departure was Louisville and DePaul’s gain.
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PTM
You might be right on March success for the boys. I do believe that Al had everything in place for a great five year run post NC. Unfortunately, we never saw it happen. ‘74-‘77 was a very good run and they had pipeline for best of the best recruits when Al stepped down. His departure was Louisville and DePaul’s gain.
Completely correct. Replacing Al with Hank was one of the three great mistakes of Marquette History.
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Completely correct. Replacing Al with Hank was one of the three great mistakes of Marquette History.
1. Hiring Hank Raymond
2. Exploring the Mississippi
3. Lalumiere Hall
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1. Hiring Hank Raymond
2. Exploring the Mississippi
3. Lalumiere Hall
4. dropping football
5. Carlton Christian
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4. dropping football
5. Carlton Christian
6. LA Gear contract
7. Avenue Commons
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6. LA Gear contract
7. Avenue Commons
8. Marquette Gold
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Got to love the off-season!
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Amazing how far back The Great Mistakes Of Marquette History go:
14 years ago: Marquette Gold
16 years ago: Carlton Christian
27 years ago: Avenue Commons
29 years ago: L.A. Gear contract
41 years ago: Replacing Al with Hank
49 years ago: Lalumiere Hall (IMO McCormick is a far worse architectural travesty)
59 years ago: Dropping football
346 years ago: Exploring the Mississippi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGC6C4vuOao (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGC6C4vuOao)
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5. Carlton Christian
But...but...he dunked on Amare Stoudemire in a high school game once.
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Amazing how far back The Great Mistakes Of Marquette History go:
49 years ago: Lalumiere Hall (IMO McCormick is a far worse architectural travesty)
This is a bad take. McCormick represents Milwaukee's most famous export. It is perfection in every way.
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Amazing how far back The Great Mistakes Of Marquette History go:
14 years ago: Marquette Gold
16 years ago: Carlton Christian
27 years ago: Avenue Commons
29 years ago: L.A. Gear contract
41 years ago: Replacing Al with Hank
49 years ago: Lalumiere Hall (IMO McCormick is a far worse architectural travesty)
59 years ago: Dropping football
346 years ago: Exploring the Mississippi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGC6C4vuOao (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGC6C4vuOao)
Does that mean MU is on a pretty good 'not effing up' run?
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9. The exterior of the Athletic and Human Performance Research Center.
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10. Not preserving the Lighthouse as a Campus shrine.
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Back to Markus.......
The Athletic did anonymous interviews during the tournament with 110 players. One of the questions asked was who was the best college player in the country this year. Markus came in 3rd.
Zion was 1st by a very wide margin and Ja was 2nd.
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Back to Markus.......
The Athletic did anonymous interviews during the tournament with 110 players. One of the questions asked was who was the best college player in the country this year. Markus came in 3rd.
Zion was 1st by a very wide margin and Ja was 2nd.
Must have been a few K-State / Creighton / Buffalo players in that survey
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Back to Markus.......
The Athletic did anonymous interviews during the tournament with 110 players. One of the questions asked was who was the best college player in the country this year. Markus came in 3rd.
Zion was 1st by a very wide margin and Ja was 2nd.
Interesting.
I would take Cassius Winston and Carsen Edwards over Markus right now (NCAA-wise)
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Not enough championships for all that talent
look at the teams they were competing against. UCLA, the greatest dynasty in college sports, NC State in 1974, the undefeated 1976 Indiana team that knocked us off in the Elite 8. The top was loaded and this was before seeding in the tourney. And who knows what would have happened in 1970,
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Amazing how far back The Great Mistakes Of Marquette History go:
14 years ago: Marquette Gold
16 years ago: Carlton Christian
27 years ago: Avenue Commons
29 years ago: L.A. Gear contract
41 years ago: Replacing Al with Hank
49 years ago: Lalumiere Hall (IMO McCormick is a far worse architectural travesty)
59 years ago: Dropping football
346 years ago: Exploring the Mississippi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGC6C4vuOao (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGC6C4vuOao)
1 year ago or there about: trying to fire John McAdams
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1 year ago or there about: trying to fire John McAdams
Sometimes what is right and what is legal are not the same thing
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PTM
You might be right on March success for the boys. I do believe that Al had everything in place for a great five year run post NC. Unfortunately, we never saw it happen. ‘74-‘77 was a very good run and they had pipeline for best of the best recruits when Al stepped down. His departure was Louisville and DePaul’s gain.
As a '77 MU grad, completely agree. The key would have been Mark Aguirre. As a freshman in 1978–79, he led DePaul to the NCAA Final Four. Would he and the other Chicago high school stars who went to DePaul, have picked Marquette instead if Al had stayed?
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Hal
Aquirre was in and rest of boys would have followed. Plus the Mt. Vernon grew likely would have joined in a couple of years later. Aquirre was slam dunk until early December day in '76 changed the path of MU ball.
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Aguirre was in.Scooter McCray was also in.Aguirre and Scooter were same year.Rodney McCray would have followed a couple years later.Doubtful we would have got Thomas from Westchester St.Joe
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Amazing how far back The Great Mistakes Of Marquette History go:
14 years ago: Marquette Gold
16 years ago: Carlton Christian
27 years ago: Avenue Commons
29 years ago: L.A. Gear contract
41 years ago: Replacing Al with Hank
49 years ago: Lalumiere Hall (IMO McCormick is a far worse architectural travesty)
59 years ago: Dropping football
346 years ago: Exploring the Mississippi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGC6C4vuOao (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hGC6C4vuOao)
Exploring the Mississippi? No way! M+J even turned around when the natives warned them that the further South natives were dangerous, gun-toting, Spanish allies. That's a smart decision if I've ever seen one!
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Interesting.
I would take Cassius Winston and Carsen Edwards over Markus right now (NCAA-wise)
Perhaps "right now" is correct, but the healthy Markus during the first two thirds of the year was better.
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Exploring the Mississippi? No way! M+J even turned around when the natives warned them that the further South natives were dangerous, gun-toting, Spanish allies. That's a smart decision if I've ever seen one!
The dumb part was trying to get Father Marquette back up to Michigan, paddling upstream when he was dying of dysentery.
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I feel like terry cummings said in an interview he was always going to depaul so maybe not every Chicago player would've chosen us
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Galway
We had the Chicago connection locked up until Al resigned. But, you are free to investigate or believe whatever you would like on my post.
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Galway
We had the Chicago connection locked up until Al resigned. But, you are free to investigate or believe whatever you would like on my post.
Goose,
You are 100% correct about Chicago connection. December 1976 is a month that will live in infamy for MU hoops. I remember reading the story of Al's resignation over Christmas break in NYC. I was stunned to say the least.
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79Warrior
There is no doubt that Al was on the cusp of having his greatest recruiting classes in the late '70's. It literally would have been selecting who he wanted over recruiting who he wanted. The lose of Aquirre was tough one to swallow.
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Galway
We had the Chicago connection locked up until Al resigned. But, you are free to investigate or believe whatever you would like on my post.
Dont get me wrong Goose, I believe you on everyone else and looked into it and asked around before. I just wanted to point it out that I vaguely remember an interview or something where he mentioned he had always dreamed of staying in Chicago
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Galway
DePaul did not have a very competitive basketball program at the time. Mark Aquirre changed their fate for a ten year period. Cummings going to DePaul, without Aquirre, would be like Jalen Johnson picking UWM to play college ball.
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Aguirre was in.Scooter McCray was also in.Aguirre and Scooter were same year.Rodney McCray would have followed a couple years later.Doubtful we would have got Thomas from Westchester St.Joe
Yup, MU coaches thought Scooter was a #DoneDeal. Same with Bill Varner who went to ND, and Rod Foster who landed up at UCLA (would they have been in the same class?). MU was ThisClose to keeping it going under Hank, despite the Aguirre defection a few years earlier.
Then, a few yrs later, Wolf went to UNC during the same off-season where Doc left a year early -- that woulda been quite a duo, if only for a season.
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Galway
We had the Chicago connection locked up until Al resigned. But, you are free to investigate or believe whatever you would like on my post.
Aguirre to DePaul was part of a package deal that included his high school teammate Skip Dillard and, in the next class, Bernard Randolph.
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Let's not forget Teddy "The Flash" Grubbs, shall we.
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Galway
DePaul did not have a very competitive basketball program at the time. Mark Aquirre changed their fate for a ten year period. Cummings going to DePaul, without Aquirre, would be like Jalen Johnson picking UWM to play college ball.
Gotcha, looked it up and you're right. They only had two good years in the 70s before he got there. Granted it was sweet 16, and elite 8 but still thought there was some NIT success in there and yet they were truly all or nothing.
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Scooter was a done deal in December,'76. Hank tried awfully hard and always came up a tad short. Mount Vernon and Chicago would have provided possibly the best teams in MU history.
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Let's not forget Teddy "The Flash" Grubbs, shall we.
Teddy went to King. Aguirre, Dillard and Randolph were from Westinghouse.
All of which reminds me of the sad decline of the CPL in recent years. It was shady and corrupt as hell, but man were there some great teams and players in the 70s, 80s and 90s.
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Teddy went to King. Aguirre, Dillard and Randolph were from Westinghouse.
All of which reminds me of the sad decline of the CPL in recent years. It was shady and corrupt as hell, but man were there some great teams and players in the 70s, 80s and 90s.
Same deal in NYC and other big cities. So much of the major talent flees their hometown high schools for prep schools these days, public leagues can't be what they used to be. High school coaches no matta anymore.
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Pakuni
I saw Aquirre play at Westinghouse and big thrill for me. CPL was a true joy. Was lucky enough to have gone to quite a few of CPL games back in the day. Sadly, I do not think I have gone since KO was the coach.
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Same deal in NYC and other big cities. So much of the major talent flees their hometown high schools for prep schools these days, public leagues can't be what they used to be. High school coaches no matta anymore.
Yep. Top kids being recreuited away by charter schools, prep schools, etc.
Can't blame the kids. If I had a basketball future, I'd gladly flee Garfield Park, Lawndale or Englewood for a nice, safe campus in Indiana, Florida or Nevada.
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Yep. Top kids being recreuited away by charter schools, prep schools, etc.
Can't blame the kids. If I had a basketball future, I'd gladly flee Garfield Park, Lawndale or Englewood for a nice, safe campus in Indiana, Florida or Nevada.
Amen.
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Teddy went to King. Aguirre, Dillard and Randolph were from Westinghouse.
All of which reminds me of the sad decline of the CPL in recent years. It was shady and corrupt as hell, but man were there some great teams and players in the 70s, 80s and 90s.
Teddy also had the bad habit of flashing his raincoat on El platforms showcasing his down under.
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Scooter was a done deal in December,'76. Hank tried awfully hard and always came up a tad short. Mount Vernon and Chicago would have provided possibly the best teams in MU history.
Ray Meyer was no match for McGuire. Denny Crum was more competitive. Unfortunately, Raymonds was no match for Meyer or Crum. He landed some good guards but failed miserably in the front court and that produced the quick decline.
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Teddy also had the bad habit of flashing his raincoat on El platforms showcasing his down under.
I'll take your word for it.
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I'll take your word for it.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1987-07-21-sp-5278-story,amp.html
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https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1987-07-21-sp-5278-story,amp.html
Thanks for exposing the truth about Teddy.
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https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1987-07-21-sp-5278-story,amp.html
Very revealing.
