S2N?

[MU82]

Great thread so far, folks!

I mostly agree with wades' comparison of Sam to Henry. Obviously, I don't agree with "100x," but I realize that is just a "wades-ism." Even if somebody is only 1% better at something, wades likes to say 100x.

As to the point, though, I agree that Sam is a better shooter and a much better defender than Henry.

The comparison with Korver doesn't work all that well for me because I think Sam has potential to be a much better defender, but Sam doesn't get his shot up as quickly as Korver does. Korver really has the ability to catch and shoot before a defender can close on him, whereas Sam has to wind up a little bit. Quickening his release, even a little, will make Sam even more dangerous offensively. Sam does release it nice and high, though, and with his height that does help make it difficult to defend.

I have compared Sam to Calbert Cheaney, and I'm sticking with that. Super steady, ability to do everything decently to very well, not spectacular at anything - although Sam could end up being that in the shooting department, which would make him very attractive to NBA teams.

I mean, Novak stuck around forever, and Sam is 100x more athletic than he ever was!

[MUfan12]

Sam’s legit, butt da Association is a hoe different game. Gotta improve both his quickness and strength. Non-conference stats=no matta. Let’s cee ‘im strap it on and put his big boy pants on against betta comp, ai na?

Dis rite heere.

[Nukem2]

Sam’s legit, butt da Association is a hoe different game. Gotta improve both his quickness and strength. Non-conference stats=no matta. Let’s cee ‘im strap it on and put his big boy pants on against betta comp, ai na?

Dem rodents dunnot ware big boy pants   

[muwarrior69]

Not for another 2 years....I hope.

[MUBurrow]

Isn't a guy like Sam Dekker a better comp for Hauser than someone like Henry? Henry's build is broader, and his foot speed will always be lacking - he's more of a lumbering type that would mold after a poor man's Dirk.  But Hauser and Dekker are each listed as about 6'7" and 220. If Sam is looking at the NBA, I think he's got to read what GMs were saying on Dekker coming out - they really liked his athleticism and explosiveness if memory serves. So I think Sam has got to keep getting stronger and work on his first dribble/blow by.  Certainly possible, but he's got a ways to go.

From an MU perspective, I think developing that part of his game would also help the team a ton. Sam is great, but he has a tendency to pick up fouls and to disappear at times. Continuing to improve foot speed and strength would help him move his feet on D to avoid fouls, and would give him another offensive weapon to make him a little less reliant on the outside shot (though that midrange game has come along nicely).

[GGGG]

Isn't a guy like Sam Dekker a better comp for Hauser than someone like Henry? Henry's build is broader, and his foot speed will always be lacking - he's more of a lumbering type that would mold after a poor man's Dirk.  But Hauser and Dekker are each listed as about 6'7" and 220. If Sam is looking at the NBA, I think he's got to read what GMs were saying on Dekker coming out - they really liked his athleticism and explosiveness if memory serves. So I think Sam has got to keep getting stronger and work on his first dribble/blow by.  Certainly possible, but he's got a ways to go.

From an MU perspective, I think developing that part of his game would also help the team a ton. Sam is great, but he has a tendency to pick up fouls and to disappear at times. Continuing to improve foot speed and strength would help him move his feet on D to avoid fouls, and would give him another offensive weapon to make him a little less reliant on the outside shot (though that midrange game has come along nicely).

Dekker is more athletic than Sam but nowhere near the shooter.  I think Calbert Cheney is the best example I have seen so far.

[wadesworld]

Isn't a guy like Sam Dekker a better comp for Hauser than someone like Henry? Henry's build is broader, and his foot speed will always be lacking - he's more of a lumbering type that would mold after a poor man's Dirk.  But Hauser and Dekker are each listed as about 6'7" and 220. If Sam is looking at the NBA, I think he's got to read what GMs were saying on Dekker coming out - they really liked his athleticism and explosiveness if memory serves. So I think Sam has got to keep getting stronger and work on his first dribble/blow by.  Certainly possible, but he's got a ways to go.

