Miss the NCAA tournament??

[BallBoy]

Yep. If he’s smart he will move on.

Who wants this?  If Wojo made a run he would hit your metrics for a good coach. Why would you then want him to be grabbed by someone else?  If you haven’t been paying attention Wojo has us swimming with more five star recruits then any of the last coaches. He has two more McD AA then any previous coach. You want to lose that for some unknown coach?  For some reason, those five stars love his system.  He will make three NCAA tournaments in four years and if your wish plays out he would have a sweet sixteen.

Why would you want him to take that elsewhere? 

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

Who wants this?  If Wojo made a run he would hit your metrics for a good coach. Why would you then want him to be grabbed by someone else?  If you haven’t been paying attention Wojo has us swimming with more five star recruits then any of the last coaches. He has two more McD AA then any previous coach. You want to lose that for some unknown coach?  For some reason, those five stars love his system.  He will make three NCAA tournaments in four years and if your wish plays out he would have a sweet sixteen.

Why would you want him to take that elsewhere? 

I want him to leave.  Because despite the fact that he is a good recruiter, I don't think he's a very good coach.  Sure top recruits love his system - because he builds it around them and showcases them in the process.  But that always hasn't translated into team success.  The end of this season is starting to look distrubingly like last year.

I think we have peaked with Wojo.  I want Marquette's peak to be higher than this.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Bailey, koby and sacar had scored a total of one basket until the last 4 minutes of the game.  They hit the equivalent of a few ninth inning homers in a game they were losing 10-0. 
SHU role players hit open shots, MUs bricked them at an alarmingly poor rate.
Story of MUs season is not hitting open shots.  In all of our losses those three have usually combined to shoot an atrocious number. Yesterday, they were 7-27 combined and that includes sacars 4 baskets and brendans 1 in the last 3 minutes.  Before the last 3-4 minutes they were a combined 2-22, simply horrendous and not going to beat anyone.

[leever]

Bailey, koby and sacar had scored a total of one basket until the last 4 minutes of the game.  They hit the equivalent of a few ninth inning homers in a game they were losing 10-0. 
SHU role players hit open shots, MUs bricked them at an alarmingly poor rate.
Story of MUs season is not hitting open shots.  In all of our losses those three have usually combined to shoot an atrocious number. Yesterday, they were 7-27 combined and that includes sacars 4 baskets and brendans 1 in the last 3 minutes.  Before the last 3-4 minutes they were a combined 2-22, simply horrendous and not going to beat anyone.

This was such a good "take" that you needed to post it word for word in two different topics this morning?

[WarriorDad]

Just counting at large only teams..for my money..20-25 maximum.

If MU is invited to play they deserve to play.  There are typically 2 or 3 teams that people question if they deserve to be in each season.  You are the most entitled fan on this message forum and that is a high bar. 

Maybe Marquette announces a 5 year extension to drive some people to another team where they will be pleased.   

[cheebs09]

I want him to leave.  Because despite the fact that he is a good recruiter, I don't think he's a very good coach.  Sure top recruits love his system - because he builds it around them and showcases them in the process.  But that always hasn't translated into team success.  The end of this season is starting to look distrubingly like last year.

I think we have peaked with Wojo.  I want Marquette's peak to be higher than this.

This is where I’m at. He does good getting a star, but the teams rarely seem  cohesive. Especially on defense. I don’t know that we have much of a defensive system that he recruits for.

[BM1090]

This is where I’m at. He does good getting a star, but the teams rarely seem  cohesive. Especially on defense. I don’t know that we have much of a defensive system that he recruits for.

It's a bit odd since 2017 was our best offensive team and the only season in the past four that was pretty balanced.

[Elonsmusk]

Who wants this?  If Wojo made a run he would hit your metrics for a good coach. Why would you then want him to be grabbed by someone else?  If you haven’t been paying attention Wojo has us swimming with more five star recruits then any of the last coaches. He has two more McD AA then any previous coach. You want to lose that for some unknown coach?  For some reason, those five stars love his system.  He will make three NCAA tournaments in four years and if your wish plays out he would have a sweet sixteen.