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Very revealing.
I think we can all agree that MSM doesn't cover these hard-hitting pieces like they used to.
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Way to go Markus.
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26435243/duke-duo-morant-wooden-award-finalists (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26435243/duke-duo-morant-wooden-award-finalists)
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Way to go Markus.
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26435243/duke-duo-morant-wooden-award-finalists (http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/26435243/duke-duo-morant-wooden-award-finalists)
Marquette has been lucky to be associated with this fine basketball player and outstanding young man for these last 3 years.
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Myles Powell declared for the draft but without signing an agent
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https://www.nbadraft.net/2020mock_draft
keep in mind this is for next year's draft
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https://www.draftsite.com/nba/mock-draft/2019/
markus at #59
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Yep. Top kids being recreuited away by charter schools, prep schools, etc.
Can't blame the kids. If I had a basketball future, I'd gladly flee Garfield Park, Lawndale or Englewood for a nice, safe campus in Indiana, Florida or Nevada.
Prep school girls in tartan mini skirts?
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https://www.draftsite.com/nba/mock-draft/2019/
markus at #59
Never mind that, there is an Achiuwa in the mix! Is Precious God'sGift's brother?
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Never mind that, there is an Achiuwa in the mix! Is Precious God'sGift's brother?
Yes. Believe there is also a brother named Promise.
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Cant see Markus going anywhere. And what is so wrong with returning for ones senior year to a team preranked 2-7?
In fact i think Markus owes it to his teammates...for 3 years these guys have all stepped to the shadows n selflessly deferred their limelight to Markus. I think it woukd be selfish of Markus to at this point abandon his team after they have given so much to him.
Its not like he is a lottery pick, why torpedo a potentially glorious campaign to slog thru downtrodden small cities in the G league when u can potentially participate in a senior season like any kid that has ever played college basketball dreams of?
Really seems like a no brainer to me.
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In fact i think Markus owes it to his teammates...for 3 years these guys have all stepped to the shadows n selflessly deferred their limelight to Markus. I think it woukd be selfish of Markus to at this point abandon his team after they have given so much to him.
You realize that the limelight will shine even more on Markus if he returns right? He'll probably be a pre-season first team All-American.
If his teammates have truly sacrificed their games in deference to Markus, then it would probably be best if he actually did leave.
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Very revealing.
Nothin' ta cee heer, hey?
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You realize that the limelight will shine even more on Markus if he returns right? He'll probably be a pre-season first team All-American.
If his teammates have truly sacrificed their games in deference to Markus, then it would probably be best if he actually did leave.
Missing the point. Him returning allows the other players to have the college season experience that say, a Auburn or UVa just had. Ed is never going to play pro ball in the US neither is the 8th man at Auburn but to have a season like they just had is a lifetime if memories and a place in their souls. Markus coming back helps them acheive that, if Markus ends up a pro he ends up a pro. Those guys prilly dont acheive that without Markus giving back.
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Cant see Markus going anywhere. And what is so wrong with returning for ones senior year to a team preranked 2-7?
In fact i think Markus owes it to his teammates...for 3 years these guys have all stepped to the shadows n selflessly deferred their limelight to Markus. I think it woukd be selfish of Markus to at this point abandon his team after they have given so much to him.
Its not like he is a lottery pick, why torpedo a potentially glorious campaign to slog thru downtrodden small cities in the G league when u can potentially participate in a senior season like any kid that has ever played college basketball dreams of?
Really seems like a no brainer to me.
Nobody has "selflessly deferred their limelight to Markus."
The best players get the most usage. That's how basketball works.
I doubt very much Javin DeLaurier and Alex O'Connell felt they were sacrificing to give Zion more looks, or feel abandoned by him turning pro.
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Missing the point. Him returning allows the other players to have the college season experience that say, a Auburn or UVa just had. Ed is never going to play pro ball in the US neither is the 8th man at Auburn but to have a season like they just had is a lifetime if memories and a place in their souls. Markus coming back helps them acheive that, if Markus ends up a pro he ends up a pro. Those guys prilly dont acheive that without Markus giving back.
Why does Markus owe Ed Morrow an experience like UVa just had?
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Missing the point. Him returning allows the other players to have the college season experience that say, a Auburn or UVa just had. Ed is never going to play pro ball in the US neither is the 8th man at Auburn but to have a season like they just had is a lifetime if memories and a place in their souls. Markus coming back helps them acheive that, if Markus ends up a pro he ends up a pro. Those guys prilly dont acheive that without Markus giving back.
There are currently two people on Marquettes roster that may see NBA playtime. Neither is Howard. Hell be back ( as will the two possible picks)
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There are currently two people on Marquettes roster that may see NBA playtime. Neither is Howard. Hell be back ( as will the two possible picks)
I'll take that bet (about Howard not seeing playing time in the NBA).
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There are currently two people on Marquettes roster that may see NBA playtime. Neither is Howard. Hell be back ( as will the two possible picks)
Howard will see NBA playtime. No doubt in my mind. Will he stick on a roster and build a stable career in the NBA? That's what we don't know.
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Missing the point. Him returning allows the other players to have the college season experience that say, a Auburn or UVa just had. Ed is never going to play pro ball in the US neither is the 8th man at Auburn but to have a season like they just had is a lifetime if memories and a place in their souls. Markus coming back helps them acheive that, if Markus ends up a pro he ends up a pro. Those guys prilly dont acheive that without Markus giving back.
No you're missing the point.
Nobody has "selflessly deferred their limelight to Markus."
The best players get the most usage. That's how basketball works.
I doubt very much Javin DeLaurier and Alex O'Connell felt they were sacrificing to give Zion more looks, or feel abandoned by him turning pro.
Yep.
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I'll take that bet (about Howard not seeing playing time in the NBA).
What we betting 8-)
I dont see any room on am NBA roster for a 5'9 shooting guard with bad pass vision and worse defense.
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What we betting 8-)
I dont see any room on am NBA roster for a 5'9 shooting guard with bad pass vision and worse defense.
12 pack of my choice, delivered to my front door (since I'm winning).
The modern NBA is all about shooting, and Markus is an elite shooter. He'll find his way onto an NBA roster at some point, even if only as a situational player.
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I'd be shocked if Howard doesn't get a look in the NBA. He may not stick, but his shooting/scoring ability is almost unmatched. Someone will take their chances on him to be a spark plug of a 2nd unit.
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https://www.nbadraft.net/2020mock_draft
keep in mind this is for next year's draft
so from this, the Bucks will have the best record in the NBA next year as well
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I'd be shocked if Howard doesn't get a look in the NBA. He may not stick, but his shooting/scoring ability is almost unmatched. Someone will take their chances on him to be a spark plug of a 2nd unit.
The NBA is full of shooters who can shoot.
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12 pack of my choice, delivered to my front door (since I'm winning).
The modern NBA is all about shooting, and Markus is an elite shooter. He'll find his way onto an NBA roster at some point, even if only as a situational player.
So we talking 2nd round pick, summer league, or does he actually have to register minutes in the regular season.
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So we talking 2nd round pick, summer league, or does he actually have to register minutes in the regular season.
Well come on, he has to play in an actual NBA game. Howard will hit the court in the NBA. I don't think he'll last a long time or latch on to long contracts, but he'll play. Every year dozens of obscure G-Leaguers get some burn to see what they're made of.
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The NBA is full of shooters who can shoot.
Not really. Only 20 (qualified) players in the league are shooting 40 percent or better from beyond the arc this year. That's out of 131 qualified shooters, so basically only 15 percent of them.
Only 49 are shooting better than 37.5 percent.
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So we talking 2nd round pick, summer league, or does he actually have to register minutes in the regular season.
Play in a real NBA game.
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The NBA is full of shooters who can shoot.
Exactly. And Howard is as good as all of them. There's a reason the NBA is full of shooters.
He won't be playable in a playoff series when teams just seek out mismatches, but he'd be a solid regular season player.
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Not really. Only 20 (qualified) players in the league are shooting 40 percent or better from beyond the arc this year. That's out of 131 qualified shooters, so basically only 15 percent of them.
Only 49 are shooting better than 37.5 percent.
So u think a guy that shot 41% over college defenders will shoot over 40% versus NBA athleticism and length from 3 feet farther back?
Doesnt stand to reason
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Which team did Rowsey play for this year?
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Markus moved off this 2019 draft board shortly after the tournament loss.
https://www.nbadraft.net/2019mock_draft
Markus is now on their 2020 draft board at 37.
https://www.nbadraft.net/2020mock_draft
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So u think a guy that shot 41% over college defenders will shoot over 40% versus NBA athleticism and length from 3 feet farther back?
Doesnt stand to reason
If used as a spot up shooter when he's not always tasked with creating his own shot as the focal point of the opponent's defense ... Markus absolutely could shoot 40 percent or better in the NBA.
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If used as a spot up shooter when he's not always tasked with creating his own shot as the focal point of the opponent's defense ... Markus absolutely could shoot 40 percent or better in the NBA.
Definitely. Especially with the lazy regular season D played in the NBA the first 3 quarters of each game
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Which team did Rowsey play for this year?
Szolnoki Olaj in Hungary.
Not sure if you're trying to draw a parallel to Markus, but if you are, please note that Markus did virtually everything better as a 19-year-old this season than Andrew did last year as a 23-year-old.
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Markus is younger than Rowsey. He scored 5 points per game more than Rowsey. Rowsey, at 23, handled the point better. Markus played better defense. Both have ridiculous range. Both are well under 6 ft. And I think that last is the crucial point. How many sub 6 ft players are in the NBA. Single digits. How many are shooting guards, or lack elite PG skills?
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Markus is younger than Rowsey. He scored 5 points per game more than Rowsey. Rowsey, at 23, handled the point better. Markus played better defense. Both have ridiculous range. Both are well under 6 ft. And I think that last is the crucial point. How many sub 6 ft players are in the NBA. Single digits. How many are shooting guards, or lack elite PG skills?
Exactly. Their stats are very comparable. You can count on one hand the number of successful non-point guards below 6' in the NBA right now.
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He won't be facing any double teams in the NBA. Defenses are keyed in on him now. He has range beyond the NBA line so that won't hurt him. The majority of his looks this year were behind the NBA line anyways. There will be more spacing. He'll be allowed to play off the ball a bit. Shot creation is a skill and there aren't many guys who can create space like Markus can.
He'll get drafted and he'll play NBA minutes whenever he chooses to go. The question is whether or not he'll stick. I'm not sure he will.
Tyler Ulis has played 133 games while shooting 28% from deep.
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He won't be facing any double teams in the NBA. Defenses are keyed in on him now. He has range beyond the NBA line so that won't hurt him. The majority of his looks this year were behind the NBA line anyways. There will be more spacing. He'll be allowed to play off the ball a bit. Shot creation is a skill and there aren't many guys who can create space like Markus can.
He'll get drafted and he'll play NBA minutes whenever he chooses to go. The question is whether or not he'll stick. I'm not sure he will.
Tyler Ulis has played 133 games while shooting 28% from deep.
Tyler Unis is a point guard, not a small 2 guard which Markus really is. Needs to improve his handle, learn how to pass to make a career in the NBA.
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Tyler Unis is a point guard, not a small 2 guard which Markus really is. Needs to improve his handle, learn how to pass to make a career in the NBA.
