Two takes on Smart after non-con

[rocky_warrior]

First from SI
https://www.si.com/college/2021/12/13/first-year-coaches-tj-otzelberger-tommy-lloyd-shaka-smart

The most notable change about Marquette in Year 1 under Smart is that it has a clear identity. The Golden Eagles are flying around on defense, and while not every game will produce the 26 turnovers Marquette forced in its early-season upset of Illinois, the effort and energy on that end of the floor has been a constant. In many ways, this group looks a lot more like one of Smart’s VCU teams than the squads loaded with five-star talent we saw under him at Texas.

Early-season wins over Illinois, West Virginia and Ole Miss have given the Golden Eagles a solid résumé, and so far they’ve avoided the types of bad losses that could hurt them come Selection Sunday. Getting into the Big Dance in Year 1 under Smart would be a major win, considering how many young players are contributing to this team. Sophomores Justin Lewis and Tyler Kolek have been essential, while freshmen Kam Jones and Stevie Mitchell have been key cogs in the backcourt. The future looks very bright in Milwaukee.

And then next from, Bleacher Report (sorry)
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2951315-way-too-early-grades-for-mens-college-basketball-first-year-head-coaches

Had we done this little exercise 12 days into the season, Shaka Smart would've gotten an easy A-plus. Marquette started out 5-0 with a shocking win over Illinois (sans Kofi Cockburn) and a pair of nice wins in Charleston against Ole Miss and West Virginia.

Considering Marquette hadn't even gotten out to a 3-0 start to a season since 2011-12, it was a noteworthy first impression for Smart in Milwaukee.

However, Darryl Morsell (who scored 21-plus in each of Marquette's first four games) has since come crashing back to earth, and so have the Golden Eagles along with him. They lost by 16 to St. Bonaventure, lost by 13 to Wisconsin and never even threatened to make things interesting in Saturday night's loss to UCLA.

None of those are bad losses, but they do collectively make it much tougher to argue for an A grade here, even though Marquette would exceed expectations if it finishes any better than bottom two in the Big East.

It doesn't help matters that Marquette's 2022 recruiting class is no more than a pair of 3-star guards. Then again, signing 5-star guys at Texas wasn't working out all that well for Smart, so maybe he can get back to his VCU roots by honing in on lower-rated guys who better fit his coaching scheme.

Grade: B

[MU82]

Shaka's doing great, and I'm pleasantly surprised by the start to the season.

His reaction to the late St. Bonaventure time-out was over the top, and I'm not sure why he didn't have Elliott on the floor during a critical juncture of the UCLA game. Otherwise, I've been very happy with how he has managed this team, especially with his emphasis not on immediate results but on creating a culture that will result in long-term excellence.

There is plenty of truth in both of those takes. Even the second one wasn't really very harsh.

[rocky_warrior]

There is plenty of truth in both of those takes. Even the second one wasn't really very harsh.

Agreed!  The apology was because it was BR, but their content is OK sometimes.

[Uncle Rico]

Agreed!  The apology was because it was BR, but their content is OK sometimes.

I think a B is the correct grade.  The recruiting thus far is my concern but I won’t really be concerned until I see how they utilize the portal next summer

[MU82]

I think a B is the correct grade.  The recruiting thus far is my concern but I won’t really be concerned until I see how they utilize the portal next summer

Was the grade for this season or for how he's managing the program in general?

For this season, I don't see how much lower it could be than A-; future recruiting classes have nothing to do with this season. If it's about the program in general, I'd probably say at least a B so far but probably would call it "incomplete."

[Uncle Rico]

Was the grade for this season or for how he's managing the program in general?

For this season, I don't see how much lower it could be than A-; future recruiting classes have nothing to do with this season. If it's about the program in general, I'd probably say at least a B so far but probably would call it "incomplete."

This years roster is part of his grade

[MU82]

This years roster is part of his grade

Fair enough. We don't have enough good players, especially knock-down shooters (an opinion many of us voiced concern about before the very first shot was taken), and that's obviously the coach's domain. So sure, B-ish is reasonable.

