Are Baseball Players Back On The Juice?

[Tugg Speedman]

Don't look now, but Major League Baseball players are hitting balls out of parks at a rate not seen since the peak of the steroid era.

With about one-fourth of the season gone, there are 18 players on pace to hit at least 40 home runs. At this same point last year, there were ten players on pace and nine finished with 40. In the last 30 years, there has never been a season with more than 17 players with at least 40 home runs.

In addition, 2.8% of all plate appearances have ended in a home run so far this season. That is on pace for the highest rate since 2006, which was the first year of MLB's new drug-testing policy.

[ChitownSpaceForRent]

Doubt it. Pitchers are probably just off of it if anything.

[wadesworld]

Straight steroids like it was in the prime of juicing?  No.  PEDs?  Absolutely.  It never stopped.

[MUsoxfan]

Of course they are. They always have been. Too much money involved for them not to be

[tower912]

Possibly.   Also possible that the balls are wound a little tighter.   Also possible that the current hitting philosophy that doesn't worry about strikeouts and doesn't settle for singles is playing a role.    Or all of the above. 

[brandx]

Possibly.   Also possible that the balls are wound a little tighter.   Also possible that the current hitting philosophy that doesn't worry about strikeouts and doesn't settle for singles is playing a role.    Or all of the above.

I think you hit on it right there. Batting Average is down 10-15 points from what it was in the steroid era.

Pitching philosophy and the increase in the speed of fastballs also play into it a little.

In 2013, fewer home runs were hit than in any year since 1995. In 2014, even fewer HRs were hit than in 2013. In 2015, the 6th lowest number of HR were hit since '95.

[Lennys Tap]

Doubt it. Pitchers are probably just off of it if anything.

Mediocre middle relievers throwing 95+ - so probably not.

[MU82]

Orange, grapefruit or apple?

[rocky_warrior]

Orange, grapefruit or apple?

Açaí - it's a super fruit.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Global warming....ball travels farther in warm weather.  Look it up

[forgetful]

Of course they are. They always have been. Too much money involved for them not to be

This was my thought.  Did anyone really think they stopped taking PEDs?

[Blackhat]

Pretty sure Trout is on some HGH.   No doubt on Arietta.  We just need Brauny to find the good stuff again.

If college football players are on it you better believe these guys are trying everything with hundreds of millions of dollars at stake.

[MU82]

We just need Brauny to find the good stuff again.

That would be great. Then he could get outraged while he lies about it and makes sure people get fired to cover his lies!

[Blackhat]

Get back to that 7.8 wins above replacement.

*Actually he might already be back on, I see he got over a 1. OPS.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Pretty sure Trout is on some HGH.   No doubt on Arietta.  We just need Brauny to find the good stuff again.

If college football players are on it you better believe these guys are trying everything with hundreds of millions of dollars at stake.

You're pretty sure...well that settles it then

[LAZER]

You're pretty sure...well that settles it then

No doubt on Arrieta too, so very settled.

[rocket surgeon]

what's a ped? 

guys in the labs keep on coming up with stuff which isn't illegal...yet, or they come up with masking agents or they come up with stuff that avoids testing positive.  MUsox guy got part of it too-too much money involved.  just axk alex rodriguez

then i'd rank mediocre pitching

don't axk, don't tell  the fans love da long ball

[tower912]

There was just a good article in SI about the % of runs being scored by home run.   Because the pitching is so GOOD, with all of the relievers coming in to throw 15 pitches at 95 mph, teams are unable to consistently string together several consecutive hits.   Yes, there are outliers.   There always are.    The TREND, though, is for fewer and shorter rallies.   Ergo, teams are willing to accept a < .260 hitter because he can hit 25+ dingers.      Now, offenses are about running up pitch counts, walking, hitting home runs.     Because it is increasingly difficult to string together 5 straight singles. 

[brandx]

Pretty sure Trout is on some HGH.   No doubt on Arietta.  We just need Brauny to find the good stuff again.

If college football players are on it you better believe these guys are trying everything with hundreds of millions of dollars at stake.

Is every star on the juice? Is it possible for some players to be better than others?

I'm just wondering what makes you the "expert" on this. How do you "know" certain players are on PEDS? Was Mickey Mantle on them? He was stronger, faster, and better than anyone else. Had to be, huh.

[rocket surgeon]

Is every star on the juice? Is it possible for some players to be better than others?

I'm just wondering what makes you the "expert" on this. How do you "know" certain players are on PEDS? Was Mickey Mantle on them? He was stronger, faster, and better than anyone else. Had to be, huh.

oh mickey was on the juice, but i don't think it was performance enhancing...in fact, it probably held him back from being an even greater player.  how many times did he come to the field feeling like max mcgee in super bowel I or dock ellis, ohhhh, just about every time he pitched

[Tugg Speedman]

PEDs are as old a sport itself. 