His handle is fine. It's actually pretty good in tight spaces. He struggles against pressure for sure but won't face much of that coming off the bench in the NBA. Totally agree on passing to make a career in the NBA. Maybe not so much the ability to pass but definitely needs to improve his court vision or willingness to pass.
All I'm saying is he'll get minutes. He'll get a shot. He may not stick. Hell. Vander got minutes for multiple teams.
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He won't be facing any double teams in the NBA. Defenses are keyed in on him now. He has range beyond the NBA line so that won't hurt him. The majority of his looks this year were behind the NBA line anyways. There will be more spacing. He'll be allowed to play off the ball a bit. Shot creation is a skill and there aren't many guys who can create space like Markus can.
He'll get drafted and he'll play NBA minutes whenever he chooses to go. The question is whether or not he'll stick. I'm not sure he will.
Tyler Ulis has played 133 games while shooting 28% from deep.
Tyler ulis is also a PG. That's a pretty big thing. It's the reason vander blue couldn't find time.
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Szolnoki Olaj in Hungary.
Not sure if you're trying to draw a parallel to Markus, but if you are, please note that Markus did virtually everything better as a 19-year-old this season than Andrew did last year as a 23-year-old.
Dead wrong.
Rowsey was a PG that nade mistakes yet had vision. How quickly you forget Rowseys play making abilities. How many great play making passes did Markus make this year. Asked a different way how many times did Markus have a wide open teammates standing at tge rim and nit pass it to him? Versus how many times did that occur with Rowsey?
Additionally, the peopke that say Markus would not face double teams in the NBa? Of cousre he wouldnt, why would a team do that? They would guard him with a 6-4” to 6-7” 2G with arms longer than Jamal’s that would swarm the crap out of him looking to pad his steal and dunk numbers.
Dont get me wrong, i like Markus but to say hes a PG with Rowseys vision or an undersized underatletic 2g that would not be swarmed by NBA athetes is a little silly. The NBA guys under 6 foot have all been uber sthletes with uber quickness and great facilitators, Markus is none if that. In time he maybe, until then hed be a massive liability on an NBA court and that only speaks to his offense. The defense against agorementioned 2g, oh my
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His handle is fine. It's actually pretty good in tight spaces. He struggles against pressure for sure but won't face much of that coming off the bench in the NBA. Totally agree on passing to make a career in the NBA. Maybe not so much the ability to pass but definitely needs to improve his court vision or willingness to pass.
All I'm saying is he'll get minutes. He'll get a shot. He may not stick. Hell. Vander got minutes for multiple teams.
Markus's handle could be described in many ways fine and pretty good are not any of those words.
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Play in a real NBA game.
We got ourselves a bet. What's the timeframe for him getting into the NBA before the bet closes.
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Markus's handle could be described in many ways fine and pretty good are not any of those words.
Yeah, totally disagree. After the first 5 games of the season or so he rarely turned the ball over unless he was facing full court pressure or a trap at midcourt. He won't face those in the NBA.
He gets loose with it sometimes but he's more than capable. I would bet thousands of dollars he plays in an NBA game, barring injury. I'd bet Vegas would agree with me if they were setting odds as well.
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Tyler ulis is also a PG. That's a pretty big thing. It's the reason vander blue couldn't find time.
But he did find time! He played for 3 different teams in the NBA!
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Markus's handle could be described in many ways fine and pretty good are not any of those words.
His handle is poor to bad
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Yeah, totally disagree. After the first 5 games of the season or so he rarely turned the ball over unless he was facing full court pressure or a trap at midcourt. He won't face those in the NBA.
He gets loose with it sometimes but he's more than capable. I would bet thousands of dollars he plays in an NBA game, barring injury. I'd bet Vegas would agree with me if they were setting odds as well.
This is so wrong. On the turnovers
As far as the nba, he might get a chance he might even make it, by why take a flyer at best a year early, why the rush. Get better have a great year and if he does develop nba potential maybe get a furst round pick.
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Markus is younger than Rowsey. He scored 5 points per game more than Rowsey. Rowsey, at 23, handled the point better. Markus played better defense. Both have ridiculous range. Both are well under 6 ft. And I think that last is the crucial point. How many sub 6 ft players are in the NBA. Single digits. How many are shooting guards, or lack elite PG skills?
+1
I'd love to see the stats of Markus 1v1 with Ponds, who certainly has NBA athleticism, or Morant. Can't remember if Ja ever guarded Markus
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This is so wrong. On the turnovers
As far as the nba, he might get a chance he might even make it, by why take a flyer at best a year early, why the rush. Get better have a great year and if he does develop nba potential maybe get a furst round pick.
Should clarify that I meant solely off the dribble turnovers. He made countless stupid or bad passes.
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Not really. Only 20 (qualified) players in the league are shooting 40 percent or better from beyond the arc this year. That's out of 131 qualified shooters, so basically only 15 percent of them.
Only 49 are shooting better than 37.5 percent.
Yep, That what James and the LA Lakers are looking for, Shooters.
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Yep, That what James and the LA Lakers are looking for, Shooters.
shooters, yes, but shooters taller than Marcus.
Of the current top 30 for three point percentage this season, only four are shorter than 6-3: Seth Curry (6-2), Quinn Cook (6-2), Collin Sexton (6-2) and DJ Augustin (6-0). Marcus is listed at 5-11 but I doubt that's accurate.
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Markus is younger than Rowsey. He scored 5 points per game more than Rowsey. Rowsey, at 23, handled the point better. Markus played better defense. Both have ridiculous range. Both are well under 6 ft. And I think that last is the crucial point. How many sub 6 ft players are in the NBA. Single digits. How many are shooting guards, or lack elite PG skills?
Markus is better overall basketball player than Rowsey. But also, I am not saying he will have a long, productive career. I am simply saying that he will get his chance and play in an NBA game at some point during his career.
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shooters, yes, but shooters taller than Marcus.
Of the current top 30 for three point percentage this season, only four are shorter than 6-3: Seth Curry (6-2), Quinn Cook (6-2), Collin Sexton (6-2) and DJ Augustin (6-0). Marcus is listed at 5-11 but I doubt that's accurate.
Its not. I'm actually just a bit over 5'9 and I was clearly taller then him and rowsey when we were next to each other.
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Its not. I'm actually just a bit over 5'9 and I was clearly taller then him and rowsey when we were next to each other.
Reminder that all NBA heights are with shoes. So it's not unrealistic that he could be accurately "listed" at 5'10 or so. Agree 5'11 is a stretch.
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Markus is better overall basketball player than Rowsey. But also, I am not saying he will have a long, productive career. I am simply saying that he will get his chance and play in an NBA game at some point during his career.
I agree Markus is better. I don't think he gets drafted if he leaves. For the aforementioned reasons.
And I love Markus. I appreciate everything he has accomplished and how he represents Marquette.
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Its not. I'm actually just a bit over 5'9 and I was clearly taller then him and rowsey when we were next to each other.
When I was at MU mu roommate (5-8) was standing next to Hutch at a crossing, turned to him and said "there's no way you're 5-10, I'm taller than you." Hutch just said "that's what the list me at."
Maybe Markus is 5-10 with his hair?
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Or maybe we just remember people's heights differently than what they really are. I play basketball with a kid every week and, because he plays bigger than he is, I swore he was 2+ inches taller than me. When discussing it with some other friends of mine who had occasionally come and played they said there was no way he was taller than me. The next week I made a point to see if he really was my height or shorter. Turns out I have at least an inch on him.
I find it hard to believe that Marquette would add 5 inches to Markus's height but not add any height to other players' height. My guess is he's 5'10" without shoes and 5'11" with them.
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Yeah, totally disagree. After the first 5 games of the season or so he rarely turned the ball over unless he was facing full court pressure or a trap at midcourt. He won't face those in the NBA.
He gets loose with it sometimes but he's more than capable. I would bet thousands of dollars he plays in an NBA game, barring injury. I'd bet Vegas would agree with me if they were setting odds as well.
I don't think the question for most people is whether he will play an NBA game or not. It's whether he will ever latch on to a team and carve out a legitimate role. Plenty of guys are getting a shot with 10 day contracts each year now.
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Should clarify that I meant solely off the dribble turnovers. He made countless stupid or bad passes.
U mean he could successfully dribble up the floor uncontested without losing it?
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U mean he could successfully dribble up the floor uncontested without losing it?
Ya know, Markus ain't perfect, but some of you guys are acting like he's not even worthy of his scholarship. The dude was a second team All American, and a finalist for the Bob Cousy award. If you want to be overly critical of a coach making millions of dollars that's one thing, but some of this is starting to border on Derrick treatment, which is just mind-blowing to me considering the accolades that Markus has accumulated.
http://www.hoophallawards.com/cousy.php
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Ya know, Markus ain't perfect, but some of you guys are acting like he's not even worthy of his scholarship. The dude was a second team All American, and a finalist for the Bob Cousy award. If you want to be overly critical of a coach making millions of dollars that's one thing, but some of this is starting to border on Derrick treatment, which is just mind-blowing to me considering the accolades that Markus has accumulated.
http://www.hoophallawards.com/cousy.php
Yup.
I'm sure it's a vocal minority, but it seems way too many fans fail to understand how fortunate we are to have Markus repping MU on and off the court.
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Ya know, Markus ain't perfect, but some of you guys are acting like he's not even worthy of his scholarship. The dude was a second team All American, and a finalist for the Bob Cousy award. If you want to be overly critical of a coach making millions of dollars that's one thing, but some of this is starting to border on Derrick treatment, which is just mind-blowing to me considering the accolades that Markus has accumulated.
http://www.hoophallawards.com/cousy.php
Markus has proven himself as one of the best college players today and one of the best MU will ever have. However, he is not an NBA player. I think there's a difference there.
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Ya know, Markus ain't perfect, but some of you guys are acting like he's not even worthy of his scholarship. The dude was a second team All American, and a finalist for the Bob Cousy award. If you want to be overly critical of a coach making millions of dollars that's one thing, but some of this is starting to border on Derrick treatment, which is just mind-blowing to me considering the accolades that Markus has accumulated.
http://www.hoophallawards.com/cousy.php
Scoopers bagging on the BEPOY and second team AA. Such a scoopy thing to do.
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First of all, Markus' teammates haven't spent the last 3 years "stepped to the shadows n selflessly deferring their limelight to Markus."
His freshman year, JJJ and Reinhardt took more shots than Markus, who was one of 7 Warriors to average between 8.7 and 13.2 ppg. That was an extremely balanced offensive team. The main reason Markus led the team at 13.2 ppg is because he shot a ridiculous 54.7% from 3-point range.
Why did Markus shoot 54.7% from 3-point range? Well, because he often was wide open thanks to all the other scoring options.
As a sophomore, Markus was not the primary ballhandler and didn't lead the team in scoring (he was 0.1 ppg behind Rowsey). Anybody who thinks Rowsey, an infamous chucker, spent the season "deferring" to Markus didn't watch the 2017-18 Warriors much. And Sam deferred to Rowsey at least as much as he deferred to Markus. The reason Sam was so wide open so often was because those two tiny guards were on the floor with him and had to be accounted for.
As a junior, yes, Markus had the ball all the time, and his favorite player to set up -- by far -- was himself. Some might not like that, but it was his job, and he took considerable pressure off the rest of the team. I would say that others deferred to him, probably too much in Sam's case ... though Sam did find the ball often enough to miss some huge, wide-open shots during our late-season fade. Scoopers who contend that we'd have been better this past season without Markus are smoking some really strong crack.
