Freeh Report

[🏀]

I'm not going to weigh in on the Freeh report itself and the accuracy or conclusions thereof, however for those that want vengeance in the form of the death penalty, you do realize you are creating more victims of this tragedy by such an action correct?

If you haven't been to central Pennsylvania, Penn State and the football team especially are a major if not the major cog in the financial well being of the area.  State College and the businesses in it only exist for big PSU occasions and football Saturdays.  The hotels charge $40 bucks on a normal weekend day and $240 on the Friday, Saturday and Sunday of football weekend.  You have all the restaurants and stores and then all the businesses that support those businesses.  In fact a lot of the 2nd Mile kids(J#$^Y f$%K S#@$%y's chartity) are underprivileged youth from the State College area who's parents have jobs either directly or indirectly because of Penn State.  You take away that economic cog and you are talking about thousands of innocent people being victims of this as well.

How does that help?  Its easy to run to the pitch fork and torch store, but I think the appropriate thing is to let the legal system play out and let Curley, Schultz, and Spanier get their punishment, let the victims get some measure of satisfaction from the purse of Penn State(which stays more full with football), keep awareness of this terrible issue alive every time they play, and prevent further victims from being developed.

I'd also remind you the Freeh report doesn't have all the information, there is still a lot to come out through the legal process, lets see what that holds, things could actually be worse than they imagine.

Disagree.

The fact that Penn State football is the only economic force is one of the problems. There is too much pandering to a single college sports program that allows this environment to exist.This includes these business owners unfortunately.

If your business model is entirely driven by seven weekends in the fall and not by the 45,000 student campus next door, that's your problem.

[mu03eng]

Disagree.

The fact that Penn State football is the only economic force is one of the problems. There is too much pandering to a single college sports program that allows this environment to exist.This includes these business owners unfortunately.

If your business model is entirely driven by seven weekends in the fall and not by the 45,000 student campus next door, that's your problem.

Because there is going to continue to be 45,000 students if PSU gets the death penalty.  You advocate to take down 200,000 innocents for the actions of less than a dozen

[GGGG]

Because there is going to continue to be 45,000 students if PSU gets the death penalty.  You advocate to take down 200,000 innocents for the actions of less than a dozen

Well, sometimes that has to happen.  Knock some sense into them.

If they as a fanbase were more contrite, I would agree with you.

[🏀]

Well, sometimes that has to happen.  Knock some sense into them.

If they as a fanbase were more contrite, I would agree with you.

+1

The fan base and surrounding community has done very little to separate the school from the actions of the dozen. In fact their insanity for Joe Pa has made it worse. They don't think the man did wrong.

[MUBurrow]

I don't get why the NCAA should be looked at any differently than any other market force in this situation. Sure it sucks for the people with bars and hotels if there isn't Penn State football for two years, but then again those businesses bet the farm on the system that can be taken away just this easily. I feel legitimate empathy for the people whose jobs might depend on PSU football, but if the NCAA allows that to enter its consideration, its doing exactly what we always accuse it of doing in a negative way - letting the money drive the ship. The NCAA doesn't exist to support entire college town's economics, and those indirect beneficiaries shouldn't figure into its decisionmaking process.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Well, sometimes that has to happen.  Knock some sense into them.

If they as a fanbase were more contrite, I would agree with you.

Yea, I think the internet is hurting them here. There is a loud faction of PSU and JoPa supporters that are making them look TERRIBLE right now, and it's getting repeated over and over online.

Joe Pa had too much power, and in the end, it corrupted him. Not the first guy. Not the last guy. PSU fans need to accept this and move on. Keep quite. Keep a low profile.

Unfortunately, that's not happening, and it's making them look like idiots.

[The Process]

In fact a lot of the 2nd Mile kids(J#$^Y f$%K S#@$%y's chartity) are underprivileged youth from the State College area who's parents have jobs either directly or indirectly because of Penn State.  You take away that economic cog and you are talking about thousands of innocent people being victims of this as well.

