Woj Coaching Context

[DegenerateDish]

Some context of where Woj is at in his coaching career:

Here's the list of Power 5 coaches + Big East with at least 60 career coaching wins at their current program (so they have been there through a full four recruiting classes) and zero NCAA tournament wins in their career is this: Tim Miles, Danny Manning, Pat Chambers, Jim Christian, and Wojo.

Of the names above, it's rumored Miles will be fired, and Wake Forest, BC, and Penn State all had to go out of their way to issue statements that their coaches would return next season.

[NickelDimer]

Oooooooooh boy

[Silent Verbal]

My goodness, that’s an ugly list of bad basketball programs.

Here’s something else:  In another thread, it was mentioned that UW had made it out of the first round in 11 of their last 12 tourney appearances.  For Purdue, it’s 17 of 19.  But yeah, the tournament is a crapshoot, it depends who you play, and getting your ass kicked is in no way an indictment of the coach or the program he’s built.

[DegenerateDish]

Also failed to mention that Chris Mullin is one win short of making this list (career record is 59-73).

[NickelDimer]

Also failed to mention that Chris Mullin is one win short of making this list (career record is 59-73).

Phew. I feel much better now.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Miles won a Blue & Gold Classic banner over Crean, though.

[Aircraftcarrier]

Fire Tony Bennett.He is losing to a 16 seed again.MU Dish the difference is Wojo program has been trending up since he came to MU and the others you mentioned are trending down.You can spin it to fit your needs.

[Aircraftcarrier]

Fire Bruce Weber he just lost to a 13 seed.

[wadesworld]

Seems like an odd stat. Current P6 head coaches with 60 or more wins at their current job. But then count NCAA Tournament wins from previous jobs.

And guys like Bobby Hurley get a HUGE NCAA Tournament win (see: play in game) so they get off of that list.

[LAZER]

Some context of where Woj is at in his coaching career:

Here's the list of Power 5 coaches + Big East with at least 60 career coaching wins at their current program (so they have been there through a full four recruiting classes) and zero NCAA tournament wins in their career is this: Tim Miles, Danny Manning, Pat Chambers, Jim Christian, and Wojo.

Of the names above, it's rumored Miles will be fired, and Wake Forest, BC, and Penn State all had to go out of their way to issue statements that their coaches would return next season.

None of them were 5 seeds and won 24 games this season and bring everyone back next year.  Kinda apples and oranges.

[rocky_warrior]

Yeah.  Just say "fire wojo" if it's what you're thinking.  No need to create stats that aren't relevant and are misleading.

Again, firing a winning coach (70% this season) is a recipe for disaster.  If Wojo was in the 50ish % category and trending down, this would be an easy argument.  But he's trending up, whether he's won an NCAA game yet or not...

[BM1090]

None of them were 5 seeds and won 24 games this season and bring everyone back next year.  Kinda apples and oranges.

Yep. If Marquette had seasons like any of those programs this year, I don't think a single person would want Wojo to be here. Pointless comparison. Just as pointless as the ones comparing Wojo to K or Wright.

[Mike Deane's Seat Belt]

watching bucky go past us while we sit at home and contemplate next year in the tourney year after year is getting really old. 

The Wisconsin program went on an exponential stock rise to their final appearance and they have maintained respectable performances since with what? Its quite amazing what that program has done in the last say 20 years, 

Heres hoping the ducks pull out the upset. 

[BM1090]

watching bucky go past us while we sit at home and contemplate next year in the tourney year after year is getting really old. 

The Wisconsin program went on an exponential stock rise to their final appearance and they have maintained respectable performances since with what? Its quite amazing what that program has done in the last say 20 years, 

Heres hoping the ducks pull out the upset.

If they lose today you could easily argue we've been better than them for 2 straight years. If they win, they definitely had a better year.

[rocky_warrior]

watching bucky go past us while we sit at home and contemplate next year in the tourney year after year is getting really old. 

I think we're finally getting to the heart of the issue - at least for MU fans residing in WI.  Recent performance relative to the Badgers has been disappointing. 

My suggestion...move out of WI!

[CleanishProgram]

I think we're finally getting to the heart of the issue - at least for MU fans residing in WI.  Recent performance relative to the Badgers has been disappointing. 

My suggestion...move out of WI!

Cool, I did, I live in Connecticut.

So I guess I can say it loud and clear with no semblance of hypocrisy!

FIRE WOEFUL

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Yeah.  Just say "fire wojo" if it's what you're thinking.  No need to create stats that aren't relevant and are misleading.

