2011-12 NFC North Division

[DegenerateDish]

The punt play design was brilliant, Toub is one of the best ST coaches in the league. I can't believe no one has thought of doing that before. Graham admitted he held the guy, ref threw the flag, so it's tough to argue it. Only stinks because it was such a brilliant play design and (almost) executed to perfection.

[MUMac]

The punt play design was brilliant, Toub is one of the best ST coaches in the league. I can't believe no one has thought of doing that before. Graham admitted he held the guy, ref threw the flag, so it's tough to argue it. Only stinks because it was such a brilliant play design and (almost) executed to perfection.

You have to have a Devon Hester to be able to pull this one off.  The Packers may have a threat in Cobb, but frankly besides Desmond Howard, they could have tried this at any time over the past 20 years and not have had any success.  It was amazing to me to see how all the Packers, except for Bush, ran right with Hester.  That is the Devin Hester factor.

Plus, the play design was brilliant, but the timing of it even moreso.  The only chance the Bears had was to return the punt for a TD.  That is why every Packer followed Hester.

Even so, the play Knox made to get down the field, field the ball, stay in bounds then turn and return it was an extremely athletic play. 

[mu03eng]

You have to have a Devon Hester to be able to pull this one off.  The Packers may have a threat in Cobb, but frankly besides Desmond Howard, they could have tried this at any time over the past 20 years and not have had any success.  It was amazing to me to see how all the Packers, except for Bush, ran right with Hester.  That is the Devin Hester factor.

Plus, the play design was brilliant, but the timing of it even moreso.  The only chance the Bears had was to return the punt for a TD.  That is why every Packer followed Hester.

Even so, the play Knox made to get down the field, field the ball, stay in bounds then turn and return it was an extremely athletic play. 

The other part that was brilliant as part of the design was they had a blocker to account for the punter as presumably he would know where the punt went.

Now this will pay dividends because they can run head fakes off this that should open seams for Hester but not as much as it should have.  Thank god for #21

[LON]

The other part that was brilliant as part of the design was they had a blocker to account for the punter as presumably he would know where the punt went.

Now this will pay dividends because they can run head fakes off this that should open seams for Hester but not as much as it should have.  Thank god for #21

I'm just shocked that no one knew that the ball was kicked to the complete other side of the field.  Absolutely no one located the ball when it was in the air.  I thought I saw in the replay that Mathstay almost gave a "WTF" kind of look when he saw all 10 guys go to the other side of the field.  Crazy play.  Glad my team caught a break on that one.

When they do the directional kicks, do the cover guys know what way it is planned on going?

[BrewCity83]

Masthay said the play was called to kick left, so all the players should have been expecting the ball to be kicked left.

[MerrittsMustache]

I'm just shocked that no one knew that the ball was kicked to the complete other side of the field.  Absolutely no one located the ball when it was in the air.  I thought I saw in the replay that Mathstay almost gave a "WTF" kind of look when he saw all 10 guys go to the other side of the field.  Crazy play.  Glad my team caught a break on that one.

When they do the directional kicks, do the cover guys know what way it is planned on going?

Yes, the coverage guys know which way the ball is supposed to go. I recall reading a quote from one of the Packers who said that he assumed the ball came off the punter's foot wrong. My favorite part of the play is when Hester looked like he was about to catch the ball but nothing happened and everyone just stood there for a second before realizing that Knox was streaking down the sidelines.

It would be nearly impossible for the coverage guys to locate the ball in the air. If those guys are running full speed while looking up, they'd get absolutely leveled.

While this play technically didn't work because of the hold, I wouldn't be surprised if it really opened things up for Hester in the future. If Know splits off from blocking the gunner like he did, he has to be accounted for whether it's a decoy or not. That's at least 1-2 fewer guys keying on Hester.

[JWags85]

I was in London over the weekend and only caught part of the game, and watched the rest taped last night.  Upon letting my rage simmer down, I came to see a hopeful silver lining.  People are beginning to realize the king has no clothes in Chicago.  I love the Bears and have defended many things, but I never defended Martz.  The man lived the last decade of a team with a HOF QB, RB and LT, as well as two perennial Pro Bowl WR.  His system had little to do with that team being an offensive monster.  Jerry Angelo's ineptitude in the offseason was Mike Brown (Cincinnati)-esque and if you look at this OL breakdown like the Tribune did the other day, its beyond laughable, its infuriating.  And while I like Lovie, this is all on his watch.  He's let Martz run crazy, which is ironic cause he won't run the ball, and Angelo has made personnel moves based on a belief in Martz' supposed brilliance.  Lovie has still done a great job with the D, no doubt, but he needs to exert more control.  I hope this season doesn't get anymore painful and there is some serious housecleaning come January.

This isn't making excuses, the Packers are a fantastic team and were well constructed by Ted Thompson to be sure.

