COVID-19 (f/k/a "the Coronavirus")

[GooooMarquette]

Interesting perspective on Texas, Wags. I hope Abbott gives a targeted approach a shot, and the state makes some headway.

I agree with what both you and 82 are saying – he has an awfully difficult job given the makeup of the state.

[Jockey]

Hoover and the depression vs Trump and covid? What's a bigger failure -having a plan that makes things worse or having no plan at all?

That is a good comparison, Muta.

To me the difference is that Hoover didn't purposely try to sabotage the country. He was just inept. The current guy is obviously inept, but is also actively trying to undermine the effort against Covid. He is fighting against more testing. He is fighting against the use of masks. He is using the crisis to try to turn American against American.

Hoover can't stand up to this level of ineptitude.

[shoothoops]

Dream City Church. Yuma, AZ:

https://twitter.com/VaughnHillyard/status/1275145487851458561?s=19

[wadesworld]

Dream City Church. Yuma, AZ:

https://twitter.com/VaughnHillyard/status/1275145487851458561?s=19

Ionizicetion. MAGA!

[GooooMarquette]

Dream City Church. Yuma, AZ:

https://twitter.com/VaughnHillyard/status/1275145487851458561?s=19

The name of the church is quite appropriate.

[Pakuni]

Dream City Church. Yuma, AZ:

https://twitter.com/VaughnHillyard/status/1275145487851458561?s=19

Brawndo also kills 99.9 percent of COVID-19. It's got electrolytes!

[pbiflyer]

Well this is going to be a setback. The White House guy who used an excel trend line formula to show the number of cases would be 0 in June resigned today.

White House adviser Kevin Hassett leaving administration:
https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/503839-white-house-adviser-kevin-hassett-leaving-administration-report


 https://mobile.twitter.com/WhiteHouseCEA/status/1257680258364555264/photo/1

[shoothoops]

Dream City Church. Yuma, AZ:

https://twitter.com/VaughnHillyard/status/1275145487851458561?s=19

Meanwhile, at a church in Austin, TX:

https://twitter.com/rossramsey/status/1275192128377892868?s=19

[shoothoops]

Deep dive why wear a mask, includes 172 studies:

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/06/21/880832213/yes-wearing-masks-helps-heres-why?utm_campaign=storyshare&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Brawndo also kills 99.9 percent of COVID-19. It's got electrolytes!

Love the Idiocracy reference!

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Deep dive why wear a mask, includes 172 studies:

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/06/21/880832213/yes-wearing-masks-helps-heres-why?utm_campaign=storyshare&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social

At my Post Office stop yesterday all 10 people in line had a mask except the guy in front of me.  His first words to the Postman behind the counter in a southern a
accent was, "I'm just a gentleman from the South."  Bizarre.

The guy in front of him had everyone laughing.  He was going to take off his mask to lick his envelope and the Postman stopped him with a "Whoah, whoah, whoah!  We're not doing that anymore.  Please hand to me and I'll tape it closed."

[GooooMarquette]

Novak Djokovic has tested positive for coronavirus

https://www.espn.com/tennis/story/_/id/29351887/novak-djokovic-tested-positive-coronavirus

Djokovic has been criticized for organizing the tournament and bringing in players from other countries amid the coronavirus pandemic. There were no social distancing measures observed at the matches in either country.

[forgetful]

I can only speak for Texas, but the targeted approach will be the game plan. My good friend is on Abbott’s staff in a fairly high ranking role.  While he, and obviously Abbott, are pretty staunch Republicans, there’s been no “it’s a hoax” mentality or denial in their internal ranks. They had difficult balances given the relatively mild spread there early on and the challenges of balancing Houston, Dallas, Austin all in varying places and outlooks, without them factoring in large rural populations.  And Frenns is correct. While numbers are concerning, they have significant contingency plans in place.

To make matters even more difficult, Texas is one of the few states where the Lt Gov has significant powers and is elected separately, and Dan Patrick is a complete grifter/lunatic that they have to work against. To say the two camps don’t get along is to put it mildly.

We butt heads on certain issues, and I certainly have my issues with Abbott and Texas politics, but he and Abbott are in a VERY difficult position with this all, regardless.

What you are saying may be his plan now, but this is not what Abbott did at all. He ignored the fact that Texas has varying places and outlooks, and instead superseded all local governments in mandating that they all open, whether they were ready or not. He declared that no local governments could make their own orders, including about such simple things as masks.

It was an unmitigated disaster and led to a significant resurgence in cases. He has now backed off that central leadership and will allow local governments to make rules on masks, but the rules and policies are not targeted, they are blanket across the entire state, and often defy scientific input.