As for Markus' NBA chances ...
I agree he has a chance because he is elite at a skill that every team covets, and he also is highly intelligent. In the NBA, he would be used more like freshman Markus was -- he'd spot up outside the arc and be a catch-and-shoot guy. He could be some team's Craig Hodges. Not only wouldn't he be double-teamed, but he often would find himself completely unguarded as the defense focuses on others. And if he hits a couple 3s and has to be guarded, it opens up driving lanes for teammates. That's the whole idea behind offenses that spread the floor (as they all do now); just the threat of having an elite shooter can help a lot, even if he doesn't touch the ball.
Having said that, I think it's only a chance. I still think it won't be easy for him to even get on a roster, let alone to get minutes. He is tiny and he lacks NBA-level PG skills. Some GM will have to fall in love with him as an elite spot-up shooter and 3rd-string (or 4th-string) PG.
It certainly could happen, but unlike a few of my fellow Scoopers I wouldn't put my money on it. (Maybe a beer, though!!)
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Ya know, Markus ain't perfect, but some of you guys are acting like he's not even worthy of his scholarship. The dude was a second team All American, and a finalist for the Bob Cousy award. If you want to be overly critical of a coach making millions of dollars that's one thing, but some of this is starting to border on Derrick treatment, which is just mind-blowing to me considering the accolades that Markus has accumulated.
http://www.hoophallawards.com/cousy.php
I do not disagree at all. All the we are better without Markus is a joke. I heard it all year from Purdue fans about Edwards as well. Sure that have bad games where they shoot you out of games but for everyone of those there are about 10 they win for you. Never was this more evident than during Purdues NCAA run. I wished Markus had that opportunity. With that said I think Edwards is a much better passer, ball handler and athlete than Markus. They are both great college players and should take the time to smell the coffee and enjoy the process of improvement throughout college, beacuse neither one of them is a sure fire NBA player. Which is OK very few are, they are gifts of nature.
In my post i was more making light of the post than Markus. Anything critical i have said has been my opinion and honest, hes a great college player and im glad hes on our team. Just would hate to see a repeat of Vander Blue, who gave up a great senior year and an oppoetunity to play on a great team and an opportunity to continue to hone his skills before rushing into something that he might not quite be ready for.
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First of all, Markus' teammates haven't spent the last 3 years "stepped to the shadows n selflessly deferring their limelight to Markus."
His freshman year, JJJ and Reinhardt took more shots than Markus, who was one of 7 Warriors to average between 8.7 and 13.2 ppg. That was an extremely balanced offensive team. The main reason Markus led the team at 13.2 ppg is because he shot a ridiculous 54.7% from 3-point range.
Why did Markus shoot 54.7% from 3-point range? Well, because he often was wide open thanks to all the other scoring options.
As a sophomore, Markus was not the primary ballhandler and didn't lead the team in scoring (he was 0.1 ppg behind Rowsey). Anybody who thinks Rowsey, an infamous chucker, spent the season "deferring" to Markus didn't watch the 2017-18 Warriors much. And Sam deferred to Rowsey at least as much as he deferred to Markus. The reason Sam was so wide open so often was because those two tiny guards were on the floor with him and had to be accounted for.
As a junior, yes, Markus had the ball all the time, and his favorite player to set up -- by far -- was himself. Some might not like that, but it was his job, and he took considerable pressure off the rest of the team. I would say that others deferred to him, probably too much in Sam's case ... though Sam did find the ball often enough to miss some huge, wide-open shots during our late-season fade. Scoopers who contend that we'd have been better this past season without Markus are smoking some really strong crack.
As for Markus' NBA chances ...
I agree he has a chance because he is elite at a skill that every team covets, and he also is highly intelligent. In the NBA, he would be used more like freshman Markus was -- he'd spot up outside the arc and be a catch-and-shoot guy. He could be some team's Craig Hodges. Not only wouldn't he be double-teamed, but he often would find himself completely unguarded as the defense focuses on others. And if he hits a couple 3s and has to be guarded, it opens up driving lanes for teammates. That's the whole idea behind offenses that spread the floor (as they all do now); just the threat of having an elite shooter can help a lot, even if he doesn't touch the ball.
Having said that, I think it's only a chance. I still think it won't be easy for him to even get on a roster, let alone to get minutes. He is tiny and he lacks NBA-level PG skills. Some GM will have to fall in love with him as an elite spot-up shooter and 3rd-string (or 4th-string) PG.
It certainly could happen, but unlike a few of my fellow Scoopers I wouldn't put my money on it. (Maybe a beer, though!!)
Agree with all of this.
I'll add that he would be fine not having elite PG skills. But for specific teams, e.g. Houston and the Lakers, where the star Harden/Lebron, are going to have the ball in there hands the majority of the time, and where what they really need is guys that will nail the 3, when those two kick the ball back out.
They don't need a traditional PG.
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If Tre Jones and Ashton Hagans(true PG's) are staying in school, Markus would be wise to follow their lead. Tre and Ashton are both much better defenders, bigger, and true PG's. Tre at one point was projected to be a first round pick. Neither are even getting evaluations.
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Ya know, Markus ain't perfect, but some of you guys are acting like he's not even worthy of his scholarship. The dude was a second team All American, and a finalist for the Bob Cousy award. If you want to be overly critical of a coach making millions of dollars that's one thing, but some of this is starting to border on Derrick treatment, which is just mind-blowing to me considering the accolades that Markus has accumulated.
http://www.hoophallawards.com/cousy.php
Sir. We dont use the d word around here.
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If Tre Jones and Ashton Hagans(true PG's) are staying in school, Markus would be wise to follow their lead. Tre and Ashton are both much better defenders, bigger, and true PG's. Tre at one point was projected to be a first round pick. Neither are even getting evaluations.
And neither are 1/10th the shooter (or scorer) that Markus is.
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And neither are 1/10th the shooter (or scorer) that Markus is.
Nope, but neither obviously felt like they would get drafted at a spot to make it worth their while...Markus won't be drafted at all.
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If Tre Jones and Ashton Hagans(true PG's) are staying in school, Markus would be wise to follow their lead. Tre and Ashton are both much better defenders, bigger, and true PG's. Tre at one point was projected to be a first round pick. Neither are even getting evaluations.
Agree Marcus should stay, but not because of those two's reasons. They need to learn to shoot, both were terrible this year shooting. They are just not ready for the NBA. Marcus is ready with that skill, but needs to be a better PG.
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First of all, Markus' teammates haven't spent the last 3 years "stepped to the shadows n selflessly deferring their limelight to Markus."
His freshman year, JJJ and Reinhardt took more shots than Markus, who was one of 7 Warriors to average between 8.7 and 13.2 ppg. That was an extremely balanced offensive team. The main reason Markus led the team at 13.2 ppg is because he shot a ridiculous 54.7% from 3-point range.
Why did Markus shoot 54.7% from 3-point range? Well, because he often was wide open thanks to all the other scoring options.
As a sophomore, Markus was not the primary ballhandler and didn't lead the team in scoring (he was 0.1 ppg behind Rowsey). Anybody who thinks Rowsey, an infamous chucker, spent the season "deferring" to Markus didn't watch the 2017-18 Warriors much. And Sam deferred to Rowsey at least as much as he deferred to Markus. The reason Sam was so wide open so often was because those two tiny guards were on the floor with him and had to be accounted for.
As a junior, yes, Markus had the ball all the time, and his favorite player to set up -- by far -- was himself. Some might not like that, but it was his job, and he took considerable pressure off the rest of the team. I would say that others deferred to him, probably too much in Sam's case ... though Sam did find the ball often enough to miss some huge, wide-open shots during our late-season fade. Scoopers who contend that we'd have been better this past season without Markus are smoking some really strong crack.
As for Markus' NBA chances ...
I agree he has a chance because he is elite at a skill that every team covets, and he also is highly intelligent. In the NBA, he would be used more like freshman Markus was -- he'd spot up outside the arc and be a catch-and-shoot guy. He could be some team's Craig Hodges. Not only wouldn't he be double-teamed, but he often would find himself completely unguarded as the defense focuses on others. And if he hits a couple 3s and has to be guarded, it opens up driving lanes for teammates. That's the whole idea behind offenses that spread the floor (as they all do now); just the threat of having an elite shooter can help a lot, even if he doesn't touch the ball.
Having said that, I think it's only a chance. I still think it won't be easy for him to even get on a roster, let alone to get minutes. He is tiny and he lacks NBA-level PG skills. Some GM will have to fall in love with him as an elite spot-up shooter and 3rd-string (or 4th-string) PG.
It certainly could happen, but unlike a few of my fellow Scoopers I wouldn't put my money on it. (Maybe a beer, though!!)
Yeah a 5 foot 11 3 and D guy. makes sense. What NBA player out there is nearly as small and is a catch a shoot guy. No chance of that happening. His only Shot is to significantly improve his handling and PG abilities. and its a shot in the dark.
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If Tre Jones and Ashton Hagans(true PG's) are staying in school, Markus would be wise to follow their lead. Tre and Ashton are both much better defenders, bigger, and true PG's. Tre at one point was projected to be a first round pick. Neither are even getting evaluations.
Jones and Hagans do nothing at an elite level. And both are horrible at the one skill that every NBA team values -- a skill that Markus does at an elite level.
So it's apples and oranges.
But as I said earlier, I agree with you that Markus faces a tough road to the NBA.
I think he'll come back, but I don't know. Neither does anybody else, because none of us knows what Markus values most right now.
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If Tre Jones and Ashton Hagans(true PG's) are staying in school, Markus would be wise to follow their lead. Tre and Ashton are both much better defenders, bigger, and true PG's. Tre at one point was projected to be a first round pick. Neither are even getting evaluations.
Those two staying could actually be an argument for Markus going. Two less PGs ahead of him on the draft board this year and two more on the draft board next year.
I would be surprised if Markus left and think it's at best 50/50 he gets drafted at all of he does go. But it's possible that he may believe that his draft prospects aren't going to improve if he stays another year. If that's the case he may not see the point in delaying the inevitable. We assume Markus loves being at Marquette but maybe he's ready for the next challenge. I loved my Marquette experience but there were definitely moments where I was anxious to get on to the next chapter of my life
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I will also point out that, if Markus knows that he has to improve his point skills to make it in the NBA, and if he decides to stay, that he undoubtedly has had conversations with Wojo about his role next year. Which means he will be primarily playing point guard like this year.
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I will also point out that, if Markus knows that he has to improve his point skills to make it in the NBA, and if he decides to stay, that he undoubtedly has had conversations with Wojo about his role next year. Which means he will be primarily playing point guard like this year.
Yeah, it’s hard to see how that would change if he stays.
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Yeah, it’s hard to see how that would change if he stays.
Agreed. Assume he would share PG duties with Koby at a minimum. 25 minutes at PG, 10 off the ball.
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Maybe I'm just crazy, but with his NBA prospects being fuzzy at best, I think there's something to be gained by being able to tell his kids and grandkids about being MU's all-time leading scorer. And that record that could stand for quite some time in this era of the "best" players leaving early.
Different story if he is a sure first rounder or even a sure draft pick...but he could very well end up choosing between $35K in the G-league and MU immortality.
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Yep. If it were me I'd want to establish my legacy at MU as one of the best ever. But not everyone has the same motivation.
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If Markus goes.....
