MUScoop
MUScoop => Hangin' at the Al => Topic started by: MuggsyB on February 27, 2021, 05:32:43 PM
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This is very difficult for me to stomach and truthfully there are no excuses. And to add insult to injury the conference has been very mediocre this year. As I said weeks ago we are nowhere close to where we need to be if the goal is to be a formidable program and capable of March/April damage. I understand there have been iterations of this post from a lot of people for quite some time, but I think it's even worse than I originally thought. It's seriously sad as well as maddening.
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This is very difficult for me to stomach and truthfully there are no excuses. And to add insult to injury the conference has been very mediocre this year. As I said weeks ago we are nowhere close to where we need to be if the goal is to a formidable program and capable of March/April damage. I understand there have been iterations of this post fom a lot of people for quite some time, but I think it's even worse than I originally thought. It's seriously sad as well as maddening.
Yes, we have become one of the bottom feeders in the BE. We will find out shortly if the powers-that-be are OK with that or not. I suspect they will make no coaching change. The status quo is working. :-\
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I don’t know what metrics Wojo is being evaluated on this season but you’d have to think Wojo was billing this as a “rebuilding” year...which it was. It’s just that we didn’t have as much success in the “good” years (previous two seasons) as we would have liked which makes this one more painful. The Big East was surprisingly(?) very down this year and the door felt open to have a better than expected season, but unfortunately we weren’t able to capitalize. There’s still a chance we could finish 7th or so which is exactly where we were projected.
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Lucky for us that DePaul has a lock on last place.
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I don’t know what metrics Wojo is being evaluated on this season but you’d have to think Wojo was billing this as a “rebuilding” year...which it was. It’s just that we didn’t have as much success in the “good” years (previous two seasons) as we would have liked which makes this one more painful. The Big East was surprisingly(?) very down this year and the door felt open to have a better than expected season, but unfortunately we weren’t able to capitalize. There’s still a chance we could finish 7th or so which is exactly where we were projected.
He hasn’t earned the doubt of this season. The implosion of 2019 and imploding of 2020 erased any chance of him having that doubt. I gave him the benefit of the doubt after 2019 (This fan base like a lot of others in college hoops need a reality check) but it’s clear he’s simply incapable of building a complete roster and he can’t overcome that with his coaching.
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It’s been a horrible year and hate to say it but next year may not be much better.
Transfers will have to make a difference, need a few players to leave.
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I don’t know what metrics Wojo is being evaluated on this season but you’d have to think Wojo was billing this as a “rebuilding” year...which it was. It’s just that we didn’t have as much success in the “good” years (previous two seasons) as we would have liked which makes this one more painful. The Big East was surprisingly(?) very down this year and the door felt open to have a better than expected season, but unfortunately we weren’t able to capitalize. There’s still a chance we could finish 7th or so which is exactly where we were projected.
What's most upsetting is the poor fundamentals CR. We have seen this game, after game, after game. Of course there are a dozen other things that are troubling but when we see these repetitive issues, like getting the ball in bounds, it's embarrassing and demoralizing.
Today like a myriad of past games, we were pushed around on the perimeter, trapped. and had 0.0 answers. We have an infinitesimal margin for error with the current personnel, this is clear as day. The overall problems are too lengthy to count and explains our inconsistency , both individually and collectively.. My hope is the powers that be are prepared to make drastic changes and actually care about the future of our great program.
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This whole “10th place in the Big East” thing will all be made worse if we retain Wojo and Butler fires Jordan and hires Matta. That would be a swift, decisive move on their part. As Bill Paxton’s character from Aliens said, “How do I get out of this chickensh!t outfit?”
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I think we would have been fine with the rebuilding year mantra had the season started slow and finished on an upswing. Now it just feels like a staff and team with no answers.
