No shows

[wadesworld]

Maybe, but I doubt it. Right now there are 2 top 10 teams (#1 and #9) in the Big East. I only looked at 1 year, but in 2010-11 the Big East had 4 teams in the top 8 when the conference season started.

In 2005-2006 we played 3 games against top 10 teams, 2 in 2006-2007, 0 in 2007-2008, 3 in 2008-2009, 5 in 2009-2010 and 2010-2011, 3 in 2011-2012, and 1 in 2012-2013.

We played 6 last year.  And all those numbers included non conference as well, and all 6 of our top 10 games last year were conference opponents.  My guess is we play 5 games against top 10 teams this year.

Don't challenge wadesworld.  Aren't you aware that he is the smartest man on this board?   

...so...oops?

[Galway Eagle]

In 2005-2006 we played 3 top 10 teams, 2 in 2006-2007, 0 in 2007-2008, 3 in 2008-2009, 5 in 2009-2010 and 2010-2011, 3 in 2011-2012, and 1 in 2012-2013.

We played 6 last year.  And all those numbers included non conference as well, and all 6 of our top 10 opponents last year were conference opponents...

...so...oops?

And yet our strength of schedule was still complete $hit

[Lennys Tap]

In 2005-2006 we played 3 games against top 10 teams, 2 in 2006-2007, 0 in 2007-2008, 3 in 2008-2009, 5 in 2009-2010 and 2010-2011, 3 in 2011-2012, and 1 in 2012-2013.

We played 6 last year.  And all those numbers included non conference as well, and all 6 of our top 10 games last year were conference opponents.  My guess is we play 5 games against top 10 teams this year.

...so...oops?

1.Last year is irrelevant, since you didn't even mention it in your post.

2,You originally stated: "I'd guess we'll play MORE games against top 10 opponents than we did in ANY season in the old Big East

3.I looked at one year (2010-11) and replied "Maybe, but I doubt it".

4.Your research (good or bad, I don't know) says we played 5 top 10 opponents that year.

5.Your opinion is that we'll play 5 top 10 opponents this year.

6.Five is not MORE than five.

7. Your original opinion (which I doubted) is now also doubted by you.

8.Oops.

[wadesworld]

1.Last year is irrelevant, since you didn't even mention it in your post.

2,You originally stated: "I'd guess we'll play MORE games against top 10 opponents than we did in ANY season in the old Big East

3.I looked at one year (2010-11) and replied "Maybe, but I doubt it".

4.Your research (good or bad, I don't know) says we played 5 top 10 opponents that year.

5.Your opinion is that we'll play 5 top 10 opponents this year.

6.Five is not MORE than five.

7. Your original opinion (which I doubted) is now also doubted by you.

8.Oops.

I don't know how many we'll play.  But there are currently 2 teams in the top 10 in the BE and we are guaranteed 2 games against them.  Plus there are 2 other teams that I think could jump into the top 10 at some point, so we could also play them at times they're ranked in the top 10.  Doubt is implied when you say, "I'd guess."  Never said, "I guarantee."  I said, "I'd guess."  So yup, there was doubt implied there.  Sorry that it took you a second post on the subject to realize it.  Once again we come upon reading comprehension issues with you.

I was responding to the idea that attendance has gone down in part because the strength of our opponents has gone down since the new BE was developed (AKA we no longer get any big name opponents or marquee matchups...my position is that any time you're playing a top 10 team it's a marquee, big name matchup), which means that last year is very relevant, since last year was new BE as opposed to old BE.  Oops?

[Goose]

The BE is watered down and nowhere near the excitement level with new BE. I'll take playing UConn and Syracuse over Creighton and Butler any day of the week.

[Galway Eagle]

The BE is watered down and nowhere near the excitement level with new BE. I'll take playing UConn and Syracuse over Creighton and Butler any day of the week.

Even the day of the week where UConn is 5-5 and Creighton is no 9 in the country?

[79Warrior]

The BE is watered down and nowhere near the excitement level with new BE. I'll take playing UConn and Syracuse over Creighton and Butler any day of the week.

