Chicago Trib: Xavier, Butler, Creighton should be official Wed or Thurs

[Aughnanure]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/college/chi-depaul-catholic-7-20130315,0,7897661.story

The additions of Xavier, Butler and Creighton should become official by Wednesday or Thursday, according to sources familiar with the talks. And thus the new Big East would take shape for 2013-14.

Xavier and Butler left Atlantic 10 meetings in New York on Friday, according to Sports Illustrated. The thought was that league might vote on increasing exit fees Friday, and if Xavier and Butler announced their imminent withdrawal, they would have lost voting rights and therefore would have had to exit the meeting.

The Atlantic 10 is holding its league tournament at the Barclays Center in Brooklyn.

Meanwhile, Creighton indeed will be the 10th team in the league, a source told the Tribune. There had been some debate on the identity of any additions after Xavier and Butler, but the new Big East has settled on Creighton for certain, barring unexpected complications.

[Coleman]

Great news.

[Eldon]

I'm lovin' it.  Now we wait on SLU and hope Gtown wins the Dayton/Richmond fight

[Groin_pull]

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/college/chi-depaul-catholic-7-20130315,0,7897661.story

The additions of Xavier, Butler and Creighton should become official by Wednesday or Thursday, according to sources familiar with the talks. And thus the new Big East would take shape for 2013-14.

Xavier and Butler left Atlantic 10 meetings in New York on Friday, according to Sports Illustrated. The thought was that league might vote on increasing exit fees Friday, and if Xavier and Butler announced their imminent withdrawal, they would have lost voting rights and therefore would have had to exit the meeting.

The Atlantic 10 is holding its league tournament at the Barclays Center in Brooklyn.

Meanwhile, Creighton indeed will be the 10th team in the league, a source told the Tribune. There had been some debate on the identity of any additions after Xavier and Butler, but the new Big East has settled on Creighton for certain, barring unexpected complications.

Hope this turns out to be true. Xavier, Butler, and Creighton are all excellent additions.

[Warriors10]

I'm lovin' it.  Now we wait on SLU and hope Gtown wins the Dayton/Richmond fight

Personally I believe we are waiting on Richmond and the BE is fighting about SLU/Dayton.  You are adding 4 midwestern schools the other way around and I doubt GT likes that.  That is also assuming you are going to 12 teams.

[Aughnanure]

Personally I believe we are waiting on Richmond and the BE is fighting about SLU/Dayton.  You are adding 4 midwestern schools the other way around and I doubt GT likes that.  That is also assuming you are going to 12 teams.

Huh? SLU isn't fighting with Dayton. SLU is in easily over Dayton. It's Dayton v Richmond v VCU.

[PE8983]

Let's just stay at 10 and keep these mid-majors out.

[Coleman]

Let's just stay at 10 and keep these mid-majors out.

+1

[CTWarrior]

Let's just stay at 10 and keep these mid-majors out.

I like 10 because it is the fairest set up.  Everybody plays everybody else once at home and once on the road.  Once you go to 12 the imbalanced schedules start.

[GGGG]

It won't be 10.  Fox wants more to provide more content. 

[Eldon]

It won't be 10.  Fox wants more to provide more content. 

Couldn't they just air our non-con games?  Or would this conflict with other media outlets who have the rights to that non-con team and thus maybe cost Fox some money?

[drewm88]

Question about this:

Xavier and Butler left Atlantic 10 meetings in New York on Friday, according to Sports Illustrated. The thought was that league might vote on increasing exit fees Friday, and if Xavier and Butler announced their imminent withdrawal, they would have lost voting rights and therefore would have had to exit the meeting.

I read it two different ways-
1. Butler and Xavier would have had to either announce their withdrawal or be subject to higher exit fees, so they left preemptively before that could happen.

2. Butler and Xavier did announce their withdrawal to the other members, and subsequently lost their voting rights and left.


I think it's number 1, and it's basically irrelevant overall, but can anyone shed some light? Regardless, this strikes me as sloppy writing.

[Avenue Commons]

Huh? SLU isn't fighting with Dayton. SLU is in easily over Dayton. It's Dayton v Richmond v VCU.

Why does VCU keep coming up? No one is discussing VCU as even a possible addition. If any Richmond school gets in, it's the Spiders.

[MU72491]

As a current student at university of Dayton I would love to see the flyers in, just so I could be wearing blue and gold in the student section next year

[MUMonster03]

I'm lovin' it.  Now we wait on SLU and hope Gtown wins the Dayton/Richmond fight

I don't think Georgetown is fighting for any Richmond area school. Why would they want a school which is right in their recruiting area?

[GGGG]

Georgetown, and reportedly some of the other eastern schools, want Richmond.