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This is very difficult for me to stomach and truthfully there are no excuses. And to add insult to injury the conference has been very mediocre this year. As I said weeks ago we are nowhere close to where we need to be if the goal is to a formidable program and capable of March/April damage. I understand there have been iterations of this post fom a lot of people for quite some time, but I think it's even worse than I originally thought. It's seriously sad as well as maddening.
Only one or two. Thanks for starting one so we can update everyone on their thoughts of Wojo. You are providing a public service.
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It’s been a horrible year and hate to say it but next year may not be much better.
Transfers will have to make a difference, need a few players to leave.
The only way next season is worse is 1) if the Big East is a lot better (could be) or 2) at least one of Carton, Lewis, or Garcia are not here. If those three are back we will be a better team, as you can see Garcia is getting used to the physicality of the game and I think he’ll be very, very good next year and I think Lewis will have a big year as well. Carton needs to find consistency. Will he? Not sure, but I’d expect him to be at least as good as he is this year.
Beyond that, I’m not sure we’re losing all that much.
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10th and likely to get clocked twice by the 11th place team.
This program is now a joke....
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It’s not just losing but how they are losing; turnovers, poor decisions & lack of ability. Player development is not Wojo’s strong suit. As it was stated earlier, not sure what metrics he is evaluated but the team is just bad. I don’t get too excited about incoming talent because I don’t believe Wojo or the staff can leverage their strengths or meld them with the existing players.
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May be coincidence, but nearly all the major sports coaches have an outing up for bid at the blue and gold auction tonight...except Wojo. He typically does.
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I wasn't a big fan of allowing UConn to rejoin the BEast, but now it helps 10th place not seem as bad as it would've been in recent years.
Go MU!
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Marquette basketball is irrelevant as long as Wojo is coach. If the good times are a loss in the 1st round of the tourney and the bad times are 10th in the Big East then the future of the program is pretty bleak.
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This whole “10th place in the Big East” thing will all be made worse if we retain Wojo and Butler fires Jordan and hires Matta. That would be a swift, decisive move on their part. As Bill Paxton’s character from Aliens said, “How do I get out of this chickensh!t outfit?”
Think Paxton also said something about "getting our ass kicked out there" That would also be fitting. We could change the nicknamof the team to Paxtons Parables.
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I wasn't a big fan of allowing UConn to rejoin the BEast, but now it helps 10th place not seem as bad as it would've been in recent years.
Go MU!
Marquette is a top ten team!!
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I said early on in the season MU should not finish behind DePaul, Georgetown, Butler, and St John’s. They will only finish in front of DePaul (a team that didn’t play until late December due to COVID), and at best will be 1-1 against them. That is embarrassing for a program like ours and the resources we put into the program.
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This is very difficult for me to stomach and truthfully there are no excuses. And to add insult to injury the conference has been very mediocre this year. As I said weeks ago we are nowhere close to where we need to be if the goal is to be a formidable program and capable of March/April damage. I understand there have been iterations of this post fom a lot of people for quite some time, but I think it's even worse than I originally thought. It's seriously sad as well as maddening.
Agree Muggsy. Disappointing and Frustrating. Say this often but feel the need to repost ugh. There is a Reason Jay Bilas said as long as MU stays in the Old Big East MU will be in the Big Dance. When MU Joined the Old Big East Mr Cords literally held his hand to my ear whispered in my ear MU will be very good for a very long time. After Marquette joined the New Big East Mr Lovell literally held his hand to my ear and whispered in my ear Do not worry about it it is only basketball.
That said I want to add someone in the AL who is there yet also said something to the effect that we might of cut a deal to be a Women’s Power like DePaul after joining the New BE. If that is true that is maddening to me too. Especially for a Men’s Program with again Top 10 National Attendance. If MU was winning I would be for no changes, but MU is not winning overall and has not won a Big Dance tournament game since the 2012-2013 season and coaching changes would probably help MU. Am for MU Winning.
