K-12 Schools & COVID

[pacearrow02]

You literally said "take the year off" when has that ever meant anything other than unpaid? I agree there's reasonable solutions, so far you have offered few and rather than address the reasonable concerns Hards listed you brushed them away.

You second paragraph saying referring to two working parents implies they have nowhere else to send their kids so send em to school. That means utilizing teachers as a nanny. The other reason I thought you were thinking that was because I misread your argument about children's activities with Hards, my bad on that front.

I don't recall you literally saying "it’s important for kids to get back to school for learning, daily structure, social interaction, etc." but I do know people misusing literally, literally drives me crazy.

I don't need to answer that specific use case, they aren't my concern. it's the teachers that are my concern because that's who I'm involved with. The kids can utilize online learning, in a group setting of rotating parents or nanny with would be classmates for all I care. That way you are still exposing your family to the same amount of people without forcing an underpaid employee to a dangerous work setting. If teachers are given sponsored adequate PPE, sterilization measures are taken, Covid specific quarantine and diagnosis are not out of sick pay, and there's thinning of a class size then I'm good with going back. At this time, however, you need to realize that not every district is like the seemingly extremely prepared and well funded one that your kids attend.

Ok thank you for at least acknowledging your scope of concern throughout this thread.  It’s solely on the teachers but when it comes to students and parents 🤷‍♂️

[pbiflyer]

Interesting take on what a day in school would look like:
https://www.facebook.com/katheryn.wood.9/posts/1585566444944146
"On Monday, district employees worked on staging and filming "Return to School"videos to communicate to families what to expect for Fall 2020. Here are a few moments we captured that we want to share with you." -(Fullerton, California)

[pacearrow02]

You literally said "take the year off" when has that ever meant anything other than unpaid? I agree there's reasonable solutions, so far you have offered few and rather than address the reasonable concerns Hards listed you brushed them away.

You second paragraph saying referring to two working parents implies they have nowhere else to send their kids so send em to school. That means utilizing teachers as a nanny. The other reason I thought you were thinking that was because I misread your argument about children's activities with Hards, my bad on that front.

I don't recall you literally saying "it’s important for kids to get back to school for learning, daily structure, social interaction, etc." but I do know people misusing literally, literally drives me crazy.

I don't need to answer that specific use case, they aren't my concern. it's the teachers that are my concern because that's who I'm involved with. The kids can utilize online learning, in a group setting of rotating parents or nanny with would be classmates for all I care. That way you are still exposing your family to the same amount of people without forcing an underpaid employee to a dangerous work setting. If teachers are given sponsored adequate PPE, sterilization measures are taken, Covid specific quarantine and diagnosis are not out of sick pay, and there's thinning of a class size then I'm good with going back. At this time, however, you need to realize that not every district is like the seemingly extremely prepared and well funded one that your kids attend.

My kids “literally” go to public school so not sure they’re any better or worse funded then other public schools across the state. 

Great leadership within the district though with principles etc.  That could be the difference but I hope others replicate what they got going on.

[Galway Eagle]

My kids “literally” go to public school so not sure they’re any better or worse funded then other public schools across the state. 

Great leadership within the district though with principles etc.  That could be the difference but I hope others replicate what they got going on.

... you don't actually believe that every public school is created and funded equal do you?

I mean seriously there's no way an educated individual believes that your suburban district is funded equally as an Inner city non flagship school, equally as a City flagship school, or equally as a country multiple township HS.

[Galway Eagle]

Ok thank you for at least acknowledging your scope of concern throughout this thread.  It’s solely on the teachers but when it comes to students and parents 🤷‍♂️

You know who'd like to be parents but won't be able to with your "so sad too bad" plan for sick pay? Teachers.

[Hards Alumni]

Interesting take on what a day in school would look like:
https://www.facebook.com/katheryn.wood.9/posts/1585566444944146
"On Monday, district employees worked on staging and filming "Return to School"videos to communicate to families what to expect for Fall 2020. Here are a few moments we captured that we want to share with you." -(Fullerton, California)

This is worth reading for the facebook comments alone.  Unintentional comedy GOLD.

[pacearrow02]

You know who'd like to be parents but won't be able to with your "so sad too bad" plan for sick pay? Teachers.

