Badger hate

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

How many games did UW have to win to play at the Bradley Center?

You had said that UW had gotten the biggest home court advantage in the tournament by playing at the Bradley Center.  While they got a huge bump from the crowd in the Oregon game, the UCONN crowd at Madison Square Garden was instrumental in the defeat of MSU. 

I think what you're arguing is that the committee gave UW 2 home games on purpose, and thus favoritism.  I'm not arguing that. 

What I'm articulationg is showing how effective the crowds were in swaying the outcome of a game that had much more significance than Wisconsin's 2 games @ the BC. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

We're going to agree to disagree, no school should have that enormous of a home court advantage in any NCAA tournament round.   And the Badgers weren't all that either to get that placement- 5 game losing streak in-season, including a Northwestern home loss, lost two of three heading into the tournament (I know Nebraska was on the road), you could make a strong argument the Badgers didn't do enough either. 

Then get rid of the pod system.  They had a 2 seed, how is it that they didn't earn that placement?  Of course they did.

Why did Duke get to go to Raleigh?  Arizona got to play in San Diego and then Anaheim...didn't they have an unfair advantage over Wisconsin in that game?  UW beat them anyway. Florida got to play in Orlando.  Syracuse played in Buffalo. 

Yes, UW lost to NW at home...They also beat TWO number one seeds this year, Florida and Virginia, in the regular season.  They went on to beat a 3rd in the NCAA tournament.  Do we get to ignore those because they lost to NW at home?  You don't get to cherry pick arguments on this.  They beat 3 seed Michigan as well.  Wisconsin earned every bit their 2 seed this year.

[ChicosBailBonds]

NOBODY had a bigger home court advantage in this tournament than UW did in Milwaukee.  It's as obvious as Buzz's shaved head.

MU fans shouldn't have sold so many of their tickets then.  We helped contribute to it.  They earned their placement per the Pod system, no different than Duke in Raleigh, Syracuse in Buffalo, Arizona in San Diego then Anaheim. 

Next year, if UW is a top 2 seed, they will likely go to Omaha or Columbus....and they will travel well again. 

[HutchwasClutch]

You had said that UW had gotten the biggest home court advantage in the tournament by playing at the Bradley Center.  While they got a huge bump from the crowd in the Oregon game, the UCONN crowd at Madison Square Garden was instrumental in the defeat of MSU. 

I think what you're arguing is that the committee gave UW 2 home games on purpose, and thus favoritism.  I'm not arguing that. 

What I'm articulationg is showing how effective the crowds were in swaying the outcome of a game that had much more significance than Wisconsin's 2 games @ the BC. 

They're all significant in the NCAA tournament when your season ends with one loss.

[HutchwasClutch]

Then get rid of the pod system.  They had a 2 seed, how is it that they didn't earn that placement?  Of course they did.

Why did Duke get to go to Raleigh?  Arizona got to play in San Diego and then Anaheim...didn't they have an unfair advantage over Wisconsin in that game?  UW beat them anyway. Florida got to play in Orlando.  Syracuse played in Buffalo. 

Yes, UW lost to NW at home...They also beat TWO number one seeds this year, Florida and Virginia, in the regular season.  They went on to beat a 3rd in the NCAA tournament.  Do we get to ignore those because they lost to NW at home?  You don't get to cherry pick arguments on this.  They beat 3 seed Michigan as well.  Wisconsin earned every bit their 2 seed this year.

I don't like the pod system.  I don't like Duke always seemingly playing in NC.  When we lost to Stanford in '08 and Washington in '10, those were overwhelmingly pro Stanford and Washington crowds. 

I'm not arguing UW didn't deserve a two seed, they probably did (although I don't think that's an obvious call either), but again, when the debate after the game is what was louder where we just played in the tournament or our own building, that is a completely unfair advantage that the majority of schools never to get to enjoy,  like us!

Why should a small group of programs enjoy this advantage when most never do?  It's crap.

I'll add that Florida was missing two of it's better players, including Wilbekin, when they lost to UW.

[brandx]

One thing about this years Badger run that I would be shocked if any UW fan ever admitted to, but I think is obvious- the BC fan support against Oregon flipped the momentum of that game and carried them to the Sweet 16.  They don't get out of the 3rd round without an incredibly generous placement in Milwaukee by the tourney committee.  I'll go to my grave believing that Oregon wins that game otherwise. 

High seeded teams get "home crowds" every single year. If Oregon was good enough they would have been playing out west in the 1st round. Location is a benefit you get for being amongst the best teams. That's the way it is done.