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That Butler win today should lock in a tenth place league finish for our favorite millionaire floor slapping cheerleader coach. What an abject FAILURE!!! 🤮
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Agree Muggsy. Disappointing and Frustrating. Say this often but feel the need to repost ugh. There is a Reason Jay Bilas said as long as MU stays in the Old Big East MU will be in the Big Dance. When MU Joined the Old Big East Mr Cords literally held his hand to my ear whispered in my ear MU will be very good for a very long time. After Marquette joined the New Big East Mr Lovell literally held his hand to my ear and whispered in my ear Do not worry about it it is only basketball.
That said I want to add someone in the AL who is there yet also said something to the effect that we might of cut a deal to be a Women’s Power like DePaul after joining the New BE. If that is true that is maddening to me too. Especially for a Men’s Program with again Top 10 National Attendance. If MU was winning I would be for no changes, but MU is not winning overall and has not won a Big Dance tournament game since the 2012-2013 season and coaching changes would probably help MU. Am for MU Winning.
The overall athleticism and fundamental skill on this MU roster MarquetteMike is seriously subpar. I've watched a lot of college hoops this weekend, it's honestly staggering. I would put us in the bottom 10% of P6 conference teams in this category. Right now we are dealing with Defcon 1 probs and there is no way to sugarcoat the facts.
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That Butler win today should lock in a tenth place league finish for our favorite millionaire floor slapping cheerleader coach. What an abject FAILURE!!! 🤮
Hey, we can still tie for ninth.
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Hey, we can still tie for ninth.
Technically, we can get ninth all to ourselves. If we win out and Butler loses to Creighton, we’d have them on winning percentage.
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The only way next season is worse is 1) if the Big East is a lot better (could be) or 2) at least one of Carton, Lewis, or Garcia are not here. If those three are back we will be a better team, as you can see Garcia is getting used to the physicality of the game and I think he’ll be very, very good next year and I think Lewis will have a big year as well. Carton needs to find consistency. Will he? Not sure, but I’d expect him to be at least as good as he is this year.
Beyond that, I’m not sure we’re losing all that much.
I agree not losing much but after those 3 I see no Big East type starters. Who are the other starters that you are excited about?
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I wasn't a big fan of allowing UConn to rejoin the BEast, but now it helps 10th place not seem as bad as it would've been in recent years.
Go MU!
Had Uconn not joined we would still of finished ahead of DePaul. We might have finished .500 in Big East, if you dropped the two games with Uconn and add back in the lost game against Georgetown.
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Had Uconn not joined we would still of finished ahead of DePaul. We might have finished .500 in Big East, if you dropped the two games with Uconn and add back in the lost game against Georgetown.
Hang a banner.
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Had Uconn not joined we would still of finished ahead of DePaul. We might have finished .500 in Big East, if you dropped the two games with Uconn and add back in the lost game against Georgetown.
The more competitive Big East programs are, the greater the ability for MU to attract recruits, coaches, fans and visibility to the program. We should want to play the best as often as possible, and adding a program with four national championships in the past twenty years brings value to the Big East and to Marquette.
Between the Big East, Fiserv and our TV contract, there is no reason MUBB should be a tenth place program right now. Zero. That is a failure on the leadership of the program this year.
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I agree not losing much but after those 3 I see no Big East type starters. Who are the other starters that you are excited about?
I’m at the same place. Those 3 are nice pieces, but they aren’t total game changers. The rest of the squad doesn’t inspire confidence that we would be any more than a potential bubble team. Similar to the expectations of this year.
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Yesterday was the 1st time I remember that I was home and not busy and I didn't bother to turn on the game.
It's like being a fan of the Jets or Jaguars - why bother to endure the anguish?
Just laugh, instead.
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Had Uconn not joined ..
MU mens + womens = 0-3 (soon to be 0-4) vs. UConn. I wonder how many seasons either program will take to notch a single win against the Huskies.
But we got some money or something, so yay.
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I agree not losing much but after those 3 I see no Big East type starters. Who are the other starters that you are excited about?