Again, firing a winning coach (70% this season) is a recipe for disaster.  If Wojo was in the 50ish % category and trending down, this would be an easy argument.  But he's trending up, whether he's won an NCAA game yet or not...

This really is it. There is zero chance he gets fired and no one that I can tell is even remotely suggesting it nationally. Marquette would be considered insane.

Again next year if they trend down or even maintain - yeah. 

[NickelDimer]

I think in reality very few think he should be fired now

[Goose]

Nickel
I think his leash should be awfully short. IMO there has not been enough bang for the buck. I have nothing against Wojo as a person, just think he is in over his head on most fronts. His recruiting is decent, but helter smelter thus far. I don’t care how he got Henry or the Hausers because he got them and kudo’s on that. Aside from Howard, I do not see another top D1 player recruited that could be a four year player.

[Dr. Blackheart]

I think in reality very few think he should be fired now

And, those vociferous voices yesterday that were here expounding the firing are watching their beloved Badgers right now.

[NickelDimer]

Nickel
I think his leash should be awfully short. IMO there has not been enough bang for the buck. I have nothing against Wojo as a person, just think he is in over his head on most fronts. His recruiting is decent, but helter smelter thus far. I don’t care how he got Henry or the Hausers because he got them and kudo’s on that. Aside from Howard, I do not see another top D2 player recruited that could be a four year player.

Agree Goose. And I predict next year may be his last. That will be his best team on paper but the conference will be better and he hasn’t shown he knows how to prepare his team for the tourney. Those last several games we saw teams in tourney mode and we couldn’t match it.

[rocky_warrior]

Agree Goose. And I predict next year may be his last.

Sad part about that, is that you're predicting it, and probably hoping for it.

I hope he does well, and I think next year MU will put together what fans hoped they could put together this year when they were 23-4.

[NickelDimer]

Sad part about that, is that you're predicting it, and probably hoping for it.

I hope he does well, and I think next year MU will put together what fans hoped they could put together this year when they were 23-4.

That’s just a really dumb thing to say. Youre better than that

[Babybluejeans]

Fire Bruce Weber he just lost to a 13 seed.

Actually, Bruce Weber undermines your point. KSU lost in the first round to a 13 seed and that sucks, but they went to the Elite Eight last year. Wojo has been here 5 years and we haven't done anything in the tourney but get blown out in the first round (if we make it at all). 'Tis the fundamental difference.

[rocky_warrior]

That’s just a really dumb thing to say. Youre better than that

What's dumb about it?

You said..."predict next year may be his last...he hasn’t shown he knows how to prepare his team for the tourney...".

So you're really saying you hope Wojo recovers from this year and does better next year???

[NickelDimer]

What's dumb about it?

You said..."predict next year may be his last...he hasn’t shown he knows how to prepare his team for the tourney...".

So you're really saying you hope Wojo recovers from this year and does better next year???

That you’d accuse a fan of hoping for the failure of their team. Silly. I hope Wojo turns out to be the greatest basketball coach in NCAA history and brings multiple titles to MU. Is that a real question?

[wadesworld]

Actually, Bruce Weber undermines your point. KSU lost in the first round to a 13 seed and that sucks, but they went to the Elite Eight last year. Wojo has been here 5 years and we haven't done anything in the tourney but get blown out in the first round (if we make it at all). 'Tis the fundamental difference.

Yup. Webber went to the Elite Eight last season, his sixth year at KState. Can you guess how many NCAA Tournament wins he had at KState in his first 5 seasons? 🤭

[Goose]

Rocky
I sure hope no one hopes Wojo fails and gets fired and I do not believe that. Wojo bring successful is the best option out there. I sure he still knocks out of the park, but just hoping that does not mean it will happen. He has every tool possible at his fingertips and it is up to him.
Stating an opinion on what might happen on negative side has no less value than the glass is half full crowd. I find it frustrating that only pro Wojo comments are considered to be truthful on here.

[rocky_warrior]

Is that a real question?

Actually, I believe a decent number of MU fans don't like Wojo mostly because he came from Duke and think he brings in too many white players.  They don't hope for MU failure, but certainly hope Wojo is gone sooner than later, and losing would accomplish that.

Sorry to peg that on you, it's hard to keep track of why people are being negative

[NickelDimer]

Actually, I believe a decent number of MU fans don't like Wojo mostly because he came from Duke and think he brings in too many white players.  They don't hope for MU failure, but certainly hope Wojo is gone sooner than later, and losing would accomplish that.