The BR guy was talking about '22 recruits and again, I don't know what that has to do with this season's grade. It'll weigh on next season's grade if the recruits/transfers aren't good enough.

[Uncle Rico]

Fair enough. We don't have enough good players, especially knock-down shooters (an opinion many of us voiced concern about before the very first shot was taken), and that's obviously the coach's domain. So sure, B-ish is reasonable.

The BR guy was talking about '22 recruits and again, I don't know what that has to do with this season's grade. It'll weigh on next season's grade if the recruits/transfers aren't good enough.

They’re far better record wise than I imagined but there are a lot of variables at play in that record. 

[Goose]

Rico

The record has Chicago Bears feel to it. Whenever the Bears have had a winning record the past decade +, it seems to me it is because they had 26 pick six, 9 punt returns during the season and still were outscored for the season. Only difference to me, I think MU is 8-3 and not 6-5 because they willed themselves to victory. All three close games they won they shut down the opponent when they needed to and that is the way to create a winning culture.

[Uncle Rico]

Rico

The record has Chicago Bears feel to it. Whenever the Bears have had a winning record the past decade +, it seems to me it is because they had 26 pick six, 9 punt returns during the season and still were outscored for the season. Only difference to me, I think MU is 8-3 and not 6-5 because they willed themselves to victory. All three close games they won they shut down the opponent when they needed to and that is the way to create a winning culture.

I don’t disagree and that’s why the process of this season was always more important than wins and losses.  It’s been said ad nauseam, but all things being equal, if Wojo is the coach, this team is 5-6, maybe 4-7.

My expectations for the Big East slate is low.  What is important to me is, some players show marked improvement by March.  They look more comfortable and natural playing the way the staff wants them to.

I’m not concerned about Kuath or Morsell.  I want to see 3-4 guys become dudes that you add to.  You’re correct.  There will be roster flux.  What we want is, the good players to stay and the ones in over their heads, to find the appropriate home

[tower912]

Those two reports do not contradict each other.

[NCMUFan]

Glad Shaka is setting a higher bar than the college BB sporting news.
Two spots above last is too low a bar for MU fans.
This fan wants Marquette in the upper half of the conference and a Big Dance bid.
Being a bottom feeder is an easy habit that is hard to break out of.

[Goose]

NC

Losing is a harder habit to break than bad shooting.

[avid1010]

If someone would have asked for the best case scenario at this point in the season I think it would be right where we are. 

[Tha Hound]

Glad Shaka is setting a higher bar than the college BB sporting news.
Two spots above last is too low a bar for MU fans.
This fan wants Marquette in the upper half of the conference and a Big Dance bid.
Being a bottom feeder is an easy habit that is hard to break out of.

You and me both, buddy

[We R Final Four]

Shaka's doing great, and I'm pleasantly surprised by the start to the season.

His reaction to the late St. Bonaventure time-out was over the top, and I'm not sure why he didn't have Elliott on the floor during a critical juncture of the UCLA game. Otherwise, I've been very happy with how he has managed this team, especially with his emphasis not on immediate results but on creating a culture that will result in long-term excellence.

There is plenty of truth in both of those takes. Even the second one wasn't really very harsh.

Yes—good take. I was a little surprised by Shaka’s reaction to the late timeout by Smith and the Bonnies. But, those tournaments are played in a 5k or smaller gyms and those Bonnie fans were crazy and I just think Shaka had enough.
I asked twice during the UCLA game ….why isn’t Greg in right now?  He needs to be on the floor. With Homer Shaka said he wishes they would have played 8 more minutes and he would have had Greg shoot more.

[We R Final Four]

.

[GB Warrior]

Fair enough. We don't have enough good players, especially knock-down shooters (an opinion many of us voiced concern about before the very first shot was taken), and that's obviously the coach's domain. So sure, B-ish is reasonable.

The BR guy was talking about '22 recruits and again, I don't know what that has to do with this season's grade. It'll weigh on next season's grade if the recruits/transfers aren't good enough.

