Negotiating Salary

[Dr. Blackheart]

Did you go through a headhunter?  If so, ask them to see if he/she can get them to sweeten the pot on a sign-on bonus or relo.  First, the headhunter won't want to lose the commission.  Second, they face this all the time and know how to handle it.  One time kickers usually come out of a HR recruiting budget. 

If no headhunter, take the new job but perhaps probe on the details of the relo which chances are they haven't shown you in full yet.  You likely signed a letter of intent on the offer pending background and drug checks anyway. 

Salaries and bonus ranges are in bands in most likelihood so that is tighter.  Kickers are typically at discretion of the HR Recruiter.  It is also probable that that window is closing/closed at this point, however, but worth the try.  Better to use naïvete about cost of living adjustments and unexpected/unplanned moving costs (or spouses), than the old job that you hate.  Also, there will be less resentment on the new company's end.

[PBRme]

Your current company is probably using some of the raise you would have gotten at the next review in your counter.  Your new employer probably will give you a normal raise at review. 

Also my company always like employees with multiple company experience.  Once someone has been at the same place to 10-15 they get "set in their ways" typically.

[Benny B]

Also my company always like employees with multiple company experience.  Once someone has been at the same place to 10-15 they get "set in their ways" typically.

This is cyclical... in an employer's market, job-hopping isn't seen as a negative, but in an employees' market, it is.  As hard as it is to hire right now, companies and recruiters are going to start treasuring people who aren't hopping around from job to job every 2-3 years... unless you work in the call center or other high-attrition industry.

[jsglow]

Late to the game. Don't retrade on the original offer that you already accepted. You can choose to stay at company #1 or you can go to company #2 at the agreed wage.

Good luck.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

I agree with the sentiment here.  Take the new job PERIOD.  The only other advice I can offer is if you have an exit interview don't "burn your bridges".  For some weird reason the new job doesn't work the old place will take you back if you leave on great terms and no negative feedback.

[PorkysButthole]

[quote/]My biggest issue had always been hiring companies holding me hostage before offering salary.  You agree in principle and they would flat out REFUSE to give a number without a current salary.  A top ad agency and a Fortune 100 company I worked for both did it, and I tried every comment to get around it to no avail.  This was only an issue because at the jobs prior to each of them, extenuating factors lead to me being severely underpaid.  This hurt me at the agency, and then when I moved to the F100, after a graduate degree, I know for a fact I started $10-15K behind comparable peers cause of it.  They even said "without a number, we will benchmark it against what we see as common for the position you currently hold" which was ominous to say the least.
[/quote]

Thankfully this is not as common as it used to be and in some states, illegal I believe.  Pretty sure this recently became illegal in Porky’s home state of NY.   In places where it’s still common practice,  it’s easier to circumvent if you’re later in your career and have been at the same company for a long time.  Never disclose your current salary because it inevitably dips below market once you’ve been at a place more than a few years even with good annual reviews and fair merit increases.   What folks in this position can do is just be honest and say look  i’m not going to provide my current compensation  but what I can say is that the base salary would have to be at least X to even consider leaving my current organization for anywhere.   If it isn’t that’s OK.  The problem is prospective employers are a lot more accepting of that type of response from someone  in their late 40s as opposed to someone in their late 20s or early 30s because they’re in a different life and career stage.  You won’t be able to get away with that if you’ve only been out of school for say five years.    About a year and a half ago I had  multiple conversations with a rival employer and suspect was on the road to a potential offer, but it was taking longer than expected and at the end of the day I put a stop to it because even though comp had never come up,  I said look I’ve been at my current employer for a very long time and at this stage of my career and life, the comp would have to be very close to double my current, otherwise it wouldn’t be worth the risk of leaving my current position/organization which I’ve been almost 20 yrs.  The problem was double my current comp at that time exceeded  what would be reasonable for the position we were discussing.   I knew it and they knew it,  so we ended discussions amicably and are still on good terms to this day. Porky wasn’t greedy at all it’s just that you eventually get to a point in your career unfortunately where its unlikely you’re going to be offered something so far and above where you currently are to make the risk of leaving worth it, But I suspect I’m much older than you so it’s generally not a situation someone in their late 20s early 30s would typically find themselves in.   Hope that helps.