Why would you want him to take that elsewhere?

If* is the issue. I don’t think we make a Sweet 16 this year. We take a step back next year.

End of the day I don’t think Wojo is a good enough coach to win at the Sweet 16 level, unless he’s got a team of 5/4 stars. I don’t think we can count on landing 5/4 star talent year in, year out to cover for his coaching deficiencies.

I’ve said before - Wojo is a good guy, reps school well, however I don’t see him being especially bright, charismatic, or inspiring. He’s best suited to be an Assistant Coach.

I’d rather move on and give Stan a chance. Stan is our ace recruiter, he seemed right on in his analysis yesterday during the in the huddle segment - and certainly is more compelling/charismatic. Promote from within. Butler has. Xavier has. MU did with Buzz.

I think we’ve seen the ceiling with Wojo. Sure. We could do worse, yet I don’t feel it’s ever a good practice in business to keep an employee in the highest profile position, out of fear their successor could be worse. (Particularly when 3 of the last 4 “CEO’s” performed better.)

[BM1090]

I just don't understand the logic of wanting Wojo gone but also wanting to promote someone from his staff.

[Elonsmusk]

I just don't understand the logic of wanting Wojo gone but also wanting to promote someone from his staff.

Because Stan’s proven to be a great recruiter, knows our players, recruits and program inside out.

However, assistant coaches do NOT have the authority to press the buttons during games as it relates to roles, rotations, playing time. They give input, but head coach ultimately decides who plays when, where, and in what capacity.

[BM1090]

Because Stan’s proven to be a great recruiter, knows our players, recruits and program inside out.

However, assistant coaches do NOT have the authority to press the buttons during games as it relates to roles, rotations, playing time. They give input, but head coach ultimately decides who plays when, where, and in what capacity.

I don't necessarily want Wojo gone but if he is fired I'd prefer they just do an overhaul. No half measures to keep the recruiting class. I'd rather just stick with Wojo if those are the options.

Maybe Stan is great and proves me wrong at MU or somewhere else, but I just don't see that as a viable solution.

[BallBoy]

If* is the issue. I don’t think we make a Sweet 16 this year. We take a step back next year.

End of the day I don’t think Wojo is a good enough coach to win at the Sweet 16 level, unless he’s got a team of 5/4 stars. I don’t think we can count on landing 5/4 star talent year in, year out to cover for his coaching deficiencies.

I’ve said before - Wojo is a good guy, reps school well, however I don’t see him being especially bright, charismatic, or inspiring. He’s best suited to be an Assistant Coach.

I’d rather move on and give Stan a chance. Stan is our ace recruiter, he seemed right on in his analysis yesterday during the in the huddle segment - and certainly is more compelling/charismatic. Promote from within. Butler has. Xavier has. MU did with Buzz.

I think we’ve seen the ceiling with Wojo. Sure. We could do worse, yet I don’t feel it’s ever a good practice in business to keep an employee in the highest profile position, out of fear their successor could be worse. (Particularly when 3 of the last 4 “CEO’s” performed better.)

The assistant coaches are task with doing the game plan and the advance scout. They rotate between the two of them. Stan did the advanced scout for Seton Hall. That is why Wojo was letting him talk in the huddle.

Your comments about Wojo needing good players to win is a homer simpsonism at its best. Of course coaches need better players to be a great team. The art is convincing those better players to come to your team. Takes time.

Just for comparison, in Buzz’s first year he had 3 future NBA players. We can argue that he was responsible for 1 of them in Butler in second year at MU. Butler only played two years under Buzz as head coach. Second year he had four NBA players. Third year he had four. Fourth year he had two (not including Juan), fifth 1 if we include Vander and year six one if we include Deonte.

If we look at this criteria than better players equals better results as a coach.

That isn’t player development either because DJO and Crowder were both good coming in. Crowder only played two years and was a stud both of them.

We can debate that Buzz’s talent was finding underrated Jucos who were ready to make an impact and that made him good. If we look at the four year non-juco player his track record for developing talent isn’t quite as good. 

