COVID-19 (f/k/a "the Coronavirus")

[pbiflyer]

This is why it is a bad idea.

Efforts to treat COVID-19 lead to drug shortage for lupus, rheumatoid arthritis patients
https://kutv.com/news/coronavirus/efforts-to-treat-covid-19-leads-to-drug-shortage-for-lupus-rheumatoid-arthritis-patients

A drug being studied in the treatment of coronavirus is causing a drug shortage for patients with lupus and rheumatoid arthritis.

The drug in question is Hydroxychloroquine (HCQ).

[forgetful]

But this IS a mistake made by Cuomo...Because of an executive order issued by the Democratic governor, any new prescriptions for hydroxychloroquine must go through the already overrun hospital system. This makes no sense.

And...Doctors DO want to prescribe it...

I live on Long Island and many doctors are telling me that they want to prescribe this medication to their patients who test positive for COVID-19 – the disease caused by the coronavirus – but do NOT need the patient to come to a hospital. However, Cuomo’s executive order forbids pharmacies from filling the prescriptions.

It was not a mistake for multiple reasons. The mistake was Trump touting this as a miracle cure. I enumerate several of the reasons below.

1. Immediately after Trump announced this, there was rampant illegal hoarding of the medication by doctors. That led to shortages for those that need this for severe illnesses.

2. Even if we only treated those with severe symptoms in NY, it would require well over 1M dosages in NYC alone right now. That doesn't take into the consideration all the cases coming in the next month. Nor does it take into consideration those that need this medication for other purposes. There will be shortages, and there is zero evidence of this having a prophylactic effect. Also, doctor's are diagnosing COVID based on "symptoms" and not positive tests. That would lead to 5-10x as many people being prescribed the medication than necessary.

So if we are going to start giving it to people as a prophylactic, they need a minimum of 200M dosages. And since it is being used as a prophylactic, and not only when there are severe symptoms, that number (longer duration) is like 1B+.

3. The medication, particularly in combination with azithromycin, can cause severe heart issues. It is recommended that patients cardiac function be monitored continuously, and they undergo an EKG at least every 2-days. This cannot be done at home, and is much higher risk than mild symptoms from COVID-19.

4. Administering these medication could have deleterious effects in general, and may complicate other treatment options if their condition worsens. The half-life of these drugs is on the order of 1-month. That means you can't just cease taking it, and the medication is gone 1-2 days later.

[WarriorDad]

This is why it is a bad idea.

Efforts to treat COVID-19 lead to drug shortage for lupus, rheumatoid arthritis patients
https://kutv.com/news/coronavirus/efforts-to-treat-covid-19-leads-to-drug-shortage-for-lupus-rheumatoid-arthritis-patients

A drug being studied in the treatment of coronavirus is causing a drug shortage for patients with lupus and rheumatoid arthritis.

The drug in question is Hydroxychloroquine (HCQ).

6000 doctors globally surveyed about the pandemic.  Answers are eye-opening.  The most effective treatment response doctors have seen is HCQ.

The questions are good and the responses insightful.  Is your government ready and helpful?  PPE availability.  Treatment options. 

https://public-cdn.sermo.com/covid19/c8/be4e/4edbd4/dbd4ba4ac5a3b3d9a479f99cc5/wave-i-sermo-covid-19-global-analysis-final.pdf

[forgetful]

6000 doctors globally surveyed about the pandemic.  Answers are eye-opening.  The most effective treatment response doctors have seen is HCQ.

The questions are good and the responses insightful.  Is your government ready and helpful?  PPE availability.  Treatment options. 

https://public-cdn.sermo.com/covid19/c8/be4e/4edbd4/dbd4ba4ac5a3b3d9a479f99cc5/wave-i-sermo-covid-19-global-analysis-final.pdf

There have been two published trials with a control group. One saw no benefit at all. The other saw a minor benefit, but didn't have enough patients to know if it would be actually statistically significant.

[Lennys Tap]

There are 10s of thousands of deaths on the hands of this administration that could’ve been prevented if we had even remote competence currently leading the country. And our economy is heading to places worse than it was during the Great Depression. Hard to do worse than that.

First, Trump and his minions (in your view) haven’t killed “10s of thousands” since the current death toll is 8,486. But (sadly) 10 of thousands will surely eventually perish.

You evidently believe that both the loss of life AND the economy grinding to a halt in an effort to mitigate that loss of life were avoidable. Why you haven’t shared your plan to simultaneously prevent any deaths and continue our economic boom is a mystery. But better late than never. Let’s hear it.

[WarriorDad]

There are 10s of thousands of deaths on the hands of this administration that could’ve been prevented if we had even remote competence currently leading the country. And our economy is heading to places worse than it was during the Great Depression. Hard to do worse than that.

I remember when other countries looked to America for leadership in times of crisis. What country in their right mind would turn to the United States of America for help in fighting what the world is going through right now? Truly Making America Great Again.

But hey at least when the weather warms up this whole covid thing will miraculously disappear, the cases in America will be at nearly zero, and our country will be back open for business by next Sunday.