And as a Cutler apologist (I don't think he's a top 5 QB, i just think he's been put in a very difficult situation with unrealistic expectations), I worry we may never get him as a productive QB ever again.  He had a pretty solid year last year despite being beaten down week to week that ended with controversy in the NFC Championship game.  By all accounts, he came back this summer in the best shape he's been, with better footwork and a good attitude.  And he was rewarded with no protection on the line and a scheme that allows for teams to sit back and wait for him to pass cause 1) there is no run blocking 2) they won't run anyways.  You can tell he is pissed, and I don't blame him one bit this year.

[NavinRJohnson]

While this play technically didn't work because of the hold, I wouldn't be surprised if it really opened things up for Hester in the future. If Know splits off from blocking the gunner like he did, he has to be accounted for whether it's a decoy or not. That's at least 1-2 fewer guys keying on Hester.

I admire your optimism, but the skunk is out of the box, and figuring out how to deal with it is not going to be difficult for NFL coaching staffs. There is a reason "trick plays' are rarely attempted, let alone work.

[StillAWarrior]

I admire your optimism, but the skunk is out of the box, and figuring out how to deal with it is not going to be difficult for NFL coaching staffs. There is a reason "trick plays' are rarely attempted, let alone work.

I'm curious...has Chicago specifically said that this was a planned trick play?  I've seen a lot of return men fake a fair catch when the ball isn't close.  This struck me more as a play where Knox just happened to notice where the ball was going and made a heads-up play and went and got it (and then ran like hell when he realized that nobody else pursued the ball).  But I don't see nearly as much coverage about it here as you guys probably see in WI/IL.

[LON]

I admire your optimism, but the skunk is out of the box, and figuring out how to deal with it is not going to be difficult for NFL coaching staffs. There is a reason "trick plays' are rarely attempted, let alone work.

Well, at least they waited until week 3...the Ravens won't be able to run that fake PAT/FG ever again after wasting it on a blowout game against Pitt in week 1.

[DegenerateDish]

I'm curious...has Chicago specifically said that this was a planned trick play?  I've seen a lot of return men fake a fair catch when the ball isn't close.  This struck me more as a play where Knox just happened to notice where the ball was going and made a heads-up play and went and got it (and then ran like hell when he realized that nobody else pursued the ball).  But I don't see nearly as much coverage about it here as you guys probably see in WI/IL.

It was a planned play.

I disagree with Navin, not to say this play will work 100% again, but now that it is on film, it needs to be accounted for. The success you may see out of this is if both Hester and Knox line up on the punt return team, gunners now need to account for both of them, as they'll most likely be split out on opposite sides of the field. As mentioned, the Packers had planned to kick this left, and had all eyes focused on Hester. Give Hester all the credit here, the Packers were so focused on him, they abandoned their responsibilities and lanes.

One of two things happens now going forward. Gunners have to possibly stop and look up where the ball is (which is an absolute disaster waiting to happen) or you'll see gunners a little bit more spread out, opening up more lanes for the punt returner. Just because a punt is supposed to be kicked left/right/middle, doesn't always work out that way.

[MerrittsMustache]

I admire your optimism, but the skunk is out of the box, and figuring out how to deal with it is not going to be difficult for NFL coaching staffs. There is a reason "trick plays' are rarely attempted, let alone work.

I'm not saying they're going to run this play again, but opposing teams now have to account for it. It's the same general concept as a play-action pass, if you can get just 1 guy to take even a half-step in the wrong direction, that can really open things up. For a returner like Hester, a gunner taking a half-step out of his lane could be all he needs to break a big return.

[MerrittsMustache]

I'm curious...has Chicago specifically said that this was a planned trick play?  I've seen a lot of return men fake a fair catch when the ball isn't close.  This struck me more as a play where Knox just happened to notice where the ball was going and made a heads-up play and went and got it (and then ran like hell when he realized that nobody else pursued the ball).  But I don't see nearly as much coverage about it here as you guys probably see in WI/IL.

If it wasn't a planned play, Venable would not have been out in front of Knox to account for the punter.

[BrewCity83]

Hope the Bears aren't out of the playoff race by the time they get this play to work.

[StillAWarrior]

If it wasn't a planned play, Venable would not have been out in front of Knox to account for the punter.

Unless, of course, he saw the play developing.  If it was not planned (and I'm not saying it wasn't), Knox had time to run from the line of scrimmage to where the ball landed (hell, he obviously had time for this even if it was planned).  Venable certainly would have had time to get in position to block the punter.  Especially since the punter actually was on the side of the field that everyone else was, and came across to where Knox was.  He was just far enough down field that he was able to get over before Knox blew by.

I ask again:  have the Bears come out and stated that this was a planned play?