[dgies9156]

Here's something I don't say all that often: I'm with Sultan on this one.  It would leave a very poor taste in my mouth if someone who accepted my offer a few days ago came back and asked for more just because he got a counter-offer from his prior employer.  Truth be told, my response would likely be, "then you should probably take that counter-offer."  If you want the new position, go with it.  Even if they don't pull the offer, it just seems like a bad way to start the relationship.

Me too!

Changing a position is never just about money. Understand why you want to leave. Plus, if you go back, you've already signaled you're not long for the company. All you are doing is giving them a chance to find your replacement.

[muwarrior69]

Your current company is probably using some of the raise you would have gotten at the next review in your counter.  Your new employer probably will give you a normal raise at review. 

Also my company always like employees with multiple company experience.  Once someone has been at the same place to 10-15 they get "set in their ways" typically.

Now that Companies no longer offer pensions I understand that trend. My wife worked at her company for 35 years and her salary was competitive when she retired with other Fortune 500 companies that were comparable. My wife was one to never be "set in her ways". She worked in R&D, always striving to improve products already on the market and develop new products for market and keeping her skills up to date. There was a time when loyalty went both ways; but not any more from what I can see.

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

Now that Companies no longer offer pensions I understand that trend. My wife worked at her company for 35 years and her salary was competitive when she retired with other Fortune 500 companies that were comparable. My wife was one to never be "set in her ways". She worked in R&D, always striving to improve products already on the market and develop new products for market and keeping her skills up to date. There was a time when loyalty went both ways; but not any more from what I can see.

This leads to my 'favorite' knock on millennials...corporations broke the structural bonds of loyalty and then blame the young employees that don't value 'loyalty'

[brewcity77]

I'm not in a field where people tend to change jobs often, but we do frequently have members going for various promotions which have both benefits and drawbacks. What I always tell young employees is to go for the job they want to do. If they really enjoy being a firefighter, do that. If they want to drive or be an officer, do that, but do it because they want that position, not because of a bump in salary.

4th and State, if the new job intrigues and interests you, take it. Don't worry about the compensation package. Your happiness in life will not be dictated by that. I've lived a life where I've scraped by on two part-time jobs making $16,000 per year, I spent a few months homeless (but still working) after an eviction, I've worked full-time in the private sector, and now work full-time in the public sector. At every stage, from those minimum wage jobs up to six figures I've never found my happiness to be dictated by changes in financial welfare.

Yes, there is truth that money can make life easier, but there's definitely a point where no amount of money will make you any happier than you already are (studies find it to be about $75,000/year). Whatever extra money you get, you will adjust to that lifestyle and the same problems you always had will resurface. If you have a choice between jobs, take the one you want the most because it interests you the most.

[warriorchick]

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[real chili 83]

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Well said.

[4everwarriors]

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Ya've come a long wey. Solid contribution, Ma, hey?

[Coleman]

To any of you guys out there, has your experience been to respectfully offer exit interviews to exiting employees or does one have to consent to one or are they not all that common today?  Has anyone given an exit interview?

I've agreed to an exit interview when I left my last job. It was no big deal. My old employer was understanding. It came down to dollars and cents.

OP, take the new job. Counteroffers rarely work out.

[jesmu84]

Don’t let em pull a switcharoo on you (no MU82) like Amazon just did with their wiping out of RSUs, options, & incentive comp “in exchange” for a $15 min.

Could you please stop with this? Especially toward other posters

[jesmu84]

BJ is a d-bag and a hypocrite. Every time he does something like that to other Scoopers, it says way more about him than the rest of us.

Maybe. But it's still a crapty thing to do. He's calling you a homo. He's being insulting to you and using homosexual as a negative.

[brewcity77]

Don’t let em pull a switcharoo on you (no MU82) like Amazon just did with their wiping out of RSUs, options, & incentive comp “in exchange” for a $15 min.

