Vote!

[Pakuni]

This.  Get.  The.  Lobbyists.  Out.

As for abortion, you tell the Republican voters that are hung up on it that if the GOP wanted to ban abortions they could have done it back in 2016 when they controlled the Legislative and Executive branches.  They literally could have written a law and passed it... but they didn't.  Because they need USE YOUR FEAR AND ANGER against you to keep themselves in power.  They don't care about abortion at all, they care about using your votes to pass legislation that lines their and their financial master's pockets.  Stop letting them use your emotions against you.

Roe v Wade says abortion is a right protected by the Constitution. Any federal legislation that would outright ban abortions, as you suggest, would be unconstitutional.  (Roe does leave room for some limits, but not a ban).
A majority Republican congress could no sooner ban abortions than it could take away women's right to vote or re-institute segregation. It would require a Constitutional amendment.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Commerce seems a natural fit.

Speaking of the cabinet, rumors circulating that Trump may soon fire SecDef Mark Esper.

I was thinking Commerce or Treasury in some capacity.

I read that Esper had already drafted his resignation letter and before he did his last act was to send the plan to rename all military bases currently named for Confederates.

[Hards Alumni]

Roe v Wade says abortion is a right protected by the Constitution. Any federal legislation that would outright ban abortions, as you suggest, would be unconstitutional.  (Roe does leave room for some limits, but not a ban).
A majority Republican congress could no sooner ban abortions than it could take away women's right to vote or re-institute segregation. It would require a Constitutional amendment.

Ah, so you're saying that there is no chance abortion becomes illegal in the US.   

[Uncle Rico]

It’s over.  The moonbats can peddle their vast conspiracies until the sun explodes, won’t matter. 

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

I agree. In Philly their claim is they made them stand more than 6 feet away, which nullified their independent observer ability. Absurd.

But Trump will be out campaigning next week rallying troops to his cause and pushing this through courts. The courts won't have receptive ears, but his people will buy in hook, line, and sinker.

There's no hanging chads this time where it's confusing as to who the vote went for.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Ah, so you're saying that there is no chance abortion becomes illegal in the US.   

My other country, Poland, is going through this right now.

The "Law and Justice Party" was pushing through a law that outright bans abortion with no exceptions.  So many people have been loudly protesting all over the country that they have pulled for now.  They basically have the equivalent of Mike Pence in charge. 

[Pakuni]

Ah, so you're saying that there is no chance abortion becomes illegal in the US.   

No, I'm saying the Republicans in 2016 couldn't have outlawed abortion like you suggested. The whole point of Roe is that it prevents states and the federal government from passing legislation making abortion illegal, the same as they can't pass legislation making Buddhism illegal or same-sex marriage illegal.
It would require either a reversal of Roe or an amendment.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

No, I'm saying the Republicans in 2016 couldn't have outlawed abortion like you suggested. The whole point of Roe is that it prevents states and the federal government from passing legislation making abortion illegal, the same as they can't pass legislation making Buddhism illegal or same-sex marriage illegal.
It would require either a reversal of Roe or an amendment.

Of course the Congress or state legislatures can do the bolded.  They can pass legislation to do pretty much anything.

That doesn't mean said legislation would stand up to a court test however.

[Galway Eagle]

My other country, Poland, is going through this right now.

The "Law and Justice Party" was pushing through a law that outright bans abortion with no exceptions.  So many people have been loudly protesting all over the country that they have pulled for now.  They basically have the equivalent of Mike Pence in charge.

Not to bring up a long dead argument but Hards has made it clear to me that if you're American you can't have a "second country" to have pride in. Whether it's citizens of said country, living in said country, married into it, etc etc. so he might not buy into your second country argument.

[Pakuni]

Of course the Congress or state legislatures can do the bolded.  They can pass legislation to do pretty much anything.

That doesn't mean said legislation would stand up to a court test however.

I mean, if you want to be pedantic and intentionally miss the point, OK.

[Galway Eagle]

No, I'm saying the Republicans in 2016 couldn't have outlawed abortion like you suggested. The whole point of Roe is that it prevents states and the federal government from passing legislation making abortion illegal, the same as they can't pass legislation making Buddhism illegal or same-sex marriage illegal.
It would require either a reversal of Roe or an amendment.

Just to clarify. This is because they rooted it in protecting free speech right? It's been a long time since I read the cliff notes on the case.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I mean, if you want to be pedantic and intentionally miss the point, OK.

My point is that I don't think fear of Roe v. Wade is why Republicans don't do something on the national level against abortion.

Fear of the backlash from suburban, white women is.

[Pakuni]

Just to clarify. This is because they rooted it in protecting free speech right? It's been a long time since I read the cliff notes on the case.

Due Process Clause of the 14th Amendment

[Warriors4ever]

My recollection is that Roe was based on Griswold vs Connecticut, which established the right to privacy as being more or less the ‘penumbra’ of rights granted in the Bill of Rights.