Unfortunately that is absolutely true. While Creighton and Butler are solid opponents, they do not have the cachet of the two you mentioned. This is the best MU could have hoped for and we need to just accept that it is what it is. I do miss playing the teams you mentioned along with Cincy, Ville and WVU. Colorful teams with colorful coaches and there always was a buzz in the Bradley Center when they came into town.

Bag, how many NCAA banners are hanging in Omaha?

[wadesworld]

The BE is watered down and nowhere near the excitement level with new BE. I'll take playing UConn and Syracuse over Creighton and Butler any day of the week.

The BE was actually more watered down in the old version, with not only St. John's and DePaul dragging the league down, but also with South Florida, Providence (who was bad then), Seton Hall (who was bad then), and Rutgers all bringing the overall quality of the conference down.  That was at least 6 games that you should win every year, guaranteed, and depending on who your mirror opponents were it was probably more than that.  Now we get 4 games we should win without an issue.

The top might be a little worse, but when you have teams the caliber of this year's Nova, Creighton, Xavier, and Butler each year (the teams may not always be the same teams that are up, but there are always solid teams) it certainly is a tough conference.

[Galway Eagle]

Unfortunately that is absolutely true. While Creighton and Butler are solid opponents, they do not have the cachet of the two you mentioned. This is the best MU could have hoped for and we need to just accept that it is what it is. I do miss playing the teams you mentioned along with Cincy, Ville and WVU. Colorful teams with colorful coaches and there always was a buzz in the Bradley Center when they came into town.

Bag, how many NCAA banners are hanging in Omaha?

NCAA tournament or NCAA tournament championship? Point is you might miss them, but really you miss having Jim Calhoun on that sideline, sooner or later you would be ragging on UConn like they're Depaul and last time I checked nobody says anything fond about Depaul.  Remember a couple years ago when Nova hit rock bottom? Like nobody showed up for that game and it'd be the same against UConn this year. 

But hey if you want to spend you life saying "I wish things were like this still" when they can't ever go back and everybody knew they were going to fall apart anyways then go right ahead.

[jsglow]

The BE is watered down and nowhere near the excitement level with new BE. I'll take playing UConn and Syracuse over Creighton and Butler any day of the week.

Well goose, those days are gone and are never coming back.  Consider this:  MU could easily be in the A-10 if things hadn't broken the right way a decade ago.

[GGGG]

The whining about the NBE is really getting old.  It's not as though we had some long standing tradition within the conference anyway - we had UConn and Syracuse as conference members for *eight* seasons.  Yep that's it.  Eight. 

Just over a decade ago we were playing conference games against the likes of East Carolina, Southern Miss and Charlotte.

We are in so much better shape now it's not even funny.  People should appreciate it.  There is a reason the C7 broke off when they did. 

[jsglow]

The whining about the NBE is really getting old.  It's not as though we had some long standing tradition within the conference anyway - we had UConn and Syracuse as conference members for *eight* seasons.  Yep that's it.  Eight. 

Just over a decade ago we were playing conference games against the likes of East Carolina, Southern Miss and Charlotte.

We are in so much better shape now it's not even funny.  People should appreciate it.  There is a reason the C7 broke off when they did.

Plus a million.  It's simply an excuse for folks.  Seriously Sultan, you need to come down for some games.  You might even get a chance to play with #noredforowen.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

The BE is watered down and nowhere near the excitement level with new BE. I'll take playing UConn and Syracuse over Creighton and Butler any day of the week.

For now. There was a time where City College of New York was a more exciting game than Syracuse. Times change. We have no option to play UConn and Syracuse every year so let's hope Creighton and Butler continue to do well and change the national perceptive on them.

[Coleman]

The whining about the NBE is really getting old.  It's not as though we had some long standing tradition within the conference anyway - we had UConn and Syracuse as conference members for *eight* seasons.  Yep that's it.  Eight. 

Just over a decade ago we were playing conference games against the likes of East Carolina, Southern Miss and Charlotte.

We are in so much better shape now it's not even funny.  People should appreciate it.  There is a reason the C7 broke off when they did.

Not sure if this is directed at my posts or not, but I definitely wasn't whining. I honestly don't care who we play as long as the atmosphere is good (full house and rowdy crowd), we are performing well, and an important team on the national stage.

None of that has happened in recent memory. Changing SOS and conference membership is certainly part of the reason.