I am pleased with everything I've seen this far, but I'm also underwhelmed by the recruiting, if only because the picture and strategy is incomplete. I'm unsure how any of the pieces the team is struggling with now (outside shooting, rebounding at the top of the list) get better with next year's machination as it currently projects.

[MU82]

I am pleased with everything I've seen this far, but I'm also underwhelmed by the recruiting, if only because the picture and strategy is incomplete. I'm unsure how any of the pieces the team is struggling with now (outside shooting, rebounding at the top of the list) get better with next year's machination as it currently projects.

All I can say is recruiting is way different now. A bazillion transfers will be available.

[NCMUFan]

It will be interesting to see the recruiting process in the future.
If transfers don't need to sit out a year, and you have playing time available it may be a desirable option.
I guess in the future, Marquette teams may look similar to this year.
Many new faces that never played together.
Maybe the new successful coach model/style will be how fast can you get a bunch of new players to play cohesively together.

[MU82]

It will be interesting to see the recruiting process in the future.
If transfers don't need to sit out a year, and you have playing time available it may be a desirable option.
I guess in the future, Marquette teams may look similar to this year.
Many new faces that never played together.
Maybe the new successful coach model/style will be how fast can you get a bunch of new players to play cohesively together.

At a lot of places, perhaps including Marquette, it will be a combination of attracting quality high school recruits and top transfers. Some schools might mostly stick to recruits; others will lean heavily toward transfers. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out, both at Marquette and elsewhere.

[brewcity77]

It seems obvious the recruiting plan is for the long-term. The staff wants long athletes that play with high activity to fit into our Violence defense while also being able to convert threes and paint shots. You can already see how guys like Joplin, Jones, and Ellis fit into that even if they aren't there yet (hence the long-term). The athleticism matches what we've heard about Itejere and while Sean Jones might not have the length desired, the activity level and defensive acumen he and Ross are reputed to have makes it pretty clear how they fit.

This is about culture and development. Shaka is looking for continuity and wants his players to adopt these philosophies for the long-term so they are paying off not necessarily this year but in years 2, 3, 4, and beyond. I suspect the hope is they will have better retention rates of their own players (Shaka only had 5 transfers out in 6 years at Texas, and only 3 were players he recruited out of high school) and they will be able to fill holes with transfers in (similar to Morsell and Kuath, and likely what they hoped Alfonso Plummer would've been and has been at Illinois).

The strategy seems clear, the only question is if the cultural retention will work in an era of immediately eligible transfers.

[Herman Cain]

First from SI
https://www.si.com/college/2021/12/13/first-year-coaches-tj-otzelberger-tommy-lloyd-shaka-smart
And then next from, Bleacher Report (sorry)
https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2951315-way-too-early-grades-for-mens-college-basketball-first-year-head-coaches

My take is we did very well non - conference . We also signed two very athletic 2022 Prospects  who appear to be a good fit in the system . Things are going very well.

[Juan Anderson's Mixtape]

Four of our top 6 in minutes per game are transfers.  I think Shaka will continue to mix in transfers as needed.  For next year, I hope Shaka adds a starting caliber wing and a big to tag team with Oso.

[Jay Bee]

For next year, I hope Shaka adds a starting caliber wing and a big to tag team with Oso.

Naughty!

But, yeah… with Kur & DM out, those certainly make sense

[The Scat]

It has to be hard to recruit when you have 10 freshman on the roster.

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Brew gets it.

I'd also add that while many more coaches are going to start to take the Hoiberg/Musselman/Beard approach and reassemble their rosters every season,  I think there will be a premium on coaches who can keep the majority of their rosters intact from year to year. I think we have one of those coaches

[Herman Cain]

Brew gets it.

I'd also add that while many more coaches are going to start to take the Hoiberg/Musselman/Beard approach and reassemble their rosters every season,  I think there will be a premium on coaches who can keep the majority of their rosters intact from year to year. I think we have one of those coaches

Basketball is a team sport . Have as much continuity as possible really builds that cohesion . I like our coaches philosophy of relationship building. I think it will help in that regard

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

Brew gets it.