One of the considerations he must have is injury given the total disregard in calls he gets from the officials in the Big East......
You have a bunch of thug forwards slamming him to the ground any time they get the chance and he gets maybe 50% of the calls.....
What would you do.....
The Big East has no one to blame but themselves for losing this "star" a year early if true.....
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Consider the players KenPom considers the best comps for Markus, based on how he played during his junior season:
Sean Singletary
Listed at 6-0/185, he played 4 years at Virginia on his way to scoring 2,000 career points. Drafted in the 2nd round (42nd overall) of the 2008 NBA draft. Spent a season with the Suns and Bobcats, then several D-League and European teams before retiring in 2014.
Sherron Collins
Listed at 5-11/205, he played 4 years at Kansas -- being named a 3rd-team AP All American as a junior, and 2nd-team AP All American as a senior. He went undrafted in the 2010 NBA Draft. Spent part of his first season as a pro on the Bobcats roster, then with several D-League and European teams.
Denis Clemente
Listed at 6-1/175, he played 2 years at Miami and 2 years at Kansas State. He went undrafted in the 2010 NBA Draft. Played in the NBA Summer League with the Charlotte Bobcats, but was cut before training camp. Currently playing in Europe.
Aaron Holiday
Listed at 6-1/185, he played 3 years at UCLA. Selected by the Packers in the first round of the 2018 NBA Draft with the 23rd overall pick. Still on the Pacers roster.
Obviously, none of these is a perfect match. They're all different players -- all of them except Collins have a slight height advantage over Markus, Singletary has a higher assist rate and was more of a ballhawk on the defensive end, but none of them can match Markus for shooting and scoring (he has both the highest 3P% and FTRate of the bunch).
That said, I think the comps do give you a rough idea of where Markus stands.
Three of the four comps played all four years in college. That much seems like a good bet. So what happens if he comes back? Best case: he continues to improve as a playmaker and defender and an NBA team selects him late in the first round. Worst case: Markus goes undrafted, either making an NBA roster as a free agent or opting to go to the D-League or Europe.
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shooters, yes, but shooters taller than Marcus.
Of the current top 30 for three point percentage this season, only four are shorter than 6-3: Seth Curry (6-2), Quinn Cook (6-2), Collin Sexton (6-2) and DJ Augustin (6-0). Marcus is listed at 5-11 but I doubt that's accurate.
Well that sure looks Daunting for Markus, but nothing venture and he will never know.
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Maybe I'm just crazy, but with his NBA prospects being fuzzy at best, I think there's something to be gained by being able to tell his kids and grandkids about being MU's all-time leading scorer. And that record that could stand for quite some time in this era of the "best" players leaving early.
Different story if he is a sure first rounder or even a sure draft pick...but he could very well end up choosing between $35K in the G-league and MU immortality.
He'll make six figures easily in Europe if that's the route he wants to go. He's not limited to only the G League if he doesn't make the NBA.
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Maybe I'm just crazy, but with his NBA prospects being fuzzy at best, I think there's something to be gained by being able to tell his kids and grandkids about being MU's all-time leading scorer. And that record that could stand for quite some time in this era of the "best" players leaving early.
Different story if he is a sure first rounder or even a sure draft pick...but he could very well end up choosing between $35K in the G-league and MU immortality.
This might be the purest example of homerism I’ve ever seen. It belongs on Buckyville.
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Consider the players KenPom considers the best comps for Markus, based on how he played during his junior season:
Sean Singletary
Listed at 6-0/185, he played 4 years at Virginia on his way to scoring 2,000 career points. Drafted in the 2nd round (42nd overall) of the 2008 NBA draft. Spent a season with the Suns and Bobcats, then several D-League and European teams before retiring in 2014.
Sherron Collins
Listed at 5-11/205, he played 4 years at Kansas -- being named a 3rd-team AP All American as a junior, and 2nd-team AP All American as a senior. He went undrafted in the 2010 NBA Draft. Spent part of his first season as a pro on the Bobcats roster, then with several D-League and European teams.
Denis Clemente
Listed at 6-1/175, he played 2 years at Miami and 2 years at Kansas State. He went undrafted in the 2010 NBA Draft. Played in the NBA Summer League with the Charlotte Bobcats, but was cut before training camp. Currently playing in Europe.
Aaron Holiday
Listed at 6-1/185, he played 3 years at UCLA. Selected by the Packers in the first round of the 2018 NBA Draft with the 23rd overall pick. Still on the Pacers roster.
Obviously, none of these is a perfect match. They're all different players -- all of them except Collins have a slight height advantage over Markus, Singletary has a higher assist rate and was more of a ballhawk on the defensive end, but none of them can match Markus for shooting and scoring (he has both the highest 3P% and FTRate of the bunch).
That said, I think the comps do give you a rough idea of where Markus stands.
Three of the four comps played all four years in college. That much seems like a good bet. So what happens if he comes back? Best case: he continues to improve as a playmaker and defender and an NBA team selects him late in the first round. Worst case: Markus goes undrafted, either making an NBA roster as a free agent or opting to go to the D-League or Europe.
Drafted in first round of the NFL draft then to the pacers in the NBA? quite the athlete eh?
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Grimes declared today......had a really mediocre season but if he stays in he will almost surely be drafted .
https://twitter.com/qdotgrimes/status/1116093166439084032?s=21
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Grimes declared today......had a really mediocre season but if he stays in he will almost surely be drafted .
https://twitter.com/qdotgrimes/status/1116093166439084032?s=21
So should we expect the full tale from big daddy yet or wait till after the draft?
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Some big east reporter said "all signs point to markus staying" i forgot his twitter @ though
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Some big east reporter said "all signs point to markus staying" i forgot his twitter @ though
John Fanta.
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This might be the purest example of homerism I’ve ever seen. It belongs on Buckyville.
Remember when UConn player decided to come back to win a title....and they did....beat Duke in the final.
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Some big east reporter said "all signs point to markus staying" i forgot his twitter @ though
https://twitter.com/John_Fanta/status/1115668348375851008
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https://twitter.com/John_Fanta/status/1115668348375851008
Awesome. That's definitely good news if the signs keep pointing that way!
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Markus participating with team at strength and conditioning drills on Instagram.
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Drafted in first round of the NFL draft then to the pacers in the NBA? quite the athlete eh?
LOL usually typos are much more nonsensical, not just ridiculous.
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Maybe I'm just crazy, but with his NBA prospects being fuzzy at best, I think there's something to be gained by being able to tell his kids and grandkids about being MU's all-time leading scorer. And that record that could stand for quite some time in this era of the "best" players leaving early.
Different story if he is a sure first rounder or even a sure draft pick...but he could very well end up choosing between $35K in the G-league and MU immortality.
+ 1 billion
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Grimes declared today......had a really mediocre season but if he stays in he will almost surely be drafted .
https://twitter.com/qdotgrimes/status/1116093166439084032?s=21
As with every one of these players, I wish the best for him.
But ...
What an underachieving 1-and-done, a kid who had pretty small impact on the big stage.
And to think all the hours we spent begging, pleading, name-changing and hoping.
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This might be the purest example of homerism I’ve ever seen. It belongs on Buckyville.
John Fanta seems to think it’s not just homerism....
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Dead wrong.
Rowsey was a PG that nade mistakes yet had vision. How quickly you forget Rowseys play making abilities. How many great play making passes did Markus make this year. Asked a different way how many times did Markus have a wide open teammates standing at tge rim and nit pass it to him? Versus how many times did that occur with Rowsey?
Additionally, the peopke that say Markus would not face double teams in the NBa? Of cousre he wouldnt, why would a team do that? They would guard him with a 6-4” to 6-7” 2G with arms longer than Jamal’s that would swarm the crap out of him looking to pad his steal and dunk numbers.
Dont get me wrong, i like Markus but to say hes a PG with Rowseys vision or an undersized underatletic 2g that would not be swarmed by NBA athetes is a little silly. The NBA guys under 6 foot have all been uber sthletes with uber quickness and great facilitators, Markus is none if that. In time he maybe, until then hed be a massive liability on an NBA court and that only speaks to his offense. The defense against agorementioned 2g, oh my
Andrew Rowsey is doing well in the Hungarian league in his rookie season. He is maintaining his 3 point prowess at the longer distance. They play the games seriously in Europe to win titles , so I think he may possibly go up a league next year.
https://basketball.realgm.com/player/Andrew-Rowsey/Summary/58121
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Andrew Rowsey is doing well in the Hungarian league in his rookie season. He is maintaining his 3 point prowess at the longer distance. They play the games seriously in Europe to win titles , so I think he may possibly go up a league next year.
https://basketball.realgm.com/player/Andrew-Rowsey/Summary/58121
Important question: How many Forints is AR bringin' in?
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Andrew Rowsey is doing well in the Hungarian league in his rookie season. He is maintaining his 3 point prowess at the longer distance. They play the games seriously in Europe to win titles , so I think he may possibly go up a league next year.
https://basketball.realgm.com/player/Andrew-Rowsey/Summary/58121
Any idea how much a guy makes in the Hungarian league?
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Any idea how much a guy makes in the Hungarian league?
$50K + 12 lbs of Hurka per month.
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John Fanta seems to think it’s not just homerism....
What does John Fanta have to do with anything? lol
Because he said "All signs point to Markus Howard coming back." ???
I think you missed RR's point entirely.
also John Fanta seems like a great guy but he's no more of an "insider" than anyone else with a twitter account.
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What does John Fanta have to do with anything? lol
Because he said "All signs point to Markus Howard coming back." ???
I think you missed RR's point entirely.
also John Fanta seems like a great guy but he's no more of an "insider" than anyone else with a twitter account.
He actually sounds more like my kids' magic 8 ball, rather than an insider. That being said, no news is good news, I guess/ or bad news..
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also John Fanta seems like a great guy but he's no more of an "insider" than anyone else with a twitter account.
(https://i.imgur.com/dvyjhpk.gif)
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What does John Fanta have to do with anything? lol
Because he said "All signs point to Markus Howard coming back." ???
I think you missed RR's point entirely.
also John Fanta seems like a great guy but he's no more of an "insider" than anyone else with a twitter account.
Well he definitely has an in with BE coaching staffs and has interviewed them all on numerous occasions similar to a young Goodman or Katz. Not saying he knows anything in particular to Markus, but to say he is no more of an insider than anyone else is simply asinine.
I also doubt he would tweet that if he hadnt heard anything. Info may be faulty but given his contacts he has prolly heard someones opinions.
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Again I think he absolutely should come back, but I don't buy into the "no news is good news" POV. The longer he goes without making a statement one way or the other, the less confident I am that he'll stay. Just my opinion. You gotta figure that at a minimum he should/will declare to get feedback, and seemingly most everyone has done just that at this point.
So waiting this long to say anything at all makes it seem to me like it will be a definitive decision when he does: either "I'm declaring for the draft with intent to stay" or "I'm coming back". Since I don't see why he'd wait this long to simply declare and get feedback. We'll see.
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Again I think he absolutely should come back, but I don't buy into the "no news is good news" POV. The longer he goes without making a statement one way or the other, the less confident I am that he'll stay. Just my opinion. You gotta figure that at a minimum he should/will declare to get feedback, and seemingly most everyone has done just that at this point.
So waiting this long to say anything at all makes it seem to me like it will be a definitive decision when he does: either "I'm declaring for the draft with intent to stay" or "I'm coming back". Since I don't see why he'd wait this long to simply declare and get feedback. We'll see.