Are we better off now than we were in CUSA? Of course. Was the current conference the best possible outcome? Of course. Has the excitement, competition, competitiveness, and prestige of MU basketball taken a hit over the past 4 years? There can be no doubt. To deny it is to deny reality. You can tell me not to lament this reality, but you certainly can't deny it.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

All of yall need to stop living in the past. Its not the opponents that are the issue, its the fact were not winning.

You make it seem like the current Big East is a bad conference, when in reality we sent 60% of the conference to the NCAA tourney last year, and can very easily do the same again this year.

Hell, if football didnt exist, I bet you a team like Kentucky would kill to be in the Big East versus the SEC. The biggest reason I was pissed off with Bazz when he left was because of the backhanded comments on the Big East.

[Coleman]

All of yall need to stop living in the past. Its not the opponents that are the issue, its the fact were not winning.

I actually agree with you 100% on the primary cause. Our team's recent futility is certainly largest factor.

But you draw bigger crowds when you are not winning against UCONN, Louisville, and Syracuse than you do when you are not winning against Butler, Creighton and Xavier...even if all three of those teams are currently ranked.

[GGGG]

Not sure if this is directed at my posts or not, but I definitely wasn't whining. I honestly don't care who we play as long as the atmosphere is good (full house and rowdy crowd), we are performing well, and an important team on the national stage.

None of that has happened in recent memory. Changing schedule is certainly part of that reason.

Are we better off now than we were in CUSA? Of course. Was the current conference the best possible outcome? Of course. Has the excitement, competition, competitiveness, and prestige of MU basketball taken a hit over the past 4 years? There can be no doubt. To deny it is to deny reality. You can tell me not to lament this reality, but you certainly can't deny it.

It's because of the lack of tournament success.  That's it.  When we were winning in CUSA, people showed up to East Carolina.  If we were still in the OBE and losing, people wouldn't show up for Rutgers and we'd be bitching about it.

[79Warrior]

NCAA tournament or NCAA tournament championship? Point is you might miss them, but really you miss having Jim Calhoun on that sideline, sooner or later you would be ragging on UConn like they're Depaul and last time I checked nobody says anything fond about Depaul.  Remember a couple years ago when Nova hit rock bottom? Like nobody showed up for that game and it'd be the same against UConn this year. 

But hey if you want to spend you life saying "I wish things were like this still" when they can't ever go back and everybody knew they were going to fall apart anyways then go right ahead.

Interesting. I guess MU fans never bring up 1977 or Al McGuire. You are right, one can never go back. In case you are wondering, it's called tradition. They have it and so do we.

[Lennys Tap]

I don't know how many we'll play.  But there are currently 2 teams in the top 10 in the BE and we are guaranteed 2 games against them.  Plus there are 2 other teams that I think could jump into the top 10 at some point, so we could also play them at times they're ranked in the top 10.  Doubt is implied when you say, "I'd guess."  Never said, "I guarantee."  I said, "I'd guess."  So yup, there was doubt implied there.  Sorry that it took you a second post on the subject to realize it.  Once again we come upon reading comprehension issues with you.

I was responding to the idea that attendance has gone down in part because the strength of our opponents has gone down since the new BE was developed (AKA we no longer get any big name opponents or marquee matchups...my position is that any time you're playing a top 10 team it's a marquee, big name matchup), which means that last year is very relevant, since last year was new BE as opposed to old BE.  Oops?

First you "guessed" we'd play MORE top 10 teams

Then you "guessed" we'd play the same amount of top 10 teams.

My reading comprehension suggests that those two "guesses" are different.

My opinion is that they are both likely incorrect.

[wadesworld]

First you "guessed" we'd play MORE top 10 teams

Then you "guessed" we'd play the same amount of top 10 teams.

My reading comprehension suggests that those two "guesses" are different.

My opinion is that they are both likely incorrect.

I guessed we'd play more without knowing the exact number of top 10 teams we played each year in the old BE. That's why it was a guess, hence why I said, "I'd...(you *guessed* it!) guess," and not, "I know for certain..." I "guess" (note: don't know for certain, but *guessing,* though all signs point to it being true) you don't know what a *guess* is. It's when there is some *uncertainty.*

Reading comprehension really does help.