I'd also add that while many more coaches are going to start to take the Hoiberg/Musselman/Beard approach and reassemble their rosters every season,  I think there will be a premium on coaches who can keep the majority of their rosters intact from year to year. I think we have one of those coaches

Why though, other than blind optimism?  There is very little reason to believe Shaka will be able to hold this group of freshman (eligibility wise) together.  Guys will transfer, other will "go pro".  Maybe most of them. Its the way of the game and Shaka is no different than any other coach in that regard.   

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Why though, other than blind optimism?  There is very little reason to believe Shaka will be able to hold this group of freshman (eligibility wise) together.  Guys will transfer, other will "go pro".  Maybe most of them. Its the way of the game and Shaka is no different than any other coach in that regard.

1. His record with transfers at Texas. Very very few transfers out.
2. Literally every person I have talked to who has spoken to Smart and the players has said the same thing. His strength and emphasis as a coach is relationship building and he's got every guy bought in 110%.
3. He certainly says all the right things in public

Yes, there will be transfers. No way 9 "freshmen" stick it out for all four years. But if only 2-4 of that group transfer out over the next 4 years and they are guys who were at the back of the rotation any way, that's 5-7 quality players who will end up playing literal hundreds of games together and thousands of practice hours together. That kind of experience and cohesion can win you a lot of games.

[MU82]

I'm confident Shaka will keep our best young players for multiple seasons.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

1. His record with transfers at Texas. Very very few transfers out.
2. Literally every person I have talked to who has spoken to Smart and the players has said the same thing. His strength and emphasis as a coach is relationship building and he's got every guy bought in 110%.
3. He certainly says all the right things in public

Yes, there will be transfers. No way 9 "freshmen" stick it out for all four years. But if only 2-4 of that group transfer out over the next 4 years and they are guys who were at the back of the rotation any way, that's 5-7 quality players who will end up playing literal hundreds of games together and thousands of practice hours together. That kind of experience and cohesion can win you a lot of games.

Every guy may have bought in, until people get in their ear and tell them they can play more elsewhere.  With immediate eligibility, I don't see too many guys spending 4 years in one place.  Whether that is at Marquette or elsewhere.  This core of young guys is exciting - I like the upside.  But I don't expect many of them to be around in 4 years.  Part of the reason why I was less excited about Shaka's offseason than most because building a culture is important, but less so than really any other time in CBB history.  Rosters will be rebuilt annually.  Transfers rates are only going to increase with the new rules and once covid stuff gets further in the rearview.   

[Jay Bee]

We need to boost the Scoop NIL Fund & start getting cash 2 these guys.

[MarquetteDano]

Every guy may have bought in, until people get in their ear and tell them they can play more elsewhere.  With immediate eligibility, I don't see too many guys spending 4 years in one place.  Whether that is at Marquette or elsewhere.  This core of young guys is exciting - I like the upside.  But I don't expect many of them to be around in 4 years.  Part of the reason why I was less excited about Shaka's offseason than most because building a culture is important, but less so than really any other time in CBB history.  Rosters will be rebuilt annually.  Transfers rates are only going to increase with the new rules and once covid stuff gets further in the rearview.

All sadly true. One of things I liked about college bball is there was rarely a "rent-a-player" vibe. They would either get their degree or leave early to pros. Now if someone stays 4 years it  will be the exception.

[brewcity77]

Why though, other than blind optimism?  There is very little reason to believe Shaka will be able to hold this group of freshman (eligibility wise) together.  Guys will transfer, other will "go pro".  Maybe most of them. Its the way of the game and Shaka is no different than any other coach in that regard.

The reason why is because historically, he's better than other coaches in that regard. Immediate eligibility could change that, but over the years he's had higher than average retention rates than we've seen here at Marquette even as transfers nationally have escalated.

https://http://www.crackedsidewalks.com/2021/11/shakas-past-and-marquette-rosters-future.html?m=1

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Every guy may have bought in, until people get in their ear and tell them they can play more elsewhere.  With immediate eligibility, I don't see too many guys spending 4 years in one place.  Whether that is at Marquette or elsewhere.  This core of young guys is exciting - I like the upside.  But I don't expect many of them to be around in 4 years.  Part of the reason why I was less excited about Shaka's offseason than most because building a culture is important, but less so than really any other time in CBB history.  Rosters will be rebuilt annually.  Transfers rates are only going to increase with the new rules and once covid stuff gets further in the rearview.