Do you believe in an election year someone else would not have been hesitant to shut down the economy?  The guy at the top has made some extremely poor comments and decisions, but he has also made some good ones that were criticized (banning travel).

If the administration has 10000 deaths on its hands and most of the deaths are coming from New York where those leaders made poor comments and decisions are they absolved? 

This is a state vs federal constitutional issue.  The Federal gov't cannot force martial law or shelter in place based on what I have read.  The feds can make recommendations, but the states have to decide for their citizens what is appropriate.  Any order by the feds is symbolic with no enforceable nature.

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/488735-could-trump-declare-national-coronavirus-shutdown-momentum-is-rising

Legal experts say Trump cannot order a shelter in place.  Spain, Italy, France have different constitutions that allow their leaders to do that.  We do not.  Wanting to do something and having the legal ability to do so are two different things.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/03/30/coronavirus-stay-home-shelter-in-place-orders-by-state/5092413002/

[WarriorDad]

There have been two published trials with a control group. One saw no benefit at all. The other saw a minor benefit, but didn't have enough patients to know if it would be actually statistically significant.

Doctors in the field appear to be seeing some benefit based on their answers.  Maybe it is a placebo effect, but that is their response in a broad, global-based questionnaire.  What did you think of the other questions and answers in the document?

[TSmith34, Inc.]

If you or a loved one has little to no chance of survival from Covid-19, but this COULD possibly save your life...you're not going to take it?? I call BS if you say you wouldn't. I'm not talking about giving this to people with mild symptoms. I'm talking about giving this to people who's outcomes are otherwise grim. At that point, what is there to lose??

Which situation has nothing to do with your earlier statement

[WarriorDad]

I said this two years ago here, there is no room for moderates.  The hyper-partisans (who think they are moderate by the way) have made this country into what it is now. No difference in these message responses. There is no room for moderates which is unfortunate.

Entirely predictable.  Same people, too.

[Galway Eagle]

I said this two years ago here, there is no room for moderates.  The hyper-partisans (who think they are moderate by the way) have made this country into what it is now. No difference in these message responses. There is no room for moderates which is unfortunate.

Entirely predictable.  Same people, too.

Classic combination of right wing nationalist nazi and left wing socialist libtard response

[wadesworld]

First, Trump and his minions (in your view) haven’t killed “10s of thousands” since the current death toll is 8,486. But (sadly) 10 of thousands will surely eventually perish.

You evidently believe that both the loss of life AND the economy grinding to a halt in an effort to mitigate that loss of life were avoidable. Why you haven’t shared your plan to simultaneously prevent any deaths and continue our economic boom is a mystery. But better late than never. Let’s hear it.

Avoidable? No. Who said that?

I’m glad people think that, even though we were watching this play out in foreign countries for months before we got hit by the coronavirus, the country that was best equipped to handle a pandemic is going to be the hardest hit country in the world by this.

I’m sure nothing any administration could’ve done could’ve changed the trajectory of this pandemic in the USA. 

It’s honestly terrifying people think the administration hasn’t failed at every possible step of this thing.

But we’re good. Donald and Jerad have control of this. As promised, everyone who wants a test has one, our cases are down to nearly 0 by April, and as the weather has warmed up this thing has just gone away, like a miracle, and as a result America will be back open for business a week from today. We’ve nailed this response.

[muguru]

Apologies if this has already been posted elsewhere

https://twitter.com/WLNSAlexSims/status/1246479343087497217?s=20

[wadesworld]

Do you believe in an election year someone else would not have been hesitant to shut down the economy?  The guy at the top has made some extremely poor comments and decisions, but he has also made some good ones that were criticized (banning travel).

If the administration has 10000 deaths on its hands and most of the deaths are coming from New York where those leaders made poor comments and decisions are they absolved? 

This is a state vs federal constitutional issue.  The Federal gov't cannot force martial law or shelter in place based on what I have read.  The feds can make recommendations, but the states have to decide for their citizens what is appropriate.  Any order by the feds is symbolic with no enforceable nature.

https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/488735-could-trump-declare-national-coronavirus-shutdown-momentum-is-rising

Legal experts say Trump cannot order a shelter in place.  Spain, Italy, France have different constitutions that allow their leaders to do that.  We do not.  Wanting to do something and having the legal ability to do so are two different things.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2020/03/30/coronavirus-stay-home-shelter-in-place-orders-by-state/5092413002/

I’d say therein lies the problem, that we have a “leader” who’s more concerned about a re-election than the health and well being of the people of the country. But the reality is it has nothing to do with being an election year and everything to do with his ego. Year 1 or year for of his term, it doesn’t matter. Don’t listen to the experts in place, fire them if it would at all ding your reputation, and worry about the deaths you’ll be dealing with when they’re mounting rather than doing your best ahead of time so they’re limited.

Reacting at every step rather than being proactive. Always the sign of a good “leader.”

[Pakuni]

First, Trump and his minions (in your view) haven’t killed “10s of thousands” since the current death toll is 8,486. But (sadly) 10 of thousands will surely eventually perish.