[Jockey]

I can only speak for Texas, but the targeted approach will be the game plan. My good friend is on Abbott’s staff in a fairly high ranking role.  While he, and obviously Abbott, are pretty staunch Republicans, there’s been no “it’s a hoax” mentality or denial in their internal ranks. They had difficult balances given the relatively mild spread there early on and the challenges of balancing Houston, Dallas, Austin all in varying places and outlooks, without them factoring in large rural populations.  And Frenns is correct. While numbers are concerning, they have significant contingency plans in place.

To make matters even more difficult, Texas is one of the few states where the Lt Gov has significant powers and is elected separately, and Dan Patrick is a complete grifter/lunatic that they have to work against. To say the two camps don’t get along is to put it mildly.

We butt heads on certain issues, and I certainly have my issues with Abbott and Texas politics, but he and Abbott are in a VERY difficult position with this all, regardless.

The results in Texas speak to its "leadership" from the governor's office.

[JWags85]

What you are saying may be his plan now, but this is not what Abbott did at all. He ignored the fact that Texas has varying places and outlooks, and instead superseded all local governments in mandating that they all open, whether they were ready or not. He declared that no local governments could make their own orders, including about such simple things as masks.

It was an unmitigated disaster and led to a significant resurgence in cases. He has now backed off that central leadership and will allow local governments to make rules on masks, but the rules and policies are not targeted, they are blanket across the entire state, and often defy scientific input.

Texas still ranks in the bottom 10 in deaths per capita. There is no catastrophic overrunning of hospitals in the state.

There were mistakes made and they have course corrected, but acting like it%u2019s a war zone there just because cases are up is absurd hyperbole. I%u2019m sure you%u2019ll say %u201Cjust wait, they are coming!%u201D  But at this point, it%u2019s unnecessary exaggeration.  There is a LONG ways to go before their per capita numbers get in line with other states, much less gross.

The results in Texas speak to its "leadership" from the governor's office.

Yes, why couldn%u2019t they be more like Illinois or Rhode Island. Typical cause it%u2019s always red and blue with Jockey

[Jockey]

Yes, why couldn't they be more like Illinois or Rhode Island. Typical cause it's always red and blue with Jockey

I never mentioned red or blue. Why couldn't Abbott do what Red governors in Ohio and Maryland did where they took control early rather than ignoring the virus?

Happy now?

[forgetful]

Texas still ranks in the bottom 10 in deaths per capita. There is no catastrophic overrunning of hospitals in the state.

There were mistakes made and they have course corrected, but acting like it%u2019s a war zone there just because cases are up is absurd hyperbole. I%u2019m sure you%u2019ll say %u201Cjust wait, they are coming!%u201D  But at this point, it%u2019s unnecessary exaggeration.  There is a LONG ways to go before their per capita numbers get in line with other states, much less gross.

Texas is one of the states that has also deliberately undercounted cases and deaths by refusing to follow CDC guidelines on probable/suspected cases/deaths. But I didn't say anything about death rates. I'm equally concerned about increased spread and possible long-term damage to individuals that does not get taken into consideration in simple death numbers (e.g. permanent damage to the heart/lungs/kidneys/brain).

And how have they course corrected? They still do not allow local municipalities to set their own rules regarding reopening. It was only a week ago, that Abbott was saying they didn't have a problem and it was just increases in testing, despite that being a provable lie. They may be getting their act together now (who knows, no real evidence of that yet), but applauding their actions/decisions and saying they have taken a targeted approach is inaccurate. Up to now they have taken a blanket and authoritarian approach.

You also have Houston having to open Children's hospitals to adults, because of surges of patients. And they will only see increases in cases with nothing changing on the policy side.

[MU Fan in Connecticut]

Outside the box thinking.

IU discovery could lead to virus-killing masks
By Shari Rudavsky Indianapolis Star

https://www.southbendtribune.com/coronavirus/iu-discovery-could-lead-to-virus-killing-masks/article_8a6c2e8e-b4a6-11ea-a31d-b7778f05275e.html

[Galway Eagle]

Outside the box thinking.

IU discovery could lead to virus-killing masks
By Shari Rudavsky Indianapolis Star

https://www.southbendtribune.com/coronavirus/iu-discovery-could-lead-to-virus-killing-masks/article_8a6c2e8e-b4a6-11ea-a31d-b7778f05275e.html

So at least one school will have sports this year

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

EU opening their borders back up on July 1.

And may bar travel from the United States.

[MU82]

Texas is one of the states that has also deliberately undercounted cases and deaths by refusing to follow CDC guidelines on probable/suspected cases/deaths. But I didn't say anything about death rates. I'm equally concerned about increased spread and possible long-term damage to individuals that does not get taken into consideration in simple death numbers (e.g. permanent damage to the heart/lungs/kidneys/brain).

And how have they course corrected? They still do not allow local municipalities to set their own rules regarding reopening. It was only a week ago, that Abbott was saying they didn't have a problem and it was just increases in testing, despite that being a provable lie. They may be getting their act together now (who knows, no real evidence of that yet), but applauding their actions/decisions and saying they have taken a targeted approach is inaccurate. Up to now they have taken a blanket and authoritarian approach.