[JakeBarnes]

Twitter tracka says its official. I suck at internet usage of phone, but its all over the Twitters.

[Aughnanure]

Indianapolis Star

http://www.indystar.com/article/20130315/SPORTS0605/303150071/Butler-withdraw-from-10-next-week-will-join-Big-East?odyssey=mod|breaking|text|IndyStar.com

[Norm]

Georgetown, and reportedly some of the other eastern schools, want Richmond.

I think the Big East should look for another east coast team, if nothing else to have another team that can send fans to MSG for the conference tournament.

[Galway Eagle]

Goodbye C7 I guess we're now the Private8

[Eldon]

I think the Big East should look for another east coast team, if nothing else to have another team that can send fans to MSG for the conference tournament.

Fordham it is!

[Jet915]

Omaha World Herald reporting that Creighton is accepting Big East invite!!!

http://www.omaha.com/article/20130315/BLUEJAYS/703159855/1070#creighton-to-accept-big-east-invite

[Eldon]

Omaha World Herald reporting that Creighton is accepting Big East invite!!!

http://www.omaha.com/article/20130315/BLUEJAYS/703159855/1070#creighton-to-accept-big-east-invite

I refuse to say congrats or welcome until Larry House gets put on your Creighton signature

[Jet915]

Haha, sorry, Larry didn't make the cut.

[Norm]

Omaha World Herald reporting that Creighton is accepting Big East invite!!!

http://www.omaha.com/article/20130315/BLUEJAYS/703159855/1070#creighton-to-accept-big-east-invite

Welcome aboard Jet!

[LastWarrior]

Omaha World Herald reporting that Creighton is accepting Big East invite!!!

http://www.omaha.com/article/20130315/BLUEJAYS/703159855/1070#creighton-to-accept-big-east-invite

Congrats Jet!  Glad to see you guys joining the conference!

[buckchuckler]

X and Butler are clearly the best 2 teams to add.  I think Creighton is also pretty clearly third.  Best recent history.  Rough stretch in the 90's but fairly regular tourney participant.  Great fan support (over 16k per game), brings in a completely new market, stretches the footprint etc.  



After that it gets pretty murky. Two of the next 3 will likely be added.  

 Dayton has 7 (though 4 since 2000) tourney appearances and 5 wins since MU won their Championship, a long time ago.  They have great fan support, about 12k per game.  They are in a market, while separate, is not totally new for the conference.  Catholic school.

SLU has 6 tourney appearances since Harry Truman left office, though they are about to make it 2 in a row.  They add a new, big market, though lets be honest, in St. Louis it is the Cards and everything else.  They add some western balance for Creighton.  Jesuit school.  About 8K per game.

Richmond has 9 tourney appearances, all since 1984, and 3 since 2000, sweet sixteen in 2011.  Not a new market, but they do add some more eastern balance, and possible a nod to the wishes of Georgetown.  Private school.  They have averaged less than 6k per game this season.  


I understand the UDPride dude is a complete joke, and it is fun to tweak em, but I don't understand the hate for them and the love for Richmond.  

To me it is really a pretty much a wash after Creighton.  If anything, the opportunity to help another very similar Catholic school should be another plus for Dayton over Richmond.

That guy was pretty douchey though...

[forgetful]

It really is too bad that Duke has football, they really would make a great addition to the conference.  A NC team would be a great addition.

edit:  I realize they are in the ACC and unlikely to leave, was really trying to highlight that a NC team would be a nice addition.  Duke having tradition and being a private would make a lot of sense.

[🏀]

After Creighton it is a wash. The thing is I do not wave to dirty myself with a crappy team from Noonegivesacrap, OH.

[Tugg Speedman]

It really is too bad that Duke has football, they really would make a great addition to the conference.  A NC team would be a great addition.

edit:  I realize they are in the ACC and unlikely to leave, was really trying to highlight that a NC team would be a nice addition.  Duke having tradition and being a private would make a lot of sense.

ND!

[Eldon]

It really is too bad that Duke has football, they really would make a great addition to the conference.  A NC team would be a great addition.

edit:  I realize they are in the ACC and unlikely to leave, was really trying to highlight that a NC team would be a nice addition.  Duke having tradition and being a private would make a lot of sense.

McIlvaine wrote how we should try to get Wake, but, of course, they have football.  When Maryland settles, and the ACC implodes, maybe we can hope for Wake, but they'd have to relegate their football to FCS, which I doubt they'd do.  They'd probably link up with Uconn, Cincy, et al at that point.

Davidson would possibly be another option, but you don't hear it being discussed much

[buckchuckler]

Another gem from the Dayton board:
"I guess the real concern is that if the BE stays at 10 for good the A10 will likely lose SLU to the MVC. Though even if that happens, a 10 team BE would be only marginally better than a revamped A10 on the court (if at all)."