You evidently believe that both the loss of life AND the economy grinding to a halt in an effort to mitigate that loss of life were avoidable. Why you haven’t shared your plan to simultaneously prevent any deaths and continue our economic boom is a mystery. But better late than never. Let’s hear it.

It would be impossible to prevent all deaths from this, just as it would impossible to prevent all economic hardship. But certainly a more proactive approach initiated much earlier on a national scale could have spared a fair amount of both.
Look no further than Germany or South Korea.

[muguru]

Avoidable? No. Who said that?

I’m glad people think that, even though we were watching this play out in foreign countries for months before we got hit by the coronavirus, the country that was best equipped to handle a pandemic is going to be the hardest hit country in the world by this.

I’m sure nothing any administration could’ve done could’ve changed the trajectory of this pandemic in the USA. 

It’s honestly terrifying people think the administration hasn’t failed at every possible step of this thing.

But we’re good. Donald and Jerad have control of this. As promised, everyone who wants a test has one, our cases are down to nearly 0 by April, and as the weather has warmed up this thing has just gone away, like a miracle, and as a result America will be back open for business a week from today. We’ve nailed this response.

I hate to rain on your parade and your agenda...somehow you will spin this, or just deny it, I'm sure..

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/public_approval_of_president_trumps_handling_of_the_coronavirus-7088.html

[forgetful]

Doctors in the field appear to be seeing some benefit based on their answers.  Maybe it is a placebo effect, but that is their response in a broad, global-based questionnaire.  What did you think of the other questions and answers in the document?

Doctors in the field making a claim without a control is largely meaningless. Also, 51% think doing nothing is better than any other treatment, so if you do want to accept uncontrolled data, the data says do nothing.

The rest of the questions largely reflect what everyone else is saying. We are grossly failing on testing and providing medical care providers with the basic necessities.

[Archies Bat]

Do you want this thread to be locked?

Because this is how you get threads locked.

IBTL.

Thanks all.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I hate to rain on your parade and your agenda...somehow you will spin this, or just deny it, I'm sure..

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/public_approval_of_president_trumps_handling_of_the_coronavirus-7088.html

You just made his point. 

Because it's very clear his administration handled very poorly at the beginning, and is still playing catch up and getting diverted today.  It obviously isn't entirely his fault.  China was too secretive for too long.  And the CDC screwed things up at certain points as well.

But the obvious and clear fact is that we lost a lot of time because his administration ignored warnings.

[MU82]

Classic combination of right wing nationalist nazi and left wing socialist libtard response

I laughed. And we all need a few of those these days.

[Pakuni]

Do you believe in an election year someone else would not have been hesitant to shut down the economy?  The guy at the top has made some extremely poor comments and decisions, but he has also made some good ones that were criticized (banning travel

The travel restrictions, the effectiveness of which is far from certain, came way too late anyhow.
Could you provide some links - reputable, please, not random people ranting on Reddit or Facebook - that were critical of the travel ban?
I know they're out there ... just curious if you know what the criticism was about.

[Pakuni]

I hate to rain on your parade and your agenda...somehow you will spin this, or just deny it, I'm sure..

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/public_approval_of_president_trumps_handling_of_the_coronavirus-7088.html

The most recent poll shows the majority of Americans disapprove of Trump's handling of the crisis.
Hooray?

[WarriorDad]

Are we supposed to be anti-drug companies still during this time, or are we relaxing our disdain for them? 

I have never understood this position.  The best, brightest should be working at drug companies to develop new drugs for humanity. That comes with great cost in research and compensation, but we have done a good job of attacking that industry.  If you want good quality outcomes you need to pay the price.  The source of funding for research is the sale of the products.  It is unfortunate, but a necessary evil in a capitalist country.  It is my sincere hope that these companies can find a vaccine or other drugs that work to combat this crisis.

[#UnleashSean]

Are we supposed to be anti-drug companies still during this time, or are we relaxing our disdain for them? 

I have never understood this position.  The best, brightest should be working at drug companies to develop new drugs for humanity. That comes with great cost in research and compensation, but we have done a good job of attacking that industry.  If you want good quality outcomes you need to pay the price.  The source of funding for research is the sale of the products.  It is unfortunate, but a necessary evil in a capitalist country.  It is my sincere hope that these companies can find a vaccine or other drugs that work to combat this crisis.

Yay for a 1000 dollar epipen that costs 2 dollars to make? You're wrong here bud, you're wrong.

[forgetful]

Serious non-partisan government related question.

Congress is at home during one of the largest crises in recent history. From there, they largely are unable to partake in classified briefings. They are unable to vote, and are largely doing nothing during a "recess".

Doctors, nurses, first-responders, are working around the clock. Even bus drivers, fast-food workers, and grocery clerks are working, as they are "essential".

Isn't congress absolutely "essential" at this time. Shouldn't they be in Washington, where they can get access to classified briefings, and come up with strategies to help get through this? If not, what good are they, if when there is an actual emergency, they aren't needed?

[Pakuni]

 Coronavirus Update: @pzf

Great news from New York:
- Number of new cases down
- Number of new deaths down
- Number of new hospitalizations down
- Number of new ICU patients down
- Number of newly discharged patients up