From an MU perspective, I think developing that part of his game would also help the team a ton. Sam is great, but he has a tendency to pick up fouls and to disappear at times. Continuing to improve foot speed and strength would help him move his feet on D to avoid fouls, and would give him another offensive weapon to make him a little less reliant on the outside shot (though that midrange game has come along nicely).

I wasn't trying to compare Henry and Sam, I was simply saying that people who want to disqualify Sam because he "can't defend anybody" in the NBA need only look at our most recent NBAer to see Sam's defense is already much, much better than at least one NBA player.

Dekker will never be able to dream of being the shooter that Hauser is, but Dekker is a lot more athletic than Hauser.

I think Sam has gotten much better at playing without fouling.  Off the top of my head, the only game I remember him being in foul trouble this year was Wichita State.

[MU82]

Isn't a guy like Sam Dekker a better comp for Hauser than someone like Henry? Henry's build is broader, and his foot speed will always be lacking - he's more of a lumbering type that would mold after a poor man's Dirk.  But Hauser and Dekker are each listed as about 6'7" and 220. If Sam is looking at the NBA, I think he's got to read what GMs were saying on Dekker coming out - they really liked his athleticism and explosiveness if memory serves. So I think Sam has got to keep getting stronger and work on his first dribble/blow by.  Certainly possible, but he's got a ways to go.

From an MU perspective, I think developing that part of his game would also help the team a ton. Sam is great, but he has a tendency to pick up fouls and to disappear at times. Continuing to improve foot speed and strength would help him move his feet on D to avoid fouls, and would give him another offensive weapon to make him a little less reliant on the outside shot (though that midrange game has come along nicely).

I like this comment a lot, Burrow.

I don't want what I've been saying misconstrued. I am not saying Sam could leave today and play in the NBA (though I'm not saying he couldn't). Sam is still a work in progress - as almost all kids his age are, even those who made the jump to the NBA. For every LeBron, there are plenty of Noah Vonlehs - and, yes, Henry Ellensons (and so far Sam Dekkers).

Agree totally that Sam needs to get stronger and, if possible, more athletic. But don't discount how much the NBA values shooters. Sam is a much better shooter than Dekker.

And yes, he does tend to disappear at times - sometimes because our little guys are playing keep-away but sometimes because he's not being aggressive enough. And he still does pick up fouls that are far too stupid for somebody of his basketball IQ.

You're also so right about his midrange game. He's actually pretty darn good at posting up and either taking the 10-footer from the angle or going into the lane for a short jumper. Good from the FTL area, too. He doesn't look to do that enough. There were two situations in yesterday's game that stick in my mind: once, he got a rebound in the lane but rather than even think about turning and taking the 7-footer, he passed out to a 3-point shooter, who missed; the other time, he had his man about 12 feet from the hoop but instead of rising over him, he passed out, repositioned at the arc, got a return pass and hit the 3. The first time, he was being "too unselfish" and it might of cost us 2 points; the second I guess he just wasn't "feelin' it," and it ended up getting us 3.

I also agree with 4ever (I think) about the BE season really being the test of how much Sam has improved and how far he has to go. Eye tink dat's wot 4ever wuz sayink.

Finally, I'll agree with those who have said stuff like, "Wow, is Joey really better than Sam?" Because that would be amazing. I have not seen one second of Joey playing basketball.

I'll stick by what I said about Sam in my OP: He needs to stop improving so damn much or else he won't be here for 4 years!

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

I think Sam is closer to 6-11 than 6-7. 

[GGGG]

The biggest reason why Sam seems to "disappear" in games is because he really can't create his own shot all that well.  He relies on people getting him in the ball in situations to score.  Now he's really smart about knowing where to be, but he isn't putting it on the floor and getting to the basket on his own.

Dekker OTOH could do that.