🤦‍♂️

[Galway Eagle]

🤦‍♂️

Facepalm all you want. Until you seem to get just how absurd the sick pay issue is I'm just going to keep repeating it.

[wadesworld]

Since as a country we're apparently just accepting that this thing will kill hundreds of thousands of our citizens every year until there is a treatment and/or vaccine, if we are going to a schedule that splits students into certain days/week in school to socially distance them there will only be half as many students in school at a time to be victims of the school shootings we've also come to accept as a country because, you know, second amendment.

[Its DJOver]

Facepalm all you want. Until you seem to get just how absurd the sick pay issue is I'm just going to keep repeating it.

Yep, can only speak for my company, but I have a separate "sick leave" and "COVID leave" balance that started April 1st.  Further if I'm forced to self quarantine for two weeks, my duties and responsibilities can be spread around to co-workers, and while it'd make their life more difficult, they'd survive.  That becomes exponentially more difficult if your duties and responsibilities include teaching 2 dozen kids that would need to be "spread around".  Until a proper solution/plan is presented for this dilemma, I can only see the returning of schools going poorly.

[pacearrow02]

Facepalm all you want. Until you seem to get just how absurd the sick pay issue is I'm just going to keep repeating it.

I have no idea what teacher sick pay policy is.  I’m sure they can figure something out if that’s the only hurdle for some teachers in returning to the classroom.

[Its DJOver]

I have no idea what teacher sick pay policy is.  I’m sure they can figure something out if that’s the only hurdle for some teachers in returning to the classroom.

Except that there are more questions than that, that need answering.  If a kid tests positive, do you send their entire class home for two weeks and attempt to switch to online?  What if that student had contact with kids from other classes in a hallway or other shared space?  Do you send the entire school home for two weeks?  Are/should teachers be planning to alternate between switching between online and in-class at the drop of a hat?(this has proven to be very difficult based on evidence from last spring) If after a two week isolation the kids come back and three days later another kid tests positive, how many times do you alternate between online and in-class before it becomes obvious that in-class isn't working and just switch to online again full time? 

It's easy to say that you're planning on going back, and if these question plus the numerous more that would arise are properly answered then you should, but I have yet to see a proposed plan that has contingencies in place for very plausible/likely scenarios listed above.

[forgetful]

Except that there are more questions than that, that need answering.  If a kid tests positive, do you send their entire class home for two weeks and attempt to switch to online?  What if that student had contact with kids from other classes in a hallway or other shared space?  Do you send the entire school home for two weeks?  Are/should teachers be planning to alternate between switching between online and in-class at the drop of a hat?(this has proven to be very difficult based on evidence from last spring) If after a two week isolation the kids come back and three days later another kid tests positive, how many times do you alternate between online and in-class before it becomes obvious that in-class isn't working and just switch to online again full time? 

It's easy to say that you're planning on going back, and if these question plus the numerous more that would arise are properly answered then you should, but I have yet to see a proposed plan that has contingencies in place for very plausible/likely scenarios listed above.

A lot of universities and school districts are telling teachers that they have to deliver all course content both online and in person. Because some (e.g. high-risk, or quarantine) will not be able to attend in person.

Those in charge, recognize that this will soon devolve into online only, if spread isn't mitigated. They just don't want to publicly state right now that all class will be online only as it will create a lot of issues politically, socially, and economically.

[pacearrow02]

Except that there are more questions than that, that need answering.  If a kid tests positive, do you send their entire class home for two weeks and attempt to switch to online?  What if that student had contact with kids from other classes in a hallway or other shared space?  Do you send the entire school home for two weeks?  Are/should teachers be planning to alternate between switching between online and in-class at the drop of a hat?(this has proven to be very difficult based on evidence from last spring) If after a two week isolation the kids come back and three days later another kid tests positive, how many times do you alternate between online and in-class before it becomes obvious that in-class isn't working and just switch to online again full time? 

It's easy to say that you're planning on going back, and if these question plus the numerous more that would arise are properly answered then you should, but I have yet to see a proposed plan that has contingencies in place for very plausible/likely scenarios listed above.

Our district just sent out the plan for all those what if’s just this morning.  When I have a minute I can pass along a screen shot of what they have in place. 

No doubt kids will get it but they are largely largely asymptomatic so will be interesting to see how much of it goes undetected.