The 1904 winner of the Olympic marathon was a doper.

http://grg51.typepad.com/steroid_nation/2009/02/1904-olympic-marathon-winner-thomas-hicks-kicked-off-modern-era-of-doping-with-strychnine.html

In 1967 Tommy Simpson died in a Tour de France stage climbing the slopes of the Mt. Ventoux.  The reason is an overdose.

http://www.outsideonline.com/1917346/biggest-tdf-scandals-1967—-death-tom-simpson

Simpson is also famous for for his last minutes of life.  After he collapsed, his heart stop, fans on the side of the road that rushed to his aid reported his last words before dying were "put me back on my bike."

In 1977 Arnold Schwarzenegger was profiled on 60 minutes and openly talked about his training regime, which included a 6 week cycle of Steroids.  This arose no suspicion as that is how it was done.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/arnold-no-regrets-about-steroids/


During the 1976 Olympics, Bill Flemming of ABC sports talked about "blood packing" by distance runners.  It was perfectly legal.

https://www.paleycenter.org/collection/item/?q=dick&p=70&item=B:01359

From the beginning of time until the 1980s, it was normal for an athlete to use PEDs.  Only starting in the 1970s/1980s was PEDs usage considered wrong and banned.  Today's moral outrage is really new.

Two arguments ... Liberterian argument, let them do what they want.

Parent argument, if your high schooler shows talent, you going to take them to a specialists so they learn to shoot themself up?

Tough call.

[Tugg Speedman]

One more thing related to above ...

Modern organized sports traces its roots back to the 1700s.  Cambridge square is exactly one-quarter mile (it's dimensions are where the mile distance comes from).  In the 17th century, the biggest sport was the mile run.  It would go off a noon in Cambridge square (via the clock tower).  Bettors and fans would come from far and wide to watch the race.

Back then any kind of training was considered morally objectionable.  You were supposed to show up and show what you can do "naturally."  Oh, you ran naked because even clothes and shoes were considered an unfair advantage.

Many years into the future, You think today's moral outrage about PEDs will be viewed as antiqued as you view this story?

My bet is yes.

[Blackhat]

I'm just wondering what makes you the "expert" on this.

I've got more friends and in higher places than anyone here could ever dream of.   

My CEO buddy at an underground laboratory that I can't mention, has informed me that the Cubs, Cardinals, and Angels are some of his biggest clients.   

I've already said too much.

[brandx]

I've got more friends and in higher places than anyone here could ever dream of.   

Ok, Chicas.

[MU82]

I've got more friends and in higher places than anyone here could ever dream of.   

My CEO buddy at an underground laboratory that I can't mention, has informed me that the Cubs, Cardinals, and Angels are some of his biggest clients.   

I've already said too much.

Yes ... tell us any more and you'll have to kill us all.

[rocket surgeon]

I've got more friends and in higher places than anyone here could ever dream of.   

My CEO buddy at an underground laboratory that I can't mention, has informed me that the Cubs, Cardinals, and Angels are some of his biggest clients.   

I've already said too much.

i can respect thi$.  anyone that thinks ped's just go away because a few get their pee's slapped is very naive.  their are more biochemists, physiologists, pharmacologists, M.D.'s etc. working on chit way ahead of the curve.  there is just way too much money involved on both sides of the process. 

   it's not all about strength either.  a lot of emphasis on recovery.  think about it-especially as one gets older-what is one of the biggest obstacles to performance?  stiffness, achiness, range of motion.  steroids are some of the best anti-inflammatories out there, but there are too many side effects.  not just their effects on some of our major organs-liver, kidney, acne, bloatedness, increase in muscle mass(yes, that is a side effect) dependency,  and of course rage issues

[Tugg Speedman]

i can respect thi$.  anyone that thinks ped's just go away because a few get their pee's slapped is very naive.  their are more biochemists, physiologists, pharmacologists, M.D.'s etc. working on chit way ahead of the curve.  there is just way too much money involved on both sides of the process. 

   it's not all about strength either.  a lot of emphasis on recovery.  think about it-especially as one gets older-what is one of the biggest obstacles to performance?  stiffness, achiness, range of motion.  steroids are some of the best anti-inflammatories out there, but there are too many side effects.  not just their effects on some of our major organs-liver, kidney, acne, bloatedness, increase in muscle mass(yes, that is a side effect) dependency,  and of course rag issues

This

It's all about recovery.   The ability to have a hard workout, really hard workout, and then comeback and do it tomorrow, and the next day and so on.  That is how the Ryan Brauns and Barry Bonds get ahead. 

And it also explains the indignance when busted.  Recovery drugs allow them to workout and train like no one else.  They are like energizer bunnies going and going.  Then when they are busted and call cheaters, they get mad because, in their mind, no one tries as hard as them.  They are correct as the non PED user needs rest and days off, they do not.  So they twist it into their mind that they are being punished for trying too hard.

And recovery is a huge business, for old people.  Professional athletes using it to enhance performance is a side effect.

[ChicosBailBonds]

He is using reverse psychology because he must be in them...


Smart guy, throws them off the scent


Mike Trout: Ban PED users for life http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/9560421/mike-trout-los-angeles-angels-says-mlb-ban-ped-users-life

[tower912]

After the Dee Gordon suspension, Verlander tweeted that it there should be zero tolerance for PED's.    Of course, he has Kate Upton to help him recover......