Day drinking? 🤪
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Again I think he absolutely should come back, but I don't buy into the "no news is good news" POV. The longer he goes without making a statement one way or the other, the less confident I am that he'll stay. Just my opinion. You gotta figure that at a minimum he should/will declare to get feedback, and seemingly most everyone has done just that at this point.
So waiting this long to say anything at all makes it seem to me like it will be a definitive decision when he does: either "I'm declaring for the draft with intent to stay" or "I'm coming back". Since I don't see why he'd wait this long to simply declare and get feedback. We'll see.
With the announcement and the introductory press conference re Megan Duffy on Tuesday and Wednesday, I suspect MU/Markus have held off in deference to the women's team. Have a feeling we will hear something this afternoon. We shall see.
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With the announcement and the introductory press conference re Megan Duffy on Tuesday and Wednesday, I suspect MU/Markus have held off in deference to the women's team. Have a feeling we will hear something this afternoon. We shall see.
The first time Markus deferred all year.
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With the announcement and the introductory press conference re Megan Duffy on Tuesday and Wednesday, I suspect MU/Markus have held off in deference to the women's team. Have a feeling we will hear something this afternoon. We shall see.
I don't disagree with you here...although if something does come out today, then I would think that he's staying in school. I don't see any way he announces he's going into the draft and staying on the day of the banquet. That would take a lot of shine of the banquet for sure.
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Day drinking? 🤪
Was this seen as rambling? The post is more than reasonable.
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With the announcement and the introductory press conference re Megan Duffy on Tuesday and Wednesday, I suspect MU/Markus have held off in deference to the women's team. Have a feeling we will hear something this afternoon. We shall see.
Great point, didn't even consider MUWBB in the equation.
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I don't disagree with you here...although if something does come out today, then I would think that he's staying in school. I don't see any way he announces he's going into the draft and staying on the day of the banquet. That would take a lot of shine of the banquet for sure.
But if he is leaving, it would come out today as well. He is not going to the banquet and field 1,000 questions about it if he isn't staying.
And I don't think he would want his being a no-show at the banquet to be the way word gets out that he is leaving.
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But if he is leaving, it would come out today as well. He is not going to the banquet and field 1,000 questions about it if he isn't staying.
And I don't think he would want his being a no-show at the banquet to be the way word gets out that he is leaving.
Maybe he makes a "surprise" announcement at the banquet tonight that he's staying. There has to be a reason he has waited this long to make any kind of an announcement. Especially if he was just going to "test the waters".
As far as if he's leaving and announcing it today..Wouldn't it be better in that instance to then wait until tomorrow after the banquet is over?? Markus isn't going to want to "ruin" the banquet for everyone by announcing today he is leaving. I can't see him doing that.
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Maybe he makes a "surprise" announcement at the banquet tonight that he's staying. There has to be a reason he has waited this long to make any kind of an announcement. Especially if he was just going to "test the waters".
As far as if he's leaving and announcing it today..Wouldn't it be better in that instance to then wait until tomorrow after the banquet is over?? Markus isn't going to want to "ruin" the banquet for everyone by announcing today he is leaving. I can't see him doing that.
If he waits until tomorrow, what is he going to say to people who ask him at the banquet tonight?
That's why I think he is staying. He would have announced by now if he were leaving.
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Since when do players announce they are staying? I have seen one and that s Tre Jones and hes from Duke which makes it a different situation
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For someone making one of the biggest decisions of their life, the timing of a banquet is most likely not a huge concern.
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Since when do players announce they are staying? I have seen one and that s Tre Jones and hes from Duke which makes it a different situation
it happens
https://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--marcus-smart-to-return-to-oklahoma-state-022930639.html
https://www.arkansasonline.com/news/2018/mar/26/daniel-gafford-will-return-arkansas-sophomore-seas/
Tyler Ulis announces he is staying for another year
http://www.diehardsport.com/college-basketball/kentucky-holding-press-conference-thursday-for-players-leaving-for-nba-draft/
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For someone making one of the biggest decisions of their life, the timing of a banquet is most likely not a huge concern.
I agree with this analysis. Not too hard to simply tell people, “I’m still talking it over with my family.”
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This reminds me of people reading into a Tweet by a potential recruit of an eye emoji with a question mark emoji. Does that mean he hates Wojo?! Does that mean he's committed silently?! My gosh, why doesn't he want to wait until after his visit to eliminate MU?!
We'll know when Markus announces something or when the deadline comes to pass without any word.
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This reminds me of people reading into a Tweet by a potential recruit of an eye emoji with a question mark emoji. Does that mean he hates Wojo?! Does that mean he's committed silently?! My gosh, why doesn't he want to wait until after his visit to eliminate MU?!
We'll know when Markus announces something or when the deadline comes to pass without any word.
In time, Stan's tweets will reveal all.
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Today is the final day for early entrants to request an evaluation from the NBA undergraduate advisory committee. Now, those lists are probably not public so we may not know, but given all the social media ceremony that seems to go into these announcements, one has to believe that he will tell us soon if he's leaving, testing the waters, or staying another year.
If he enters without requesting an evaluation, he forfeits his eligibility and cannot return.
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Today is the final day for early entrants to request an evaluation from the NBA undergraduate advisory committee. Now, those lists are probably not public so we may not know, but given all the social media ceremony that seems to go into these announcements, one has to believe that he will tell us soon if he's leaving, testing the waters, or staying another year.
If he enters without requesting an evaluation, he forfeits his eligibility and cannot return.
Yup. Think we hear something yet this afternoon or maybe we could hope Markus will tell the banquet audience tonight that he is staying.
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Does anyone here believe Markus shouldn't at least declare and get some feedback, then make an informed decision?
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Does anyone here believe Markus shouldn't at least declare and get some feedback, then make an informed decision?
I would assume so, but you never know. I think a guy like Tyus Jones is probably a lock to go whenever he declares but he's decided to skip declaring this year.
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Does anyone here believe Markus shouldn't at least declare and get some feedback, then make an informed decision?
Yes, but he probably already knows the feedback.
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I would assume so, but you never know. I think a guy like Tyus Jones is probably a lock to go whenever he declares but he's decided to skip declaring this year.
Tyus is already getting minutes on the Timberwolves. TAMU only gets the easy locks.
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Yes, but he probably already knows the feedback.
That's actually not a bad point.
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Tyus is already getting minutes on the Timberwolves. TAMU only gets the easy locks.
Bah! Hoisted by my own petard!
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Does anyone here believe Markus shouldn't at least declare and get some feedback, then make an informed decision?
It would be insane not to exercise the option going into your senior year. Same with Sam. Free feedback from a future employer. Exactly zero downside, all upside.
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It would be insane not to exercise the option going into your senior year. Same with Sam. Free feedback from a future employer. Exactly zero downside, all upside.
There are downsides. The fact that you are required to still be in class might make the commitments to the pre-draft process too difficult to juggle. Like a lot of things, its an investment of time and energy that Markus might not be ready to make. Especially if he has a pretty good idea what the eventual outcome might be.
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Does anyone here believe Markus shouldn't at least declare and get some feedback, then make an informed decision?
Seems to me the info can be solicited without going thru the process. Im sure the Clippers and many other MU associated people have extensive scouting reports on him from within their organizations. Would he benefit from going to the wirkouts? Idk
The info should be readliy available with out declaring tho
And its not like Wojo has never worked with any prospects over tge course if tge last 20 years. He would be able to provide much of tge same evals
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Yes, but he probably already knows the feedback.
Lots of us kan provide his feedback, aina?
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Lots of us kan provide his feedback, aina?
Yah.
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It would be insane not to exercise the option going into your senior year. Same with Sam. Free feedback from a future employer. Exactly zero downside, all upside.
Just curious. What if every senior.to be went through the process? That would be a cluster. Would the evaluations be that thought.out?
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Danny Ainge at an MU game said this about Markus "great shot maker, bad shot taker".
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Today is the final day for early entrants to request an evaluation from the NBA undergraduate advisory committee. Now, those lists are probably not public so we may not know, but given all the social media ceremony that seems to go into these announcements, one has to believe that he will tell us soon if he's leaving, testing the waters, or staying another year.
If he enters without requesting an evaluation, he forfeits his eligibility and cannot return.
I'm not sure if that's true...
April 11 (11:59pm ET): Deadline to request evaluation from NBA Undergraduate Advisory Committee
Beginning this year, an early entrant who requests an evaluation from the NBA Undergraduate Advisory Committee can hire an NCAA-certified agent without worrying about losing his remaining college eligibility.
April 17-20: Portsmouth Invitational Tournament
Only college seniors are eligible for this pre-draft camp, which takes place in Portsmouth, Virginia.
April 21 (11:59pm ET): Deadline for early entrants to declare for the draft
College underclassmen and international early entrants have until the end of the day on April 21 (Easter Sunday) to submit their names into the 2019 NBA draft pool. They can always withdraw their names later if they decide they’re not quite ready to go pro.
Once the early entrant list is set, NBA teams can begin conducting or attending workouts for those players.
I think you just can't hire an agent after today without forfeiting your eligibility. I'm not sure to be honest.
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Yes, but he probably already knows the feedback.
He'll get substantially better feedback by going through team workouts, meeting with personnel directors and scouts face to face and perhaps even attending the NBA combine (he'll likely get an invite), none of which he'd be able to do without declaring.
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Danny Ainge at an MU game said this about Markus "great shot maker, bad shot taker".
Fact or conjecture, hey?
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Danny Ainge at an MU game said this about Markus "great shot maker, bad shot taker".
Is that an actual direct quote? Because I've seen the description "bad shot maker" which is a compliment, and not what I think you think your quote means.
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Guru and Keefe/jon fall into the same category... bullcrap artists. Throw as much crap against the wall and stand there with chest out and expect oeople to belive you. Then the one thing that sticks use as evidence that u know everything.
Danny prolly passed him a note during the game, cuz he heard he was important
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Guru and Keefe/jon fall into the same category... bullcrap artists. Throw as much crap against the wall and stand there with chest out and expect oeople to belive you. Then the one thing that sticks use as evidence that u know everything.
Danny prolly passed him a note during the game, cuz he heard he was important
What the hell? That was his direct quote that someone obtained from him that sat next to him at a game..he asked him what he thought of Markus and that's what Ainge said to him..I'm just passing along something I saw..
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Danny Ainge at an MU game said this about Markus "great shot maker, bad shot taker".
Link, please.
Or is this just second-hand (or third-hand or fourth-hand) conjecture?
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Don't often agree w Guru but he subscribes to other MU sites. Easily could have seen it there.
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Link, please.
Or is this just second-hand (or third-hand or fourth-hand) conjecture?
Idk if it was Danny ainge but somebody in the NBA did say that Markus takes shots that everybody would consider terrible but for him are good shots
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Idk if it was Danny ainge but somebody in the NBA did say that Markus takes shots that everybody would consider terrible but for him are good shots
I don't doubt that. I've said the same myself ... and not only about Markus. There are plenty who fit this description, including our PG the previous year.
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Don't often agree w Guru but he subscribes to other MU sites. Easily could have seen it there.
You know of what you speak my friend.
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Since when do players announce they are staying? I have seen one and that s Tre Jones and hes from Duke which makes it a different situation
Ashton Hagans for Kentucky also announced the same. As much as we remember the more public Grimes recruitment, Hagans is the one we were in on that really could've been transformational for this team.