Will be an absolute must for adults to be wearing masks and washing hands like crazy.  In their announcement this morning a new additional safety measure based off parent feedback is that kids will no longer be going to cafeteria for lunch but staying in their classroom to eat.

[Its DJOver]

A lot of universities and school districts are telling teachers that they have to deliver all course content both online and in person. Because some (e.g. high-risk, or quarantine) will not be able to attend in person.

Those in charge, recognize that this will soon devolve into online only, if spread isn't mitigated. They just don't want to publicly state right now that all class will be online only as it will create a lot of issues politically, socially, and economically.

Different levels also pose different problems.  K-5 is usually just one group of 20+ kids that take all classes together, if one gets sick, send the class home.  Once you get higher up, kids schedules become more personalized.  If you test positive, you would have to send their entire English class home, plus their entire science class, which may be a completely different group of kids, plus their math class, which would be another different group of kids.

Another problem that I have yet to see addressed is in-between classes.  I actually think that if you can get everyone to wear a mask and socially distance themselves (easier said than done), once they're in class, they should be all right.  The problem comes when you would have 90% of a schools capacity in the hallways together.  You could try staggering when you let certain classes out as well as force one way traffic in hallways, but that would very quickly turn into a scheduling nightmare.  Imagine not being released from a class until 8:35 say, and having you next class start at 8:20 because of all the staggering (we're not all Hermione).

Question and concerns will keep coming quick and fast, and I just don't see the solutions being able to keep up with them.

[Hards Alumni]

Different levels also pose different problems.  K-5 is usually just one group of 20+ kids that take all classes together, if one gets sick, send the class home.  Once you get higher up, kids schedules become more personalized.  If you test positive, you would have to send their entire English class home, plus their entire science class, which may be a completely different group of kids, plus their math class, which would be another different group of kids.

Another problem that I have yet to see addressed is in-between classes.  I actually think that if you can get everyone to wear a mask and socially distance themselves (easier said than done), once they're in class, they should be all right.  The problem comes when you would have 90% of a schools capacity in the hallways together.  You could try staggering when you let certain classes out as well as force one way traffic in hallways, but that would very quickly turn into a scheduling nightmare.  Imagine not being released from a class until 8:35 say, and having you next class start at 8:20 because of all the staggering (we're not all Hermione).

Question and concerns will keep coming quick and fast, and I just don't see the solutions being able to keep up with them.

Suggestion.  Move the teachers around at the bell instead of the students.  Might be hard for science labs or art class (if that still exists), but we must adjust.  Stagger entry and release from school for the day.  Masks required at all times.

Our district just sent out the plan for all those what if’s just this morning.  When I have a minute I can pass along a screen shot of what they have in place. 

No doubt kids will get it but they are largely largely asymptomatic so will be interesting to see how much of it goes undetected.

Will be an absolute must for adults to be wearing masks and washing hands like crazy.  In their announcement this morning a new additional safety measure based off parent feedback is that kids will no longer be going to cafeteria for lunch but staying in their classroom to eat.

That would be super cool.  Thanks in advance.

[pacearrow02]

Suggestion.  Move the teachers around at the bell instead of the students.  Might be hard for science labs or art class (if that still exists), but we must adjust.  Stagger entry and release from school for the day.  Masks required at all times.

That would be super cool.  Thanks in advance.

Love the idea of teachings rotating as opposed to the bell going off and the typical between class chaos going down in the hallways. 

Seems like an absolute must and will pass that along to our district.  Staggered entry/exit also great idea that I haven’t seen our district address.  They do say a lot of the safety mitigation plans will be discussed at the parent meetings next week.

[Its DJOver]

Suggestion.  Move the teachers around at the bell instead of the students.  Might be hard for science labs or art class (if that still exists), but we must adjust.  Stagger entry and release from school for the day.  Masks required at all times.

That would be super cool.  Thanks in advance.

Interesting idea, but would raise just as many new problems as it may solve.  You note some difficulties, but there's also the fact that not everyone would be taking the same classes. You could be in advanced English but remedial math.  What if one kid is taking Spanish and one is taking French?  Band or Choir (assuming they still exist). Chemistry or Physics or Biology, the list goes on and on.  There would be too many variables that it would still be a scheduling nightmare IMO.  Better, but not good enough.