[Galway Eagle]

Due Process Clause of the 14th Amendment

Got it thanks

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

My recollection is that Roe was based on Griswold vs Connecticut, which established the right to privacy as being more or less the ‘penumbra’ of rights granted in the Bill of Rights.

Which was based on the Due Process clause of the 14th Amendment.

Pretty much every court decided civil liberty case is based on the same clause including Brown v. Board of Ed, Loving v. Virginia, and Obergefell v. Hodges

[Hards Alumni]

Not to bring up a long dead argument but Hards has made it clear to me that if you're American you can't have a "second country" to have pride in. Whether it's citizens of said country, living in said country, married into it, etc etc. so he might not buy into your second country argument.

Sure you can.  Makes sense if you're a direct immigrant, or your parents are.  Beyond that, it's a strange way to define your personality.  I have a coworker whose 4 grandparents all have VERY German last names, yet she is very proud of her Irish heritage.  Makes zero sense to me, but I guess whatever floats your boat.

BUT THANKS FOR BRINGING THIS UP AGAIN.

[Hards Alumni]

Of course the Congress or state legislatures can do the bolded.  They can pass legislation to do pretty much anything.

That doesn't mean said legislation would stand up to a court test however.

Might now.

[Billy Hoyle]

My point is that I don't think fear of Roe v. Wade is why Republicans don't do something on the national level against abortion.

Fear of the backlash from suburban, white women is.

I don’t think Roe will ever be overturned...it’s too valuable to the GOP. Without that, what do they have to attract single issue evangelicals?

[Pakuni]

I don’t think Roe will ever be overturned...it’s too valuable to the GOP. Without that, what do they have to attract single issue evangelicals?

That and the fact it would be mostly meaningless. Overturning Roe just puts the decision to the states, the majority of which aren't going to enact a ban (77 percent of Americans support Roe, including 59 percent of Republicans).
So, yeah, some women might have to drive from Alabama to Florida or Kansas to Colorado for the procedure (which is unfair), but it's not going to end abortion.

[Hards Alumni]

I don’t think Roe will ever be overturned...it’s too valuable to the GOP. Without that, what do they have to attract single issue evangelicals?

If you want a trip down memory lane...

Democrats imposing Sharia Law
"Happy Holidays!"/War on Christmas
Communism = antitheism

[MU82]

Cool story, bro.  Progressives didn't lose the election for Hilary.

Hillary ran a poor campaign and she is primarily to blame for her own loss. However, if you don't think progressives contributed quite a bit to the loss -- and probably would have been able to help her cross the finish line despite herself if they were motivated to keep a cancer like Trump out of the WH -- I don't know what to say.

Thousands upon thousands of progressives either stayed home or voted for Jill Effen Stein. They can congratulate themselves for their role on those 3 new SCOTUS justices.

[Billy Hoyle]

Sure you can.  Makes sense if you're a direct immigrant, or your parents are.  Beyond that, it's a strange way to define your personality.  I have a coworker whose 4 grandparents all have VERY German last names, yet she is very proud of her Irish heritage.  Makes zero sense to me, but I guess whatever floats your boat.

BUT THANKS FOR BRINGING THIS UP AGAIN.

I’m with George Carlin in this one. https://youtu.be/mIG4-03Gru4

My wife is first gen Filipina. She feels greater identity with her heritage than I do mind, but much because she’s been seen as “different” most of her life. A MU some referred to her as “that Chinese girl.” Me, being Scot and Irish (a McMac) nobody ever judged me based upon heritage, so it’s very different for non-white groups.

[Billy Hoyle]

Hillary ran a poor campaign and she is primarily to blame for her own loss. However, if you don't think progressives contributed quite a bit to the loss -- and probably would have been able to help her cross the finish line despite herself if they were motivated to keep a cancer like Trump out of the WH -- I don't know what to say.

Thousands upon thousands of progressives either stayed home or voted for Jill Effen Stein. They can congratulate themselves for their role on those 3 new SCOTUS justices.

12 percent of Bernie primary voters voted for Trump in 2016 to “prove a point” and “start a revolution” too. That was the difference in WI, MI, and PA.

If you want a trip down memory lane...

Democrats imposing Sharia Law
"Happy Holidays!"/War on Christmas
Communism = antitheism

None of those have been as successful as abortion though. It’s been huge in keeping Catholics with the GOP as well.

[Galway Eagle]

I’m with George Carlin in this one. https://youtu.be/mIG4-03Gru4

My wife is first gen Filipina. She feels greater identity with her heritage than I do mind, but much because she’s been seen as “different” most of her life. A MU some referred to her as “that Chinese girl.” Me, being Scot and Irish (a McMac) nobody ever judged me based upon heritage, so it’s very different for non-white groups.

I was just teasing Hards because he once told me to cut the Irish pride which I took to mean cut out my second citizenship. As opposed to your average 6th gen John [insert Irish surname] from any south side neighborhood around the country. I don't honestly care anymore but it was too good an opportunity to pass up. Again wasn't trying to hijack thread only trying to tease when it was available.

So anyways. Any concern about the military ballots in Georgia breaking so hard for Trump they'd swing the state back to Red?