[rocket surgeon]

After the Dee Gordon suspension, Verlander tweeted that it there should be zero tolerance for PED's.    Of course, he has Kate Upton to help him recover......

nothing like a little "deep tissue" massage after going 9 huh yeah huh yeah huh yeah!!  the more i think about it though, that does seem like an unfair advantage

[MU82]

There is little incentive to avoid juicing.

In the unlikely event you will be caught, you will be suspended only 50 games. In the meantime, if you do it right and avoid being caught long enough, you can help yourself reap millions. Does anybody really think Gordon or Braun or McGwire or Sosa or most of the others regret their choices?

Plus, we've gotten to the point where the ticket-buying and TV-watching public really don't care. They might pretend to be a little outraged at first, but it passes quickly and they are more than willing to cheer a sullied star, buy gear with his number on it, etc.

Bonds was worshipped in SF even though fans there knew he was the PED poster child.

In NY, fans could give a shyte if A-Rod juices. If the juicing helps him hit HRs ... yay! If he sucks with or without juicing ... boo!

I will say right now that if I were a young player on the cusp and I was convinced that juicing would put me over the top, I would at least seriously consider doing it. Maybe my conscience would prevent me from doing it, but humans are pretty good at justifying all kinds of means toward ends.

[rocket surgeon]

There is little incentive to avoid juicing.

In the unlikely event you will be caught, you will be suspended only 50 games. In the meantime, if you do it right and avoid being caught long enough, you can help yourself reap millions. Does anybody really think Gordon or Braun or McGwire or Sosa or most of the others regret their choices?

Plus, we've gotten to the point where the ticket-buying and TV-watching public really don't care. They might pretend to be a little outraged at first, but it passes quickly and they are more than willing to cheer a sullied star, buy gear with his number on it, etc.

Bonds was worshipped in SF even though fans there knew he was the PED poster child.

In NY, fans could give a shyte if A-Rod juices. If the juicing helps him hit HRs ... yay! If he sucks with or without juicing ... boo!

I will say right now that if I were a young player on the cusp and I was convinced that juicing would put me over the top, I would at least seriously consider doing it. Maybe my conscience would prevent me from doing it, but humans are pretty good at justifying all kinds of means toward ends.

not a bad analysis for an atheist

    fans are fickle and the haters will hate especially more if they find out they were juicing.  as you said, fans love the action, homers, etc.  then the faux outrage if they are CAUGHT.  it's kinda like the ncaa catching rules violations note, the "no-name" schools paying a kids bus fare home to his mom's funereal -death penalty, north carolina classes...huh?

[ChicosBailBonds]

MU82

I disagree and I'm going to name drop here for a reason.  When I ran the out of market sports businesses for Directv a number of years ago, McGwire and Sosa were both are spokesmen.  This was during the craziness of the chase.  Years later we had the chance to talk to Mark and he absolutely regrets it. 

I can't speak for Sammy or the other guys, but Mark knows it will keep him out of the HOF and hurt his chances to get back in the game as a coach at the MLB level....which he is back now.

The penalties are pretty severe.  If you are someone that is on the fringe, the risk may be worth it. If you are a stud, the risk is beyond silly because you are going to get paid a ton no matter what.  You have it made.   The upside at that point isn't worth it.

[MU82]

MU82

I disagree and I'm going to name drop here for a reason.  When I ran the out of market sports businesses for Directv a number of years ago, McGwire and Sosa were both are spokesmen.  This was during the craziness of the chase.  Years later we had the chance to talk to Mark and he absolutely regrets it. 

I can't speak for Sammy or the other guys, but Mark knows it will keep him out of the HOF and hurt his chances to get back in the game as a coach at the MLB level....which he is back now.

The penalties are pretty severe.  If you are someone that is on the fringe, the risk may be worth it. If you are a stud, the risk is beyond silly because you are going to get paid a ton no matter what.  You have it made.   The upside at that point isn't worth it.

If McGwire doesn't juice, he is a billion miles from the Hall of Fame. He hit 245 of his HRs in a 4-year span when he was using his arse like a pin cushion. Plus, as he told Costas in the big interview with the crocodile tears, the stuff kept him healthy. He couldn't have performed without it, at least that's what he contended. And that doesn't even count all the years he was juicing with Canseco. No juice, does he even hit 350 HRs?

So I hope that's not the reason he regrets it. The thing he should regret is lying for 5, 6, 7 years to La Russa, who repeatedly stuck his neck out for him, as well as lying to others who vouched for him. I was good friends with the AP reporter who wrote about the andro, and McGwire's whole "How dare you even suggest I take steroids" reaction was, in retrospect, comical. In many ways, his whole career was a sham, built on a series of lies.

I guess you or I can't speak toward who regrets it or not or who thinks it's worth the risk or not.

But if I'm a mediocre ballplayer hoping to stick, or a good ballplayer hoping to be regarded as great, maybe I don't think so much about the risk or about future regrets. Athletes, as a rule, are me-centric. They think about now, not the consequences. And the fans they lie to don't give a rip if they produce.

Just my educated opinion from having been pretty up close and personal with many athletes for decades. Ugh ... now I'm job-dropping!