[Hards Alumni]

Interesting idea, but would raise just as many new problems as it may solve.  You note some difficulties, but there's also the fact that not everyone would be taking the same classes. You could be in advanced English but remedial math.  What if one kid is taking Spanish and one is taking French?  Band or Choir (assuming they still exist). Chemistry or Physics or Biology, the list goes on and on.  There would be too many variables that it would still be a scheduling nightmare IMO.  Better, but not good enough.

Fair points.  This plan could cover K-8 though.  High School schedules would definitely be a whole different ball game.  Everyone swaps to block scheduling and we boil down what school is for high schoolers.  Teacher swapping for the first half or 3/4 of the day doing core classes, and then at lunch (or after 3rd period) the more 'elective' or specialized classes take place.  Which may mean high schoolers bug out after lunch and take their specialized classes online.  Band and Choir are cancelled for obvious reasons.

Block scheduling is a major way around dealing with this.

[pacearrow02]

Interesting idea, but would raise just as many new problems as it may solve.  You note some difficulties, but there's also the fact that not everyone would be taking the same classes. You could be in advanced English but remedial math.  What if one kid is taking Spanish and one is taking French?  Band or Choir (assuming they still exist). Chemistry or Physics or Biology, the list goes on and on.  There would be too many variables that it would still be a scheduling nightmare IMO.  Better, but not good enough.

For those scenarios where rotating teachers isn’t an option.  Mask up baby, no kissy face in the hallways and away you go.

[Its DJOver]

Fair points.  This plan could cover K-8 though.  High School schedules would definitely be a whole different ball game.  Everyone swaps to block scheduling and we boil down what school is for high schoolers.  Teacher swapping for the first half or 3/4 of the day doing core classes, and then at lunch (or after 3rd period) the more 'elective' or specialized classes take place.  Which may mean high schoolers bug out after lunch and take their specialized classes online.  Band and Choir are cancelled for obvious reasons.

Block scheduling is a major way around dealing with this.

Agree with this, but also think that it is going to make some people very unhappy.  They'll either have to deal with it, or come up with their own solution, because it's really the most realistic path that I see, and I still think that it may not work and everyone could end up back being exclusively online.

[pacearrow02]

Fair points.  This plan could cover K-8 though.  High School schedules would definitely be a whole different ball game.  Everyone swaps to block scheduling and we boil down what school is for high schoolers.  Teacher swapping for the first half or 3/4 of the day doing core classes, and then at lunch (or after 3rd period) the more 'elective' or specialized classes take place.  Which may mean high schoolers bug out after lunch and take their specialized classes online.  Band and Choir are cancelled for obvious reasons.

Block scheduling is a major way around dealing with this.

Hards_ do you sit on the school board for our district?  They just proposed that very thing of virtual learning in the afternoons for specialized courses with main courses in the morning done face to face and on campus. They’re looking for feedback from parents with kids in high school on the viability of that.

My kids aren’t in high school yet but seemed to make sense to me when reading.

[pacearrow02]

Agree with this, but also think that it is going to make some people very unhappy.  They'll either have to deal with it, or come up with their own solution, because it's really the most realistic path that I see, and I still think that it may not work and everyone could end up back being exclusively online.

Well knock me over with a feather!!  Shocked that you would still look at this with doom and gloom in mind.

[Hards Alumni]

Agree with this, but also think that it is going to make some people very unhappy.  They'll either have to deal with it, or come up with their own solution, because it's really the most realistic path that I see, and I still think that it may not work and everyone could end up back being exclusively online.

I had block in HS from So-Sr year and loved it. 

Hards_ do you sit on the school board for our district?  They just proposed that very thing of virtual learning in the afternoons for specialized courses with main courses in the morning done face to face and on campus. They’re looking for feedback from parents with kids in high school on the viability of that.

My kids aren’t in high school yet but seemed to make sense to me when reading.

Ha no.  My mother was a superintendent for years and has poisoned me against ever teaching or taking school boards seriously.   

[Its DJOver]

Well knock me over with a feather!!  Shocked that you would still look at this with doom and gloom in mind.

Uncalled for.  No matter your opinion on the best way to move forward it should be universally accepted that these plans may not work.  If that's doom and gloom, so be it.  I've just seen way too many "plans" not work in this country regarding COVID to have any significant level of optimism.