After looking at the actual *unquestionable facts* (see: no longer guessing) it turned out we actually played more games against top 10 teams last year in the new BE than we ever had in the old version. That is a *fact* and not a *guess.* No uncertainty there.

Can I spell out anything else for you Mr. Lenny?

[g0lden3agle]

Can both of you put each other on ignore and be done with the bickering?

[Galway Eagle]

Interesting. I guess MU fans never bring up 1977 or Al McGuire. You are right, one can never go back. In case you are wondering, it's called tradition. They have it and so do we.

Is that "They" referring to UConn or Depaul or Creighton? I'm going to assume it refers to UConn...

And Depaul and Creighton don't? We have loads of tradition, you are right, and yet we've sucked and I'd gaurantee we aren't exactly packing in other teams' stadiums. In fact if you want to get a slap in the face go over to HolylandofHoops and get a sense of the opinion of Marquette now. My point was that if a team with tradition is winning it's great to see them sure but UConn isn't winning and it isn't looking good for the future so why are we wasting time wishing we still played them?

[Lennys Tap]

I guessed we'd play more without knowing the exact number of top 10 teams we played each year in the old BE. That's why it was a guess. I "guess" (note: don't know for certain, but *guessing,* though all signs point to it being true) you don't know what a *guess* is. It's when there is some *uncertainty.*

Reading comprehension really does help.

I know what a guess is. My guess is that your totally and admittedly uniformed first guess  which you subsequently backpedaled from AND your new guess that you switched to once you informed yourself a little on the subject will both be wrong guesses.

Your broken record silliness about reading comprehension is as ridiculous as it's redundant. You are not confounding me or anyone else. Your points are never complex but often demonstrably false. Defending untrue facts or bad logic by claiming to be misunderstood just digs the hole deeper.

[wadesworld]

I know what a guess is. My guess is that your totally and admittedly uniformed first guess  which you subsequently backpedaled from AND your new guess that you switched to once you informed yourself a little on the subject will both be wrong guesses.

Your broken record silliness about reading comprehension is as ridiculous as it's redundant. You are not confounding me or anyone else. Your points are never complex but often demonstrably false. Defending untrue facts or bad logic by claiming to be misunderstood just digs the hole deeper.

That's what a guess is pal, so you obviously do not know what a guess is.  If you had all of the facts there would be no reason to guess.  You would know, factually.  Here, the following link may help:

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/guess?s=t

1. to arrive at or commit oneself to an opinion about (something) without having sufficient evidence to support the opinion fully

So yes, my guess was prior to "informing myself."  My stating that I was guessing should've told you this a long, long time ago because the very definition of a guess is exactly that.

And you actually got something right.  My points aren't complex at all.  I agree 100%.  The fact that you make it so difficult says everything you need to know.  You're the only Scooper who struggles with it.  Ever wonder why?

[MU Buff]

I know you two are talking about AP rankings at the time of the game but it got me thinking so I did some research on Kenpom. This is based off year end rankings and the last two columns are how many HOME games we played against top 10 and top 25 teams each season. Obviously the 2017 numbers are projections at this point.

Year	Conf	Rank	Rating	Top 10	Top 25
2002	CUSA	7	8.12	1	1
2003	CUSA	7	7.65	1	3
2004	CUSA	8	7.02	0	2
2005	CUSA	9	6.94	1	3
2006	BE	1	13.94	1	3
2007	BE	5	13.55	1	4
2008	BE	4	13.21	2	4
2009	BE	2	15.25	1	4
2010	BE	3	15.01	0	2
2011	BE	2	16.44	2	6
2012	BE	3	12.72	0	3
2013	BE	2	13.77	1	4
2014	BE	5	12.24	0	3
2015	BE	2	14.23	2	5
2016	BE	3	13.92	1	3
2017	BE	3	14.75	2	5

2010 was quite the anomaly because we only played the top teams in the Big East (Syracuse, West Virginia) on the road that year. The conference had an amazing three year run culminating with 2011 and it really struggled the first year after realignment (2014) but overall we're pretty lucky to still be in such a great conference. I know some of the schools that left have bigger fan bases so it added to the excitement of those home games but in terms of the quality of the teams coming to Milwaukee, we're doing pretty well.