[MU82]

The biggest reason why Sam seems to "disappear" in games is because he really can't create his own shot all that well.  He relies on people getting him in the ball in situations to score.  Now he's really smart about knowing where to be, but he isn't putting it on the floor and getting to the basket on his own.

Dekker OTOH could do that.

Something else for Sam to improve at.

[Galway Eagle]

Dekker OTOH could do that.

When he isn’t tripping over himself

[MUBurrow]

Totally agree with everyone pointing out that Hauser's shooting ability vs Dekker's athletic, off the dribble ability probably reduce the value of the comp.  Probably a little lazy on my part in the mold that pftcommenter usually makes fun of, to be honest :/  For what little its worth, I just pulled the height/weights off the first google search results that came up and they had Hauser at 6'8" and Dekker at 6'7". 

I'd definitely rather start from having Hauser's range and having to develop the explosiveness for today's NBA, so that's a major plus for (our) Sam.

[onepost]

Being from Omaha and growing up a Jays fan, I've always likened Sam to Doug McDermott.  Granted, Doug started with a phenomenal inside game and worked his way out to be a lethal 3-point shooter, and Sam started with incredible 3-point shooting and is working his way down with post-ups and a midrange game.

The main similarity between the two is that they always make (made* in Doug's case) the right play.  Always.  As has been stated here, Sam can almost be too unselfish at times, but he always makes the correct extra pass, always swings it when the defense dictates such, never takes a bad shot, and is seemingly always in the right spot at the right time.  The craziest thing about watching Doug was thinking he'd had an OK game, then looking up and seeing he had 27 and 8: Sam is the exact same.  They're two of the most "quiet" scorers I've ever watched at this level.  3's, midrange post-ups/lay-ups, free throws.  And hardly ever putting the ball on the ground.  Not NEARLY as exciting as Markus and Rowsey, but even more effective IMO.

Plus, I get the same feeling with Sam that I did with Doug in that "we're never out of a game with him on the floor / this guy won't let us lose".  That Eastern Illinois game, and to a lesser extent NIU, had awful upset written all over it, but Sam single-handedly willed us to OT.  Buzz's teams when I was at MU would have surely lost that kind of game (UW-GB), but with Sam (and certainly Markus too) you know you're not gonna suffer those bad losses.  Which is such a luxury to have given our bubble status since he's been here.  I loved Sam's game last year, but it wasn't until that scrimmage against Milwaukee at the Al that I really thought he had a legit shot at the NBA: he was even taller than I remembered, put on a good amount of muscle, and dictated the entire game.  My confidence in that has only grown as the season has gone on.  I could absolutely see him ending up in a system like San Antonio where people groan "how'd everyone else pass on this guy?"

[4everwarriors]

Better than that kid who went from Milwaukee Hamilton out to Westwood on his way to Oakland, ai'na?

As far as I no, Sam hasn’t had hip surgery and subsequently miss nearly an entire professional season because of it, hey?

[skianth16]

Sam's game isn't much different from Novak's as far as I can tell. Both guys are/were great at taking advantage of the opportunities given to them but not so great at creating their own shot. Novak was also viewed as not being as athletic as most of the guys in the NBA, but was still able to play good enough defense, mostly from being a smart player, to not really get burned much. I think this is very much like Sam today as well. If anything, Sam is a little quicker and is more versatile on defense. Plus, I think Sam has a better inside game than Novak did in college.

If he keeps improving the way he has in the last 2 years, he'll have a shot at getting drafted or making a team somewhere. He's a guy that could do well in the right system as a role player, but he could also struggle in the wrong system. Sam could easily be a Jeremy Lin type guy where he blows up for a year or two with the right opportunity. All that said, I'd be willing to bet a significant sum that he's a 4 year guy no matter what. He needs to improve his quickness and defense, and he needs to show that he's not just a perimeter catch and shoot player. The NBA loves potential, and if Sam is too one-dimensional, he may have trouble convincing teams to take a shot on him. Plus, he'll have Joey here with him beginning next year, and I can easily see that being another reason for him sticking around all 4 years even if he gets some interest from the pros.