The point however is that Buzz has better players so the results were better. If Wojo gets better players the results will be better. Wojo’s starting point had zero nba players.

[BM1090]

The assistant coaches are task with doing the game plan and the advance scout. They rotate between the two of them. Stan did the advanced scout for Seton Hall. That is why Wojo was letting him talk in the huddle.

Your comments about Wojo needing good players to win is a homer simpsonism at its best. Of course coaches need better players to be a great team. The art is convincing those better players to come to your team. Takes time.

Just for comparison, in Buzz’s first year he had 3 future NBA players. We can argue that he was responsible for 1 of them in Butler in second year at MU. Butler only played two years under Buzz as head coach. Second year he had four NBA players. Third year he had four. Fourth year he had two (not including Juan), fifth 1 if we include Vander and year six one if we include Deonte.

If we look at this criteria than better players equals better results as a coach.

That isn’t player development either because DJO and Crowder were both good coming in. Crowder only played two years and was a stud both of them.

We can debate that Buzz’s talent was finding underrated Jucos who were ready to make an impact and that made him good. If we look at the four year non-juco player his track record for developing talent isn’t quite as good. 

The point however is that Buzz has better players so the results were better. If Wojo gets better players the results will be better. Wojo’s starting point had zero nba players.

Mostly agree but all three of Jimmy's years were when Buzz was head coach.

[bilsu]

Right now Creighton is losing at St. John's at halftime.
I think MU is in the tournament even if they lose to DePaul, St. John's and the first game in the Big East tournament.
I also think we have no chance to win a game in the NCAA tournament. It has nothing to do with coaching.
The teams in the NCAA tournament are generally going to be more solid teams overall than MU. MU cannot win with Howard and Anim alone.
Wojo lost his first two NCAA games to more solid teams.
Wojo has done a good job getting three defective teams to the NCAA tournament.
However, Wojo is responsible for team building so ultimately he is responsible.

I think that is the basic difference between other posters and myself. Other posters tend to think MU has talent and Wojo's coaching is holding them down. I do not think Wojo's teams have had a lot of talent overall.

I do not follow it closely enough to know how they actually have fared in NBA, but South Carolina had some potential NBA players on it. Murray St. had the guard who most likely will be NBA rookie of the year this year.

[Elonsmusk]

The assistant coaches are task with doing the game plan and the advance scout. They rotate between the two of them. Stan did the advanced scout for Seton Hall. That is why Wojo was letting him talk in the huddle.

Your comments about Wojo needing good players to win is a homer simpsonism at its best. Of course coaches need better players to be a great team. The art is convincing those better players to come to your team. Takes time.

Just for comparison, in Buzz’s first year he had 3 future NBA players. We can argue that he was responsible for 1 of them in Butler in second year at MU. Butler only played two years under Buzz as head coach. Second year he had four NBA players. Third year he had four. Fourth year he had two (not including Juan), fifth 1 if we include Vander and year six one if we include Deonte.

If we look at this criteria than better players equals better results as a coach.

That isn’t player development either because DJO and Crowder were both good coming in. Crowder only played two years and was a stud both of them.

We can debate that Buzz’s talent was finding underrated Jucos who were ready to make an impact and that made him good. If we look at the four year non-juco player his track record for developing talent isn’t quite as good. 

The point however is that Buzz has better players so the results were better. If Wojo gets better players the results will be better. Wojo’s starting point had zero nba players.

Again. Assistant coaches do not decide starting lineup, rotation, playing time. Those decisions matter most. Of course scouting is part of an assistants job - but once the game starts it isn’t the assistant hi gets to decided who’s in/out.

That aside, who is in charge of the roster/talent in the program?  Why bag on Buzz?  He got it done. Wojo’s development of 4 year high school players?  It’s been abysmal - mostly filled with transfer and regression.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

Again...I said ignore the metrics, and this is where the good old eye test comes in...if you have watched enough CBB this year and have seen other teams enough...does this team really and truly look/play like an NCAA tournament team to you?? Ignore the fact that they have to take 68 teams, and that other teams will be in there that don't really deserve to be either, but in a typical year, would you say they are NCAA quality with the way they have played this year?? It's an honest question..