[brandx]

when the debate after the game is what was louder where we just played in the tournament or our own building, that is a completely unfair advantage that the majority of schools never to get to enjoy,  like us!

I guess we should win more games then. There is no vendetta against MU. It comes down to winning.

Do you think there should be no reward for a team that goes 30-2 as opposed to one that goes 20-12? Shouldn't the teams that win be rewarded?

[ChicosBailBonds]

I don't like the pod system.  I don't like Duke always seemingly playing in NC.  When we lost to Stanford in '08 and Washington in '10, those were overwhelmingly pro Stanford and Washington crowds. 

I'm not arguing UW didn't deserve a two seed, they probably did (although I don't think that's an obvious call either), but again, when the debate after the game is what was louder where we just played in the tournament or our own building, that is a completely unfair advantage that the majority of schools never to get to enjoy,  like us!

Why should a small group of programs enjoy this advantage when most never do?  It's crap.

I'll add that Florida was missing two of it's better players, including Wilbekin, when they lost to UW.

I don't think it (POD) is going away.  Attendance has struggled in the early rounds at some NCAA sites the last 5 to 10 years.  There was also the argument that the reverse was happening and high seeded teams were having to travel a great distance and playing against teams that has a more regional advantage.  That is also unfair.

Its impossible to get this right with that many teams involved and tournament sites preselected 3 years in advance.  Make the best of the situation.  If MU was sent to Chicago, no one here would bitch despite it being roughly the same distance from Chicago as Madison is to Milwaukee.  Props to UW fans that support their team.

Let's also not forget that last time Wisconsin was in Milwaukee, they lost the second game to Pittsburgh, who was actually the higher seed.  THAT, was unfair as hell.

[HutchwasClutch]

I guess we should win more games then. There is no vendetta against MU. It comes down to winning.

Do you think there should be no reward for a team that goes 30-2 as opposed to one that goes 20-12? Shouldn't the teams that win be rewarded?

They are rewarded- if the committee seeds properly, your opponents aren't as good on your way to the Sweet 16 and beyond.  After all, a one has NEVER lost to a 16.  Two's very rarely lose, etc.  How much reward do you want to give them?

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

I guess we should win more games then. There is no vendetta against MU. It comes down to winning.

Do you think there should be no reward for a team that goes 30-2 as opposed to one that goes 20-12? Shouldn't the teams that win be rewarded?

Teams should be rewarded.  What I would like to see the committee due is create more matchups based on former rivalries or instate rivalries.  Dayton vs. Ohio St. in the first round was a great storyline that turned into a great game.  It would be nice to see that if the possibilities of these type of matchups exist in the first round, to capitalize on them.  

[ChicosBailBonds]

They are rewarded- if the committee seeds properly, your opponents aren't as good on your way to the Sweet 16 and beyond.  After all, a one has NEVER lost to a 16.  Two's very rarely lose, etc.  How much reward do you want to give them?

It's more than just the first round that you are rewarded for.  Case in point, Arizona's games were San Diego and Anaheim.  It can carry through.  

How do you propose this issue is "fixed" considering the sites are selected years in advance.  How are you going to make a fairer system that doesn't create other unfair situations by moving teams around?

[HutchwasClutch]

I don't think it (POD) is going away.  Attendance has struggled in the early rounds at some NCAA sites the last 5 to 10 years.  There was also the argument that the reverse was happening and high seeded teams were having to travel a great distance and playing against teams that has a more regional advantage.  That is also unfair.

Its impossible to get this right with that many teams involved and tournament sites preselected 3 years in advance.  Make the best of the situation.  If MU was sent to Chicago, no one here would bitch despite it being roughly the same distance from Chicago as Madison is to Milwaukee.  Props to UW fans that support their team.

Let's also not forget that last time Wisconsin was in Milwaukee, they lost the second game to Pittsburgh, who was actually the higher seed.  THAT, was unfair as hell.

2004 was another b.s. draw for UW- that year they did WAY less and were placed in Milwaukee.  I was at their first game against Richmond, and it was very similar to this year's Oregon game, they were behind and not showing much, then they started as small run, the crowd got very loud and involved and it snowballed.  

[HutchwasClutch]

It's more than just the first round that you are rewarded for.  Case in point, Arizona's games were San Diego and Anaheim.  It can carry through.  

How do you propose this issue is "fixed" considering the sites are selected years in advance.  How are you going to make a fairer system that doesn't create other unfair situations by moving teams around?