You also have Houston having to open Children's hospitals to adults, because of surges of patients. And they will only see increases in cases with nothing changing on the policy side.

Excellent comment, all true.

One of the under-told tragedies from this pandemic are the number of "survivors" who are suffering severe health issues, especially to their lungs and kidneys. Many of the conditions will plague these poor folks for the rest of their lives. My wife and I know two of them; one is an obese man who nonetheless had a healthy heart at his most recent checkup in 2018 but now has serious heart issues. The other is a 40-year-old woman who works at the hospital with my wife; she had no previous health issues but ended up getting very sick, spent a couple weeks on a ventilator and now has serious lung problems that might end up being permanent.

We fixate on the dead, for obvious reasons, and we cheer those whose cases are mild and/or who recover completely, again for obvious reasons. But there are thousands and thousands of Americans who won't really "recover" from this.

Changing the subject slightly but sticking with your comment ...

I won't ever trust the numbers from Texas or Florida. They cooked the books, they went wide open early, they are now suffering the consequences, and they still won't give accurate data.

[GooooMarquette]

EU opening their borders back up on July 1.

And may bar travel from the United States.

Unfortunately, I wouldn’t blame them a bit. Heck, I doubt we will be able to even go to Canada anytime soon.

[mu03eng]

Excellent comment, all true.

One of the under-told tragedies from this pandemic are the number of "survivors" who are suffering severe health issues, especially to their lungs and kidneys. Many of the conditions will plague these poor folks for the rest of their lives. My wife and I know two of them; one is an obese man who nonetheless had a healthy heart at his most recent checkup in 2018 but now has serious heart issues. The other is a 40-year-old woman who works at the hospital with my wife; she had no previous health issues but ended up getting very sick, spent a couple weeks on a ventilator and now has serious lung problems that might end up being permanent.

We fixate on the dead, for obvious reasons, and we cheer those whose cases are mild and/or who recover completely, again for obvious reasons. But there are thousands and thousands of Americans who won't really "recover" from this.

Changing the subject slightly but sticking with your comment ...

I won't ever trust the numbers from Texas or Florida. They cooked the books, they went wide open early, they are now suffering the consequences, and they still won't give accurate data.

1. Your point is well founded on long term health impacts, but I do wonder what is attributed to the nature of the virus and what is attributed to our lack of treatment protocols in the early days. A lot of the long term effects may be from the treatments received versus the virus itself. Extremely anecdotal but I have two colleagues that are roughly the same age, health, etc....one got Covid in early March in the Boston area and another got it last month in Wisconsin. Even though they were in roughly the same shape when admitted, the guy is Boston has had a much longer road to recovery than the Wisconsin one. We had a conversation about their treatment plans and it was very different. Early patients were literally experimented on, and some of that is going to have an impact.

To your last contention, I have zero evidence to say whether you are wrong or right (very likely right) but wouldn't that then make it realistic that other states might be cooking the books in the opposite direction?

[Frenns Liquor Depot]

To your last contention, I have zero evidence to say whether you are wrong or right (very likely right) but wouldn't that then make it realistic that other states might be cooking the books in the opposite direction?

I don't think this is happening to any strong degree (estimating high) based on the excess death analyses that occurred - still significant unexplained excess death pretty much everywhere. I am sure there are debatable instances/examples though - bound to happen.  So by in large all under-counting...the question is just by how much.  In India & other Emerging markets...a ton -- in texas probably less so.  In other states trying to follow the CDC guideline to a 'T' probably even less.

Also, I dont believe there is a strong incentive to over-count.  No money, more scrutiny from your people, makes the environment seem out of control.  No politician that wants to get re-elected is going to make their situation look materially more extreme. 

I think there is one person that certainly thinks otherwise--but that person also thinks everything is about that person.

[GooooMarquette]

One of the under-told tragedies from this pandemic are the number of "survivors" who are suffering severe health issues, especially to their lungs and kidneys. Many of the conditions will plague these poor folks for the rest of their lives. My wife and I know two of them; one is an obese man who nonetheless had a healthy heart at his most recent checkup in 2018 but now has serious heart issues. The other is a 40-year-old woman who works at the hospital with my wife; she had no previous health issues but ended up getting very sick, spent a couple weeks on a ventilator and now has serious lung problems that might end up being permanent.

We fixate on the dead, for obvious reasons, and we cheer those whose cases are mild and/or who recover completely, again for obvious reasons. But there are thousands and thousands of Americans who won't really "recover" from this.

Yep. In addition to long-term lung, kidney and heart issues, there is a well-documented post-intensive care syndrome, where people can experience PTSD, anxiety and depression.

And many of the people who suffer strokes and survive will likely suffer a range of long-term neurological symptoms.