Time Cover: It's Time to Pay College Athletes

[GGGG]

I would use it as a recruiting tool.  Come to UW and I'll guarantee you X number of endorsements valued at $X

Right.  Like that's going to happen.

As other people have mentioned here, the number and value of endorsements that would be available is extremely exaggerated.

And even if it does, it wouldn't be the end of the world.

What's to prevent a booster from telling a recruit if he comes to University X, he'll guarantee $50K for a couple of endorsements? Doesn't the "free market" go out the window when a big time booster wants a big time recruit at their university?

Actually that is pretty much the definition of a free market.

[Tugg Speedman]

What's to prevent a booster from telling a recruit if he comes to University X, he'll guarantee $50K for a couple of endorsements? Doesn't the "free market" go out the window when a big time booster wants a big time recruit at their university?

Interesting that no one pushes back on this statement, that rich boosters will hand suitcases full of money to players, but I get push-back on the idea that they might actually earn money via endorsements and other "personal services" (i.e., meet and greets)

So let me say the amount of money they will be handed is much smaller than most believe and the opportunities to "make money" from their image is much larger than most think.

[Tugg Speedman]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/9669838/photo-shows-johnny-manziel-signing-autographs-south-florida-autograph-broker-drew-tieman

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Interesting that no one pushes back on this statement, that rich boosters will hand suitcases full of money to players, but I get push-back on the idea that they might actually earn money via endorsements and other "personal services" (i.e., meet and greets)

So let me say the amount of money they will be handed is much smaller than most believe and the opportunities to "make money" from their image is much larger than most think.

You're mixing 2 things together.

#1 You initially claimed that MU would be at an advantage because of it's media market and the players would be able to generate more revenue than a player in Madison.

I don't find this true at all, and I have a tough time finding local celebrities (who are about equal with MU players "fame") who make make money endorsing products. I guess there are some local radio guys like Bill Michaels?

#2 If you want to talk about ALL of college basketball, then yes, there are guys on certain teams who will make a lot of money. Also, a guy like T.Boone is likely to just pay the whole team so he can have the best players.

So, in conclusion, yes, certain players in college basketball will be able to cash in on their likeness, but MU isn't likely to be at an advantage because it's a metro area school. There isn't a huge demand for local celebrity endorsements.

Good?

[Tugg Speedman]

You're mixing 2 things together.

#1 You initially claimed that MU would be at an advantage because of it's media market and the players would be able to generate more revenue than a player in Madison.

I don't find this true at all, and I have a tough time finding local celebrities (who are about equal with MU players "fame") who make make money endorsing products. I guess there are some local radio guys like Bill Michaels?

#2 If you want to talk about ALL of college basketball, then yes, there are guys on certain teams who will make a lot of money. Also, a guy like T.Boone is likely to just pay the whole team so he can have the best players.

So, in conclusion, yes, certain players in college basketball will be able to cash in on their likeness, but MU isn't likely to be at an advantage because it's a metro area school. There isn't a huge demand for local celebrity endorsements.

Good?

Keep in mind we are talking about 1 to 3 players a year that would be in the position to make extra money.  The other 9 to 11 are getting compensated enough with a free education.

But those 1 to 3 players are the different between winning the nBE and an also ran.

[forgetful]

Keep in mind we are talking about 1 to 3 players a year that would be in the position to make extra money.  The other 9 to 11 are getting compensated enough with a free education.

But those 1 to 3 players are the different between winning the nBE and an also ran.

I agree that the numbers being able to make money from appearances would be small.  But if there is one thing we know about college sports is that some fans are completely irrational. Case in point the individual that paid $115,000 for the 12th man license plate this year. 

Those people will gladly hand over a lot of money to players to get them to come to their University.  And honestly, they don't care about the persons name or likeness, just that they help team X win.

We do this and we turn college sports into something similar to the gladiators of ancient rome.  People pampered and honored for a few years by the wealthy, with no concern for the well being or long term development.  At least right now making sure they do get a quality education is important.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Right.  Like that's going to happen.