Transfers will go up. For some coaches more than others.  I'm confident we will have less than most

[GB Warrior]

We need to boost the Scoop NIL Fund & start getting cash 2 these guys.

I propose immediate reinvestment of all Scoop dues to support our team.

[MU82]

Going forward, a major part of recruiting will be recruiting one's own players -- the guys a coach really wants to keep, anyway.

The Charlotte Observer had an article this morning about how the UNC-Charlotte football team fared on national signing day. It included this:

In addition to the new faces, Healy touted the recruiting job he and his staff have done of keeping current players on the roster.

“I was told that there were two schools in the country that didn’t have a (scholarship) guy in the portal, and that’s us and Georgia,” Healy said. “Retaining players is extremely important to me. We’ve got to recruit our own as well.”[/b]

Like TAMU, I think we have a coach who will do far better than most at "recruiting our own" in this new Freedom of Movement Era of major-college sports.

[rocky_warrior]

I propose immediate reinvestment of all Scoop dues to support our team.

Hm, I'm gonna need to unload about 3000 yards of dirt to someone for $$$. And they're gonna need a barge & tugboat to pick it up. 

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

Transfers will go up. For some coaches more than others.  I'm confident we will have less than most

Still getting a lot of blind optimism vibes here, but fair enough.  Hope you're right, at least as it pertains to good players.  I don't give two craps if a guy that can't hack it leaves and Shaka replaces with a better player.  Such is life in big boy athletics.

[goldeneagle91114]

It will be interesting to see the recruiting process in the future.
If transfers don't need to sit out a year, and you have playing time available it may be a desirable option.
I guess in the future, Marquette teams may look similar to this year.
Many new faces that never played together.
Maybe the new successful coach model/style will be how fast can you get a bunch of new players to play cohesively together.

A perfect example of this is what TJ Otzelberger has done at IA state.

the Cyclones were 2-22 overall, 0-18 in the Big XII. In addition, they had losing records in 3 of their last 4 seasons and haven't had much basketball relevance since Hoiberg Left.

...enter Otz, They're now 10-0 and ranked 11th in the country. They're doing it with an roster that was created completely from the Transfer Portal.

This is not only a fantastic turn around, but it shocking how fast it can happened

[JakeBarnes]

A perfect example of this is what TJ Otzelberger has done at IA state.

the Cyclones were 2-22 overall, 0-18 in the Big XII. In addition, they had losing records in 3 of their last 4 seasons and haven't had much basketball relevance since Hoiberg Left.

...enter Otz, They're now 10-0 and ranked 11th in the country. They're doing it with an roster that was created completely from the Transfer Portal.

This is not only a fantastic turn around, but it shocking how fast it can happened

Part of the reason TJO was on my short list for the offseason. Still happier we got Shaka, but TJO's time recruiting at Iowa State prepared him for the transfer portal world for sure.

[panda]

A perfect example of this is what TJ Otzelberger has done at IA state.

the Cyclones were 2-22 overall, 0-18 in the Big XII. In addition, they had losing records in 3 of their last 4 seasons and haven't had much basketball relevance since Hoiberg Left.

...enter Otz, They're now 10-0 and ranked 11th in the country. They're doing it with an roster that was created completely from the Transfer Portal.

This is not only a fantastic turn around, but it shocking how fast it can happened

New age of college hoops. Long term roster construction is not a requisite for success anymore.

[MU82]

New age of college hoops. Long term roster construction is not a requisite for success anymore.

No, but signing good recruits and then re-recruiting them to stay will still be a major contributor to long-term success. Because it's a lot easier to fill a couple of spots than start from scratch every year.