Sorry to peg that on you, it's hard to keep track of why people are being negative

All good Rocky. Any true Marquette fan that dislikes Wojo for whatever reason would quickly learn to like him if he won big. I have no doubt about that.

Although now that you say it I do seem to remember feeling like some, or one fan rooted against MU because they disliked Buzz. So maybe those peeps do exist?

[warriorfred]

Is this a private fight or can anyone join?

Everyone wishes Wojo would be a raging success and Marquette would be hangin banners to infinity.

Unfortunately, the product on the floor after 5 years has been a disappointment (see in re O'Neill Success).

I do not see enough development to warrant the continued Wojo experiment.

[Goose]

Rocky
This fan loves he came from Duke, the most successful program over past 25 years. That is a major positive. Recruiting white guys? The three best players, IMO, he has recruited are white guys. Add a couple of very good grad transfers and best guys, aside from Howard, he brought into program. While I would recruit differently, anyone that is against recruiting white guys is a frickin idiot.

[rocky_warrior]

So maybe those peeps do exist?

All kinds of crazy on the internet!

[NickelDimer]

All kinds of crazy on the internet!

Someone should sell tickets eh?

[Dr. Blackheart]

On KSU, just to note that they were without their best player.

[willie warrior]

Sad part about that, is that you're predicting it, and probably hoping for it.

I hope he does well, and I think next year MU will put together what fans hoped they could put together this year when they were 23-4.

Yeah. And then they crapped the bed to 24-10.

[Loose Cannon]

watching bucky go past us while we sit at home and contemplate next year in the tourney year after year is getting really old. 

.

No worries Mate, they lost 72-54.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Some context of where Woj is at in his coaching career:

Here's the list of Power 5 coaches + Big East with at least 60 career coaching wins at their current program (so they have been there through a full four recruiting classes) and zero NCAA tournament wins in their career is this: Tim Miles, Danny Manning, Pat Chambers, Jim Christian, and Wojo.

Of the names above, it's rumored Miles will be fired, and Wake Forest, BC, and Penn State all had to go out of their way to issue statements that their coaches would return next season.

As others have pointed out, really odd misleading sate. But the obvious difference I see between Wojo and all of those listed? Wojo's teams have been trending up. Their teams have been trending down.

[muguru]

Here's a stat on Wojo that ISN'T misleading...he is the ONLY coach Besides Mike Deane(and he was fired within 48 hours after failing to do so) that coached at MU at least 5 years with no sweet 16's in those 5 years. He is also the ONLY one of those Coaches without a tournament win within 5 years. Beyond no tournament wins, the two tournament losses under Wojo have been in the top 6 worst margins in MU history.

What F'n more does the admin need to see?? There is NO disputing based on that alone, he is the worst Coach in MU history after 5 years on the job. This guy deserves to keep his job, why??

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Here's a stat on Wojo that ISN'T misleading...he is the ONLY coach Besides Mike Deane(and he was fired within 48 hours after failing to do so) that coached at MU at least 5 years with no sweet 16's in those 5 years. He is also the ONLY one of those Coaches without a tournament win within 5 years. Beyond no tournament wins, the two tournament losses under Wojo have been in the top 6 worst margins in MU history.

What F'n more does the admin need to see?? There is NO disputing based on that alone, he is the worst Coach in MU history after 5 years on the job. This guy deserves to keep his job, why??

Because they’ve largely improved each year and he has done so without recruiting issues or players who are getting in trouble. Of course they want him to lead MU to the Final Four, but they aren’t going to fire him after this season.

[Cheeks]

Here's a stat on Wojo that ISN'T misleading...he is the ONLY coach Besides Mike Deane(and he was fired within 48 hours after failing to do so) that coached at MU at least 5 years with no sweet 16's in those 5 years. He is also the ONLY one of those Coaches without a tournament win within 5 years. Beyond no tournament wins, the two tournament losses under Wojo have been in the top 6 worst margins in MU history.

What F'n more does the admin need to see?? There is NO disputing based on that alone, he is the worst Coach in MU history after 5 years on the job. This guy deserves to keep his job, why??

When Hank went to the Sweet 16, you only had to win one game to get there.  Pacific, the team we beat, was 14-11, including 11-10 to start their conference tournament (the PCAA) which they won.  Same for Nagle and Hickey. 

As stated with data last week, trending in right direction, program is clean, that's what the admin needs to see and is seeing.  Record attendance this year....people going to games. 

This is not updated yet, but won't change dramatically.  Line says it all (in this case, lower means better).