As other people have mentioned here, the number and value of endorsements that would be available is extremely exaggerated.

And even if it does, it wouldn't be the end of the world.

How do you know what the impact would be?  You don't, you are just speculating like the rest of us.

[chapman]

At least the rest of the world got a Putin cover over Mr. Tweet Something Retarded Each Week.

[MerrittsMustache]

Do we really think that will work?  Today the cap on payments is $0, and it doesn't work.  The NCAA has no way to police this stuff, they don't have the resources to police it.  No different, in my opinion, to the jobs these kids are allowed to do today....how often do we already find out the kid never did the job, or was grossly overpaid for the job at hand.  Besides, it would be so easy to cook the books.   "Here Mr. Dekker is your $500 paycheck for the commercial spot limited as the max by the NCAA"  <and under the table is another $5G for all the gas money to get you down here to the studio...good job>

It just becomes another shell game that is tacitly endorsed but difficult to police. 

You really don't see a different between making an appearance somewhere or doing a radio ad and getting paid for a no-show job? There would be a contract so the player wouldn't get paid if he doesn't show up or doesn't film the spot. Pretty easy to prove if those things took place.

Of course, there will be cases when the contract saying $500 and there is money given under the table, but those would be few and far between. Put it this way, do you think any boosters have given Dekker (to use your example) cash under the table? If not, what makes you think they'd do it if he showed up at their sporting goods store for an hour in exchange for a couple hundred bucks?

[MerrittsMustache]

I would use it as a recruiting tool.  Come to UW and I'll guarantee you X number of endorsements valued at $X

That's no different than promising playing time to recruits. It sounds good, but it doesn't really mean anything.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Last week's cover was about Obama and Syria.

I really was trying to figure out why this was so damn important.....apparently the rest of the world got the important stuff, but here in the dumbed down nation we got this.

[ChicosBailBonds]

That's no different than promising playing time to recruits. It sounds good, but it doesn't really mean anything.

Good news is that this fantasy idea of endorsements isn't going to happen any time soon, nor should it. 

[Tugg Speedman]

Good news is that this fantasy idea of endorsements isn't going to happen any time soon, nor should it. 

Endorsements is nothing but the NCAA lifting the outside job restrictions on scholarship athletes, no matter what the job might be.  What's wrong with that?

And again, if the endorsement idea is a bust, then no harm in allowing it.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Endorsements is nothing but the NCAA lifting the outside job restrictions on scholarship athletes, no matter what the job might be.  What's wrong with that?

And again, if the endorsement idea is a bust, then no harm in allowing it.

The harm is this:

Select schools and select alumni with DEEP pockets, will simply purchase the top talent.

T. Boone could afford to sign every player to a 6 figure "appearance contract", and thus, OSU would get the best players. Same for a lot of top schools with rich and/or crazy alumni.

Instead of donating $ to the school, their "donation" will be paying players for an appearance at their son's birthday party.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Keep in mind we are talking about 1 to 3 players a year that would be in the position to make extra money.  The other 9 to 11 are getting compensated enough with a free education.

But those 1 to 3 players are the different between winning the nBE and an also ran.

That's fine, but MU still wouldn't be at an advantage as you claimed.

What you propose would likely end college basketball and football (as we know them).

[MerrittsMustache]

I really was trying to figure out why this was so damn important.....apparently the rest of the world got the important stuff, but here in the dumbed down nation we got this.

With over 15,000 posts on this board, you sure seem to spend a lot of time discussing unimportant topics.

[MerrittsMustache]

The harm is this:

Select schools and select alumni with DEEP pockets, will simply purchase the top talent.

T. Boone could afford to sign every player to a 6 figure "appearance contract", and thus, OSU would get the best players. Same for a lot of top schools with rich and/or crazy alumni.

Instead of donating $ to the school, their "donation" will be paying players for an appearance at their son's birthday party.

Not if you cap their earnings and require that endorsement contracts go through the university's compliance dept.