So apparently
VCU= Georgetown
St. Joes = Marquette
La Salle = Villanova
Charlotte = Butler
Dayton = Xavier
Richmond = Creighton
St. Bonaventures = St. John's
Rhode Island = Providence
Duquense = Seton Hall
Fordam = De Paul


Those evaluations seem about right to me.   

I think we actually want Dayton in the conference now.  Their fans are amusing as heck. 

[Galway Eagle]

McIlvaine wrote how we should try to get Wake, but, of course, they have football.  When Maryland settles, and the ACC implodes, maybe we can hope for Wake, but they'd have to relegate their football to FCS, which I doubt they'd do.  They'd probably link up with Uconn, Cincy, et al at that point.

Davidson would possibly be another option, but you don't hear it being discussed much

Davidson isn't ready to make the big jump them and Belmont should try to go to the A10 though and maybe in time we can pillage them.

[ZiggysFryBoy]

I refuse to say congrats or welcome until Larry House gets put on your Creighton signature

or Larry Horse.

[Coleman]

Seriously, stay at 10 right now. Run the A-10 like our minor league system for the next decade.

Wait 3-4 years. Promote the best two performers in that time. Wait another 3 years. Bring up 2 more. Do it all the way to 16 teams if you want.

But make the teams prove themselves. Demand NCAA bids in the years prior. Don't rush it to 12 right now. Dayton or Richmond haven't earned it yet.

[The Process]

I think we actually want Dayton in the conference now.  Their fans are amusing as heck. 

They make a perfect replacement for WVU - although I wonder if we'll have to provide the couches for their fans to burn after each loss.  That's a *lot* of potential couches.  Would Fox agree to pick up the tab?

Davidson isn't ready to make the big jump

Hopefully we can prove that point on Thursday.

[MULawAlum]

It's amazing how perfectly this has all come together.  I can't imagine it playing out any better than it did.  Should be a fun league.

[The Process]

I think we actually want Dayton in the conference now.  Their fans are amusing as heck. 

You're right - Avid Flyer put in this gem on Saturday on their delusional "UD in Big East in 2014!" thread:

"Well were up to .04 cents now. Adding mine too. Not just a couple schools on the east, its a whole band of Jesuit schools to which they are adding two and possibly a 3rd in SLU. Dayton is essentially toast as far as the NBE is concerned and I don't want us to be a beetch to those Jesuit schools. Georgetwon and Maquette have become the bullies of the new conference. I would rather us stay with the A-10 or go to the old BE (American 12) for the east coast exposure."

At least his last sentence is a better representation of their likely future than delusions of joining us.

If we go a little farther down on that page, we find Angry John's rant:

"I am getting the feeling that I would trust UC, Memphis, Temple and UConn more than I would those crooked Jesuit clowns of Georgetown, Marquette and Xavier.

If it is discovered that Xavier is attempting to keep us out of the "New Big East", I would no longer play them in an out of conference game. Screw them ! If their is some sort of collusion and defamation of character going on, I would not rule out a lawsuite. We have sued Marquette, DePaul and UC before."

I have some questions here:

1. What is a "lawsuite?"  Is that where lawyers stay to consummate their contracts, like the Sybaris for affairs?
2. Based on his "logic," shouldn't UC and UCONN be suing the ACC for not being allowed in?
3. How long until this winds up on UDPride's board so they can get mad and burn couches?

[TallTitan34]

When did Dayton sue us before?

[The Process]

When did Dayton sue us before?

Good question.  And while we're at it, they talk about how they've sued UC before yet they trust them more than us "crooked Jesuit clowns?"  Perhaps Angry John might be best off taking a sojourn to the Sybaris to... ahem... blow off some steam?

[Benny B]

Good question.  And while we're at it, they talk about how they've sued UC before yet they trust them more than us "crooked Jesuit clowns?"  Perhaps Angry John might be best off taking a sojourn to the Sybaris to... ahem... blow off some steam?

It is Dayton, so my guess would be more blowing and less steam.

[The Process]

It is Dayton, so my guess would be more blowing and less steam.

Unless they were to go for a ride on the old-time steamer the SS Cleveland...

[mug644]

Huh? SLU isn't fighting with Dayton. SLU is in easily over Dayton. It's Dayton v Richmond v VCU.

If SLU was coming to the New Big East, wouldn't they also have left the same A10 meeting that Butler and Xavier left?

[ZiggysFryBoy]

4ever manages the sybaris in the quon, maybe he can comp them a suite or two

[Warriors10]

Sounds like they are gonna tell mommy and daddy if we don't let them play with us.