To me, they MIGHT be..but barely, and that's the exact issue to me...You can't expect them to get in every year and get really high seeds, but I don't like them getting in and essentially backing their way in. That doesn't make me feel very good.

You are one miserable dude.

[NickelDimer]

Right now Creighton is losing at St. John's at halftime.
I think MU is in the tournament even if they lose to DePaul, St. John's and the first game in the Big East tournament.
I also think we have no chance to win a game in the NCAA tournament. It has nothing to do with coaching.
The teams in the NCAA tournament are generally going to be more solid teams overall than MU. MU cannot win with Howard and Anim alone.
Wojo lost his first two NCAA games to more solid teams.
Wojo has done a good job getting three defective teams to the NCAA tournament.
However, Wojo is responsible for team building so ultimately he is responsible.

I think that is the basic difference between other posters and myself. Other posters tend to think MU has talent and Wojo's coaching is holding them down. I do not think Wojo's teams have had a lot of talent overall.

I do not follow it closely enough to know how they actually have fared in NBA, but South Carolina had some potential NBA players on it. Murray St. had the guard who most likely will be NBA rookie of the year this year.

First, saying winning or losing whether in the tournament or otherwise has nothing to do with coaching is nuts.

Second, last year’s team didn’t have talent? The fuq? We were definitely more talented than Murray State and while they had Ja we had Markus. We got housed and that had everything to do with poor coaching.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

Also, to answer the question - MU could lose their next 3 without even being in any of the games, Markus break his leg and we’d still get in. MU is nowhere near the true bubble.

0-3: 9/10 seed

1-2: 7/8 seed

2-1: 6/7 seed

3-1: 6 seed

Win out including BET, we probably get up to a 5. Don’t see that as overly likely.

[Mr. Sand-Knit]

Right now Creighton is losing at St. John's at halftime.
I think MU is in the tournament even if they lose to DePaul, St. John's and the first game in the Big East tournament.
I also think we have no chance to win a game in the NCAA tournament. It has nothing to do with coaching.
The teams in the NCAA tournament are generally going to be more solid teams overall than MU. MU cannot win with Howard and Anim alone.
Wojo lost his first two NCAA games to more solid teams.
Wojo has done a good job getting three defective teams to the NCAA tournament.
However, Wojo is responsible for team building so ultimately he is responsible.

I think that is the basic difference between other posters and myself. Other posters tend to think MU has talent and Wojo's coaching is holding them down. I do not think Wojo's teams have had a lot of talent overall.

I do not follow it closely enough to know how they actually have fared in NBA, but South Carolina had some potential NBA players on it. Murray St. had the guard who most likely will be NBA rookie of the year this year.

I agree fully
Unfortunately our two best players rn are howard n Jayce.  When we were playing well bailey was playing well.  Some for some reason think Anim is better then bad, he is not good at all.  Right now we have 3 well below average starters in Anim, Bailey and Koby.  None if them would start on good teams.  We are Markus howard away from being a rather bad team.  Those three missed wide open shot after shot after shot the last month.

[ATL MU Warrior]

First, saying winning or losing whether in the tournament or otherwise has nothing to do with coaching is nuts.

Second, last year’s team didn’t have talent? The fuq? We were definitely more talented than Murray State and while they had Ja we had Markus. We got housed and that had everything to do with poor coaching.

Did you really just compare a likely NBA rookie of the year and future perennial all-star to Markus, who will be fortunate to stick on an NBA roster? 

They are light years apart. Ja ran that team and dominated the game in virtually every aspect. Markus...shot a lot.

[NickelDimer]

Did you really just compare a likely NBA rookie of the year and future perennial all-star to Markus, who will be fortunate to stick on an NBA roster? 

They are light years apart. Ja ran that team and dominated the game in virtually every aspect. Markus...shot a lot.