Too late, per Wikipedia:

The Second Mile is a nonprofit organization for underprivileged youth, providing help for at-risk children and support for their parents in Pennsylvania. It was founded in 1977 by Jerry Sandusky, a former Penn State assistant college football coach.[1][2][3] The charity said its youth programs serve as many as 100,000 children annually.[4] Since November 2011, the organization has been preparing to cease operations after Sandusky was charged and found guilty of child sex abuse.

...

Jack Raykovitz, the longtime president and CEO of The Second Mile, announced his resignation on November 14.[17] Under new management, the charity told The New York Times on November 18, 2011 that it was preparing to fold, with plans to transfer some programs to other charities.[18] An attorney for one of Sandusky's victims filed suit to prevent the transfer of assets,[19] and the charity soon thereafter made an announcement asking potential donors to instead give to the Pennsylvania Coalition Against Rape; programs were expected to continue at least through the end of the year.[20] On May 25, 2012, interim CEO David Woodle announced the organization had requested court approval to transfer its programs and remaining assets to Arrow Child & Family Ministries, after which The Second Mile would cease operations.[21]

Even if some programs are able to be transferred to other organizations, the odds are that there will be cuts (duplication of resources within the existing non-profits that receive the programs, etc), regardless of PSU Football getting the Death Penalty.

[Benny B]

Blah blah blah don't punish the innocent student athletes blah blah blah.

I'm sorry, but life isn't fair.  Sometimes innocent people get unwillingly caught up in situations they didn't create.  Should the SEC have let Enron off the hook because of the hundreds of employees who would lose their jobs?  Should the courts let murderers who are single-parents go free because the kids need their parent?  Should we not ban BPA because of all the Chinese chemical factory workers who might mass suicide?  If your employer is, unbeknownst to you, secretly supplying arms to Al-Qaeda, should we let it go because you'd lose your job?

If you're not going to hold someone accountable because of innocent bystanders, how do you deter this behavior in the future?

Because there is going to continue to be 45,000 students if PSU gets the death penalty.  You advocate to take down 200,000 innocents for the actions of less than a dozen

Darn straight.  Take down a million if you have to.  Society is not accountable to the innocents, Penn State is accountable to the innocents.  Society is accountable to justice being served.  If you're going to go Utilitarian here, I'll throw it right back at you by saying that not "punishing" the 200,000 "innocents" punishes the millions of society instead.  Penn State created this situation.  If the innocents want retribution, go after the University that lied to you, not the society who seeks to heal itself.

Only on Jerry Springer and in Happy Valley does it make sense to blame "the other guy" instead of dumping the sleazy whore that's been cheating on you the past twenty years.

[mu03eng]

First, the vast majority of PSU fans and alumni are deeply disappointed in Joe and especially the university but that gets lost in the few idiots that the angry mob holds up as examples of all PSU people.  This is a perfect example of how twitter and the internet have created a human hive mind....the mob has been formed and knows EXACTLY what went down and knows that the PSU are all contributors.

Second, I honestly think some of the "protective" behavior or excuse making coming from PSU is because the angry mob has backed them into a corner.  They feel attacked and are going to rally together no matter how misplaced that concept is.

Third, alumni and fans raised $500,000 in the 2 weeks following the scandal breaking, not saying its ever enough for what happened but they aren't without compassion or wanting to help.


Lastly......remind me again, does the catholic church still operate in America or did we give them the death penalty?

[Benny B]

Third, alumni and fans raised $500,000 in the 2 weeks following the scandal breaking, not saying its ever enough for what happened but they aren't without compassion or wanting to help.

If they really are compassionate, they'll take their medicine and not make a fuss. Otherwise, what they're doing isn't called compassion, it's called bribery.

[mu03eng]

If they really are compassionate, they'll take their medicine and not make a fuss. Otherwise, what they're doing isn't called compassion, it's called bribery.

Out of curiosity do you wear your judges robe with the executioners mask or is that a day of the week kind of thing?