Select schools and select alumni with DEEP pockets, simply purchase some of the top talent anyway.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Not if you cap their earnings and require that endorsement contracts go through the university's compliance dept.

Select schools and select alumni with DEEP pockets, simply purchase some of the top talent anyway.

You're right... it's really the same problem, which is why I say it won't work.

The NCAA can come up with any system it wants, but unless it can enforce it, we aren't really solving anything.

[CTWarrior]

The other thing that they could do is allow athletes to profit off of their own name.  That would fall outside of the NCAA rules and Title IX, and then them earn what the free market bears.  So if Manziel wants to earn $50,000 in a summer for autographs, that's just fine.  If a local car dealer wants Chris Otule to be its spokesman, that's fine too.

Again, be careful what you wish for.  As soon as you allow that, the biggest schools will find donors to offer everybody who signs with the school significant money for their autographs, etc.  You will end up with a much smaller pool of schools who are willing to go there and the end result will be a lot less scholarships for true student-athletes.

I would like to point out one other thing.  Even though these are sports, the athletes are much less integral to the product than many of us are aware.  If you decreed that all of the current D-I football players were ineligible and you replaced them with the next best 5,000 or whatever players, college football would still be immensely popular, Auburn would still want to beat Alabama, there would still be tailgate parties, etc.It would be popular as long as the games were competitive.

[MerrittsMustache]

You're right... it's really the same problem, which is why I say it won't work.

The NCAA can come up with any system it wants, but unless it can enforce it, we aren't really solving anything.

What system should they come up with? Or do you think the current broken system is good enough?

[GGGG]

Again, be careful what you wish for.  As soon as you allow that, the biggest schools will find donors to offer everybody who signs with the school significant money for their autographs, etc.  You will end up with a much smaller pool of schools who are willing to go there and the end result will be a lot less scholarships for true student-athletes.

I'm fully aware of the potential consequences but believe them to be exaggerated.

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

What system should they come up with? Or do you think the current broken system is good enough?

Honestly, I don't have a good answer/solution to the current problems.

However, I don't think that players receiving payment from 3rd parties, and having the NCAA regulate it is a good idea. I think that would be significantly worse.

For the most part, players now receive a free education and some small perks for playing a D1 sport. Is it "fair"? I dunno, I guess not.

[MerrittsMustache]

Honestly, I don't have a good answer/solution to the current problems.

However, I don't think that players receiving payment from 3rd parties, and having the NCAA regulate it is a good idea. I think that would be significantly worse.

For the most part, players now receive a free education and some small perks for playing a D1 sport. Is it "fair"? I dunno, I guess not.

Fair enough. But in what way would it make it significantly worse?

I don't think universities should be paying their athletes a salary but I do think that students in the public eye should be able to capitalize off of that, if the options are there. Like others have pointed out, the endorsement deals aren't going to come flying in for most athletes but if Chris Otule can get 50 bucks for wearing a Ciganiak Planning hat to a press conference, why stop him?

[Canned Goods n Ammo]

Fair enough. But in what way would it make it significantly worse?

I don't think universities should be paying their athletes a salary but I do think that students in the public eye should be able to capitalize off of that, if the options are there. Like others have pointed out, the endorsement deals aren't going to come flying in for most athletes but if Chris Otule can get 50 bucks for wearing a Ciganiak Planning hat to a press conference, why stop him?

In theory, I agree with you.

However, I'm fearful of the eventual (and in my mind inevitable) arms race that would occur.

#1 You'll have rich alumni from around the country offering sponsorship dollars to players (in an effort to field the best team possible).
#2 The NCAA will attempt to cap the earnings a player can make.
#3 Certain boosters will attempt to side-step the NCAA.

Well, then we will be right back where we started, but with a lot more cash already moving around. Just seems worse.

Also, I think the best kept secret in college basketball is per diem. The idea that they never have any cash (which is what some people think) is silly.

[ChicosBailBonds]

Not changing

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/9682086/ncaa-budge-paying-college-athletes