Nope I didn’t. But it’s not like we took the court without our own NPOY candidate. On top of that we had more talent around Markus than Ja. And we got dragged.

[warriorfred]

I want him to leave.  Because despite the fact that he is a good recruiter, I don't think he's a very good coach.  Sure top recruits love his system - because he builds it around them and showcases them in the process.  But that always hasn't translated into team success.  The end of this season is starting to look distrubingly like last year.

I think we have peaked with Wojo.  I want Marquette's peak to be higher than this.

On this we agree.

[BallBoy]

Again. Assistant coaches do not decide starting lineup, rotation, playing time. Those decisions matter most. Of course scouting is part of an assistants job - but once the game starts it isn’t the assistant hi gets to decided who’s in/out.

That aside, who is in charge of the roster/talent in the program?  Why bag on Buzz?  He got it done. Wojo’s development of 4 year high school players?  It’s been abysmal - mostly filled with transfer and regression.

The more you post the more faux-alpha comes out. No leader acts the way you describe. They take information from their team, they listen and the incorporate that into their decision. I would wager that Stan and the other coaches are aligned to the starters, to the minutes and to the approach and not because Wojo told them how it is going to be.  They understand the goals and know what the coach is doing.  Have you noticed many times the assistants are talking to the player on the bench. Telling them what to do etc.  in most cases the coaching team were discussing their team together.

To steal a line from Wojo it isn’t criticism it is fact. I never stated anything negative about Buzz. I simply stated the simple facts. He had more NBA talent on his teams and they were better. That is solely to point out how dumb it is to say Wojo It takes better talent for Wojo’s team to be better. Of course he will get better with better players.

Wojo has a good track record with making four year players better. Wojo’s transfer rate is no better or worse than Crean’s or Buzz’s.  Sacar is better, Howard is better, Theo is better, Bailey is better, Cain is better,  Sam was better.

[Elonsmusk]

The more you post the more faux-alpha comes out. No leader acts the way you describe. They take information from their team, they listen and the incorporate that into their decision. I would wager that Stan and the other coaches are aligned to the starters, to the minutes and to the approach and not because Wojo told them how it is going to be.  They understand the goals and know what the coach is doing.  Have you noticed many times the assistants are talking to the player on the bench. Telling them what to do etc.  in most cases the coaching team were discussing their team together.

To steal a line from Wojo it isn’t criticism it is fact. I never stated anything negative about Buzz. I simply stated the simple facts. He had more NBA talent on his teams and they were better. That is solely to point out how dumb it is to say Wojo It takes better talent for Wojo’s team to be better. Of course he will get better with better players.

Wojo has a good track record with making four year players better. Wojo’s transfer rate is no better or worse than Crean’s or Buzz’s.  Sacar is better, Howard is better, Theo is better, Bailey is better, Cain is better,  Sam was better.

Assistant coaches actually talk to players during game with advice/coaching?  Who knew?  Thanks for that contribution. In your playing days, did the assistant coaches determine substitutions?  In mine I never was subbed into a game by assistant coaches. I don’t recall watching MU games and seeing Stan call to the bench for a players to sub in.

You see a lot of improvement in Brendan Bailey, Cain, Theo?  Guess you have low standards for what improvement looks like. Markus? Sam?  Both those guys had great freshman campaigns. Players should get incrementally better year over year...but to suggest our 4-year kids have improved massively under Wojo?  Please. At minimum an equal number have transferred out/regressed.

End of the day, you’ve been a die hard Wojo supporter. I sounded the alarm in the 1st semester of Wojo’s time at MU saying he didn’t have it. 6 years later we are still hoping for just a sniff of March success, with most in our fanbase prepared to a step back in Year 7.

Meanwhile you and your infinite wisdom of basketball as a former participant in the Gus Macker tournament (and Intramural champ) continue to try to prop up the thin accomplishment of our head coach. Carry on, faux alpha.

[The Hippie Satan of Hyperbole]

I have a couple ideas who I would want instead of Wojo.  I have no idea if they are interested or if Marquette would have interest in them.  And that's fine because it's not really my job to know.

But Stan is not on that list.