[Spotcheck Billy]

Flying over Penn State.

[Henry Sugar]

Lastly......remind me again, does the catholic church still operate in America or did we give them the death penalty?

Well played

[Chicago_inferiority_complexes]

If you haven't been to central Pennsylvania, Penn State and the football team especially are a major if not the major cog in the financial well being of the area.  State College and the businesses in it only exist for big PSU occasions and football Saturdays. 

I couldn't care less. None of that garbage would exist were it not for the heavy subsidization by the taxpayers of the State of Pennsylvania. Cry me a river. Let's see what kind of industries would develop if the business and taxpayer climate didn't have to fund so many worthless colleges with 50% graduation rates and sports programs that generate zero revenue.

[Benny B]

Out of curiosity do you wear your judges robe with the executioners mask or is that a day of the week kind of thing?

I don't wear the mask... it doesn't go well with my mail hood & eyepatch.

[GGGG]

Lastly......remind me again, does the catholic church still operate in America or did we give them the death penalty?

What a dumb analogy.  No one is suggesting that the University close...just that the athletic department may have run afoul of NCAA bylaws.

[Henry Sugar]

What a dumb analogy.  No one is suggesting that the University close...just that the athletic department may have run afoul of NCAA bylaws.

I love the analogy because it helps re-frame the appropriate level of outrage at PSU. If we are "X" upset with PSU, then how upset should we be with the Catholic Church?

[🏀]

I love the analogy because it helps re-frame the appropriate level of outrage at PSU. If we are "X" upset with PSU, then how upset should we be with the Catholic Church?

The analogy is a stretch because the Catholic Church isn't a government funded place of education. I have no interest in defending the Catholic Church, and those priests are hopefully getting pounded in jail.

[Benny B]

I love the analogy because it helps re-frame the appropriate level of outrage at PSU. If we are "X" upset with PSU, then how upset should we be with the Catholic Church?

I can't understand why any rational person would be enraged by Penn State's football program being shut down after what was known about the Sandusky string of events.  As a Catholic, I want to see guilty priests and their conspirators brought to justice.  It doesn't enrage me at all that victims' advocate groups are now doing the same thing to many dioceses (in a financial sense) that these priests did to their victims (in the literal sense).

[GGGG]

I love the analogy because it helps re-frame the appropriate level of outrage at PSU. If we are "X" upset with PSU, then how upset should we be with the Catholic Church?

I am much more upset with the Catholic Church than I am at PSU.  But you can't "shut down" the Catholic Church....you can shut down Penn State football.

[mu03eng]

I am much more upset with the Catholic Church than I am at PSU.  But you can't "shut down" the Catholic Church....you can shut down Penn State football.

But you can shut down churches an diosces

[mu03eng]

The analogy is a stretch because the Catholic Church isn't a government funded place of education. I have no interest in defending the Catholic Church, and those priests are hopefully getting pounded in jail.

Catholic church is tax exempt so in a real way federally funded and a lot of the churches have schools

[Chicago_inferiority_complexes]

But you can shut down churches an diosces

This might be the first time I've come across an instance on the internet where Godwin's law would not apply.

[The Process]

This might be the first time I've come across an instance on the internet where Godwin's law would not apply.

Umm...

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/YssMT0qXYOw" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" class="bbc_link bbc_flash_disabled new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/YssMT0qXYOw</a>

and

Nothing to do with PSU, but there's an interesting book that investigates that issue.  The author's claim is that one of the primary reason the Nazi's were so interested in animal welfare, (and nature, in general) was to justify their opinions on the superiority of races.  A predator kills the biologically inferior.

Animals in the Third Reich: Pets, Scapegoats, and the Holocaust by Boria Sax
http://www.amazon.com/Animals-Third-Reich-Scapegoats-Holocaust/dp/0826414087

Just might be applicable under Godwin's Law...

[Chicago_inferiority_complexes]

Umm...

and

Just might be applicable under Godwin's Law...

Damn, forgot about that post.