Nothing in life is perfect, they can make it better though by getting rid of the pod system.  The field certainly is not set several years out.  The whole pod system came about with the NCAA hypocrisy about kids missing too much class time.  I'm sure the kids at UK who have their sights on the NBA as soon as this tournament is over are really concerned about all the work they'll have to catch upon after tomorrow night. 

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

Nothing in life is perfect, they can make it better though by getting rid of the pod system.  The field certainly is not set several years out.  The whole pod system came about with the NCAA hypocrisy about kids missing too much class time.  I'm sure the kids at UK who have their sights on the NBA as soon as this tournament is over are really concerned about all the work they'll have to catch upon after tomorrow night. 

Yes, I'm sure their tutors are hungover and writing papers at a feverish pitch today. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Nothing in life is perfect, they can make it better though by getting rid of the pod system.  The field certainly is not set several years out.  The whole pod system came about with the NCAA hypocrisy about kids missing too much class time.  I'm sure the kids at UK who have their sights on the NBA as soon as this tournament is over are really concerned about all the work they'll have to catch upon after tomorrow night. 

You're falling into the same trap as so many others do.  Just because UK has one and done kids that don't care (some anyway) about school, doesn't mean that is the case for all 68 teams.

The reality is, the POD system didn't change anything about kids out of class, nor did the NCAA claim it would.  If you play on Thursday, you still leave on Monday.  If you play on Friday, you still leave on Tuesday.  None of that has changed.  The POD system was created in 2002 to cut down on travel costs, help fans of their schools get to games (make it more affordable), and increase attendance.

ALSO, it was to create what I described earlier, putting a top tiered seed at a home court DISADVANTAGE.  Here is the bylaw directly as written "To recognize the demonstrated quality of such teams, the committee shall not place teams seeded on the first five lines at a potential “home-crowd disadvantage” in the second round.



Has the POD system had a negative impact on upsets?  Nope.




By the way, great read on the POD system being an Unqualified Success

http://www.teamrankings.com/blog/ncaa-basketball/the-pod-system-for-once-the-ncaa-got-something-right-stat-geek-idol

[HutchwasClutch]

Yes, I'm sure their tutors are hungover and writing papers at a feverish pitch today. 

 

[warriorfred]

Yes, I'm sure their tutors are hungover and writing papers at a feverish pitch today. 

Can we still say +1, because that was very funny.

[ChicosBailBonds]

http://www4.ncsu.edu/~rghammon/workshop/F12_McFall_NCAA.pdf

[warriorfred]

A few reasons I dislike UW:

-  Fan Base - Primarily those that went to UW Oshkosh, but jump on the bandwagon.
-  The Assumption - If you grew up in Wisconsin, you like UW.
-  The Assumption 2.0 - If you grew up in Wisconsin, you should attend UW (my sister was a national merit scholar and did not receive any local scholarships, among many reasons, was that she did not apply to UW).

I could go, but their fan base is particularly obnoxious.

[HutchwasClutch]

the second round.

By the way, great read on the POD system being an Unqualified Success

http://www.teamrankings.com/blog/ncaa-basketball/the-pod-system-for-once-the-ncaa-got-something-right-stat-geek-idol

We could probably go back and forth all day Chicos, so agree to disagree.  I found a column which articulates very well the negatives of the pod system.  It's not recent, but all of the arguments are every bit as applicable to now.  And interesting points about STATE schools getting unfair advantages from it-

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/146032-ncaa-tournament-pod-system-needs-changes

And I swear among the things (as mentioned by you above) the NCAA babbled about when it introduced the pod system, was less missed classes for it's athletes. 

[Tums Festival]

In the 1974 tournament NC State didn't play a single game outside the state of North Carolina. Bo Ellis was right when he said it wasn't our time.

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

You have to admit...... this is pretty good. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

We could probably go back and forth all day Chicos, so agree to disagree.  I found a column which articulates very well the negatives of the pod system.  It's not recent, but all of the arguments are every bit as applicable to now.  And interesting points about STATE schools getting unfair advantages from it-

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/146032-ncaa-tournament-pod-system-needs-changes

And I swear among the things (as mentioned by you above) the NCAA babbled about when it introduced the pod system, was less missed classes for it's athletes. 

I swore I read here that Bleacher Report articles were as accurate as MSNBC material and not to be used. 

 

[MikeDeanesDarkGlasses]

I swore I read here that Bleacher Report articles were as accurate as MSNBC material and not to be used. 

 

Let it be known that Fox News and CBN are being added to the list as well. 

[ChicosBailBonds]

Let it be known that Fox News and CBN are being added to the list as well. 

As are the NY Times, CBS, ABC, PBS, NBC and others.  Looks like we'll have to rely on Pravda