[MerrittsMustache]

Unless, of course, he saw the play developing.  If it was not planned (and I'm not saying it wasn't), Knox had time to run from the line of scrimmage to where the ball landed (hell, he obviously had time for this even if it was planned).  Venable certainly would have had time to get in position to block the punter.  Especially since the punter actually was on the side of the field that everyone else was, and came across to where Knox was.  He was just far enough down field that he was able to get over before Knox blew by.

I ask again:  have the Bears come out and stated that this was a planned play?

The Bears have not come out and specifically stated it was planned...because they didn't have to.

[JWags85]

The Bears have not come out and specifically stated it was planned...because they didn't have to.

My parents told me Rodgers said post game that it was one of the best drawn up plays he'd ever seen and they were completely fooled.  Those guys have seen/played more football than any of us ever will, so if they don't think its a fluke, I am positive it was drawn up.

[NavinRJohnson]

My parents told me Rodgers said post game that it was one of the best drawn up plays he'd ever seen and they were completely fooled.  Those guys have seen/played more football than any of us ever will, so if they don't think its a fluke, I am positive it was drawn up.

I heard a little bit ago on the radio, that apparently, a couple Packers, including McCarthy said that they picked up this play, or at least aspects of it on film and earlier in the game (I believe the punt Bush downed on the 1 yard line), so there's no question it was designed, and they got a perfect punt/situation on which to execute it. What are they doing? Getting it out there in hopes that teams won't punt toward the sideline to keep the ball away from Hester, and or limit his returns by cutting the field in half. As I said, it is a nice gimmik/attempt, but with the element of surprise gone, it will take about 5 minutes for teams to take it away.

[MUMac]

The Bears have not come out and specifically stated it was planned...because they didn't have to.

Agreed.  There is no way that Knock did this on his own.  If he had, what accounts for Hester?  What accounts for the lone blocker upfield (for the Punter).

Watch Hester springing upfield after the fake (almost beat Knox to the endzone).

This was definitely designed, well designed.

[DegenerateDish]

Agreed.  There is no way that Knock did this on his own.  If he had, what accounts for Hester?  What accounts for the lone blocker upfield (for the Punter).

Watch Hester springing upfield after the fake (almost beat Knox to the endzone).

This was definitely designed, well designed.

Meant to point that out, watch Hester on this play. It's ridiculous how fast he gets down field, and he almost does beat Knox, not to mention he ran nearly 40 yards wide across the field as well. Just insane.

[MerrittsMustache]

I heard a little bit ago on the radio, that apparently, a couple Packers, including McCarthy said that they picked up this play, or at least aspects of it on film and earlier in the game (I believe the punt Bush downed on the 1 yard line), so there's no question it was designed, and they got a perfect punt/situation on which to execute it. What are they doing? Getting it out there in hopes that teams won't punt toward the sideline to keep the ball away from Hester, and or limit his returns by cutting the field in half. As I said, it is a nice gimmik/attempt, but with the element of surprise gone, it will take about 5 minutes for teams to take it away.

You're not getting it. As MUdish and I both stated, the play might not be run again but it WILL need to be accounted for. It's the same reason why teams run fake end-arounds, for example, early in games: they want their opponent to be aware that that play is an option and they want to see how the D responds. Having this play out there means the coverage team will have more to worry about than just bringing down the best return man in NFL history. They need to be aware of where the ball is and where other players are on the field. They can't simply run in their lanes to Hester and assume the ball is going to come down to him. If Knox is blocking a gunner but leaves him and goes to the opposite side of the field as Hester, someone, likely that gunner, is going to have to go with him. Immediately, that opens up a lane for Hester. It may not seem like much, but giving Hester any advantage at all could result in a quick TD for the Bears.

[NavinRJohnson]

You're not getting it.

I totally get what you're saying. I just think you are drastically overstating the importance of it. If Knox disengages, do they really have to account for him, or do they let him go and have one less blacker to worry about? It depends I suppose. To suggest that this will appreciably  impact how teams scheme for Hester (any more than they already do), is a bit silly. They will call their coverages consistent with the situation the same as they do now.

If his return stats are appreciably better than they have been in past years, you can claim credit later.

[Sir Lawrence]

Here is a pretty good break down, with still shots, of the play. 
Slocum stinks as a special teams coach, in my opinion.

http://espnmilwaukee.com/page.php?page_id=278

[StillAWarrior]

Here is a pretty good break down, with still shots, of the play. 
Slocum stinks as a special teams coach, in my opinion.

http://espnmilwaukee.com/page.php?page_id=278

Thanks for posting that.  I had only seen the video of the play once and had only seen stills of the hold, but not the others showing how the play developed.

[Blackhat]

Is Dom Capers a living defensive legend?


  I think he is and underappreciated among the general public.  Before Dom, Packers were nothing, he and McCarthy are a DYNAMITE combo.

Hope Ernest Dominic Capers works a long time in GB.