Still getting a lot of blind optimism vibes here, but fair enough.  Hope you're right, at least as it pertains to good players.  I don't give two craps if a guy that can't hack it leaves and Shaka replaces with a better player.  Such is life in big boy athletics.

Well, TAMU did show some stats to explain why it's a little more than "blind optimism."

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

No, but signing good recruits and then re-recruiting them to stay will still be a major contributor to long-term success. Because it's a lot easier to fill a couple of spots than start from scratch every year.

Well, TAMU did show some stats to explain why it's a little more than "blind optimism."

Transfer stats from other schools (where he was recruiting very different players) and from previous to immediately eligible transfers are frankly irrelevant. 

[TAMU, Knower of Ball]

Transfer stats from other schools (where he was recruiting very different players) and from previous to immediately eligible transfers are frankly irrelevant.

Irrelevant? No. Far from conclusive, absolutely.

[MU82]

It's like a stock's past performance. No, it shouldn't be looked at as proof that something will happen in the future. But it might be indicative of a trend.

But yes, I do tend to try to look at Marquette basketball from the optimist's side. The opposite -- always beyotching, venting, getting worked up over hypothetical situations, etc -- is pretty unappealing.

[JamilJaeJamailJrJuan]

It's like a stock's past performance. No, it shouldn't be looked at as proof that something will happen in the future. But it might be indicative of a trend.

But yes, I do tend to try to look at Marquette basketball from the optimist's side. The opposite -- always beyotching, venting, getting worked up over hypothetical situations, etc -- is pretty unappealing.

Fair enough.  I am generally right there with you.  Wasn't and still not a big believer in this particular squad, but think the future is definitely much brighter than whatever road Wojo has us on.  I just want to watching a team that dances most season, as do all (well, most) of us. 

But I also don't sit here thinking Marquette is going to be immune from mass transfers that are sure to be an annual occurrence nationwide just because Shaka had better than average transfer rates at Texas and TAMU heard "guys are buying in".  It all changes when people get in teenagers years about greener pastures when they aren't pleased with their current playing time/prospects for the future,etc.

[MU82]

Fair enough.  I am generally right there with you.  Wasn't and still not a big believer in this particular squad, but think the future is definitely much brighter than whatever road Wojo has us on.  I just want to watching a team that dances most season, as do all (well, most) of us. 

But I also don't sit here thinking Marquette is going to be immune from mass transfers that are sure to be an annual occurrence nationwide just because Shaka had better than average transfer rates at Texas and TAMU heard "guys are buying in".  It all changes when people get in teenagers years about greener pastures when they aren't pleased with their current playing time/prospects for the future,etc.

I don't think TAMU said MU was "immune." He (and I) just feels good about our coach being able to keep most of the athletes he wants to keep. The beautiful thing is we'll get to see soon enough!

[BCHoopster]

You are all forgetting these scholarships are only for one year, not four. Hate to say it but kids sometimes are asked to leave, or the coach says, you probably will not play much the following year, you might as well look for a new opportunity.  I can see it happening after the season. 

[The Equalizer]

You are all forgetting these scholarships are only for one year, not four. Hate to say it but kids sometimes are asked to leave, or the coach says, you probably will not play much the following year, you might as well look for a new opportunity.  I can see it happening after the season.

I"m not seeing anyone falling into the category.

Other than the walk-ons, who on the roster is going to be told they won't play much?  Certainly not Kolek, Lewis, Mitchell, Jones, Oso, or OMP--they're already in the main rotation.  And I don't think Shaka asked Itejere to redshirt if he planned on asking him to transfer at the end of the year.

Prior to UCLA, I might have expected a "time to move on" message delivered to Elliott, but he seems to have picked up his play--we'll see what happens.

That leaves Joplin and Ellis, and I doubt either of them being told they won't play much the following year--I suspect they're being told exactly the opposite--increasing roles with more minutes available after Morsell departs.

if you think that we'll have transfers because Shaka telling that playere they aren't going to get minutes, who is he having that conversation with? Last year, I could easily see that conversation being held with Jose, Dexter, or Symir.  This year I just don't see it.