This is a ridiculous attempt at a personal attack. Marquette taught you better than this.

[mu_hilltopper]

Jay Bee will be eating Arby's for the next week instead of posting on Scoop.

[brewcity77]

Jay Bee will be eating Arby's for the next week instead of posting on Scoop.

[real chili 83]

I thought you were bigger than that.

[JWags85]

Thankfully this is not as common as it used to be and in some states, illegal I believe.  Pretty sure this recently became illegal in Porky’s home state of NY.   In places where it’s still common practice,  it’s easier to circumvent if you’re later in your career and have been at the same company for a long time.  Never disclose your current salary because it inevitably dips below market once you’ve been at a place more than a few years even with good annual reviews and fair merit increases.   What folks in this position can do is just be honest and say look  i’m not going to provide my current compensation  but what I can say is that the base salary would have to be at least X to even consider leaving my current organization for anywhere.   If it isn’t that’s OK.  The problem is prospective employers are a lot more accepting of that type of response from someone  in their late 40s as opposed to someone in their late 20s or early 30s because they’re in a different life and career stage.  You won’t be able to get away with that if you’ve only been out of school for say five years.    About a year and a half ago I had  multiple conversations with a rival employer and suspect was on the road to a potential offer, but it was taking longer than expected and at the end of the day I put a stop to it because even though comp had never come up,  I said look I’ve been at my current employer for a very long time and at this stage of my career and life, the comp would have to be very close to double my current, otherwise it wouldn’t be worth the risk of leaving my current position/organization which I’ve been almost 20 yrs.  The problem was double my current comp at that time exceeded  what would be reasonable for the position we were discussing.   I knew it and they knew it,  so we ended discussions amicably and are still on good terms to this day. Porky wasn’t greedy at all it’s just that you eventually get to a point in your career unfortunately where its unlikely you’re going to be offered something so far and above where you currently are to make the risk of leaving worth it, But I suspect I’m much older than you so it’s generally not a situation someone in their late 20s early 30s would typically find themselves in.   Hope that helps.

Good to know.  And thanks for that insight.

And yea, at the time I was 27, had only had a "good" job for 3 years after some turbulent times, and recently added a graduate degree.  I had an idea of my worth on paper from a plethora of online resources, but didn't have a ton of leverage or tangible support, especially being put in that spot after agreeing in principle and being horrifically underpaid at my role.

We've had some mention of it, but my advice to younger colleagues and peers is always "know your worth".  Not in an arrogant "I deserve this" sense, but it pains me to hear about people who are making 20-25% or more below what they could, simply because they don't know comps, havent explored elsewhere, etc...  Especially when its not a job you LOVE.

At the agency I mentioned I moved from, I was in strategy, but for media planning it went

Assistant->Planner->Supervisor->Associate Director

About a 20% raise each promotion every 2-3 years.  However, if you jumped agencies, you could normally move faster, and that raise was closer to 40-50% early, and 30-35% later.  I knew Planners making more than Supervisors, and Supervisors making more than ADs.  A couple really liked the client and the team and had left and come back.  I get being comfortable and secure in your job, but at a point its a bit irresponsible if you have ambition.

[brewcity77]

I thought you were bigger than that.

I'm giving the mods kudos for doing the right thing. It wouldn't be very consistent to only criticize when I disagree and not commend when I do agree.

[GooooMarquette]

This.  Your current job may value people, but they don’t value you as an individual.  Don’t risk the new job offer asking for more.  Make good on your acceptance, work your ass off for a year, and then in your performance review, disclose to your new employer how you turned down your previous employer’s offer and ask for a raise commensurate with said offer.

Agree 100%.

Looks bad to accept an offer then ask for more. Act in good faith by honoring your original deal, then once you have shown them what you can do, use your actual performance with the new employer as a (very legitimate) bargaining chip next time around.

[GooooMarquette]

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Doesn't this belong in the NM thread? 

[MU82]

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Take the job - PERIOD.

Well said, chickadee!