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I'm not sure if that's true...
April 11 (11:59pm ET): Deadline to request evaluation from NBA Undergraduate Advisory Committee
Beginning this year, an early entrant who requests an evaluation from the NBA Undergraduate Advisory Committee can hire an NCAA-certified agent without worrying about losing his remaining college eligibility.
April 17-20: Portsmouth Invitational Tournament
Only college seniors are eligible for this pre-draft camp, which takes place in Portsmouth, Virginia.
April 21 (11:59pm ET): Deadline for early entrants to declare for the draft
College underclassmen and international early entrants have until the end of the day on April 21 (Easter Sunday) to submit their names into the 2019 NBA draft pool. They can always withdraw their names later if they decide they’re not quite ready to go pro.
Once the early entrant list is set, NBA teams can begin conducting or attending workouts for those players.
I think you just can't hire an agent after today without forfeiting your eligibility. I'm not sure to be honest.
https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/enforcement/2019ENF_NBAMemo.pdf (https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/enforcement/2019ENF_NBAMemo.pdf)
Guru - this NCAA memo is where I got my information. I only know what I read about this, but I will say that the early entry rules this year are enough different from last year that they don't seem to be well understood by fans or pundits.
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https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/enforcement/2019ENF_NBAMemo.pdf (https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/enforcement/2019ENF_NBAMemo.pdf)
Guru - this NCAA memo is where I got my information. I only know what I read about this, but I will say that the early entry rules this year are enough different from last year that they don't seem to be well understood by fans or pundits.
That's just it, I guess I'm confused...so is that rule stating, that if you declare after today, you can no longer get an evaluation and MUST stay in the draft?? Because if you look at what I posted, as we know the withdrawal date is May 21st and under it it says If you feel you aren't ready to go pro, you may withdraw. Well, but wouldn't that kind of go hand in hand with the eval??
Either way, I do find it quite odd, that Markus hasn't announced anything, I mean if today was his last day to get an eval, it only makes sense then, he would be staying, right?? No way he declares after today and stays "all in"?? I just can't see that. Still have a strong hunch he may make an announcement at the banquet tonight, to provide more juice.
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I would be shocked if Markus “announces” anything at the banquet.
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I would be shocked if Markus “announces” anything at the banquet.
I wouldn't...did you read anything in this thread?? Today was the last day he could declare and get an evaluation...which he MUST do if he plans to retain his eligibility. There is ZERO chance an all american can make a decision like this and it not get out somehow. If he announces something after tomorrow, he HAS to stay in the draft...I can't see that happening. Don't you think if nothing comes out before the banquet, or he doesn't make some sort of an announcement at the banquet that he's NOT going to get a million questions about it tonight from attendees?? Think he wants to deal with that?? Think about it...The next announcement is the most important announcement of MU's season.
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I wouldn't...did you read anything in this thread?? Today was the last day he could declare and get an evaluation...which he MUST do if he plans to retain his eligibility. There is ZERO chance an all american can make a decision like this and it not get out somehow. If he announces something after tomorrow, he HAS to stay in the draft...I can't see that happening. Don't you think if nothing comes out before the banquet, or he doesn't make some sort of an announcement at the banquet that he's NOT going to get a million questions about it tonight from attendees?? Think he wants to deal with that?? Think about it...The next announcement is the most important announcement of MU's season.
I hope the fans are smart and respectful enough to not bother Markus with that at the team banquet. I also don’t think the rules are very clear so I’m not sure any of us really know what the true deadlines are and what each deadline means each step of the way.
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I wouldn't...did you read anything in this thread?? Today was the last day he could declare and get an evaluation...which he MUST do if he plans to retain his eligibility. There is ZERO chance an all american can make a decision like this and it not get out somehow. If he announces something after tomorrow, he HAS to stay in the draft...I can't see that happening. Don't you think if nothing comes out before the banquet, or he doesn't make some sort of an announcement at the banquet that he's NOT going to get a million questions about it tonight from attendees?? Think he wants to deal with that?? Think about it...The next announcement is the most important announcement of MU's season.
Today is the last day he can request an evaluation. I don't think he needs to publicly announce that request. He could've made the request already. He can still declare through April 21.
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How do they determine the people going to the combine?
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How do they determine the people going to the combine?
The NBA teams send in their lists of the top 60 players in the draft, and the NBA somehow comes up with a ranked list. Then as the top kids decide to skip the combine, they invite alternates from the next guys on the list.
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Today is the last day he can request an evaluation. I don't think he needs to publicly announce that request. He could've made the request already. He can still declare through April 21.
No he doesn't publicly need to, but everyone else has...and it would be odd for a second team all american to not announce something like that when everyone and their brother(national writers etc), would be contacting him to find out. In other words, I don't think something like that could stay quiet.
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The NBA teams send in their lists of the top 60 players in the draft, and the NBA somehow comes up with a ranked list. Then as the top kids decide to skip the combine, they invite alternates from the next guys on the list.
Hmm i dont see Markus as a top 60
College player for sure
Pro prospect prolly not
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Anything from the banquet??
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Anything from the banquet??
Nope. Markus and Sam co-MVPs.cam to be grad assistant. Long speeches by Cam & Matt. Kind of a dull event this year.
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Hopefully we hear news soon, determines the outlook of next season for us
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Nope. Markus and Sam co-MVPs.cam to be grad assistant. Long speeches by Cam & Matt. Kind of a dull event this year.
Co MVP’s? Cute
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Nope. Markus and Sam co-MVPs.cam to be grad assistant. Long speeches by Cam & Matt. Kind of a dull event this year.
No great words of prophecy from Stan?
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Heard the first 80 percent of the dinner was excellent, but that last 20% was awful.
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Heard the first 80 percent of the dinner was excellent, but that last 20% was awful.
(http://media.tenor.com/images/868fcfef4afd1e4ea8b0c67cac276710/tenor.gif)
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It would be insane not to exercise the option going into your senior year. Same with Sam. Free feedback from a future employer. Exactly zero downside, all upside.
Quite the contrary. He could make a bad first impression and have a stigma hanging over him next year.
If I’m going to a job interview for a job I want, I’m not going in half-drunk expecting that they’ll give me a clean slate in my second interview.
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(http://media.tenor.com/images/868fcfef4afd1e4ea8b0c67cac276710/tenor.gif)
I like that the gif also subscribes to the 80/20 rule.
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I would be shocked if Markus “announces” anything at the banquet.
This was the correct viewpoint
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At this point, I think John Fanta saying all signs point to him staying seem accurate. He declares now, he's gone. Just can't see him not giving himself the option to return.
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At this point, I think John Fanta saying all signs point to him staying seem accurate. He declares now, he's gone. Just can't see him not giving himself the option to return.
I believe he returns as well. But he can still declare and return.
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I believe he returns as well. But he can still declare and return.
If he requested advisory committee advice by 11:59 last night.
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I believe he returns as well. But he can still declare and return.
Not according to the memo Mom posted above...Key Point #1..A student-athlete loses his eligibility if :
1. He Enters the NBA draft WITHOUT requesting an Undergraduate Advisory Committee evaluation from the NBA.
Further under the 2019 Key Dates:
April 11th (11:59PM ET)- Deadline to request evaluation from Undergraduate Advisory Committee
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I missed the part where it's required to brew announced
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Not according to the memo Mom posted above...Key Point #1..A student-athlete loses his eligibility if :
1. He Enters the NBA draft WITHOUT requesting an Undergraduate Advisory Committee evaluation from the NBA.
Further under the 2019 Key Dates:
April 11th (11:59PM ET)- Deadline to request evaluation from Undergraduate Advisory Committee
He could have done so yesterday or last night. He's not required to say anything.
Anyway we will find out soon enough.
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Or he could've done so weeks ago.
He could also have made up his mind that he just wants to start getting paid to play basketball, hoping that he makes the NBA but being willing to go overseas or play in the G League if that's what he needs to do. In that case, he could declare anytime over the next 9 days.
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Or..maybe we the fans are the only one's that are thinking he might go pro after this year. Markus may not have even been entertaining that thought for all we know.
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Or..maybe we the fans are the only one's that are thinking he might go pro after this year. Markus may not have even been entertaining that thought for all we know.
No he's definitely entertaining the thought. Still think he ends up coming back
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No he's definitely entertaining the thought. Still think he ends up coming back
TAMU continuing with the easy ones.... very few high-major D-I starters don't entertain the thought of playing in the NBA.
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TAMU continuing with the easy ones.... very few high-major D-I starters don't entertain the thought of playing in the NBA.
I read his post as saying just that..
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So I was just looking through the players that have declared, looking for players that we may not have to face next year, and other than the obvious Ponds, and (potentially) Powell, there were some surprises. Baby Froling from CU. Goodin, Jones, Marshall, and Scruggs from X. Froling wouldn't be a huge loss for CU if he stays in as he's probably behind Epperson if he comes back healthy, as well as Krampelj, but if X loses all 4 of those guys, they'll be hurting big time next year. Are they just going through the motions to get evaluated, or is it another case of a delayed exodus from the coaching change, ie. Duane, Deonte, Teve, Magic? Not exactly a like-for-like situation as Steele was an assistant, but if those players committed to play for Mack, I could see them wanting to move on.
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What about his wrist injury? is it better to go to the combine hurt, or not go at all?
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So I was just looking through the players that have declared, looking for players that we may not have to face next year, and other than the obvious Ponds, and (potentially) Powell, there were some surprises. Baby Froling from CU. Goodin, Jones, Marshall, and Scruggs from X. Froling wouldn't be a huge loss for CU if he stays in as he's probably behind Epperson if he comes back healthy, as well as Krampelj, but if X loses all 4 of those guys, they'll be hurting big time next year. Are they just going through the motions to get evaluated, or is it another case of a delayed exodus from the coaching change, ie. Duane, Deonte, Teve, Magic? Not exactly a like-for-like situation as Steele was an assistant, but if those players committed to play for Mack, I could see them wanting to move on.
Froling is headed back to Australia to play professionally.
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So I was just looking through the players that have declared, looking for players that we may not have to face next year, and other than the obvious Ponds, and (potentially) Powell, there were some surprises. Baby Froling from CU. Goodin, Jones, Marshall, and Scruggs from X. Froling wouldn't be a huge loss for CU if he stays in as he's probably behind Epperson if he comes back healthy, as well as Krampelj, but if X loses all 4 of those guys, they'll be hurting big time next year. Are they just going through the motions to get evaluated, or is it another case of a delayed exodus from the coaching change, ie. Duane, Deonte, Teve, Magic? Not exactly a like-for-like situation as Steele was an assistant, but if those players committed to play for Mack, I could see them wanting to move on.
Xavier guys are just going through the evaluation process.....I would expect them all to return unless something goofy happens.
Froling is following his brother to the Australian pro league so he won't be back.
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He's back. Per his twitter.
https://twitter.com/markushoward11/status/1116733521777840128 (https://twitter.com/markushoward11/status/1116733521777840128)
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How can he say he’s back when he never left?
But, that’s great!!!!
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Tremendous good news . Makes recruiting for that open 2019 spot much easier. MU can hopefully find a serious pogo stick grad transfer.
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He's back. Per his twitter.
https://twitter.com/markushoward11/status/1116733521777840128 (https://twitter.com/markushoward11/status/1116733521777840128)
Another win for the Scoop Underboard Letter Writing Committee! Arby's coupons helped with the nudge too.