I don’t see any sure fire starting level BE players. But I’m not sure Cain/Elliott are either (though Elliott has shown some things down the stretch here, so if he sticks around and stays healthy maybe he’s okay as a 5th starter), and Theo would be a nice 5th starter on a team that has 4 consistent scoring threats. But he hasn’t had that since his sophomore year. So I’m not sure you’re losing a ton.
IF Carton, Lewis, and Garcia are all back next year, we will be a better team. The conference should be a better conference so there might not be a ton of progress made unless at least one of Mitchell, Aidoo, or a transfer are fairly major contributors.
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I don’t see any sure fire starting level BE players. But I’m not sure Cain/Elliott are either (though Elliott has shown some things down the stretch here, so if he sticks around and stays healthy maybe he’s okay as a 5th starter), and Theo would be a nice 5th starter on a team that has 4 consistent scoring threats. But he hasn’t had that since his sophomore year. So I’m not sure you’re losing a ton.
IF Carton, Lewis, and Garcia are all back next year, we will be a better team. The conference should be a better conference so there might not be a ton of progress made unless at least one of Mitchell, Aidoo, or a transfer are fairly major contributors.
This is fair although I think Oso has potential. The biggest prob from a pure personnel standpoint is we don't have a 2nd guard that can create off the dribble. I'm not defending DJ who was abysmal yesterday and has been inconsistent overall, but he has no one to take the pressure off of him. Elliott has his moments spot shooting and in transition. Torrence and McEwen have been very poor in our offensive sets to put it kindly.
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This is fair although I think Oso has potential. The biggest prob from a pure personnel standpoint is we don't have a 2nd guard that can create off the dribble. I'm not defending DJ who was abysmal yesterday and has been inconsistent overall, but he has no one to take the pressure off of him. Elliott has his moments spot shooting and in transition. Torrence and McEwen have been very poor in our offensive sets to put it kindly.
We’ll see about Oso, but he has a long ways to go offensively. This has been a lost year for him developmentally so he’ll be coming into next year with barely any game experience.
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I reject the notion that letting UConn into the Big East somehow hurt our men's basketball program.
We were 6-3 against them when when both teams were in the previous version of the Big East, and there were several very fine (including NCAA championship) UConn teams during those years. Going into this season, UConn hoops had been meh for several years; while we were going to 3 of 4 NCAAs, they were mostly sucking despite playing in an inferior conference.
Are they back on the upswing under Hurley? It would seem so. That means it's up to Marquette to play up to their level, not for us to wish that a good program hadn't joined the BEast. It might take a new coach for us to do it, but it's both silly and defeatist to assume that it can't happen.
I mean, our previous coach - an unorthodox dude whose head-coaching resume included all of 1 losing season at a mid-major - ended up doing very well against Hall of Famer Jim Calhoun, for cripe's sake.
I know things seem hopeless now, so the tendency is to be negative about every single thing that has to do with Marquette basketball. But sports are cyclical. We'll be competitive again, and the optimist in me says we'll be at least Buzz-Crean level again.
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Although it was before the team was in the Big East, it says a lot when the Mike Deane years are looked back on with fondness.
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Although it was before the team was in the Big East, it says a lot when the Mike Deane years are looked back on with fondness.
Only by people who are fooling themselves -- or were his drinking buddies.
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Technically, we can get ninth all to ourselves. If we win out and Butler loses to Creighton, we’d have them on winning percentage.
Or as some might say, we could finish “alone in 9th” in the Big East.
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The more competitive Big East programs are, the greater the ability for MU to attract recruits, coaches, fans and visibility to the program. We should want to play the best as often as possible, and adding a program with four national championships in the past twenty years brings value to the Big East and to Marquette.
Between the Big East, Fiserv and our TV contract, there is no reason MUBB should be a tenth place program right now. Zero. That is a failure on the leadership of the program this year.
So the only thing holding Depaul back is lack of an NBA arena?