[hairy worthen]

4ever manages the sybaris in the quon, maybe he can comp them a suite or two

sybaris?  I know it as the soak and poke.

[Litehouse]

Sounds like they are gonna tell mommy and daddy if we don't let them play with us.

Papa Francis is on our side for this one.

[brewcity77]

I find it interesting how so many are now 100% on the SLU bandwagon. Don't get me wrong, they have had a couple good years, but I want to make sure they have a long-term commitment to the program and would really like to see where they go in the coaching search. Jim Crews has done fine with Majerus' players, but will he be able to recruit? They have one 2-star committed for 2013. This is a program that has been to the tournament only 6 times since the 1960s.

There is upside there, but honestly, I'm not convinced they belong in over Dayton. The vociferous Flyers fans may be repugnant, but they come out in force and support the hell out of that program. Dayton's basketball program brings in more revenue than Georgetown, Xavier, Villanova, or Butler. Maybe the step up to an elite league will allow Archie Miller to really kick the program up a notch.

Of course...many thought that DePaul moving to the Big East would let them kick it up a notch too, so there's that...

[GGGG]

When did Dayton sue us before?

And on what basis would they sue us now?

[MUfan12]

When did Dayton sue us before?

Wasn't there a dispute about a return game between Crean and Gregory? I don't remember the specifics. Maybe that was it?

[Litehouse]

With all these "maybes" associated with each school (SLU, Dayton, Richmond, VCU) I'm convinced than ever that we should stick with 10 for a few years.

[The Process]

The vociferous Flyers fans may be repugnant, but they come out in force and support the hell out of that program.

Judging from those St. Patrick's Day pictures, they'll come out in force and support just about anything, so long as they can drink and riot.

I also wonder whether Fox would be thrilled with three relatively-close in location programs (Butler/X/Dayton) being back together in the Big East, especially if they're handing out big TV contracts as part of this.  How much overlap is there between the Indy/Dayton/Cincy markets, anyways, both in terms of recruiting and TV-wise?

[Benny B]

Judging from those St. Patrick's Day pictures, they'll come out in force and support just about anything, so long as they can drink and riot.

I also wonder whether Fox would be thrilled with three relatively-close in location programs (Butler/X/Dayton) being back together in the Big East, especially if they're handing out big TV contracts as part of this.  How much overlap is there between the Indy/Dayton/Cincy markets, anyways, both in terms of recruiting and TV-wise?

From Nielsen:

Rank / DMA / TV Homes
21  St Louis       1,243,490
26  Indianapolis  1,089,700
34  Milwaukee       902,190
35  Cincinnati        897,890
57  Richmond        553,390
63  Dayton           498,270
75  Omaha           414,060

Though, two important points:

1) Creighton's fan base extends beyond their local market.  If you added the Lincoln DMA (276,790), you'd have a combined DMA that would rank #48, just ahead of Louisville.

2) TV market coverage is more important to conferences starting their own (or who eventually want to start their own) TV network.  It is also important to conferences whose TV partner needs to gain leverage with more cable/satellite providers.  Since FS1 is already available on most providers and has sufficient programming to compete for viewership demand nationwide, FS1 isn't concerned about whether the Big East is going to "lock up" the Cincinnati and Indianapolis markets... it's more concerned about having original programming that viewers will want to watch.

[The Process]

Fair, but what about my other point?  Shouldn't X and Butler be opposed to having a third Big East program nearby from a recruiting perspective?  Is there enough overlap to be concerned?

[Benny B]

Fair, but what about my other point?  Shouldn't X and Butler be opposed to having a third Big East program nearby from a recruiting perspective?  Is there enough overlap to be concerned?

Xavier and Butler are recruiting against the likes of IU, UK, OSU and UC already... not sure that they have any concern with Dayton.

Additionally, X, Butler and Dayton are currently in the same conference, and no one seemed to be complaining about recruiting overlap as it was.

[The Process]

Additionally, X, Butler and Dayton are currently in the same conference, and no one seemed to be complaining about recruiting overlap as it was.

Probably because they know it's a mid-major conference and they want to get to a better conference, such as the Big East.  At a high-major level, I wonder if things might be different with overlap.

[MDMU04]

With all these "maybes" associated with each school (SLU, Dayton, Richmond, VCU) I'm convinced than ever that we should stick with 10 for a few years.

Hell, I say we should keep it at 10 forever but float the expansion rumors right around tournament time every just to screw with the Dayton board.

Seriously, that 2014 thread on the UD board is hilarious. They have a 1200+ post thread without trolls from other schools egging on their existential meltdown.

I thought this board had the all time meltdown award with the everlasting smu thread last year, but we're not even on the same planet as those people.