[wadesworld]

Being from Omaha and growing up a Jays fan, I've always likened Sam to Doug McDermott.  Granted, Doug started with a phenomenal inside game and worked his way out to be a lethal 3-point shooter, and Sam started with incredible 3-point shooting and is working his way down with post-ups and a midrange game.

The main similarity between the two is that they always make (made* in Doug's case) the right play.  Always.  As has been stated here, Sam can almost be too unselfish at times, but he always makes the correct extra pass, always swings it when the defense dictates such, never takes a bad shot, and is seemingly always in the right spot at the right time.  The craziest thing about watching Doug was thinking he'd had an OK game, then looking up and seeing he had 27 and 8: Sam is the exact same.  They're two of the most "quiet" scorers I've ever watched at this level.  3's, midrange post-ups/lay-ups, free throws.  And hardly ever putting the ball on the ground.  Not NEARLY as exciting as Markus and Rowsey, but even more effective IMO.

Plus, I get the same feeling with Sam that I did with Doug in that "we're never out of a game with him on the floor / this guy won't let us lose".  That Eastern Illinois game, and to a lesser extent NIU, had awful upset written all over it, but Sam single-handedly willed us to OT.  Buzz's teams when I was at MU would have surely lost that kind of game (UW-GB), but with Sam (and certainly Markus too) you know you're not gonna suffer those bad losses.  Which is such a luxury to have given our bubble status since he's been here.  I loved Sam's game last year, but it wasn't until that scrimmage against Milwaukee at the Al that I really thought he had a legit shot at the NBA: he was even taller than I remembered, put on a good amount of muscle, and dictated the entire game.  My confidence in that has only grown as the season has gone on.  I could absolutely see him ending up in a system like San Antonio where people groan "how'd everyone else pass on this guy?"

I have thought Doug as well, but more for their efficiency moving around the court.  No wasted movement at all.  They know how to set themselves up for an open shot by being a screener for someone else, etc.  Very good at understanding how they are being defended and knowing how to counter it when they are off the ball.  Pick and slip vs. pick and pop, etc.

[GB Warrior]

Most encouraging thing about Sam's game is that he added the pump fake and ability to dip inside for contested midrange jumpers that he's hitting regularly. If he adds one element to his game each year he's here, his ceiling is better than Novak. He shows hints of having a back-to-the-basket game.

[GooooMarquette]

Dem rodents dunnot ware big boy pants   

Dey be wearin' dere manzieres?

[MarquetteDano]

Sam is our best all around player no question.

Though for the NBA a tweener.... too small to guard the "4", and too slow to guard the "3".  He may get a cup of coffee in the NBA but I would shocked if anything more.

See a prosperous career in the Europe if he wants it.

[mufvr]

Compare Sam’s game today to Butler’s when he was a sophomore.  Sam’s a great kid and the sky is the limit.  We’re fortunate to have him!

[Hards Alumni]

Compare Sam’s game today to Butler’s when he was a sophomore.  Sam’s a great kid and the sky is the limit.  We’re fortunate to have him!

Defense is night and day on your comparison.

Don't see it at all.

[Galway Eagle]

Defense is night and day on your comparison.

Don't see it at all.

Was butler a good defender his first two years? I remember an interview where he said he blames himself for letting pondexter beat us and had worked on his defense all summer going into his senior year

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

I feel like Sam could be one of those players the Spurs draft late in the second round, everybody laughs it off, but becomes a serviceable role player that shouldn't be as good as he is.

One thing is for certain though, both Markus and Sam could put quite a dent in the Marquette record books over the next few years.

[muwarrior69]

Sam is our best all around player no question.

Though for the NBA a tweener.... too small to guard the "4", and too slow to guard the "3".  He may get a couple of coffee in the NBA but I would shocked if anything more.

See a prosperous career in the Europe if he wants it.

FIFY, because Sam does not play "hero" ball. He is the consummate team player.