[BCHoopster]

It will happen.  Your points are well accepted on each player but times have changed.

[MU82]

There almost surely will be transfers out, whether initiated by the player, the coach or some of each.

That was the case in most programs even before players finally got the freedom they deserve. It figures to happen more now.

It will be a great test of Shaka's recruiting ability, and that of every other coach.

[dgies9156]

Going forward, a major part of recruiting will be recruiting one's own players -- the guys a coach really wants to keep, anyway.

Brother MU:

Absolutely. In the future, the teams most likely to be contenders for Nattys will be those teams that have recruited well, coached-up the players they have and held them together for three or four years. You may not like Greg Gard but his is one strong model for the future, albeit with a bit more talent and better recruiting.

While I know it is nice to say that "we have __ five-star recruits," I'm not really thrilled at that concept. The Henry Ellensons of the world come in to a program thinking it is the AAA team for some NBA franchise. As we saw with Ellenson, this group expects the entire focus of the team to be on them. They aren't team-oriented and the idea of a college degree is kind of a joke. Joey Hauser had the same problem. As much as I want to win a National Championship again someday, I could do without the primidones.

Like others have said here, it appears Coach Shaka is a relationship builder. The young core of what we have on the floor right now, Kam, Stevie, Justin, Omax and Oso, I truly am expecting to be with us for all four years of eligibility. If Coach Shaka coaches these guys up and we begin to show signs of "getting there," we'll get a lot more of the talent we need to be special again.

In this vein, Santa, bring me a Marquette NCAA bid for Christmas!

[MU82]

Brother MU:

Absolutely. In the future, the teams most likely to be contenders for Nattys will be those teams that have recruited well, coached-up the players they have and held them together for three or four years. You may not like Greg Gard but his is one strong model for the future, albeit with a bit more talent and better recruiting.

While I know it is nice to say that "we have __ five-star recruits," I'm not really thrilled at that concept. The Henry Ellensons of the world come in to a program thinking it is the AAA team for some NBA franchise. As we saw with Ellenson, this group expects the entire focus of the team to be on them. They aren't team-oriented and the idea of a college degree is kind of a joke. Joey Hauser had the same problem. As much as I want to win a National Championship again someday, I could do without the primidones.

Like others have said here, it appears Coach Shaka is a relationship builder. The young core of what we have on the floor right now, Kam, Stevie, Justin, Omax and Oso, I truly am expecting to be with us for all four years of eligibility. If Coach Shaka coaches these guys up and we begin to show signs of "getting there," we'll get a lot more of the talent we need to be special again.

In this vein, Santa, bring me a Marquette NCAA bid for Christmas!

Given that Lewis already is showing up in the second round of some mock drafts, time will tell if he'll be around for 3 more years ... but your point is well-taken and I agree.

If unable to field numerous 1-and-dones -- which applies to just about everybody except Duke and Kentucky -- the next best route to excellence has always been getting good players, developing them into very good players, keeping them together, and managing their egos effectively so they work as a team.

Many coaches will tell you the ideal situation is like the one Virginia had a couple years ago, or Illinois back in the mid-aughts -- teams loaded with very good, very coachable players who aren't quite superstarry enough to go pro after only a year or two.

Of course, that was before athletes won the right to be free agents at the end of any season, so we'll see if that's still rewarded going forward.

[BCHoopster]

Lewis needs al least one more year in college, UCLA player just backed him down with real ease last game. Offensively he still has be become more consistent.

[MU82]

Lewis needs al least one more year in college, UCLA player just backed him down with real ease last game. Offensively he still has be become more consistent.

Well, sure. And Carton needed more time, too. And so did Henry. And so did Vander. And so did (insert name here). We've learned repeatedly that "needing more time" doesn't mean a kid will stay.

Selfishly, I like watching JL play, I've enjoyed watching him improve, and I hope he's around for at least one more season after this one.

[Dr. Blackheart]

Brother MU:

As much as I want to win a National Championship again someday, I could do without the primidones.

You might need those anticonvulsants if that happens.