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Here's a stat on Wojo that ISN'T misleading...he is the ONLY coach Besides Mike Deane(and he was fired within 48 hours after failing to do so) that coached at MU at least 5 years with no sweet 16's in those 5 years. He is also the ONLY one of those Coaches without a tournament win within 5 years. Beyond no tournament wins, the two tournament losses under Wojo have been in the top 6 worst margins in MU history.

Bob Dukiet?
Rick Majerus?
Eddie Hickey?
Tex Winter?

Did MU history start with KO?

What F'n more does the admin need to see?? There is NO disputing based on that alone, he is the worst Coach in MU history after 5 years on the job. This guy deserves to keep his job, why??

I don't think there's any argument that puts Wojo's tenure below Bob Dukiet, Mike Deane, Rick Majerus, Eddie Hickey, Jack Nagle, or Tex Winter's tenure at Marquette.

We'll see if he passes any of the others

[DegenerateDish]

I’m not sure how the stat is misleading. It’s pretty straight forward. A lot of coaches with over 4 years experience in power conferences have won an NCAA game. Purposely not including newer coaches would be dumb. You three that said it was misleading are all usually smart posters here too.

Listen, I like Woj. I have his cell # in my phone. He’s a genuinely good guy. From a coaching perspective, he’s got work to do, and quick.

[muguru]

Bob Dukiet?
Rick Majerus?
Eddie Hickey?
Tex Winter?

Did MU history start with KO?

I don't think there's any argument that puts Wojo's tenure below Bob Dukiet, Mike Deane, Rick Majerus, Eddie Hickey, Jack Nagle, or Tex Winter's tenure at Marquette.



We'll see if he passes any of the others

Tamu, if you re read what i said, I said of ANY Coach that was at MU at LEAST 5 years. Dukiet was not, Majerus was not, Tex was not, and Eddie Hickey made the tournament twice...although it was much smaller then...but he still made it twice. Even Deane had a tournament win within 5 years.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Tamu, if you re read what i said, I said of ANY Coach that was at MU at LEAST 5 years. Dukiet was not, Majerus was not, Tex was not, and Eddie Hickey made the tournament twice...although it was much smaller then...but he still made it twice. Even Deane had a tournament win within 5 years.

Ah I see what, you were saying. I misunderstood you.

Even so, your second paragraph was still ridiculous.

[Jon]

Fire Tony Bennett.

Fire me? What the f#ck did I do to this punk Aircraftcarrier?

[wadesworld]

I’m not sure how the stat is misleading. It’s pretty straight forward. A lot of coaches with over 4 years experience in power conferences have won an NCAA game. Purposely not including newer coaches would be dumb. You three that said it was misleading are all usually smart posters here too.

Listen, I like Woj. I have his cell # in my phone. He’s a genuinely good guy. From a coaching perspective, he’s got work to do, and quick.

I just don’t know how much better I’d feel about Wojo or the program had our game against St. John’s last Thursday been an NCAA Tournament play in game like Bobby Hurley’s one nice NCAA Tournament win was.

[MUHoopsFan2]

I’m not sure how the stat is misleading. It’s pretty straight forward. A lot of coaches with over 4 years experience in power conferences have won an NCAA game. Purposely not including newer coaches would be dumb. You three that said it was misleading are all usually smart posters here too.

Listen, I like Woj. I have his cell # in my phone. He’s a genuinely good guy. From a coaching perspective, he’s got work to do, and quick.

No he doesn't really. I think Wojo bashers ARE OVERREACTING.

 Most of the losses were close...they improved vastly defensively and they got the most out of what they had and played hard. Come on now! Until January they led the Big East!

His only issue to me was is guard play over the long haul. Losing Greg hurt and he did not believe in or trust Cain [which was a mistake if you ask me.] and Chartouny gave him nothing and Bailey was not quite ready to play as many minutes he was forced to give him.

It was small minor things that derailed things that was no big deal., They are not going to be worse next year or at all. But it depends. I say next year they can win the Big East.     

[jaygall31]

Can we all agree he's just an awful game coach.

[willie warrior]

When Hank went to the Sweet 16, you only had to win one game to get there.  Pacific, the team we beat, was 14-11, including 11-10 to start their conference tournament (the PCAA) which they won.  Same for Nagle and Hickey. 

As stated with data last week, trending in right direction, program is clean, that's what the admin needs to see and is seeing.  Record attendance this year....people going to games. 

This is not updated yet, but won't change dramatically.  Line says it all (in this case, lower means better).

Impressed with this Cheeks. BOT will be also. Probably prepared by Wojo's power point guru.