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As you all remember, I broke the Vander news in 2013, much to Scoop's raucous calls of Bullsnit.
Well, I'm back again and i have news. Bad news for us scoopers:
Markus is gone to the draft.
Whether it's a good idea or bad idea, we've seen the last of Markus in Blue and Gold.
Do with this what you will. M2N
?-(
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Love it. Let’s go.
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Heard the first 80 percent of the dinner was excellent, but that last 20% was awful.
her look said it all
he started out with great skill
but his finish sucked
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Froling is following his brother to the Australian pro league so he won't be back.
Except Harry is headed to the NBA Draft.
https://twitter.com/nbl/status/1113627385750941697?s=21
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Except Harry is headed to the NBA Draft.
https://twitter.com/nbl/status/1113627385750941697?s=21
Sheesh. He averaged 7.8 in the NBL.
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So waiting this long to say anything at all makes it seem to me like it will be a definitive decision when he does: either "I'm declaring for the draft with intent to stay" or "I'm coming back". Since I don't see why he'd wait this long to simply declare and get feedback. We'll see.
Bump
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I could see Marshall getting serious interest. He is a pro. Has everything the NBA looks for
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I could see Marshall getting serious interest. He is a pro. Has everything the NBA looks for
27% three point shooter with over 5 attempts per game. I'm sorry, I just can't see it. You need Giannis like ability to get to the rim with that poor of an outside shot.
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Tremendous good news . Makes recruiting for that open 2019 spot much easier. MU can hopefully find a serious pogo stick grad transfer.
Its tough for me to imagine a grad transfer, as I'm not sure what position you can sell, unless it is more depth or versatility at the 5 position--even then, you are basically telling someone that they'd be transferring in for their last year and only getting at most about 20 minutes per game. I have to believe a traditional transfer is much more likely.
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Its tough for me to imagine a grad transfer, as I'm not sure what position you can sell, unless it is more depth or versatility at the 5 position--even then, you are basically telling someone that they'd be transferring in for their last year and only getting at most about 20 minutes per game. I have to believe a traditional transfer is much more likely.
I think this makes Marquette look like a huge opportunity for a traditional transfer. After sitting out a year, they will have a pretty wide open opportunity with three starters and one back up, who plays major minutes, leaving.
Furthermore, such a transfer could be nice for Wojo because then he can concentrate on two big 2020 targets now that Symir is in the fold.
Of course Symir could reclassify and blow that idea out of the water...
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I think Symir has an interesting decision. On one hand, he can save eligibility and be part of the next crew. On the other, he can get limited minutes but have a shot at a very deep run as a Frosh.
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I think Symir has an interesting decision. On one hand, he can save eligibility and be part of the next crew. On the other, he can get limited minutes but have a shot at a very deep run as a Frosh.
Me thinks its not really up to Symir at this point. He's a 2020 unless Wojo to tells him to come for next season.
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Me thinks its not really up to Symir at this point. He's a 2020 unless Wojo to tells him to come for next season.
i don't think so. He's a top 50ish recruit. If he wants to come I think he's welcome here. But I do think the decision has already been made one way or another.
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Me thinks its not really up to Symir at this point. He's a 2020 unless Wojo to tells him to come for next season.
My impression is that if Symir called Wojo tomorrow and said "I wanna be part of next year's run Coach" they would take him without hesitation. But I don't think it's an unlimited offer. They are kicking the tires on some traditional transfers. If one of them beats Symir to the punch I would assume the decision gets taken out of his hands.
My ideal scenario:
Land a stud traditional transfer (would love a true FR like Adam Flagler for class balance)
Symir stays in 2020 class
Land 1 of Dawson Garcia/Dain Dainja/Andre Jackson/Jamari Sibley
Land 1 of Jalen Suggs/Nimari Burnett/Reece Beekman/Julian Strawther/Ethan Morton
Land Jalen Johnson
If Eke's back is a no go: land one more of the previously mentioned players
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Me thinks its not really up to Symir at this point. He's a 2020 unless Wojo to tells him to come for next season.
If that’s the case, then I don’t have the best feeling about him being at MU. Has he signed or just verballed? He may want to reclassify but sees the logjam MU now has at guard next year. Could easily reclassify, decommit and end up at some place like Syracuse and play right away.
My thought is get him on campus ASAP and redshirt him if possible.
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If that’s the case, then I don’t have the best feeling about him being at MU. Has he signed or just verballed? He may want to reclassify but sees the logjam MU now has at guard next year. Could easily reclassify, decommit and end up at some place like Syracuse and play right away.
My thought is get him on campus ASAP and redshirt him if possible.
I think the coach staff has a pretty good feeling about Symir ending up on campus regardless of his reclassification.
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Symir has not yet signed, so he has the power.
If he wanted to do something and Wojo told him to do something else, there are dozens of other programs (maybe hundreds) who would take him.
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Symir has not yet signed, so he has the power.
If he wanted to do something and Wojo told him to do something else, there are dozens of other programs (maybe hundreds) who would take him.
I agree with this analysis .
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27% three point shooter with over 5 attempts per game. I'm sorry, I just can't see it. You need Giannis like ability to get to the rim with that poor of an outside shot.
Really? Wasn't Henry Ellenson the 14th or 15th pick?
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Really? Wasn't Henry Ellenson the 14th or 15th pick?
Henry didn't exactly work out for the Pistons in case you didn't notice. I would be very surprised to see Naji leave this summer.
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Didn't have a bad run wit da Nicks. Due da name Christian Wood ring a bell, hey?
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Henry didn't exactly work out for the Pistons in case you didn't notice. I would be very surprised to see Naji leave this summer.
Oh, I noticed. But he was a power forward who shot a lot of 3s but didn't make many -like Naji. And wasn't exactly Giannis, like Naji. But he was a lottery pick nonetheless - if you didn't notice.
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Oh, I noticed. But he was a power forward who shot a lot of 3s but didn't make many -like Naji. And wasn't exactly Giannis, like Naji. But he was a lottery pick nonetheless - if you didn't notice.
Henry was not a lottery pick.
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Oh, I noticed. But he was a power forward who shot a lot of 3s but didn't make many -like Naji. And wasn't exactly Giannis, like Naji. But he was a lottery pick nonetheless - if you didn't notice.
Henry wasn't a lottery pick and Naji isn't a PF.
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Symir has not yet signed, so he has the power.
If he wanted to do something and Wojo told him to do something else, there are dozens of other programs (maybe hundreds) who would take him.
Meh. If a kid wants out, he’ll be let out. Having not signed isn’t a big deal imo.
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For the record, I'd do anything for one more year with Markus. Kid is a second team all-American, can fill it up, and lead us to a 5seed. All the negativity around him is silly. I hope he starts developing an "unfinished business" mindset with Sam.
Interesting suggestion
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Meh. If a kid wants out, he’ll be let out. Having not signed isn’t a big deal imo.
I honestly do not know how often a kid who has signed and decides he wants out is allowed to transfer without having to sit out a year.
Maybe that's the norm. If so, you're right.
I was always told by coaches that "we don't really have him for sure till he signs," but maybe they were just being superstitious or something.
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Interesting suggestion
:-X :P
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I honestly do not know how often a kid who has signed and decides he wants out is allowed to transfer without having to sit out a year.
Maybe that's the norm. If so, you're right.
I was always told by coaches that "we don't really have him for sure till he signs," but maybe they were just being superstitious or something.
It's the norm. I am correct.
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Does anyone think Symir will reclass and redshirt like joey did?
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Does anyone think Symir will reclass and redshirt like joey did?
It has to make the most sense for all parties. Let’s face it, Symir wants to be a pro in, let’s say 3 years. Does it make sense to
1. Stay at prep school in Vermont for another year, and although playing great competition, delay your exposure to the next-level?
2. Join Marquette in 2019 but see relatively limited PT? Less work on individual skills, and less time to adjust to academics and the whole college experience.
3. Join MU in 2019 and fully immerse yourself in the college-level work ethic and speed of the game, while working on your body and a couple quirks in your game, all while both retaining a year of eligibility and gaining the experience of a possible Championship run. You get to focus on self-improvement and individual skills all while learning from a talented group of players and coaches.
It really seems like a no-brainer. Wouldn’t he be most ready for the Next Next level with Option3? His commit video really focused on D Wade as both a scorer and passer, and it looks like he really wants to develop as a complete guard. I know this post is kinda like duh, capt obvious, but I guess that’s my point.
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2. Join Marquette in 2019 but see relatively limited PT? Less work on individual skills, and less time to adjust to academics and the whole college experience.
I’m not sure that’s necessarily true. Think there’s potentially a lot of minutes available for a top level PG/combo guard. Not sure if symir will fit that bill coming a year early but it’s certainly possible. Not as high on GE and koby as some others on here are and I see them as more “energy” guys.
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Does anyone think Symir will reclass and redshirt like joey did?
I think it is not as crazy of an idea as it might look at first glance
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Does anyone think Symir will reclass and redshirt like joey did?
Joey was hurt. He wasn't going to play his second semester in high school. The situations are apples and kumquats. He chose to come to Marquette so he could get worked on by elite trainers, get started with his college courses and get exposed to the college scene. He did not give up playing basketball that year to do so. It was a win-win.
3. Join MU in 2019 and fully immerse yourself in the college-level work ethic and speed of the game, while working on your body and a couple quirks in your game, all while both retaining a year of eligibility and gaining the experience of a possible Championship run. You get to focus on self-improvement and individual skills all while learning from a talented group of players and coaches.
It really seems like a no-brainer. Wouldn’t he be most ready for the Next Next level with Option3? His commit video really focused on D Wade as both a scorer and passer, and it looks like he really wants to develop as a complete guard. I know this post is kinda like duh, capt obvious, but I guess that’s my point.
It might seem like a no-brainer to you, but you are not an 18-year-old elite-level athlete who has supreme confidence in his ability and who probably does not like the idea of sitting out a year while healthy and ready to play. You are bringing logic, maturity and an ability to see the big picture here. Most of these kids want to play, period.
I have absolutely no window into Symir's mind. Maybe he's thinking logically like you. If so, it would make him a rarity. More likely, if he decides to reclassify he will be summoning the exact confidence that has helped him be an outstanding basketball player to believe he is good enough to crack Wojo's rotation next season.
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It has to make the most sense for all parties. Let’s face it, Symir wants to be a pro in, let’s say 3 years. Does it make sense to
1. Stay at prep school in Vermont for another year, and although playing great competition, delay your exposure to the next-level?
2. Join Marquette in 2019 but see relatively limited PT? Less work on individual skills, and less time to adjust to academics and the whole college experience.
3. Join MU in 2019 and fully immerse yourself in the college-level work ethic and speed of the game, while working on your body and a couple quirks in your game, all while both retaining a year of eligibility and gaining the experience of a possible Championship run. You get to focus on self-improvement and individual skills all while learning from a talented group of players and coaches.
It really seems like a no-brainer. Wouldn’t he be most ready for the Next Next level with Option3? His commit video really focused on D Wade as both a scorer and passer, and it looks like he really wants to develop as a complete guard. I know this post is kinda like duh, capt obvious, but I guess that’s my point.
If he’s aiming to be a pro in 3 years, he doesn’t need to consider benefits of saving a year of eligibility, since he wouldn’t use it up anyway.